Developing the first loop / part with all the instruments and fully tricked out before coming up with other parts can be a trap. I do my best to get one instrument all the way through first. I finish way more songs like that.
This has to possibly be the #1 mistake we all fall into. It's impossible to write a song with 50 layers going. It's useful as a proof of concept before embarking on a project to make sure it all works, but that type of repetition does some crazy things to the pathways in the brain that is super difficult to combat and be wary of. Another way of thinking about it: create a deliberate turd first, like a mandala you intend to let go of.
For me this is so true when it comes to electronic music. On my guitar, I can write a full song just playing and coming up with lyrics, but when I''m in FL I have had the problem of trying to come up with synth parts, then make a drum part for it, then add a pad, and eventually you just keep looping the first part you wrote! Getting a MIDI controller has really helped me with this, I can sit and play it for a while before writing another part.
This is pretty good advice. As mentioned, being flexible is super important to work with others. Sometimes you have to be flexible in your own policies or even pricing, it just depends on the person you're working with, and the interest you have in the project. Always remain humble and teachable and that will take you far.
When it comes to song writing, writing out the entire baseline or chords from start to finish helps me with the layout of the song, which gives me the direction for every other part (melody, harmony, drums, etc.). I suggest a method like that if someone is stuck writing and arranging nice loops and don't know how to transition from one part of the song to the next, which is the toughest part of songwriting in my opinion.
People forget that a chord progression isn’t a song. A loop isn’t a song. People have written songs by figuring out the progressions, melody and lyrics first (before you even worry about production) for a century.
I actually love playing with plug ins for inspiration and for exploration reasons. There are a few foxholes you can fall down with that approach. Personally, it's my favorite part of generating an idea. Just flipping through everything. Turning things on and off. Mapping, automation... it gets the bug going lol Thank you for this video!
@@silverhandle Maybe, i dont remember their channel name.. They may not be terrible, I use to watch their videos from time to time and I never found value in them.. could just be me. I just remember them giving advice then they play their song that demonstrated the lesson and just thinking, im definitely not going for that
@@EremEdition yeah. Well, any songwriting rules are just ideas and can also be used in ways that diverge from the main thought behind whatever technique is being offered. As far as “how to write songs”, they very much focus on writing pop songs - which I do find quite helpful and resonant with me, as I write pop songs (Americana/Rock/Pop)
Great advice: add a second chord progression as early as possible. Yeah, i can see how that can help me from just stopping at a simple loop because i grow bored of it.
Thanks for a great video! I write music for tv and do mixing, I was doing it for years before I really started doing it more professionally, and I've been writing music since I was a teenager. I always say, you gotta be a sicko, lol. You just gotta do it.
@@AdamSliger Oh degen country, it's like pop country, but swearier, and it's all the stuff you can't usually do or say in a pop country song... without being outlaw country or cowpunk, which both have distinct sounds. It's fun and subversive, a little proggy. The kind of songs I like writing. Sometimes, I experiment with the dark arts of jazz. But I'm up for anything :)
Glad I watched this. The idea of going to the associated minor for the chorus helped me (and has me wondering what other choices there are, so I’ll spend some time listening to songs to see different chorus choices people make - and how often the associated minor is used!). Now I’m wondering how to break out of a two loop repeat and come up with something for the bridge… where’s that confounded bridge? Any suggestions?
Great advice! The immediate embellishment looping trap is real. I force myself to play the song all the way through on bass guitar and letting it guide the different chord progressions. I wish someone had told me this at the start.
13:28 I’m on the last 3 minutes of the video and it seem like more of a talk. There’s no structure. If the whole video was on the thumbnail topic it’d be way more interesting. If you had points to talk about it’d be great. The best part of the video was the top comment.
Thank you for this video; about a year I pushed myself to write and release a song a week, which i managed to keep up for 9 weeks. However, I burnt myself out and then found that I didn't have the time to properly get back into the groove of writing/producing during my final year at uni. I've just finished now though and am super excited to devote more time to what I love - this was the perfect reminder I needed to hear 🙌
Please people...don't rush your songs in the name of quantity. If you can make a great album in a few years that doesn't have a lot of BS filler, its worth the extra time spent.
speaking about beginning a project without a deposit, there are two reasons not to trust somebody... one - you don't know them. the other - you _know_ them.
Well said!!! Yeh even buying those plugins .. to make a loop ... is part of the inspiration and process of the "bike ride" aka...a point on the path on the songwriting journey.
me thinks songwriting = less plug ins and more actual instruments (guitar, piano, ukulele etc.) no need for computer type technology or digital interface. just an instrument (or maybe just voice), piece of writing paper, and pencil/pen. This is the way to start out being a songwriter. This way you develop yourself as a writer and sharpen your skills at creating original melodies, chord prog., rhythms , and lyrics. If you don't develop these skills and just use plug ins then you are maybe getting good at picking out pre made tones and beats, but that is not the same thing as writing your own music.For example, a 'chord progression' is a very tactile thing between a musician and his or her instrument. It has to do with the way you hands are moving (whether guitar or piano etc) and muscle input and all kinds of tactile brain-body type stuff. If you just 'pick' a chord progression from a list of pre sets you miss all that. It's like the difference between playing football out in the yard with your friends or playin Madden football video game. The latter is more like production and less like songwriting.
I mean yeah, writing modern country songs, isn’t very hard. It’s extremely derivative and paint-by-numbers. Your friend kind of took the easy way out, lol. (Good for him, go get the bag and all that, but just saying).
@@AdamSliger- read my comment again and pay attention. I said it’s very easy to WRITE modern country. I said nothing about #1 hits. (Though pay-for-play and astroturfing is a very real thing in Nashville too) Your friend in the video even backs me up at 1:39: “He had everything setup like a preset.” It’s kind of an open secret that Nashville producers are extremely paint-by-numbers. That’s all I said. Calm down, lol.
I’m calm lol, I think the production is pretty paint by numbers but the writing is still gonna be tricky no matter what. Tons of uber talented writers doing it
My dream is to write songs and have singers I trust and admire sing them, because I suck at singing. I currently am aiming for Billie Eilish. I know it's a hard goal but it would be worth it. Thanks for this video. ❤
As a songwriter I like to hear more about Brock story on how he went about collaborating with other artists. I have released a couple of albums but i rather have better musicians use my songs
For some reason, when he said "By the way, my name is Adam Sliger" I got uncomfortable. Like I was literally in the room with the two dudes (I think, any way) and had to back up to create space. Okay, back to the video.
Thanks for the discussion!! - and the producer book: my format keeps changing, though there are some things that work well (and I include composition notes- maybe too wide a scope). That'll be great to read.
Now with AI... being a writer is the ultimate skill. Write music, then turn it into music. Make some popular songs and boom you can probably write music for other people. My entire channel is all AI music I've been making and writing.
@@AdamSliger For me? I'm not trying to be a music writer... I'm trying to be an indie music artist. So the plan is growing where I am and my following. I have some interesting strategies coming up that a lot of musicians don't think of. My goal is to be one of the first 6 figure AI musicians out there.
You can’t write a better song if you don’t write another song.
PREACH
this is a fact
Big facts!
you can write a better song if you don't write your first song...
Get that 2nd chord progression down before fleshing out the entire loop is MAJOR!! for breaking out of the never ending loop syndrome.
It’s the way for sure 🤘
Oh man, i feel this. Such a fine skill to know when to hit record mentally or IRL-ily
Developing the first loop / part with all the instruments and fully tricked out before coming up with other parts can be a trap. I do my best to get one instrument all the way through first. I finish way more songs like that.
it is indeed a trap haha
This has to possibly be the #1 mistake we all fall into. It's impossible to write a song with 50 layers going.
It's useful as a proof of concept before embarking on a project to make sure it all works, but that type of repetition does some crazy things to the pathways in the brain that is super difficult to combat and be wary of. Another way of thinking about it: create a deliberate turd first, like a mandala you intend to let go of.
For me this is so true when it comes to electronic music. On my guitar, I can write a full song just playing and coming up with lyrics, but when I''m in FL I have had the problem of trying to come up with synth parts, then make a drum part for it, then add a pad, and eventually you just keep looping the first part you wrote! Getting a MIDI controller has really helped me with this, I can sit and play it for a while before writing another part.
100%. So much more challenging to write the rest when you have one section that is made to perfection. So easy to get scared to mess it up then
Getting the extra progressions recorded asap is great advice I totally agree. Get the ear used to changes before it’s too late
Thanks I think it’s a big help!!
@@AdamSliger I truly did that yesterday on something I’m working on as I type this . Glad I found your channel! Subbing now
Heck yeah thank you
This is pretty good advice. As mentioned, being flexible is super important to work with others. Sometimes you have to be flexible in your own policies or even pricing, it just depends on the person you're working with, and the interest you have in the project. Always remain humble and teachable and that will take you far.
Thank you!!!
When it comes to song writing, writing out the entire baseline or chords from start to finish helps me with the layout of the song, which gives me the direction for every other part (melody, harmony, drums, etc.). I suggest a method like that if someone is stuck writing and arranging nice loops and don't know how to transition from one part of the song to the next, which is the toughest part of songwriting in my opinion.
Facts
People forget that a chord progression isn’t a song. A loop isn’t a song. People have written songs by figuring out the progressions, melody and lyrics first (before you even worry about production) for a century.
Thanks for having me Adam! Always fun chatting abott it music and studio life 🎧
appreciate you coming by!
You guys seem super chill. Very inspiring. Thank you!
🤘🤘
I actually love playing with plug ins for inspiration and for exploration reasons. There are a few foxholes you can fall down with that approach. Personally, it's my favorite part of generating an idea. Just flipping through everything. Turning things on and off. Mapping, automation... it gets the bug going lol
Thank you for this video!
That’s awesome and no prob!!!
I love you channel. It's 3:39AM here right now and I'm watching this. Thanks for these great videos man. Respect +1
appreciate you so much!
I’ve written almost 500 songs. I have no knowledge of music theory, notes, etc. the songs just come to me
That’s amazing
@@AdamSliger I began writing songs after sustaining a head injury in a car crash in 2009
I’m sure it’s been therapeutic for you!
No knowledge? I’m Sure, you picked up a little something
@@babyzorilla I have a little but I mostly listen. When I play with others I can hear it and my fingers seem to know where to go
Almost skipped because no offense when scrolling it looked like that man and lady who give terrible song writing tips
Funniest comment ever lmao
From how to write songs channel?
@@silverhandle Maybe, i dont remember their channel name.. They may not be terrible, I use to watch their videos from time to time and I never found value in them.. could just be me. I just remember them giving advice then they play their song that demonstrated the lesson and just thinking, im definitely not going for that
@@EremEdition yeah. Well, any songwriting rules are just ideas and can also be used in ways that diverge from the main thought behind whatever technique is being offered. As far as “how to write songs”, they very much focus on writing pop songs - which I do find quite helpful and resonant with me, as I write pop songs (Americana/Rock/Pop)
@@silverhandle Well okay. I dont know what you are expecting me to say. Glad they taught you pop. I'm going to leave now ..
Great advice: add a second chord progression as early as possible. Yeah, i can see how that can help me from just stopping at a simple loop because i grow bored of it.
Thanks for a great video! I write music for tv and do mixing, I was doing it for years before I really started doing it more professionally, and I've been writing music since I was a teenager. I always say, you gotta be a sicko, lol. You just gotta do it.
Big facts lol
I'm just sayin, if anyone wants to collab on degen country or experimental anything, hit me up
Idk what that even is but I’m interested
@@AdamSliger Oh degen country, it's like pop country, but swearier, and it's all the stuff you can't usually do or say in a pop country song... without being outlaw country or cowpunk, which both have distinct sounds. It's fun and subversive, a little proggy. The kind of songs I like writing. Sometimes, I experiment with the dark arts of jazz. But I'm up for anything :)
Glad I watched this. The idea of going to the associated minor for the chorus helped me (and has me wondering what other choices there are, so I’ll spend some time listening to songs to see different chorus choices people make - and how often the associated minor is used!). Now I’m wondering how to break out of a two loop repeat and come up with something for the bridge… where’s that confounded bridge? Any suggestions?
Go for the minor 2 if you’re stuck!!
8:52
I really dig this because I’m a life long musician trying to song write and produce…
Great advice! The immediate embellishment looping trap is real. I force myself to play the song all the way through on bass guitar and letting it guide the different chord progressions. I wish someone had told me this at the start.
i worte a pretty good song today
it goes:
i am a mouse
i live in a house
i sleep on a couch
antidisestablishmentarianism
Love it
13:28 I’m on the last 3 minutes of the video and it seem like more of a talk. There’s no structure. If the whole video was on the thumbnail topic it’d be way more interesting. If you had points to talk about it’d be great. The best part of the video was the top comment.
I get you, I have like 50+ scripted videos but for a few wanted to try a lil more free flowing especially since this was a collab
Thank you for this video; about a year I pushed myself to write and release a song a week, which i managed to keep up for 9 weeks. However, I burnt myself out and then found that I didn't have the time to properly get back into the groove of writing/producing during my final year at uni. I've just finished now though and am super excited to devote more time to what I love - this was the perfect reminder I needed to hear 🙌
You got this
Please people...don't rush your songs in the name of quantity. If you can make a great album in a few years that doesn't have a lot of BS filler, its worth the extra time spent.
For sure
speaking about beginning a project without a deposit, there are two reasons not to trust somebody... one - you don't know them. the other - you _know_ them.
Facts lmao
Well said!!! Yeh even buying those plugins .. to make a loop ... is part of the inspiration and process of the "bike ride" aka...a point on the path on the songwriting journey.
me thinks songwriting = less plug ins and more actual instruments (guitar, piano, ukulele etc.) no need for computer type technology or digital interface. just an instrument (or maybe just voice), piece of writing paper, and pencil/pen. This is the way to start out being a songwriter. This way you develop yourself as a writer and sharpen your skills at creating original melodies, chord prog., rhythms , and lyrics. If you don't develop these skills and just use plug ins then you are maybe getting good at picking out pre made tones and beats, but that is not the same thing as writing your own music.For example, a 'chord progression' is a very tactile thing between a musician and his or her instrument. It has to do with the way you hands are moving (whether guitar or piano etc) and muscle input and all kinds of tactile brain-body type stuff. If you just 'pick' a chord progression from a list of pre sets you miss all that. It's like the difference between playing football out in the yard with your friends or playin Madden football video game. The latter is more like production and less like songwriting.
I mean yeah, writing modern country songs, isn’t very hard. It’s extremely derivative and paint-by-numbers. Your friend kind of took the easy way out, lol. (Good for him, go get the bag and all that, but just saying).
It’s so easy we all have country #1 smash hits right?
@@AdamSliger- read my comment again and pay attention. I said it’s very easy to WRITE modern country. I said nothing about #1 hits. (Though pay-for-play and astroturfing is a very real thing in Nashville too)
Your friend in the video even backs me up at 1:39: “He had everything setup like a preset.” It’s kind of an open secret that Nashville producers are extremely paint-by-numbers. That’s all I said. Calm down, lol.
I’m calm lol, I think the production is pretty paint by numbers but the writing is still gonna be tricky no matter what. Tons of uber talented writers doing it
My dream is to write songs and have singers I trust and admire sing them, because I suck at singing. I currently am aiming for Billie Eilish. I know it's a hard goal but it would be worth it. Thanks for this video. ❤
Nice, relaxed and interesting! Keep the videos coming 👍
Thanks, will do!
As a songwriter I like to hear more about Brock story on how he went about collaborating with other artists. I have released a couple of albums but i rather have better musicians use my songs
For some reason, when he said "By the way, my name is Adam Sliger" I got uncomfortable. Like I was literally in the room with the two dudes (I think, any way) and had to back up to create space. Okay, back to the video.
sorry haha
Thanks for the answer y'all!
You got it!!!
Wow it is like watching Garth & Wayne Dudessssssss!
i love how chill and real y’all are lol
haha thanks
Thanks for the discussion!! - and the producer book: my format keeps changing, though there are some things that work well (and I include composition notes- maybe too wide a scope). That'll be great to read.
No prob!! And yeah I’m looking forward to it!
your girlfriend looks like young sheldon's dad
I’m confused
all the best with your song writing
you've got a resonance issue in your room or something, like around 250hz it's really coming through on this video. just saying! great video though.
Had to edit this one on a plane so didn’t get to really do the audio proper lol but yeah you’re not wrong
Very helpful information. Thank you both!
Glad it was helpful!
This was such a great video. The bike riding analogy was spot on. THANK YOU!
Glad it was helpful!
Love this video. Using your own initiative. Thank you for this reminder.
any time!
Are you sure your name isn’t Gary
fairly certain
Thanks for answering my question! ❤
Of course!!
Nice video ....just not for me though.
Fair play to ya
Now with AI... being a writer is the ultimate skill. Write music, then turn it into music. Make some popular songs and boom you can probably write music for other people. My entire channel is all AI music I've been making and writing.
What’s the plan besides making songs and putting them on here?
@@AdamSliger For me? I'm not trying to be a music writer... I'm trying to be an indie music artist. So the plan is growing where I am and my following.
I have some interesting strategies coming up that a lot of musicians don't think of. My goal is to be one of the first 6 figure AI musicians out there.
@@ShyeepThat’s interesting… you reckon that kind of money is out there for AI music?