Holley efi VS. Fueltech, Motec, Haltech, ProEfi, Aem, , Etc. Terminator X / HP - Dominator -sniper
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- Опубликовано: 15 фев 2021
- Holley efi VS. Fueltech, Motec, Haltech, ProEfi, Aem, , Etc. Terminator X / HP - Dominator -sniper
Just a look into the ECU's i come in contact with one way or another at my shop and what lead me down the path ive recently been taking.
for all of you who have asked about remote tuning in the last week or so, i have not forgotten about you. i dropped and broke a phone and i just got a new one so i have 1000 messages to reply to.
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I thought I was at a Whitehouse briefing when you said "circle back" but then you actually did circle back so I was relieved to realize you were going to actually give us the information.
Lol right.
I've dealt with Scott from Haltech Australia -So helpful with any ECU questions and a real gentleman!
fantastic overview of all the systems and what people should expect
First time EFI installer, went with Term X Max with 0 issues on my turbo 5.3L , tunned it with the help of your videos 🤘
That’s awesome!
Side note, Mega Squirt offers a ton of features for a crazy affordable price, and some of us still have FAST sir.... LOL
Agreed MS3PRO evo is incredibly powerful and cheap AND made in USA
And the warranty is way better....sky is the limit on my Ultimate Pro and TCU ( controlling my 4l80e via can bus ), also having wireless connectivity...
Fast which I have used many systems from may not be the new kid on the block but it's rock solid.....
Id probably next upgraded to a dominator then UPGRADED to a MS3 Pro Ultimate, if the FAST TCU allowed per gear rpm...
Now I have per gear, and predictive shift along with several programmable latencies .....even a gear hold to keep it from blowing thru gears with rpm shifting when I blow the tires on a 1000+ hp sequential mpi injected BBC...
Haltech is growing really quickly. The new Nexus R5 range is amazing. NSP software is a game changer. Happy 35th Birthday Haltech!
Haltech is slow bro...
@@petehira1594 Quicker than you'll ever be bro 😎
Thinking very hard about that nexus 5..
Haltech has been bought by the USA. Motec bought by Bosch. So Haltech has gone down now that the USA will ruin it as they do with everything they purchase.
I've dealt with Holley, haltech, aem, motec, Bosch, megasquirt and others in my shop. The main thing that I used to choose my own ecm is the customer and technical support. In my experience with all the different brands Haltech has always had the best support in my experience. I switched to all Haltech elites on my personal vehicles a few years ago.
Would they have a system for a 68 FE motor? 390 FE to be precise
This makes me feel a lot better about going with haltech for my first dip into EFI tuning. I chose them because I live in Australia and they're a very popular choice. Plus they're locally designed and manufactured.
link has excellent tech support too
You choose suport and not think on fueltech ?
Fuel tech has some of the best tech support they actually answer their phones.
While I’m a Haltech import guy and the support in Oz is amazing, I agree with your Holley decisions for a drag car - watch out Haltech is coming though! Very well presented! Keep up the great work.
there are reasons you typically dont see dominators on big alcohol promods, fuel control isnt really the best on the holley at that level but never seen an issue on smaller builds. Fueltech is second to none on logging, but we have had some issues where we didnt buy fueltech specific sensors or tried to make racepak sensors work and had issues. for the drag racing application the configuration, time based applications, ability to move the log into the time based sections, and live diagnostic functionality are by far superior in the fueltech system. we started using the fueltech power management stuff this past weekend and it works amazing. the engine rpm literally follows within a few rpm of commanded.
this video helped me tremendously ! I am around so many Motec tuners and agree it's the best. But, I was put off that it would seemingly be an endless expense. Although limited, I can grow a bit with the dominator for my LS. Thanks Joe!
The funny thing about the huge price range and motec & life with high-end processors: 9000 rpm is 540,000 tenths of degrees (360x10) per second or 0.54 mHz, and a $5 arduino runs at 16mHz. Certain tasks do take a while, but even the slowest tasks on better arduino-compatible hardware can still execute millions of lines of code per second.
In plain words: engines are sloooooow compared to even hobbyist processors. That's why there's literally a $25 arduino being developed for a new cheaper-than-Microsquirt ecu.
In reality the physical cases are the most expensive part of the ecu's, and their software interfacing is what costs them the most money. But as Joe explained very well - sometimes you have to pay to play and not all cars have similar needs.
honestly, i want to hear what you have to say about ECUs more than anyone else lol
Esp32 arduino compatible are really fast @240mhz. Speeduino should run great on them but I haven't tried it..
The speed of the processor is only part of it. The biggest problem, at high levels of both power and engine speed, is electromagnetic noise and crosstalk causing bad signals. When you're tracking anywhere from a couple hundred to well over a thousand signals at a hundred or thousand times per second, the simple act of datalogging alone can eat up a tremendous amount of processing time per cycle. If you're getting bad signals in the process of ingesting data, then that's a whole nother can of worms. That's why milspec wiring harnesses are so damn expensive.
I just want to say thank you for all your work all your videos. I learn a lot and I'll keep watching and learning more thank you very much.
You killed it with this video. Great information on all systems and plus and minuses
thanks i appreciate it!
Well done Joe, thanks. I came to this video from the direction of considering a Holley setup for a conservative, Gen-1 SBC street engine. I watched a couple of Holley's videos, which caused yours to pop up. I'm pretty knowledgeable concerning how multi-point EFI works -- as in, I can troubleshoot any 20th century factory engine management system without too much trouble and with no specialized tools. By covering the whole spectrum, you gave me a great primer course in these systems while also answering the question of what to do in my case. I appreciate that. Liked, subscribed, and archived.
I was overwhelmed with all the control module’s before I watched this, thank you for the help and insight.
Another great video. Thanks Joe! Yes. I went with Terminator for my 427 SBC TPI Mini Ram with a Procharger.
Nicely done. I feel like I need to watch it again and take notes. I like the motec but man I need to make a house payment. I was really intrigued and impressed with a Ausie car running high 6's. It actually had a lazer on the frame to sense when the car was trying to wheelie. Much quicker response than the right foot lift feature most of us are used to.
Thank you for the great perspective Joe.
I’m only 51 seconds in to this video and it’s already one of the best I’ve ever seen! Baddass editing as always Joe!!
Love the no BS on ECUs , clarity!!!!
Came to hear what you would talk about FuelTech but left with a great overview of the market, excellent video, thank you.
Tong of good info Joe, Shines light on areas that most wouldn't think of when choosing a system.
thanks! tried to take a bit of a different approach. i figured everybody would bitch and complain but its been kind of the opposite haha
That was a lot of useful information in a short period of time. My favorite kind of video. Thank you!
Matt sent me here, but this was a super spot on video from someone that actually sees it all. Thanks for putting all this together, Cold beer on me one day!
nice, glad you liked it!
Just subbed from Brad @ SEP recommendation. Hobby tuner trying to go pro so I'm trying to install every different ECU I can on all my buddies cars, this is an awesome breakdown. Very helpful.
Excellent analytics, you confirmed my previous decision to by a Holley management system for my crate GM LT4.
Bro, that was an outstanding and informative presentation. And one I really needed to see.
Great vid, thanks for taking the time to do this!!!
Very helpful insight. For the first time fuel injection guys like myself this is a great way to understand what is out there. I am starting a factory five cobra replica build and want Fuel Injection, traction control, launch control, and flat foot shifting. The dominator will do that (I think) and like knowing it is widely used
Excellent non-emotional overview. Thanks!
Love how explain each one, not a drag racer but like bulid something for circuit track day this helps alot ...
Was about to order the Terminator X for my LS Miata.
Watched this video to make sure I wasn't making a mistake.
Went back and confirmed my order after watching.
Same, im thinking of using it on my 5.3 swap into a 98 Silverado
Well done video that needed to be done. Thumbs up and thank you... MoTeC here I come.
I know this is an old vid, but, 1,000 thumbs up. It's awesome how honest and accurate this is.
Thanks you. Well done. Like the format
Thanks for covering the comparison . Really help me get an understanding of who's who in ECUs.
your welcome!
Thank you for making this video!!! its been a great help to me
RIP my ears lol
Raw, Direct and honest from someone who would know. Great video!
Thank good I have been waiting for a video like this for the last 6 months
haha glad you found what you were looking for!
Great overview and summary.
Excellent video Joe. There is something to be said about remembering hot keys and other shortcuts. Jumping around to different ecus can be a pain. And you are right about AEM, series 1 and 2 stuff I always fought issues that shouldn't have been there (gremlins). Had the same issue with an older Haltech. Tech support at the time was dismal.
thanks!
Very useful information I have terminator x max and have never had any support issues and if you do have issues RUclips it you're right Holley is designed for the beginner and with a little work you can do quite a bit and best of all updates are free TY for your perspective
DSMLinkv3 for 4g63, and Edelbrock ProFlo4 EFI for my 383 stroker.. which is more of a plug and play self tuning setup- it works and I like it.
Great video to watch. Thank you!
Great info! should break out complete EFI systems review from the ECU's though. Thanks
Wow fantastic content. Nicely done.
Very nice breakdown, I would be interested in seeing video on the differences in the Holley Systems. My grand plan is to swap an LV3, v6, into my Grand National.
Appreciate that honesty in this industry!
hard to find now a days huh? usually its just people trying to sell you something!
@@JoeSimpsonAtTempest exactly... keep the videos coming. I'm not too far from you so when the time comes I hope to be spinning that hub dyno.
"I need my wiring harness to be transferable to my next car if it burns down" I've actually heard that before lol , Great video buddy!
Really... lol I had my car burst into flames a couple times and rewired it a couple times.
I mean dr25 and tefzel will get you through a mild 🔥
@@TurboVisBits if you're using those, you have enough "resources" to have a spare harness just in case there's a fire!
Great Information....you had me at all the ODB references.
😂😂 my favorite part
Sounds like if you can't tune it yourself you are dependent upon your tuner. Your tuner has a tuner he is familiar with and likes. He also has to like you. Their are ecms that will fit your needs and can be upgraded.
Back to the tuner. It sounds like if you are a competitive type you may need to learn how to tune. If you want to 🏆.
You never know how good your competitors tuner is and how close their ties are.
Great video.
also agreed, terminator people opened the door to really low experience people calling about self inflicted issues
tech support sounds like it could be a painful job haha
'iTs GotTa be ECU ReLaTed'
Great Video. Now I need to learn what an ECU is and I guess take it from there. I have a bad feeling about this. A real rabbit hole.
Wow thank you for all of the helpful information.
Thanks for all your experience. That's more than most of us have.
I'm new to your channel, so I'm planning to sit back and take it all in, as opposed to offering input, but I felt like it was worth taking the time to comment to tell you thank you & you've done a great job on this video! Very well formatted, accurate, professional but casual, ect, ect, you did well!!
thank you, i appreciate it!
I agree 100 % with everything you said… including aem. I wish I could use your torch and torch every aem I’ve ever seen
This helped me a lot. Thank you.
Good info. Makes perfect sense to me..
Absolutely agree and thank you for sharing.
Great video! I’m curious if your experience with Haltech has changed over the past year since you did this vid… Also, between Holley Terminator X and the Haltech Elites in regards to tuning in Alpha-N, does one system stand out over the other? I’m planning on upgrading my stock ECU on my ‘75 280z for street/autocross with a 3.1 L stroker (original straight 6) with Jenvey ITBs and was told Alpha N tuning will help me eliminate a lot of vacuum lines. Thanks!
Great video thx Joe. Very hard to remain unbiased in this trade as we all have our favourites but you did a fantastic job here. 😊
Thanks for your input very helpful 🤘
Excellent vid Joe. Everyone I know uses some form of Holley system so it makes sense for me to buy a Terminator. There's so much free help available for it too. Thank you for the insight! 👍👍
yup, thats exactly it. are there "better" (really you would be saying more advanced) systems, yes absolutely. but from a popularity and a support standpoint its hard to beat!
Subscribed, to the point and no BS
Great discussion! Thanks so much.
That's a damn good intro now let's get to it. 🏁🏁🏁🏁🏁💯💯💯💯
Nice review ! Just to note, MaxxECU and ECU Master are on the different segments. Maxx is so much more powerfull and flexible system.
Good information about all. But I'm with you really can't go wrong with Holley.
Nice vid. Good information. Just missed comments on Speeduino and its 600 Mhz processing speed capacity and $100 kits.
Dude... You know more about EFI than I do cameras and editing software. 😮
ive gotten a phone call or 2 about it over the years haha
The amount of memes inserted in this video brought joy to my life
Excellent video!!
You said you werent persueding us but now i want Holley EFI on my honda 😂 maybe if i LS swap my s2000 in a dream. GREAT VIDEO👌🏾🤙🏾👍🏾
Great vid! I wish you were closer!!!
thanks, where are you located? i follow your IG stuff, your car is badass!
@@JoeSimpsonAtTempest Ha! Thats awesome man. Thanks!!! Im down in Texas... about 25 hours away 🤦♂️
That intro was epic
Great video. Agree 100 percent with everything you said.
Good content, man
Thanks man i appreciate it!
Great coverage on a difficult subject. I would have liked to have seen a lttle bit about fault diagnostics and data acqusition between Motec & Holley. I'm debating changing a GM Performance Parts "Crate motor ECM" to a Holley system....
Maxxecu have tons of features and its a pretty fast ecu too. But it wasnt stable. Some of them have trigger issues. But the tech support is pretty good at addressing all of the issues. Ive tuned a lot of maxxecu cars but i personally used link g4+ on my own car lol
you should have a look at Emtron, made here in australia like haltech but super impressive.
Love all the ODB in this video
I have actually heard the same about AEM from a company that makes patch harnesses. Its why I went with a haltech. Im tuning the car myself and I like it for what its worth.
yea, a lot of people feel the same unfortunately.
That was the definition of straight shootin, "Sh Sha Shame on ya"!
After watching this, i feel like i fall into the terminator category. Im doing a 5.3 swap into a 98 Silverado and really do not want a factory ecu, i really like the handheld interface and it seems to be the most cost effective option,.
Link are nice ECUs, great features and good support
Great video Joe
Thanks!
@@JoeSimpsonAtTempest your welcomed, its been a while,hope your well and doing great.
Really good break-down on the ECU's! Definitely got a laugh out of the Big Stuff 3 and AEM standpoints :D
all in fun, hopefully nobody takes it too seriously haha
@@JoeSimpsonAtTempest yeah since FAST still makes the most efficient LS intake lol
I was watching a video of an engine builder that uses motec and mentioned something about how the RPM limiter on the motec wasn't as violent and didn't beat on the thrust bearing as much. I know nothing about these boxes, but if that's true that would be pretty interesting how the implementation of the same thing might be slightly better.
Great info without undue bias. Would like to see a follow up in 6 or 12 months to see if and how your perspective might change, thumbs up.
thats not a bad idea!
I really enjoyed the video. I'm a domestic guy (Twin turbo BBC) that tunes part time at an import shop. I tune 90% Haltech, that's what software package I'm most familiar with so its interesting to see other tuners perspective. I even run the Haltech Nexus R5 on my big block chevy. I looked into the M150, Holley and FuelTech before going with the R5. Each system has pros and cons I hate the multiple box thing with FuelTech, I dont wanna have to add a traction control box or addon for the Holley, and the Motec had so much extra to buy besides the box which isn't priced too bad. Keep making great videos.
yea the 100 different boxes for everything with fuel tech is a deal breaker for most. like i think i stated in the video, as long as your going with a name brand system, if your familiar with it, as long as it has the features you need most of the ecus are going to be pretty comparable for the average user. 10 years ago that may have been a different conversation!
I'm an import guy and I love the Haltech stuff, so much so i'm using the Elite 2500 for my new LS Build, once you get used to the system the possiblilites of it for the price are amazing, the basically 21 hour a day tech support is killer too
@@TeeeRoyJenkins looked into the 2500T for my LS project. Excellent features !
@@BEANS-O-MATICtransmissions it truly is. For the price now I'd love to try the nexus.
Good video 👍🏻
Loved your presentation Joe. I recently learned that Holley does not offer individual cylinder knock control. I can help with that...
Nope. The knock control on Holley is basically unusable. Actually on the to do list for another video
@@JoeSimpsonAtTempest Hi Joe, thanks very much for your quick reply. I released the first version in 1991, for distributor ignition. Since then I've added versions for coil on plug, both smart and dumb coils. It's designed for engines with piston to wall clearances of 0.006" or less, to minimize false detections. The threshold, detection, and control software works really well. My most popular version is the Vampire, for modular Ford ignition. No wires are cut or intercepted, no tach adapters are required.
Fantastic video Joe. I didn't see the Autronic SM4. I bought one about 7 years ago now for a project yet to be completed. I suppose this means the Autronic didn't become popular, at least in the US. Curious to know how the SM4 would compare to the Holly/FuelTech/MoTeC linup. The SM4 still looks to be a current product from Autronic.
This editor is hilarious 😂 great info !!
This was a great video with good explanation for newbies who don't know what to decide on, I am a builder and tuner as well as the driver of my race cars 80 percent import, I have a car on motec "gold box" lol, fuel tech ft600, haltech elite 1500 and aem infinity, I feel you didn't really give aem a shot I always hear horror stories but me personally the way I set cars up I don't see any of those issues with the infinity, I have setup Honda, Mitsubishi, VW/Audi, 65 mustang supercharged and a 95 mustang turbo on infinity and always get everything I need out of the unit, I think I am probably as knowledgeable on infinity as you are on Holley so I can see why you went that route , again not taking anything away from your video but I believe just like you said go with the route your tuner or support group recommend and I think you will have the best luck that way. Thanks for the you pretty much broke down everything people need to hear to make a decision
Interesting perspectives. I could see Holley being a bread and butter setup for the reasons you gave. The Megasquirt its self can be a decent ECU but there's definitely some jank to it at times. I think unless you're on a dirt budget its time has largely come. An MS3 Pro or even a non-pro MS3 don't really make fiscal sense compared to just getting more of an entry level Holley at this point.
In terms of the MaxxECU I was watching a video from a guy named Nivlac57 who was talking about the reason he went with it was he could do variable cam timing on his Vortec 4200. Seems kind of nichey but it's still a pretty major difference if you need it. I'd also say looking at it the economics of it seem good if the firmware is solid.
I could also see why HPT would be frustrating. It's not like HPT is a monolithic thing, you have to know the variants of all the ECUs in order to tune them and stuff like 24X vs 58X boxes and which ones let you do what. Where they do offer benefit is cost, if you run an electronically controlled auto. You don't really get to control a 4L80E with an entry level Holley box. Where they suck is you have to bolt stuff on like a wide band controller. Where they likely have benefits is that you can get tons of info online for it.
Good overview- funny,too 😂
I agree a thousand percent with every word you said there is no other way to put it
thats a weird thing for somebody to say on the internet. usually its the exact opposite haha
Thanks for the good info