I'm with you 100 percent no need for oxygen from a local store. Getting fish online and shipped is for sure a different ball game. Fasting the fish for sure, temperature being stable per say also important. Some shippers put some kind of chemicals in there not exactly sure what it does. Maybe it helps keep the fish calm, just not sure.
heres a few facts, one without oxygenating bags overseas our hobby would not exist as it does today, the oxygen gets into the water via diffusion and a bag set with pure oxygen and then tested with a hach led oxygen probe will read near 90 % saturation, a bag sealed with air will read around 60 to 65 % , 12 hours later the oxygen bagged fish when opened will read at least 80 % saturation, the air bagged fish will be around 30 %, same sized fish, the one at 30 % was succumbing to suffocation by that point. NO wholesaler or importer in the world ships fish without pure oxygen, when mistakes are made the entire bag of fish comes in dead even after a 6 hour shipment from within the u.s., we ourselves have ran out of oxygen while bagging a stores order 2 hours away and bagged more generously to help and had 20 % more losses than we would ever normally expect. while fasting does help especially with larger fish, you cannot fast heavily on small juvenile fish for 24 hours prior to shipment and then ship for 30 hours from overseas and expect the fish to be able to pull thru. , the whole co2 lowers the ph is true but it is due to respiration (using the available oxygen) and urination which drops the ph as low as 6 on a lot of marine shipments and even lower on freshwater which massively helps as ammonia is no longer toxic at those ph levels, so very large numbers of fish can be shipped in relatively small volumes of water for at least 24 hours. the part we can agree on is that most fish going from a store to a home have no issues with atmospheric air for less than an hour, we do bag our fish with oxygen depending on distance a customer is going and also if the fish is particularly large . however to even slightly suggest the commercial side cannot do without using oxygen has zero basis in fact and flies against decades of fish farms, wholesalers, and importers world wide, including public aquariums which test during transport oxygen levels to keep them safe on their future stock. def. not trying to argue but trying to help clarify.
Thanks for the detailed explanation. That makes a lot of sense and it sounds like you have firsthand experience. We also ask people how long they are going to be in the bag. If more than an hour, we oxygenate the bag. I’ve had fish shipped in breather bags as well. That always seemed to work well. I think I’m skeptical because my perception is colored by the people that say, “did you put oxygen in the bag? I have a 20 minute drive home and I don’t want the fish to die.” 😂
Also, since you seem knowledgeable, I’ve heard and we go by the tenet that pure oxygen in the bag is bad for fish that have labyrinth organs/can breathe atmospheric oxygen. Have you heard of this? If so, do you feel that is accurate?
@@nextdooraquatics5013 45 years commercial experience, you are correct 20 minutes most fish are fine no oxygen, a lot of our stuff goes at least an hour away or is shipped, we have always packed all wholesale orders on oxygen including all air breathers, any imported fish (all your gourami’s, bicirs, etc) are always packed on oxygen, not completely sure on bettas since they come in inside tea bag sized bags, we do oxygenate them on shipouts though and have never had an issue, hope this helps
I'm with you 100 percent no need for oxygen from a local store. Getting fish online and shipped is for sure a different ball game. Fasting the fish for sure, temperature being stable per say also important. Some shippers put some kind of chemicals in there not exactly sure what it does. Maybe it helps keep the fish calm, just not sure.
I think some put methylene blue in there. I guess to reduce the likelihood of an ick outbreak or other diseases.
heres a few facts, one without oxygenating bags overseas our hobby would not exist as it does today, the oxygen gets into the water via diffusion and a bag set with pure oxygen and then tested with a hach led oxygen probe will read near 90 % saturation, a bag sealed with air will read around 60 to 65 % , 12 hours later the oxygen bagged fish when opened will read at least 80 % saturation, the air bagged fish will be around 30 %, same sized fish, the one at 30 % was succumbing to suffocation by that point. NO wholesaler or importer in the world ships fish without pure oxygen, when mistakes are made the entire bag of fish comes in dead even after a 6 hour shipment from within the u.s., we ourselves have ran out of oxygen while bagging a stores order 2 hours away and bagged more generously to help and had 20 % more losses than we would ever normally expect. while fasting does help especially with larger fish, you cannot fast heavily on small juvenile fish for 24 hours prior to shipment and then ship for 30 hours from overseas and expect the fish to be able to pull thru. , the whole co2 lowers the ph is true but it is due to respiration (using the available oxygen) and urination which drops the ph as low as 6 on a lot of marine shipments and even lower on freshwater which massively helps as ammonia is no longer toxic at those ph levels, so very large numbers of fish can be shipped in relatively small volumes of water for at least 24 hours. the part we can agree on is that most fish going from a store to a home have no issues with atmospheric air for less than an hour, we do bag our fish with oxygen depending on distance a customer is going and also if the fish is particularly large . however to even slightly suggest the commercial side cannot do without using oxygen has zero basis in fact and flies against decades of fish farms, wholesalers, and importers world wide, including public aquariums which test during transport oxygen levels to keep them safe on their future stock. def. not trying to argue but trying to help clarify.
Thanks for the detailed explanation. That makes a lot of sense and it sounds like you have firsthand experience. We also ask people how long they are going to be in the bag. If more than an hour, we oxygenate the bag. I’ve had fish shipped in breather bags as well. That always seemed to work well. I think I’m skeptical because my perception is colored by the people that say, “did you put oxygen in the bag? I have a 20 minute drive home and I don’t want the fish to die.” 😂
Also, since you seem knowledgeable, I’ve heard and we go by the tenet that pure oxygen in the bag is bad for fish that have labyrinth organs/can breathe atmospheric oxygen. Have you heard of this? If so, do you feel that is accurate?
@@nextdooraquatics5013 45 years commercial experience, you are correct 20 minutes most fish are fine no oxygen, a lot of our stuff goes at least an hour away or is shipped, we have always packed all wholesale orders on oxygen including all air breathers, any imported fish (all your gourami’s, bicirs, etc) are always packed on oxygen, not completely sure on bettas since they come in inside tea bag sized bags, we do oxygenate them on shipouts though and have never had an issue, hope this helps