You should still be able to use your amp as normal when using the 4CM. While you can use your multi FX pedal to bypass your amp, that's only one possible configuration. Check your multi FX pedal's manual to see if you need to change settings. There are some examples in the linked guide that may help.
THE BEST FX LOOP EXPLANATION! I watched a bunch no one explained where the guitar and front of the amp cables go. Obvious if you already know but this guy explained it perfectly with visuals. Very good top quality video. Thanks for taking the effort to do it well.
Very well explained. Years ago, many folk, including myself, were using the '4 cable' method without knowing it was a 'method'. It was natural, when dealing with amps with an effects loop, to place those pedals that work better in front of the amp (e.g. overdrive/compression/wah), and have those pedals that work best after the pre-amp i.e. in the FX loop (e.g. time based effects such as chorus, flange, delay, reverb). The 'classic' placement of types of pedal (before amp/in loop) was well known then.
OMG All these years I was wondering what costly stuff can I buy to have a great sounds how great artists get on stage. Thank you very much from the core of my heart. You are saviour.
Can you do a video on using your line 6 helix floor in 4 cable method and using helix to also switch the amp channels as well. Mesa dual rectifier multiwatt would be nice. Your videos are clear and easy to understand. Thanks.
I never even thought about using a switchable effects loop to mute the preamp stage.. That really does make for a lot of customization with older tube amps that don't have midi capabilities
so with the Helix why are you using a separate send block and return block for the preamp loop? Why not just set the block as fxloop and that way you only use 1 block instead of 3
On old amps w no effects loop you can get a great sound with overdrive first,delay second with reverb being last.The time based effects are super sensitive placed in front so you have to lower the mix level to maybe half of what it would be if used in the e loop.My Plexi sounds better with pedals in front of amp than my newer amps using time based pedals in the loop.I agree that my DSL sounds better using OD in front and delay reverb in the loop.I wonder if Plexi like reissues would sound better using loop instead of everything in front.
I was just wondering if this was possible and you gave me the answer. I tried it and it just saved me some money... a lot of money actually ;) Thanks brother.
Having a hard time connecting a Korg G3 multi effects to my existing pedalboard , that includes a whammy, compression, and octave pedal, EQ and a noise gate.
What a gr8 tutorial.! Gotta admit that demo with "all pedals" going into front of the amp cracked me up. Sounded like the huge hangar/warehouse at work when there's lots of machines moving and echoing at the same time.😂
Great video... Thank you! Where would a noise gate plugged with the 4 cable method go? I use a Boss Katana with built in effects, but I also have 3 pedals: Cry Baby Wah, Rat distortion, and Noise Gate. Thank you!
Placing the noise gate straight after your Rat pedal will probably work best. Depending on what built-in effects you use with the Katana, you could try placing the noise gate in the FX loop. But they typically work best placed after the noisiest pedal, which is probably the Rat.
Thanks for the video! I connected my helix LT to my EVH iconic but only get small, quiet sounds out of the speakers. No matter what the volume, gains, etc are I can’t hear it much. Changed to line/instrument in global settings as well. Any suggestions?
Great videos Aaron, thank you. Can you do this setup with the line 6 Helix rack and a Mesa Boogie Triaxis? That would be a huge help. Thank you and Happy Holidays. RJ
While the Triaxis is far more complicated than a typical amp with how much control you have over it, the basic idea is still the same. Have a read through the 4CM article on my website as it has a few different diagrams and you should get the basic idea of how to connect it all up. There is a section for 'FX LOOP' in the Triaxis manual that I recommend reading. Have fun, I'd imagine you would get some great tones out of that rig.
How about a "3 cable" method with an effects unit (i.e. Boss GT-1)? Would go like this... Plug guitar into the amplifier (cable 1) and then from amplifier fx "send" go into the input on GT-1 (cable 2) and then from mono output on GT-1 into amplifier fx "return" (cable 3)? Technically the GT-1 doesn't have an effects unit... but is that not a an effects loop of sorts? I would just be using this for delay and chorus effects pretty much. I have a great amplifier (6505+) and just want to add some basic effects.
Yes that will work fine with how you described setting it up. Just make sure any amp/cab models on the GT-1 are bypassed so they don't interfere with your amp's tone.
I notice a signal drop. if I bypass the preamp model, and uses the cabinet amp, in 4CM method particular in using clean amp channel. what can be the cause?
i have a question....so i have a zoom multieffect and i wanna use the effects (delay,reverb,etc) but also use an 808 as a booster and a boss noise sup...so what do i do? connect the 808 to NS then to the input of the zoom and do the same steps you explain after that?
You have a few different choices. You can place the 808 and NS before the zoom, after the zoom (but before the amp input), or in the effects loop. My guess is that placing those pedals before the zoom will give you the best results, but the best way to find out is to experiment and try out each combination. It really depends on how you use the zoom. Let your ears tell you which positions sound best for each pedal rather than following typical 'rules' you see shared online.
I have a similar question as Aaron. I want my over drive and gate to go into the front of my amp head, but not interfere with the effects loop. If I put my overdrive and gate into the front of my helix won’t it mess with the overall signal throughout the chain even in the effects loop? Is there a way to wire it so that it only effects before the preamp and not after? Thanks in advance
@@chrissalinas1902 Anything you put into the front of your amp will affect the rest of the chain, including the effects loop. All the effects loop does is give you a way to insert effects later on in the chain. But it will still be affected by anything plugged in before that point.
hi, for sure one of the best video about 4cm. good job done.And now, my question : can you break that nut :-) Amp : JC-40 > 1 fx loop . 2 Guitar IMPUT for stereo , ( in fact 2 amp section ) LINE6 HX Effect : 2 FX loop. 2 Output. so now: using 4cm, only 1 guitar imput will be used. so in fact NO STEREO. i asked on many sites, obviously none can answer that : how to get both imput on JC-40 for stereo effect. So what i tried to be sure . on my signal flow , on last slot i added a auto panner. running 4cm with only 1 imput used ( left/ mono as recommanded ) the pan make a channel silent. mean, sound disapear because of no imput on right , for instance. the second FX loop on the HX effects, is , normally made for a second amp with its own Send / return. BUT the JC-40 ( and all other JC ) do not have 2 FX LOOP. in fact , only 1 send. so.. hw do i get the 2 imput of the JC used ? 5 cables methode ? i hope you will enjoy thinking about that -)
As you mentioned, the JC-40 doesn't have stereo send jacks, so you know you can't have stereo on both the amp input and effects loop. So you need to decide which is more important to you. Do you want to run everything stereo on the amp input side and forget about the amp's effects loop? Or run your amp input mono and add stereo effects in the effects loop? You can't properly have both, so you need to choose which is more important to you. Once you make this choice, it will be easier to work out how to set up your rig. I would suggest forgetting about 4CM and just run a stereo output directly from your HX Effects to your JC-40. It's a simpler setup and makes good use of your amp's stereo input. No need to overly complicate things by trying to add in 4CM when you know it's not going to properly work. Alternatively, try running stereo into the amp's input, listen to how that sounds, then compare that to running mono into the amp and using the amp's effects loop. Let your ears tell you which option sounds better.
@@AaronMatthies good point Aaron,well, actually i cant try anything. My HX effect is now on repair, for second time, but when back, i will try one thing: since it has 2 fx loop, and within the signal flow , 1 can choose fx 1 or fx 2 or both, i will simply try to use both, and out of the HX send , i will go to second Amp section. maybe will be working, the return will be anyway from a single jack backside of the amp.but i will think about your suggestion, Thanks Aaron, Stay Safe : -)
I’m using this method for my noise gate my pre amp is my drive/dist. Where do input my delay pedal? Between the pedal and the amp input or between the pedal and the effects loop?
Delay pedals typically sound best in the effects loop towards the end of the chain after any drive effects. But it's always a good idea to test out different positions and let your ears tell you what sounds best.
You can easily combine other pedals with a multieffects pedal. You can add pedals from the multieffect's send jack or after the return jack. For example, if you want to add a reverb pedal at the end, you would unplug the return jack from the multieffects pedal, plug it into the reverb pedal and connect the reverb pedal to the multieffects return jack. Just think of the multieffects pedal as a single pedal in a chain and you can add other pedals before or after it as you like.
Question: Sometimes I will be playing out of an amp with effects loop, and sometimes not (vintage Marshall, Fender, etc.) Is there a way to set up a pedal board where I can use the 4 cable method, sending some effects to the loop and some straight into the amp front end, and then also have all pedals going into the front end for an amp without an effects loop, without having to rewire the pedal chain to accommodate these two options? Thanks, Dan
You should be able to do something like that with an effects switcher like the BOSS ES-8. The idea with these is that you plug all of your pedals into the switcher, then you can program the switcher to route your pedals in any way you want. So you should be able to set up one setting where all the pedals go to the front of your amp, then another setting where some of the pedals go into the amp's effects loop.
Really good thing to know for beginners. For my bass I have a compressor, preamp pedal, distortion, overdrive, chorus, noise gate. Should any of them be after the Amp for better sounds, or are all fine before it? I am asking, cos chorus distortion and overdrive have not arrived yet, since I just ordered them :) Thabjs. Great video. Thumps up from Germany.
The only pedal you might want to try out in the effects loop may be the chorus pedal. All of the others should sound best in front of the amp. The chorus pedal may or may not sound better in the effects loop. Your ears will tell you what position sounds best. Glad you found the video helpful.
Well the Tone Block does have an effects loop, so you can try it out and let your ears tell you whether it's worth the effort or not. I'd imagine it won't make much difference and you'll prefer a simpler setup without all the cables.
Q: I'd like to combine the ME unit with a pedal (Fortin GRIND) - where is the optimal position for this pedal in the 4CM chain, as described in this video?
It depends what effects you will be running through your multi-effects pedal. If you think about it, you have three main choices: 1) before the ME input, 2) in between the ME and the amp main in, 3) in the effects loop. I doubt that pedal would work best in the effects loop (3), so you might want to experiment with 1 or 2.
So in essence by removing the pre amp, you are just using the speakers of Katana? Thats what I need to do as I have a boss katana mk2 but want to buy a Helix lt. I want to be able to control the amp tone with the helix instead of boss amp.
Hello and thank you for this video! I have run my setup like this for a few years now and it really makes a huge difference in sound. There is one thing I can’t seem to find good information on yet… I would like to eliminate the unwanted noise when the rig is on, volume up and idle. I have seen that pedals like the cock blocker and the Electro-Harmonix Silencer address this for the most part but nobody seems to mention where a noise suppressor /gate using the “four cable” method would go in relation to the effects loop. In other words, would I still take the guitar input into the “guitar in” of the silencer then into let’s say the distortion pedal and then into the amp in, then…take the fx loop send of the amp into the send of the silencer pedal then into let’s say the “reverb” pedal and then the out of the reverb into the fx loop return? Would this work? Any input would be appreciated. Thanks!
I'd suggest experimenting by placing the noise suppressor/gate at different positions to figure out what works best for your rig. Hear how it sounds at the very start of your rig compared to in the effects loop and let your ears tell you when it's working the best.
The Fortin Zuul is really nice.It’s got a side input for guitar then effects loop goes into main input on Zuul then output goes to delay/reverb to return of effects loop to keep from gating delay/reverb tails.It works great and barely have to turn it up to maybe one or two.I can’t even tell if it’s on playing wise and it’s quiet as a mouse.
Hi Aaron, I have a question for you. I have a Boss Gt-1 multi processor. In the back of it, there is only right and left (output) (there is no send/return). I also have Blackstar Id: Core 100. Can I still use the 4 cable method?
Looks like the BOSS GT-1 doesn't work with the 4 cable method. Seeing as your amp does have an effects loop, you could add other pedals to the effects loop and keep your GT-1 at the front of the signal chain.
Not sure which bit you mean. With the physical cable connections, I mean the combo amp. But depending on what multi-effects pedal you have, you might also need to play around with the settings to turn the onboard amp on/off. I go into more detail in the guide on my website, so that might help you out more than this video.
So I can have 2 pedal boards one in front for overdrive and one in effects loop for modulation etc. Can I use a daisy chain in the effects loop to power the modulation pedals? I have a voodoo labs pedal brick on my main board but want to use all 8 lines for od, distortions, fuzz, boost etc
Depending on what switcher you use, you either use one of the loops for your amp's effects loop, or it might have a dedicated loop for that purpose. For example, with the BOSS ES-8, you connect the volume loop to the amp's fx send/return. But with the BOSS ES-5, it doesn't have a volume loop so you use one of the other loops. There's usually a way to get it to work. I'd check out the manual for your switcher to see if it has a section on how to set up the 4 cable method.
@@AaronMatthies I have a moen gec8 jr, I don't seem to find anything related to it in the manual ps: My amp's head use one input in the fx loop and a Y cabel at the other end
I never knew this about my amp. I have always just put the pedals in front weather it was Overdrive, Delay, Flanger and use the amps built in distortion. I feel now like I wasted years of having better tone.
That pedal is a footswitch. All it does is control two settings on your amp. The footswitch labeled 'FX LOOP' is to bypass/enable the effects loop. Once you set up your pedals in the effects loop, you can use your footswitch to turn those effects all on/off at the same time.
It depends on the pedals you use and how much the clean channel on your amp colors your tone. In most cases I would expect very little difference when using a clean channel, but you can test it to see if you hear a difference.
@@AaronMatthies Aaron, great video. I understand the set up you are describing better than I did with other videos, however I'm still getting confused because I have a noisegate pedal with a send and return and I'm not understanding how to connect that to my two noisy pedals ( od and dist) to go in front of the amp?
The send and return in a noise gate pedal is to isolate noisy pedals. Connect a cable from the noise gate pedal's send to your two noisy pedals, then connect the output from the noisy pedal to the noise gate's return. Then you can plug your guitar in the input and amp in the output as normal. I'm guessing you have a BOSS NS-2. Check the manual for diagrams on how to set it up.
@@AaronMatthies thanks for the reply. It's a stone deaf reaper noise gate. The diagram does show how to connect the gate to 1 distortion pedal but does not have illustrations of the how to when you are using it in a pedalboard setup with modulation and time effects that need to go in the loop of the amp. I'm checking the link you posted on the 4 cable method now. Hopefully that gets me there.
The quick way to check if any amp can use the 4 cable method is to look for effects send and return jacks. If you can't find those two jacks on an amp, it can't do the 4 cable method.
Why 4 cable method? You don‘t use more cables as you would normally do, it‘s just 2 cables per pedal, inputting a noise gate with send-return would be real 4 cable method!
Why is this called "the 4 cable method" ? Why is it not just called using your amp like you are supposed to. lol. Now what about the 6 cable method. Like on a Marshall JTM 60 or a ART SGX 2000 Express. This is when your amp has both a serial and parallel loop. That may call for a video and a tile such as 'Method'. Er, I am not actually complaining about the title or realization that this required a tutorial for people, just making a bit of fun. \m/
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Check out this guide for diagrams and more details on the 4 Cable Method: guitargearfinder.com/4cm
Question: is it the job of the multi FX pedal to disable some amp functions? I can't utilize my Amp when in four cable modr
You should still be able to use your amp as normal when using the 4CM. While you can use your multi FX pedal to bypass your amp, that's only one possible configuration. Check your multi FX pedal's manual to see if you need to change settings. There are some examples in the linked guide that may help.
THE BEST FX LOOP EXPLANATION! I watched a bunch no one explained where the guitar and front of the amp cables go. Obvious if you already know but this guy explained it perfectly with visuals. Very good top quality video. Thanks for taking the effort to do it well.
6:52 - 7:04 is literally what I needed to hear, nobody else has made that clear on youtube, thank you
Very well explained. Years ago, many folk, including myself, were using the '4 cable' method without knowing it was a 'method'. It was natural, when dealing with amps with an effects loop, to place those pedals that work better in front of the amp (e.g. overdrive/compression/wah), and have those pedals that work best after the pre-amp i.e. in the FX loop (e.g. time based effects such as chorus, flange, delay, reverb). The 'classic' placement of types of pedal (before amp/in loop) was well known then.
One of the best (and simplest) explanation of the 4CM. I always though I knew what it was; now I know what it is
Ummm...this is exactly what was said on another 10 channels about this subject.
OMG All these years I was wondering what costly stuff can I buy to have a great sounds how great artists get on stage. Thank you very much from the core of my heart. You are saviour.
Can you do a video on using your line 6 helix floor in 4 cable method and using helix to also switch the amp channels as well. Mesa dual rectifier multiwatt would be nice. Your videos are clear and easy to understand. Thanks.
I never even thought about using a switchable effects loop to mute the preamp stage.. That really does make for a lot of customization with older tube amps that don't have midi capabilities
so with the Helix why are you using a separate send block and return block for the preamp loop? Why not just set the block as fxloop and that way you only use 1 block instead of 3
This is by far the best video explanation. Every other video I saw didn’t tell you why you do this
I understood a different channels explanation but yours is the best with visual examples. Best teaching by far.
That's quite the compliment. Thank you very much.
On old amps w no effects loop you can get a great sound with overdrive first,delay second with reverb being last.The time based effects are super sensitive placed in front so you have to lower the mix level to maybe half of what it would be if used in the e loop.My Plexi sounds better with pedals in front of amp than my newer amps using time based pedals in the loop.I agree that my DSL sounds better using OD in front and delay reverb in the loop.I wonder if Plexi like reissues would sound better using loop instead of everything in front.
I was just wondering if this was possible and you gave me the answer. I tried it and it just saved me some money... a lot of money actually ;) Thanks brother.
Thank you very much for this treat! It is very easy now to trust the effects and the amp to do the job!
Having a hard time connecting a Korg G3 multi effects to my existing pedalboard , that includes a whammy, compression, and octave pedal, EQ and a noise gate.
Brilliant explanation. 🙏
Great explanation of how to wire your board for the fx loop
Thanks for clearing that one up for me
thnx brother this is awesome and easy to understand
Thanks for the video. Do you mind doing the 4cable in Boss mE 90. Thanks
Thank you so much man. Best Explanation on youtube.
Hi, how do I do this with the pod go? Also same question as Glen Bailey asked. Cheers
What a gr8 tutorial.! Gotta admit that demo with "all pedals" going into front of the amp cracked me up. Sounded like the huge hangar/warehouse at work when there's lots of machines moving and echoing at the same time.😂
Well explained!
Great video... Thank you! Where would a noise gate plugged with the 4 cable method go? I use a Boss Katana with built in effects, but I also have 3 pedals: Cry Baby Wah, Rat distortion, and Noise Gate. Thank you!
Placing the noise gate straight after your Rat pedal will probably work best. Depending on what built-in effects you use with the Katana, you could try placing the noise gate in the FX loop. But they typically work best placed after the noisiest pedal, which is probably the Rat.
Hi ..! I wanted to ask, can we use the pedals on the GT8 as a foot switch to change the pre-amp patches on the Amp ..??
Thank you. Very comprehensible.
Great video and explanation.
Thanks for the video! I connected my helix LT to my EVH iconic but only get small, quiet sounds out of the speakers. No matter what the volume, gains, etc are I can’t hear it much. Changed to line/instrument in global settings as well. Any suggestions?
Great videos Aaron, thank you. Can you do this setup with the line 6 Helix rack and a Mesa Boogie Triaxis? That would be a huge help. Thank you and Happy Holidays. RJ
While the Triaxis is far more complicated than a typical amp with how much control you have over it, the basic idea is still the same. Have a read through the 4CM article on my website as it has a few different diagrams and you should get the basic idea of how to connect it all up. There is a section for 'FX LOOP' in the Triaxis manual that I recommend reading.
Have fun, I'd imagine you would get some great tones out of that rig.
Thanks for the Info, Aaron. I got it to work.
How about a "3 cable" method with an effects unit (i.e. Boss GT-1)? Would go like this... Plug guitar into the amplifier (cable 1) and then from amplifier fx "send" go into the input on GT-1 (cable 2) and then from mono output on GT-1 into amplifier fx "return" (cable 3)? Technically the GT-1 doesn't have an effects unit... but is that not a an effects loop of sorts? I would just be using this for delay and chorus effects pretty much. I have a great amplifier (6505+) and just want to add some basic effects.
Yes that will work fine with how you described setting it up. Just make sure any amp/cab models on the GT-1 are bypassed so they don't interfere with your amp's tone.
I notice a signal drop. if I bypass the preamp model, and uses the cabinet amp, in 4CM method particular in using clean amp channel. what can be the cause?
my fender amp has a PRE OUT
& a POWER IN
pre out is SEND
power in is RETURN
i have a question....so i have a zoom multieffect and i wanna use the effects (delay,reverb,etc) but also use an 808 as a booster and a boss noise sup...so what do i do? connect the 808 to NS then to the input of the zoom and do the same steps you explain after that?
You have a few different choices. You can place the 808 and NS before the zoom, after the zoom (but before the amp input), or in the effects loop.
My guess is that placing those pedals before the zoom will give you the best results, but the best way to find out is to experiment and try out each combination. It really depends on how you use the zoom.
Let your ears tell you which positions sound best for each pedal rather than following typical 'rules' you see shared online.
Thanks! i'm gonna try those connections and let my ears tell what i'm going for
I have a similar question as Aaron. I want my over drive and gate to go into the front of my amp head, but not interfere with the effects loop. If I put my overdrive and gate into the front of my helix won’t it mess with the overall signal throughout the chain even in the effects loop? Is there a way to wire it so that it only effects before the preamp and not after? Thanks in advance
@@chrissalinas1902 Anything you put into the front of your amp will affect the rest of the chain, including the effects loop. All the effects loop does is give you a way to insert effects later on in the chain. But it will still be affected by anything plugged in before that point.
@@AaronMatthies thank you for a better understanding. Your video got me on the right path
hi, for sure one of the best video about 4cm. good job done.And now, my question : can you break that nut :-)
Amp : JC-40 > 1 fx loop . 2 Guitar IMPUT for stereo , ( in fact 2 amp section )
LINE6 HX Effect : 2 FX loop. 2 Output.
so now: using 4cm, only 1 guitar imput will be used. so in fact NO STEREO.
i asked on many sites, obviously none can answer that : how to get both imput on JC-40 for stereo effect.
So what i tried to be sure . on my signal flow , on last slot i added a auto panner. running 4cm with only 1 imput used ( left/ mono as recommanded ) the pan make a channel silent. mean, sound disapear because of no imput on right , for instance.
the second FX loop on the HX effects, is , normally made for a second amp with its own Send / return. BUT the JC-40 ( and all other JC ) do not have 2 FX LOOP. in fact , only 1 send. so.. hw do i get the 2 imput of the JC used ? 5 cables methode ?
i hope you will enjoy thinking about that -)
As you mentioned, the JC-40 doesn't have stereo send jacks, so you know you can't have stereo on both the amp input and effects loop. So you need to decide which is more important to you. Do you want to run everything stereo on the amp input side and forget about the amp's effects loop? Or run your amp input mono and add stereo effects in the effects loop? You can't properly have both, so you need to choose which is more important to you.
Once you make this choice, it will be easier to work out how to set up your rig.
I would suggest forgetting about 4CM and just run a stereo output directly from your HX Effects to your JC-40. It's a simpler setup and makes good use of your amp's stereo input. No need to overly complicate things by trying to add in 4CM when you know it's not going to properly work.
Alternatively, try running stereo into the amp's input, listen to how that sounds, then compare that to running mono into the amp and using the amp's effects loop. Let your ears tell you which option sounds better.
@@AaronMatthies good point Aaron,well, actually i cant try anything. My HX effect is now on repair, for second time, but when back, i will try one thing: since it has 2 fx loop, and within the signal flow , 1 can choose fx 1 or fx 2 or both, i will simply try to use both, and out of the HX send , i will go to second Amp section. maybe will be working, the return will be anyway from a single jack backside of the amp.but i will think about your suggestion, Thanks Aaron, Stay Safe : -)
I’m using this method for my noise gate my pre amp is my drive/dist. Where do input my delay pedal? Between the pedal and the amp input or between the pedal and the effects loop?
Delay pedals typically sound best in the effects loop towards the end of the chain after any drive effects. But it's always a good idea to test out different positions and let your ears tell you what sounds best.
How do you add pedals after you hooked up a multi effects pedal to the effects loop?
You can easily combine other pedals with a multieffects pedal. You can add pedals from the multieffect's send jack or after the return jack. For example, if you want to add a reverb pedal at the end, you would unplug the return jack from the multieffects pedal, plug it into the reverb pedal and connect the reverb pedal to the multieffects return jack. Just think of the multieffects pedal as a single pedal in a chain and you can add other pedals before or after it as you like.
Question: Sometimes I will be playing out of an amp with effects loop, and sometimes not (vintage Marshall, Fender, etc.) Is there a way to set up a pedal board where I can use the 4 cable method, sending some effects to the loop and some straight into the amp front end, and then also have all pedals going into the front end for an amp without an effects loop, without having to rewire the pedal chain to accommodate these two options? Thanks, Dan
You should be able to do something like that with an effects switcher like the BOSS ES-8. The idea with these is that you plug all of your pedals into the switcher, then you can program the switcher to route your pedals in any way you want. So you should be able to set up one setting where all the pedals go to the front of your amp, then another setting where some of the pedals go into the amp's effects loop.
Great, I'll look into that. Thank you, Dan@@AaronMatthies
Really good thing to know for beginners. For my bass I have a compressor, preamp pedal, distortion, overdrive, chorus, noise gate. Should any of them be after the Amp for better sounds, or are all fine before it? I am asking, cos chorus distortion and overdrive have not arrived yet, since I just ordered them :)
Thabjs. Great video. Thumps up from Germany.
The only pedal you might want to try out in the effects loop may be the chorus pedal. All of the others should sound best in front of the amp. The chorus pedal may or may not sound better in the effects loop. Your ears will tell you what position sounds best.
Glad you found the video helpful.
If you are using a quilter tone block that is just a clean platform then you don’t need to use the 4cm correct?
Well the Tone Block does have an effects loop, so you can try it out and let your ears tell you whether it's worth the effort or not. I'd imagine it won't make much difference and you'll prefer a simpler setup without all the cables.
Amazing video. Thx!
Q: I'd like to combine the ME unit with a pedal (Fortin GRIND) - where is the optimal position for this pedal in the 4CM chain, as described in this video?
It depends what effects you will be running through your multi-effects pedal. If you think about it, you have three main choices: 1) before the ME input, 2) in between the ME and the amp main in, 3) in the effects loop.
I doubt that pedal would work best in the effects loop (3), so you might want to experiment with 1 or 2.
@@AaronMatthies Thanks
So in essence by removing the pre amp, you are just using the speakers of Katana? Thats what I need to do as I have a boss katana mk2 but want to buy a Helix lt. I want to be able to control the amp tone with the helix instead of boss amp.
Yes, the 4 cable method is a great way to get the most out of your Helix for exactly that reason.
Hello and thank you for this video! I have run my setup like this for a few years now and it really makes a huge difference in sound. There is one thing I can’t seem to find good information on yet…
I would like to eliminate the unwanted noise when the rig is on, volume up and idle. I have seen that pedals like the cock blocker and the Electro-Harmonix Silencer address this for the most part but nobody seems to mention where a noise suppressor /gate using the “four cable” method would go in relation to the effects loop.
In other words, would I still take the guitar input into the “guitar in” of the silencer then into let’s say the distortion pedal and then into the amp in, then…take the fx loop send of the amp into the send of the silencer pedal then into let’s say the “reverb” pedal and then the out of the reverb into the fx loop return?
Would this work? Any input would be appreciated. Thanks!
I'd suggest experimenting by placing the noise suppressor/gate at different positions to figure out what works best for your rig. Hear how it sounds at the very start of your rig compared to in the effects loop and let your ears tell you when it's working the best.
The Fortin Zuul is really nice.It’s got a side input for guitar then effects loop goes into main input on Zuul then output goes to delay/reverb to return of effects loop to keep from gating delay/reverb tails.It works great and barely have to turn it up to maybe one or two.I can’t even tell if it’s on playing wise and it’s quiet as a mouse.
Hi Aaron, I have a question for you. I have a Boss Gt-1 multi processor. In the back of it, there is only right and left (output) (there is no send/return). I also have Blackstar Id: Core 100. Can I still use the 4 cable method?
Looks like the BOSS GT-1 doesn't work with the 4 cable method. Seeing as your amp does have an effects loop, you could add other pedals to the effects loop and keep your GT-1 at the front of the signal chain.
When you say amp do you mean the combo amp or the amp onboard the multifx pedal?
Not sure which bit you mean. With the physical cable connections, I mean the combo amp. But depending on what multi-effects pedal you have, you might also need to play around with the settings to turn the onboard amp on/off. I go into more detail in the guide on my website, so that might help you out more than this video.
Does it work with Zoom G5, because I don't see "send/return" option.
The Zoom G5 is a great unit, but unfortunately it wasn't designed for the 4 cable method.
So I can have 2 pedal boards one in front for overdrive and one in effects loop for modulation etc. Can I use a daisy chain in the effects loop to power the modulation pedals? I have a voodoo labs pedal brick on my main board but want to use all 8 lines for od, distortions, fuzz, boost etc
That sounds good to me - you can definitely have two pedals boards and use a separate power supply with a daisy chain for one of the boards.
What if you have all your pedals go in to a looper/switcher, how would you do it then?
Depending on what switcher you use, you either use one of the loops for your amp's effects loop, or it might have a dedicated loop for that purpose. For example, with the BOSS ES-8, you connect the volume loop to the amp's fx send/return. But with the BOSS ES-5, it doesn't have a volume loop so you use one of the other loops.
There's usually a way to get it to work. I'd check out the manual for your switcher to see if it has a section on how to set up the 4 cable method.
@@AaronMatthies I have a moen gec8 jr, I don't seem to find anything related to it in the manual
ps: My amp's head use one input in the fx loop and a Y cabel at the other end
I never knew this about my amp. I have always just put the pedals in front weather it was Overdrive, Delay, Flanger and use the amps built in distortion. I feel now like I wasted years of having better tone.
what do i do woth my Marshall pedal 'PEDL-90016'? it doesnt have an in or out hole, just a wire coming out of it
That pedal is a footswitch. All it does is control two settings on your amp. The footswitch labeled 'FX LOOP' is to bypass/enable the effects loop. Once you set up your pedals in the effects loop, you can use your footswitch to turn those effects all on/off at the same time.
great explanation. thank you very much #Zambia
Why not just put your time based pedals through the amps fx loop
Anyone knows what is thru?
Do i need to use 4 way cable method if im just using clean channel of the amp??
It depends on the pedals you use and how much the clean channel on your amp colors your tone. In most cases I would expect very little difference when using a clean channel, but you can test it to see if you hear a difference.
@@AaronMatthies Aaron, great video. I understand the set up you are describing better than I did with other videos, however I'm still getting confused because I have a noisegate pedal with a send and return and I'm not understanding how to connect that to my two noisy pedals ( od and dist) to go in front of the amp?
The send and return in a noise gate pedal is to isolate noisy pedals. Connect a cable from the noise gate pedal's send to your two noisy pedals, then connect the output from the noisy pedal to the noise gate's return. Then you can plug your guitar in the input and amp in the output as normal. I'm guessing you have a BOSS NS-2. Check the manual for diagrams on how to set it up.
@@AaronMatthies thanks for the reply. It's a stone deaf reaper noise gate. The diagram does show how to connect the gate to 1 distortion pedal but does not have illustrations of the how to when you are using it in a pedalboard setup with modulation and time effects that need to go in the loop of the amp. I'm checking the link you posted on the 4 cable method now. Hopefully that gets me there.
Thank you for RUclips algorithm
Can a HRD do the 4 cable method?
The quick way to check if any amp can use the 4 cable method is to look for effects send and return jacks. If you can't find those two jacks on an amp, it can't do the 4 cable method.
i believe the power amp in and out are the same as fx loop send and return
Helix - 6:09
Hehe i got Katana 100 and helix lt Xd
Why 4 cable method? You don‘t use more cables as you would normally do, it‘s just 2 cables per pedal, inputting a noise gate with send-return would be real 4 cable method!
Why is this called "the 4 cable method" ? Why is it not just called using your amp like you are supposed to. lol. Now what about the 6 cable method. Like on a Marshall JTM 60 or a ART SGX 2000 Express. This is when your amp has both a serial and parallel loop. That may call for a video and a tile such as 'Method'. Er, I am not actually complaining about the title or realization that this required a tutorial for people, just making a bit of fun. \m/
The first part is how shoegazers do it. 🫡