I think comparing this to chess and poker has one major flaw. Both never change, always the same figurines with their movements, always the same cards and their combinations. You can easily build a much more longlasting memory of it. TFT changes every two weeks on a minor and every 3 months on a major level. You are supposed to be much more up to date because, taking your example with „oh dishsoap took this and it was great“, might not even be true anymore only a couple of days later. Each set/patch requires you to reexplore what’s working and what’s not. Augments get added/removed/changed all the time. This is very different from „oh I have this full house here, that’s PROBABLY very strong“ or „oh I have the queen trapped here that way, I’ve had that before“. These memories never go invalid. This is very much NOT the case with TFT and much of its submechanics.
As someone who has played every set and started making content myself. I feel that I used to have more fun when I was not trying to min/max the game and follow the copy/paste players as I personally think it pulls some fun out of it. I used to always log on YT and just watch better players and what kind of neat things they would build. I understand both spots, people who do not have a lot of time would rather log in, see what the meta is and try to crush out a few wins. Where I agree with pulling stats to even this small of a degree is that I'd be playing a game and could call out the exact units someone was going to build, what items and near bis augments they would pick. That personally for me sucks the fun out of it when every lobby is mirrored of 9/10 of your last lobbies. I LOVE when I see other players pop off with something I've never seen before that either is bizzare and makes me laugh or op and shock me
I had the opposite experience: Having stats would show me more possibilities that actually work. I just can't test 20 comps for a dozen games each until I know what I want to play. Especially with 2-weeks patch cycles. Ultimately, I will just play what I like more and what FEELS best anyways. But the fact that I can look at weird augments and actually see that they perform okay enough which gives me an incentive to investigate them further. That is how I (an imo pretty low-skill casual player) reached Master multiple times already while playing flex only. Last time they removed stats, I basically only played 2-3 comps because I just can't afford to grief that many games when I have limited time. And ultimately, I just played less overall and had less fun. That was also the time when every week or so a new "OP comp" would appear on Reddit and everyone would spam it in ranked to climb (tbf there were also other reasons for that during that set, but hiding stats did not help at all - whoever just followed Reddit faster would get 1-2 days of free climb until getting giga contested and many people ended up with incredibly inflated MMRs). I get that there is an argument to be made, that effort and keeping track of the community should be rewarded (i.e. if stats are hidden, investing dozens of hours into unit analyses with ratios, dps numbers aso. with study groups becomes way more valuable), but in the end, TFT is still a GAME. Imo a game should be made for the player to have fun, not to force them to invest time and grind. You are ultimately just raising the threshold of entry for competitive by hiding stats. People are always mentioning how exciting seeing unknown strategies is - but the reality is, that stats didn't stop that. You just had to actually look at the game to see what is going on. People just DEFAULTED to stats and didn't even bother looking at the games. But other players (e.g. like me) would actually look at the game, see something, analyse the stats, and try to understand how to work it out. I can only speak for myself, but I personally played the weirdest unknown comps in recent sets when everyone was like "meta is solved" - simply due to having stats tell me that "it isn't autolose, so you can try it".
How many times have we had augments that averaged like 5.2 because they were bugged and people who selected then would get HUGE disadvantage? Wukong and shen augs for instance were quite terrible for a few patches (shen for the whole set?) There is no way to guess something is fishy with an augment without this. It is not even only about being flexible or considering your spot when making choices. TFT has it's share of bugged augs and knowing which ones are almost a guaranteed 8th is a good thing
Or when they just silently change something to get stats on it. I mean, we even had the coin toss that randomly got changed to 60% instead of 50-50 at some point. How exactly am I supposed to find that out without playing 100s of games and keeping a detailed analysis of everything that happened? I know, coin toss is irrelevant to the game as a whole. But if augment stats are hidden, you essentially have to manually create stats by playing 100s of games if you want to be competitive - which won't happen if you aren't playing full-time. This just means that people who can get information will just get an advantage over those who can not invest as much time into the game. Which is just bad for competitive...
dont forget about tooltips being wrong but they decided to patch it way too late and the only info you have that the tool tip is wrong is from Mort commenting about it on a clip instead of just hotfixing it
This will end the same way it did last time. Augment stats don't effect the better players, they effect the players with fewer games. Pros don't really need augment stats, they are just a way to "simulate" game time. If a player had 100,000 games themselves they wouldn't need to look up stats ever. Players with 1000 games don't really need stats either for the vast majority of games. The augment stats give players confidence when thinking about very niche lines and specific scenarios that make a comp viable. Now we will all just take the default good augments and this will ultimately lead to less variety.
Yeah you say that, but every single high elo streamer does the same thing. They all pull up the stats and make choices based on delta if they don't have anything that perfectly fits their comp.
It only enables the most casual, disengaged players. You don't need stats to think critically and find synergies between augments and your current board
@@bvrmnlol "It only enables the most casual, disengaged players". Then why do pros literally pull up the stats during tournaments? Since stats are not needed to critically think about your augment choices, I think it's a good move by Riot to force everybody to do this. + it will be very likely good for game variance.
@@bvrmnlolmaybe in like emerald or some shit. You are completely gating yourself out of GM+ picking augments based on their avp regardless of your spot…horrible way to play.
this is a terrible change for people who play casually like 1-2 hrs a day but are competitive. I hit masters this season doing just that and i needed stats inorder to determine which augments are actually good. They are not the be-all-end-all to remove any sort of skillful piloting. I understand Mort's points but the solution is excessive. Players who just pick the best augment without considering if their situation calls for it are not going to have an unfair advantage to people who actually know their stuff. The only people who like this change are people who already play like 6-10 hrs a day.
Insider trading to the top again. The usual consequence of limiting information. It'll effect players that don't play much the most. I see no reason for this, especially with the augment balance being so up in the air.
The thing is even with stats that's already a thing, top-players will always talk about strats and theories that are being developed behind the scenes, so you are definitely correct
But isn’t that how it’s supposed to be? In ranked the players that play the most will climb the most, and the players that don’t will remain in the bottom. Why should players that play less be the same rank?
@@leonperez933 Because it's not about skill, just information. Ofc you could argue that's part of the skill but in the end dodging 4.9 augments is not the skill expression players value
I don't get why tft influencers were ever against this. Most of them are good enough to not need the stats and it makes their knowledge that much more valuable to the community, driving more engagement/interaction
Because a lot of them lean on stats a lot if you read marcelp's guide last set for climbing to high challenger one of the biggest things he said is always always always checking stats
Where do you think they get the knowledge they share in their videos? They are just doing what 95% of the player base is too lazy to do which is do hours of stat checking. This is also annoying as a casual player since you could get on for a few games and immediately lookup what you needed to play a semi decent game of tft without devoting hours to it.
I'm not looking to make an argument for or against the change, however I will say as one of the aforementioned diamond players who doesn’t get a lot of games in per set. I like having stats available to me. I mean I get baited by bad augments anyway, but I like having the extra help in the augment decision process. I don't really see a problem with people wanting to know what is best for their comps. I get the point that it could make the game stale, but I know that people are still going to follow the tftacademy tierlist and just play what's broken even without tactics . tools. I'm not sure taking away the stats will have the outcome that people think it might, but that's just my two cents. If anyone has anything to add please feel free.
fair feedback...but , that's the point > making bad choice on augments means experimenting them and more important... learning the game. After all the game is called "TeamFight TACTICS" not "teamfight stats 3rd party advantage "
@@stephensleezer5083 lots of people dont use the websites for just 'help', they straight up make their augment choices solely based on the statistics, whatever shows the highest avp, they immediately take it without even trying to think by themselves. I've seen a lot of people looking up the stats for high variance augments like Wandering Trainer or Call to Chaos which is obviously almost completely pointless.
@@Set491 Fair enough. I just wish more people would make your argument, which it seems is something like "using stats from a third party website to inform decisions is fundamentally unhuman and therefore doesn't belong in a game". But a lot of these comments seem to hide behind exaggerations that you can't have a good understanding of the game AND use stats.
There's only 2 reasons I don't like this change and the first is balance. I trust the tft team but when they take away stats we will not know how broken or bad augments are and so we will not be able to hold them accountable for it. The other reason is that it introduces a kind of gatekeeping where high elo players that have connections with each other will share the information on what is broken giving them an advantage over players who don't have such connections, compared to everyone having the stats and being able to see them.
This homework argument is ridiculous to me, because if you care about your rank you will have to do even more homework to find the best and most viable augments for your team comps. Instead of having stats you can look at and interpret for yourself quickly, you will have to find tons of examples and anecdotes on augments with a given team comp to find how well any given augment works in a given situation.
i don't mind hiding stats if riot is decent at balancing, take elise's hero augment for example, it was unplayable for half of the set and it is too niche of a comp for people to know is it good or bad without looking at stats
Not to mention times they added bugged augments, for a good chunk of time spin 2 win wukong augment just didn't give any of the stats, making it an average 6th and unplayable augment
I love to check any type of stat while playing, its actually a huge fun factor for me and augments missing will make my overall expirience just less fun..
On the do your homework point. Taking stats away doesnt take away the homework away. It just makes it more time intensifive and more niche. If Augments balancing was better then yes we don't need stats. But Augments with a 3.85 is not acceptable.
The bugs are the biggest argument for stats. If they aren't communicating IN GAME the bugs, they need to leave stats in. They can't rely on websites to reach the average user.
The fact of the matter is that in a game like TFT, something that says 10% buff to whatever and 12% buff to whatever can be completely different in power levels and there is just no realistic way to know the difference without either trying that augment or seeing the stats. Instead of having "homework" of looking up the stats, you now have "homework" of playing many games and keeping your eyes glued to streams. Maybe that's a good thing from Riot's perspective but unfortunate from a player who doesn't have much time.
@@Set491?? If you hate playing the game, you’re not gonna be playing the game. He isn’t saying he hates the game, he’s saying that instead of have stats you’re going to have to play a bunch more games to “gather the stats yourself” ie see what wins games and that’s just not fun for anyone. In a way it’s even more homework
Playing games of TFT shouldn't be homework though, playing any game you enjoy shouldnt be homework. Using third party apps and constantly looking up statistics for the game you are playing whilst playing it IS homework though. Also, the best players who have tons of time to play a lot of TFT will do WAY better with having access to stats and infos than the bad players who don't have much time to play the game. If you are only playing 3 games a week or whatever, does it really matter that one augment averages a 4.2 over a 4.4 when you as a player who barely plays arent going to recognize that the 4.2 is actually a 3.7 in the one comp its good in and a 4.7 in every other comp? It might actually be WORSE for you to read the stats because there is so much information coming in at once that you are barely going to parse the info, and the first like 15-20 games of a set you'll be just learning the units and traits and item combinations anyway. if you play 3 games a week, 20 games of TFT is gonna take like 6-7 weeks, at which point I just don't think you're getting very much from having access to stats when the better players who play a ton have had ample time to read them, understand them, and compare them with each other and their favorite streamers.
Horrible change. Instead of playing the game 100% of the time, I'll have to make some time for memorizing tier lists and watching more vods. And we have to do this every single patch.The devs are making this change with the intent of me discovering augments for myself. But that is simply not an option because everyone else in the lobby (at higher ranks at least) will be studying tier lists. All they did is add chores back into the game
Love the discussion vids Subzeroark! I'm a player who plays TFT pretty much every other set, normally ending in Master/Diamond if I don't play much. I feel like these kind of changes affect people like me the most. I want to play my best, but play less than 200 games a set. I don't have time to watch hours and hours of streams to identify what augments are best, and I don't have prior knowledge between sets about which augments are "standard good". A stats website helped me get a baseline, like you said, of what augments were good in which comps, but were never the be all end all for me, if something felt like it fit better I'd take it over something that had a higher rating. Also, once I'd played 100 games or so I used the stats websites much less as I had the knowledge already about strong augments. Its really gunna hurt new players who pick augments that sound good, but are actually 5.0 and then don't understand why they lose so much. Any new player who wants to be competitive is going to have a much harder time because of this, and the 1k games players who share information between each other are gunna be just the same as usual. I understand the sentiment, but it feels like a negative for the wider playerbase who want to improve and become the best they can be,
I don’t really like this because it will drive the developers to make lazier augments. As in easier to play ones. Because without stats people will almost always choose the “mid” option with no risk.
thats why the people who choose the «mid» option with no risk, will be just that «mid» players. taking risks and knowing when to pick augments because of experience is a skill instead of looking up stats on a website and letting it decide the game for you lmao
@@daviboyable Tell that to a casual player trying to climb when they only have a limited amount of games due to time constraints. Stats are just a substitute for time investment into research. They are worse than actual research, but good enough to allow players with little time to focus on actually playing the game. What is even worse: Some "mid" augments can be secretly op. E.g. 2 stat augments might look nearly identical on a rough glance, but one is 4.0 the other is 4.6. Neither is risky whatsoever. But how do you know which one is better without stats? You simply don't unless you literally run some simulation manually or Mortdog randomly blurts out that info on stream (which has happened before). It is just not feasible for a normal, casual player to make that analysis. So this will just end up gatekeeping competitive moreso than anything else.
I feel like the motivation for this change was the fact that balancing augments this set was going to be an issue and now they dont really need to worry about it at all.
At the end of the day, in the elo where the stats actually matter, people don’t care as much for them, and for the casuals, it creates a lower barrier for play. I get that they don’t like it but the narrative about it being unhealthy is pretty ridiculous
Not a fan of stats at all when it comes to augments. People stat checking to get an advantage ingame to pick an augment is annoying. You are literally making a TFT website make the decision for you. Literal bots when you get to higher ranks and see that everyone just insta picks the augment that obviously has the best stats. Zero creativity and honestly just a hastle to have to pull up stats all the time to be on an even playin field with the rest.
This change is an admission that riot es either unable or unwilling to balance augments So their fix to some augments being picked more often because of their higher win rate is not telling you the win rate anymore
removing stats is kind of insulting to tft, implying that just clicking the best augment in stats makes you win. theres an incredible amount of game left even if you know the best items, units, and boards and optimizing how to get to the best boards from your spot is what makes it fun for more competitive players
Yeah, this is just a change for competitive TFT, which seems to be their focus in all regards. The majority of the casual player base is not at all in their minds. It is only a negative for people who do not have the time to sink multiple hundreds of games into a set. We will be stuck picking the bugged augments or the egregiously poor augments for the few games we get to play.
Yeah, i feel like the "doing the homework" argument is stupid because instead of taking 2 minutes to open tactics, well WHOOPS now you clicked a bugged augment because you didnt see /u/fuckoTFT's reddit post about how Blumpkin Buster (Smeech Hero Augment) is bugged
@zbrodie Your comment would make sense if the game were balanced. Which it has never been. In fact, there are always egregiously overpowered and underperforming aspects of the game.
@@zbrodie removing augment stats makes sense in a world where the devs communicate bugs well. they do not. spin to win was fully bugged for a patch where it gave wukong a 5% AD ratio instead of a 300% one lol it's not about googling the best answer, but more like bubbling in the right answer and having your scantron read wrong. tactics.tools is the teacher saying "ok guys I messed up just bubble B for number 6"
So people that don't have the time to play 20 games each patch and "try things out" don't get a way to quickly check if an augment is severely under or overperforming now mid-match. Great change guys! Really saved the high end competitive scene with that one! Didn't just totally fuck over the people that don't have as much time but still want to be competitive, though if those are not the whales, then I guess why would you care about them
What do you consider casual, but competitive? In my country there are 2 known players, one who spams 1000k games within the first 2 months and then stops and another who gets to master in extremely few games but stops there, they both play tournaments and the one with few games always outperformed the guy with 1k games even though both are master+. I haven't read new set's augments or units yet but you know when an augment is busted when you read it no? I think the only one that can be hard to guess are hero augments or ones that forces you to play differently like the one that gave you rolls when for each tick of level you bought.
Raw games played is *really* not a good skill check in the first place. I bet if you took a pro tft player and gave them 10 games in a set and then took a random gold player and gave them 300 games in a set, the pro player would still average a higher placement over the course of his games, playing against better competition. Games played does not equate to skill, and in fact, sometimes people play a bad comp a LOT because they find it fun and in that case a large number of games played is actively detrimental for them.
idk what they expect to happen, i think they are being too idealistic this isn't going to change how people play the game, they need to understand the community for what it is, a bunch of stat sheep. also tft is an unintuitive game, a lot of augments can go from good to untakeable even in the best scenarios due to slight tweaks in numbers. You can say "oh this augment seems like it should be good here" and be completely wrong, and i think that would happen more times than not. Also you can tell if augments are bugged bc of horrible stats (wukong rework spin to win 7.0 avg XD)
yeah my problem with them is they try to have it both ways. They created a game where inherently, the numbers affect the strength, not just the words. which is fine. But don't take away a method people use to decipher which numbers lead to better results.
I don't agree with this as it will hurt more casual players. If anything, I could see ppl choosing augments that are more general or 'safe' and this would decrease risk taking (especially in ranked). If people are playing for enjoyment, they would probably play norms or hyper roll. Playing ranked is to be the best at the game and ppl find THAT to be fun (not necessarily the game itself). Edit: Also, I feel bad about the sites that survive off data scraping (ONLY IN THIS INSTANCE THOUGH - DATA SCRAPING IN GENERAL IS SHIT). What will they do?
the change is lame to be honest, i didn’t even check augment stats set 12 but as a comp-sci nerd a game actively not posting augment data at the end of the match is cringe. artificially trying to boost creativity is not a thing. stats should be there for competitive minded players. more frustrating to try to do “homework” on something but not having the tools to do it
honestly same, i really enjoy analysing data and i feel like people really weren't forced to go check that data, so removing that option is kinda cringe yeah. I'd totally understand if it was banned on tournaments tho, and there i'd support it.
As someone who played tons of trading card games both before and after we had access to tons of data and stats, I can say unequivocally that the games were more fun and way more varied before we had access to the raw data, not even because people are playing the strongest stuff everytime, but because people are playing the SAME stuff everytime. TFT has so many possible permutations and if even the low ranked players are all just "BIS BIS BIS" hunting over and over again in lobbies it can drastically hamper the fun of everybody. They aren't artificially doing anything, why do you assume you should have access to the data in the first place? If TFT had launched without the ability to scrape data on games and was now changing it to allow people to do so, would you say they are "artificially trying to lessen the skill-gap?"
yeah but it gets to a point where people turn off their brains and pull up stats to see which augment to pick. So annoying and honestly a hastle to always check.. I think people should make their own decisions, not some tft website.
I think the game is too complex to hide stats, even with stats people don't play perfectly so your "creativity" can only go so far, and everyone can access the stats it doesn't take a lot of time to just browse what is good so I think the change is silly.
I think your “Go” example isn’t a 1 to 1 because Tft changes so often: augs and champs change every patch, sets change every couple months, etc. it will never be fully solved to a point like a static game like go can. So, removing an assets to the majority of the community that doesn’t have time to devote their life to learning the ever changing game seems pretty destructive imo.
This changes nothing besides taking away info from lower rank players. The best players separate themselves partly by knowing which augments to pick in their spots, no good player just picks based off stats anyways.
@ I’m challenger, never checked stats before. This won’t affect me much but it hurts lower ranked players or people tryna learn the game. How is this any different than banning sites that list the top comps (based on stats). All this does is make the already steep learning curve for the game even worse.
My opinion here is when I was really low ranked I'd come home from work and if I had free time I'd just watch my favorite youtubers. Quite a few will tell you their thought process in why they are building certain lines and why they took certain augments. At least that's the way it was a few set ago
@@reiarigato8559 Are you trying to argue he never takes a statistically unfavourable augment based on his spot? what a ridiculous assertion. Like the op said "The best players separate themselves partly by knowing which augments to pick in their spots, no good player just picks based off stats anyways." I've seen dishsoap take less favoured augments before, he doesn't blindly follow stats.
I just dont agree with people saying this is bad for casuals who dont play often. I literally play max one or two games a session, I also have never over looked into augment stats and still manage to hit diamond this set. The average player is much smarter than people give credit and will be able to make a value judgement based on their current spot. If they get burned by their choices THEY DO LEARN for next time. This change will not hurt casuals whatsoever or if it does itll be negligible
God forbid people actually need to play the game to develop their own knowledge and skill, to understand what's good for their playstyle instead of copy pasting from meta tft websites LMAO
@@matthewturvey563 what if i am not a robot and I can tell one augment is probably better synergy with my spot, playstyle, etc. and I'm using my critical thinking knowledge and skill. why can't I also look at stats and incorporate the stats into my decision making process by using the stats as a corpus of experience and factor in my spot and playstyle.
@@erble8645 why do you need the stats to do that? you're playing a game and not looking at a spreadsheet. if you're failing to place and it's not because someone blatantly hard contested and greifed you, you with your "critical thinking" skills should be able to discern what led to the outcome of that game. you in the game have 100% knowledge of what the enemy has outside of whatever is exactly in their current shop and their exact gold value. and actually, good players wouldn't need stats to tell them what augments their comp needs to succeed. most people don't use it as an additive to their playstyle they just use it as a how-to manual on what to pick. super disenginous to say that people use it to incorporate the stats into their decision-making process when it just blatantly is their decision-making process.
@@mankdemes8887 i never said you need stats in order to think critically. My point was that some people still do think critically AND use stats is all. Your point that the vast majority of the player base doesn't do this I have no idea about and concede that point. I understand the change might have been made for the overall good of the game. Saying something like "good players wouldn't need stats to tell them..." makes me think you don't understand that multiple augments can fit a comp and the game developers' adjustment of their numbers can heavily impact what augment is actually stronger. Criticize stale gameplay and the majority of playerbase being drones all you want. But I think it's wrong that you imply there's no use for stats in terms of how strong an augment is in a given comp.
10:45 Chessengines are actually a really bad example. Yes, we know the "objective truth" in a lot of positions, but the objective truth often doesn't line up with experienced results. There are openings where the engine will tell you that one side is clearly winning, but even at the tippitytop level the results are even. Or there are positions where the engine says it is even, but even can mean that there is one single very long sequence of moves that leads to a draw and everything else losses, so a lot of humans lose in those positions. This is even more true for "normal" players. There are a lot of positions that titled players would say are doomed for one side that casual players wouldn't even see an advantage in. Past some level players also don't really care about past results in a position. If Magnus Carlsen thinks everyone is just missing one way to play a variation which leads to the terrible 25% pointscore, then he will still go into it and try to prove that there is something people had been missing. Having a number that doesn't necessarily apply to you, even if it is "objective" makes it the good kind of stat in a lot of circumstances. I think it's really fun to look through stats in search of anomalies - sometimes you see something that seems wrong and then you have to consider why an item that most people agree is mediocre has such a high AVP (gets picked on late game carrousels inflating its stats) or whether seeing a high lobby winrate on WW 3* actually means WW is busted or if the only 3*s also had his heroaugment. The stat sites are unfortunately TOO GOOD at what they are trying to do. You can filter for so much that you can get to these answers directly and don't have to actually figure out the followup questions yourself. If you only got more surface level information, then I think the stats would be much less of an issue - but I don't think Riot can force that to happen. There are some things which act like these hidden questions still - Figuring out how good Heartsteel or another Econ trait was had to be done "by hand", since the stats always looked bad. People maybe had 3 Hearsteel on their lategame boards, but anything more than that was generally cut by everyone making Top 4, so ofcourse the stats looked terrible.
As someone who plays very very casually, with the new pacing of how they are releasing sets i really feel discouraged from playing when they make these kinds of changes, it just feels too daunting to have to learn new augments on top of new set and honestly i feel that my limited amount of free time is better spent elsewhere.
@@arber7240 I dont think any 'real' casual player will look up the stats for any decision they make. Looking into stats means you're invested into the game to the point you would spend extra time to type in all that stuff and wanna find out the best way to climb. Real casual players play this game on their Mobiles while attending classes 😂
how?? the way augments work is that you look at your board, read what the augment does and think which ones fits best, is not that hard man, specially if you are a casual
Honestly the most fun I have ever had in this game was just slamming random crap/augments and either laughing at how op it turned out to be or laughing at how bad I am getting stomped haha
I'm genuinely curious, what does "very very casually" mean to you? is it like, 2 games a month? 3 games a week? 1 a day? what does that mean? Because I have friends who play TFT very casually and they legit play during release week and then will play on game nights when we cant find another thing to do, so they probably play 10-20 games per set. Those people... do not need access to stats in order to enjoy the game and just play in casual lobbies.
The reason they are doing it is to hide their incompetence in balancing certain augments. This will change nothing to be honest, now augments will just be ranked S tier to F tier
Damn I get it but augment stats are the most important and unfun. Some auguments just ruin your game, even though they look good. This testing is so weak. I don't mind BIS items stats gone or compositions, but auguments are healthy.
Finally.. it was such a bad thing that no one was using his brain and "look at the stats, what's the best pick it". I think game would be more fun without stats. I mean for the new players, comps are okay to look at it, but augment stats or win chance to round, bla bla.. it's to much. I don't object to commentators looking at it. Because it's don't effect the game directly like "stats says this one is best let's see what he gonna pick" it is okay. But seing the stats while playing the game not good. That's how i think.
I was never a fan of looking up augment stats, I feel like it is just unfair, I would rather just pick whatever seems nice and then think about it after the game.
I'd be fine with it if augments were even close to balanced. Right now theres augments close to 3.0 avp and some around 6.0avp. You could easily pick an augment that theoretically sounds good for your board but its just undertuned and like 5.0 avp and youre just putting yourself at a huge disadvantage. At least we have stats for the first patch I guess.
i don't like this change at all. The way i see it is regardless if stats are in the game or not You still should think about picking augments and make decisions dependant on your current situation. Data is just protection against poor game balance, because it let's you see that sometimes augment matching your strategy is still bad because numbers just arent't tune up right. Arguably there is more homework now because if you treat game seriously (grandmaster+ lvl) You still need to look for information , (watching tournaments,streamers) but these informations won't be accessible for everyone so this change promotes players spending time in their inner circles more than semi-casuals. good example is how support golem 1 and 2 was broken and overtuned for most of last set. If stats wasn't in game it doesn't fix anything, its just elitist change, because people watching tournaments and their favourite streamers would notice how they prioritize taking this augments above any other combat augments , not because it fits, just because its overtuned, and there are always op augments and rly bad ones, regardless how they fit team comp, i believe information is good because more ppl abuse something , then faster it will be fixed.
So instead of doing their job of balancing the game they just put the blame on the players and ban stats 😅. Not having stats just bait you into playing something that doesn’t work out most of the time and that is much more frustrating than seeing everyone play the same thing. And there is so much more nuance than just picking the best statistic in order to win a game of tft so I can only see this as the dev team being lazy and just dumping the problem on the players instead of fixing it
I will be ignoring the details of every single augment and sheeping tierlists out of protest. Set 9 was my GOAT and they bricked it for months with this stat paranoia..
I like the point about pros making tierlists. The key difference between stats and pro tierlists that I think makes tierlists more interesting is that pro players can and will disagree on which augments are good. Disagreement and discussion is so much more interesting and engaging than a number you can point to. That being said, pros have biases, but statistics also miss key information. I think wanting to optimize lines through statistics is a totally valid way to play TFT, but I also think getting players to think while they play is the most important thing. (Also I sit around plat/emerald and I've never used stats websites... I'm secretly hoping my opponents struggle at the start of the set without the extra knowledge, which i myself am used to not relying on :> )
I'll say this: as someone who started in Set 10, I loved how I could play my favorite line and figure out for myself what was good in that line. It feels good. I've been getting burned out by TFT because everybody just realized what was strong so fast. It forced me to play lines that I didn't think was fun, and I think my strength as a player is how flexible I can be. I'm excited for this change. I will say though that stat checking definitely made me grow really fast as a player, so there's that.
Augments are too poorly balanced imo to do this. Rest is good, but some augments are unplayable. Eg. Built Different, sometimes 3.xx, sometimes like 5.68, can't really tell without ruining a game trying it.
well if u think the augment sucks, dont pick it? if you pick it and it turns out it sucks, then dont pick it again? pretty simple. play the game and you'll develop skill
@@matthewturvey563 okay but there is 200+ augments and I have a tournament a weak after the release, how will I know if an hero augment is good or not if I never saw it in my hundred game and the only time I get to see it is in tournament ? How do I know I have the spot or I don't?
@@matthewturvey563 making a strength evaluation after one game is iffy. Sometimes you high roll, sometimes you play it improperly. Obviously as you gain experience and skill you will try to account for those in your evaluations but it's like just nerfing not having played as much.
@@matthewturvey563If you are not on grandmaster/challenger level I doubt you are able to easily connect a game lose back to your augment choices or even just a single augment choice. Especially since it's highly unlikely that you personally will hit the same combination of augments, items and comp choices again. That's why stats are helpful because it's way more likely that out of thousands of players someone has been at your position before and then you can clearly see the connection.
I think this is extremely bad for new people, can't study groups and higher level players just share knowledge with each other, while people not in those circles just have to grasp at straws or try and figure out patches on their own?
I've never used stats. I'm a very playing what feels right sort of guy. Obviously I'll look at good players and learn meta lines but I find myself in a unique position of this not impacting me all that much. Welcome to my world.
I think this is a good change since Ive seen top tier players and streamers would look up literally every single choice in TFT. Items, Augments were just chosen without even considering their spot or their tempo or their whatever. Like whats the point of having a choice when you could just follow a step by step guide. Its like youre not even playing the game and thinking by yourself but rather just braindead follow a guide and be a robot. Ive seen a challenger player in my lobby complaining about getting the post nerf Item Collector ll as an option and instead but taking Ascension with 6 warriors 🤦🏻♂️. Even tho they had 100 items on their board they chose Ascension over item collector just because the stats said Ascension's avp is higher. And I dont even wanna talk about how often Ive seen people looking up the stats for Wandering Trainer trying to find whether the stats say they should take it or not ... And of course this problem is not only to be found with Augments stats but items as well. Not too long ago I've watched Boxbox looking up the stats for his Gwen 2 with BB &JG, wether Hoj or Gunblade would be better on her. He looked up the items for Gwen star level 2. He picked gunblade out of his instead of Hoj. Anyone would understand that having Hoj in Combination with Spellcrit (JG or IS) is usually of higher value in general because you can significantly increase your Unit's overall DPS by having a higher crit chance. Thats just the way the calculus work. If he had not forgotten to put BB & JG in the filter according to the stats he would've likely taken Hoj. My point is if he didn't look up stats and instead just used his basic knowledge of TFT and think for himself, he wouldve probably taken Hoj as well. After all he is a smart guy. But just because its so intuitive of high elo players to look up stats for anything these days things like these happen. And its just sad to see tbh.
I think I stopped watching a lot of streamers because of this...top tier players playing the same meta comp and doing "paint by numbers" with stat checking. Like I can see people doing that in my lower tier lobbies...I watch the pros for something new or fun...not just to see the same thing as my lobby just played better lol
I don't even think this affects bad players that much like some people are saying. I get the argument with bugged augments but those are a very small percentage of cases. I have friends who aren't great at the game and they don't even use stats for items, let alone augments. I don't use them either because it's not fun and it feels like too much effort. Part of the game is recognising spots for augments. It'll suck when you don't know the augments but at least personally I find most of the augments easy to understand and it's not hard to get a grasp of if they're good if you have some knowledge of the set.
Did you know Tiny but deadly is bugged on kaisa Bruiser set 11 and on kalista faerie? Because stats knew and I just didn't pick this in those comps, but I learned about the bug way later thanks to leduck
no one has a problem that you don't use them because it's not fun and feels like too much effort. Also, I promise you good players still recognize spots for augments. Yes there are some people that blindly follow stats. who cares. yes, augment stats can influence the high elo meta to be "stale". That's a valid criticism.
@ ye I know good players still recognise spots, that’s why I’m saying it shouldn’t really affect them. The main impact is bad players and I agree that it’s bad for the game if bad players can just blindly follow stats and not experiment. There’s already enough bad players forcing the same 3 or 4 comps based on metaTFT/mobalytics without ever flexing. (Which is okay but I think that’s enough help for worse players)
@@magmoz565 yeah i think those are fair criticisms. but the reason it affects good players (or any player) is because it's just part of the way the game is designed that something can "fit a spot better" but the tuning of the numbers can make another augment a stronger choice. Stats give us the ability to gauge relative strength of the balance of augments and factor that choice into our decisions. I dont have a problem with removing augments i just dont likewhen people act like you can't use stats and think critically about spot
Idk this video is just recapping the Reddit thread.. i think it’d be better if you formed your own opinion and made a video. Not a personal attack it’s just a bit boring when it’s regurgitated
Again really... this promotes high playtime even more. The thing with stats is the way you read them, sure if an augment is giga broken it will show, but there is and was a lot of top tier hidded augments that didin't show in the stats that you had to know.
There are many level of competitive, some can be reach without spending a large amount of time. That’s why TFT have such a large player base. With data people with less play time can still be high rank with good ingame fundamentals. A game fill with nerd play game all day to be ‘competitive’ will never be popular
@@TuNguyen-hm4fq Agreed. But the elite top 1% players all do nerd spreadsheets behind the scenes imo. There's just no other way to find the small edges.
I think removing stats and removing tft streamers would improve the game fun because a meta known to the whole community is boring and destroys creativity. Nothing against you ofc subzero, love your streams. But everyone doing the same thing is boring and destroys a part of the game
Id say generally no stats means deeper understanding of the game, cause you wont just go ohh that augment and that comp, but rather go into the why, just like how people figure out the avenge the fallen was broken with kalista specifically cause half the board was trait bots that could be sacrificed but on the other hand people will stumble harder when augments seem good, but actually arent. Although that might also make a perception effect take place in the sense that you play differently if you dont know the strenght of your augments
I wish it was the case, but a lot of the times a generic augment is just stronger than an augment that fits your team, which silently griefs you. You have to waste a game per augment to know it's bad.
@@TheFuriator yeah your first point is the thing i think people miss. you can pick augments "for your spot" and another generic one can still be stronger. additionally it's probably no where near a game an augment, cause there's too many variables each game.
remember the first time they tried this people saying this will finally make the game fun again people will experiment more we'll get more diversity yeah that clearly happened, and will clearly happen again
Really good change imo, prevents meta being solved too quickly and allows for more skill expression in knowing the strengths and weaknesses of augments.
I agree, metas get solved way to fast now and then the ranked climb is e everyone playing "s" tier. This leaves for less expressive gameplay if you still want to lock out top 4s
What make you think people gonna stop spamming meta comp? Sooner or later there will be a tier list and people gonna play around it anyway. Except this time when there is no data people just gonna choose the safe augment and ignore all the niche augment with slightest downside. And don’t blame people on playing S tier comp when they want to win. Why don’t blame the balance team for can’t make other comp perform on that level? We can totally have a balance meta where 10+ comp can be S tier like at the end of set 11
@@TuNguyen-hm4fq you are not wrong, I do not blame people for playing meta's it is 100% a balancing issue. Set 10 and 11 had a large amount of playable lines, sadly set 12 was the opposite and made the every game feel the exact same because everyone was playing the same things imo
great change, there will be discussion in the community of what augments are strong, instead of just saying, this one has better stats, end of discussion. Players will have to actually use more brain cells and have their own opinion about augments. The tier list won't be all the same, some RUclipsrs and pros will agree on certain aspects but differ on others, resulting in greater variation and a richer dialogue around strategies
Is there any reason to belive this doesnt end like last time exept the gathered stats wouldnt be made accessable by the public because of the risk of loosing API access? I think a better way would be to ban using stats during the Game. Riot uses Kernal anti cheat anyway therefore this shouldnt be that hard.
You obviously don't know anything about what you're saying, so I'll repeat the key information in as simple of a language as possible so you memorize it: if match history shows augments picked, you can browse match history of people from websites with API access and create a program that calculates the average placement of people who took the augment. That's what happened in set 9. Riot didn't provide the data of how well the augment did, but because it was shown in match history you could create the data from that information. Now augments won't show up in match history anymore so you will never be able to check back on what augment you picked on a previous game, so you can't create data yourself anymore. Also: the anti cheat argument is stupid. People have phones. It's less convenient to browse stats on your phone as you play than having the number show up on your screen, but if you prohibit it showing on the screen, people who have it on their phones get uncontested advantage. Either it's all available always for everything or nothing never. Because if not you create inequality.
@@Mebsuta as shown in the video people gathered Augment stats "by hand" with quite a number of people. This information was shown on stat sites as educated guesses. The point I was making you obviously didnt understand was that this time these websites wouldnt show those educated guesses in fear of loosing API access. I also disagree that anticeat is a bad solution. The vast majority of people stop doing inconvinient things. It wouldnt detect everyone who looks at stats because of secondary devices but far less people would do it. In my opinion having stats for everybody is better then only top player having (slightly worse) stats. The core "problem" they want to solve is that people feel the need to pull up stats during a game. Make that against the rules and enforce it. If you want to convince someone try beeing less condescending and maybe you dont look like an idiot.
In general I like when stats don't exist because I hate meta in TFT, it's so boring playing EVERY game against the same over and over and over because the numbers say it's better
Just a reminder that cellphone doesn't have metatft. So that is a win any day. More so than me having .5 apm on my cellphone, the worst feeling it missing out on meta tft for augments.
I think comparing this to chess and poker has one major flaw.
Both never change, always the same figurines with their movements, always the same cards and their combinations.
You can easily build a much more longlasting memory of it.
TFT changes every two weeks on a minor and every 3 months on a major level.
You are supposed to be much more up to date because, taking your example with „oh dishsoap took this and it was great“, might not even be true anymore only a couple of days later.
Each set/patch requires you to reexplore what’s working and what’s not.
Augments get added/removed/changed all the time.
This is very different from „oh I have this full house here, that’s PROBABLY very strong“ or „oh I have the queen trapped here that way, I’ve had that before“.
These memories never go invalid.
This is very much NOT the case with TFT and much of its submechanics.
As someone who has played every set and started making content myself. I feel that I used to have more fun when I was not trying to min/max the game and follow the copy/paste players as I personally think it pulls some fun out of it. I used to always log on YT and just watch better players and what kind of neat things they would build. I understand both spots, people who do not have a lot of time would rather log in, see what the meta is and try to crush out a few wins. Where I agree with pulling stats to even this small of a degree is that I'd be playing a game and could call out the exact units someone was going to build, what items and near bis augments they would pick. That personally for me sucks the fun out of it when every lobby is mirrored of 9/10 of your last lobbies. I LOVE when I see other players pop off with something I've never seen before that either is bizzare and makes me laugh or op and shock me
I had the opposite experience: Having stats would show me more possibilities that actually work. I just can't test 20 comps for a dozen games each until I know what I want to play. Especially with 2-weeks patch cycles. Ultimately, I will just play what I like more and what FEELS best anyways. But the fact that I can look at weird augments and actually see that they perform okay enough which gives me an incentive to investigate them further. That is how I (an imo pretty low-skill casual player) reached Master multiple times already while playing flex only.
Last time they removed stats, I basically only played 2-3 comps because I just can't afford to grief that many games when I have limited time. And ultimately, I just played less overall and had less fun. That was also the time when every week or so a new "OP comp" would appear on Reddit and everyone would spam it in ranked to climb (tbf there were also other reasons for that during that set, but hiding stats did not help at all - whoever just followed Reddit faster would get 1-2 days of free climb until getting giga contested and many people ended up with incredibly inflated MMRs).
I get that there is an argument to be made, that effort and keeping track of the community should be rewarded (i.e. if stats are hidden, investing dozens of hours into unit analyses with ratios, dps numbers aso. with study groups becomes way more valuable), but in the end, TFT is still a GAME. Imo a game should be made for the player to have fun, not to force them to invest time and grind. You are ultimately just raising the threshold of entry for competitive by hiding stats.
People are always mentioning how exciting seeing unknown strategies is - but the reality is, that stats didn't stop that. You just had to actually look at the game to see what is going on. People just DEFAULTED to stats and didn't even bother looking at the games. But other players (e.g. like me) would actually look at the game, see something, analyse the stats, and try to understand how to work it out. I can only speak for myself, but I personally played the weirdest unknown comps in recent sets when everyone was like "meta is solved" - simply due to having stats tell me that "it isn't autolose, so you can try it".
How many times have we had augments that averaged like 5.2 because they were bugged and people who selected then would get HUGE disadvantage? Wukong and shen augs for instance were quite terrible for a few patches (shen for the whole set?)
There is no way to guess something is fishy with an augment without this. It is not even only about being flexible or considering your spot when making choices. TFT has it's share of bugged augs and knowing which ones are almost a guaranteed 8th is a good thing
Or golden quest saying 175 when actually being 196. You knew it was good at 161 so surely it’s at least playable at 175…
Riot still has the data, so they will be able to detect the outlier faster as more people take it
Or when they just silently change something to get stats on it. I mean, we even had the coin toss that randomly got changed to 60% instead of 50-50 at some point. How exactly am I supposed to find that out without playing 100s of games and keeping a detailed analysis of everything that happened?
I know, coin toss is irrelevant to the game as a whole. But if augment stats are hidden, you essentially have to manually create stats by playing 100s of games if you want to be competitive - which won't happen if you aren't playing full-time. This just means that people who can get information will just get an advantage over those who can not invest as much time into the game. Which is just bad for competitive...
dont forget about tooltips being wrong but they decided to patch it way too late and the only info you have that the tool tip is wrong is from Mort commenting about it on a clip instead of just hotfixing it
This sucks for people with low game time but want to compete like myself
I don't look at augment stats, but it seems stupid to remove them. Let people play the way they wanna play.
This will end the same way it did last time. Augment stats don't effect the better players, they effect the players with fewer games. Pros don't really need augment stats, they are just a way to "simulate" game time. If a player had 100,000 games themselves they wouldn't need to look up stats ever. Players with 1000 games don't really need stats either for the vast majority of games. The augment stats give players confidence when thinking about very niche lines and specific scenarios that make a comp viable. Now we will all just take the default good augments and this will ultimately lead to less variety.
Yeah you say that, but every single high elo streamer does the same thing. They all pull up the stats and make choices based on delta if they don't have anything that perfectly fits their comp.
It only enables the most casual, disengaged players. You don't need stats to think critically and find synergies between augments and your current board
@ yeah because why wouldn’t you use a cheat sheet on a test
@@bvrmnlol "It only enables the most casual, disengaged players". Then why do pros literally pull up the stats during tournaments?
Since stats are not needed to critically think about your augment choices, I think it's a good move by Riot to force everybody to do this. + it will be very likely good for game variance.
@@bvrmnlolmaybe in like emerald or some shit. You are completely gating yourself out of GM+ picking augments based on their avp regardless of your spot…horrible way to play.
this is a terrible change for people who play casually like 1-2 hrs a day but are competitive. I hit masters this season doing just that and i needed stats inorder to determine which augments are actually good. They are not the be-all-end-all to remove any sort of skillful piloting.
I understand Mort's points but the solution is excessive. Players who just pick the best augment without considering if their situation calls for it are not going to have an unfair advantage to people who actually know their stuff.
The only people who like this change are people who already play like 6-10 hrs a day.
Insider trading to the top again. The usual consequence of limiting information.
It'll effect players that don't play much the most. I see no reason for this, especially with the augment balance being so up in the air.
The thing is even with stats that's already a thing, top-players will always talk about strats and theories that are being developed behind the scenes, so you are definitely correct
But isn’t that how it’s supposed to be? In ranked the players that play the most will climb the most, and the players that don’t will remain in the bottom. Why should players that play less be the same rank?
this maybe a financial incentive move
@@leonperez933 Because it's not about skill, just information. Ofc you could argue that's part of the skill but in the end dodging 4.9 augments is not the skill expression players value
I don't get why tft influencers were ever against this. Most of them are good enough to not need the stats and it makes their knowledge that much more valuable to the community, driving more engagement/interaction
Because a lot of them lean on stats a lot if you read marcelp's guide last set for climbing to high challenger one of the biggest things he said is always always always checking stats
@ChocliOG you are not wrong lol
Most of them are super “good” because they spend more time studying stats rather than actually playing the game
@@vastnumber lol acting like a challenger player would be bad without stats. youre a memer
Where do you think they get the knowledge they share in their videos? They are just doing what 95% of the player base is too lazy to do which is do hours of stat checking. This is also annoying as a casual player since you could get on for a few games and immediately lookup what you needed to play a semi decent game of tft without devoting hours to it.
I'm not looking to make an argument for or against the change, however I will say as one of the aforementioned diamond players who doesn’t get a lot of games in per set. I like having stats available to me. I mean I get baited by bad augments anyway, but I like having the extra help in the augment decision process. I don't really see a problem with people wanting to know what is best for their comps. I get the point that it could make the game stale, but I know that people are still going to follow the tftacademy tierlist and just play what's broken even without tactics . tools. I'm not sure taking away the stats will have the outcome that people think it might, but that's just my two cents. If anyone has anything to add please feel free.
fair feedback...but , that's the point > making bad choice on augments means experimenting them and more important... learning the game. After all the game is called "TeamFight TACTICS" not "teamfight stats 3rd party advantage "
@@pokemonul1501 i get your last sentence is just kinda just for effect but are you implying that statistics cannot inform tactics?
@@erble8645Yes but then you are just a bot.
@@stephensleezer5083 lots of people dont use the websites for just 'help', they straight up make their augment choices solely based on the statistics, whatever shows the highest avp, they immediately take it without even trying to think by themselves.
I've seen a lot of people looking up the stats for high variance augments like Wandering Trainer or Call to Chaos which is obviously almost completely pointless.
@@Set491 Fair enough. I just wish more people would make your argument, which it seems is something like "using stats from a third party website to inform decisions is fundamentally unhuman and therefore doesn't belong in a game". But a lot of these comments seem to hide behind exaggerations that you can't have a good understanding of the game AND use stats.
There's only 2 reasons I don't like this change and the first is balance. I trust the tft team but when they take away stats we will not know how broken or bad augments are and so we will not be able to hold them accountable for it. The other reason is that it introduces a kind of gatekeeping where high elo players that have connections with each other will share the information on what is broken giving them an advantage over players who don't have such connections, compared to everyone having the stats and being able to see them.
This homework argument is ridiculous to me, because if you care about your rank you will have to do even more homework to find the best and most viable augments for your team comps. Instead of having stats you can look at and interpret for yourself quickly, you will have to find tons of examples and anecdotes on augments with a given team comp to find how well any given augment works in a given situation.
i don't mind hiding stats if riot is decent at balancing, take elise's hero augment for example, it was unplayable for half of the set and it is too niche of a comp for people to know is it good or bad without looking at stats
Not to mention times they added bugged augments, for a good chunk of time spin 2 win wukong augment just didn't give any of the stats, making it an average 6th and unplayable augment
I love to check any type of stat while playing, its actually a huge fun factor for me and augments missing will make my overall expirience just less fun..
On the do your homework point. Taking stats away doesnt take away the homework away. It just makes it more time intensifive and more niche. If Augments balancing was better then yes we don't need stats. But Augments with a 3.85 is not acceptable.
The bugs are the biggest argument for stats. If they aren't communicating IN GAME the bugs, they need to leave stats in. They can't rely on websites to reach the average user.
The fact of the matter is that in a game like TFT, something that says 10% buff to whatever and 12% buff to whatever can be completely different in power levels and there is just no realistic way to know the difference without either trying that augment or seeing the stats. Instead of having "homework" of looking up the stats, you now have "homework" of playing many games and keeping your eyes glued to streams. Maybe that's a good thing from Riot's perspective but unfortunate from a player who doesn't have much time.
If you hate playing the game but want to win just play normals
@@Set491?? If you hate playing the game, you’re not gonna be playing the game. He isn’t saying he hates the game, he’s saying that instead of have stats you’re going to have to play a bunch more games to “gather the stats yourself” ie see what wins games and that’s just not fun for anyone. In a way it’s even more homework
@@Set491 hes talking about playing the game optimally
person that doesnt have time should not ever hit master or higher, and due to copying meta ppl where able to do iit, makes no sense
Playing games of TFT shouldn't be homework though, playing any game you enjoy shouldnt be homework. Using third party apps and constantly looking up statistics for the game you are playing whilst playing it IS homework though. Also, the best players who have tons of time to play a lot of TFT will do WAY better with having access to stats and infos than the bad players who don't have much time to play the game. If you are only playing 3 games a week or whatever, does it really matter that one augment averages a 4.2 over a 4.4 when you as a player who barely plays arent going to recognize that the 4.2 is actually a 3.7 in the one comp its good in and a 4.7 in every other comp? It might actually be WORSE for you to read the stats because there is so much information coming in at once that you are barely going to parse the info, and the first like 15-20 games of a set you'll be just learning the units and traits and item combinations anyway. if you play 3 games a week, 20 games of TFT is gonna take like 6-7 weeks, at which point I just don't think you're getting very much from having access to stats when the better players who play a ton have had ample time to read them, understand them, and compare them with each other and their favorite streamers.
Horrible change. Instead of playing the game 100% of the time, I'll have to make some time for memorizing tier lists and watching more vods. And we have to do this every single patch.The devs are making this change with the intent of me discovering augments for myself. But that is simply not an option because everyone else in the lobby (at higher ranks at least) will be studying tier lists. All they did is add chores back into the game
Love the discussion vids Subzeroark! I'm a player who plays TFT pretty much every other set, normally ending in Master/Diamond if I don't play much. I feel like these kind of changes affect people like me the most. I want to play my best, but play less than 200 games a set. I don't have time to watch hours and hours of streams to identify what augments are best, and I don't have prior knowledge between sets about which augments are "standard good". A stats website helped me get a baseline, like you said, of what augments were good in which comps, but were never the be all end all for me, if something felt like it fit better I'd take it over something that had a higher rating. Also, once I'd played 100 games or so I used the stats websites much less as I had the knowledge already about strong augments. Its really gunna hurt new players who pick augments that sound good, but are actually 5.0 and then don't understand why they lose so much. Any new player who wants to be competitive is going to have a much harder time because of this, and the 1k games players who share information between each other are gunna be just the same as usual. I understand the sentiment, but it feels like a negative for the wider playerbase who want to improve and become the best they can be,
I don’t really like this because it will drive the developers to make lazier augments. As in easier to play ones. Because without stats people will almost always choose the “mid” option with no risk.
thats why the people who choose the «mid» option with no risk, will be just that «mid» players. taking risks and knowing when to pick augments because of experience is a skill instead of looking up stats on a website and letting it decide the game for you lmao
@@daviboyable Tell that to a casual player trying to climb when they only have a limited amount of games due to time constraints. Stats are just a substitute for time investment into research. They are worse than actual research, but good enough to allow players with little time to focus on actually playing the game.
What is even worse: Some "mid" augments can be secretly op. E.g. 2 stat augments might look nearly identical on a rough glance, but one is 4.0 the other is 4.6. Neither is risky whatsoever. But how do you know which one is better without stats? You simply don't unless you literally run some simulation manually or Mortdog randomly blurts out that info on stream (which has happened before). It is just not feasible for a normal, casual player to make that analysis. So this will just end up gatekeeping competitive moreso than anything else.
@@Scheater1337 you bring up some good points ngl
I feel like the motivation for this change was the fact that balancing augments this set was going to be an issue and now they dont really need to worry about it at all.
At the end of the day, in the elo where the stats actually matter, people don’t care as much for them, and for the casuals, it creates a lower barrier for play. I get that they don’t like it but the narrative about it being unhealthy is pretty ridiculous
Not a fan of stats at all when it comes to augments. People stat checking to get an advantage ingame to pick an augment is annoying. You are literally making a TFT website make the decision for you.
Literal bots when you get to higher ranks and see that everyone just insta picks the augment that obviously has the best stats. Zero creativity and honestly just a hastle to have to pull up stats all the time to be on an even playin field with the rest.
This change is an admission that riot es either unable or unwilling to balance augments
So their fix to some augments being picked more often because of their higher win rate is not telling you the win rate anymore
removing stats is kind of insulting to tft, implying that just clicking the best augment in stats makes you win. theres an incredible amount of game left even if you know the best items, units, and boards and optimizing how to get to the best boards from your spot is what makes it fun for more competitive players
Yeah, this is just a change for competitive TFT, which seems to be their focus in all regards. The majority of the casual player base is not at all in their minds. It is only a negative for people who do not have the time to sink multiple hundreds of games into a set. We will be stuck picking the bugged augments or the egregiously poor augments for the few games we get to play.
Yeah, i feel like the "doing the homework" argument is stupid because instead of taking 2 minutes to open tactics, well WHOOPS now you clicked a bugged augment because you didnt see /u/fuckoTFT's reddit post about how Blumpkin Buster (Smeech Hero Augment) is bugged
Or combat bandages last set @@1234pokemonrulz
God forbid, the game about strategically building powerful teams makes you think about a choice you make rather than googling the answer
@zbrodie Your comment would make sense if the game were balanced. Which it has never been. In fact, there are always egregiously overpowered and underperforming aspects of the game.
@@zbrodie removing augment stats makes sense in a world where the devs communicate bugs well. they do not.
spin to win was fully bugged for a patch where it gave wukong a 5% AD ratio instead of a 300% one lol
it's not about googling the best answer, but more like bubbling in the right answer and having your scantron read wrong. tactics.tools is the teacher saying "ok guys I messed up just bubble B for number 6"
As long as the scraping actually can't happen and the Devs communicate argument-crippling bugs effectively, I'm all good with this.
They have never been good at that, so it will be fked.
with overlays being a thing, scraping will be a thing
So people that don't have the time to play 20 games each patch and "try things out" don't get a way to quickly check if an augment is severely under or overperforming now mid-match. Great change guys! Really saved the high end competitive scene with that one! Didn't just totally fuck over the people that don't have as much time but still want to be competitive, though if those are not the whales, then I guess why would you care about them
What do you consider casual, but competitive? In my country there are 2 known players, one who spams 1000k games within the first 2 months and then stops and another who gets to master in extremely few games but stops there, they both play tournaments and the one with few games always outperformed the guy with 1k games even though both are master+. I haven't read new set's augments or units yet but you know when an augment is busted when you read it no? I think the only one that can be hard to guess are hero augments or ones that forces you to play differently like the one that gave you rolls when for each tick of level you bought.
Raw games played is *really* not a good skill check in the first place. I bet if you took a pro tft player and gave them 10 games in a set and then took a random gold player and gave them 300 games in a set, the pro player would still average a higher placement over the course of his games, playing against better competition. Games played does not equate to skill, and in fact, sometimes people play a bad comp a LOT because they find it fun and in that case a large number of games played is actively detrimental for them.
They need to bring back daily PBE RP from playing tft idk why they took that out.
idk what they expect to happen, i think they are being too idealistic this isn't going to change how people play the game, they need to understand the community for what it is, a bunch of stat sheep. also tft is an unintuitive game, a lot of augments can go from good to untakeable even in the best scenarios due to slight tweaks in numbers. You can say "oh this augment seems like it should be good here" and be completely wrong, and i think that would happen more times than not. Also you can tell if augments are bugged bc of horrible stats (wukong rework spin to win 7.0 avg XD)
yeah my problem with them is they try to have it both ways. They created a game where inherently, the numbers affect the strength, not just the words. which is fine. But don't take away a method people use to decipher which numbers lead to better results.
It's always like this with Riot, one step forward and two backwards
I don't agree with this as it will hurt more casual players. If anything, I could see ppl choosing augments that are more general or 'safe' and this would decrease risk taking (especially in ranked). If people are playing for enjoyment, they would probably play norms or hyper roll. Playing ranked is to be the best at the game and ppl find THAT to be fun (not necessarily the game itself). Edit: Also, I feel bad about the sites that survive off data scraping (ONLY IN THIS INSTANCE THOUGH - DATA SCRAPING IN GENERAL IS SHIT). What will they do?
I’ll agree with this change when they stop having dog shit augments thats D tier that can lose me a game because i didn’t have the warning against it
the change is lame to be honest, i didn’t even check augment stats set 12 but as a comp-sci nerd a game actively not posting augment data at the end of the match is cringe. artificially trying to boost creativity is not a thing. stats should be there for competitive minded players. more frustrating to try to do “homework” on something but not having the tools to do it
baseg
honestly same, i really enjoy analysing data and i feel like people really weren't forced to go check that data, so removing that option is kinda cringe yeah. I'd totally understand if it was banned on tournaments tho, and there i'd support it.
yeah but they have no choice but to artificially boost creativity because they cant fucking balance their game lmfao.
As someone who played tons of trading card games both before and after we had access to tons of data and stats, I can say unequivocally that the games were more fun and way more varied before we had access to the raw data, not even because people are playing the strongest stuff everytime, but because people are playing the SAME stuff everytime. TFT has so many possible permutations and if even the low ranked players are all just "BIS BIS BIS" hunting over and over again in lobbies it can drastically hamper the fun of everybody. They aren't artificially doing anything, why do you assume you should have access to the data in the first place? If TFT had launched without the ability to scrape data on games and was now changing it to allow people to do so, would you say they are "artificially trying to lessen the skill-gap?"
yeah but it gets to a point where people turn off their brains and pull up stats to see which augment to pick. So annoying and honestly a hastle to always check.. I think people should make their own decisions, not some tft website.
I think the game is too complex to hide stats, even with stats people don't play perfectly so your "creativity" can only go so far, and everyone can access the stats it doesn't take a lot of time to just browse what is good so I think the change is silly.
I think your “Go” example isn’t a 1 to 1 because Tft changes so often: augs and champs change every patch, sets change every couple months, etc. it will never be fully solved to a point like a static game like go can. So, removing an assets to the majority of the community that doesn’t have time to devote their life to learning the ever changing game seems pretty destructive imo.
This changes nothing besides taking away info from lower rank players. The best players separate themselves partly by knowing which augments to pick in their spots, no good player just picks based off stats anyways.
this is a good thing! Please dont tell me u think this is a bad thing. PICTURE MATCHERS RUIN TFT
@ I’m challenger, never checked stats before. This won’t affect me much but it hurts lower ranked players or people tryna learn the game. How is this any different than banning sites that list the top comps (based on stats). All this does is make the already steep learning curve for the game even worse.
Dish soap literally chooses augments based on their win rates
My opinion here is when I was really low ranked I'd come home from work and if I had free time I'd just watch my favorite youtubers. Quite a few will tell you their thought process in why they are building certain lines and why they took certain augments. At least that's the way it was a few set ago
@@reiarigato8559 Are you trying to argue he never takes a statistically unfavourable augment based on his spot? what a ridiculous assertion. Like the op said "The best players separate themselves partly by knowing which augments to pick in their spots, no good player just picks based off stats anyways." I've seen dishsoap take less favoured augments before, he doesn't blindly follow stats.
I just dont agree with people saying this is bad for casuals who dont play often. I literally play max one or two games a session, I also have never over looked into augment stats and still manage to hit diamond this set. The average player is much smarter than people give credit and will be able to make a value judgement based on their current spot. If they get burned by their choices THEY DO LEARN for next time. This change will not hurt casuals whatsoever or if it does itll be negligible
God forbid people actually need to play the game to develop their own knowledge and skill, to understand what's good for their playstyle instead of copy pasting from meta tft websites LMAO
@@matthewturvey563 what if i am not a robot and I can tell one augment is probably better synergy with my spot, playstyle, etc. and I'm using my critical thinking knowledge and skill. why can't I also look at stats and incorporate the stats into my decision making process by using the stats as a corpus of experience and factor in my spot and playstyle.
@@erble8645 why do you need the stats to do that? you're playing a game and not looking at a spreadsheet. if you're failing to place and it's not because someone blatantly hard contested and greifed you, you with your "critical thinking" skills should be able to discern what led to the outcome of that game. you in the game have 100% knowledge of what the enemy has outside of whatever is exactly in their current shop and their exact gold value. and actually, good players wouldn't need stats to tell them what augments their comp needs to succeed. most people don't use it as an additive to their playstyle they just use it as a how-to manual on what to pick. super disenginous to say that people use it to incorporate the stats into their decision-making process when it just blatantly is their decision-making process.
@@mankdemes8887 i never said you need stats in order to think critically. My point was that some people still do think critically AND use stats is all. Your point that the vast majority of the player base doesn't do this I have no idea about and concede that point. I understand the change might have been made for the overall good of the game. Saying something like "good players wouldn't need stats to tell them..." makes me think you don't understand that multiple augments can fit a comp and the game developers' adjustment of their numbers can heavily impact what augment is actually stronger. Criticize stale gameplay and the majority of playerbase being drones all you want. But I think it's wrong that you imply there's no use for stats in terms of how strong an augment is in a given comp.
10:45 Chessengines are actually a really bad example.
Yes, we know the "objective truth" in a lot of positions, but the objective truth often doesn't line up with experienced results. There are openings where the engine will tell you that one side is clearly winning, but even at the tippitytop level the results are even. Or there are positions where the engine says it is even, but even can mean that there is one single very long sequence of moves that leads to a draw and everything else losses, so a lot of humans lose in those positions. This is even more true for "normal" players. There are a lot of positions that titled players would say are doomed for one side that casual players wouldn't even see an advantage in.
Past some level players also don't really care about past results in a position. If Magnus Carlsen thinks everyone is just missing one way to play a variation which leads to the terrible 25% pointscore, then he will still go into it and try to prove that there is something people had been missing.
Having a number that doesn't necessarily apply to you, even if it is "objective" makes it the good kind of stat in a lot of circumstances. I think it's really fun to look through stats in search of anomalies - sometimes you see something that seems wrong and then you have to consider why an item that most people agree is mediocre has such a high AVP (gets picked on late game carrousels inflating its stats) or whether seeing a high lobby winrate on WW 3* actually means WW is busted or if the only 3*s also had his heroaugment. The stat sites are unfortunately TOO GOOD at what they are trying to do. You can filter for so much that you can get to these answers directly and don't have to actually figure out the followup questions yourself.
If you only got more surface level information, then I think the stats would be much less of an issue - but I don't think Riot can force that to happen.
There are some things which act like these hidden questions still - Figuring out how good Heartsteel or another Econ trait was had to be done "by hand", since the stats always looked bad. People maybe had 3 Hearsteel on their lategame boards, but anything more than that was generally cut by everyone making Top 4, so ofcourse the stats looked terrible.
As someone who plays very very casually, with the new pacing of how they are releasing sets i really feel discouraged from playing when they make these kinds of changes, it just feels too daunting to have to learn new augments on top of new set and honestly i feel that my limited amount of free time is better spent elsewhere.
@@arber7240 I dont think any 'real' casual player will look up the stats for any decision they make. Looking into stats means you're invested into the game to the point you would spend extra time to type in all that stuff and wanna find out the best way to climb.
Real casual players play this game on their Mobiles while attending classes 😂
how?? the way augments work is that you look at your board, read what the augment does and think which ones fits best, is not that hard man, specially if you are a casual
Honestly the most fun I have ever had in this game was just slamming random crap/augments and either laughing at how op it turned out to be or laughing at how bad I am getting stomped haha
I'm genuinely curious, what does "very very casually" mean to you? is it like, 2 games a month? 3 games a week? 1 a day? what does that mean? Because I have friends who play TFT very casually and they legit play during release week and then will play on game nights when we cant find another thing to do, so they probably play 10-20 games per set. Those people... do not need access to stats in order to enjoy the game and just play in casual lobbies.
The reason they are doing it is to hide their incompetence in balancing certain augments. This will change nothing to be honest, now augments will just be ranked S tier to F tier
Damn I get it but augment stats are the most important and unfun. Some auguments just ruin your game, even though they look good. This testing is so weak.
I don't mind BIS items stats gone or compositions, but auguments are healthy.
Finally.. it was such a bad thing that no one was using his brain and "look at the stats, what's the best pick it". I think game would be more fun without stats. I mean for the new players, comps are okay to look at it, but augment stats or win chance to round, bla bla.. it's to much. I don't object to commentators looking at it. Because it's don't effect the game directly like "stats says this one is best let's see what he gonna pick" it is okay. But seing the stats while playing the game not good. That's how i think.
I was never a fan of looking up augment stats, I feel like it is just unfair, I would rather just pick whatever seems nice and then think about it after the game.
Personally stats are a way for me to justify less common augments so this will likely just force me onto meta lines more often i guess.
I'd be fine with it if augments were even close to balanced. Right now theres augments close to 3.0 avp and some around 6.0avp. You could easily pick an augment that theoretically sounds good for your board but its just undertuned and like 5.0 avp and youre just putting yourself at a huge disadvantage. At least we have stats for the first patch I guess.
i don't like this change at all. The way i see it is regardless if stats are in the game or not You still should think about picking augments and make decisions dependant on your current situation. Data is just protection against poor game balance, because it let's you see that sometimes augment matching your strategy is still bad because numbers just arent't tune up right. Arguably there is more homework now because if you treat game seriously (grandmaster+ lvl) You still need to look for information , (watching tournaments,streamers) but these informations won't be accessible for everyone so this change promotes players spending time in their inner circles more than semi-casuals.
good example is how support golem 1 and 2 was broken and overtuned for most of last set. If stats wasn't in game it doesn't fix anything, its just elitist change, because people watching tournaments and their favourite streamers would notice how they prioritize taking this augments above any other combat augments , not because it fits, just because its overtuned, and there are always op augments and rly bad ones, regardless how they fit team comp, i believe information is good because more ppl abuse something , then faster it will be fixed.
So instead of doing their job of balancing the game they just put the blame on the players and ban stats 😅. Not having stats just bait you into playing something that doesn’t work out most of the time and that is much more frustrating than seeing everyone play the same thing. And there is so much more nuance than just picking the best statistic in order to win a game of tft so I can only see this as the dev team being lazy and just dumping the problem on the players instead of fixing it
Good change cant change my mind
I will be ignoring the details of every single augment and sheeping tierlists out of protest. Set 9 was my GOAT and they bricked it for months with this stat paranoia..
doesn't solve anything imo, stats are here to stay regardless
I like the point about pros making tierlists. The key difference between stats and pro tierlists that I think makes tierlists more interesting is that pro players can and will disagree on which augments are good. Disagreement and discussion is so much more interesting and engaging than a number you can point to. That being said, pros have biases, but statistics also miss key information. I think wanting to optimize lines through statistics is a totally valid way to play TFT, but I also think getting players to think while they play is the most important thing.
(Also I sit around plat/emerald and I've never used stats websites... I'm secretly hoping my opponents struggle at the start of the set without the extra knowledge, which i myself am used to not relying on :> )
I'll say this: as someone who started in Set 10, I loved how I could play my favorite line and figure out for myself what was good in that line. It feels good. I've been getting burned out by TFT because everybody just realized what was strong so fast. It forced me to play lines that I didn't think was fun, and I think my strength as a player is how flexible I can be. I'm excited for this change. I will say though that stat checking definitely made me grow really fast as a player, so there's that.
Augments are too poorly balanced imo to do this. Rest is good, but some augments are unplayable.
Eg. Built Different, sometimes 3.xx, sometimes like 5.68, can't really tell without ruining a game trying it.
well if u think the augment sucks, dont pick it? if you pick it and it turns out it sucks, then dont pick it again? pretty simple. play the game and you'll develop skill
@@matthewturvey563lolchess pls
@@matthewturvey563 okay but there is 200+ augments and I have a tournament a weak after the release, how will I know if an hero augment is good or not if I never saw it in my hundred game and the only time I get to see it is in tournament ? How do I know I have the spot or I don't?
@@matthewturvey563 making a strength evaluation after one game is iffy. Sometimes you high roll, sometimes you play it improperly. Obviously as you gain experience and skill you will try to account for those in your evaluations but it's like just nerfing not having played as much.
@@matthewturvey563If you are not on grandmaster/challenger level I doubt you are able to easily connect a game lose back to your augment choices or even just a single augment choice. Especially since it's highly unlikely that you personally will hit the same combination of augments, items and comp choices again. That's why stats are helpful because it's way more likely that out of thousands of players someone has been at your position before and then you can clearly see the connection.
I don't understand what the team has against accessibility.
I think this is extremely bad for new people, can't study groups and higher level players just share knowledge with each other, while people not in those circles just have to grasp at straws or try and figure out patches on their own?
I've never used stats. I'm a very playing what feels right sort of guy. Obviously I'll look at good players and learn meta lines but I find myself in a unique position of this not impacting me all that much. Welcome to my world.
I think this is a good change since Ive seen top tier players and streamers would look up literally every single choice in TFT. Items, Augments were just chosen without even considering their spot or their tempo or their whatever. Like whats the point of having a choice when you could just follow a step by step guide. Its like youre not even playing the game and thinking by yourself but rather just braindead follow a guide and be a robot.
Ive seen a challenger player in my lobby complaining about getting the post nerf Item Collector ll as an option and instead but taking Ascension with 6 warriors 🤦🏻♂️. Even tho they had 100 items on their board they chose Ascension over item collector just because the stats said Ascension's avp is higher.
And I dont even wanna talk about how often Ive seen people looking up the stats for Wandering Trainer trying to find whether the stats say they should take it or not ...
And of course this problem is not only to be found with Augments stats but items as well. Not too long ago I've watched Boxbox looking up the stats for his Gwen 2 with BB &JG, wether Hoj or Gunblade would be better on her. He looked up the items for Gwen star level 2.
He picked gunblade out of his instead of Hoj.
Anyone would understand that having Hoj in Combination with Spellcrit (JG or IS) is usually of higher value in general because you can significantly increase your Unit's overall DPS by having a higher crit chance. Thats just the way the calculus work.
If he had not forgotten to put BB & JG in the filter according to the stats he would've likely taken Hoj.
My point is if he didn't look up stats and instead just used his basic knowledge of TFT and think for himself, he wouldve probably taken Hoj as well. After all he is a smart guy. But just because its so intuitive of high elo players to look up stats for anything these days things like these happen. And its just sad to see tbh.
? You are beyond delusional if you think this is true 😂😂😂
I understand this is an exaggeration, but I have to correct you. Top tier players are considering their spot or tempo.
I think I stopped watching a lot of streamers because of this...top tier players playing the same meta comp and doing "paint by numbers" with stat checking. Like I can see people doing that in my lower tier lobbies...I watch the pros for something new or fun...not just to see the same thing as my lobby just played better lol
@@MonkeyBearTFTif pros played for fun they'd be stuck in shitlo like you lmao
@@xavs3245 pro players are fake, they all just DATA NERDS 🤓
Augment stats were pretty useless imo. They're way too situational and especially when its at 2+.
I don't even think this affects bad players that much like some people are saying. I get the argument with bugged augments but those are a very small percentage of cases. I have friends who aren't great at the game and they don't even use stats for items, let alone augments. I don't use them either because it's not fun and it feels like too much effort. Part of the game is recognising spots for augments. It'll suck when you don't know the augments but at least personally I find most of the augments easy to understand and it's not hard to get a grasp of if they're good if you have some knowledge of the set.
Did you know Tiny but deadly is bugged on kaisa Bruiser set 11 and on kalista faerie? Because stats knew and I just didn't pick this in those comps, but I learned about the bug way later thanks to leduck
no one has a problem that you don't use them because it's not fun and feels like too much effort. Also, I promise you good players still recognize spots for augments. Yes there are some people that blindly follow stats. who cares. yes, augment stats can influence the high elo meta to be "stale". That's a valid criticism.
@ ye I know good players still recognise spots, that’s why I’m saying it shouldn’t really affect them. The main impact is bad players and I agree that it’s bad for the game if bad players can just blindly follow stats and not experiment. There’s already enough bad players forcing the same 3 or 4 comps based on metaTFT/mobalytics without ever flexing. (Which is okay but I think that’s enough help for worse players)
@@magmoz565 yeah i think those are fair criticisms. but the reason it affects good players (or any player) is because it's just part of the way the game is designed that something can "fit a spot better" but the tuning of the numbers can make another augment a stronger choice. Stats give us the ability to gauge relative strength of the balance of augments and factor that choice into our decisions. I dont have a problem with removing augments i just dont likewhen people act like you can't use stats and think critically about spot
Not having stats is more fun. But, Didn’t study groups just maintain their own stats and have an advantage with stats last time anyway?
Idk this video is just recapping the Reddit thread.. i think it’d be better if you formed your own opinion and made a video. Not a personal attack it’s just a bit boring when it’s regurgitated
Again really... this promotes high playtime even more. The thing with stats is the way you read them, sure if an augment is giga broken it will show, but there is and was a lot of top tier hidded augments that didin't show in the stats that you had to know.
Back to checking vids / tierlists by high lvl ppl instead of a quick tactic tool check..''Homework'' just becomes harder for everyone..
You gotta do your HW in ANY GAME if you want to be competitive.
There are many level of competitive, some can be reach without spending a large amount of time. That’s why TFT have such a large player base. With data people with less play time can still be high rank with good ingame fundamentals. A game fill with nerd play game all day to be ‘competitive’ will never be popular
@@TuNguyen-hm4fq Agreed. But the elite top 1% players all do nerd spreadsheets behind the scenes imo. There's just no other way to find the small edges.
huge win mortgod
I think removing stats and removing tft streamers would improve the game fun because a meta known to the whole community is boring and destroys creativity. Nothing against you ofc subzero, love your streams. But everyone doing the same thing is boring and destroys a part of the game
Id say generally no stats means deeper understanding of the game, cause you wont just go ohh that augment and that comp, but rather go into the why, just like how people figure out the avenge the fallen was broken with kalista specifically cause half the board was trait bots that could be sacrificed
but on the other hand people will stumble harder when augments seem good, but actually arent.
Although that might also make a perception effect take place in the sense that you play differently if you dont know the strenght of your augments
I wish it was the case, but a lot of the times a generic augment is just stronger than an augment that fits your team, which silently griefs you. You have to waste a game per augment to know it's bad.
@@TheFuriator yeah your first point is the thing i think people miss. you can pick augments "for your spot" and another generic one can still be stronger. additionally it's probably no where near a game an augment, cause there's too many variables each game.
Yeah that's true, like how giant and mighty was basically an Auto pick most of the set
Great change from riot and im very happy with it
remember the first time they tried this people saying this will finally make the game fun again people will experiment more we'll get more diversity
yeah that clearly happened, and will clearly happen again
Really good change imo, prevents meta being solved too quickly and allows for more skill expression in knowing the strengths and weaknesses of augments.
I agree, metas get solved way to fast now and then the ranked climb is e everyone playing "s" tier. This leaves for less expressive gameplay if you still want to lock out top 4s
What make you think people gonna stop spamming meta comp? Sooner or later there will be a tier list and people gonna play around it anyway. Except this time when there is no data people just gonna choose the safe augment and ignore all the niche augment with slightest downside.
And don’t blame people on playing S tier comp when they want to win. Why don’t blame the balance team for can’t make other comp perform on that level? We can totally have a balance meta where 10+ comp can be S tier like at the end of set 11
@@TuNguyen-hm4fq you are not wrong, I do not blame people for playing meta's it is 100% a balancing issue. Set 10 and 11 had a large amount of playable lines, sadly set 12 was the opposite and made the every game feel the exact same because everyone was playing the same things imo
9:13 nah it was set 10
Not a problem, everyone complaining git gud or sumtin idk
This might bring me back to the game, so unfun to need an extra tab open at all times just to play the game
FACTS! picture match database meta slaves ruin the whole point of tft
@@matthewturvey563 I'm not against you necessarily, but from your perspective, what is the point of tft?
Just let us play the game why does Mortdog want to police how we have fun?
THIS IS BASED
great change, there will be discussion in the community of what augments are strong, instead of just saying, this one has better stats, end of discussion. Players will have to actually use more brain cells and have their own opinion about augments. The tier list won't be all the same, some RUclipsrs and pros will agree on certain aspects but differ on others, resulting in greater variation and a richer dialogue around strategies
Not diving too deep Into it. I like the change 👍
love u bud
now people will have to manually type what augments they took in what game for the illegal stat websites 🙄🙄
Is there any reason to belive this doesnt end like last time exept the gathered stats wouldnt be made accessable by the public because of the risk of loosing API access? I think a better way would be to ban using stats during the Game. Riot uses Kernal anti cheat anyway therefore this shouldnt be that hard.
You obviously don't know anything about what you're saying, so I'll repeat the key information in as simple of a language as possible so you memorize it: if match history shows augments picked, you can browse match history of people from websites with API access and create a program that calculates the average placement of people who took the augment. That's what happened in set 9. Riot didn't provide the data of how well the augment did, but because it was shown in match history you could create the data from that information. Now augments won't show up in match history anymore so you will never be able to check back on what augment you picked on a previous game, so you can't create data yourself anymore. Also: the anti cheat argument is stupid. People have phones. It's less convenient to browse stats on your phone as you play than having the number show up on your screen, but if you prohibit it showing on the screen, people who have it on their phones get uncontested advantage. Either it's all available always for everything or nothing never. Because if not you create inequality.
@@Mebsuta as shown in the video people gathered Augment stats "by hand" with quite a number of people. This information was shown on stat sites as educated guesses. The point I was making you obviously didnt understand was that this time these websites wouldnt show those educated guesses in fear of loosing API access. I also disagree that anticeat is a bad solution. The vast majority of people stop doing inconvinient things. It wouldnt detect everyone who looks at stats because of secondary devices but far less people would do it. In my opinion having stats for everybody is better then only top player having (slightly worse) stats. The core "problem" they want to solve is that people feel the need to pull up stats during a game. Make that against the rules and enforce it. If you want to convince someone try beeing less condescending and maybe you dont look like an idiot.
In general I like when stats don't exist because I hate meta in TFT, it's so boring playing EVERY game against the same over and over and over because the numbers say it's better
l2p complainers, good change
good ! noobs will learn game by themselves
Its a great change. Many players got lazy and gamę based on tactical thinking and innovation changed into copy pasta play.
HOW ABOUT YOU PLAY THE GAME INSTEAD OF MATCHING PICTURES FROM A WEBSITE
Aren’t you just ass from losing to someone matching pictures on a website?? 😂
@@Dragonrage132 Maybe? but at least I'm playing the game myself and not letting some database dictate how i play a VIDEO GAME. pathetic
Just a reminder that cellphone doesn't have metatft. So that is a win any day. More so than me having .5 apm on my cellphone, the worst feeling it missing out on meta tft for augments.
BASED MORT
As I don't use them, this will be great for me!
👎👎👎👎👎
you need to learn to show people what you are reading instead of random gameplay. Helps people follow along.
Good. People using stats are cringe
PICTURE MATCHERS RUIN TFT, THIS IS FANTASTIC NEWS.
I support this change ,cooking feels much more enjoyable to me and I am a top 500 player in my region
Good change
For a guy who never check augment stat like me. Its a win lol 🥸