How to Stabilize Wood and What is Stabilization
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- Опубликовано: 25 июл 2024
- Stabilizing wood can be a great way to use scraps that are not solid enough for general use. How to Stabilize Wood it a question that has come up a lot more recently since I made a video making a couple mallets: • Making Mallets for Tal...
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This was super helpful, of course now I have to save every last tiny scrap of wood in the shop.
Lol. Yup got to love that pile of almost sawdust scraps for some future project!
frank howarth wait, you don’t do that already?
Same, I already had a problem...
Got a 55 gallon garbage can full.
Year
Very useful! I am fixing to start into turning and I kept running across this as a suggestion without explanation of what it is. Thank you very much for the info and demo.
That was the simplest, most easily understood demo I have ever seen for this. Thank you for sharing this, not nearly as difficult or intimidating as I thought. Thank you!!
thanks David. that means a lot
@@WoodByWright I was wondering can you glue this stabilised wood to untreated wood.
I'm thinking of trying this for bass fretboards..
Your thoughts would be appreciated
@@WoodByWright is there some place where I can private message you? Or even FB. Thank you!
Came here to say the same thing!
Thank you for your time and video . 👍🏻 Very helpful and easy to understand. All the best. 🤝
I just now found your channel, and the info youve given me today and the quality of your videos im surprised that you dont have more subscribers, you taught me/showed me alot of good stuff today. And today was a day I wish I knew all this before hand. But such is learning curves sometimes!
Ty sir. I have started to fo some wood rings. And I have been watching people stabilize wood. But they never went onto detail. So this helped alot.
James this is great info. Thanks!!!
thanks My pleasure!
James, this is the best video I’ve seen on stabilization and I’ve seen quite a few. Your explanation between Cactus Juice and epoxy was super. While I don’t have a need to stabilize anything right now I’m sure that sometime in the future I’ll want to. The information in your video will be very helpful when I do. Thanks.
Thanks man. That means a lot.
Exactly the advice and product links I was looking for! Also, that clip at the end made me crack up, subbed.Well played Wright.
Thanks. Glad I could help.
Thank you for the video! Very well done and clearly explained. I appreciate it!
Best stabilization vid I've seen so far. Thanks for your hard work.
Thanks Thomas! that means a lot.
No sooner did I ask the question and you do a video on it...excellent, and informative..I had been watching the Tally Ho Restoration for a while now and all I can say is that kid is a genius...Nathaniel Bowdich would be very proud.
LOL my pleasure. thanks Neil. I am really hoping to get out there and help him again some time.
That was really really worth watching. thank you for this great video.
Thanks. My pleasure.
Awesome. This video answered all my questions.
Wonderful video! Took the mystery out of stabilization! Thanks!!!!
Great video, clear and full explanation!! Thanks
Thanks for the info James. I want to get into pen turning and I've been saving some nice spalted tulipwood for it. Time to get into stabilising.
Damo
Sweet man. Don't have too much fun!
Darn! I just burned a bunch of nice looking cherry pen blanks because of a little rot. Didnt know about this option. Thank you very much James for sharing this! I am totally going to order this stuff. Thank you!
thanks man. my pleasure. it is perfect for that!
Stabilisation explained very well.. I have a vacuum pot so I can give it a go thank you for the video
Sweet! thanks!
Seriously the best demo vid on this I’ve ever seen. Well done man. I feel confident I can do this now.
Thank you. I'm glad I could help out.
Thank you for sharing! Even 4 years later it`s helping people like me
Exactly the response I wanted to my question from the other video, thank you!
Thanks I'm glad you like it.
I got the supplies to do this a year ago and was just intimidated by the process too much to take a day and get it figured out. This was an extremely easy to understand tutorial, and I’ll be doing this soon.
Cool. Let me know if you have any questions I'd love to help you out.
Wow this was extremely helpful and fun to watch!!! Thank you so much!
thanks. my pleasure
Great video. It pretty much answers all my questions. Thanks.
thanks! glad I could help!
Great video! Thank you for the info.
Great video, you’ve convinced my to make a vacuum chamber. Your explanation of stabilizing was great, it’s not so intimidating now.
Thanks man. Glad I can help.
Great video on the topic! Thank youuuu
I’m looking at making outdoor signs, this seems like a great technique for that.
You'd have to go full on imagination. For example, do to the material and zippers they use for space suits. Keeping the zippers up out of the several expensive gallons of juice.
Pain, BUT, when done, you would have what you were hoping for.
Meanwhile, consider doing what I did for years, and argued with the then [and now] expert in finishing about - saturating the wood with thinned poly, in stages, letting the solvent gas off.
Deep penetration, in my opinion, ALWAYS trumps surface coats that require more maintenance.
If you want to share ideas, do a search for ImaginationUnincorporated, which is me. Then contact me via that information.
Seems to be the best wood stablization video I found so far. Explanations are great too. But I imagine that this is a bit of an overkill and completely changes the density and composition to try to use on guitar builds... I'm from a place where we have very little humidity so the indian rosewood fretboard I got started to bend almost as soon as it arrived so now I have it clamped lightly on a flat surface hoping it doesn't warp or start to crack as it dries.
Thanks for the info James! 👍👊
my pleasure Fred!
That was interesting James. Thank you for the tutorial on wood stabilization and the stabilization chamber. My wife hundreds of rose bushes at one time and as some died when I dug them up the roots were actually big enough to make somersmall. Most were pretty solid but some pieces would have a punky spot or two. I have saved them hoping to be able to use them One day and I believe you have given me the anwer. Thank you and God bless.
That sounds like a great project. Nice man!
200 c or 200f
I like your philosophy of trying to match any old wood to a use where it will work. nice one
Thanks!
I find(and found this, the other day,) really interesting. Thanks James...rr
it is so much fun to play with!
Great tutorial! I've been sitting on a bunch of birch burls that I've been wanting to dig into, but it's so dang spongey, it would just crumble as soon as I started working with it. Gonna try this out. Thanks, homie!
Nice relaxing video full of information. Thanks! :)
Thanks!
Nice one James. Good video as usual
thanks.
thanks for the info, very helpful!
thanks! my pleasure!
Thanks for the vid man. Also vacuum chambers have no pressure. Which implies positive pressure. They have a negative pressure or “vacuum“ . And you would pump atmospheric pressure out, not in. As for the pvc its warning is against positive pressure, no negative. Also, the valve wo a line is basically an air bleed, you dont have to start the pump with it open. You can leave it closed always til ur ready to take the lid off if the chamber is under vacuum. Thanks for the vid man
They still have pressure, the pressure is simply lower than atmospheric pressure
@@stevenleadeswhich is called vacuum
thank you for sharing this knowledge
my pleasure!
Hi, great video well detailed. Do you leave the vacuum pump ON for the full duration when sacking all the air out of the wood? Or just like the pressure pot once it gets to the desired level switch off and leave as it is?
It depends on how good your valves are. If I can get it down low enough and close it then I do. But most the time it takes a good 20 minutes plus to get it all the way down to a solid vacuum.
Good tip, James!
thanks William
very good video, i learned a lot! thank you!
My pleasure thanks for watching.
Great video. I've been thinking about getting the supplies to do this. I have a bunch of spalted stuff that is getting too punky to work with. This would work. :)
sounds perfect!
Right.
As a bowyer I'd love a discussion on the changes to the mechanical properties of stabilizing wood. We have similar needs to people in the fishing rod hobby. High tensile and compression strength.
How long do you think the chamber will last with the resin? If you look in the description of the chamber it does say "Chambers are not compatible with stabilization resin (i.e. Cactus Juice™, Gator Venom™, Minwax™ etc.)".... I'm not sure if this actually does anything that it wouldn't otherwise do to regular stabilizing chambers that are made for it. What are your thoughts?
it should last forever. two parts that can fail one is if you splash epoxy/resin up into the valves. the chamber itself looks to be made of stainless steel. the other part that might have issues is the seal getting hard and not sealing because you get epoxy/resin on it.
but then they sell the seals for cheap
They are just covering their backside. @zifnab has it on the head.
Make sure your chamber has a glass lid! The degassing chambers with plastic lids will fail! I know from experience.
I just cut down a black locust that is spalted and worm/ant tracked.
I was merely cutting it down to make way for 2 large mulberries to come down. I'm a little excited to see what it looks like when I get to milling it.
This spring I'm moving to town, so I'd figured I would do some maintenance logging before the place is sold, so I'm quite excited to see what all I end up with slabbing elm, black and honey locust, mulberry and a few others we haven't identified yet.
Originally I was just going to mill up a bunch of fence posts and call it good, but now I seem to be hooked on "gold mining" wood lol.
Having different options to stabilize and add value to certain woods is nice.
Sounds like a fun time.
VERY helpful, thank you!
Thank you, very informative!
Great informative video.
Thanks Brian!
Hey thanks I just cut up a burl I found & cant wait to make some knife handles out of it with your methods
sweet! sounds like fun!
Very clear and ilustrative, thank you for your video. I'm trying to learn because I want to start doing some things on wood and this video clarifies a lot my doubts about stabilizing wood. Can I ask you if vacuum is also the good way for stabilize wood + coloured resin?
thanks. sure I know several people that will add color to the resin.
Really well explained.. I’ve always been curious about the whole process. I’ve seen different colours in the past for the juice, is it dyes or you have to get the colour you want?
You can add a dye to it and change it to whatever color you want. The only downside to that is once you dye it it is hard to reuse it.
Terrific video!!
Great video. I've been wanting to learn more about this. I saw a thread on some web site where a guy made a small set up with a gallon pickle jar and a $25 hand operated brake bleeder pump from Harbor Freight, along with various fittings and some silicone.
ya I have seen that. the problem with the bike pump and no gauge is you 1. do not know how good the vacuum is, and 2. with a bike pump you can rarely get it halfway as far which is ok for most it just means the juice will not penetrate as far in some woods.
This guy used a brake bleeder pump thar had a gauge attached.
@@dannyhale7645 oh I miss read that sorry. I don't think I have seen that one. I will have to look for it.
I found it in a Google search it was on a site called The Shave Den. I think he was making scales for a straight razor.
Great video 👌🏻 thanks
Thanks mic
Thanks for the video!I see that you remove the vacuum,then add the vacuum again,watching for more bubbles,cycling a couple of times..I’ve seen some people leave the vacuum on until the bubbles disappear,usually 2 or 3 hrs,then release the vacuum and let sit. Is there a difference? If so,which is better?
I have done it both ways but I found it to work a bit better with cycling it. In the end it's just a personal preference.
amazing video!
Thanks.
Could you do the same thing with wood shavings from sanding or using a planer? Im thinking about using some of mine to make knife scales
Sure. That sounds like a great project!
Great video! Thank u. So for stabilizing you use the vacuum, but for removing bubbles from resin you use a pressure pump.? Is that correct? Thanks again. Total Beginner in San Fran 😀
both methods will remove bubbles. but it is easier to hold pressure then it is to hold a vacuum. With pressure, you compress the air bubbles tell they cannot be seen. with vacuum you remove the air from the resin.
Great video. Is Cactus Juice a food safe product. Can I use it to stabilize wood for spoons and such?
it does not state that on the label but like with epoxy I consider it food safe once cured. but everyone has a different level for what they consider "food Safe"
Nice video. I am not in the Cactus League yet as I recently started doing knife scales. I have made four knives with Ebony Macassar and have noticed some "puggyness" to the wood, especially after using and cleaning the knife for a week. Now I have two orders and think I should put the scales through the stabilizing process. Have you heard of using Winwax Wood Hardener with two parts Acetone?
sounds like fun. yes that works like a penetrating epoxy in that it hardens the surface. it will not stabilize the wood from expansion and contraction but it will harden it down a bit into the wood.
interesting, before I heard about different methods, but they are so complicated
Hello! My name is Alexandre and I live in the Brazilian Amazon. Congratulations for your work! I want to ask: have you stabilized Pinus, that pallet wood? How is the result? Thank you.
Yes you can stabilize pine. it works fine!
Thanks for the info. Been researching this topic for a while. So the Amazon description for the Chamber your using says it is NOT compatible with cactus juice. Please explain. Thankyou
That is there to cover their back side. there is nothing that it can harm as long as you do not get it into the hose or pump.
If I had a nickel for every tip you gave that blew my mind, I would be a rich man! That pvc pipe idea is gold!
Thanks man. I will try to keep them comming!
@@WoodByWright I've used big pvc pipe to steam with, but never would of thought to use it as a pressure chamber.
thank you
wow never heard of this very interesting. Does stabilizing actually eliminate wood movement. im trying to make carvings with inlays Would stabilizing help with movement ???
Stabilization makes less wood movement. It will still expand and contract due to temperature but far far less due to humidity..
I have a liberty hatch cover that I found on my property, can I stabilize the wood if it’s too large to fit in a vacuum pot? And oven? I imagine the resin won’t be able to penetrate the whole piece.
Without a full vacuum you would not be able to penetrate the whole piece. However with large items like that you really don't need to penetrate the whole piece. I would personally just use a penetrating epoxy depending upon how punky the wood is it will absorb in a 1/16-in to a quarter inch. And for most uses that's all you need. If you really want to try and pull it in a little bit further you can use a vacuum packing bag but that won't help that much more.
Woah, I didn't realize I had the video set at 1.5x and just though you were way to excited about playing with your wood.
Lol sounds about right.
I'm just learning about stabilization and I was curious if you still cure with cactus juice but don't have a vacuum system. I know it probably won't soak in as deep but I don't do turning but I do a lot of colored epoxy & polyurethane so I'd like to stop it soaking up so much.
you can do some of that just soak it over night, but for that you wold get better luck with penetrating epoxy.
I am curious about doing a large piece like a table top. I have done a couple of red oak ones and spent endless time filling tiny voids. What about putting the top in a polyethylene bag, pouring some epoxy and drawing a vacuum on the bag to suck the stuff into the voids? Then fill the larger voids?
That actually works fairly well. I've done that on a few of them. You just have to make sure you set up the bag right so that the air can get out without it drawing up into the vacuum hose. You won't get quite as good of a vacuum as this but it does good enough for filling cracks and voids and bug holes.
Have you cut any blocks open to see if the wood is fully stabilized? I was thinking in terms of using a stabilized block then cut in half for knife handle scales. Great video . 👍🏼
Yes. As long as you leave it with enough time and in that case you'll probably want to dry it completely first. You can do that by vacuum drying the block before adding the stabilizing agent. Or heating it in an oven to around 200° overnight. But yes I have cut open several large blocks. I had a mallet head a few years ago that I stabilized and drilled the handle hole all the way through it afterward. And it was fully stabilized in the middle.
Thanks so much. I want to start doing my own handle material. The price of the setup and resin would quickly pay for itself.
Nice video! Does stabilizing replace the need for a coat of polyurethane on the mallet, for example, or would you still wipe on a couple of coats?
I would never use poly on a mallet. it is jsut going to get banged up. I just use BLO and Paste wax. but even on this I use BLO.
Is the cactus juice a two part mixture?The stuff I’m seeing on amazon shows a small bottle that comes with the larger.
That is the activator. You put it in as soon as you get it in the mail. They do not add it at the factory as the trucks get hot and it may cure it in route. Once you add it this will sit on the shelf for years.
Can you use a pressure pot instead of a vacuum pot and achieve the same results. GREAT VIDEO!!!
Unfortunately no.
This was very good video but I have a few questions. Do you have to use vacuum chamber always or is it enough to leave the wood in cactus juice for a long time? For example a week or two. And does the wood need to be completely dry before the stabilization? Thank you for the answer.
Just soaking the wood for a few weeks. We'll get the resin a little ways into the wood, but it won't fully penetrate it. Even if you soaked it for a year or more it wouldn't make it all the way through. It does need to be dry. It doesn't have to be 100% dry though. Just very dry. Unless you're doing large pieces such as things more than 4 in a cross. Those you probably want to stick in the oven beforehand to make sure they're fully dry.
200 c is getting into the breakdown temperature of wood unless its fahrenheit. I an thinking boat construction and and termite proofing. I also wonder how cactus juice will take with resin dyes could be awesome, try red.
F and yes you can add does to it.
I am considering buying these tools myself and I can choose between a chamber with the valves on the lid or on the pot. Do you have any suggestions or comments.
I would get the valves on the lid. You want those as high as you can get them. You don't want accidental splashing to go back up and do a line.
how much weight does cactus juice add? thinking of stabilizing wooden drum sticks and they cant be too heavy.
Great video btw!
It depends on the wood. But if they're made out of maple like most of them are it may only be a few grams.
Can anyone tell me if the HF vac pump is sufficient and or good for 10 quart pot for stabilizing, I under stand it has a vacuum pull of 22 microns ????
It will work, but it will take a bit longer to pull a full vacume.
if i've got glued up wood already (my main medium is skateboards), does stabilization work? Existing glue is primarily titebond 3.
with scate boards there are no voids to fill. stabilization is mostly with wood that is too soft or has voids to fill. bit if there are void in the glue up then yes you can still do it even with glue.
Wood By Wright ahhh awesome!! i am making some climbing holds and miiight just want to fortify them just a bit more!!
I have a piece of cocobolo about 2x4x6 inches with hairline micro cracks on the ends about 1/8-1/4" deep would this cactus juice work on cocobolo? Would it fill in these extremely thin cracks?
Yes. This would work perfectly there. You want to make sure you take that vacuum down as far as it can possibly go though It takes a bit more force to get it through that type of wood.
So I have some really old pine that has lots of cracks. I want to turn some and use some for knife scales. Should I stabilize first then fill voids with epoxy?
Stabilizing is more for punky and rotin wood. And it does not work well with pine.
@@WoodByWright well that’s a bummer
Just out of curiosity, I bought a few 48”x9”x1” spalted maple boards for guitar tops. They’re pretty rough sawn wood so seem pretty porous but the splaying seems stable. Should I use the cactus juice to stabilize them more before using or is it not necessary?
As long as the boards are solid and they're not punky or soft you really don't need to stabilize.
Did you use the activator with the cactus juice? Great video thank you.
Yes. they cannot ship it with the activator in the bottle. Otherwise if it gets too hot in the truck it may cure the juce. so you have to add it when you get it but even after use the activator it will not set until it has been heated. when you add the activator it can sit on the shelf for several years still as long as you don't heat it up.
@@WoodByWright oh okay thank you for the clarification.
Hey I have a question.... how long c an I pull a vacume using total boat penetrating reson? the thickness of my materal is 1/4inx3inx5in it is bug eaten spalted maple. I plan on thining down the epoxy with asitone... thanks ,,,, Martin
You can pull a vacuum as long as you want. Usually I just keep it going until the epoxy sets. And then the vacuum won't do anything more.
Could i end up with a nice quality stabilization withouth a vaccumchamber, but instread just letting it soak for like a week or something? i kinda dont wanna spend alot of cash on a vaccum chamber, but i still wanna stabilise the wewd i got
For a few months you might get enough into it for a decent stabilization. But it would really take a lot for most woods.
Do you want to add a stain before stabilizing? Or will the stain come out during stabilization? If it does come out will the wood still accept a stain after stabilization?
Thank you for the video! Very informative!
it you want to add a stain do it after stabilization. the wood fibers will still absorb finish.
@@WoodByWright thanks for the tip!
I wander if I could do this to a vintage wood golf driver!
How does the wood glue to other wood after completing this process? Does it still bond as well as normal?
If it is a clean sanded or planned surface it glues the same as it did before.
What kind of wood can I stabilize? I have a hobby of making canes. My cane handles is usually made from soft wood.
You can stabilize any wood you want. Sometimes with pine and other soft woods you have to leave it in a bit longer as it just takes a little longer for it to get into the small pores.
2 questions, could you sort of re-hydrate dry wood by using water in the chamber, and are the cured resin infused pieces workable with hand tools, e.g., sloyd knives and hook knives?
Yes. Off and I will rehydrate would doing this but I will use raw linseed oil instead of water. That is much better for the wood and won't cause problems in the future as the water evaporates. And yes you can still work them with hand tools. It actually works very well with hand tools much better than it did before stabilization. As now you don't have to worry so much about grain Direction
@@WoodByWright Thanks! I have been curious about this process as I have made spoons from such things as basin big sagebrush, the grain is beautiful but the item is kind of fragile. I was wondering if infusing would work for spoon blanks like this.
Do you have to use stablized wood right away? or can you store it and use it later when you decide what project you want to do with them?
Yes you can store it for as long as you want.most of the time I don't stabilize things until they get close to the size that I want to work with.
I was hoping to see you turn your spring pole lathe into a vacuum pump.
Lol that would be interesting!
Do you have to let the blocks sit in the resin after your 2 cycles or once you let the final air back in you can pull them out? Great video, very helpful.
once the air comes back in they are good to go. thanks Paul!
@@WoodByWright Oh ok awesome. Thanks!
but I noticed that when you pulled them out of the oven the sides looked as if there was no hardener on the surface ... you think it's still pulling it from residual vacuum in the wood fibers while it was sitting in the oven? Would be fine I suppose if the surface is coming off, but what if you just wanted to keep that surface, should you keep it in the solution for a bit longer at atmosphere before pulling them out?
@@davidaustin6962 I think you are just seeing a trick of the camera. The wood fibers are solid all the way around.
Can you dye the cactus juice?
The link to the vacuum pot you provided says that this pot is not suitable for cactus juice and resin stabalizing. How has this held up for you so far?
It works fine. They put that in to protect them selves. Just do not let the pump suck in the liquid.
Now I know, thanks!
Could you add dye or stain to the juice to color the wood?
Sure, but that bottle will always be that color.
I would like to encase a scroll sawn design in resin.
Should I stabilize before or after cutting the pattern into the wood??
This will be both thin baltic birch and solid hardwoods, up to 1/4"..
It's generally best to do it before. As the wood will move a little bit with the stabilization.
@@WoodByWright will a scroll saw cut resin??
yes it will though you may want to slow it down so it does not heat up too much.