Should The (D) Line Be Extended to Co-Op City?
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- Опубликовано: 6 сен 2024
- In this video, I give my thoughts on Extending the (D) Line to Co-Op City, giving the Bronx a Crosstown Subway Line.
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As someone who uses the D and travels to Co Op City often, I absolutely believe that the D should be extended to Co Op City. It would be a faster alternative to crowded buses and it could server as a Crosstown Bronx service in an area that has a high bus ridership.
Exactly. This would benefit so many people, and relieve congestion on a lot of Crosstown Bus routes.
What?
You mean you using personal opinion and not taking into effect the costs and usefulness of it?
1:This is expensive and unneeded
2: Extra buses and maybe running articulated buses solves aforementioned problems above
3:3 Bus routes run through the area making this entire idea retarded
4: The 6 Is better off going to Co-Op city since it’s closer and doesn’t have to cross the Bronx to get there
5:the D will become overextended making ridertimes much larger for who?
Oh yeah
Legit everybody else who uses the line outside of the extension area
@@ninofromkitchennightmares1497 Agreed. The (6)/ line is only a stones throw from Co-op City, since it was planned to connect the entire Pelham Bay Line which was built to BMT/IND standards to the 2 Avenue subway, and extend it into Co-op City back during the 1968-1969 time frame.
Yes. The B too!! Make the B a full time service to the Bronx too if they extend the line to Coop
Extra buses will not solve the issues listed above. Buses constantly get stuck in traffic crossing the Bronx, which is what this option is trying to resolve. I mentioned this in the video, which it seems like you didn't watch, based on the uninformed comment.
Coop city has more than 40k people, so extending two subway lines there is a must. Ideally, the coop city station should be an express station so residents can get a quick ride to Manhattan. I'd also add a station at the proposed co-op city Metro-North station that will be opened as part of the Penn Station Access project.
Any cross bronx extentions should be considered, the divide between one side of the borough and another is genuinely harrowing. We should avoid having to get stuck in traffic on Fordham or the expressway for once
Both these train lines should’ve went to coop city, especially the 6 line. The D line I heard was already planned to run as far as Baychester Avenue with the IND second system. It was to run under Burke avenue, and turn north east, and run under Boston road. Has that been done, a connection to coop city would’ve been easy to complete. But there was no ambition because back when the subway was built that area was nothing but an airfield and swamps, and later an amusement park. The housing development didn’t arrive until the 1960’s, decades after the subway lines were built.
That's why the D makes that turn at 205 the. It was supposed to head towards Burke. That explains why 205th has tracks where the trading turn around. From what I remember reading, it was supposed to be 2 tracks after 205th.
Exactly, a lot of the planned extensions were never completed:
1. Because of costs and the Great Depression, & 2 Because the companies felt like they would not see much of a return in terms of ridership numbers for the cost of the projects.
Not all extensions were popular, unlike the QBL.
This is absolutely fascinating that there was an airfield there.
Could you say any more about that?
(I grew up on 219th Street between Barnes and bronxwood Avenue).
Yes!! I saw an old map proposal. They wanted the D to go out to Coop.
@@larrydee8859 There was an amusement park there called Freedomland which was actually laid out as a map of the U.S. It was torn down in the sixties to make way for the construction of Co-op City. After it was completed in the early seventies much of the Bronx’s middle class started to move there which began the borough’s decline. Historically thriving areas like the Grand Concourse, Belmont, Soundview, Boston Road corridor all began to see an economic downturn.
Have you considered a job at the MTA? Or emailing them your proposal to see if you get any feedback. The city will greatly benefit from your contribution for improving traveling destinations.
I'm glad you think so, and I will be working on an application soon.
@Aneudi Diaz and @Mystic Transit- Agreed! We need more passionate and innovative minds like yours working for MTA. Best wishes in your future endeavors and keep the awesome videos coming!
@@MysticTransit well, that was a year ago. any luck?
It is a good idea. There was a plan many years ago to take the "D" crosstown in the Bronx. It would have ended about one block away from the present Baychester Ave station on the #5. Before that happened, the New York Westchester and Boston went out of business. The trackage within the city limits was purchased instead, as it was a cheaper option than the "D" line extension and became the northern part of today's #5 line.
Wow, thanks for the little history there. I've always known about the plans to extend the (D) east of 205 St via Burke Avenue, but I didn't know it was supposed to run to Baychester Avenue.
@@MysticTransit In the MTA's 1968-9 Plan for action, It was to be extended from 205 Street & Bainbridge Avenue to Burke Avenue and White Plains Road only.
Right now, if you wanted to take the subway from 242nd St-Van Cortlandt Park to Pelham Bay Park, you would have to:
1. Take the 1 down to 96th and transfer to the 2 (17 stops)
2. Take the 2 up to 149th-Grand Concourse and transfer to the 4 (5 stops)
3. Take the 4 down to 125th and transfer to the 6 (1 stop)
4. Go either 18 more stops if there’s no peak direction express or 9 stops if there is.
Either way, it’s a minimum of 32 stops and 3 separate transfers just to get from one side of the North Bronx to the other. A Cross-Bronx Line, probably along Van Cortlandt Park South and Gun Hill Road, would revolutionize what it’s like to live in the Bronx
Dude buses are faster than backtracking
That is way the A should be extended. Extending the D is a half measure; it misses the 1. Its closest direct connection is 59 Street. The A could almost replicate the Bx12 (the second busiest bus line in 2019, after only the M15 (2nd AV)).
I think this is a case for a 207 St Light Rail, running from Broadway to Pelham Bay/Bay Plaza in the Bronx.
Absolutely...that was the original plan until MTA bought the NYW&B in the 1940s...205 was never supposed to be the terminus of the Concourse Line. I would also include the Interborough Line to be extended there as well like the proposal was when Triboro RX was studied
@@TheRailLeaguer that is exactly what I'm saying. 205 was never supposed to be the terminus of the line. So I'm in favor of the extension. We have the same issue in Brooklyn where there's a void south of Eastern Parkway and east of Nostrand Avenue
The "hated by transit fans" MTA did not come in to existence until 1968, so how could it in "your words" buy the NYW&B Railroad??
Good idea 👍🏽. The Bronx would benefit from a crosstown subway line. It would certainly reduce bus and vehicular traffic congestion.
Yeah, this line would be extremely beneficial for everyone living in the Bronx, taking congestion off certain bus lines, reducing vehicular traffic, and providing commuters with easier access into the east of the borough.
It doesn’t need an overextension
You can legit just make an entirely new line for this
And also it isn’t about crosstown it’s about getting people to higher interval areas which buses can do
The subway was designed to run through the 4 boroughs not to cater to specific people
A cross-boro D line that could connect to a potential Co-op City Metro-North station would be dope.
The metro north stop is a done deal just gotta wait for all the final stuff to be worked out
I was against the D train going to Co-op at first thinking that the 6 train by itself was a better idea..but as I look into it more and more it makes way more sense considering it would help so many commuters...I see your point...would still prefer underground but understand the price point argument
The proposal extends it over a viaduct after 205th
TBH, I'd be fine if it were to be an El or run Underground. Underground would probably make the most sense, because it would easier connect with the current trackage at Norwood, however, an El would be cheaper, and with the MTA constantly overspending on construction projects, price is something we need to take into account.
@@MysticTransit I'm worried about some of those community groups in the North Bronx fighting this just cuz they don't want it going through thier neighborhoods as an el
Yeah, that might be an issue, and in that case, we might just have to build it as a Subway Line, which would still cause some disruptions in the community, depending on if it is built using the Cut & Cover method or not.
@@Alexander-ru3qc well give EL as the ONLY option or nothing
I definitely agree that there should be an extension of the D to Co-Op City, however I believe that it should run along Gun Hill Road, and terminate at Bay Plaza. The 6 should also be extended 1 stop to Bay Plaza as well so passengers can transfer to the D.
The Stations are as follows:
White Plains Rd (Transfer to the 2)
Bronxwood Av
Boston Rd
Burke Av-Esplanade (Transfer to the 5)
Allerton Av
Co-Op City-Bay Plaza (Transfer to the 6 and the Bx12 SBS)
I think the six line should be extended to co-op city it will be a little easier for the six line than the D line
A D train extension would make sense too. B Division trains connect to more lines than the A Division.
Yes it would be great idea if the D train can go to co-op city. The bus takes to long.
Was opposed to bringing the D to CO-OP. But if it's functioning as a cross town in the bronx, I'm on board.
You could move the B/C at Norwood-205(either or would be more feasible as opposed to both, preferably the C.) Doing this though would once again make the C the only train to travel all 4 boroughs, like in the 80s.
This seems like a good idea. Hell, maybe extend even farther to City Island?
@@dodge1515 that would be GREAT!
@@anthropological That would be retarded
Bx29 Buses are already empty as fuck heading there
Waste of money
@Jay Nedaj Videos thought they stopped in the late 80s
Everything is fine as is
The D doesn’t need an extension
Why should the C be swapped up with a Week Only line when it’s better off on 8th Ave
Great ideas you have.
Many Years ago, there was always talk about extending the D train crosstown to allerton Avenue , and up Boston Rd.
(I grew up in the late 50s and 60s, up on East 219th Street in the Northeast Bronx).
The Bronx badly needs a crosstown rail route in my opinion.
(Though not directly related to the above conversation....Many many years ago, there was also talk of running IRT Subway equipment down the Harlem division of the New York Central, to Grand Central station.
The subway cars would be equipped with under running third rail shoes.
The purpose of this, would aleave the overcrowding on the Lexington Avenue subway).
There was a 1929 plan to do that and go to Boston post road. At 205 Station there is about 1000 feet of tunnel build east of station, now used for layup. Rumors goes that there is about 200 feet of tunnel build east of Bronx Park Boulevard. There is a manhole cover mark IND NYC on Burke Ave. Maybe for power or comm. There is no vents cover on sidewalk.
D-Train AND 6-Train Extension to CO-OP CITY makes a lot of sense as the D-Train would provide much needed Crosstown service in the Bronx and the 6-Train would pretty much do the same thing only running North and South, I have always hoped that the MTA would one day extend the 6-Train line from its current terminus at Pelham Bay Park to City Island that way anyone wanting direct access to City Island from anywhere else would have it but honestly I don’t see it happening anytime soon
Start with extending the 6 train as an el. That's the cheapest thing to do and would help towards solving part of the problem.
Right just maybe one or two stops. Ending the D train In co op would be a lot especially if they’re talking about building a Metro north Station over there.
Eventually they are definitely gonna wind up extending the 6 Pelham line to co op city I'm telling you.
I have been saying this should have been
Constructed years ago!!! I grew up on the 2 Train at 233rd Street Station. If the D Train was expanded back then, I could get down to Fordham Rd for shopping that much quicker, even the West Side of Manhattan for that matter. Or if I wanted to go to Co-Op City to Bay Plaza, the D Train would have been a life saver versus taking a SLOW BUS 🚌! I also mentioned it before in one of your previous videos, expanding the 6 Train into Co-Op City would be ideal as well! Where they plan on constructing the new Metro North Station for the New Haven Line expansion, I would have both the D and 6 Trains connect there, make 1 BIG Transportation Hub in Co-Op City! That's just my opinion.
Yeah, having a Transportation Hub in Co-Op would not be a bad idea. I'm imagining a Large train station, with transfers between the (6/D), multiple bus routes, and possibly the Metro-North when PSA is compeleted.
Yet another good proposal. Especially with the extended 6 meeting the D Train at the Terminal. That was a great curveball.
Yeah, I knew not everyone would expect me adding an extension to the (6) Line in this video, but I feel like it would be a really good idea, and allow for easier transfers between the IRT and IND, which the Bronx severely lacks.
If that happened, it'd be only the 2nd point where the A&B Divisions actually meet up. The other is Queensboro Plaza.
I think this is a great idea because there is a huge Residential area at Co-op-city. This can connect people to Yankee Stadium or Washington Heights much more easily!
It wouldn’t
You can legit just take the 23 to the 6 and your in Manhattan
Love it
The solidly Manhatten centric development of the NYC subway makes alot of sense historically but has truly become its Achilles heel more recently. Providing transit within and between the other boroughs is definitely the way forward for subway development.
As someone who spends more of his free time than he should hand drawing his own 'ideal' transit maps of cities in their country, can I ask what you used to map your extensions in this video?
Co-Op city does need an actual subway stop, instead of a Metro-North stop at the far sourth of it. Pelham Bay line extension is incredibly important especially I think, and I very much so agree with the two station co-op north and co-op south, something the metro-north system won't do, as it's not even really in Co-Op city in the first place, but even so it's on the far southern side.
Construction costs would be high as the area is a wetland - with the water table especially at Co-Op City close to the surface, lots of support work would be required. Still, the project should be done as the population has changed over the years.
There is about 5 to 15 feet of clearance between the highest tides to grade street level. The areas where he is talking about could handle the new service on co op city blvd
I think it's a good idea, especially with the ability to transfer between the D and the 6 as they meet up
It makes sense and I agree with you. The 6 line should be a much faster and easier proposal than the D crosstown project because there should be an extension. From Pelham Bay Park to Co-Op City by train would save the MTA millions of dollars. Bartow and Co-Op City Boulevard need subway stations.
convenient transit access significantly increases property value! Both residential and commercial. (even with an elevated structure)
It’ll expand the Co-Op City Commuters for a better travels to Manhattan & Brooklyn. (D) should get extended to Co-Op City. Also to relive overcrowding on the (6) Express service.
Addendum#1. The use of the monorail for co-op city could possibly address service extensions to Throggs Neck into Long Island to Port Washington??? It could be the "Co-op Connect" system. This would offer a multitude of travel options for those in the Bronx and Co-Op City residents.
I think a line along 207th Street, Fordham Road and Pelham Parkway would also provide transfers to the North-south Subway Lines and Metro North Railroad lines.
That doesn’t even need a tunnel portal due to 207 th yards
I think this is a good idea for a line as well, however, this seems like something Light Rail can serve.
@@MysticTransit Or maybe a Light Metro with some overground/ elevated guideways or underground tunnels or maybe in future it can be an extension of Interborough Express when it gets extended to Bronx to serve as a crosstown for Bronx also and connect to all the north south lines there.
I feel like the D train should run along Gun Hill Rd after running along Burke Ave as an elevated structure to have that closer connection to the IRT Dyer Ave Line then curving on on Bartow Ave terminating on Co-op City Blvd the middle section or southern portion instead of Continuing on along Burke Ave into the northern section of Co-op City and have the 6 train go up to the northern section of Co-op City and now 6 express trains can start from and end at Pelham Bay Park without have that issues at Parkchester with delays with longer wait times and they should convert Westchester Sq East Tremont Ave to an express station for the future in case we get that 6 train extension to Co-op City and that the Co-op City terminal should have 3 or 4 tracks 2 for express and 2 for local.
gun hill road might be too high for 205th street so i prefer burke
@@thoseonetrains It’ll go on Gun Hill Rd after running along Burke Ave
@@Jayjaycurlss01 OH
oops i didn't see the comment clearly
i know they intersect
The most ideal terminus for the D at Co Op City would be at Bay Plaza. Somewhere near the mall since that's where a lot of people go
@@coolboss999 yeah that’s what I meant I as well the D train going near Bay Plaza or the going near or the south part of Co-op City to have a connection to the Future Metro-North New Haven Line
As a resident of the North Bronx, who lives off of Boston Road, the VERY LAST thing we need is
overhead rail, yeah its cheaper, but it be faster and more dependable if it is underground. Whenever it snows I always take the D train, because as the only underground option in this part of the Bronx it is the most relable!
No no it’s not. Overhead train equals more lines besides the original proposal was an EL regardless there’s a reason subways were not built in that area geography
@@qjtvaddict the reason is NOT geographic, it's Political!!! The Bronx has always been treated as a second class borough!
With all the technical advances in transportation made in the 50 years there is no reason that ALL, but one, of the trains in this borough are above ground...
That area of the Bronx has been poorly served since the tearing down of the old Freedomland amusement park and construction of Coop City. They’ve been relying on the # 6 line’s Pelham Bay Park station snd inadequate bus connectors for more than fifty years.
I have heard talks from everyday riders about the idea of the 6 Train going further into Co-op city. I think the plan of the D also going into Co-op city would be a great options for the thousands of residents. areas like co-op city (where I grew up) and other areas of the Bronx are two-fare zones that, by adding a train line, it would make travel much easier for those that need to get into Manhattan. A project like this is long long overdue
The should run from Co-op City to Clearview-Willets Point Boulevard, while the (K) should run from Fordham Road to Euclid Avenue. The should run from Bay Terrace-Little Bay Park to Bensonhurst-Bay Parkway, while the (D) should run from Norwood-205th Street to 9th Avenue. The should run from Throgs Neck-Schurz Avenue to Tottenville-Hylan Boulevard, while the (B) should run from Bedford Park Boulevard to Brighton Beach. The should run from City Island-Rochelle Street to Prospect Park-Ocean Parkway, while the (6) should run from Pelham Bay Park to Brooklyn Bridge-City Hall. The {} should run from Miles Avenue to Silver Lake Park-Victory Boulevard, while the {(DQ)} should run from Allerton Avenue to Sunset Park-36th Street.
As a person who actually lives in the area, this is needed, but the plan to go via Burke is…. not particularly good. Gun Hill is where the Bx41 is, it’s generally busier, if for future development the White Plains line uses it’s third express track, Gun Hill has that ready unlike Burke’s bypass status. As for the plan in whether it would be tunnel or elevated, it would get more complicated than your plan, but would provide service to more busy, direct areas. As for your 6 train extension, it would be more helpful to just end it at Bartow because the area is extremely walkable, and there’s barely any need for that extension (although we do need more bike encouragement). Also the (outside) strip malls of Bay Plaza and their parking lots should be changed for the station’s TOD.
Burke would be the most direct route for the route, though it could take Gun Hill and Bartow for the last 2 miles of the route.
@@TheRailLeaguer Yes, it’s more direct, but it’s better to serve actual commercialized areas over Burke, which is literally mostly residential on this route.
@@peskypigeonx Well the Burke Avenue alignment also serves Gun Hill Road between Burke and Bartow Avenues (which is highly commercial as well). It also connects to the Burke Avenue station on the 2 and 5 train, making the transfer opportunities even better and can still serve Gun Hill Road. Better serving Gun Hill Road west of Burke Avenue could be better done by enhancing existing Bx28 and Bx38 service. Not to mention that the Burke Avenue corridor is not far away from Gun Hill Road.
There’s also no plans for third track express service on White Plains road, aside from those short turn services.
@@TheRailLeaguer “Can Still Serve Gun Hill Road” Yes, but with a transfer. You also would avoid the Metro-North Station at Williamsbridge. The Bx28 and Bx38 was ALREADY crowded even when the Bx30 was still there. It’s just a slightly sharp turn. You can do it gradually and still connect to Gun Hill Station. Also, Gun Hill already has a mezzanine where they can put stairs down to the D, which is more convenient. Maybe you should think about why Gun Hill has DOUBLE the ridership as Burke. Also, the extension would need to be underground, as there is no space for a portal without destroying parts of Bronx Park.
@@TheRailLeaguer To add on, Burke Station has no bus connections (other than the buses that already run under the White Plains Road line)
Connecting the subway to Staten Island. The R-Line has a bell mouth put in place to Staten Island, but better yet, it's better to connect the proposed inter-boro express to Staten Island. That's important.
That would be a good idea but would make the R too long but if we deinterline and extend the D then that would be the better option. We would want an express line to serve Staten Island and also increase the speed limits on CPW 6th Ave and 4th Ave to make the D faster. That can be done with CBTC, and the longest metro route was 52 miles long so having a deinterlined D extended there wouldn’t be too bad. Plus high speed too and you would reach Grand St from Grasmere in 30 minutes with the D. As far as Co-op city goes we’re better off extending the 6 there.
I would better propose a light rail for Staten Island from Brooklyn such as one crossing the Bridge and the other taking over the aging BQE to operate as a 4th Ave Superexpress. That would be the better option because I won’t want to make the B or D lines longer than what they have already. Combine that with better frequency on the SIR, and then connect St George with Bay Ridge via NYC Ferry. Light rail plus a D Extension to Grasmere should be enough for Staten Island.
All this would be perfect! Heck it would reduce the traffic on I-95!
Appreciate the video. One suggestion would be to make the transfer to the IRT not at Burke Ave but at Gun Hill Road, which is already the biggest stop in the area, is already ADA accessible and high enough above ground that another elevated platform may be connected under it at its current elevation. The D could emerge from underground along the existing Metro North right of way just to the east of its current terminus and hook a right east along Gun Hill all the way down to Co-Op City.
@@TheRailLeaguer Thanks for the reply. Burke may be a straight shoot from the current subway alignment but that would require it to go under the nature preserve along the Bronx River, which may be a non-starter. There may be another problem around the water table but hope to see the BX get some crosstown subway service in my lifetime.
As a person who lives in the area, this would probably be the preferred extension for people who actually live here, and I agree with it much more than the Burke extension, but the actual space for a portal from underground to elevated would be…. complicated. In either plan, both would have to be underground.
@@peskypigeonx Your concern for a tunnel portal is exactly why the Burke Avenue option is the best, though Gun Hill could use a crosstown rail option in its stead. I always though route Bx28 could be converted into some light rail line or maybe there could be a subway shuttle going to the Western Bronx.
@@TheRailLeaguer -_- I’m not dealing with these dumb solutions anymore.
@@peskypigeonx What dumb solutions?
In general I feel like it’s wiser for the MTA to focus on extensions to IND and BMT lines as the wider cars can accommodate any high density rushes. The MTA is in a position where they need to focus more on handling larger capacities before they can focus on providing faster service
I don't fully agree with mostly focusing on IND/BMT Lines, however, that is where most of the potential is when it comes down to extensions. Some IRT Lines can be extended though, and that shouldn't be ignored.
Great awesome ideas you think like me when it comes to modernizing our transportation system. This is long overdue for New York City Bronx site residence😎👍🏾
That would be great. I used to the shopping centers there many years ago by taking the money train and the Bx29 to get, sometimes Bx29, then transfer to Bx12 to get to 207th street at Inwood and take the A train on the way home. Since I live close to 155th street and 8th Avenue, this extension will cut the travel time in half and shorten many transfers
I think there is a perfect opportunity to do so (either via Burke Avenue or Gun Hill Road) to the very least Bay Plaza complex
Wouldn’t making the BX 28 or 38 select bus service be easier? And for getting to Co Op city from Manhattan, people should take the Fordham Road light rail to the six
This idea on the D train was planned and part of the 1970s second ave line and this project as well. FYI there are bell mouths past 205th st station already in place and the train could easily extend without major constitution.
I enjoyed your segment on connecting the west and east Bronx. Extending the 6 train into Coop city is great idea and should be done. Instead of extending the D train. I think the should rebuild part of the 3rd Ave Elevated line. That's was it's original purpose, and makes sense to me. Also I believe it would be less disruptive and less expensive than extending the D train.
And 125th street in Manhattan would be severely overloaded....
@@user-dj7wv5ok2x Why do you think the 125st station would be over loaded? Which 125th st station? I'm asking for your context and understanding?
@@daltonhanleyjr4142 The 6 train stops at 125th/Lexington, which is a major transfer point between the local and express services. It's already massively overcrowded as it presently is; extending the 6 to Co-op City would totally inundate 125th/Lexington.
Extending the 2nd avenue line into the Bronx to eventually connect with the extended D train from Norwood would make much more sense, as it would alleviate the pressure at 125th/Lexington.
2:35 DUDE THE D (pause) TRAIN SHOULD BE ELEVATED IF ITS GOING TO CO-OP CITY BECAUSE THE D TRAIN HAD ENOUGH UNDERGROUND FOR ONCE
I think it's a great idea extending the D train line and the 6 train line to Co-op city that will give the people who live in Co-op city to get to the subways faster into the city and back home quicker it's the Best 💡 idea good luck.
One big problem with the "D" possibly being extended into Co-op City that most people are not aware of. The tunnel where the original line ends at 205th Street and Webster Avenue is blocked across the way by the large foundation of a big charter school building, sitting on the east side of Webster Avenue. In order for any expansion and construction, there would have to be deep tunneling underneath the school building and the Metro-North Commuter Railroad four track right-of-way near the Bronx River and the Bronx River Parkway. Too little, too late.
What do you think of a 3 train extension to Linden Boulevard? That could be a future video.
I have plans to extend the (3) to JFK, however, I'm not finished with them. When they are done, I may make a video on it.
@@MysticTransit Really want to see this one now because I was doing something similar on the side but also really liked the idea of something heading towards Spring Creek/Gateway Mall and want to see ways you can do both. Might crib some ideas off your idea when that video goes live. 👀
2:17 What if the D could run a little south from what you’re showing here and stop at Pelham Parkway’s unused express tracks for cross-platform transfers? The express platforms can be shaved to allow B division trains to stop at them just like what was done to the Astoria Line. Currently, Queensboro Plaza is the only station in the system to provide cross-platform transfers between A and B division lines.
This would be a great idea. It's definitely going to be a while. (If they see this and decide to do it) still though this would help me and everyone alot. The D (pause) and the 6 would work great together in co op City.
What program or app did you use to draw that subway line visual? It looks cool
Brand New Subway.
@@MysticTransit thank you and I love it already. Time to upgrade the mta 🤣
A gondola could connect Pelham Bay to co-op city then travel towards the 205 st station. No traffic or added pollution.
The Roosevelt Island Tram was the first built for urban transportation. Time to expand.
I think that if people that do live in cop 🌆 need a way to get into Manhattan because there's no bus and subway transportation service into Manhattan or back to cop 🌆
Not a good idea the D has only a part time express track . It would be far easier to put elevated tracks above metro north tracks going up third ave
Needs faster traveling of those extensions to get closer anywhere of home and others that is more convenient too!
Easiest and cheapest solution (which the mta likes) would be to extend the 6 line two stops from pelham bay park. 1st stop to section 5 and second stop would be Bay Plaza.
Not even 1 1/2 miles of track. Elevate it right over the hutch or along side it.
Possibly share the proposed station with metro north. Split the cost. Win-win.
The D Line would be nice, but they would never do it. Too extensive of a project.
At first I thought this was a bad idea as I didn’t really see that many people who would benefit from this. But after realizing that expanding the line to Co-Op City will make it more useful, I think this is a great idea to serve the residents of Co-Op City much easier.
Exactly, not only the residents of Co-Op City would benefit, but a large portion of the Bronx would as well, as this extension serves new areas, and provides transfers to 3 other Subway Lines + the Metro-North.
It would be great idea to extend the D train to Co-op City. It would definitely cut down on overcrowded buses and bus traffic itself coming out of Co-op City and routes like Bartow Ave and Gun Hill Road. But I doubt it will happen bc like u stated, opposition from the residents in the areas affected especially if the D line is elevated.
@@TheRailLeaguer true but might be more expensive. And how long will it take. The first phase for 3 stations of the Second Ave Subway took 10 yrs. And still the question, would residents along the proposed D line route would go for it whether it's elevated or underground.
@@TheRailLeaguer hoping ur right and it becomes a reality!
It would be a great idea. But the NIMBYs will definitely oppose a subway route, especially an elevated one.
Making the D elevated in the Bronx is not an option. It wouldn't fit well and cloud up the sky line of the North Bronx. The most obvious option is underground but I get that would be more expensive
@@fcny1218 better idea stop listening to them
Extension of the D line would be ideal and preferable to the six line. The D line used to be the old , privately run IND or independent line. The trains are wider, and can accommodate more passengers comfortably than the IRT.
this might already existed but the 8 train. I think it should go from grand concourse to Brooklyn and Queens. In Queens, the 8 can run via the 7 line but go seperate ways at the 7 terminal. In Manhattan , the 8 train could cross the F line and have a station transfered to the 1, 2, and 3 lines. I also think that the 8 train should have it's custom train station in central park like I mean in the center of the park or something. so there should be a stop at central park. Then in Brooklyn, the 8 train could have stations close to or transfered to the 4 line. Me personally, I think at Yankee Stadium, the 8 train should be transfered to the 4, B, and D trains. I'm not saying that it should come to life (It doesn't need to if MTA wants) but i'm just saying It could be a good idea for people who cannot make it to the Jerome line and choose Grand Concourse line. I think the 8 train should contain a R142, R142A, and a R62A (the ones with the LED on the side it looks cool.
This could be extra beneficial if the IBX ever (gets built at all, and then) gets extended to the Bronx, matching the original Triboro vision. Put together with this D extension, West Bronx residents could have fairly good access to the IBX, enabling a new set of paths from there to Queens and Brooklyn. All that said... I'm not very confident the MTA will ever be driven enough to accomplish this :(
idk i feel like co-op isn’t that known for a train to be rerouted like that-just seems excessive but the 6 train should definitely go to co-op that’d make life way easier ngl
What about connecting the Line to the 4/6 and Running a Bronx Express loop from the 4 returning on the 6 at all times plus a shuttle service on the full line. Or connecting all three Lexington avenue branching and running express outbound on the 2 and inbound on the Four and Six with the same Cross Bronx shuttle? This takes advantage of the third tracks full time to allow more service in general.
Even if people didn't understand the merits of a crosstown line, why don't people see how close Burke Ave on the 2/5 is to the 205 St station on the D and beg their elects for a one stop extension?
I'm here for it. Also, your channel is growing fast. Only 3 videos ago we both had 3k subs now you're on the way to 4k. Keep the content coming!
Yeah, I'm surprised by the growth, as with many others.
I don’t understand why the 6 has not been extended to coop. They can easily extend it to at least the mall.
There more pressing projects than the "D" train - like Utica Avenue and Kings Plaza on the #4 line. Extension of the 2/5 in Flatbush.
A quick solution is an extension of the #6 line. Although it wouldn't be crosstown, it would provide a viable link into Manhattan.
As for elevating the "D" line, its a no go. It add an already saturated borough with elevated lines.
And the elevated line can not be compare to Chicago, because these elevateds are in a highway median. And this one will be in a residential neighborhood.
Anyway, the benefits are there to having it as a crosstown subway. YES! But this adds more mileage to an already high mileage line. And there is no terminal in Manhattan to short turn or change train crew on this line with inconveniencing passengers. And workers would be hard press to take a "D" train job because of possible emergencies.
There is a compromise to this: Light rail. But it would operate from River (Hudson) to River (Long Island Sound) making much fewer stops than a bus. It will connect all crossing subway lines including the extended #6, 5, 2/5 (Burke), D, 4 (Mosholu) and #1 trains. Certain sections through the Bronx River park will have to be elevated because of the terrain in that area.
No, extending the D train is just as important. If you live in The Bronx you'll understand.
@@IlDiavolo2515 Yes. It is important. But the demand is more pressing for Utica. The buses that cover this area is the most crowded in Brooklyn. Not so for individuals using the 28,30 and 38.
And YES, I'm familiar with the area.
@Amir the Cultivated Commuter or it can be elevated. Flatbush and Nostrand is big enough for this to happen. The issue is only the will to make it happen with little resistance.
@@TheRailLeaguer Or 2 via Nostrand, 3 via Utica, 4/5 via Livonia with short turns at Utica/Eastern Pkwy. This way you don’t have to do any construction at all & this 5 via Utica would only bypass 4 stops anyway
@@TheRailLeaguer being elevated cuts cost and reduces construction time. And since we are talking about a two track and wide street, I think it is a go. The area being highly congested is the reason to extend the line and to build it quickly.
I love the idea. The D line could also be versatile in extending it past Co-Op and head into northwest of Queens since no train goes there except for the 7 just barely. Makin it the first in crossing all 4 boroughs.
Technically, it wouldn't be the first train to cross 4 boroughs. The (C) did it in the 80's.
Also, I think a (7) Train extension is better suited to serve Northern Queens.
Yeah I don't think making the D train almost 3/4 of a circle would be great
I agree with the narrator with the proposals of extending both the D and the 6 line to co-op City. The city and the MTA back in 1973 were foolish to tear down what was remaining part of the third Avenue elevated line that ran from 149th Street to gun Hill road. An elevated structure extension of the six line is indeed feasible and an elevated structure along gun Hill Road that extends the D line also is a feasible structure. Of course there will be opposition as people do not like elevated structures near their residences or businesses. However, if these lines are extended the real estate values of these neighborhoods will drastically increase because there will be additional transportation options and linkages to vital Bronx neighborhoods that have been disconnected. If they were to considered the underground options that would take way too long and will cost too much money and probably would never happen and if it were it would probably be the year 2120. Look at how the second Avenue subway started in 1929 and didn't get actually built partially until 2017?! So it takes into account funding of course, neighborhood opposition, and of course the engineering and structural design. It's feasible but you will need money, neighborhood support and great engineering to get these through. Nonetheless great proposals and great ideas by the narrator here.
No that's an excellent point. And underground would be more efficient and faster and would avoid opposition that could stall it for several decades. However, it's just seems that underground construction also takes a long time and is complicated. However it may be the more efficient and shorter approach.
@@TheRailLeaguer
I believe you are absolutely right. It may boil down to a combination of the two underground and elevated depending on environment and structure and other determinants. It just seems that in recent years based on what took place with the second Avenue project and The Big dig project in Boston that these projects take longer for some reason. However regardless of the manner whether it's elevated or underground it would be great to see this extension completed at least an hour lifetime. Hopefully it will get done and look forward to attending the grand opening ceremonies 😄
@@burbank there could be a compromise here. The original 1929 plan called for the extension to continue eastward via Burke Avenue to Boston Road, and then along that Street to Baychester Avenue with the tracks continuing further up a bit.
A potential co-op city extension would reuse the Burke Avenue section of this plan. However, past Boston Road, the line would diverge from the 1929 plan and continue along Burke Avenue and Gun Hill Road, and along Bartow Avenue to Co-op City. Past Boston Road you are free to make it elevated for the trip along Gun Hill.
Could you do a video on the 7 train extension in queens
Eventually, yes. It is currently on my list.
The D Train extension should terminate at the soon to be new co-op city metro north station for an easy and much needed transfer. With metro north adding east bronx and Penn station access, imagine the service this would provide. Metro north riders would have another option for west side access, especially upper west side access, or if there's an issue getting into GCT. It would also provide much needed relief for fans attending yankee Stadium on game days, giving another desperately needed public transportation option to get to the stadium. It would also give local bronx residents an option to get to the city or west side faster by going east on the D to catch a Penn station bound D train. Especially for those within in say 5 or so stations of a proposed co-op city terminus.
This is a great idea I think it would cost a ton less to build this above ground than it would be to build underground. The city and state could use eminent domain for the stops and infrastructure along the way. There could be a terminus for the 6 at the new Co Op City Metro North stop. As far as the other train line I think Bay Plaza would be the best spot for that to be ended. The biggest pushback you would get from Co Op would be noise, pollution, traffic and crime rates. On the other hand I could see the people in Co Op being on board with this is for a 1 transfer ride to the train considering the bx 26 does not travel the northern part of co op city unlike the Bx 23, 50, 38, The Bx 28 only travels the northern part of Co op city from 10pm to 6 or 7 am. The Bx12 only goes into Bay Plaza. The Bx 29 only serves section 5 via Bartow Ave and Hutchinson river parkway and out in the back of section 5.
I like this idea 100% because as somebody who is recently taking the 6 train home, by making an Extension to Co-Op City it would be less Train Traffic on the Last Stop Which is Pelham Bay Park, furthermore it would be less Crowded on the Bx12 SBS as well.
Just The Other Day I saw a Lot of Train Traffic on the 6 Train Via Buhre Ave, 2 of the same 6 trains behind each other.
I would be in favor of an elevated line to co-op city. However, has anybody considered a transfer point at Pelham Bay where people could board a monorail system? This could easily also help people who might want access to the future proposed metro north Station. This would ALSO give those commuters another way to access the LIRR as well. Since monorail trains are very quiet and fairly rapid, you wouldn't suffer in travel times. And you could create the yard for them by the swamp that parallels the section of the Hutchinson River Parkway near the bus garage by I-95. To alleviate road congestion, theoretically you could simultaneously provide access to the 5 train as well with also another line out of co-op city that could run up Gun Hill to the 2 train, thus bringing back a portion of the 3rd Ave El to Fordham Road. And even that could help serve as yet another option to connect to Fordham Road's Metro North Station!
Would make sense to have both the D train and the 6 both extend into Co-op. This would help traffic on Gun Hill Rd and make it easy to get across the Bronx without having to take a bus or have to go into Manhattan to come back out.
I’ve made my fantasy line for the D train to Co-Op City:
205th St - Bainbridge Ave (Perry Ave) - BX 10, BX16, BX28, BX30, BX34
Webster Ave - (Bronx Park) BX41(SBS)
White Plains Rd (Burke Ave) - BX39, BXM11, 2,5
Bronxwood Ave (Burke Ave) - BX8
Boston Rd - Laconia Ave (Burke Ave) - BL60, BL61, BL62
Gun Hill Rd (Burke Ave) BX28, BX38, 5
Eastchester Rd (Hammersley Ave) - BX31, BXM10
Baychester Ave - BX23, BX30, BX38, Q50
Dreiser Loop - BXM7
Bellamy Loop
Asch Loop - Bartow Ave
Bay Plaza - Co-Op City - BX5, BX12 (SBS), BX29, BX38
The entire extension wouldn’t be elevated as it will be subterranean throughout. Since the Bronx IRT lines are elevated throughout much of the borough, it would make sense to make the IND Burke Ave-Concourse Line.
Also, it’s a great possibility to just construct a transfer tunnel to connect the D line extension to the 5 train at Gun Hill Rd rather than use IG an out of system transfer.
You’ve also placed the D line terminus somewhere around Baychester Ave but a perfect terminus would be at the Mall at Bay Plaza, since it’s a destination within the Bronx.
The 6 train doesn’t need to be extended to Co-Op city IMHO. Pelham Bay Park is a perfect terminus for a line the way placing a terminus at Locust Point for the 8 line you talked about in a prior video.
You could also provide rush hour express service between 205th St - Bainbridge Ave and Gun Hill Rd by constructing a third track and maybe expanding the Concourse Line to four tracks, but that would be a lot of money, therefore it’s only optional. The extension can provide local service like the G train provides throughout Brooklyn.
One more proposal would be to switch the D train in Brooklyn from the West End Line via New Utrecht Ave and 86th St with the B train on the Brighton Line. It would also make a lot of sense to swap the B and D lines in Brooklyn since the old B used to go through Borough Park, Bensonhurst, and Bath Beach while the old D was local on the Brighton Line.
It really isn’t feasible to build a station at Webster Avenue since it’s too close to the 205th Street station.
As for your plan to swap the B and D routes in Brooklyn, barring deinterlining, that would not really serve present-day riders adequately since the B is a part time route and the D is full time. What you’re ending up doing is creating too many part-time shuttles. That’s something they did not want to do.
However what could work is deinterlining entirely, with the N and Q taking on Brighton and the B and D taking on 4th Avenue express (late night service would remain unchanged to some extent). This is going in line with the need to deinterline while maintaining some passenger preferences (Brighton riders prefer Broadway).
It should be considered the D can serve as a east west crosstown linking to Co op city as a transition. Adding the 6 train extension to Co op city would also benefit as it would allow the D and 6 to operate at full capacity at peak hours and provide access to those areas. The D train can also provide back up to get around in case of service disruptions on the 2 and 5 and vice versa. With the he added effect of the second avenue subway extension to the Bronx and resign the bus network. I think the Bronx can be serve well
Do you think it would be cool if MTA had like a light rail that ran on top of the cross Bronx expressway/I-95 from Washington heights to Parkchester where it could connect people going crosstown to the 1,A,4,D/B,2/5,6?
Maybe the MTA should rebuild an existing elevated line with sound attenuating technology ... just to see if its possible and to demonstrate to NIMBY's the benefits of extending new lines into their neighborhood.
Utica Ave would be a good start for that.
As an alternative why not create a shuttle train service? One that goes from those points in the Bronx to Midtown (or possibly even to Downtown) Manhattan. If, by chance, you live in Brooklyn, take the D to Manhattan, transfer to a shuttle, and you get to your destination in the Bronx. In the old days, the D was busy enough and extending it would only make it more congested and slow it down further. But if there is no viable alternative then, yes, extend the line.
Seems to be interesting, I don't know if the MTA would pick this option or not, but it seems to be a nice idea.
Another Idea is connecting IND Trains such as the A Train to the LIRR tracks. They fit. However, the LIRR, even though it's MTA, is a separate entity and it's political due to the money that the LIRR makes and the opposition from the people of LONG Island.
By all means, extend the 6 into Coop City. I do think extending the d would be to costly given the change in elevation from east to west. I think a light rail along the old 3rd Avenue El route would work. Run a line up 3rd Ave to Webster Ave turning at Gun Hill and going down Gun Hill towards Coop City.
So a Q train extension?
This would also be a perfect opportunity to connect the 2 Avenue Subway with this extension via 3 Avenue and Webster
Excellent idea. More subway service is needed in the Bronx. The 3rd Avenue elevated line needs to be rebuilt and be connected with SAS at 125th Street. The MTA needs to revise phase 3 and phase 4 of the SAS to include this extension.
Wasn't there a line planned to go from the BX to Queens Plaza? 6 and the D definitely needs to be extended. Busses and driving cross that part of the BX is exhausting
BRILLIANT idea! Just BRILLIANT 🔥🔥🔥. MTA should hire you as the CEO 👨💼. You’re way SMARTER than those so called executive’s there 😁😁😁.
Too many good proposals go to wayside to further inconvenience New Yorkers. I was around when the old 3rd Avenue line (The Bronx) was being dismantled. The 8 train (as it was called then) traveled between Grand Concourse to Gun Hill Road along 3rd Avenue. Where I lived at in the Mid 1970's (East163rd St and 3rd Ave), the 8 line was on elevated tracks along 3rd Avenue (the nearest station was only 2 or 3 blocks away to the south). I cannot say this proposal is impossible, especially when it did exist during that time, so what's so hard about extending existing subway lines to Co-op City, because I do know that The MTA gets plenty of revenue to improve ridership on many underserved areas within the city.
I was thinking that the D train would be extended between Bedford Park Boulevard and Woodlawn Heights (Little Ireland neighborhood) - Katonah Avenue/242nd Street remaining underground. Additionally, I was dreaming that the elevated 6 line would be extended between Pelham Bay Park and three new elevated destinations in the Bronx: Eastchester - Boston Road; City Island, and during Orchard Beach - Park Drive (the late spring and summer seasons only).
How about extending the A train subway line going into the Bronx. Weather it be crosstown underground or go into Riverdale. It could be underground or elevated. Just some suggestions. What do you all think that solution.
I think the D should be extended to bay plaza through a underground extension but if we do go elevated I think we could send it to bay plaza and then run with the 6 on co-op city blvd. Then terminate on Conner street. Then if the 3rd Ave line gets built we could either have it run under Pelham pkwy to bay plaza or have it run to bay plaza via Burke Ave.
Concourse yard may have to be expanded, also need to a few extra tracks for 6 trains in the upper bronx..
Concourse Yard can stay its current size. It's fine how it is. More cars from the yard would just get used.
The (6) can be double tracked from Pelham Bay to Co-Op City, since there is no Express service East/North of Parkchester, and it is only 2 extra stations.
Addendum #2
This could invigorate growth and refurbishment of businesses along every route they serve. But I'm now wondering that if the monorail could reestablish a section of the 3rd Ave El, and at Fordham Road be redirected back to Co-Op City via Pelham Parkway?
Love the D Train..especially when it goes above ground at Prospect Park into a beautiful part of Brooklyn..
I thought the D train emerged from the ground at 4th avenue, over to the 9th avenue station, and then onto the West End Line to Coney Island....
Salute champ. You might need to come and work for MTA. Get in the Capital Construction Department. That was a nice idea. Keep up the good work.
Maybe one day. I've always wanted to work as an Operator/Conductor though, but I wouldn't mind working down at 2 Broadway, helping out with the construction plans and stuff.
Your plans sound perfect the way you said it. Do you have the ability to forward this to the MTA for review?
I'm not too sure, but hopefully someone from the Construction and Development board sees this video.
@@MysticTransit I think it's better to try to forward this video to someone who has connections with the MTA because otherwise, they'll just probably watch it and not say anything.
Or just arm MNRR conductors with Metrocard readers so that those boarding westbound MNRR trains at Co-op city can swipe for their trips to NYP. This would be in line with the new NYP access for New Haven trains. Caveat: just a conceptual idea which should be a much cheaper alternative.