Silent Hill HD Collection: SH Retrospective
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- Опубликовано: 27 ноя 2019
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It is finally time to cover the one #SilentHill release almost everyone agrees is the worst of the worst. #Konami saw fit to hire on a rookie team with no experience in making an HD Collection, and thanks to the ditching of the games' source code, and other equally dumb moves, this collection ended being the laughing stock of the #SurvivalHorror community. For those who haven't touched this abomination, I have dirtied my hands to find out just how bad it is. Let's dive in! Игры
Normally I wouldn't do this, but I have addressed the same issue 20 times already. Yes I have seen the Great Debate videos with Tom Hulett, and no it does not disprove anything I've said here. The information that made it into this video, is the information that can be objectively proven.
1, Konami dumped the source code for the game in the collection
2, Hijinx decided to use incomplete source code instead of running the original, or PC versions on an emulation layer (which could have looked and performed just as good, if not better than what we got.)
3, Tomm Hulett planned from the very start to re record all voiced dialogue, and re write the original script.
These are the 3 issues that lead to every issue I brought up in this video, and nothing said in the Great Debate video disproves any of it. If the info in the Great Debate interview did disprove any of this, I would still not use it, as it is hearsay, coming from the one man with a good enough reason to lie about things. Those 3 issues are objective fact, that has been confirmed by Tomm, his team, and members of Konami. You'll excuse me if a story made up by a guy facing extreme amounts of criticism, after the fact, which contradicts the story he told before all the harassment, seems a bit suspect.
Except the interview with him happened before he left Konami in 2013. The interview took place in 2011. That and he decided to do the new audio recording because he wanted it to be good. He knew fans would be upset, but he wanted to be in-charge of it because he wanted it to at least be quality. That and he did not direct the actors or even choose them that was by Elizabeth McGlynn. So if you have issues with the VA work that should be on Ms. McGlynn who is an accomplished ADR director and long time SH collaborator.
The reason the VA work had to be redone was because of issues with Konami and the actors, not Tomm. Tomm pushed to get the original VAs audio performances and this is collaborated by others in the project such as Jeremy Blaustein and Guy Cihi who have no reason to lie (especially in regards to Tomm's involvement).
That and Tomm did not have an active part in this games development (the producer in charge would be Devin Shatsky). The issues with it are on Hijinx and Konami. You can critique Tomm for a lot of things but the HD Collection as a whole is not one of them. If you did not like the new script and VA work that's fine, but Tomm did fight to get you the original audio for SH2.
Sorry love your content, but it was highly biased against Tomm for something that he did not do.
It's really funny that we are supposed to treat Tomm as poor innocent holier than life victim all of a sudden.
Like walking talking bible and other shitload of arrogant-ass proven quotes magically did not happened. The guy lost his Konami-did-it card by his own damn hands. PR is a thing, you know.
@@facepalmvideos1 Oh, Tomm made bad decisions. I just think we need to be more fair on where to hand blame. Downpour that's Tomm, Book of Memories, that's Tomm, HD Collection... that's not really Tomm. He only handled the logistics in getting the new recordings done and did touch-up work on the scripts. If you liked the new voice work or not, that's fine, but that's also on Mary Elizabeth McGlynn so give her equal credit/blame on that one.
The technical issues with the project are on Devin Shatsky, Hyjinx and Konami (more Konami).
There was a few videos that investigated the mess of silent hill hd collection. At some point in the video tomm had explained that he had play tested or something and made a list of bugs and everything that was wrong with it. He emailed to whoever that needed to look at and moved on. All the problems he had listed were the common complaints the game recieved. I think they didn't have enough time to fix the game so they released it I could be wrong and or I really don't remember the details of that matter . Months down the line they called him again to play the game and write down all the bugs in the game, and he was like "wait a minute, this looks familiar " then realizing he was writing the same things down like before . Some got patched in afterwards but I believe Tomm was surprised they didn't patch the problems the first time around.
@@Wexter0083 Mary Elizabeth McGlynn did get her fair share of shit for this, even in video you commenting on.
But you just can't do such monumentally stupid thing as "touching up the script" in freaking HD remaster and then be the guy that has nothing to do with this regardless. Especially when your intent to rewrite said script is on record all over the internet. Public relations kinda work this way, for better or for worse.
This was a road built by his own arrogance
All I’m wanting is SH 1,2,3,4 all available in their original forms on PS4
Ps4 or switch or Xbox one
Just want to play these games on a modern console
how about the complete originals (with none of the Hulett bugs) packaged with proper remakes?
eh but that would require competent programmers
I was gonna buy this for Xbox one but idk now oof
We need a Silent Hill Collection for modern consoles. Also. Castlevania vol. 2
@@TheIronTiger44 Konami has proven how little they value their franchises, we need a team of dedicated fans that appreciate all the original team and VA talent did to buy the IP so it can be done properly
Konami should hav hired bluepoint to remaster this. The MGS HD collection they made was one the best collections i've played
Bluepoint pretty much nails all the ports or remasters they handle.
not only that, but there were plenty of studios who have the experience with ports or remasters other than bluepoint, and they went with a studio who had none.
@@Dacho_Shaki u're right! I just mentioned bluepoint bc they worked with Konami on the MGS collection.
Except, they were working on MGS HD collection which released in 2011 and then went on to work on the Vita version on PlayStation All-stars which came out in 2012. Silent Hill HD also released in 2012.
Konami went to the lowest bidder to spend as little money as possible.
Charles Manson once was asked how does it feel to be crazy psychopath and he replied
-"I don't know,I never played SH 2 with new voice over"
Charity also once said:
"I punched my Mother out once."
HD Collection voice acting: Anime
Original voice acting: Real people
HD Collection voice acting: Mary Elizabeth McGlynn is a jealous ice queen and used her role in casting to put herself in the spotlight and bring her Funimation friends along too.
Well, Vincent has Sasuke's voice
Is hardly call the voice acting in the originals sounding like real people. They are just as badly done as the resi series. However due to the strangeness of the goings on in sh it fits well
I never understood how much a idiot you can be to lose the source code of one of your most successful franchises in the first place!?!
Not defending it, but apparently it was the norm to actively throw the code away at that end of development at the time. Really strange tradition to have.
@@balthasarirvine1295 That was the norm among many Japanese developers during the 90s and early 2000s. Which says everything about how they felt on preservation. This came to bite Square in the ass with the remasters earlier this decade.
This is a prime example of a publisher not valuing the games as much as the fans do.
Now it seems they keep the codes very close for the many ports we get for games now.
@Davide Lombardo Unacceptable for such a big company and for one of the best franchises!!
*Reads title*
SH Community: Wow thats a weird way to spell "trash"
^ this
You read my mind.
*#lolz*
Hot take; it's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be
@@Darstag good to hear :)
Doctor: Slow Pendulum isn't real, he can't hurt you
Slow Pendulum: 16:15
I mean, the Metal Gear Legacy Collection had everything up to date and included a PSN code for MGS1, also Konami. It's pretty insulting to the series.
It really is!
O_o ok i've played silent Hill 3 ...maybe 3 times....WAY back so i really don't have any idea how heather sounds... but the short clip where she sits on the bed.... she sounds WAY to "grown up" and "sexy" for a teenager/young adult
You are exactly right.
The biggest crime of the collection is that Silent Hill 4 wasn't included.
Because 4 sucked but also they didn’t add origins ps2 version either , 2 and 3 was masterpieces so understand them doing just them
@@starman5901 in your opinion. 4 is underrated, best one since 2.
They didn't add origins because Team Silent didn't make it
@@liammcnulty1987 lol best once since 2 😂😂😂 nah your must be trolling , 1 , 3 and origins shit on 4 , 4 on level of homecoming, not bad but not good
@@starman5901 cry harder. I'm sorry my opinion upsets you so much, kid. I'm glad you loved 3 the most, but I thought it was too similar to 2, with a rehashed story of the first game. The 4th had the best atmosphere. The gameplay was clunky and the game had many faults but the atmosphere and story made up for it. No other SH game had that feeling of dread, especially when your room started to get haunted.
No need to get so angry and upset because I think 4 is under appreciated. In fact, there's a lot of recent interest in SH4 lately, people are starting to look at it again.
If you're just looking for an argument for the sake of it then I suggest you go elsewhere.
@@liammcnulty1987 because 4 is over rated , yes i do say story is good thou, but Enemies and level design was bloody awful , also that sill resident evil chest too
No one:
Avalanche Reviews: it works through my framemeister just fine
Lol, we get it. You have a framemeister. Move on.
I'm late but hear me out
Capcom: We made Resident Evil
Konami: We made Silent Hill
Capcom: We remade Resident Evil.
Konami: We made an HD collec- WAIT NO NO WE DIDN'T
Capcom: We made RE7
Konami: ...... We killed Silent Hills....
Capcom: We remade Resident Evil 2 and now 3.
Konami: We don't wanna talk about it...
Honestly, Konami MIGHT be working on a new SH or some remakes. But who knows.
Funny how after the 4th installment of both series it went down hill until the time of P.T and Re7 and BOTH were first person.
@@ScarletKing9697 they’ll never sell the IPs. They still make a ton of money off SH and metal gear branded pachinko machines, and they’re not the type of company that cares ab fans at all.
@@ScarletKing9697 Imagine if they sold Castlevania to FromSoftware
I'd want to correct you;
Konami: OH YEAH? WELL WE MADE PAAAAAAAAACHINKOO!! YEAAH HELL YEAH!
In Tom Hewlett's defense, when you work for a company that literally hires internal police to make sure you don't talk shit about the big guy at the top, and still expects you to deliver state of the art output with broken alpha versions of games created 10 years ago, the very fact that he was even able to make these is a miracle in itself. the poor man was stuck between accountants that didn't know how game design works and outraged fans that were too angry to see he was doing what he could.
meh, after Homecoming I had it in my heart to forgive, NOT after book of memories and the HD collection. My charity for Tom, especially when he acted like a godking who knows SH better than the fans yet fucked up consistently, ran empty by 2014. and hearing what the HD collection crew tried to do to the voice cast of SH2 was utter garbage
*INTERNAL POLICE*?!? good god
4:34 OMG Heather's shadow is scarier than Pyramid Head!
Douglas knew better than to even bring his shadow in the same scene. 😆
Fallout 76 gets a lot of shit but have you seen its realtime shadows... Makes sh hdc look like mrs pacman
You were actually more generous to the HD collection than I was expecting. I didn't notice most of the good side you were talking about in the collection until you mentioned them!
Really sucks that this game was my entry to the series. Luckily I had enough sense to buy original versions on ps2 that I had to rebuy because god damn, it still made me fall in love to this series. Thats the only good thing about this collection. It brought attention to the series.
Unfortunately many newbies dont understand that a lot of bad things in this are not in the original games.
I really hated SH3 in this, mainly because the new voice actor completely fucked her character up. She seemed bitchy and I just didnt care for her. Then bought the pc version and later ps2 version and now shes my favorite female game protagonist of all time. Thank goodness I've played the originals now so many times that the taint is slowly wearing off.
Same here essentially. Played 1 on an emulator then played 2 on hd. had the sense to but a cheap ps2 and copies of 2, 3 and 4. It didnt taint my experience that much though. 2 is still one of the scariest, most emotional games I've ever played. And probably still my favourite survival horror game ever.
Dude same this was my entry to it. I played 3 as a demo.
l haven't been able to play the originals for years, l had hoped for so long they would have fixed this HD collection mess so l could replayed them on console. can't bring myself to replay them in this deplorable state
The original was on PSX now called PSone - probably before you were born
@@Thatitchyguy Try the original 1 with the pterodacyls!
the biggest problem right now is that someone like me who's starting his Silent Hill Collection, can't afford the original versions of 2 and 3 since each one goes for hundreds of dollars whereas the HD Collection is available for $30-$40. So I don't care if it's worse, I'd rather get what I can afford
I played through 3 in the HD collection and 2 on ps2 and honestly 3 felt fine to me. There’s issues sure but overall it’s still the game.
Better off with emulator then wasting money on a "hd" version of these games
@ricodontworryboutit3296 don't know how to run an emulator for anything higher than n64
I just bought a PS2 copy of the original for £47 with shipping. The box is kinda fucked up but the discs are minimally scratched. I was gonna get the hd version on Xbox cause it was £24 but I did a fair share of research to decide but god it felt like throwing so much money away.
@@deviltime009 Google is your friend, it's really not that complicated lol
I’m gonna be honest here
This was my SH introduction
I wasn’t there for graphics or frame rate
But mostly or characters and story
Sooo win?
Oh I also played with the original voices (I’m not an animal)
Would you recomendación this port for some one who hasnt played the original games? I want to play these games so badly, but i don't have a ps2 or a decent pc
@@josefu1730 We are on the same boat then. I played SH1 on my ps3, but I have no other way to play 2 and 3 than to buy the HD collection.
@@iwantasandwich9606 i've played the hd collection (360 version on x1) and i truly enjoyed it, i didn't feel like i was losing something. But in sh3 the effects are shit. So, buy it on a sale, i did that (5 bucks)
@@josefu1730 Thanks for answering. I really want to play these games. And since i haven't played the originals I got nothing to compare them to. So as long as both games don't crash it will be fine. Just one thing. Do u remember what kind of sale it was?? I'm on xbox too so I would like to know if it was just randomly put on sale. Or with gold offers. Or a konami's titles sale. I think I'm asking too much so thank u anyways.
@@iwantasandwich9606 it was a random sale
Also;
27:46
"Very rarely does the guy cleaning paintings at a museum hold himself in as high regard as the original artist who made the works he's in charge of dusting off every night."
FUCKING REKT
The irony of looking back at this abomination on THANKSgiving of all days 😂
I'm pretty sure I read or heard it somewhere that the reason why they didn't use the original VO in Silent Hill 3 cuz they couldn't get in touch with Heather's original voice actress to get permission to use it in the HD Remaster and the reason was that she was on rock climbing trip at the time and by the time she knew about it , it was too late. That's what I heard anyway. Anyway I hope you review Silent Hill 4 😍
And the Western silent hill games lol.
While I don’t have any background in the history of the HD collection, I do know that the voice actor for Douglas passed away around the time of SH3’s original release (sad really) which I’m sure complicated things.
Just sad that this whole thing went up in smoke, really could have been something if it was only handled with care.
sneke989 RIP Voice actor who played Douglas. He will be forever enshrined in one of the greatest games of all time.
I did want to get the HD collection back in the day, but I heard nothing but negative things about it, like regarding the visuals, and the sound quality, so I always avoided it, and stuck with the ps2 versions. And holy shit, I did not know about the new voice actors. That's actually kind of insane. I mean Troy Baker was James? Madness, lol.
I actually encountered an even more annoying issue in Silent Hill 2 that wasn't mentioned here. I don't know if this was only on the 360 version, but for some reason they made the environments ludicrously dark in the version of 2 in the collection. It was so dark that unless you had the light on you literally couldn't navigate, and it made the outdoor segment after the hospital utterly nightmarish (as opposed to the original where it was dark, but not so dark you couldn't navigate without the light on). The light itself only illuminated a very small area immediately in front of you too. I understand that the 360 version was far more stable on release, and because of that I never experienced any slowdown, but they also didn't patch it, meaning the PS3 version eventually ended up being slightly better from what I understand.
There's another issue with this collection that no-one seems to acknowledge;
In SH3, the difficulty settings seems to be completely messed up. Trying to play on normal difficulty will give you a certain amount of ammo. So far, so good. But why is there a hard mode amount of enemies on normal mode?? You're not supposed to be gangraped by enemies when you only have 5 bullets!
I've beaten this game on ps2 enough times to see something is clearly off here..
@@Stigmatix666 your complaint is one I've heard many times from people, I think I put the game down many times not being able to get through it with the weird difficulty. I beat it eventually, but I think combat wise it angered me the most and not because of clunky controls like later SH games
I had it on both and the 360 version is better in my opinion-
Especially if you’re playing on the Xbox one because they got rid of that SMG glitch..
In Tom Hulett's deference (he has come out in recent years to talk about his experience at Konami), he was just an associate producer on this title and had other projects he was working on (namely Silent Hill Downpour). But, he was actually going on leave around the time the game was in a bug fixing stage and left Konami and Hijinx a detailed log of all the bugs he found while playing Silent Hill 2 & 3. While on leave he was requested to play through both games again and on his own time played through both games and made another bug report. When he got back into the office and checked his old report and his new report he noticed it was the exact same... every single bug he reported the first time had not been fixed in the "newer finished build" he had just played.
Tom Hulett is not a bad guy, you can say his vision for Silent Hill is not your taste, but he is not a lazy hack. He did really care about the franchise and it can be argued without him things would have been a lot worse. For those curious TheGrateDebate have an excellent interview with the man about everything HD Collection.
EDIT: In regards to the Voice Acting, Tom wanted the original voice tracks. He did not want to redub the games, but Konami and the original actors were in a dispute over rights and residuals. So, Tom went and redubbed it and thanks to his good working relations with Elizabeth McGlynn they did the best they could and did a great job. It's just not the originals and Tom knew that. And, thanks to Tom's persistence they even got the original audio for Silent Hill 2, but due to other issues could not get it done for Silent Hill 3.
Once again no one cares because Tom, is such a controversial figure, even though just doing a scrap of research shows he did have a love and passion for the franchise. He did the best he could with the hand Konami gave him.
This. I find people dont dig deep enough when looking into the HD Collection stuff. I appreciate your research. :)
@@captainwolfstrik That's the part that surprises me is the amount of misinformation there is in regards to Tom Hulett when its so easy to get the real story. I guess its easier to blindly hate a man for something out of his control (or in this case something that was not even really his project) than do a bit of research and challenge their bias on the man.
Okay but why the rewrites then
@@ImmaLittlePip When taking a game and re-dubbing it, you have to match the already finished lip-flaps. So actors will do certain takes to match the flaps better and change small wording. And any changes that were bigger he got in contact with Jeremy Blaustein for approval of the changes. They are rather minor changes at most and something you would not pick up on unless you had the two side-by-side or were very knowledgable of the original game.
I feel so bad for Tom Hulett
When I heard the absolute soul-crushing butchering of Mary's final letter in SH2 - I died a little inside. Say what you want about original SH2 voice acting, but the final letter and that long hallway flashback were an absolute awe-inspiring masterpiece of a voice acting job. And I will die on that hill. And now that masterpiece has ugly soap-opera tier doodles on it. Absolute fucking misery.
But ok, it's all well and good, you can play with old voice acting, right? No harm done, right?
Well, you can't in 3. And that idiots managed to do the impossible. They managed to make Heather unlikable and Claudia with Vincent boring by the power of crappy voicework alone. That ride to Silent hill bit plain and simple does not work anymore, Claudia simply does not believe in her paradise and salvation of humanity anymore, Vincent does not have any subtlety to him anymore. What a travesty.
This is an Oldboy remake of videogames. How did they fuck up this badly with the same damn script is beyond me.
I have not played SH3 on the HD collection yet, still on SH2...I'm now concerned about when I play through 😐
At least you can opt for the original voice acting
why did it make heather unlikable for you, personally i never minded the voice acting in the sh3 remake. the sh2 new voices are awful though
you felt marys pain as she was smothered via pillow.....
"pillarboxing" and then you cut to letterboxing. I do not understand how you keep making this mistake. Pillarboxing is vertical, it's what happens when you play 4:3 games on a 16:9 TV. Letterboxing is horizontal and is what happens when you watch films in wider aspect rations than 16:9, or when a game wants to feel "cinematic".
Yeah, I noticed that mistake as well.
ok boomer.
@@false_idol__ Dude I know ok boomer is a pretty catch-all comeback but I don't think it really applies here. You shoulda like, called me autistic or something.
@@ElectricBarrier I mean, I wasn't trying to insult.. I was just pointing out that you reached boomer criteria.
@@false_idol__ In that case, I don't get it? What does knowing the difference between letterboxing and pillarboxing have to do with being a boomer? Do "kids these days" not know?
I've seen several RUclipsrs pick apart the silent hill and Resident evil games and each time I appreciate the love that goes into these videos. Keep up the great work, dude!
Jared, I used to feel the same way about Tomm Hulett, but there have been some videos posted on here with interviews from him that really shed some light on the whole situation. It's quite interesting to look into.
yea i agree, he can easily be used to be a scape goat but theres more to it than just one person's call or influence.
.... sounds like something Tomm Hulett would say.
Yeah but here's the thing, his logic and decisions where he did have power weren't exactly smart either. The new voices thing IS his idea and his logic for it sounded sympathetic till I thought of it, making more controversial decisions helps no one. He also at some point could've looked at other hd collections and handed in his ps2 copies and said "look I know you have less than a year but just burn these and you're better off".
His biggest issue was that he was in front of all the communication giving the worst impression and also saying stupid shit. He was never immune to criticism at least not when it came to the first 4 games and the collection
yes! i would implore anyone who blames tomm hulett to check out TheGrateDebates videos on him, really opened my eyes
I wish a larger discussion on the history of this collection's development was given, since it is hugely relevant here. On top of having a short time frame to get both games finished, apparently Hulett and the team didn't even have the original source code for the games. On top of not having a lot of the original development team to ask questions or notes from the making of the game to troubleshoot or bug test, which are incredibly important in porting or remastering a game. This is not excusing Hulett or the team, but the idea that the developers are just "lazy" is an insulting if not ignorant view that hides how complex and ruthless game development can be. The ultimate blame goes to Konami for not respecting their license, and not getting a better team or giving them more time to polish such an amazing series of horror titles.
When you got to the part about the voice acting, all I can say is that I wholeheartedly agree with where you were coming from and I felt the dame way. I still haven't actually played the games yet but I was really into the lore and watching the cutscene movies and listening to the soundtracks and reading synopsis that I did eventually stumble upon the cutscenes for Silent Hill 3's re-cast and oh boy was it not good. I understand that the original voice cast for these games weren't professionals (that I'm aware of aside from Laura Bailey who voiced Angela) but that's kinda what really sold the atmosphere of these games, they sounded like people you could meet in real life... Well sorta but you get what I mean. I especially agree with Heather's voice change, the new actress doesn't make her sound like a teenager and oh man, I didn't even hear Laura's re-cast till this video, just not good stuff. It really just comes to show that voice acting can really make or break the atmosphere for a game and it's a shame Silent Hill got affected by it. It's like the anime for Pokemon. Whether people want to admit it or not, the 4Kids voice cast for the main characters was actually rather nice as opposed to the re-cast that makes the characters sound flat and boring with not much personality though that's just my opinion of course. That's why I could understand your grip with the Silent Hill re-cast for voice acting haha.
It's funny how a small group of modders made a better job with a PC version of SH2 for free rather than a paid studio with a shitty 11th hour port job.
Well, one put heart in them work, while the other only go for a quick buck
Adding mods to an ongoing project for one game on PC is not the same as porting two games based on unfinished code to two different consoles. None of us know how much money, time and resources were given to Hijinx Studios to work on this project. While I'm not defending the quality of the product, it's clear that they had the cards stacked against them from the start.
Then again, I guess it's just easier to play armchair developer because it's just a port right? What's so hard about translating code to two new pieces of hardware that the originals weren't coded for? Why not just hire some modders instead? I'm sure they would've got it done perfectly.
@@ieatcrayons20 Honestly, they probably could have just used the PC assets instead of the unfinished codes to smooth out the process, fix some of the bugs from the PC version and all. Some of the FF remasters were based on a PC version.
@@Dacho_Shaki The problem with that is that according to a Hijinx developer, Konami only gave them the PS2 code of the games to work with. The issue isn't with the assets (sounds, textures, 3D models) but the code that dictates how it's all supposed to work together. I can only imagine how much of a nightmare having to not only port unfinished code but then have to do QA on code that your team didn't write and then figure out how to fix it.
This whole thing was doomed from the start because of Konami's choices.
Modding an existing game with zero deadlines or time constraints, and without having to think about paying salaries for employees is a much much much easier task than having to recreate a game from unfinished code on a short schedule and tight budget. This isnt hininks fault at all, it's konami's. Why are yall do ignorant to what goes into making games. Every single dev in the game industry is passionate about what they do, but if your higher ups say it has to be done by a certain day, well too bad thats just how it is.
"I hope everyone who worked on it never find work in this industry again". That was a pretty gigantic manchild thing to say. If you work at a crappy company that gives you a crappy boss who then orders you to do things that are a bad idea but you have no real authority to override what he's saying you should never find work in the field again? Come on now.
Exactly. The higher-ups at Konami are responsible. Too tight deadline, feud with voice actors, losing the game sources, etc
I always find your videos to be so smooth to watch. I've never played the HD collection but i've had seen a good part of what was wrong, but there's some pretty new things I've learned thanks to you. Keep making great videos mate!
I'm so glad i own a physical copy of SH3. thank god I never had to initially experience these masterpieces through the HD collection.
People just getting into the series have to fight an uphill fight. That's for damn sure.
There's this game for PS2 called Lifeline: Voice Action Adventure. It's so bad it makes me wonder if you've played it.
RAIFU-RINE
No, I have stayed far away from that one
@Avalanche Reviews, Play the game, Avalanche...
Also, Pro Countdown Vampires when Avalanche? 😉
AAAHH, FINALLY, time to let these restless dreams rest
Man, the 6th gen (Dreamcast, PS2, GameCube, Xbox) REALLY nailed the survival horror genre in my opinion. Games like RE1 Remake, Eternal Darkness, Silent hill 2-4, The Suffering, Fatal Frame 2, Rule Of Rose and Haunting Ground, just to name a few.
The 7th gen was kind of where it started to fade into obscurity with some notable exceptions like Dead Space 1 and Amnesia.
P.S. Any plans on doing retrospectives on canceled horror projects like Silent Hills and Shadow of the Eternals? The latter is especially heartbreaking for me personally since it was essentially going to be a spiritual successor to Eternal Darkness.
To be totally honest I actually didn't mind the HD remasters shortcomings that much. Even though Hijinx did at an absolutely terrible job at porting the games as you stated in your video, I still find this to be the optimal way of playing these games today... for me at least. The HD visuals simply just look better when playing on modern televisions, especially if you own an OLED since it rivals the contrast ratios of the CRT's we used back in the day.
Don't get me wrong I do definitely prefer the originals, but at a practical level, it just makes more sense than dusting off my old ps2 and CRT or playing them on a monitor where the poor contrast level ruin every dark part of the game. (this is of course just personal preference)
Anyway, great video as always! currently marathoning your stuff during this shitty quarantine
What about the PC version? That one is in HD and has the fog fixed
This kinda sums up my feelings too. The Enhanced Edition is a really good option too, but the collection still has the benefit of allowing different voice casts and honestly does look pretty nice visually. The fog not being great is a shame, but honestly? You don't spend enough time outdoors enough for me to consider it awful
@@ori.g4mionly if you have a computer with enough graphic power and enough memory to get the save files done, keeping in mind the rest of space is occupied by other apps and personal work files
IMO, I think what made the original voice actors shine was that they came off as everyday people if that makes any sense.
Sure top tier VAs were here. But it takes away from that normalcy charm that James and Heather were being your typical everyperson
Keep on moving man, don't give up! I enjoy your content a lot, you do a great work, always well thought out, well researched and well presented. It comes off as a labor of love, with passion, with dedication, with competence. I'm rooting for your success. Cheers from a far away fan.
You're putting a too much hate on Hijinks and Hullet rather than Konami. Besides for bad releases usually being the fault of the money men, here specifically Konami basically made it impossible to make a good game.
They made them use broken and old source code, had no access to the original team for advice, a year to develop it, a low budget, and were likely mandated to use a new voice cast due to royalty concerns or Konami thinking that's the only important thing to get sales.
It's like if a chef was hired to a 5 star restaurant and their first night they're giving low grade meat and only 75% of the amount they need to fill all the orders but you're still expected to create a fantastic dinner.
And just look at how bad every Konami game has been without its main/original developers or team, especially with Silent Hill. At best the new games are ok. The developers keep changing but Konami and low quality are consistent.
@@ObliviousAdoboThis video came off as really biased which is frustrating because I really like his content. I hope Jared just doesn't know about all this behind the scenes bullshit and isn't a salty fanboy.
He talks about "making a living" off of RUclips. Making a living from talking shit and putting videos together. Shows you he has a lazy mentality.
@@ObliviousAdobo thanks, post this comment in the main section. It would be better if a few more people would read it.
Though I do not have a full picture anyway, I think it is safe to say the team behind remasters are not the only ones to be blamed.
Yeah, he defnintley went overboard when it came to bashing them, especially when he said none of them deserve to get work in the future.
Which seems a bit assholishe to me.
Your stuff is always great. An HD collection is such a great idea, its so sad this is the result. Thank you for your work and research, this was very informative.
I wouldn't say the voice acting debate is subjective. When A New Hope was being made, no one could take Darth Vader seriously until they had James Earl Jones do the voice. Silent Hill is no different. Guy Cihi and Heather Moris put more than their voices into their characters. They embody every aspect from their mannerisms to their grunts during combat. Every character across each game was built off the people Team Silent hired. The HD Collection feels like a worse version of George Lucas's Special Editions where he got the most famous actors from the 90s to dub over the original cast. It wouldn't fir then, and it'll never fit with Silent Hill. Watching the prison scene in the HD Collection is absolute torture at how much they butcher James and Maria.
Bbbbbbbut tomm hullett schmuck did nothing wrong!!
Yeah Guy Cihi IS James just like Heather Morris IS Heather
Guy Cihi IS James Sunderland - literally! Lol. Seriously, why they re-did the voices is special Olympic-tier retarded... completely divisive decision from Konami
This remaster was my first experience with the series. Since then I’ve gotten my hands on a copy of the original ps2 sh2, and my god at the difference...
Love the video! I'm really looking forward to your thoughts on silent hill 4
I'm sorry, I despise Troy Bakers acting. Not the man himself, but he always plays the same characters, and as the remaster shows, he gets too breathy and theatrical.
I understand that. He does tend to do the same voice in every game.
Watch Retro Replay, he can do sooo many voices, accents and impersonations.
He does a pretty good joker voice
Agree, his voices suck
He played Snowe from FFXIII and Valvetorez from Disgaea 4 really well.
"The Gang F**** Up The Gameplay" popped up as soon as the always sunny intro rolled up on my tv and I'm watching this video on my phone, it was legendary.
Great video! I just finished SH 2 on this collection and without not playing the original, saw many glitches and issues. However, the PS2 games are about $150-$200 each, so this is all I’ve got for now. Thanks for all the great content!
Would of been nice to see the 360 version compared as well since it’s backwards compatible, especially on Xbox One X. Everyone talks about the PS3 version but the 360 version is rarely covered.
My 360 died on me recently, or I definitely would have.
It does?
I want to get an X...
To play older games lmao.
Don't care about any of Microsoft's exclusives.
Genome Soldat X is great for backwards compatibility. You might want to wait until the next Xbox comes out though, since Microsoft is apparently carrying over the progress made next gen.
Try it on PSnow- I finished silent hill 2 no problem
I can't blame Mary McGlynn since in this day and age, it's sadly expected for all employees to also dabble in PR for the company they work for or else be fired. It's unfair and shouldn't be legal for a company to demand it, but right now it is. Also I don't understand the difficulty of upscaling ps1 games to HD. I own several games on the ps1 and Dreamcast so there is a a graphical improvement. Couldn't Konami use that Bleem program to make SH1 look much better? I don't see why not.
Because hijinx was already in over their heads up converting the ps2 games. Who knows how bad it would have came out, if they ruined the first game too. Ha!
I’ve only ever played the Xbox port of SH2 and my first reaction to the remastered voice actors was:”THATS NOT JAMES!”
I'd really like your review of American McGee's Alice. Super oldschool and a CLASSIC in my eyes.
29:10 This WAS my first exposure to SH. Thanks, Cousin Sam!
Luckily he had a ps2 copy of sh2&3 for me to borrow.
Great work, btw!
Ranting Jared is a strong Jared.
The strongest!
SH2 on the HD collection is fine, never froze or glitched on me. Obviously weird little sound & texture oddities, but honestly it was really fun finding all the flaws, it made my experience actually enjoyable.
Now SH3 on HD is bad unfortunately
Great content as usual. I currently having a SH replay on emulators, but really would like to get the PC versions with the new patches. Is there a safe site where I can get the PC versions? So far I've only found shady download sites.
go to oldgames.com
Awesome video, as usual. Can't wait for your take on the post Team Silent games. ONE BIG thing I don't understand about the new voices. I remember an interview with Tomm Hulett way back when the HD Collection was still in development, where he uses the example of Angela being voiced by a much older woman rather than a real teenager as one of myriad reasons for why the voice recordings needed to be "fixed". (Never mind that that decision was made on purpose, to make her voice sound more world weary, and beaten down by the horrible life she'd lived.) BUT then goes and does the EXACT same thing with both Heather AND Laura?!?!?!? I mean what??? Seriously.
Their is a level where my game just froze every time so I couldn’t pass the game
Perfect day to upload, Jared you think you're slick😂😂🤣 knowing we're all stuffed on bird 🐦 and in front of some screen 😂🤣 happy turkey day my bro
My first experience with the Silent Hills games was with this HD collection and it's still one of my favorite series. But I'm not sure why, my version has the original voice acting and didn't have any bugs (altho I did notice the really bad fog)
Excellent video! I especially agree on the voices, that really don't fit these nervous broken characters. Probably the thing that angered me most. Well... besides the massive fuckups graphically (like the fog and roads looking terrible).
MasterCrumble I always wondered if Troy Baker himself or mcg / hulett decided on “bro James”. He seriously sounds like a turn of the century jock instead of a confused man who did something terrible.
I wish one day we get a proper port of the first 3 games.
At first I didnt mind the HD Collection because it was my first Silent Hill experience. Now looking back on it you do make a lot of good points in the video. The HD Collection is good but not as good as the original games.
I completely misread the title, but glad I watched it. I hope you look into the the none Team Silent games, I think there is a few hidden gems.
i want to get into silent hill, but besides SH4 on gog. this is the only way to do it. im not gonna buy a ps2 for 200 bucks, and then buy the discs which are 150 or more on amazon. should i buy this collection just too be able too play them. also i would like too play SH 1 as well. but i dont see any where i can buy that. any better suggestions to play these games or something im missing. should i wait since there's rumors of remakes and new games.
Worst konami game ever...
Konami: hold my pachinko machine
Hahaha spot on
Hey man, first of all I liked the video because I found it really interesting, and everything that is Silent Hill related is a must watch for me. Good job.
That said, everybody should just stop saying that this was Tom Hulett's fault. He partecipated in making some good Silent Hill games, like Silent Hill Origins and Silent Hill: Shattered Memories. If you listen to some podcasts where he was interviewed, you can actually tell that he is a big fanboy of this franchise and he is sorry for how this collection came out.
In his words, it was the perfect storm around the project:
1) Konami didn't have the source code of SH1 and SH4 that he wanted to include in the collection. They simply lost it. And your argument about using the PC version of the games is not that simple, because the PS3 was really hard to program. They spent the majority of the time working on that version of the game because it was harder, and here's why the patch is available only on the PS3.
2) The code that Konami gave of SH2 and SH3 wasn't complete, it was an "almost-finished" build of the game. It had missing textures, missing models, and missing text. On top of that, sound glitches that would cause the crash of the game. They had to rework on everything only to make it playable.
3) The team asked Konami for more time and money, but Konami was unrelenting. The release window was already set for March 2012, and they didn't give more resources just because it was a "remaster" and not a "remake". Hulett was shocked in hearing this, and even after explaining everything, Konami never moved a finger.
4) After all these problems, came Guy Cihi expecting more money for the HD release. According to Hulett and other voice actors in the industry, when you dub a game you only receive money for that game only, unless you own the rights of your performance. According to Cihi, he was payed but he never expected a re-release with his voice. But if the contract stated that everything about the game was Konami's property, he didn't have a case at all. So Hulett, while every problem discussed above was going on, he needed to spend even more money that could've been spent on making the game better in order to pay other voice actors to re-dub the game. Oh, and the voice actors didn't have a lead or someone that could explain what was going on in the scenes, they only had the cutscenes and a microphone for the redubbing.
5) The team that worked on the game was too young and incompetent for this project, and they lost track many times.
In the end, this happened. And if you're wondering why for example the Legacy Collection of Metal Gear Solid is in perfect shape is simple: Kojima kept the source code of every single game included in that collection, and they gave the job to BluePoint, an excellent studio.
Thank you. I was wondering what it was about the new VO that bugged me so bad other than them not matching the character at all. It really does sound layered on at such a high volume.
Wonderful video, every aspect of this collection is very well described by you
Thank you! Glad ya liked it.
The HD collection was how I first played Silent Hill 2 & 3 unfortunately.
Well at least it did its job and got you into the series....... Or did it? Please don't tell me it scared you off! You show me where it hurt you and I'll make it pay!!!!
@@AvalancheReviews Oh, I enjoyed the games. I just wished it had been on ps2 instead of Xbox 360. Oh well. Nothing that roms and emulators can't take care of.
Every time I hear the new Heather, I cringe and wanna cry.
Though I love her as the Major. She trashed this role in this game ....
I've been debating on this collection. Then I waited with baited breath for your review of it.
Thank you.
I rather be the 4 legged mannequin in the pyramid head scene than waste a red cent on this HD dumpster fire
Can I ask you a question ?
I was thinking about buying silent hill : HD collection on Xbox one but some people warned me about it , is there a possibility to have the old voices on at least Silent hill 2 ?
And is it worth buying ? I’m torn tbh I loooove the series and I’m so nostalgic I just want to be able to have them since I don’t know if there’s ever gonna be another silent hill ..
thanks 💓
I am new to your channel Avalanche Reviews, I am loving your Silent Hill reviews though. I just have one question maybe you can help me with. You said playing this collection on PS3 was a bad idea if you wanted the best experience possible in your opinion. Where can I find the PC Game? Would I have to buy a physical copy with a disk?
god i can't get over how they changed heathers voice. it was iconic the way it was. that alone ruins this game imo
I totally agree! Her voice WAS her character. She just fit the role so well, and the new voice actor doesn't even come close.
As someone who never played the originals and only tried the hd remasters, i really enjoyed it.
thats like eating the store pizza as opposed to the real thing. You should hold yourself to a higher standard.
@@bulletsunderpressure I didn't have the means to get a PS2, og Xbox, or a PC. I worked with what I had at the time.
That ecstatic laugh on the ladder image gives the the creeps every time I play this game. I even had a nightmare about it.
Interesting. As I pointed out in my comment on the SH3 video, I experienced very similar slowdowns to what you're describing here on the PC version of that game. Frame rate would drop dramatically and the game would appear to play in slow motion. In my case, it happened consistently, and only, when the flashlight was aimed towards the camera.
I don't remember what I did to fix it but I eventually got it working. I just attributed it to trying to run an older game on modern hardware and a newer OS than it was designed for, though I never pinpointed the exact cause.
Man I don’t own a PC or PS2… the HD collection is literally all I have. And I don’t care about the flaws it has. I know it’s shitty what they did with them. But at the end of the day I am still playing silent hill. I still got to appreciate the beauty that is those games either way. Nothing changed.
They have trophies too :)
I agree with you man
A bird that spent its entire life in a cage does not miss the freedom of the outside world.
@@18ps3anos Well put. If you only know crap, you appreciate crap.
so there are slow downs in SH3 already then how does it looks like if Heather is weaing the bulletproof vest?
I so wanna support independent reviewers and retrospective videos like these but for some odd reason my bank doesnt allow patreon transactions to go through.Much love and support for your work man.
IDK that game at the end of the video looked pretty nice.
10:00 60 field per second? Don't you mean 60 frames?
I had to look that up, but no he doesn't.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(video)
Like aways, loved your video Jared!
But I think you should take a look at the excellent videos "who ruined silent Hill?", Which give a really interesting perspective at what happened behind the scenes.
It appears it has way less to do with Tomm Hulett than we think
More high quality content
And to think that when I was a newbie to the series, I wanted to start with this collection🙏🙄
Federico Abatecola i did...
Ah yes, some of the best survival horror games that we can’t even play properly on new gen :(
On current gen we got nothing.
PC version
It truly sucks that so many great games are left to rot by their own creators.
Just go full PC Gamer and never regret it
i dont have a ps2 and really wanna play the series, are these good enough if i dont have experience with the series beforehand or not worth it?
The issdus with performance are enough to scare me away, but I guess if you don't have a pc, this would be the only real option. Even then, I would say going with emulation might be a better route.
@ Avalanche reviews - BTW in the video you mentioned that your PC can play both games at 1080p right ? But I seen mods where you can upgrade the resolution up to 4K and running at 60fps and it looks amazing. But I was wondering why did Silent Hill used actual 3d backgrounds for their games instead of the pre-render backgrounds like in Resident Evil Remake 2002 I mean the 3d BGs in Silent Hill are nice and all but the pre-rendered ones in Resident Evil Remake and 0 where amazing even more so in my opinion so what gives, I mean so there a reason for this ?
I don't k now the actual reason behind that move, but I would have to imagine 2 possible answers.
1, it fit their gameplay layout with Harry exploring the town of Silent Hill. That would have been an insane amount of pre rendered backgrounds.
2, They wanted to distinguish themselves from RE
Don’t support Disney +!
Censoring old stuff, putting cringe trigger warnings on old stuff, and how Disney is handling great Fox movies?
No thanks. Would like to watch Gargoyles though.
The Mouse Empire really will end many good things, pop culture related if they continues this path, rewriting history and stuff
👆🏻 this
@@Gruntvc idrc about alla that. It’s creating a monopoly on the creative industry which is was more severe
Wish they never changed Heathers voice
How would I get either of them on pc?
Great video as always,
What's the name of the track that starts around 19:28?
I now wish I ordered the ps2 originals instead of ordering these two timeless games for my Xbox 360 from eBay...
Damn....
Get them before goofballs increase the price due to recent videos blowing silent hill 2/3 up, they're like 30+ dollars right now on Amazon
I wanna say something real quick. It’s totally okay to play this game if you can’t afford/find/play an original copy on the PS2 or PC. The HD collection has a lot of hiccups but if you haven’t played silent hill 2 it’s still worth it. I only had my hands on this collection for the longest time and even though it’s got loads of fuckups, I’m still glad I was able to play the games. And the HD collection is so old now that it’s not like you can give Konami money by buying a new one. So in conclusion, Silent Hill is great. Play it however you can. Just be aware that this version is far from the best
i think if you want to play this game your best bet would be emulation
it will have a better result depending on your setup
Serious question here
I have 2 (greatest hits version), 3 & 4 on ps2 and the PS3 HD version. Recently though my ps2 has died.
Whats the best way to play them now?
mod your ps3 to enable the PS2 emulator
ReedTehPlant this is possible on the PS3 super slim?
@@DeegoL9yeah, your best bet is HEN, just look it up
Still funny how I remember one day I was on the ps now store and I saw the Silent Hill “HD COLLECTION “ and saw that I could download it for free, and I decided why not I love the aesthetic of the foggy town, heard many good things of the games , and I loved playing Pyramid head on Dead by Daylight. I figured why not and decided to play it on my PS4 and wow, what an introduction. Menu music is great and presentation really shows me , a person who has no experience with this franchise , what is to be expected but then I start with SH2, “new voices, that’s weird” oh boy. Long story short I didn’t finish SH2 and haven’t even started SH3 thanks to this video, but it breaks my heart because my introduction with this series is with its bastard child. Hopefully one day I will be able to experience the “team silent trilogy” they way they intended it , maybe one day I’ll find it in the fog.
Your entire argument is that it’s not as good graphically or sound wise, but the noise filter looks nice. Gotcha
This game was my first time with the series.... I agree that the game and grafics suffered a huge amount in this port I'm kinda nostalgic for the voice acting expecially Troy Baker as James
......w-what? :/
@@Arkonu Troy Baker is fucking trash
@557deadpool if he's trash tell that to Final Fantasy 13, Death Stranding and more importantly Last Of Us and Part 2 of Last of Us then ;).
I want to play them but my PS2 has already died and the og SH1 on the PS1 is so expensive on Ebay...I also don't have my own PC so emulating is out of the question :( Should I buy this HD collection even though they are a mess?
Just a quick question on this whole video. Wasn't there a patch file update released later on to fix the issues that was experienced in this game?