Great show Coach. Just a couple of extra bits for Ogors: * Leadbelchers are interesting now in a MSU Meatfist build, as it's a 150pts source of 4+ Trample and Charge * The Mournfang change is massive. On the face of it, it's as you say they're now a cheap enough Battleline that they'll be taken and a reinforced block is going to be an upgrade on 6 Gluttons in many ways. However the bigger benefit is that prior to the Battlescroll, the best Boulderhead list (Kragnos, FLoSH, 2 SHBR, 2 Mournfang) was 10 points over. This change now brings the list to 1990pts and I don't think I've overstating it by saying this change brings Boulderhead back onto the table
The big key for Ogors and Mournfang pack is the quite-successful Kragnos and 3 stonehorns list is legal again at 1990pts with mournfang making up the 3rd battleline. It was a solid list before but has been 2010pts for several months. Mournfang are also quite good into a shooting meta with native -1 to wound against shooting and 6s to wound only into unleash hell.
Many good and clever balance changes in this Battlescroll. But just like with most previous ones, it should have gone further with the points drops for underused / weak units. Meaning both more severe drops for a couple units that received only a minor points drop and also just more units that should have received a points drop at all.
Great video! As a mostly Slaanesh player, I ve found this battlescroll disappointed since it has no impact on our lists and I was hoping for more than a few point drops here and there on heroes that for the most parts don t see play and still won t
So I think the changes to sloppity are a bigger hit than they first seem. Nurgle wasnt a top table crushing army and lost a huge tool. The compensation was -1 to hit which means so little in a world where +1 to hit is around every corner. -1 to wound is much more impactful.
You’re right in regards to Nurgles power level. It was a janky piece of tech that while i appreciate, clearly didnt want in the game moving forward. -1 to wound would have definitely been more impactful
I saw so many mistakes with this sloppidy bilepiper. So many people just played him wrong. I even saw it on stream when supposedly top players brought sloppi to the match. In tournaments I lost my first Game vs Nurgle as, later I didnt win high one time because he denied me pkt with the wrong interpretation of the rule and on the biggest event of the last year I lost my 2nd match due to wrong usage of the bilepiper. After those expierences I finally knew how to the warscroll is played correctly, but the damage had already been done (to many of us.)
Welcome to a game made by humans for humans. Mistakes will be made regardless of the player and the majority of the time it is just that a mistake not an intent to cheat.
As Gumby says, it happens to the best of us, which is why the app is helpful… pull it out and discuss it with your opponent. Our bias can blind us in the heat of the moment
Its true on the one hand on the other hand, why is it a mistake of mine to not detect the mistake of my opponent? How should I know that I have to read the rule in the very moment of the game. How should one know that the experiencd opposing player is doing a mistake with the army he plays for month. Especially when half of the game is spend with measuring sloppidys pile in and ranges and you get a huge headache. The last thing coming to mind that he is playing his rule wrong. You guys say it so easily... just look at the book, just read the rule. The ability to recognize rule mistakes is not a given thing... you gain it through a lot of experience. As a newbie in your first tournaments those experiences are made. So thanks for your empathic, thoughtful and mindful answers Ofc mistakes happen but this rule was a prime example of NPE and rule misinterpretations and we should be happy that its gone
Thalia is just too squishy, doesn’t deal enough damage. Her double orders are cool. Her rally is too restrictive. The biggest bummer is her 4+ save. Fusiliers really need a points drop.
We saw players taking her and players saying a point drop of 30 at least would make her a usable unit, you get a big -40pts and it's still not enough ? The other players considering her must be all so strong to play a sub unit like her !
Slaanesh going back to Fantasy I guess, so disapointed, it seems that GW trully doesn't know what to do with your faction, we seems to already have an outdate BT that cannot be balanced
That's why I also believe, because seeing the poor state of Slaanesh right now and only provide meaningless points change is not a rationnal decision. But at this point I just decided to completly disconnect my mind from expecting good ideas for Slaanesh, that's sad but hey@@AoSCoach
Great show Coach. Just a couple of extra bits for Ogors:
* Leadbelchers are interesting now in a MSU Meatfist build, as it's a 150pts source of 4+ Trample and Charge
* The Mournfang change is massive. On the face of it, it's as you say they're now a cheap enough Battleline that they'll be taken and a reinforced block is going to be an upgrade on 6 Gluttons in many ways.
However the bigger benefit is that prior to the Battlescroll, the best Boulderhead list (Kragnos, FLoSH, 2 SHBR, 2 Mournfang) was 10 points over. This change now brings the list to 1990pts and I don't think I've overstating it by saying this change brings Boulderhead back onto the table
Great point on Boulderhead. I didn’t recall that the preferred list went over 2k and this now brings you back in line. Big win!
The big key for Ogors and Mournfang pack is the quite-successful Kragnos and 3 stonehorns list is legal again at 1990pts with mournfang making up the 3rd battleline. It was a solid list before but has been 2010pts for several months.
Mournfang are also quite good into a shooting meta with native -1 to wound against shooting and 6s to wound only into unleash hell.
Great call out. The Mournfang are a tanky little unit which can cause trouble to your opponent in different ways.The -1 to wound can be brutal
Many good and clever balance changes in this Battlescroll. But just like with most previous ones, it should have gone further with the points drops for underused / weak units. Meaning both more severe drops for a couple units that received only a minor points drop and also just more units that should have received a points drop at all.
I tend to agree but i can only assume the Dawnbringers might help them in future books then new rules and points decreases make them too over powered
Time for double carnosaurs!
This is the perfect Seraphon list
Great video! As a mostly Slaanesh player, I ve found this battlescroll disappointed since it has no impact on our lists and I was hoping for more than a few point drops here and there on heroes that for the most parts don t see play and still won t
Me too but maybe Slaanesh has an update coming in a future Dawnbringers
@AoSCoach Maybe. In the meantime I m having a lot of fun with my Bretonnians playing The Old World!
So I think the changes to sloppity are a bigger hit than they first seem. Nurgle wasnt a top table crushing army and lost a huge tool. The compensation was -1 to hit which means so little in a world where +1 to hit is around every corner. -1 to wound is much more impactful.
You’re right in regards to Nurgles power level. It was a janky piece of tech that while i appreciate, clearly didnt want in the game moving forward. -1 to wound would have definitely been more impactful
I welcome our new Khorne overlords.
New? They've been doing well for a while... I'm just waiting for our Sons of Behemat overlords to return
@@AoSCoach Well but not super out of line. If you had 5 runners neck and neck in the race then everyone else just stepped on a rock.
My Sloppity 😢...
All flies it is I guess. 😅
Poor old Sloppity but it was good for the overall game
I saw so many mistakes with this sloppidy bilepiper. So many people just played him wrong. I even saw it on stream when supposedly top players brought sloppi to the match.
In tournaments I lost my first Game vs Nurgle as, later I didnt win high one time because he denied me pkt with the wrong interpretation of the rule and on the biggest event of the last year I lost my 2nd match due to wrong usage of the bilepiper.
After those expierences I finally knew how to the warscroll is played correctly, but the damage had already been done (to many of us.)
Welcome to a game made by humans for humans. Mistakes will be made regardless of the player and the majority of the time it is just that a mistake not an intent to cheat.
As Gumby says, it happens to the best of us, which is why the app is helpful… pull it out and discuss it with your opponent. Our bias can blind us in the heat of the moment
Its true on the one hand
on the other hand, why is it a mistake of mine to not detect the mistake of my opponent? How should I know that I have to read the rule in the very moment of the game. How should one know that the experiencd opposing player is doing a mistake with the army he plays for month.
Especially when half of the game is spend with measuring sloppidys pile in and ranges and you get a huge headache. The last thing coming to mind that he is playing his rule wrong.
You guys say it so easily... just look at the book, just read the rule.
The ability to recognize rule mistakes is not a given thing... you gain it through a lot of experience. As a newbie in your first tournaments those experiences are made.
So thanks for your empathic, thoughtful and mindful answers
Ofc mistakes happen but this rule was a prime example of NPE and rule misinterpretations and we should be happy that its gone
You guys got a battlescroll?
Hey you got a few discounts…
@@AoSCoach 2 more 10 point drops and I get a free pizza, at least.
As Fabien said, I still don't understand why Skywardens get those +10 points...
Feels targeted to a specific build. The higher performing lists have more Wardens than Endrinriggers
thanks for answering @@AoSCoach !
Thabks for being reasonable on Sylvaneth rather than Rob trashing Sylvaneth players. Disappointed by the balance here
Thalia is just too squishy, doesn’t deal enough damage. Her double orders are cool. Her rally is too restrictive.
The biggest bummer is her 4+ save.
Fusiliers really need a points drop.
I want a reason to bring Tahlia into my lists but the Marshall on Griffon just does more for me
@@AoSCoach same!
We saw players taking her and players saying a point drop of 30 at least would make her a usable unit, you get a big -40pts and it's still not enough ? The other players considering her must be all so strong to play a sub unit like her !
@@lo9070 indeed. Mine git shredded pretty unceremoniously by mediocre units. That’s why I don’t hold her in high esteem
Slaanesh going back to Fantasy I guess, so disapointed, it seems that GW trully doesn't know what to do with your faction, we seems to already have an outdate BT that cannot be balanced
I can only assume there might be something for Slaanesh in Dawnbringers 5 or if there is a 6. Very light touch for them
That's why I also believe, because seeing the poor state of Slaanesh right now and only provide meaningless points change is not a rationnal decision. But at this point I just decided to completly disconnect my mind from expecting good ideas for Slaanesh, that's sad but hey@@AoSCoach
Keeper, 30 daemonettes, reinforced fiends, 3x blissbarbs have play I think.
damn I am early
🥇