@@Seldonlair the problem is that it's really hard to tell if you are serious, or making a joke. Regardless, industrial and chemical pollutants are a huge problem, we aren't purely chemical beings and life would be easier if we were. As a phenomenon, we are also entropic and physically dynamic. If the process of life is somewhat unique to us, then there is a process associated with us that sustains the denial of normal chemical reactions. A regulatory process which is not chemical but mechanical, using homology structures for selective bias in genetic expression against mutations that would otherwise degrade the balance of substrates.
NileRed: "So now we made our plastic gloves into this fine, 99,5% pure crystalline Pulver..." Tom: YOU GOTTA READ BETWEEN THE TAR!!! That's why I love this channel 😂
@@0verv0ltage haha vor allem ne ölpumpe xD wenn ich mich dran erinner wie unsere Pumpe aussah in der Ausbildung.... Da konnt ich vorhersagen was der letzte gekocht hat XD
Hydroxyapatite is really stable, doesn't decompose till, like 1200 C. You should have just burned the shit out of those bones until the ash was completely white, that would have completely solved the tar problem. Also, butchers will usually have some large cow bones in stock, for dogs.
Me, a cook: Oh, you need the flesh off the bones. Boil the bones then dude, easy :) yep, boil the bones. Just...boil the bones, brother. *Boil the b* -- *BOIL THE BONES MAN*
I think chicken bones (at least of ones used in meat production) would have relatively little Calcium because 1 - they're brittle 2 - chickens were bred to grow meat fast (which would mean grow bones fast) 3 - their diet and lifestyle were not designed to make particularly strong bones
Absolutely! And it's nice to see my own theories (and the theories of most of the comments) of where the project went wrong be confirmed in your video - mainly the temperature of furnace and how much more I should have heated the bones. Was cool to see we came up with similar methods, but you can never underestimate experience, you sure know how to furnace things good!
I love the effort put into both of yalls videos! I enjoyed them both very much! Fuckin "CHICKEN GAS" had me crackin up!!! Much love and Happy Halloween to both of yall.
took me about a year to figure out that explosions and fire and extractions and Ire were in fact different channels and that I was not just remembering the name wrong every time a new video popped up
"I've got quite a few questions about this project, even though I'm the one... that... came up with it" I feel like this is the motto for most Ph.D's and post grad work
Extractions&Ire I know this is unrelated buuuuuuuut. When you finally synthesise cubane, should put some of it in a small ornate vial (or at least something clean and not hideous) And a certificate or any proof of what it is and cast it in resin like how some people cast whiskey bottles so you have a nice trophy to display for your hard work.
Last year's halloween special was spooky in a dangerous way, this year's was spooky in an existential way. Watching you suffer through this, then have your project idea done by someone who specializes in metallurgy and get a way better result was painfully relatable.
Hate to tell you this Tom, but there's definitely a food with a better bone ratio, and they call them "bones" 😂 turns out that's a thing you can just get on it's own
@Eddie Hitler yeah i would be very interested in that. I will have to google it because i have no idea how much calcium is actually in dentin and enamel
Very nice video! Funnily enough I've worked on that matter commercially as a chemical engineer on scales of 30 t batches. I would like to point you to the process of bone gelatine production! The first step in that is the bone preparation. Which ends with demineralization of the protein structures with hydrochloric acid. Which actually seems to be the most efficient according to the literature I read back then. Literature on that is sparce but not unattainable. There's a paper by P. J. Makarewicz on the kincetics and lab scale trials, A. G. Ward and A. Courts have a series of monographs on the topics and there is a "Gelatin Handbook" by Gareis that gives overview over the general ideas. You can usually precipitate snow white calcium phosphates, sulphates or carbonate (whatever you choose) from the resulting solutions. Would be amazing if you tried that process because gelatin production is such a forgotten topic! Although not very chemistry to be honest... Quick run through the steps: Crushing of the bones to bone chips. Enzymatic removal of flesh and other tissues followed by defatting with hot water (there's a lot of fat in bones hence why the tar-fest) . Although they did that with petrol up until the 80s or something. And since you don't want to make food grade stuff from the collagenous bone parts you should be able to remove the fats with solvents as well. Step by step extraction of clacium with acid solutions
“Gelatin production isn’t really chemistry” proceeds to go on about the chemistry… I’m smell science…. Or maybe that’s the chicken gas 🤣 sounds like chemistry to me man, cool information as well!
@@markshort9098 While I'm less than an amateur, a quick search turned up a bunch of papers and posts on using acidic solutions to dissolve collagen: "Collagen generally gets solubilzed in acidic condition. My experiments need collagen to be at neutral pH. But It's really getting difficult as collagen precipitate when the pH was increased."
So, a lot of the proteins in bone matrix are soluble like collagens. You can use a slow cooker and whatever bones you start with to make a delicious broth by extracting it. If done correctly the remaining bone is extremely weak and can easily be crushed to powder. I would have made bone broth then taken the clean, weak bone and used something like a pair of food cans nested in a capsule and burnt it in a charcoal fire (possibly with a blower) to destroy as much of the remaining organic as possible. From there you’d know the chemistry better than I would, I’m just a civil engineer who likes cooking.
That's a great idea. I agree that the difficulties began with the pyrolysis. Before reading your comment, I would have just tried to pyrolyse them as much as possible ensuring that the process was being fed enough oxygen. My thoughts come from things I've read about alchemists who often used bone ash, which is usually a light grey colour once it is fully pyrolysed, not the black abomination created here hehe.
@03:13 I love the glove-box-close editing. Show the struggle for an uncomfortable length of time, then, cut to the end, leaving the viewer with the burning question, "How long did it REALLY take to close that glove box?"
I might have tried keeping the bones at high heat for a longer time, that'd probably burn off more of the organics. Apparently cremated remains are mostly calcium phosphates, so cremating the chicken could work.
@@ficolas2 Well, museums use bugs to clean bones, bugs and ants can clean bones really nicely if you want clean "raw bones" without damaging them or changing their content. In chemical perspective they would not be clean from organic material but they would be clean for any external materials(meat tendons)
That is exactly what I was thinking - why did not he burn the thing completely to ashes until all the oily black color is gone. Too much chicken chloride (I don't know any better words to describe the stuff) was still left in solution and it gave him a lot of trouble at every stage.
I would've dissolved the toasted bones in hydrochloric acid, boiled it down, and then chucked the whole mess into a Piranha solution bath. That should've destroyed everything organic and selectively precipitated out the calcium as insoluble calcium sulfate. And to get calcium metal...who knows man. High temperature electrolysis of the chloride? A "thermite-style" reduction with lithium or magnesium?
The strangeness and oddity that is such a specific and "peculiar" idea happening SO close to Cody's Lab doing the same is freaky. Also the people who genuinely worried you were going to use your own bones should always be accompanied by an adult for their own safety.
Just want you to know, I love your videos, grade A content my friend. I'm not a chemist, im a mechanical engineer, but I quite enjoy your videos. Always cheers up my day, you're hilarious. Keep up the good work.
When did I like your comment? When did I watch this video before? I clicked this video thinking “oh this is cool” and I see that I’ve already liked the comment.
I skimmed the comments and could tell by about the 3 minute mark that this video might not turn out well. You've got my respect for going on through with it and posting. Wish I had the kind of follow through displayed here. Towards the end you had me thinking you might've just cracked the recipe for turning trash into multivitamins XD
Not a chemist, but when you are making concrete from scratch and you dont have access to limestone you can just take sea shells and burn them for a long time under high heat then dissolve the remains in water. I think burning the bones a lot longer and a lot hotter would have solved a lot of your tar
This, pretty much. You can just burn the bones all the way to ashes in some sort of inert recipient; this should leave only metal oxides (calcium, sodium, magnesium, etc. oxides), and get rid of all the non-metals/organics as CO2/NO2/H2O/etc. Then you can just drop the ashes in acid to dissolve, then separate the calcium as an insoluble salt like calcium carbonate, just as originally planned in the video. That's how I'd do it, at least (assuming I had an appropiate recipient/flame to do the calcination step).
Agree. The oils and proteins would just become CO2 and nitrogen oxides. Calcium oxide and calcium phosphate would be left. I think it's call "calcining".
this is my first time watching one of your videos, and I love it! You are so informative and entertaining at the same time, great stuff! subbed for life!
Im at the part where hes got his beaker of calcium carbonate and Im just taking a moment to appreciate all the work he had just put into making Lime from bones
I remember someone somewhere doing the math on making a sword out of the iron in blood. It turned out to be "I run a slaughterhouse" amounts of blood. There is very little iron in there.
"You gotta read between the tar." I'll put that quote in my PhD thesis. Thanks. And to you, random youtuber: If you read this comment in -~2-3 years- 2026 or later please remind me.
This was a more entertaining way to do it than Cody did :) ... I think at the end there, I would have just heated it to carbonize all the tar, then dissolve in water and filter the carbon out.
mate, get yourself a kiln. kilns are G r e a t at turning organic chemistry into inorganic chemistry. plus if you fuck around with the atmospheres inside the kiln you can do all kinds of metal-based reactions
10/10 would watch again. Being bamboozled by chemistry I don't understand whilst also simultaneously watching the screen turn deep fried because of the occurance of tar is an eye opening experience, would recommend
The music in these videos is just as anxiety inducing as are the safety measures. I love it! Thank you for the entertainment. I do recommend more safety.
Overall a very interesting video, I enjoyed watching it, and it is on brand for E&F because it's a chemistry shitposting channel first and foremost, so it did perfectly well. Tho, for the actual extraction I'd have: Bought cow bones, y'know, you can just ask the local butcher for bones. Some boiling would soften the meat and degrade the marrow, making it easier to strip off. Then strip as much of the flesh as possible with a knife. With meatless bones you can just leave them to dry, a couple of hours in a 90°C oven would suffice Once the bones are boiled and dry they should be pretty brittle, so you could grind them a bit to make them easier to deal with Afterwards, incinerating the bones (calcinating? just leave them at 500°C in a crucible) You should be left with just ashes, which are mostly sodium and calcium carbonates and phosphates, way easier to extract calcium from there on, without having to deal with tar, or W H A C K smells.
"read between the tar" Best quote from the video, and there were so many contenders. Video was entertaining and then informative as usual! *Edit "I've had enough of shitshows at the moment" replaces earlier best quote
"But you know what? We're just gonna f*ing stumble and suffer our way through this project." I like your attitude, that's how a real analytical chemist talks!
So many ways those bones could have been cleaned before it became a black mess. Soxhlet extractor comes to mind as a standard chemistry tool. Ants and sun bleaching would be the way to start, afterward crushing and Soxhlet would at least be a bit cleaner. Clean, pulverize, extract organics, purify with fire, then put in solution and precipitate - that's how I would have gone about it. P.S. I'm a new sub but a big fan. love that you shameless put out this train wreck of an experiment -- it's like I could do that too! Please don't ever use a glass rod or funnel when pouring your solvents. I laughed so hard at the paint stripper spilled all over a painted lab bench top. If only you had included a clip cleaning the paint off the bottom of the flask. ...but seriously, I love you man. Be safe (mostly, you know). Now to watch Cody's video!
In the last step you could have used interphase crystalization in cold (acidic water+ethanol)/dcm as a way to obtain pure crystals of CaCl2. Picking a good ratio of water ethanol could lead to a decent yield. I like your channel :)
In elementary school, a million years ago, we did an experiment: we poured vinegar over the bones and left it for a few days until all the minerals dissolved in the liquid and only soft collagen was left. Maybe isolating calcium from a vinegar solution would be easier than burning bones?
Vinegar is just acetic acid, so any acid would do. I think the tar could have been avoided in some respect if the collagen was removed before burning the bones (Someone else commented that if you slow cook the bones, the collagen in the bone matrix is dissolved, leaving the minerals in the bone - which could then provide the calcium with less organics)
@@belzi87 But if using a low grade acid like Acetic will leave collagen behind, it would be a good starting point Also curious if a Piranha solution start would have been a good starting point since you'd remove all the carbon at the start too
@@ZeroPlayerGame my high school chem is extremely rusty but wouldn't the acid dissolve the bones and the CaSO4 precipitate out? or the surface layer of CaSO4 just completely stops the rest of the bone from reacting? asking completely out of curiosity.
I remember reading somewhere that the public in the uk collected bones during WOII to extract the phosphorus. Got a procedure for making white phosphorous from bone in a home chemistry book from the 50s. Which is an interesting chemical but not very nice to have around the house.
Bleached and cleaned bones, grind to powder, dissolve everything in strong acid, filter, precipitate an insoluble calcium salt. Avoiding those organics and polymers is really tricky. Your purification steps were well thought out
One thing you could've done, if you had prepared this a bit earlier in advance (and by a bit earlier I mean a couple of months lol), is to just leave your leftovers in a bucket of water with a mostly-sealed lid and let all the flesh rot off over time. It does take a while, you have to periodically swap out the water, and it is *quite* stinky, but it is a very, very effective way to isolate bone. I do speak from experience, as I once preserved a crow skull in this manner. It goes faster if the water is warm, tbf--I did this in autumn in Minnesota, so you'd probably get it done quicker in a place where the ozone layer hasn't been invented yet. Another method is to stick the leftovers in a bucket with some dermestid beetles, if you have them. I did not, and I'm not certain how viable an option that would have been in Australia, but it does go faster and is far less smelly. Also, fun fact--by using the water method, I actually got some saponification to occur on my crow skull! This is a relatively common thing that happens to corpses in cool, wet environments; they form a substance called adipocere, or corpse wax. Could be something to look into for next halloween? 👀
for some reason I totally thought you were gonna put them on a meat ant mound to get rid of the meat. it's not exactly chemistry but I guess ants are just really complicated chemicals. great video!
Someone made a techno song with the LORT quote "They're taking the hobbits to Isengard" as the only lyrics, and it actually worked, so we need to find Tom a good DJ who can cook up the Chicken Gas Remix for him :P
Finally, the mad lad actually did it Edit: rewatching this a couple months later...a cleaner method might have been getting bone meal from a gardening place, so you get no oils or fat or whatever.
You know I always pictured Al Noble and Pasteur and guys like that doing chemistry. They’re just doing stuff out in the backyard with a pretty good idea of what’s meant to happen intellect, but with a “your guess is as good as mine” attitude
Thanks Cody for the pointer to this channel. Looks great to fill the time between yr videos.. edit. This is a great video, especially the spectrometry at the end. Also love the style and the music ... Sounds a bit like aphex twin. Liked + subscribed
I was watching this in my shed because I forgot my keys and had to wait for someone and I was just having a shit day in general, now it's a little better thanks tom
Aha! By uploading a day early you've fallen directly into my trap, and uploaded a video on my birthday. Thanks for the birthday wishes, but strictly in the "thanks I hate it" sense. Cheers from NZ
I'd recommend the following improvements. First of all I'd start with bone meal which you can buy at any hardware store. Second I'd recommend calcining the material much longer and at hotter temperatures to drive off the organic impurities and carbon. Third I'd recommend using a soxhlet extractor to remove the organic impurities. If I was going for elemental calcium I would melt it in a stainless steel crucible and use dry electrolysis to separate out the metal. I wouldn't worry about purity too much since the only impurities would be alkali metals.
Thanks a lot for this warm video! Had my fair share of laughs! 😂 As an electronics engineer with exactly 0 knowledge in chemistry, I really enjoy your videos. They are so innocent and down to earth. Broken grad cylinder? Bah! Measures just fiiiine. Great! 🤣
Cody: Jank equipment, impressively clean reaction Tom: Proper lab equipment, horrible jank reaction (TAR) Edit: The unhinged laughter inmediately after he opens up the (im)pure calcium chloride beaker. That's why we watch this channel.
Bro I don't know anything about chemistry but I love watching your videos, I come back and re-watch these things all the time, in the least terroristy way possible
I'm gonna try doing this eventually, the only difference being I'll be going after the phosphorous. I think what I'll do is find some way to get the bones super hot, then just turn them into ash, collect that ash, maybe use a different acid, probably sulfuric as calcium sulfate is insoluble, Then extract the Phosphoric acid from that, and eventually turn that into WP, then RP.
I feel you on the smell , if you’ve ever made soup from whole chicken carcass such that it dissolves the bones & you let it go too long it starts to smell wack. I think there must be some smelly amino acids liberated
I love the clown trip house jingle going on with the juxtaposition of the jank ass shit chemistry, busted toaster oven with the beaker keeping it closed, etc... made me feel like if someone walked in on me watching this i would feel shame.
I'm so happy, back in June, in the subreddit I started a thread to remind bones and Halloween. And yes we did. And we gave ya months of start time :) we love you!
Not sure if this would work or not, but after putting the bones in a fire to burn off all the organic material, then crushing the bone into a powder, I would have tried dissolving the powder in dilute nitric acid, slowly adding nitric until it’s all dissolved so as to eliminate the step of having to neutralize the acid. From there I would give it a vacuum filtering, then put the solution in a container and pour table salt in to it. According to the reactivity series of metals, that should make the calcium precipitate out of the solution as the sodium from the salt goes into solution in a single displacement reaction. I imagine there would be a bunch of side reactions where you’d get possibly calcium chloride (among other compounds) from the calcium nitrate, since the calcium is reactive in water, it might react and turn in to calcium oxide, but at this point you could then filter and separate all the precipitated calcium compounds you now have which should put you that much closer to getting that sweet sweet reactive calcium metal. From there I have no idea. I imagine the the remaining steps would have to be done under oil or some solution calcium isn’t reactive in to get the pure metal out, but I really have no idea if even what I said above would even work. I’m coming from the angle of precious metal refining and I only work with copper, silver, gold and platinum group metals which I have very limited knowledge there, but it seems plausible.
It's the little touches in these videos, like failing to close the glove box after six tries, that really make it top tier chemistry
I would have slammed it after the second try. Impressed by his patience!!
@@HomemadeChemistry I was thinking the same thing. Lol, probably why half of everything I own is at least 50% broken
His car's somehow cleaner than mine...
@@AsymptoteInverse lmao
@Carrion Storm Don't forget "Chicken gas", TOP chemistry
Tom: tries to get food with a high bone:meat ratio
Also Tom: uses bird bones, which are famously light and hollow
Tom: u know I don't do B I O L O G Y
Should've used ribs
That point didn't even occur to me, but you're right.
He should have just bought marrow bones from a butcher
Well, using more solid bones such as ribs or any of the large animal bones would make the burnout process much longer.
Tom is like the opposite of a hippie: disgusted by anything natural or organic, longs for just some good ol' normal chemicals.
Just like back in the 60s.
@@Seldonlair the problem is that it's really hard to tell if you are serious, or making a joke.
Regardless, industrial and chemical pollutants are a huge problem, we aren't purely chemical beings and life would be easier if we were. As a phenomenon, we are also entropic and physically dynamic.
If the process of life is somewhat unique to us, then there is a process associated with us that sustains the denial of normal chemical reactions.
A regulatory process which is not chemical but mechanical, using homology structures for selective bias in genetic expression against mutations that would otherwise degrade the balance of substrates.
@@noahnoah2747 Dude. You just exemplified what not to do with a troll, and I wasn't even trolling you or anyone else.
No one likes a preacher.
@@Seldonlair awesome, I don't care
@Noah Noah wow this comment might be the most pseudo-intellectual thing i've ever read. What are you on about m8?
I love me some discusting low calcium flesh
Integza just here hiding in the comments hey bud
Love your work keep it up
Your muscles also need calcium, to work properly.
@@BlackSoap361 i did not know that
I like your channel. I've been watching for years
Tomatoes also have quite a bit of calcium
NileRed: "So now we made our plastic gloves into this fine, 99,5% pure crystalline Pulver..."
Tom: YOU GOTTA READ BETWEEN THE TAR!!!
That's why I love this channel 😂
"Our bones are covered in disgusting low calcium flesh."
me: *takes notes*
If you knew how to your wings, there'd be less flesh left to burn off
Yeah i liked that one too xD
I will henceforth remove my flesh
Use a chemical digestor to get rid of the low calcium, but high energy content flesh.
E: Yea, ok, bone-charcoal works too.
The flesh is weak, brother.
As someone who repairs vac pumps for a living, you’re a monster.
@@0verv0ltage haha vor allem ne ölpumpe xD
wenn ich mich dran erinner wie unsere Pumpe aussah in der Ausbildung.... Da konnt ich vorhersagen was der letzte gekocht hat XD
He said sorry!
I feel like he felt genuinely bad about it, and His apology seemed sincere.
It was a sincere apology and I felt bad about it and I'll probably do it again
@@ExtractionsAndIre you’re a good lad.
Hydroxyapatite is really stable, doesn't decompose till, like 1200 C. You should have just burned the shit out of those bones until the ash was completely white, that would have completely solved the tar problem. Also, butchers will usually have some large cow bones in stock, for dogs.
My sentiments exactly.
So now he needs to make ANOTHER calcium extraction video! :D
Follow up video next year? 👀
You know what they say, weeks in the lab will save you hours in the library.
@@aaronlastname7775 Damn you now there is coffee on my keyboard desk and screen.
Me, a cook: Oh, you need the flesh off the bones. Boil the bones then dude, easy :) yep, boil the bones. Just...boil the bones, brother. *Boil the b* -- *BOIL THE BONES MAN*
Yeah, it’s nearly as bad as NileRed’s cooking lmao
The answer is SOUP
I think chicken bones (at least of ones used in meat production) would have relatively little Calcium
because
1 - they're brittle
2 - chickens were bred to grow meat fast (which would mean grow bones fast)
3 - their diet and lifestyle were not designed to make particularly strong bones
I didn’t realize you had a second channel! Oops! Haha. It’s so interesting to see the similarities and differences in our procedure!
Absolutely! And it's nice to see my own theories (and the theories of most of the comments) of where the project went wrong be confirmed in your video - mainly the temperature of furnace and how much more I should have heated the bones.
Was cool to see we came up with similar methods, but you can never underestimate experience, you sure know how to furnace things good!
I love the effort put into both of yalls videos! I enjoyed them both very much! Fuckin "CHICKEN GAS" had me crackin up!!! Much love and Happy Halloween to both of yall.
You've missed out on some top tier chemistry shitposting, highly recommended to check out the rest!
took me about a year to figure out that explosions and fire and extractions and Ire were in fact different channels and that I was not just remembering the name wrong every time a new video popped up
@@ExtractionsAndIre Cody has insane experience given his charcoal series haha
"I've got quite a few questions about this project, even though I'm the one... that... came up with it"
I feel like this is the motto for most Ph.D's and post grad work
Haha yes true
Extractions&Ire I know this is unrelated buuuuuuuut.
When you finally synthesise cubane, should put some of it in a small ornate vial (or at least something clean and not hideous)
And a certificate or any proof of what it is and cast it in resin like how some people cast whiskey bottles so you have a nice trophy to display for your hard work.
@@CephalonLux nah blow it all up
And therapist
"You gotta read between the tar" spoken like a true organic chemist xD
This 100% feels like a hellish chimera of Cody's Lab & Michael Reeves
@Spin Lock Thats literally the point.
But more like old michael: poor
"Now I am become Tar, the destroyer of yields"
This needs to be an official Ex+F merch T-shirt
God damn I didn't know chickens were such heavy smokers
👏.👏.👏.
Missed a golden opportunity to be placed on a new and much more interesting watch list by asking the discord to mail you bones.
@Dewdrops Good ol' Boneghazi
legendary quotes of 2021:
"Godamn chicken Gas" -Extractions&Ire, 2021
I nominate "You have to read between the tar."
@@user54389
Reading between the tar is literally organic chemistry 101
I know this smell, as I burn chicken bones for my plants... It's burnt chicken smell, like after you cook chicken but too far and burn it 😜
And he turned himself into a gas. Funniest shit I have ever seen.
Sounds like a horrible chemical (or biological?) weapon
I don't know why but the stir bar wriggling around like a maggot in the shit soup made me laugh far too much
Last year's halloween special was spooky in a dangerous way, this year's was spooky in an existential way. Watching you suffer through this, then have your project idea done by someone who specializes in metallurgy and get a way better result was painfully relatable.
Hate to tell you this Tom, but there's definitely a food with a better bone ratio, and they call them "bones" 😂 turns out that's a thing you can just get on it's own
@Eddie Hitler maybe milk bone or something like that bird bones yeahy yeah not alot uh milk in there
@Eddie Hitler yeah i would be very interested in that. I will have to google it because i have no idea how much calcium is actually in dentin and enamel
@Eddie Hitler perhaps next Halloween?
a far better way to get clean bone is with Cuttlefish bone and its not filled with marrow like other bones are.
Yeah, bone meal is super easy to get. Would have saved a lot of effort
Very nice video!
Funnily enough I've worked on that matter commercially as a chemical engineer on scales of 30 t batches. I would like to point you to the process of bone gelatine production! The first step in that is the bone preparation. Which ends with demineralization of the protein structures with hydrochloric acid. Which actually seems to be the most efficient according to the literature I read back then. Literature on that is sparce but not unattainable. There's a paper by P. J. Makarewicz on the kincetics and lab scale trials, A. G. Ward and A. Courts have a series of monographs on the topics and there is a "Gelatin Handbook" by Gareis that gives overview over the general ideas.
You can usually precipitate snow white calcium phosphates, sulphates or carbonate (whatever you choose) from the resulting solutions. Would be amazing if you tried that process because gelatin production is such a forgotten topic! Although not very chemistry to be honest...
Quick run through the steps:
Crushing of the bones to bone chips.
Enzymatic removal of flesh and other tissues followed by defatting with hot water (there's a lot of fat in bones hence why the tar-fest) . Although they did that with petrol up until the 80s or something. And since you don't want to make food grade stuff from the collagenous bone parts you should be able to remove the fats with solvents as well. Step by step extraction of clacium with acid solutions
“Gelatin production isn’t really chemistry” proceeds to go on about the chemistry… I’m smell science…. Or maybe that’s the chicken gas 🤣 sounds like chemistry to me man, cool information as well!
epic comment very good!
This comment is oozing with chemistry love. I appreciate it.
Is that a typo? Did you mean greater than 8% or less than 8% acid? I'm going to try this when i eventually get the time to get back in my lab
@@markshort9098 While I'm less than an amateur, a quick search turned up a bunch of papers and posts on using acidic solutions to dissolve collagen: "Collagen generally gets solubilzed in acidic condition. My experiments need collagen to be at neutral pH. But It's really getting difficult as collagen precipitate when the pH was increased."
So, a lot of the proteins in bone matrix are soluble like collagens. You can use a slow cooker and whatever bones you start with to make a delicious broth by extracting it. If done correctly the remaining bone is extremely weak and can easily be crushed to powder. I would have made bone broth then taken the clean, weak bone and used something like a pair of food cans nested in a capsule and burnt it in a charcoal fire (possibly with a blower) to destroy as much of the remaining organic as possible. From there you’d know the chemistry better than I would, I’m just a civil engineer who likes cooking.
That's a great idea. I agree that the difficulties began with the pyrolysis. Before reading your comment, I would have just tried to pyrolyse them as much as possible ensuring that the process was being fed enough oxygen.
My thoughts come from things I've read about alchemists who often used bone ash, which is usually a light grey colour once it is fully pyrolysed, not the black abomination created here hehe.
I then would have done electrolysis on the calcium chloride
@@edwinsalisbury83 That's cheating
@@oldnelson4298 why? After all Humphry Davy did electrolysis on molten calcium hydroxide
@@edwinsalisbury83 If you did that in a casino you'd be thrown out
It never ceases to amaze me how much chemistry involves tar and poo colored solutions.
Try clinical chemistry 🤣
and piss color. don't forget piss color
@@joshc5613Don’t forget cum color.
@03:13 I love the glove-box-close editing. Show the struggle for an uncomfortable length of time, then, cut to the end, leaving the viewer with the burning question, "How long did it REALLY take to close that glove box?"
The contrast between your setup and Nile red's setup is for some reason just hilarious to me
Lawful good and chaotic neutral
@@MetalicDeathSloth lawful chaotic vs chaotic lawful
If you look at some of Nile's earlier videos, it's kinda similar to EnF's
Nilered's looks more professional and this guy's stuff looks like a Walter white stuff
@@danielwols Walter Brown
I might have tried keeping the bones at high heat for a longer time, that'd probably burn off more of the organics. Apparently cremated remains are mostly calcium phosphates, so cremating the chicken could work.
Or just leave bones in garden for few days so bugs would clean them... If you want "raw bones" 😅
@@paranoiia8 they would still have lots of organics, bones are 30% protein by weight
@@ficolas2 Well, museums use bugs to clean bones, bugs and ants can clean bones really nicely if you want clean "raw bones" without damaging them or changing their content. In chemical perspective they would not be clean from organic material but they would be clean for any external materials(meat tendons)
@@paranoiia8 yeah and that's not what you need to get calcium from them, burning is the way to go
That is exactly what I was thinking - why did not he burn the thing completely to ashes until all the oily black color is gone. Too much chicken chloride (I don't know any better words to describe the stuff) was still left in solution and it gave him a lot of trouble at every stage.
I would've dissolved the toasted bones in hydrochloric acid, boiled it down, and then chucked the whole mess into a Piranha solution bath. That should've destroyed everything organic and selectively precipitated out the calcium as insoluble calcium sulfate. And to get calcium metal...who knows man. High temperature electrolysis of the chloride? A "thermite-style" reduction with lithium or magnesium?
The strangeness and oddity that is such a specific and "peculiar" idea happening SO close to Cody's Lab doing the same is freaky.
Also the people who genuinely worried you were going to use your own bones should always be accompanied by an adult for their own safety.
Just want you to know, I love your videos, grade A content my friend. I'm not a chemist, im a mechanical engineer, but I quite enjoy your videos. Always cheers up my day, you're hilarious. Keep up the good work.
Tried this recipe and my kids can't get enough of this spoopy seasonal treat! Great cooking channel, clear and family friendly instructions!
'I'l get some bones with good calcium content!"
CHOOSES HOLLOW BIRD BONES
"Turning chickens into tar" would sound a bit more halloween-like
I think there's a Far Side cartoon, here. I just don't know what it would be
When did I like your comment? When did I watch this video before? I clicked this video thinking “oh this is cool” and I see that I’ve already liked the comment.
@@handleonafridge6828 *Just A Burning Memory intensifies*
Brings a new and exciting meaning to "tar and feather".
Chickens is just tar in solution
I skimmed the comments and could tell by about the 3 minute mark that this video might not turn out well. You've got my respect for going on through with it and posting. Wish I had the kind of follow through displayed here. Towards the end you had me thinking you might've just cracked the recipe for turning trash into multivitamins XD
I've never seen wings served in a bag like that, but it makes infinitely more sense than milk in a bag.
Not a chemist, but when you are making concrete from scratch and you dont have access to limestone you can just take sea shells and burn them for a long time under high heat then dissolve the remains in water. I think burning the bones a lot longer and a lot hotter would have solved a lot of your tar
This, pretty much. You can just burn the bones all the way to ashes in some sort of inert recipient; this should leave only metal oxides (calcium, sodium, magnesium, etc. oxides), and get rid of all the non-metals/organics as CO2/NO2/H2O/etc.
Then you can just drop the ashes in acid to dissolve, then separate the calcium as an insoluble salt like calcium carbonate, just as originally planned in the video.
That's how I'd do it, at least (assuming I had an appropiate recipient/flame to do the calcination step).
Agree.
The oils and proteins would just become CO2 and nitrogen oxides.
Calcium oxide and calcium phosphate would be left.
I think it's call "calcining".
Great video, in addition to the chemistry there's a great subplot about an Australian man struggling to learn english.
Already giggling like crazy minutes in. Aww, man, I missed you. Life is better with you.
he's got another channel, explosions and fire. he uploads more frequently there
this is my first time watching one of your videos, and I love it! You are so informative and entertaining at the same time, great stuff! subbed for life!
Im at the part where hes got his beaker of calcium carbonate and Im just taking a moment to appreciate all the work he had just put into making Lime from bones
Please extract iron from blood next, then u can combine calcium and iron to create a "being" with alchemy
Ok edward elric
That may cost an arm and a leg
That’s the law of equivalent exchange after all
@@Bobsry16 idk about bone marrow but I think there could be iron in it
I remember someone somewhere doing the math on making a sword out of the iron in blood. It turned out to be "I run a slaughterhouse" amounts of blood. There is very little iron in there.
You are an amazing organic chemist! You can even make tar out of inorganics!!!
chicken bones are not inorganics
"You gotta read between the tar."
I'll put that quote in my PhD thesis. Thanks.
And to you, random youtuber: If you read this comment in -~2-3 years- 2026 or later please remind me.
It’s not that long yet but don’t forget!
Are you done yet ?
6-month check-in
@@hovant6666 Haven't even started yet :D
I was trying to score an internship to save up a bit of cash before starting my PhD but no luck so far.
@@gamingmarcus Ach, good luck with the struggle lad
Came for the bones, stayed for the aphex twin.
This was a more entertaining way to do it than Cody did :) ... I think at the end there, I would have just heated it to carbonize all the tar, then dissolve in water and filter the carbon out.
"I am a tar connoisseur" I love this channel. The comments are amazing too!
Welcome to the channel. Safety Third!
mate, get yourself a kiln. kilns are G r e a t at turning organic chemistry into inorganic chemistry.
plus if you fuck around with the atmospheres inside the kiln you can do all kinds of metal-based reactions
Atom bombs are great at turning organic things into inorganic things
@@blackfeathers2166 that’s a tad bit dark
He has kiln watch the rest of his vids.
@@PhillGaul well w h y d i d n ' t h e u s e i t t h e n
@@Dabeliboss it's actually quite bright
10/10 would watch again. Being bamboozled by chemistry I don't understand whilst also simultaneously watching the screen turn deep fried because of the occurance of tar is an eye opening experience, would recommend
24:42 - The edit here is comedy gold
Awesome video. Thank you
The music in these videos is just as anxiety inducing as are the safety measures. I love it! Thank you for the entertainment. I do recommend more safety.
This was absolutely disgusting start to finish yet still incredibly enjoyable
Overall a very interesting video, I enjoyed watching it, and it is on brand for E&F because it's a chemistry shitposting channel first and foremost, so it did perfectly well.
Tho, for the actual extraction I'd have:
Bought cow bones, y'know, you can just ask the local butcher for bones.
Some boiling would soften the meat and degrade the marrow, making it easier to strip off.
Then strip as much of the flesh as possible with a knife.
With meatless bones you can just leave them to dry, a couple of hours in a 90°C oven would suffice
Once the bones are boiled and dry they should be pretty brittle, so you could grind them a bit to make them easier to deal with
Afterwards, incinerating the bones (calcinating? just leave them at 500°C in a crucible)
You should be left with just ashes, which are mostly sodium and calcium carbonates and phosphates, way easier to extract calcium from there on, without having to deal with tar, or W H A C K smells.
Boiling and drying doesn't yet make bones very brittle. Definitely hard to crush. But after strong heating they are very brittle.
But there will be no chicken gas then...
Finally, actual bone hurting juice
The bone juice is hurting me, how the tables have turned
@@ExtractionsAndIre Tom IS the bomb 🎃👻🔊🎵🎙️🎧🥁
Who usually does your soundtrack? What software / hardware? 🙂
Apex Twin is good too though 😏
@@ExtractionsAndIre c'mon mate atleast you should have make calcium metal
Main channel video when
Fucking love your videos
tom hurting bone juice
"read between the tar"
Best quote from the video, and there were so many contenders.
Video was entertaining and then informative as usual!
*Edit "I've had enough of shitshows at the moment" replaces earlier best quote
This video is pure internet gold! I had a smile the whole time watching. Can't wait for the E&F follow up video; Turning bone to explosives.
"God damn chicken gas"
Is so fucking esoteric, that it will legitimately haunt me for the rest of my days. Thanks a ton lol
its incredibly high quality. I was astounded and satisfied.
I had to stop the video to catch my breath I was laughing so hard!
Chicken Gas would absolutely be my band name if I was even remotely musically talented.
Much better smelling than "God damn human gas" :) :) :)
:)
I used an audio editor to remove the "G" so I have a sound clip of him saying "goddamn chicken ass"
Was the "whack smell" reminiscent of pyridine? IIRC pyridine was originally obtained from the destructive distillation of bones.
nah pyridine isn't as bad as yall say lol
Came here to ask exactly this question. +1
Everything this man touches turns to tar, it's amazing !
i wish i could donate my bones to this cause
how much milk you drink?
@@ExtractionsAndIre not enough cos i cant get up from bed in the morning welp
I mean..... There is always a way.
@@ExtractionsAndIre I've been drinking plenty of dairy lately, i am 100% fit for this
ho gosh, just found out about your second channel, I just LOVE your energy, editing, and the subjects you tackle, glad this exists :)
The creep of explosions and fire shitpost editing style into extractions and ire continues, and I am living for it!
I feel like NileRed could make a massively popular third channel that's just him reacting to watching your videos.
"But you know what? We're just gonna f*ing stumble and suffer our way through this project."
I like your attitude, that's how a real analytical chemist talks!
"Fuck it, lets give it a shot!"
How advanced chemistry is born.
Yeah tom defo be like that with making cubane in his fucking shed lol
That attitude is my senior project in a nutshell
@@grimnekropolis8500 You go dude, there's a treat in the end of the tunnel. Well, I hope so anyway. =)
@@Tranarpnorra definitely learned some interesting things… like poly lacticacid dissolves in chloroform
"back when i thought the channel would be epic meal time with BONES"
So many ways those bones could have been cleaned before it became a black mess. Soxhlet extractor comes to mind as a standard chemistry tool. Ants and sun bleaching would be the way to start, afterward crushing and Soxhlet would at least be a bit cleaner. Clean, pulverize, extract organics, purify with fire, then put in solution and precipitate - that's how I would have gone about it.
P.S. I'm a new sub but a big fan. love that you shameless put out this train wreck of an experiment -- it's like I could do that too! Please don't ever use a glass rod or funnel when pouring your solvents. I laughed so hard at the paint stripper spilled all over a painted lab bench top. If only you had included a clip cleaning the paint off the bottom of the flask.
...but seriously, I love you man. Be safe (mostly, you know).
Now to watch Cody's video!
In the last step you could have used interphase crystalization in cold (acidic water+ethanol)/dcm as a way to obtain pure crystals of CaCl2. Picking a good ratio of water ethanol could lead to a decent yield.
I like your channel :)
This channnel is absolutely my favorite thing on RUclips right now
The perfect Australian to combat lockdownerism. The explosives expert.
"expert"
I much prefer "Lock-down syndrome"
@Sketcho Fink imagine having at least 3x the deaths of your neighbors just cause you're selfish
@Sketcho Fink right right time to take my camera to the changeroom
Oh wait safety. Hm.
@@juliaf_ What exactly are you on about?
In elementary school, a million years ago, we did an experiment: we poured vinegar over the bones and left it for a few days until all the minerals dissolved in the liquid and only soft collagen was left. Maybe isolating calcium from a vinegar solution would be easier than burning bones?
Vinegar is just acetic acid, so any acid would do. I think the tar could have been avoided in some respect if the collagen was removed before burning the bones (Someone else commented that if you slow cook the bones, the collagen in the bone matrix is dissolved, leaving the minerals in the bone - which could then provide the calcium with less organics)
@@belzi87 But if using a low grade acid like Acetic will leave collagen behind, it would be a good starting point
Also curious if a Piranha solution start would have been a good starting point since you'd remove all the carbon at the start too
@@CyberGenesis1 Piranha would just dissolve the whole thing completely
@@ZeroPlayerGame my high school chem is extremely rusty but wouldn't the acid dissolve the bones and the CaSO4 precipitate out? or the surface layer of CaSO4 just completely stops the rest of the bone from reacting? asking completely out of curiosity.
Oh yeah, you might be right - CaSO4 is very stable even in highly acidic conditions.
the "just gotta get my bag of bones out of the glove compartment" bit was hilarious ( a pencil fell in the crack so it wouldn't close lmaooooooo)
I've had some heartfelt laughs in this video, although over half a year late
thanks tom, you really never fail to amaze with your content
I remember reading somewhere that the public in the uk collected bones during WOII to extract the phosphorus. Got a procedure for making white phosphorous from bone in a home chemistry book from the 50s. Which is an interesting chemical but not very nice to have around the house.
Bleached and cleaned bones, grind to powder, dissolve everything in strong acid, filter, precipitate an insoluble calcium salt. Avoiding those organics and polymers is really tricky. Your purification steps were well thought out
Missed an opportunity to call the HCL "bone hurting juice", it's a liquid that "hurt" the bones.
Eh
One thing you could've done, if you had prepared this a bit earlier in advance (and by a bit earlier I mean a couple of months lol), is to just leave your leftovers in a bucket of water with a mostly-sealed lid and let all the flesh rot off over time. It does take a while, you have to periodically swap out the water, and it is *quite* stinky, but it is a very, very effective way to isolate bone. I do speak from experience, as I once preserved a crow skull in this manner. It goes faster if the water is warm, tbf--I did this in autumn in Minnesota, so you'd probably get it done quicker in a place where the ozone layer hasn't been invented yet. Another method is to stick the leftovers in a bucket with some dermestid beetles, if you have them. I did not, and I'm not certain how viable an option that would have been in Australia, but it does go faster and is far less smelly.
Also, fun fact--by using the water method, I actually got some saponification to occur on my crow skull! This is a relatively common thing that happens to corpses in cool, wet environments; they form a substance called adipocere, or corpse wax. Could be something to look into for next halloween? 👀
How well that cubane joke aged! ahaha
Keep up the good work mate! good to see another Aussie at it!
for some reason I totally thought you were gonna put them on a meat ant mound to get rid of the meat. it's not exactly chemistry but I guess ants are just really complicated chemicals. great video!
Hello fellow Bones watcher.
We need a “God damn chicken gas” remix
Xd
Someone made a techno song with the LORT quote "They're taking the hobbits to Isengard" as the only lyrics, and it actually worked, so we need to find Tom a good DJ who can cook up the Chicken Gas Remix for him :P
@@andersjjensen Oh yeah I remember that one! Something like that would be awesome
Finally, the mad lad actually did it
Edit: rewatching this a couple months later...a cleaner method might have been getting bone meal from a gardening place, so you get no oils or fat or whatever.
You know I always pictured Al Noble and Pasteur and guys like that doing chemistry.
They’re just doing stuff out in the backyard with a pretty good idea of what’s meant to happen intellect,
but with a “your guess is as good as mine” attitude
Thanks Cody for the pointer to this channel. Looks great to fill the time between yr videos.. edit. This is a great video, especially the spectrometry at the end. Also love the style and the music ... Sounds a bit like aphex twin. Liked + subscribed
This extraction almost has an alchemy vibe to it.
And I loved that!
I think beef ribs would have been easier and boiling to remove the flesh like they do in taxidermy would leave you with a cleaner starting point.
I was watching this in my shed because I forgot my keys and had to wait for someone and I was just having a shit day in general, now it's a little better thanks tom
Seriously amazing music choices in this video, Aphex!
I've watched dozens of these videos now and I don't know any more about Chemistry! DOZENS.
Aha! By uploading a day early you've fallen directly into my trap, and uploaded a video on my birthday. Thanks for the birthday wishes, but strictly in the "thanks I hate it" sense. Cheers from NZ
@@0verv0ltage germany is just a shit version of austria-hungary
I'd recommend the following improvements. First of all I'd start with bone meal which you can buy at any hardware store. Second I'd recommend calcining the material much longer and at hotter temperatures to drive off the organic impurities and carbon. Third I'd recommend using a soxhlet extractor to remove the organic impurities. If I was going for elemental calcium I would melt it in a stainless steel crucible and use dry electrolysis to separate out the metal. I wouldn't worry about purity too much since the only impurities would be alkali metals.
Thanks a lot for this warm video! Had my fair share of laughs! 😂
As an electronics engineer with exactly 0 knowledge in chemistry, I really enjoy your videos. They are so innocent and down to earth. Broken grad cylinder? Bah! Measures just fiiiine.
Great! 🤣
Cody: Jank equipment, impressively clean reaction
Tom: Proper lab equipment, horrible jank reaction (TAR)
Edit: The unhinged laughter inmediately after he opens up the (im)pure calcium chloride beaker. That's why we watch this channel.
Bro I don't know anything about chemistry but I love watching your videos, I come back and re-watch these things all the time, in the least terroristy way possible
This man is single handedly keeping the plastic spoon companies in business lol
5:47 Bird bones are mostly air. Next time get a ham bone or beef bone from the butcher. They have lots.
I'm gonna try doing this eventually, the only difference being I'll be going after the phosphorous.
I think what I'll do is find some way to get the bones super hot, then just turn them into ash, collect that ash, maybe use a different acid, probably sulfuric as calcium sulfate is insoluble,
Then extract the Phosphoric acid from that, and eventually turn that into WP, then RP.
Use piss. Plenty in that.
I feel you on the smell , if you’ve ever made soup from whole chicken carcass such that it dissolves the bones & you let it go too long it starts to smell wack. I think there must be some smelly amino acids liberated
I love the clown trip house jingle going on with the juxtaposition of the jank ass shit chemistry, busted toaster oven with the beaker keeping it closed, etc... made me feel like if someone walked in on me watching this i would feel shame.
We have an appropriate song for this in New Orleans" Save the Bones For Henry Jones" by various artists.
I'm so happy, back in June, in the subreddit I started a thread to remind bones and Halloween. And yes we did. And we gave ya months of start time :) we love you!
Satire: When comes your book?: 101 Ways to make Tar
lmao this is hilarious. I think it would even bring attention from non-chemists too
AND things that turn gd yellow.
@@matthewellisor5835 That is the main pre-cursor to Tar.
favorite part of every video is watching him shake his hand while explaining complex mechanisms
Not sure if this would work or not, but after putting the bones in a fire to burn off all the organic material, then crushing the bone into a powder, I would have tried dissolving the powder in dilute nitric acid, slowly adding nitric until it’s all dissolved so as to eliminate the step of having to neutralize the acid. From there I would give it a vacuum filtering, then put the solution in a container and pour table salt in to it. According to the reactivity series of metals, that should make the calcium precipitate out of the solution as the sodium from the salt goes into solution in a single displacement reaction. I imagine there would be a bunch of side reactions where you’d get possibly calcium chloride (among other compounds) from the calcium nitrate, since the calcium is reactive in water, it might react and turn in to calcium oxide, but at this point you could then filter and separate all the precipitated calcium compounds you now have which should put you that much closer to getting that sweet sweet reactive calcium metal. From there I have no idea. I imagine the the remaining steps would have to be done under oil or some solution calcium isn’t reactive in to get the pure metal out, but I really have no idea if even what I said above would even work. I’m coming from the angle of precious metal refining and I only work with copper, silver, gold and platinum group metals which I have very limited knowledge there, but it seems plausible.