Smoke = Disengagement tools. Excellent for when enemies swarm a non-vital area and you just want to leave. The mission timer gets dicey sometimes so being able to smoke and run is basically the same effect as a 5-minute long firefight.
Yeah the more distance between you and the enemy when you use it, the more likely you are to break pursuit. Night Time, Weather and the Scout Armor make it even more consistent, But that's also because its effecting the baseline detection system
@@EravinVT Its okay, the odds anyone was ever going to use it was near zero. People barely use smoke as it is and no one is going to give up a slot in the SEAF willingly to a smoke shell.
I KNEW I was forgetting something but just could not for the life of me think of the last source of smoke. The Amount of times i've fired a smoke shell from a SEAF with the intent to use it has to be 0 haha
@@EravinVT AFAIK, it doesn't help the SEAF isn't even that great of a smoke strike. If it provided smoke out to the same radius as the mini-nuke, it be way better. AFAIK, it basically does the same as the Orbital Smoke Strike, or maybe a bit smaller. If it could smoke an entire enemy base in smoke, it easily be the best of the "filler" SEAF options.
Great stuff! But why is it anytime? Smoke, bots and especially bugs, seem to just see right through it and hum me no matter how much smoke and distance I put between me and them?
I use it mainly against the bots. They’re really good at breaking engagement and staying stealthy. Wanna go to a mission without being seen but there’s a few enemies next to you? Smoke. You’re waiting for extraction and enemies are coming for you? Smoke. If they’re in the smoke, they also can’t see you. Did that once against a Hulk and I was so close to it
Definitely Shines brightest against Automatons, Just because the bugs are so simple to deal with in a direct fight while the Automatons bring in 7 drop ships full of more rocket launchers then enemy units
Ah yes, the launch me back into orbit to evac mushroom spores. If you do want to set them off for smoke concealment while standing next to them, ensure you are angled correctly.
A couple notes: - There is actually one more way to dispense smoke on the field, coming in quite a sizeable package - the SEAF Artillery smoke shell. You probably won't load it over the possibility of HE, Mini Nukes, Napalm and Stasis, but sometimes you have to. - I am unsure if that is specific to the spore clouds, or universal among all sources of smoke, but I've actually seen melee bugs keep attacking the spore cloud I ran through, even after I was well over 50m away. A surprising, but nevertheless very useful effect.
The SEAF Artillery was mentioned in one of the first comments, Slipped my mind due to how there has probably been a total of three deployed with the intent to be utilized since release xD
@@EravinVT If it's going to come from an artillery, it should be way bigger or longer lasting than a regular stratagem call. I've used it once and I didn't take note if there was any difference.
I couldn’t even tell you what a smoke artillery looks like comparatively to a stratagem call, I don’t think I’ve ever looked at one tbh despite using smoke grenades and orbital smoke quite a lot across my play time
I could see maybe a white phosphorus version of smoke being added for an eagle strike in the future. Give a way to break contact and damage enemies who might try to pass through. But for now it's more of a tool to keep yourself alive.
The Mushrooms also seem to alert nearby enemies, many times I've step on one while sneaking around an outpost and at the very least a couple of enemies will run towards the shrooms to investigate. This seems to be somewhat tied to "explosives" in general. When I notice a patrol far away from me coming my way I usually shoot my autocannon towards a rock or hill close to them and they'll stop in their tracks and run towards the explosion to investigate allowing a safe retreat before they reach your location. That or they see you immediately and call for reinforcements, it's a bit of a 50/50.
Came for the smoke info, Commented to keep my C-01 permit. Now I know how to lose any pursuing women so I can save myself for Lady Liberty! Thanks Eravin!
Tbh I prefer ems strikes. They use a blue stratagem beacon, have a very short cooldown, and can be used both offensively (to open up enemies to attack) and defensively (when I need to run away from a bunch of enemies or a heavy).
I've been loving smoke against automatons since day one, it feels like an enemy accuracy debuff on top of a disengagement tool. I get kicked every time I use it tho
I might give smoke a try, but I'm really enjoying stun grenades for stealth approach. It allows you to stun part of a group so you can easily take out small bots first to avoid bot drop and it also helps with setting up hulk for 2 quick shots with autocannon in a pinch.
Smokes are pretty situational for me, I particularly enjoy what you get out of them on Geological Survey as they allow you to skip dealing with 3/5 of the bot drops you get from those just about everytime when used correctly. But I enjoy running them in general now on Automatons as it lets us have a safer extraction process often.
How are you skipping the last few waves? I get that you smoke the objective, but don’t they still advance into the smoke? Also, if you don’t clear the waves quick enough, more drops occur. I want smoke to work, but I have a hard time visualizing want those 10 meters are. And I suspect smoke is better with bots as they hit you from range so you already have the distance baked in. Bugs are always up on you. @@EravinVT
Used it all day throughout my last stream, You "skip" the bot drop because the first 2 objectives only cause 1 drop each. You can smoke them both finish it and run away. In the Final Stage you deal with the first two drops, but then the third you smoke it and run. Skipping 3/5 Bot Drops
I knew the regular smoke worked to lose enemies I had a feeling the spores did to but wasn’t fully sure so when I’m running I run over as many I can. I’m glad to know it wasn’t all in vain
The Eagle smoke strike can take out bot fabricators just the same as the regular Eagle strike with about the same amount of spread. (Just no explosion) It does it regularly enough that I don't bother using anything else.
I feel like the eagle / orbital smokes should come free whenever you choose an eagle or orbital stratagem.. They'd be cool to use but absolutely nobody is gonna take them over something that goes boom lol
Good info and perfectly presented, thanks! Been enjoying smoke, particularly eagle smoke for around a week now and it certainly makes the upper two difficulties much more comfortable when not playing into stealth per se. I‘ll have to keep the 10 meter rule in mind.
Okay, see that makes more sense. The way the game showed off how they used smoke was, placing it on top of the enemies; which really didn't explain anything on how it's really meant to be used. Disengaging is what's it's for, not for preemptive strikes, or sneak attacks; I've been utilizing it so wrong, appreciative of the info!
Interestingly, "Smoke Cover" is a bad term, and specifically not used by the IRL military, because: *"Cover"* = Breaks visibility, AND stops bullets *"Concealment"* = Breaks visibility, does NOT stop bullets
Third time on this subject, Concealment was too long for one and second it might not block bullets to us, cover is the term I used because the AI pathing treats it like a wall they cannot pass unless they currently have a target locked on the other side.
Can you do a breakdown of defense evac missions? My friends and I were able to do level 9 terminid evacs pretty easily but even doing level 7 bot missions proves extremely difficult. We tried splitting 3-1 with me solo at the objective and it usually works pretty well until around half way through. Pretty consistently I’ll get 5, 6, 7 ships overhead when I hit the 21-30 mark on civilians evacuated. And then from there it’s a never ending stream. The best way to work around this that I’ve found is, when that starts happening, I head out of the rates, my squad mates rush back to town, pull aggro, and leave again but it’s not fool proof and if even a single bot sees me drops start spawning again (with no flare to show that they will be showing up) and the mission is busted from there on out. Level 6 bot (and terminid for that matter) missions are exponentially easier to the point that they are boring, which is why I’m interested in figuring out a way to progress through the level 7-9 difficulty bot missions.
I think, i am the "Try hard." Joying SOS lobbys, collect all samples, throw epic explosions, helping new players and giving Hugs. Sweet Demokratie ❤️🔥
oh this is interesting to know. on my last lvl 6 mission, i wasted like 10 minutes from the start of a mission and died like 3 times just to get rid of a ever growing horde that just kept going for me. Wish i had a Smoke Grenade or stratagem with me to just run away. very useful tips in how to use these. (not to mention all these "Tier lists" with smoke on "F for uselessness"
Well that’s the fun thing about tier lists, they are made to get clicks not to spread useful information 😂 Very unfortunate state the Helldivers RUclips landscape is in, trying to do better than that here though.
Use the "Rock Paper Scissors Emote" With your soon to be away team standing next to any of the invisible walls in the ship, upon exiting the Rock Paper Scissors Animation, They will clip through the invisible wall. :D
within 10m that explains why the bugs spawn so close in the current dark fluid mission. If they're within 10meters of the objective we can't spam smoke to make them lose sight of it.
Smoke can actually break the titans line of sight but you basically have to play chicken with it, the best way ive seen is to go to a location with lots of smoke mushrooms and run over each and every one of them while the titan is chasing you, since the mushrooms locations are spread out the titan will have a hard time reacquiring you by doing this, especially since a titan can only turn its body (and therefore its vision cone) so fast.
That’s what I pretty heavily implied would be the case. “If it locks you for its next attack you can’t shake it” if it hadn’t done this, then yeah you can shake it like anything else
@@EravinVT 100%. The secondary slot fills a weird space for me of running out of ammo or getting by the chainsaw bots exclusively. But with something like the sickle having potentially limitless ammo, a stealth utility nade and the nade pistol? Sounds like a fully fledged load out. Have you tested the sickle for sound level? I'm curious how it stacks compared to the scorcher.
I have very limited time on the Sickle as it's inability to deal with Devastators unless they are looking my direction puts me off using it over my Scorcher with it's insane variety of enemies it's effective against. I'm waiting to do more thorough sound testing when we get suppressed weaponry as i'll have a much more diverse array to talk about then. Once that happens though i'll be looking into each and every single gun in the game's exact noise levels. @puthenveetilnoel
@@EravinVT I'll be looking out for the next sound test video then. Im looking forward to the suppressed auto. But the medium armor pen marksmen rifles are the real ones I wanna see. Not suppressed, but busting through hive guard and devastators sounds awesome.
I'm excited to see how well the AR20L justice works when it returns, It was my favorite weapon in the original. But i'll definitely be testing what Helldivers 2 considers "Suppressed" When we get the Truth Whisperer.
Hey my dude! Started up a match to try this out, since it looked awesome that someone finally found a relevant use for smokes, especially with how crucial being able to disengage at higher difficulties is! However, I tried aggroing bots from from close, medium and far away, and I tried with smoke between us, them going through smoke, as well as me going through smoke, all of these several times whilst wearing Scout Armor. Not once did I manage to actually disengage, lose them or just in general break aggro, other than frankly just running out of range. I'm still trying this as I type out this comment, and maybe I'll figure it out, but as of now, it seems like the aggro break either doesn't actually work, or it simply comes down to a ton of luck. Any chance you could provide some footage of it? I'd love to actually bring Smoke to missions and not feel like I'm wasting a slot. Cheers! Skull Admiral B1 of SES Bringer of Family Values out!
I stream 4 times a week showing smoke work as it does in the video on Helldive Difficulty, as well as in my previously made video "Advanced Tips for Stealth" So the evidence is readily provided it works the way it does.
@@EravinVT Yeah I watched that one too to see if I simply missed something. It’s 2am here so I’ll try it more tomorrow, since I really want to make it work ^^
To long, it's also cover in the way that the enemy AI treats it like a solid impassible surface on contact if not actively pathing towards a player. In that way the word cover is appropriate.
I don't mind how it is but I would take extras, I don't think we need more free stun grenades though. Those are in a great place when you can get away with not taking explosives.
@@EravinVT my thinking was, if an explosive grenade can take out half a patrol or a base, a single smoke should be able to hide me from a full patrol but not be able to take out any bases. Because in my experience, I need multiple smoke just to disengage from a single fight.
I feel like disengaging a single fight is worth more than a grenade in most cases, considering how much time that fight would otherwise waste. Way more so Bots then Bugs and more so at difficulty 9.
@@EravinVT agree. That's why I wanted to make smoke work, but I always ended up wasting too much grenade for a single disengage, especially when playing with randoms when the bot drop count is often high and I need to disengage multiple times.
So happy to see smoke info. Does smoke only break pursuit? Doesn’t it also make bot fire lose accuracy? Does throwing smoke on the giant turret or sauron eye do anything?
It doesn’t affect their accuracy if they have you locked as their target. The Cannon Turret has vision like any other enemy, the reason they most often kill someone is because they have had the alerted status spread to them, or been previously engaged by a nearby stratagem or attack, making them sit in a soft alerted status in which they will swivel and blast anyone within their effective range, so yes to smoke blocking its vision “however” if it’s directly on the cannon it’s going to open fire due to that being considered a hostile action by the AI. Smoke @ The Eye has a similar problem, smoke on you near the Eye I’ve never tested if it can see through it.
I'm a bit confused by your description of enemies loosing you in the smoke, they stop knowing where you are when they touch the smoke or you do? Also, is it kust as useful or more useful than having a wall between you and them for loosing Agro?
It's more useful then a wall as the enemy will continue to take the shortest path towards you when you deploy smoke (Even if this paths them into the smoke) Where they will stop moving. The enemy loses you somewhere between the moment you pass through the smoke, and the enemy reaches the smoke. It's hard for me to give the exact moment it occurs as it is dependent on a variety of factors how fast an enemy loses your trail. There is alot of overlap with Smoke mechanics and my previous "5 Useful Tips & Tricks For Stealth in Helldivers 2" Video. Detection Range definitely factors into making Smoke "more effective" So stacking modifiers like scout armor night time and weather will improve the results you get from deploying smoke. This probably should of had a section in the video somewhere, My bad!
very late comment but i've been wondering, do i need to go THROUGH the smoke in order to break line of sight with the anemy or can i throw the smoke BETWEEN me and the enemy to achieve the same result?
Hello! Just some question: do you throw it on yourself after being seen? And, do you have to stay inside or run through it to make the enemies lose track of you? Like, if I put them in between me and the enemies will it also work? Can I keep entering the smoke, shot, enter the smoke, shot, to keep the enemi confused constantly and entering the alerted status?
You throw it anywhere it blocks the enemy's line of sight to you, imagine you are throwing a wall in their way. Meaning it can used in anyway that blocks their direct line of sight to you. No you cannot keep reentering smoke to confuse the enemy
Not sure if a bug but if my allies are in the middle of combat and I’m no where near them throwing smokes and calling in offensive stratagems doesn’t alert enemies. At least until said item actually takes affect.
Typically by the time the smoke has taken effect and dropped enemy pursuit the smoke doesn't have much time remaining, Firing on the enemy through the smoke will most often times just result in them resuming Alert and beginning pursuit again.
Ideally yes, You might see a bit of disorientation on their end shooting through smoke but generally they re-engage in full if being fired on through it
Thanks for the great videos but I have a question. Does the backpack laser drone do anything to your stealth and will it attack if you haven't been seen yet? Love to have the little guy shoot while I run away from encounters but I worry it may be causing more encounters by engaging early.
It ruins your approach and opens fire as it doesn’t understand what you’re trying to do. It will always open fire on enemies within range indiscriminately.
Hey Eravin, do you know a reliable method to replicate the bug at the beginning of the video where you and your friends fall through the floor of the super destroyer? It looks like a whole ton of fun
is it useful to use the smoke in an aggressive sense, such as smoking an area that leads towards an objective, so that enemies are less likely to see your approach, or at the least in the case of bots, not be able to target you and blast you in the face with a rocket.
It doesn’t do much as far as preventing enemies entering an alert status comparatively to just going prone. Unless you are working an objective which forces you into a standing position.
I’ve kinda use it like this for rushing those cannon towers to get close. Keep in mind a lot of times you would need to be out of alert before advancing. As well like he said you can use it to draw attention somewhere else to move in for a flank, same could be said with any grenade. Finally if a hulk hasn’t been alerted to you can smoke him and flank.
Apparently the sentry will not fire through the smoke according to an earlier comment but this is not based on my first hand account, Enemies when they are hit from within smoke can track and shoot where it came from.
People shouldn't be scared to say meta. Most games have one or more top tier weapons that specialize in taking out a majority of enemies but would be dumb to use on others. The nerf of the railgun was bad. We all grinded to lvl20 only to get a gun that now is a fraction of what should've have been while enemies are appearing more numerous big or small, and more so useless for the terminid faction. Now we have the arc gun that's great for mobs but useless for bile titans, its now the brain dead loadout the devs feared and is the reason they nerfed the railgun. At least with the railgun you aim points charge shoot and if on unsafe don't blow yourself up. Arc thrower just charge and shoot at general direction of enemies. The devs coddled the arc thrower by trying to fix accuracy on the arc thrower and now made it a bug to randomly disconnect players out of the game.
I think the railgun and arc thrower are both in decent spots currently for the exact reason they are on the top of the pile for their respective factions, but weak against the opposite. Railgun still performs almost exactly the same in automatons in the exact ways you wanted to use it before the nerf. It’s noticeably weaker in bugs. Arc Thrower melts through bugs but requires standing still to get its maximum DPS for an extended period, making it weak for automatons. As long as weapons are only “strong” against one function and not dominating across all content as the Railgun was, we are in a spot with variety.
@@EravinVT I believe the nerf to overall penetration was a good choice in order for people to get them to use the unsafe mode but they should've kept the same DMG or a less significant reduction, as well as the max pen of the railgun. What it seem now if the armor scale is 1-10 and the difference between safe and unsafe was 4 and 5 that's would be fine but I believe the max pen was dropped from 10 to what it seems would be 8. Now the only reason I scaled it that way was bc a developer had mentioned it. If both weapon and enemies have the same armor value then said weapon only does partial DMG possibly 50%. For instance, prepatch an automaton tower turret could be penatrated from all sides including the front so long as the charge was on unsafe and exceeded 75%-80% charge and be destroyed in 4 shots. Although I was never absolutely sure if the penetration was full or partial. Postpatch no matter how high it is charged it can no longer pen the side or front of the turret. As for it's effectiveness against terminids, I was hoping to still have it be more useful as it is now on the lower end of ttk for support weapons for the larger enemies. I wouldn't mind shoot 4 maxed out shots on a titan but as of now a two maxed out shot with the PS host bug is happening as well as when the bug isn't happening it takes of 20 shots with maxed out shots. Thankfully do to the charger nerf the arc now has an odd effect where if lucky and accurate can kill a charger in 2 headshots. Although results may need more testing.
You are number 4 to try to make this correction, this is now my 4th time saying "The enemy AI behaves as if it is Cover, a solid wall." and the word Concealment is to long. Don't know what the obsession is with this specific nitpick but, starting to be annoying.
@@EravinVT Did you post the video? You literally said they continue firing into the smoke and try to hit where you were, which definitely means it acts as concealment rather than cover.
My advice. Tighten the beginning of your videos up, I skipped to 1min to get into the vid. You should be taking about the thing on topic within about 20 seconds or your retention will suffer. Intros should be no more than a splash screen at most. Good luck.
I will make the intros I want to make "Retention" doesn't suffer just because you make an entertaining intro. The majority of the top creators for this game cram 9:30 worth of blabbering in with 30 seconds of actual info at the end so I think i'm allowed to do a Bit.
Good video with a horrible intro. 100% of the viewers will see the first 5 seconds and you have selected the most mindless, useless, unrepresentative first FOURTY FIVE seconds.
As always my favorite Comment from this video will be featured at the End of the next! Thanks for watching everybody, cya next time.
Dose the gas strike have the same effect as smoke and mushrooms
It does not
You'd see my comment but I deployed smoke first... :) hehehe
Clever 😅
Dang it
Great info, didn't think cooking one off in my hand
Honestly scared me internally the first time I thought to try it, But my hand was still there so it became a useful tip!
It the most useful tool to play hide and seek
Works well with the stun grenades too.
Yes thanks to @Eravinttv for showing this 😊
Smoke = Disengagement tools.
Excellent for when enemies swarm a non-vital area and you just want to leave. The mission timer gets dicey sometimes so being able to smoke and run is basically the same effect as a 5-minute long firefight.
It does what it does well
Me smoking Marb reds watching this video
"I'm a genius"
You are some what of an expert
@@jalontf2 me smoking a joint "i'm jeff"
That explains a few things, I have been using smoke way too close. The enemies are likely chasing me by sound/proximity.
Yeah the more distance between you and the enemy when you use it, the more likely you are to break pursuit. Night Time, Weather and the Scout Armor make it even more consistent, But that's also because its effecting the baseline detection system
The spear can smart aim through smoke :)
The Spear and me have a barely functional work relationship that’s threatened each time it takes a few to many repositions to lock a fabricator
@Eravinttv yeah it is too unreliable at the moment. It is still interesting that it can acquire targets through smoke.
1:30 - You forgot the SEAF Smoke Shell.
Damnit lol
@@EravinVT Its okay, the odds anyone was ever going to use it was near zero. People barely use smoke as it is and no one is going to give up a slot in the SEAF willingly to a smoke shell.
I KNEW I was forgetting something but just could not for the life of me think of the last source of smoke. The Amount of times i've fired a smoke shell from a SEAF with the intent to use it has to be 0 haha
@@EravinVT AFAIK, it doesn't help the SEAF isn't even that great of a smoke strike. If it provided smoke out to the same radius as the mini-nuke, it be way better.
AFAIK, it basically does the same as the Orbital Smoke Strike, or maybe a bit smaller. If it could smoke an entire enemy base in smoke, it easily be the best of the "filler" SEAF options.
Great stuff!
But why is it anytime? Smoke, bots and especially bugs, seem to just see right through it and hum me no matter how much smoke and distance I put between me and them?
I use it mainly against the bots. They’re really good at breaking engagement and staying stealthy. Wanna go to a mission without being seen but there’s a few enemies next to you? Smoke.
You’re waiting for extraction and enemies are coming for you? Smoke. If they’re in the smoke, they also can’t see you. Did that once against a Hulk and I was so close to it
Definitely Shines brightest against Automatons, Just because the bugs are so simple to deal with in a direct fight while the Automatons bring in 7 drop ships full of more rocket launchers then enemy units
Ah yes, the launch me back into orbit to evac mushroom spores.
If you do want to set them off for smoke concealment while standing next to them, ensure you are angled correctly.
Personal Shields also block the knockback, Walking on them pops the smoke without being thrown as well. They have to take damage to throw you.
I walk through them all the time, especially when I first started and wasn't really aware of them. Didn't even know they could throw you
A couple notes:
- There is actually one more way to dispense smoke on the field, coming in quite a sizeable package - the SEAF Artillery smoke shell. You probably won't load it over the possibility of HE, Mini Nukes, Napalm and Stasis, but sometimes you have to.
- I am unsure if that is specific to the spore clouds, or universal among all sources of smoke, but I've actually seen melee bugs keep attacking the spore cloud I ran through, even after I was well over 50m away. A surprising, but nevertheless very useful effect.
The SEAF Artillery was mentioned in one of the first comments, Slipped my mind due to how there has probably been a total of three deployed with the intent to be utilized since release xD
@@EravinVT If it's going to come from an artillery, it should be way bigger or longer lasting than a regular stratagem call.
I've used it once and I didn't take note if there was any difference.
I couldn’t even tell you what a smoke artillery looks like comparatively to a stratagem call, I don’t think I’ve ever looked at one tbh despite using smoke grenades and orbital smoke quite a lot across my play time
I still think the smoke needs a buff before I could adding into the arsenal.
It doesn't need to be anything other then a niche take imo. It's good at what it does and that's good enough for me.
How so? It does exactly what it's supposed to do and with light armour you're basically a ninja
@@leckallen2350 I think it needs to cover a bigger area, especially the eagle and orbital variants.
I could see maybe a white phosphorus version of smoke being added for an eagle strike in the future. Give a way to break contact and damage enemies who might try to pass through. But for now it's more of a tool to keep yourself alive.
We just need bigger radius. The smoke areas are way too small
Excellent info from R&D. Helping to hone the cutting edge of democracy. For Super Earth!
For Super Earth!
The Mushrooms also seem to alert nearby enemies, many times I've step on one while sneaking around an outpost and at the very least a couple of enemies will run towards the shrooms to investigate.
This seems to be somewhat tied to "explosives" in general. When I notice a patrol far away from me coming my way I usually shoot my autocannon towards a rock or hill close to them and they'll stop in their tracks and run towards the explosion to investigate allowing a safe retreat before they reach your location. That or they see you immediately and call for reinforcements, it's a bit of a 50/50.
The explosion isn't directly related to your character so they investigate but do not immediately become aggressive
You can also cook the stun grenade in your hand and it will stun everything in the area and won’t harm you
yep sure can
Came for the smoke info,
Commented to keep my C-01 permit.
Now I know how to lose any pursuing women so I can save myself for Lady Liberty! Thanks Eravin!
This one wins next comment spot two videos from now, this is fantastic lmao
@@EravinVT 😂 thanks man keep up the great content!
Ty for the laugh and for watching 😂👍
Tbh I prefer ems strikes. They use a blue stratagem beacon, have a very short cooldown, and can be used both offensively (to open up enemies to attack) and defensively (when I need to run away from a bunch of enemies or a heavy).
Depends on what the objective of the stratagem is, the use case isn't a flat overlap
I like using smoke with the bots. Definitely learned some stuff I didn’t know yet. Thanks for the info!
Happy to help thanks for watchin
I've been loving smoke against automatons since day one, it feels like an enemy accuracy debuff on top of a disengagement tool. I get kicked every time I use it tho
Toxic, try finding matches in my discord, Ghost Divers love smoke and stealth gameplay
Also good for hellbomb arming
I might give smoke a try, but I'm really enjoying stun grenades for stealth approach. It allows you to stun part of a group so you can easily take out small bots first to avoid bot drop and it also helps with setting up hulk for 2 quick shots with autocannon in a pinch.
Smokes are pretty situational for me, I particularly enjoy what you get out of them on Geological Survey as they allow you to skip dealing with 3/5 of the bot drops you get from those just about everytime when used correctly. But I enjoy running them in general now on Automatons as it lets us have a safer extraction process often.
How are you skipping the last few waves? I get that you smoke the objective, but don’t they still advance into the smoke? Also, if you don’t clear the waves quick enough, more drops occur. I want smoke to work, but I have a hard time visualizing want those 10 meters are. And I suspect smoke is better with bots as they hit you from range so you already have the distance baked in. Bugs are always up on you. @@EravinVT
Used it all day throughout my last stream, You "skip" the bot drop because the first 2 objectives only cause 1 drop each. You can smoke them both finish it and run away. In the Final Stage you deal with the first two drops, but then the third you smoke it and run. Skipping 3/5 Bot Drops
I knew the regular smoke worked to lose enemies I had a feeling the spores did to but wasn’t fully sure so when I’m running I run over as many I can. I’m glad to know it wasn’t all in vain
Yep it all works the same
The Eagle smoke strike can take out bot fabricators just the same as the regular Eagle strike with about the same amount of spread. (Just no explosion)
It does it regularly enough that I don't bother using anything else.
Mentioned that at some point pretty sure
You don't want this smoke (you do)
I sure do!
I feel like the eagle / orbital smokes should come free whenever you choose an eagle or orbital stratagem.. They'd be cool to use but absolutely nobody is gonna take them over something that goes boom lol
You would be surprised
Nobody that is bad, true, if you are not tho you might very well consider it for all the good reasons mentioned ...
Good info and perfectly presented, thanks! Been enjoying smoke, particularly eagle smoke for around a week now and it certainly makes the upper two difficulties much more comfortable when not playing into stealth per se. I‘ll have to keep the 10 meter rule in mind.
Glad you found it useful and thank you for watching 🫡
Okay, see that makes more sense. The way the game showed off how they used smoke was, placing it on top of the enemies; which really didn't explain anything on how it's really meant to be used. Disengaging is what's it's for, not for preemptive strikes, or sneak attacks; I've been utilizing it so wrong, appreciative of the info!
Interestingly, "Smoke Cover" is a bad term, and specifically not used by the IRL military, because:
*"Cover"* = Breaks visibility, AND stops bullets
*"Concealment"* = Breaks visibility, does NOT stop bullets
Third time on this subject, Concealment was too long for one and second it might not block bullets to us, cover is the term I used because the AI pathing treats it like a wall they cannot pass unless they currently have a target locked on the other side.
Can you do a breakdown of defense evac missions? My friends and I were able to do level 9 terminid evacs pretty easily but even doing level 7 bot missions proves extremely difficult. We tried splitting 3-1 with me solo at the objective and it usually works pretty well until around half way through. Pretty consistently I’ll get 5, 6, 7 ships overhead when I hit the 21-30 mark on civilians evacuated. And then from there it’s a never ending stream. The best way to work around this that I’ve found is, when that starts happening, I head out of the rates, my squad mates rush back to town, pull aggro, and leave again but it’s not fool proof and if even a single bot sees me drops start spawning again (with no flare to show that they will be showing up) and the mission is busted from there on out. Level 6 bot (and terminid for that matter) missions are exponentially easier to the point that they are boring, which is why I’m interested in figuring out a way to progress through the level 7-9 difficulty bot missions.
I’ll be doing 9 Evacs all day today now that there is a Bot invasion during my stream starting at 6pm EST. Then likely make a short video after
I think, i am the "Try hard."
Joying SOS lobbys, collect all samples, throw epic explosions, helping new players and giving Hugs.
Sweet Demokratie ❤️🔥
I respect your work
@@EravinVT oh 😅😂 i do my comment on the wrong video 😂
Watch youtube on TV and comment on the open video on my phone 😂
oh this is interesting to know.
on my last lvl 6 mission, i wasted like 10 minutes from the start of a mission and died like 3 times just to get rid of a ever growing horde that just kept going for me. Wish i had a Smoke Grenade or stratagem with me to just run away.
very useful tips in how to use these. (not to mention all these "Tier lists" with smoke on "F for uselessness"
Well that’s the fun thing about tier lists, they are made to get clicks not to spread useful information 😂 Very unfortunate state the Helldivers RUclips landscape is in, trying to do better than that here though.
How do you get outside of the ship and jump off? That’s a true act of patriotism. Guessing it uses the hug emote to clip somehow.
Use the "Rock Paper Scissors Emote" With your soon to be away team standing next to any of the invisible walls in the ship, upon exiting the Rock Paper Scissors Animation, They will clip through the invisible wall. :D
Didn't want my C-01 permit to be revoked so here is some assistance with the algorithm, Brother of Democracy!
Your C-01 is safe for now, your assistance is of the highest value to our mission Brother. Your Planet thanks you for your patriotism.
within 10m that explains why the bugs spawn so close in the current dark fluid mission. If they're within 10meters of the objective we can't spam smoke to make them lose sight of it.
Smoke has helped me in many mission while spreading democracy
Smoke Spreads just like Democracy
Smoke can actually break the titans line of sight but you basically have to play chicken with it, the best way ive seen is to go to a location with lots of smoke mushrooms and run over each and every one of them while the titan is chasing you, since the mushrooms locations are spread out the titan will have a hard time reacquiring you by doing this, especially since a titan can only turn its body (and therefore its vision cone) so fast.
That’s what I pretty heavily implied would be the case. “If it locks you for its next attack you can’t shake it” if it hadn’t done this, then yeah you can shake it like anything else
Because its basically impossible to take B site on Inferno without smokes, I adopted Eagle Smokes as part of my bot build almost instantly.
Good
I usually run with gun-bunnies, but my smoke carried us through a Geo mission
gun bunny is a very cool term I haven't heard since playing SR5e
I did destroy a bot factory once with the eagle smoke stratagem.
It does infact work “sometimes”
Love the Brasch General! 🎉❤
4:36 Wait, what? How do you use the spear on bug holes? I thought it only locks onto big enemies?
It doesn't lock on to bug holes, it does however kill fabricators. Mispoke a bit by talking about both at the same time.
Good video. Had no idea how to make it work before.
Glad I could help and thanks for watching!
Thanks for the video. I mean I prefer wiki pages myself but good ones are hard to come by nowadays.
man, that intro. what a wild ride of emotions that was.
anyways!! ☁
☁
☁
*Crawling through a bush and praying*
I think i'm getting pretty creative with them lol
Man if nades weren't so important for objectives, I would be making smokes. Need to practice with em some more.
I'm excited for the grenade pistol for this reason, Will probably run smokes always with that.
@@EravinVT 100%. The secondary slot fills a weird space for me of running out of ammo or getting by the chainsaw bots exclusively. But with something like the sickle having potentially limitless ammo, a stealth utility nade and the nade pistol? Sounds like a fully fledged load out.
Have you tested the sickle for sound level? I'm curious how it stacks compared to the scorcher.
I have very limited time on the Sickle as it's inability to deal with Devastators unless they are looking my direction puts me off using it over my Scorcher with it's insane variety of enemies it's effective against. I'm waiting to do more thorough sound testing when we get suppressed weaponry as i'll have a much more diverse array to talk about then. Once that happens though i'll be looking into each and every single gun in the game's exact noise levels. @puthenveetilnoel
@@EravinVT I'll be looking out for the next sound test video then. Im looking forward to the suppressed auto. But the medium armor pen marksmen rifles are the real ones I wanna see. Not suppressed, but busting through hive guard and devastators sounds awesome.
I'm excited to see how well the AR20L justice works when it returns, It was my favorite weapon in the original. But i'll definitely be testing what Helldivers 2 considers "Suppressed" When we get the Truth Whisperer.
Good info thank you!
glad you liked it and thanks for watching!
This comment has been democratically chosen for you as your favorite comment. Failure to feature it is a betrayal of liberty and will be noted.
bet
Hey my dude! Started up a match to try this out, since it looked awesome that someone finally found a relevant use for smokes, especially with how crucial being able to disengage at higher difficulties is!
However, I tried aggroing bots from from close, medium and far away, and I tried with smoke between us, them going through smoke, as well as me going through smoke, all of these several times whilst wearing Scout Armor.
Not once did I manage to actually disengage, lose them or just in general break aggro, other than frankly just running out of range. I'm still trying this as I type out this comment, and maybe I'll figure it out, but as of now, it seems like the aggro break either doesn't actually work, or it simply comes down to a ton of luck. Any chance you could provide some footage of it? I'd love to actually bring Smoke to missions and not feel like I'm wasting a slot.
Cheers!
Skull Admiral B1 of SES Bringer of Family Values out!
I recall in one of the dev & CEO interviews saying that it takes them 30-45 seconds to lose aggro.
I stream 4 times a week showing smoke work as it does in the video on Helldive Difficulty, as well as in my previously made video "Advanced Tips for Stealth" So the evidence is readily provided it works the way it does.
@@EravinVT Yeah I watched that one too to see if I simply missed something. It’s 2am here so I’ll try it more tomorrow, since I really want to make it work ^^
If you're still having trouble getting them to work i'll be using them all stream tomorrow @ 6pm EST here on RUclips & Twitch
I'm a more of an EMS enjoyer myself
I use EMS and Stuns during Automaton Eradicates pretty frequently, Lots of fun niches for the lesser used options.
Smoke concealment. Cover is behind a rock
To long, it's also cover in the way that the enemy AI treats it like a solid impassible surface on contact if not actively pathing towards a player. In that way the word cover is appropriate.
They really should make the number of any utility & non-damaging grenade by default of 6 and 3 per pickup.
I don't mind how it is but I would take extras, I don't think we need more free stun grenades though. Those are in a great place when you can get away with not taking explosives.
@@EravinVT my thinking was, if an explosive grenade can take out half a patrol or a base, a single smoke should be able to hide me from a full patrol but not be able to take out any bases. Because in my experience, I need multiple smoke just to disengage from a single fight.
I feel like disengaging a single fight is worth more than a grenade in most cases, considering how much time that fight would otherwise waste. Way more so Bots then Bugs and more so at difficulty 9.
@@EravinVT agree. That's why I wanted to make smoke work, but I always ended up wasting too much grenade for a single disengage, especially when playing with randoms when the bot drop count is often high and I need to disengage multiple times.
Smoke is great when you play with guys that shoot at everything.
Smoke and gas strikes have been in my loadouts for bots lately
Smoke has some pretty cool use cases, It's not an always take for me but the Geological Survey Benefit to me feels worth it.
So happy to see smoke info. Does smoke only break pursuit? Doesn’t it also make bot fire lose accuracy? Does throwing smoke on the giant turret or sauron eye do anything?
It doesn’t affect their accuracy if they have you locked as their target.
The Cannon Turret has vision like any other enemy, the reason they most often kill someone is because they have had the alerted status spread to them, or been previously engaged by a nearby stratagem or attack, making them sit in a soft alerted status in which they will swivel and blast anyone within their effective range, so yes to smoke blocking its vision “however” if it’s directly on the cannon it’s going to open fire due to that being considered a hostile action by the AI.
Smoke @ The Eye has a similar problem, smoke on you near the Eye I’ve never tested if it can see through it.
@@EravinVT thank you, helldiver. Very helpful and time-saving.
Thanks for the video, can friendly turrets acquire targets through smoke?
I believe so? Honestly didn't occur to me to check that with how little I use turrets. Completely slipped my mind.
Worth testing in the future. Will relay if/when info becomes available.
They do not work when blocked by smoke
Neat cool to know
@@EravinVT don't sleep on turrets, especially the Gatling and auto cannon
I'm a bit confused by your description of enemies loosing you in the smoke, they stop knowing where you are when they touch the smoke or you do?
Also, is it kust as useful or more useful than having a wall between you and them for loosing Agro?
It's more useful then a wall as the enemy will continue to take the shortest path towards you when you deploy smoke (Even if this paths them into the smoke) Where they will stop moving.
The enemy loses you somewhere between the moment you pass through the smoke, and the enemy reaches the smoke. It's hard for me to give the exact moment it occurs as it is dependent on a variety of factors how fast an enemy loses your trail. There is alot of overlap with Smoke mechanics and my previous "5 Useful Tips & Tricks For Stealth in Helldivers 2" Video. Detection Range definitely factors into making Smoke "more effective" So stacking modifiers like scout armor night time and weather will improve the results you get from deploying smoke. This probably should of had a section in the video somewhere, My bad!
oh there's the 10 meter range!
so that's why it never seem to work when i use it XD
Yeah minimum distance to be effective at actually losing pursuit haha
very info dense and all good stuff. thank you
Glad it was helpful! thanks for watchin
A bit late to the party, but i could swear that smoke messes up hunter jump pathing. When im inside the cloud, it seems like they never jump at me
Devastator and Hulks and rocket raiders: We don't do that here
*proceeds to fire at my back automatonly*
lol sometimes but such is life
Great video! How do you show team-stratagems and cooldowns?
They pop up anytime I pull up my map
Wow, thanks@@EravinVT ! I never noticed it, whenever I pull up the map, i'm actually looking at the map HAHAHAHAH
thats funny xD glad I could help and thanks for watching
very late comment but i've been wondering, do i need to go THROUGH the smoke in order to break line of sight with the anemy or can i throw the smoke BETWEEN me and the enemy to achieve the same result?
It's more effective if you pass through it as the enemy lose their connection to you (no viable path to target)
@@EravinVT Wow, didn't expect you to reply to such a late comment, thanks for the info!!
Should really buff this, especially the orbital
And with the armor shred grenade coming the smoke nade is gonna be even less used damn
Idk what they would buff about Smoke, it does what it does and it does it well
Is it neccesery to move through a smoke for enemy to lose you or can I throw it in front of them?
I’ve had success with both as long as the smoke isn’t directly in front of them and blocking their LoS to you
Hello! Just some question:
do you throw it on yourself after being seen? And, do you have to stay inside or run through it to make the enemies lose track of you? Like, if I put them in between me and the enemies will it also work?
Can I keep entering the smoke, shot, enter the smoke, shot, to keep the enemi confused constantly and entering the alerted status?
You throw it anywhere it blocks the enemy's line of sight to you, imagine you are throwing a wall in their way. Meaning it can used in anyway that blocks their direct line of sight to you.
No you cannot keep reentering smoke to confuse the enemy
@@EravinVT Thanks!!
Thanks for the smoke!
Yw, thanks for watchin!
Remember to do your democratic duty and vote this election soldier. Democracy depends on you!
Not only did I vote I SUPER voted!
Any idea how they interact with Detector Towers or the flying ships?
gunships ignore any and all detection mechanics, they are stalkers that fly and shoot rockets
THANK YOU FOR THE 10m RULE! I couldnt figure oyt why they just didnt work for me!
Glad I could help haha, nice to know the base line rules for your equipment.
I dont need smoke. Just more bullets. Good info tho.
I respect that
Cool intro!
Thanks! Been trying to get more creative with them lately and just learned about type ons lol
Not sure if a bug but if my allies are in the middle of combat and I’m no where near them throwing smokes and calling in offensive stratagems doesn’t alert enemies. At least until said item actually takes affect.
Not sure how to parse what you mean by this
Does gas have the same shrouding mechanisms as smoke?
It does not
what will happen if you decide to engage enemy from the smoke? like, do they wont shoot back in case of bot. or they wont move at all in case of bugs?
Typically by the time the smoke has taken effect and dropped enemy pursuit the smoke doesn't have much time remaining, Firing on the enemy through the smoke will most often times just result in them resuming Alert and beginning pursuit again.
@@EravinVT so the moment you decide to smoke. you better go all in on retreating? / continuing stealth in case enemy not in alert state
Ideally yes, You might see a bit of disorientation on their end shooting through smoke but generally they re-engage in full if being fired on through it
@@EravinVT im still in dilemma whether i should use auto cannon or spear for ez fabri
Thanks for the great videos but I have a question. Does the backpack laser drone do anything to your stealth and will it attack if you haven't been seen yet? Love to have the little guy shoot while I run away from encounters but I worry it may be causing more encounters by engaging early.
It ruins your approach and opens fire as it doesn’t understand what you’re trying to do. It will always open fire on enemies within range indiscriminately.
I think Id rather just take stuff that can kill what is chasing me, rather than stacking up on stuff that doesnt deal any damage at all to amything.
Whatever floats your boat, I just laid out what the items do. Leaving everyone to form their own opinion.
Hey Eravin, do you know a reliable method to replicate the bug at the beginning of the video where you and your friends fall through the floor of the super destroyer? It looks like a whole ton of fun
is it useful to use the smoke in an aggressive sense, such as smoking an area that leads towards an objective, so that enemies are less likely to see your approach, or at the least in the case of bots, not be able to target you and blast you in the face with a rocket.
It doesn’t do much as far as preventing enemies entering an alert status comparatively to just going prone. Unless you are working an objective which forces you into a standing position.
I’ve kinda use it like this for rushing those cannon towers to get close. Keep in mind a lot of times you would need to be out of alert before advancing. As well like he said you can use it to draw attention somewhere else to move in for a flank, same could be said with any grenade. Finally if a hulk hasn’t been alerted to you can smoke him and flank.
Can you also use smoke to cover a sentry turret or mortar? Or will enemies still know because the sentry is firing?
Apparently the sentry will not fire through the smoke according to an earlier comment but this is not based on my first hand account, Enemies when they are hit from within smoke can track and shoot where it came from.
People shouldn't be scared to say meta. Most games have one or more top tier weapons that specialize in taking out a majority of enemies but would be dumb to use on others. The nerf of the railgun was bad. We all grinded to lvl20 only to get a gun that now is a fraction of what should've have been while enemies are appearing more numerous big or small, and more so useless for the terminid faction. Now we have the arc gun that's great for mobs but useless for bile titans, its now the brain dead loadout the devs feared and is the reason they nerfed the railgun. At least with the railgun you aim points charge shoot and if on unsafe don't blow yourself up. Arc thrower just charge and shoot at general direction of enemies. The devs coddled the arc thrower by trying to fix accuracy on the arc thrower and now made it a bug to randomly disconnect players out of the game.
I think the railgun and arc thrower are both in decent spots currently for the exact reason they are on the top of the pile for their respective factions, but weak against the opposite. Railgun still performs almost exactly the same in automatons in the exact ways you wanted to use it before the nerf. It’s noticeably weaker in bugs. Arc Thrower melts through bugs but requires standing still to get its maximum DPS for an extended period, making it weak for automatons. As long as weapons are only “strong” against one function and not dominating across all content as the Railgun was, we are in a spot with variety.
@@EravinVT I believe the nerf to overall penetration was a good choice in order for people to get them to use the unsafe mode but they should've kept the same DMG or a less significant reduction, as well as the max pen of the railgun. What it seem now if the armor scale is 1-10 and the difference between safe and unsafe was 4 and 5 that's would be fine but I believe the max pen was dropped from 10 to what it seems would be 8. Now the only reason I scaled it that way was bc a developer had mentioned it. If both weapon and enemies have the same armor value then said weapon only does partial DMG possibly 50%. For instance, prepatch an automaton tower turret could be penatrated from all sides including the front so long as the charge was on unsafe and exceeded 75%-80% charge and be destroyed in 4 shots. Although I was never absolutely sure if the penetration was full or partial. Postpatch no matter how high it is charged it can no longer pen the side or front of the turret. As for it's effectiveness against terminids, I was hoping to still have it be more useful as it is now on the lower end of ttk for support weapons for the larger enemies. I wouldn't mind shoot 4 maxed out shots on a titan but as of now a two maxed out shot with the PS host bug is happening as well as when the bug isn't happening it takes of 20 shots with maxed out shots. Thankfully do to the charger nerf the arc now has an odd effect where if lucky and accurate can kill a charger in 2 headshots. Although results may need more testing.
Smokes are very inconsistent and even when they do work they aren't worth taking up grenade slot or stratagem slot
Well that is an opinion, and a fair one at that.
For Super Earth!
Does the orbital gas strike have the same effect as smoke?
It does not
@@EravinVT 😞
Schould i take orbital or eagle smoke?
orbital smoke is my preference if i'm running another eagle already, if I have no other eagles then eagle smoke
Alr ty ill try that been going for total anihalation before w autocannon 500kg normal eagle and laser. Just wanna try sth new.
For Democracy o7
and Freedom!
Nice
:D
Smoke provides "concealment" which is distinct from "cover", which provides a physical barrier
You are number 4 to try to make this correction, this is now my 4th time saying "The enemy AI behaves as if it is Cover, a solid wall." and the word Concealment is to long. Don't know what the obsession is with this specific nitpick but, starting to be annoying.
Reminds me of 40k rules
@@EravinVT Did you post the video? You literally said they continue firing into the smoke and try to hit where you were, which definitely means it acts as concealment rather than cover.
You are officially that guy, congrats. The one and only of those four to then double down on something that could not matter less
@@EravinVT If it's so irrelevant why did you even engage with it? You clearly thought it was important enough to argue about.
smonk
indeed
Invisible, not invincible
Meant what I said
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My advice. Tighten the beginning of your videos up, I skipped to 1min to get into the vid.
You should be taking about the thing on topic within about 20 seconds or your retention will suffer.
Intros should be no more than a splash screen at most.
Good luck.
I will make the intros I want to make "Retention" doesn't suffer just because you make an entertaining intro. The majority of the top creators for this game cram 9:30 worth of blabbering in with 30 seconds of actual info at the end so I think i'm allowed to do a Bit.
What it does is it wastes a grenade and/or stratagem slot. Cheers
This Message Brought to you by the Eastern Front
For sure not one person has used a smoke grenade.
This Statement is not condoned by the Ministry of Truth
I've used them.
it blindw you and your fellow helldivers while being swarmed by bots or bugs. as far as im concerned thats all it does
Well, that’s just wrong
Good video with a horrible intro. 100% of the viewers will see the first 5 seconds and you have selected the most mindless, useless, unrepresentative first FOURTY FIVE seconds.
Smoke is for non skilled players
That sure is a new take
It doesn’t nothing!!!! LmaO 🤣
You mean "it does nothing" or "doesn't do anything".
Stay in school :)