Review is spot on. I may change the wheelset on mine. One of my pivot bolts backed after less than 200 miles. Had to get a new rear triangle as a result. This bike inspires confidence on rain rutted grsvel descents.
So ultimately would you say you would purchase this, Jom? I have to say I was quite seriously considering this bike since it was announced. Unfortunately, reviews for it have been, at least how I'm reading into them, less than super positive. Many seem to like it, but shy away from saying it's great. Ultimately the very high price of it (at least 4700 USD for a low-spec model) plus the notion that some of the components on this bike are custom (the rear shock), made me forgo it. CyclingTips reviewed it recently and they're more critical of it than most (and not just because they don't understand it). From what I've read, it seems that the Fox AX fork is both not a very good suspension fork and very expensive, so it seems somewhat that Niner built a whole bike around an imperfect front fork (because there's no other choice).
Hans, it doesn't OK over corrugations, but usually, the suspension cannot rebound fast enough. I rode it on a railway line at a decent speed, definitely not possible on a rigid bike.
I been waiting for someone independent to review this bike and it has confirmed my doubts , it is so much better to start with a race built XC MTB and convert to a dropper bars the weight saving is massive. It is also so much faster and cheaper than this donkey have you tried the other way yet (race XC MTB to GRX conversion)
You service your shock every ten hours of riding? 😂 That would be about once every week and a half for me, all I’ve seen are a lower service every ~100hrs and a full service every ~200hrs.
I see this as version one. The weight and the niggles will be slowly improved. The most disappointing thing is the Fox AX fork. Fox seems to have stopped delevoping it like they do with their mtb forks. The clearance, damper and weight should of been improved for the time it has been out. I would get your mate to put in a different volume air spacer to reduce the bottom outs of the bigger and rougher stuff. Lastly is this the bike you're going to don the next DK on?
Fox doesn't sell enough gravel forks for them to want to pay the $$$$ for a new mold to update the cast lowers. Why would fox spend the $ for a new and improved gravel fork vs mtb when mtb vastly outsells gravel suspension and has far greater industry competition. Gravel suspension is coming but it's going to take a few years. When 29" mountain bikes first started getting mass produced by only a couple of manufacturers such as Gary Fisher our choices in forks were White Industries (now mrp) and Marzocchi. It took a couple of years and then improvements and options happened. I suspect that the fox gravel forks are a similar deal.
I am fascinated by this bike and would love to test ride one. It's way more than I need, but quite an intriguing product, like many of Niner's machines. Looking at the geometry and sizing though, I may just be borderline on needing that smaller size they don't (yet) offer.
Fingers crossed they produce a smaller size. One of my good friends, Amanda "Panda" Nauman, a two-time winner of Dirty Kanza 200, cannot ride the bike... her size is unavailable :(
@@GravelCyclist That is a pity. I love to see talent and proven ability paired with the appropriate weapon. I would also be curious to learn what she would think of it - it is not a light machine, but as you pointed out, that can be offset with the right wheels. It's also purpose-built, so the right race and rider....beauty.
I was able to ride it reasonably fast with the full suspension. A rigid bike would have been all over the place... but, emulating what I did is not recommended!
Me: "Seeing a full-sus gravel specific bike is cool but I don't think I would ever get one" Also me: *Builds a drop bar XC hardtail with a suspension seatpost* Oh how the tables have turned...
Hey Jom, I really like the idea of the fully suspended gravel bike so find this review very interesting. What are your thoughts on the seat tube angle on this bike, its seem very laid back in comparison to modern trends, especially for a company with MTB heritage. Do you think it limits the bike fit potential as its alters the effective top tube length? Also been chasing through the comments regarding the Stans wheel, 1900g seems a bit on the chunky side!
Seat tube angle is very laid back for sure, but I don't feel bike fit is dramatically affected. I'm not a bike fitter, the Niner MCR 9 RDO fit me like a glove. There are definitely better options than those Stans wheels... with that said, they are good for bike packing or training rides. For performance-oriented riding, forget it. Absolute dogs.
I have a mixed feelings...gravel with suspension 🤔 Maybe this is future for gravel bikes...but on today this is little bit weird for me but still interesting. 👍
I think you dislike the Grail wheels because you've only used the heavier versions. I know you're informed, but do you realize that they come in lighter grades? I have both the carbon version, at just over 1300 grams, and the first year aluminum model in the cheapest heaviest version at 1800 grams. Both perform great but the carbon is noticeably more nimble. The alum is so bombproof that it is still true after about 15,000 miles of gravel riding. Give a lighter version a try.
Thank you, I'm well aware of the different models, and I distinctly mentioned the 4-Star build, the bike in this video that they are delivered with. However, I should have been a little more clear making that distinction in the video. I realize the alloy versions are bombproof and good for toting around loads, bikepacking, etc, but there are far better options with less weight and still very reliable. They are pigs at close to 1,900 grams and are detrimental to the bike's performance, I stand by those comments. I rode the same wheels in my RLT 9 RDO review, once those wheels were substituted, these bikes come alive. They're good for train heavy, race light! If you're with Stans, message me via the website, happy to review a lighter set and bring some positives.
It makes a lot of sense and it is only natural for this bike to exist. I'm surprised it has taken so long really, although if you look at old Paris Roubaix footage, it's not the first front shock on a road bike. It's a beautiful machine!! For me personally, I like keeping my riding skills sharp and taught, so I'll stay rigid. This from a guy who has never owned a springer mtb... and currently prefers to ride a rigid steel 29'er SS.
I always wanted something like this to exist when I watched the 1994 Paris Roubaix, when Johann Museeu rode a full-suspension Bianchi road bike... the bike eventually broke in the race due to bad preparation of the frame material (no heat treating) and physical manipulation (bending) during the build.
Hi Geoff, I have always wanted to build this frame into a project bike, with the aim of getting it as light as possible. It would be interesting to run the new Rockshox Rudy with this frame.
The only downside I can see is with gravel RACING aero is important (see tt bars in DK) that fork is costing many many watts. If you’re just looking for comfort when riding and not at the pointy end of any race it seems like a killer bike.
Most of my audience doesn't care about the pointy end of a gravel race, and most of those folks are using aero bars for an additional hand position / comfort. Thankfully, there are choices for all. Thanks for chiming in!
Vibrations get absorbed by our bodies and are inefficient/fatiguing. Eventually more aero designs will develop. Ovalized stanchions/sliders are likely going to be a future development in shock forks. As it should be theoretically more structurally efficient plus aero. Another option is locating the shock in a faired head tube. Action-tec and the likely copied cannondale headshock would be an easy enough way to incorporate front suspension and have it be aero. Unfortunately locating the shock inside of the head tube requires the same length head tube for both the largest and smallest sizes.
Hi JOM, You always seem to be on a small frame for your height (don't know how tall you are) judging by the Seat post. Is there a particular reason for this? Thanks.
Martin, I am on the correct size, but I do try and get away with the smallest size possible. It is easy to make a smaller bike bigger with longer stem and so on, but not the other way around. Please remember that fitting is personal. Inseam length has zero factor on my fitting because you can raise or lower a seatpost. Top tube length and head tube length are what I care about. Thanks!
@@GravelCyclist Hi JOM, I totally agree its all persona. I have the inseam for a large but body length for a medium so find it difficult to get a correct fit.
@@massmoor consider either custom or "women's specific" to get a shorter top tube. Custom steel is often surprisingly cost-effective and GOOD heat treated steel frames are typically lighter than straight gauge ti/marginally heavier than butted ti. Custom ti is $$$$ unless you go for Chinese custom ti. I would greatly prefer good steel to mediocre Chinese mystery ti with questionable quality. Another option is a stem riser/higher rise stem on a smaller frame. Stem risers aren't considered cool but work fine. After a few decades as a bike mechanic I've never seen one fail. I'd trust a stem riser for one of my bikes. Getting my bars high enough unless converting a mtb to drop bars (short reach high rise stem worked fine for me).
For me it’s more like an “MTB light” not gravel. I think the gravel cycling is still searching it’s own path... come on , dropper post and full suspension frames? Why? If you need a suspension for riding buy a mountain bike. I am huge fan of non-competitive bike touring and bike-packing but these features are totally unnecessary.
No. Does it really matter what people buy and ride? People are buying these bikes. Are they for everyone, no. Are they are a good choice for some, yes.
Gravel Cyclist I am just talking about the market is trying to sell literally everything based on the current gravel trend. For me a full suspension gravel bike almost as silly as the “aero fat-bikes” . What will be the next, a flat bar 2.1 inch wide tire full suspension gravel bike which is gonna be basically a marathon XC bike under a fresh name?
Within a decade gravel bikes are going to be largely featuring suspension. Within 2-3 decades so will road bikes (1-2 cm). Suspension increases comfort, control and the capability of a bike. The downsides of suspension such as reliability, suspension bob and weight are now rather minor in mountain bikes. The technology is there or very close to being there. What isn't ready yet is the consumers. Companies don't want to spend a bunch of money developing a new bike and marketing it only to have it not sell. Companies don't just want to develop the best performing products but stuff that sells. Companies are either in the business of making money or they fail.
The Fox AX fork is far superior to the Lauf. The Fox has rebound control whereas the Leaf is a leaf spring. Not a fan, I reviewed version one of the Lauf fork, aesthetically speaking, it is horrendous.
@@GravelCyclist Yes, but at a 400 gm weight penalty. The Lauf has some damping (hysteresis) in itself, which I find is plenty for most gravel situations. Now if you are into more coarse gravel (babyheads) I’m sure the Fox would be superior. Yes, you have to get past the aesthetics but when I’m on the saddle, I never see it! ;)
Personally I like gravel and road bikes for simplicity. I mountain bike too and don’t need another bike to have suspension service done on.
That is definitely a negative of this bike. Thanks for chiming in!
Review is spot on. I may change the wheelset on mine. One of my pivot bolts backed after less than 200 miles. Had to get a new rear triangle as a result. This bike inspires confidence on rain rutted grsvel descents.
"an all day 193 mile ride" Did I hear that right? If so, that is impressive.
You heard that correct. I linked that ride report in the video description.
Nice representation for O'Dell's. 90 Shilling for the win!
Niner kindly shipped that bottle cap with the bike :)
looking forward to no suspension downhill mtb
looking backward - to 1990s downhill mtb's
YES!!!! A 50 CM BIKE PLEASE!!!
Amanda "Panda" Nauman aka 2-time winner of DK200 also needs one. She's a Niner sponsored athlete but cannot ride the MCR :(
So ultimately would you say you would purchase this, Jom? I have to say I was quite seriously considering this bike since it was announced. Unfortunately, reviews for it have been, at least how I'm reading into them, less than super positive. Many seem to like it, but shy away from saying it's great. Ultimately the very high price of it (at least 4700 USD for a low-spec model) plus the notion that some of the components on this bike are custom (the rear shock), made me forgo it. CyclingTips reviewed it recently and they're more critical of it than most (and not just because they don't understand it). From what I've read, it seems that the Fox AX fork is both not a very good suspension fork and very expensive, so it seems somewhat that Niner built a whole bike around an imperfect front fork (because there's no other choice).
I would like to ride one bike like this. 😊😊
Yes. One would have to try this. I could see this bike to work well on corrugations.
Hans, it doesn't OK over corrugations, but usually, the suspension cannot rebound fast enough. I rode it on a railway line at a decent speed, definitely not possible on a rigid bike.
Gravel bike with full sus.... Perfect for the roads here in my country.
Oh! crap! Just when I was narrowing my next purchase this comes along...
I been waiting for someone independent to review this bike and it has confirmed my doubts , it is so much better to start with a race built XC MTB and convert to a dropper bars the weight saving is massive. It is also so much faster and cheaper than this donkey have you tried the other way yet (race XC MTB to GRX conversion)
The primary cons for me with this are the same as with full sus mtb's; 10 hour shock self-servicing and 100hr send away for a rebuild
For sure, definitely a negative.
hi what does that even mean for noobs like in english
You service your shock every ten hours of riding? 😂 That would be about once every week and a half for me, all I’ve seen are a lower service every ~100hrs and a full service every ~200hrs.
hi jom, great review, you rode the 53 sized frame, what height are you?
Yessssss
I see this as version one. The weight and the niggles will be slowly improved. The most disappointing thing is the Fox AX fork. Fox seems to have stopped delevoping it like they do with their mtb forks. The clearance, damper and weight should of been improved for the time it has been out. I would get your mate to put in a different volume air spacer to reduce the bottom outs of the bigger and rougher stuff. Lastly is this the bike you're going to don the next DK on?
If I do DK again, I would definitely consider this bike.
Fox doesn't sell enough gravel forks for them to want to pay the $$$$ for a new mold to update the cast lowers. Why would fox spend the $ for a new and improved gravel fork vs mtb when mtb vastly outsells gravel suspension and has far greater industry competition. Gravel suspension is coming but it's going to take a few years. When 29" mountain bikes first started getting mass produced by only a couple of manufacturers such as Gary Fisher our choices in forks were White Industries (now mrp) and Marzocchi. It took a couple of years and then improvements and options happened. I suspect that the fox gravel forks are a similar deal.
I am fascinated by this bike and would love to test ride one. It's way more than I need, but quite an intriguing product, like many of Niner's machines. Looking at the geometry and sizing though, I may just be borderline on needing that smaller size they don't (yet) offer.
Fingers crossed they produce a smaller size. One of my good friends, Amanda "Panda" Nauman, a two-time winner of Dirty Kanza 200, cannot ride the bike... her size is unavailable :(
@@GravelCyclist That is a pity. I love to see talent and proven ability paired with the appropriate weapon. I would also be curious to learn what she would think of it - it is not a light machine, but as you pointed out, that can be offset with the right wheels. It's also purpose-built, so the right race and rider....beauty.
All that train track riding had me wincing lol
I was able to ride it reasonably fast with the full suspension. A rigid bike would have been all over the place... but, emulating what I did is not recommended!
Me: "Seeing a full-sus gravel specific bike is cool but I don't think I would ever get one"
Also me: *Builds a drop bar XC hardtail with a suspension seatpost*
Oh how the tables have turned...
Haha, I'm scratching my head seeing the reinvention of the suspension stem... it isn't much better time around.
This bike makes sense for certain people.
Haters be looking for problems yo
100%. I had a ton of fun riding the bike.
How much does it weigh? Ok answered in the video 24.6 pounds. Which is 11kg. Chunky boi. That’s almost as much as my enduro MTB.
Hey JOM! Great review. Why do you say the Stans Grail Wheelset is detrimental to the Niner bikes?
It is heavy... it kills the bike's performance, they weigh close to 1,900 grams. They're great for bike packing, but spirited riding, no way.
Hey Jom, I really like the idea of the fully suspended gravel bike so find this review very interesting. What are your thoughts on the seat tube angle on this bike, its seem very laid back in comparison to modern trends, especially for a company with MTB heritage. Do you think it limits the bike fit potential as its alters the effective top tube length? Also been chasing through the comments regarding the Stans wheel, 1900g seems a bit on the chunky side!
Seat tube angle is very laid back for sure, but I don't feel bike fit is dramatically affected. I'm not a bike fitter, the Niner MCR 9 RDO fit me like a glove. There are definitely better options than those Stans wheels... with that said, they are good for bike packing or training rides. For performance-oriented riding, forget it. Absolute dogs.
Oh godz, absolutely love... how to get? I live in Thailand
Talk to NinerBikes.com
It is what it it is . If it’s fast and comfortable then it’s a win
Well said.
hey john I'm looking for a comfortable gravel bike for a tall guy with back pain who traditionally is a road rider any suggestion? I'm 6 feet 4 inches
What is model name of front brake? Thank you.
I have a mixed feelings...gravel with suspension 🤔
Maybe this is future for gravel bikes...but on today this is little bit weird for me but still interesting. 👍
Plenty of choices for all, I don't see suspension going mainstream on all bikes but I've been wrong before!
I think you dislike the Grail wheels because you've only used the heavier versions. I know you're informed, but do you realize that they come in lighter grades? I have both the carbon version, at just over 1300 grams, and the first year aluminum model in the cheapest heaviest version at 1800 grams. Both perform great but the carbon is noticeably more nimble. The alum is so bombproof that it is still true after about 15,000 miles of gravel riding. Give a lighter version a try.
Thank you, I'm well aware of the different models, and I distinctly mentioned the 4-Star build, the bike in this video that they are delivered with. However, I should have been a little more clear making that distinction in the video. I realize the alloy versions are bombproof and good for toting around loads, bikepacking, etc, but there are far better options with less weight and still very reliable. They are pigs at close to 1,900 grams and are detrimental to the bike's performance, I stand by those comments. I rode the same wheels in my RLT 9 RDO review, once those wheels were substituted, these bikes come alive. They're good for train heavy, race light! If you're with Stans, message me via the website, happy to review a lighter set and bring some positives.
It makes a lot of sense and it is only natural for this bike to exist. I'm surprised it has taken so long really, although if you look at old Paris Roubaix footage, it's not the first front shock on a road bike. It's a beautiful machine!! For me personally, I like keeping my riding skills sharp and taught, so I'll stay rigid. This from a guy who has never owned a springer mtb... and currently prefers to ride a rigid steel 29'er SS.
I always wanted something like this to exist when I watched the 1994 Paris Roubaix, when Johann Museeu rode a full-suspension Bianchi road bike... the bike eventually broke in the race due to bad preparation of the frame material (no heat treating) and physical manipulation (bending) during the build.
Thanks for the review, If the wheelset isnt great on a std build, is it worth buying the frame only, then building with spec components?
Hi Geoff, I have always wanted to build this frame into a project bike, with the aim of getting it as light as possible. It would be interesting to run the new Rockshox Rudy with this frame.
Manda uma dessa pra testar aqui no Brasil ❤
Nah Bruh
So, bottom line, how much does it cost? Be safe. 👍☮️🌞🦠😷🚲
Look on Niner's website for the latest pricing info.
The only downside I can see is with gravel RACING aero is important (see tt bars in DK) that fork is costing many many watts. If you’re just looking for comfort when riding and not at the pointy end of any race it seems like a killer bike.
I should add I commented before I finished the video and you did note it’s not a race bike per se.
Most of my audience doesn't care about the pointy end of a gravel race, and most of those folks are using aero bars for an additional hand position / comfort. Thankfully, there are choices for all. Thanks for chiming in!
Vibrations get absorbed by our bodies and are inefficient/fatiguing. Eventually more aero designs will develop. Ovalized stanchions/sliders are likely going to be a future development in shock forks. As it should be theoretically more structurally efficient plus aero. Another option is locating the shock in a faired head tube. Action-tec and the likely copied cannondale headshock would be an easy enough way to incorporate front suspension and have it be aero. Unfortunately locating the shock inside of the head tube requires the same length head tube for both the largest and smallest sizes.
Hi JOM, You always seem to be on a small frame for your height (don't know how tall you are) judging by the Seat post. Is there a particular reason for this? Thanks.
Martin, I am on the correct size, but I do try and get away with the smallest size possible. It is easy to make a smaller bike bigger with longer stem and so on, but not the other way around. Please remember that fitting is personal. Inseam length has zero factor on my fitting because you can raise or lower a seatpost. Top tube length and head tube length are what I care about. Thanks!
@@GravelCyclist Hi JOM, I totally agree its all persona. I have the inseam for a large but body length for a medium so find it difficult to get a correct fit.
@@massmoor consider either custom or "women's specific" to get a shorter top tube. Custom steel is often surprisingly cost-effective and GOOD heat treated steel frames are typically lighter than straight gauge ti/marginally heavier than butted ti. Custom ti is $$$$ unless you go for Chinese custom ti. I would greatly prefer good steel to mediocre Chinese mystery ti with questionable quality. Another option is a stem riser/higher rise stem on a smaller frame. Stem risers aren't considered cool but work fine. After a few decades as a bike mechanic I've never seen one fail. I'd trust a stem riser for one of my bikes. Getting my bars high enough unless converting a mtb to drop bars (short reach high rise stem worked fine for me).
For me it’s more like an “MTB light” not gravel. I think the gravel cycling is still searching it’s own path... come on , dropper post and full suspension frames? Why? If you need a suspension for riding buy a mountain bike. I am huge fan of non-competitive bike touring and bike-packing but these features are totally unnecessary.
No. Does it really matter what people buy and ride? People are buying these bikes. Are they for everyone, no. Are they are a good choice for some, yes.
Gravel Cyclist I am just talking about the market is trying to sell literally everything based on the current gravel trend. For me a full suspension gravel bike almost as silly as the “aero fat-bikes” . What will be the next, a flat bar 2.1 inch wide tire full suspension gravel bike which is gonna be basically a marathon XC bike under a fresh name?
@@gilberttiborjakub9890 Understood, thanks for clarifying!
Within a decade gravel bikes are going to be largely featuring suspension. Within 2-3 decades so will road bikes (1-2 cm). Suspension increases comfort, control and the capability of a bike. The downsides of suspension such as reliability, suspension bob and weight are now rather minor in mountain bikes. The technology is there or very close to being there. What isn't ready yet is the consumers. Companies don't want to spend a bunch of money developing a new bike and marketing it only to have it not sell. Companies don't just want to develop the best performing products but stuff that sells. Companies are either in the business of making money or they fail.
omg that weights almost 2x my road bike, haha wth.. if im riding something that heavy its gonna me by fs mtb
Trade off with FS MTB = flat handlebars, which I find extremely limiting. The MCR is not a bike for everyone.
@@GravelCyclist Totally agree! I freakin hate flat handlebars on anything but the steepest and most technical singletrack.
I just walk, lightest option by far.
Your bike weighs 12lbs?
Flat Bars are great for Mountainbikes but if you are on a road or have any headwind, they are much slower and less fun than drop bars.
its clearly xc mtb with road bar
About the 400th time this has been said.
I think the true comparison would be to the Lauf!
The Fox AX fork is far superior to the Lauf. The Fox has rebound control whereas the Leaf is a leaf spring. Not a fan, I reviewed version one of the Lauf fork, aesthetically speaking, it is horrendous.
@@GravelCyclist Yes, but at a 400 gm weight penalty. The Lauf has some damping (hysteresis) in itself, which I find is plenty for most gravel situations. Now if you are into more coarse gravel (babyheads) I’m sure the Fox would be superior. Yes, you have to get past the aesthetics but when I’m on the saddle, I never see it! ;)
Any suspension forks made compatible with flat mount road/gravel brake calipers?
Not that I'm aware of.
Suntour makes one: www.srsuntour.com/products/fork/GVX-700C-6511.html