One of my coolest experiences overseas My Ranger squad was assigned to an RRC team (Ranger recon, one of the five tier 1 units) for a certain city we were operating in, civilian clothes, beat up range rovers, whole 9 yards and not a ranger platoon’s typical job, but it was a cool change of pace from direct action. ANYWAYS, the RRC dudes were wearing local indig garb, beards, headdresses and all that, we were their imbedded QRF if shit got spicey, we kinda wondered how long they’d be able to hold out the two-three minutes or so until we got there with no long guns. When asked, one of the RRC dudes just smiles, pulls aside his mamjams revealing a low profile plate carrier and, sure enough, an MP7. He just says “we’ll be ok for the first two minutes, after that y’all beetter get here fucking quick.” Loved those dudes
@@aaron4820 In that case, perhaps CZ could come up with a SBR-friendly PCC with the mag in the grip. Something that utilizes a bottlenecked, high-velocity pistol cartridge. Something with a delayed-blowback or gas operation, to minimize weight and reciprocating mass. Of course, the ideal cartridge for this is 5.7x28, because it's got far more market penetration than 4.6x30. (Seriously though, while I'm full well aware that it's not a trivial matter to take a gun from concept to practical product how much fun would it be for CZ to just sweep the leg on HK's commercial marketplace potential on a civi MP7?)
Another epic video from a foreign country with a couple of foreign beauts. I am a huge fan of both and I think they both have a specific role. Thanks for the fantastic content, Mr Reeves.
I've been loving your European Vacation videos. I was there this summer but didn't get to shoot anything but vacation pics on my phone. What I enjoy most is seeing how different cultures approach firearms and their use and training - especially anti-terrorist police units like this one. Next is the fun of watching some seriously high-end firearms in use. Thanks for repping us Americans so well on these visits!
My interpretation of based, though certainly unofficial and unchecked against any database or cross-references: independent thinking, uncaring of other’s judgement and sometimes can mean badass (as in this case). Bois is the plural of a modern spin on “Boy” and, though the origin or meaning behind the augmentation of the word from “boy” to “boi” is foreign to me, I enjoy its use from time to time. I used “bois” here for the alliteration with “based,” though these are clearly men.
@Solar General This was a mildly popular word circa 2010. I would say he is most likely in his early to mid 20's and wants to regale us with his vocabulary....(or lack of)
Well if you’re talking about in the states the 4.6 is a bad choice, just like the 5.7. But full auto and the correct projectiles and the mp7 seems the better choice.
@@rodiculous9464 it will still defeat soft armor with the AP ammo, but that’s a niche application; a good fit for secret service bodyguards perhaps. Not very useful for most civilians, police, or military. Actually, the same goes for subguns in general, hence the adoption of SBR’s.
You can have heavy bullets subsonic with a suppressor with the 9mm and still get good terminal ballistics with very little sound. While you can not make the 4.6mm subsonic and keep good terminal ballistics, because it then gets less effective than a .22lr.
I'm really glad to hear you say such good things about the Sellier & Bellot ammo manufacturing plant. I've never had an issue with their ammo, and now that I have seen this video I am even more confident in using it.
Honestly I'd be really curious in a comparison between 5.7 and 4.6. I know a lot of folks are raging for the mp7, and it's a cool idea, but I have never seen 4.6 ammo (granted I've not explicitly looked for it). 5.7 on the other hand is making a bit of a resurgence which for me increases the likelihood of me someday picking one up as an intermediate cartridge.
For me the practicality of the cartridge just doesn’t make sense. Mainly varmint or predator hunters are the only folks buying .17 caliber. How many civilians need a .17 caliber gun for penetrating armor when you can’t get the AP ammo anyway. Makes sense for military/government. That’s just my opinion. I’d still watch a ballistics comparison between 5.7 and 4.6.
James, you Chad you! Funny that the Czech SWAT Cops are all carrying Glocks. I thought they would carry CZs. There seems to be a lot of videos lately on the MP-7, wonder if H&K is seeing what the interest is and maybe market a civilian version. Just a thought. Looked like a fun time. Great video. CIAO!
I don't really give a s*** about either one, but I'm smart enough to realize that the two have nothing to do with each other. It's like comparing a 2023 Ford Maverick to a 1996 F-250.
I'd love to get the chance to shoot a full auto MP7, but having had the chance to shoot a full auto MP5 I can say that it was quite an enjoyable experience. My opinion may be biased as I also shot the UMP40 that day, which is not nearly as smooth lol
I shot one in Vegas - it isn't nearly as enjoyable as the MP5 on full auto. It bucks quite a bit more and the higher cyclic rate makes it harder to control. The MP5 SD by comparison was smooth as butter.
I've heard the UMPs were rather jumpy, especially in the calibers starting in 4. If I had to pick a modern 45ACP, I would probably go with a Kriss Vector. Supposed to be rather smooth with the downward terminating recoil system. Plus I think they look cool.
Always like what you do. I have a zf5. The biggest advantage it has over the mp7 in the civilian world is ammo availability. And the fact the the mp7 cannot be had by civilians. They are both excellent weapons
I have heard that yet there are private ownership MP7 in the USA probly only 3 but they do exist at least one is known and was even used In a RUclips video.
@@MRblazedBEANS did not know that. My guess is either way they are very difficult to come, not to mention extremely costly. Would be awesome to own one
The only thing to consider in my eyes is the fact that this particular MP7 has the fun switch while the MP5 has the fun slap. Truly a dilemma to stump philosophers for the years to come.
plus the mp7 has little to no prestige or reputation, whereas the mp5 has been around since '64 and is still in major use in many countries across the globe
Great video. I think it all comes down to ammo availability. If both ammo were equally available I would go with MP7, the guy is 100% correct “it’s all about shot placement” plus 10 round’s extra is huge!!!!
I love MP7 design hate that I can’t buy it in the states. 4.6 is great for the same reasons as 5.7. It’s a different thing to me than a P90. I see MP7 as a pistol you’d actually want to fight with rather than a PDW.
Good substitute for the MP-5 when it's got to be smaller is the MP-5KA3 reverse stretch. Got to shoot both, cyclic rate was the same. Both used the A3 collapsible stock to keep carry size down. Tried the MP-7 at a demo with my department. It's very controllable, light and easy to learn on. On the who's got more power, all of them need multiple hits.
I had the pleasure of shooting an mp7 at a range in Dallas. It was sublime. High rate of fire but almost no recoil. Too bad there is no civilian option available in semi auto as a pistol.
While I have never had an opportunity to shoot an MP7, I have had several in my hands at SHOT. Every time I asked the HK reps if HK would ever release a semi-auto civilian MP7, the answer was always no and never. I have shot a full auto MP5-if you lean into it a little, you can draw a smiley face at 10 yards easily.
I think the main thing that has hampered the MP7 outside of the fact that the MP5 seems to have the special rule of "It Will Not Die", is that it's not got a pistol buddy or really anything else loading the calibre. Which is a shame because if there had been a traditional handgun that fed from the same mags that would have been a nice logistics sync up. It also pretty much ensured no civilian markets unlike the 5.7 that now has many non-FN firearms loading it.
If someone said that they would buy one or the other for me for Christmas, I'd pick the MP5 just because it is so iconic, and I probably will never get into a situation where the differences that you describe become an issue. If I had to use one or the other for duty carry, or something like that, I'd need to do more research before I decided.
I would go that route as well given the same choice. But if given a little latitude in model choice, I would probably pick an MP5SD. I like the fact that it makes all the ammo subsonic via barrel porting. I also like the MP5K and MP5/10, but would probably take the standard 9x19 if I was given one.
One advantage of the MP5 is in extreme circumstances.If you absolutely have to use a gun to defend yourself and bystanders you can instantly silence by slapping down the bolt anyone who asks "do you even know what you're doing with this?"
One advantage the MP5 has over the MP7 is that civilian ownership is possible in the USA for the MP5. I won’t dismiss the awesomeness of the MP7 but as a gun owner, the MP5 matters more to me.
From personal experience, MP7 for the win hands down end of story. This kind of vid is why professionals and amateurs alike subscribe. Keep this content comin, James 👍
My most bestest favorite full auto I’ve ever fired is the MP-5 in 9x19. I’d have to know more about the terminal performance of that Lilliputian HK-7 cartridge. Good comparison video.
The MP5 is my favorite full auto also, but it was in 9mm and I'd LOVE to try the 10mm version. My second favorite full auto sub gun (nothing beats the M60 or ol' Ma Deuce for smiles) was the H&K UMP in .45 ACP. The main reason I'd avoid the MP7 would be the same reason I've not gotten a 5.7 gun, the ammo cost is exorbitant.
When talking about ammo making if you can visit Norma in Sweden. I won a contest and me and a group of people got a factory tour and it was really cool
Retired Tac Officer out of DFW. First full auto I shot and trained with was a MP5 and I will never say a bad word about it. I was taught to “slap that ass” when reloading it’s just a GREAT GUN!!!!! Later when I was with the Cartel task force we got ahold of some MP7 and my god they are butter. Soooo smooth so fast. MP5 you will be my first love always but you’re just a big pistol and your rpm are just a little lower this hurts my heart. I will always remember that is was your fine Austrian sexy azz that stopped some German Thieves on one fine 80’s Christmas Eve night at Takanomi Plaza
Also if you’re interested in that suppressor. They have them for sale on SilencerCo’s shop as the “Choad-7 Mk3” all the girth with a disappointing amount of length. But it all how you use it they say… on a serious note, HK please import the MP-7 as a pistol to the US already!!!
whenever the cartridge efficacy argument comes up surrounding 5.7 or 4.6, I think it's good to remember that the firearms originally designed to fire them were always going to be select fire. It might not have been part of the NATO request for a 9x19 replacement, but both of these high velocity pistol caliber wonder cartridges really rely on bursts - so groups of holes - to have the desired effect. Be that hitting a vital organ (because statistics) or reducing someone's blood pressure to the point of unconsciousness. This is especially apparent when you consider the bullet construction of their original loads. They're effectively solid steel. They don't fragment or expand. The point I'm trying to make is that 5.7 and 4.6 are very effective, but specifically at what they were designed to do. And they might not be as amazing when handicapped by being fired out of a semi-auto-only firearm.
Gotta love these times in which 9mm is now the “muh stoppin’ powah” caliber in most modern SMGs. Truth be told, I’d carry the heavier MP5 ideally with 147gr hollow points. Won’t overpenerate most walls and the round will likely stay in the target or at least be slowed down considerably after exiting.
Both of these are awesome, but I'm more of a UMP fan. They're not as iconic as the MP5 and MP7, but the look of them plus they're available in 45 ACP and 10mm are the perks that make them my favorite HK sub guns. The MP5 is my favorite 9mm sub because of the roller delayed blowback making the "slap" all the shit, and the MP7's round is badass, but I've never been a huge fan of it. The 5.7x28 is definitely a better choice if that's the type of work you're doing.
I'm very happy to see the guy, the guy that was trying to pack on top of his package.. very glad to see him pull the stock all the way out LOL.. it was a point of contention with some of the modeling.. they just figured the stock should just go right to that lip.. and it's just like what's the point of having the stock out if it doesn't reach your shoulder LOL, and it had me wondering if I was just fudging it by extending it.. which was fine cuz it just looks better if it's held comfortably and correctly.. very happy that I was anatomically accurate.. cuz the last thing I'm going to do is go out of my way to get my hands on a Gucci machine pistol from Europe.. kind of wish this video had come out when I was doing it though, it was really hard to get a feel for how it recoiled, it seems like some people just it bounces around all over the place, some people maybe some not so much and it seems like everybody in the states who has one has it semi-automatic.
I know guys who have run the MP7 in action in the field. You have to appreciate that the 4.6 is about half the size of a 5.56 round. And 5.56 is effectively a 22 caliber round. So you’re running sub 22 cal with that round. That’s not a big wound channel, no matter how fast it moves. I’m told it takes almost a full mag on target to neutralize a single opponent. Where with a 5.56 your target is toast within 1-2 rounds. There’s a reason it never fully replaced the MP5. Yes lower armor piercing on 9mm but your wound channel is vastly superior.
A rental MP5 is the only gun I've ever got the opportunity to try out in full auto. I get what you're saying about their controllability since I was shocked with how well I was able to keep the mag dump on target. Especially at the time, too, since I was still very much of a noob when it came to guns
I think I remember James saying that he was burned out having to release videos so often, but left on good terms. Fresh content creation gets tough when doing as often as TFB does.
As a civilian if I’m choosing between semi auto variants….. I’d probably go with the SP5 cuz of that better power shot per shot. Also ammo availability. Hell cuz of that even a full auto variant id still probably choose the MP5 over the MP7(although it’s close here but what’s the fun in having a machine gun if it’s too expensive to shoot it) But as a duty gun I’d go MP7 all the way. Cuz of the reasons the operator at the end said. The round for round stopping power is also almost a moot point cuz at close range if you’re on full auto(the point of a submachinegun) you’re putting several rounds on target(ideally) at once.
I’ve carried & shot thousands of rounds through an MP5 - great guns! However, I’d love to shoot the MP7 as I’m guessing it would be superior (based on your observations/experience). Thanks!!!
In fact, due to solid physical laws, the 4.6 round, specifically the DM11, actually carries more energy than your average non-+P 9mm Luger (the +P rounds such as the M882 still rocks) while recoiling much less
I think the recoil and controllability benefits are marginal at best and may be more down to the shooter than anything else. A more substantial benefit would be it’s better options for optic mounting.
Being the poor I am & only allowed to have semi auto I’ll never know what it’s like to shoot either of’em. U know bc I don’t have any friends that are foreign anti terrorist units. But thanks to TFB TV I get to have the feeling of wanting some thing so badly wash over all normal thought processes.
While HK were working up loads and projectiles for the MP7 to fire what did they use as a test bed? Is there a 4.6 MP5 out there hiding in the HK vaults?
A most interesting video Mr Reeves my compliments. I wonder if funding constraints have something to do with the MP 5 still being more widely used over the newer more "scientific" MP 7? I believe the MP 7 was initially designated a Personal Defence Weapon for use by rear echelon troops for self defence during the last days of the Cold War. On a personal note I really like your Hairstyle and facial growth. Salute Mr Reeves.
Years ago I saw some experimental ammo for the M1 carbine. It was basically an M1 carbine shell that had been neck down to 25 caliber and it looks a lot like that 4.6x30. Can you imagine if we had moved to that 25 caliber round in the 1950s, we might never have even seen the 223. At least not in the iteration that it was created with.
You also have that 20 mm grenade launcher with the three round capacity.. that's kind of cool to have on on a virtual machine pistol... kind of makes you wonder what they were doing with the oicw project when they already had solid gold.. although I don't think you can do any of the fancy range specific air burst calibration, but it's kind of better for it when you think about it.. since gun manufacturers seem to have worse consolitus interface chops than whoever decided to keep the dual analog controller as is for 20 years.. but you know.. pretty handy nonetheless even in its simplicity, and hell of a lot safer than those dark energy balls h&k was working on for the universal Union(1). (1) It's not that it bounces even that's all that worrying it's that if it bounces back at you it removes you from existence, it's just kind of like.. somehow they managed to make it extremely deadly, and delivering that death on a random probability path.. plus just trying to shoot it jumps around a lot you know weapons shakes out of control.. did you get it in the window or did you shoot it at your feet and now you've just you know accidentally removed half your squad from existence.. just like yeah, shrapnel fragmentation, pressure etc it's all bad.. very likely to kill you, very likely to lose a limb.. but it it goes off in one place you know and if you don't die, like worst case scenario Tom Cruise.. whereas that dark energy stuff is like worst case scenario deletion.. best case scenario nothing.. middle case scenario guy next to you deletion... Slightly less to the middle case.. you delete one guy and then half the squad is just fine in the same room, still delivering fire. Whereas you know, you're admittedly weaker 20 mm grenade.. if it gets there at least it'll you know knock them on the rocker or something.. give you a chance to move or something you know like.. with the balls you got to like you kind of got to wait until they do their thing..
I don’t know if I’ll ever like the way the MP7 looks… I love the look of the CZ scorpion, basically all look good, it’s a similar style. Space guns from the future is cool looking, but the MP7 looks weird, like a half a gun. That said, it also looks very capable at first glance to. Form
I haven’t shot either, but I think I’d like the MP5 more because I have shot 9x19 in many different firearms, I’ve got an airsoft MP5K and an airsoft G3A3 that I’m used to the ergonomics of, and I typically prefer Cold War-era firearms over modern stuff. Who knows when I’ll ever even touch an MP7 in person because they are nearly impossible to get in the US.
Hypothesis: Could the difference in deflection from the POA between the 2 be because of the rear stock? I swear that I could see the stock on the MP7 bow and turn the muzzle downward as it fired full auto.
When the situation literally requires a mag dump on target per bad guy to stop the threat. MP7. 😆 Fuck it, I'm just talking shit and here for the pew, pew. Thanks again, James!
![NATO PDW Trials: The Forbidden Saga of "MP7 vs P90" [ Collab with Oxide ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Py9MJUmdQ4o/mqdefault.jpg)
The MP7 didnt help McClane save Nakatomi plaza
Happy trails, Hans.
Checkmate
True 🤣
Is the MP5 a Christmas SMG?
Oof 😅
One of my coolest experiences overseas
My Ranger squad was assigned to an RRC team (Ranger recon, one of the five tier 1 units) for a certain city we were operating in, civilian clothes, beat up range rovers, whole 9 yards and not a ranger platoon’s typical job, but it was a cool change of pace from direct action.
ANYWAYS, the RRC dudes were wearing local indig garb, beards, headdresses and all that, we were their imbedded QRF if shit got spicey, we kinda wondered how long they’d be able to hold out the two-three minutes or so until we got there with no long guns. When asked, one of the RRC dudes just smiles, pulls aside his mamjams revealing a low profile plate carrier and, sure enough, an MP7. He just says “we’ll be ok for the first two minutes, after that y’all beetter get here fucking quick.” Loved those dudes
I had a few buddies get to shoot with Germans, they shot whatever their MG is, an MP7, and G36. But not me :(
I heard stories from SF claiming it took half a mag to drop people with the 4.6mm, you ever heard that?
@@jimmybronco5336 MG 3
JSOC unit. 🇺🇸⚔️
@@manbabymonke Or the MG4, depending on when this was.
The mp7 might be better when you’re not the one paying for it and the ammo
Or even have access to it
Dont make that mistake, you're paying for it... with every paycheck, you just don't necessarily get to play with it
You understand logistics and finance!
Any effort to push H&K releasing a civil version of MP7
is one small step (but great job) for TFBTV, one giant leap for gunmankind.
*push H&K to release civilian mp7
video literally possible only because of CZ ammo company not H&K lol
@@aaron4820 a civilian version could adopt another caliber...a popular one like...wich one do you think would be fun ? Or just obvious ?
If you want MP7 in "more popular cartridge" you can probably go with B&T MP9/TP9 ;)
Tommy is building his own MP7 clones just like he does with UMPs and G36s. It’s only a matter of time
@@aaron4820 In that case, perhaps CZ could come up with a SBR-friendly PCC with the mag in the grip. Something that utilizes a bottlenecked, high-velocity pistol cartridge. Something with a delayed-blowback or gas operation, to minimize weight and reciprocating mass.
Of course, the ideal cartridge for this is 5.7x28, because it's got far more market penetration than 4.6x30.
(Seriously though, while I'm full well aware that it's not a trivial matter to take a gun from concept to practical product how much fun would it be for CZ to just sweep the leg on HK's commercial marketplace potential on a civi MP7?)
A day on the range with URNA shooting MP7's and MP5's. The stories and fun. That is a day well invested in life. I tip my hat to you Sir.
"if you haven't even shot a full auto MP5, what are you even doing with your life?!" -Love it James! Keep up the spectacular content bro
Another epic video from a foreign country with a couple of foreign beauts. I am a huge fan of both and I think they both have a specific role. Thanks for the fantastic content, Mr Reeves.
I've been loving your European Vacation videos. I was there this summer but didn't get to shoot anything but vacation pics on my phone. What I enjoy most is seeing how different cultures approach firearms and their use and training - especially anti-terrorist police units like this one. Next is the fun of watching some seriously high-end firearms in use. Thanks for repping us Americans so well on these visits!
Next time you must go to Czech Republik if you like to shoot guns.
@@prometheusx2 I lived in Poland for 14 years and always wanted to visit Prague but never made it. It's still on my wish list!
This is so rad. Awesome that you got to fiddle with some Maschinenpistolen alongside some based Czech bois.
@Solar General hates people of color and lgbt
What does bois mean?
My interpretation of based, though certainly unofficial and unchecked against any database or cross-references: independent thinking, uncaring of other’s judgement and sometimes can mean badass (as in this case).
Bois is the plural of a modern spin on “Boy” and, though the origin or meaning behind the augmentation of the word from “boy” to “boi” is foreign to me, I enjoy its use from time to time. I used “bois” here for the alliteration with “based,” though these are clearly men.
Chill with the pretentious garbage
@Solar General This was a mildly popular word circa 2010. I would say he is most likely in his early to mid 20's and wants to regale us with his vocabulary....(or lack of)
Man if you have armor defeating capability in a shorter package, those are two strong reasons for mp7 in my opinion.
But you can't get either the mp7 or the armor penetrating ammo in the states
Well if you’re talking about in the states the 4.6 is a bad choice, just like the 5.7. But full auto and the correct projectiles and the mp7 seems the better choice.
" " " armor defeating " " "
Soft cold war era armor 🤣
@@rodiculous9464 L3a will stop the lead round. Just like 5.7
@@rodiculous9464 it will still defeat soft armor with the AP ammo, but that’s a niche application; a good fit for secret service bodyguards perhaps.
Not very useful for most civilians, police, or military.
Actually, the same goes for subguns in general, hence the adoption of SBR’s.
This is the coolest gun content I've seen in several months. Kudos to James and TFBTV.
You can have heavy bullets subsonic with a suppressor with the 9mm and still get good terminal ballistics with very little sound. While you can not make the 4.6mm subsonic and keep good terminal ballistics, because it then gets less effective than a .22lr.
I'm really glad to hear you say such good things about the Sellier & Bellot ammo manufacturing plant. I've never had an issue with their ammo, and now that I have seen this video I am even more confident in using it.
I love S&B's boxes. No wasted space for better storage
Honestly I'd be really curious in a comparison between 5.7 and 4.6. I know a lot of folks are raging for the mp7, and it's a cool idea, but I have never seen 4.6 ammo (granted I've not explicitly looked for it). 5.7 on the other hand is making a bit of a resurgence which for me increases the likelihood of me someday picking one up as an intermediate cartridge.
For me the practicality of the cartridge just doesn’t make sense. Mainly varmint or predator hunters are the only folks buying .17 caliber. How many civilians need a .17 caliber gun for penetrating armor when you can’t get the AP ammo anyway. Makes sense for military/government. That’s just my opinion. I’d still watch a ballistics comparison between 5.7 and 4.6.
Good idea
@@erroneous6947 I've seen some and basically 5.7 stomps 4.6 in every category.
What if Ruger came out with the charger variant of the LC Carbine? Boom.
@@erroneous6947 Oxide has a video of the P90 versus the MP7 up against russian armour if that helps.
James, you Chad you! Funny that the Czech SWAT Cops are all carrying Glocks. I thought they would carry CZs. There seems to be a lot of videos lately on the MP-7, wonder if H&K is seeing what the interest is and maybe market a civilian version. Just a thought. Looked like a fun time. Great video. CIAO!
Probably my favorite video so far. Those two are my absolute dream sub guns
Would love to see vector vs. mp5 and p90 vs. mp7 for veterans and newbies to the platforms. Great video as always James!
MP5 guys are already on the keyboard
I don't really give a s*** about either one, but I'm smart enough to realize that the two have nothing to do with each other.
It's like comparing a 2023 Ford Maverick to a 1996 F-250.
Nah, the only correct opinion: 12:39 "Pick which ever one you like. They're both fantastic." 🗿
Been fun seeing all this content coming from overseas. Thanks James and TFBTV.
I'd love to get the chance to shoot a full auto MP7, but having had the chance to shoot a full auto MP5 I can say that it was quite an enjoyable experience. My opinion may be biased as I also shot the UMP40 that day, which is not nearly as smooth lol
I shot one in Vegas - it isn't nearly as enjoyable as the MP5 on full auto. It bucks quite a bit more and the higher cyclic rate makes it harder to control. The MP5 SD by comparison was smooth as butter.
I've heard the UMPs were rather jumpy, especially in the calibers starting in 4.
If I had to pick a modern 45ACP, I would probably go with a Kriss Vector.
Supposed to be rather smooth with the downward terminating recoil system.
Plus I think they look cool.
@@tylerwilliams6022 I haven't heard good things about reliability with the Vector, which is disappointing
@@tylerwilliams6022 The mp7 is in 4.6 which is like a miniaturized rifle round smaller than 9mm but with a higher pressure than the 9
Great review as always James. Looks like a lot of fun to shoot. I would love having either.
Always like what you do. I have a zf5. The biggest advantage it has over the mp7 in the civilian world is ammo availability. And the fact the the mp7 cannot be had by civilians. They are both excellent weapons
I have heard that yet there are private ownership MP7 in the USA probly only 3 but they do exist at least one is known and was even used In a RUclips video.
@@MRblazedBEANS did not know that. My guess is either way they are very difficult to come, not to mention extremely costly. Would be awesome to own one
The only thing to consider in my eyes is the fact that this particular MP7 has the fun switch while the MP5 has the fun slap. Truly a dilemma to stump philosophers for the years to come.
Fun switch over fun slap everyday!
plus the mp7 has little to no prestige or reputation, whereas the mp5 has been around since '64 and is still in major use in many countries across the globe
This is an awesome video. You need to make a “9” reasons why the MP5 is better than the MP7 video. That would be dope.
Woke up to watch this with 69% battery left. You have brought some of the best MP7 footage online In awhile. Thank, James!
That's cray-cray, but ion remember askin
Great video. I think it all comes down to ammo availability. If both ammo were equally available I would go with MP7, the guy is 100% correct “it’s all about shot placement” plus 10 round’s extra is huge!!!!
I love MP7 design hate that I can’t buy it in the states. 4.6 is great for the same reasons as 5.7. It’s a different thing to me than a P90. I see MP7 as a pistol you’d actually want to fight with rather than a PDW.
Favorite channel, favorite gun guy and favorite content. Another great video James
James wearing his comtacs backwards training with an elite antiterrorist unit like an absolute goober. Love it.
Good substitute for the MP-5 when it's got to be smaller is the MP-5KA3 reverse stretch. Got to shoot both, cyclic rate was the same. Both used the A3 collapsible stock to keep carry size down. Tried the MP-7 at a demo with my department. It's very controllable, light and easy to learn on. On the who's got more power, all of them need multiple hits.
I had the pleasure of shooting an mp7 at a range in Dallas. It was sublime. High rate of fire but almost no recoil. Too bad there is no civilian option available in semi auto as a pistol.
My wallet breaks into a cold sweat with each H&K video I watch, and this one just gave it palpitations.
While I have never had an opportunity to shoot an MP7, I have had several in my hands at SHOT. Every time I asked the HK reps if HK would ever release a semi-auto civilian MP7, the answer was always no and never. I have shot a full auto MP5-if you lean into it a little, you can draw a smiley face at 10 yards easily.
I think the main thing that has hampered the MP7 outside of the fact that the MP5 seems to have the special rule of "It Will Not Die", is that it's not got a pistol buddy or really anything else loading the calibre. Which is a shame because if there had been a traditional handgun that fed from the same mags that would have been a nice logistics sync up. It also pretty much ensured no civilian markets unlike the 5.7 that now has many non-FN firearms loading it.
plus the mp5 is just more fun
Great Review! Awesome summary and comparison - let the tools speak for themselves.
That brevis can is sick! Everything HK makes is iconic. Can you get the HK 416a8 on the channel?
I love that James’s vest was on backwards the whole time 😂.
If someone said that they would buy one or the other for me for Christmas, I'd pick the MP5 just because it is so iconic, and I probably will never get into a situation where the differences that you describe become an issue. If I had to use one or the other for duty carry, or something like that, I'd need to do more research before I decided.
I would go that route as well given the same choice.
But if given a little latitude in model choice, I would probably pick an MP5SD.
I like the fact that it makes all the ammo subsonic via barrel porting.
I also like the MP5K and MP5/10, but would probably take the standard 9x19 if I was given one.
One advantage of the MP5 is in extreme circumstances.If you absolutely have to use a gun to defend yourself and bystanders you can instantly silence by slapping down the bolt anyone who asks "do you even know what you're doing with this?"
Every time i see brass flying in perfect sync from actions it just calms me, i love guns man. Especially these babies.
One advantage the MP5 has over the MP7 is that civilian ownership is possible in the USA for the MP5. I won’t dismiss the awesomeness of the MP7 but as a gun owner, the MP5 matters more to me.
You truly are living your best life. Cheers!
From personal experience, MP7 for the win hands down end of story. This kind of vid is why professionals and amateurs alike subscribe. Keep this content comin, James 👍
Excellent show as always. Love the MP7!
My most bestest favorite full auto I’ve ever fired is the MP-5 in 9x19. I’d have to know more about the terminal performance of that Lilliputian HK-7 cartridge. Good comparison video.
The MP5 is my favorite full auto also, but it was in 9mm and I'd LOVE to try the 10mm version. My second favorite full auto sub gun (nothing beats the M60 or ol' Ma Deuce for smiles) was the H&K UMP in .45 ACP. The main reason I'd avoid the MP7 would be the same reason I've not gotten a 5.7 gun, the ammo cost is exorbitant.
Another excellent video! Thank you.
The URNA officer cosplaying Administrative Results is on point
This Vid is why your channel is so much better content than all the other Top 10 guntubers.
When talking about ammo making if you can visit Norma in Sweden. I won a contest and me and a group of people got a factory tour and it was really cool
Retired Tac Officer out of DFW. First full auto I shot and trained with was a MP5 and I will never say a bad word about it. I was taught to “slap that ass” when reloading it’s just a GREAT GUN!!!!! Later when I was with the Cartel task force we got ahold of some MP7 and my god they are butter. Soooo smooth so fast. MP5 you will be my first love always but you’re just a big pistol and your rpm are just a little lower this hurts my heart. I will always remember that is was your fine Austrian sexy azz that stopped some German Thieves on one fine 80’s Christmas Eve night at Takanomi Plaza
Home sweet home. Great that we (Czechs) are having at least one part of the industry we can be proud of... :)
What am I doing with my life? Watching RUclipsrs like you living and fulfilling my dreams.
Also if you’re interested in that suppressor. They have them for sale on SilencerCo’s shop as the “Choad-7 Mk3” all the girth with a disappointing amount of length. But it all how you use it they say… on a serious note, HK please import the MP-7 as a pistol to the US already!!!
whenever the cartridge efficacy argument comes up surrounding 5.7 or 4.6, I think it's good to remember that the firearms originally designed to fire them were always going to be select fire. It might not have been part of the NATO request for a 9x19 replacement, but both of these high velocity pistol caliber wonder cartridges really rely on bursts - so groups of holes - to have the desired effect. Be that hitting a vital organ (because statistics) or reducing someone's blood pressure to the point of unconsciousness. This is especially apparent when you consider the bullet construction of their original loads. They're effectively solid steel. They don't fragment or expand.
The point I'm trying to make is that 5.7 and 4.6 are very effective, but specifically at what they were designed to do. And they might not be as amazing when handicapped by being fired out of a semi-auto-only firearm.
5.7 is still pretty amazing even with semi-auto
S&B does make some damn good ammo but then again I’m Czech so maybe a little biased. Also CZ’s dunk on Glock all day every day 😂🎯
Excellent content lately
Gotta love these times in which 9mm is now the “muh stoppin’ powah” caliber in most modern SMGs. Truth be told, I’d carry the heavier MP5 ideally with 147gr hollow points. Won’t overpenerate most walls and the round will likely stay in the target or at least be slowed down considerably after exiting.
I'm sure I would love the MP7....if fullauto wasn't restricted and someone else paid for the ammo.
I've always wanted to see a review on the MP-7 ever since I saw one shot and reviewed on the show Future Weapons back in 2008.
Both of these are awesome, but I'm more of a UMP fan. They're not as iconic as the MP5 and MP7, but the look of them plus they're available in 45 ACP and 10mm are the perks that make them my favorite HK sub guns. The MP5 is my favorite 9mm sub because of the roller delayed blowback making the "slap" all the shit, and the MP7's round is badass, but I've never been a huge fan of it. The 5.7x28 is definitely a better choice if that's the type of work you're doing.
I'm very happy to see the guy, the guy that was trying to pack on top of his package.. very glad to see him pull the stock all the way out LOL.. it was a point of contention with some of the modeling.. they just figured the stock should just go right to that lip.. and it's just like what's the point of having the stock out if it doesn't reach your shoulder LOL, and it had me wondering if I was just fudging it by extending it.. which was fine cuz it just looks better if it's held comfortably and correctly.. very happy that I was anatomically accurate.. cuz the last thing I'm going to do is go out of my way to get my hands on a Gucci machine pistol from Europe.. kind of wish this video had come out when I was doing it though, it was really hard to get a feel for how it recoiled, it seems like some people just it bounces around all over the place, some people maybe some not so much and it seems like everybody in the states who has one has it semi-automatic.
I know guys who have run the MP7 in action in the field. You have to appreciate that the 4.6 is about half the size of a 5.56 round. And 5.56 is effectively a 22 caliber round. So you’re running sub 22 cal with that round. That’s not a big wound channel, no matter how fast it moves. I’m told it takes almost a full mag on target to neutralize a single opponent. Where with a 5.56 your target is toast within 1-2 rounds. There’s a reason it never fully replaced the MP5. Yes lower armor piercing on 9mm but your wound channel is vastly superior.
Love me some S&B ammo. Hoping we will get their 4.6 ammo in the States.
JOY...... many thanks, your vids keep on giving.
A rental MP5 is the only gun I've ever got the opportunity to try out in full auto. I get what you're saying about their controllability since I was shocked with how well I was able to keep the mag dump on target. Especially at the time, too, since I was still very much of a noob when it came to guns
I see quite a few people talking about and showcasing the MP7 lately. I’m wondering if this is a viral campaign by HK to release a civilian version.
I can’t get over how cringe the Springfield ads are lol
I love you James Reeves
NoT aLl ArS aRe MaDe EqUaL
@@biunzRS lol I died at this comment
A good video on the mp7 ap effect on Soviet armor is oxide’s mp7 vs p90 video
A great video Mr.James. Your gun haiku verses are like an Ear pro and sound suppressor. What about that that that Czech cop said about 9mm impotence?
Hey relatively new viewer, I am liking the new videos but I am also looking back at some of the older ones. My question is where did Alex.C go?
I think I remember James saying that he was burned out having to release videos so often, but left on good terms. Fresh content creation gets tough when doing as often as TFB does.
The MP7 is amazing Krout space magic but MP5 just got dat drip.
Excellent video as always
Liked the grenade launcher option the combine added
As a civilian if I’m choosing between semi auto variants….. I’d probably go with the SP5 cuz of that better power shot per shot. Also ammo availability. Hell cuz of that even a full auto variant id still probably choose the MP5 over the MP7(although it’s close here but what’s the fun in having a machine gun if it’s too expensive to shoot it)
But as a duty gun I’d go MP7 all the way. Cuz of the reasons the operator at the end said. The round for round stopping power is also almost a moot point cuz at close range if you’re on full auto(the point of a submachinegun) you’re putting several rounds on target(ideally) at once.
I’ve carried & shot thousands of rounds through an MP5 - great guns!
However, I’d love to shoot the MP7 as I’m guessing it would be superior (based on your observations/experience). Thanks!!!
In fact, due to solid physical laws, the 4.6 round, specifically the DM11, actually carries more energy than your average non-+P 9mm Luger (the +P rounds such as the M882 still rocks) while recoiling much less
What an opportunity... amazing upload
I haven’t started the video yet, but there better be a counter video like that AR versus AK videos.
I think the ammo capacity and compactness of the mp7 are its biggest advantages
The mag being in the handle also makes reloading faster
Do a comparison video between MP7 and FN P90
That would be more interesting.
MP5 in my opinion still has its place.
I think the recoil and controllability benefits are marginal at best and may be more down to the shooter than anything else. A more substantial benefit would be it’s better options for optic mounting.
I still need an MP7 sample. Great video!
I wish we saw some crossover with garrand thumb. Think youd be hilarious trying to deal with Charles, and his shenanigans.
Can we talk about that intro music!? it is so pleasant.
Thanks for a perfect video to watch after a night involving too much tequila, keep living your best life James 👌🏽
Being the poor I am & only allowed to have semi auto I’ll never know what it’s like to shoot either of’em. U know bc I don’t have any friends that are foreign anti terrorist units. But thanks to TFB TV I get to have the feeling of wanting some thing so badly wash over all normal thought processes.
I like the Czech dude shirt “I will stand my ground” S&B
While HK were working up loads and projectiles for the MP7 to fire what did they use as a test bed? Is there a 4.6 MP5 out there hiding in the HK vaults?
A most interesting video Mr Reeves my compliments.
I wonder if funding constraints have something to do with the MP 5 still being more widely used over the newer more "scientific" MP 7?
I believe the MP 7 was initially designated a Personal Defence Weapon for use by rear echelon troops for self defence during the last days of the Cold War.
On a personal note I really like your Hairstyle and facial growth.
Salute Mr Reeves.
Just 5 reasons? James is trying to be nice.
Years ago I saw some experimental ammo for the M1 carbine. It was basically an M1 carbine shell that had been neck down to 25 caliber and it looks a lot like that 4.6x30. Can you imagine if we had moved to that 25 caliber round in the 1950s, we might never have even seen the 223. At least not in the iteration that it was created with.
It certainly would have been a wonderful reason to develop more Sub guns.
That was a sweet Stechkin automatic pistol on the table. You should do a video with it.
You also have that 20 mm grenade launcher with the three round capacity.. that's kind of cool to have on on a virtual machine pistol... kind of makes you wonder what they were doing with the oicw project when they already had solid gold.. although I don't think you can do any of the fancy range specific air burst calibration, but it's kind of better for it when you think about it.. since gun manufacturers seem to have worse consolitus interface chops than whoever decided to keep the dual analog controller as is for 20 years.. but you know.. pretty handy nonetheless even in its simplicity, and hell of a lot safer than those dark energy balls h&k was working on for the universal Union(1).
(1) It's not that it bounces even that's all that worrying it's that if it bounces back at you it removes you from existence, it's just kind of like.. somehow they managed to make it extremely deadly, and delivering that death on a random probability path.. plus just trying to shoot it jumps around a lot you know weapons shakes out of control.. did you get it in the window or did you shoot it at your feet and now you've just you know accidentally removed half your squad from existence.. just like yeah, shrapnel fragmentation, pressure etc it's all bad.. very likely to kill you, very likely to lose a limb.. but it it goes off in one place you know and if you don't die, like worst case scenario Tom Cruise.. whereas that dark energy stuff is like worst case scenario deletion.. best case scenario nothing.. middle case scenario guy next to you deletion... Slightly less to the middle case.. you delete one guy and then half the squad is just fine in the same room, still delivering fire. Whereas you know, you're admittedly weaker 20 mm grenade.. if it gets there at least it'll you know knock them on the rocker or something.. give you a chance to move or something you know like.. with the balls you got to like you kind of got to wait until they do their thing..
I don’t know if I’ll ever like the way the MP7 looks… I love the look of the CZ scorpion, basically all look good, it’s a similar style. Space guns from the future is cool looking, but the MP7 looks weird, like a half a gun.
That said, it also looks very capable at first glance to.
Form
I haven’t shot either, but I think I’d like the MP5 more because I have shot 9x19 in many different firearms, I’ve got an airsoft MP5K and an airsoft G3A3 that I’m used to the ergonomics of, and I typically prefer Cold War-era firearms over modern stuff. Who knows when I’ll ever even touch an MP7 in person because they are nearly impossible to get in the US.
Hypothesis: Could the difference in deflection from the POA between the 2 be because of the rear stock? I swear that I could see the stock on the MP7 bow and turn the muzzle downward as it fired full auto.
No, it was definitely the sight. I don't know why I didn't just look at it sooner, someone knocked the windage waaayy off.
When the situation literally requires a mag dump on target per bad guy to stop the threat. MP7. 😆 Fuck it, I'm just talking shit and here for the pew, pew. Thanks again, James!
My agency went to 11.5 M4s to replace our MP5s. Probably a better choice than MP7 but it would have been fun.
Even better is a short SpPR or SBR in 300 blackout it contains 4 times more stopping power
1:03 APS Stechkin.. now we are talking!
greetings from Czech Republic!
One of my dream guns