Pat Metheny on Kenny G
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- Опубликовано: 5 окт 2024
- Pat Metheny's answer to a Polish reporter's question about the acceptance of jazz music. Includes memorable quote on his opinion of Kenny G and his music. Sorry for the lousy un-synced video quality, but this is how it came to me (highly compressed Real Media format, further compressed by RUclips's own process).
Don't sugar coat it for us, tell us how you feel.
hahahaha
ha ha ha
Cynical but funny.
Jajaja
Pat Metheny on other musicians: *Rounder Spongebob*
Pat Metheny on Kenny G: *Bodybuilding Spongebob*
I wish i could get this video as a tattoo
IKR?
Pat was pissed because Kenny G played his dribble over the top of Louis Armstrong's What A Wonderful World. So Pats criticism was well deserved.
So disrespectful.
Weird. Watching this interview just now, for the 1st time (it was flagged earlier this evening by a PM music fan on Facebook), Louis Armstrong was the 1st person I thought of as someone who, to me anyway, represents jazz at its essence. I don't hold any strong opinions about Kenny G one way or another. This is the 1st I've heard of Kenny G playing over the top of What a Wonderful World, though, and I just thank God I never heard that. Just the idea reminds me of those ice dancers from France at the Salt Lake City Olympics who skated out to music played over Martin Luther King's "I Have a Dream" speech. A horror show.
No no. Actually Kenny G is so disrespectful to jazz.
I would bet that you don’t have one Pat Metheny album
All the jazz police slating Kenny G because it's not proper jazz. Well no one said it was jazz. They don't direct the same anger at the likes of Dave Koz, Jeff Kashiwa and Mindi Abair etc.
Pat Metheny is a brilliant and dedicated artist. That said, when you get into the game of rating your fellow practitioners, nobody wins.
That's putting it politely, all products are created to serve a target market, including the music genre. Kenny G's music is smoothing and peaceful, I get it we live in a very evil and hateful world and we have tuned out the desire for peace!
@@jonathanvictorian2107 nothing peaceful about Kenny G. It’s more like purgatory. An absence of experiences and meaning.
@drumxd fr tho
Somehow I can't find it within me to elevate Kenny G to the status of "fellow practitioner".
@@jonathanvictorian2107
Actually, I don't find mindless, infantile and vacuous playing like Kenny G's to be "soothing and peaceful." Having that pablum fed into my brain through my eardrums is, if anything, stressful and annoying, kind of like if adults were forced to listen to recordings of kids reciting nursery rhymes for hours on end.
"Do not put other musicians down, because if you do, you put yourself down" Art Blakey
kennyt G is a natural black asshole..u understand..
Well everyone hates him considering what he did with Lousi Armstrong's What a Wonderful World
Implying Kenny G is a musician
"I said that before I heard Kenny G" - Art Blakey
@@peabrane8067 Just in G flat :D
Whenever I am having a bad day I listen to this... just cheers me right up.
Damn thats slightly toxic
I dig Pat and his music. He’s not wrong about Kenny G, whose laughably shite music is so banal & dull, and who did what he did with Louis Armstrong a few years back.
I’d pay to watch them fistfight though. Maybe brutal but could be darn funny too. My money’s on Pat. Should’ve been an episode of Celebrity Deathmatch. Or was it?
@@cfibb Yes! I'd love to see Pat suplex Kenny G. with the wrath of the Jazz Inquisition.
this is just one of the perks of being a master musician/composer/guitarist/innovator like pat metheny --you can state the obvious unanomynously and even with a little smirk on your face. i throroughly enjoyed this.
Me too!
Bundao
If someone mentions jazz and your only thought is Kenny G, you have issues.
If someone mentions jazz and your only thought is Pat Metheny, or Michael Brecker, or David Sanbourn, you still have Issues. Better watch that Ken Burns documentary on what Jazz REALLY is.. lol.
Kenny Garrett is the only Kenny G
BOOM!!!!
YES! I always say that as well...
pat metheny = yhwh
I hear Ya!
I thought I was the only person that knew that
if Kenny G was an unknown sax-playing neighbor of Pat, Pat would have said: "nice job neighbour".
No, he wouldn't.
i think pat would whip beer bottles at kenny's car windshield n tell him to keep the NOISE down
Probably true. Tho if that neighbor was the most famous & successful artist in his field, he’d probably think a little differently.
Doubtful. He’d probably say “corny” and “my neighbor has no balls”.
I love this rant!
Audioholics This rant is just flat out rude!! Kenny Garrett’s music is amazing, not dumb!
@@hemanthkamana1886 Pat is talking about Kenny Gorelick, not Kenny Garrett.
Eric Liang it was a joke lol
@@hemanthkamana1886Oh rofl, couldn't tell
With all due respect to Mr. Metheny, I don't think Kenny G is the reason so many people hate jazz; I think the average jazz-hater associates jazz with avant guarde, atonal or very dissonant music. As Sheldon Cooper of The Big Bang Theory said, "Maybe I've been wrong to hate jazz all my life, maybe it's great to hear all the notes at once!"
I agree as for me some Jazz music sounds good and some sounds horrendous. Its all subjective anyways. If I dont like a certain type of music I dont listen to it and I sure as hell dont run around bashing the artist for it. Its their music and its not for me, Im going to move right along. I think people need to learn to love what they love and stop worrying about everyone else. I mean the mentality for most now a days is me, me, me so I guess it kind of makes sense. You dont like what I like so youre stupid. I wish all the music sounded the same.......
For me it's the snooty pretentiousness of jazz snobs. Avant guarde free jazz is an acquired taste. It's not meant for everydbody. Pop music is fun to listen to and enjoyable. Some of it is junk food ear candy, but some of it is the most influential thought provoking inspiring music every created. It meant to be simple and fun for everyone to enjoy and even better if it has a message. But why do jazz snobs need to look down on everyone for liking more assessable music? "Pfft! Are antonal saxaphone sqonks in odd time signatures to complicated for you?" It's like anyone who likes anything popular like rock, blues, r&b, country and smooth jazz is stupid and unsophisticated but free jazz is for the elitists with finer tastes. It's like wine snobs. There are super niche people who will pay waaaay too much for some super fancy chardonnay from an exclusive european vinter, and then there are woman who buy a bottle with a colorful label at the grocery store for a 'book' night get together. As long as they enjoy it, who cares? Why rain on everyone's parade with a jackass comment. People who like Kenny G just like him for who he is and maybe they'll dig deeper into other jazz saxaphonists. Or maybe not. But his exixtance isn't ruing Pat's music or taking away his fanbase. I get his comments a bit and am not surprised by them but still it's how he said them.. Don't live in a niche jazz bubble and shit on everyone else who is not in it. Don't insult smooth jazz fans for being 'stupid" for liking what they like without any apologies. Some people drink european chardonnay, some people buy three buck Charles Shaw.
LOL that's exactly how I would summarize straight ahead. It's so busy and discombobulated that I can't make heads or tails on it. If you like Jazz or elevator muzak, more power to you. There's enough room for both to exist.
I didn't expect such a teenage-like viewpoint frome Metheny. You can't judge art like talking about football. Still my favorite guitarist though.
Are you saying that art is all about expression and not also an intellectual exercise? It's both...
Il a le droit il a le niveau pour le faire et c'est un musicien accompli. Le point de vue d'un immense musicien comme Pat Metheny est plus que valable. C'est pas un ignare qui parle et s'insurge contre cette immondice. Merci Pat!!! :D
I like Kenny G's music, but I never thought of it as Jazz. I always thought G made smooth/pretty tunes. Whatever. I'm surprised to hear such an accomplished musician like Metheny speak this way about another musician. The people that criticize people like G are usually either dejected "musicians" or jazz fans that don't create any form of music themselves. All a matter of wanting to feel superior, directly as a musician or indirectly as a jazz fan, imo.
Right! They was harsh, dumbest music in human gene. G. Makes soft elevator music, it's more new age. He does solo very well r Kenny. Discontent to hear Mr metheny speak in that way.
Good for you. I agree with your take on the inappropriate badmouthing; one could be more polite. But: I can certify that MANY people categorized Kenny G as a jazz musician. I wrote it in past tense because. commercially, Kenny G is NO MORE.
I couldn't agree with you more! I looked up KG"s net worth and it's 100 million and I am pretty sure he didn't earn his money selling books!
@@jonathanvictorian2107 He earned his money by dumbing everything down to the lowest common denominator. Shrewd business move, but certainly not innovative or artistic.
@@paulschmitz9175 exactly. Selling lots of records should never be confused with being a great musician. The masses have always loved dumb music while more sophisticated music has always had a smaller following. His words may have been harsh but they were honest.
I get the technical criticism, but I don't get the vehemence that it's delivered with. Consider Kenny's position: He plays sax but isn't a top flight player. OK. Fair enough, but people buy, and importantly, enjoy his records. What's he supposed to do? Tell them not to? Tell them that he's really not that good and so they should go listen to someone else? So, hardcore jazz fans don't like his stuff. OK. Nobody's asking them to. I don't ever remember Kenny G claiming to be anything great. Maybe I missed it. I'm also a longtime Metheny fan, but his criticism here comes off as snottily arrogant jealousy. Having said that, I'm not so sure overdubbing Armstrong was in the best taste and probably should have been left alone.
Excellent reply +gold python. I saw Kenny G in concert and the guy was technically BRILLIANT and he had a killer band that had Chick Corea Elektric Band skills. I've seen Metheny in concert too and it was as epic as I figured that it would be. But Kenny G's show was the more surprising as to the musicianship. I KNEW Metheny's group would slay, but Kenny G was way more than the pop jazz stuff that I was expecting.
Absolutely. I like Pat's and Kenny's music. Obviously they are for different moods but both have played some great stuff and not so good stuff too. Kenny is guilty of churning out bland easy listening ballads for the boomers who pay good money for it but I've seen him play live and he is very impressive. Among my Metheny album collection there are some tunes I find boring too, but you can't please everyone all of the time. I think what happens is Kenny G's music gets promoted as jazz and that annoys the anal jazz police. Well Kenny never claimed to be a jazz musician, just a musician and he is a nice guy.
Metheny obviously makes some good points in this (mostly about the best music of a genre typically being the most difficult to appreciate at first) but the way he goes about it is so juvenile it makes you forget he’s such an excellent guitarist.
Let’s also not forget that the particular flavor of ECM jazz fusion is and was not necessarily pushing boundaries the same way Zappa or Davis were.
Actually, I've never been a fan of Kenny G, but his tone is great and there is a soothing beauty to much of his music. I'd never buy his album, and have mainly only heard his music in stores. But there's something so snooty about what Metheny says here.
I’ve heard Kenny’s MUZAK . . .gonna give a listen to Pat Metheny and get back to you . . . 🧐
I'd say "snooty" only applies if a person's comments are wrong, which Metheny's certainly aren't.
Thank you Rick Jordon for being so understanding. I'm amazed at how long this debate has been going on. But I will say: Pat Matheny and Kenny G are great musicians from different genres of jazz. Kenny G never made one negative statement about Pat Matheny's playing as a matter of fact he just kept playing his sax and made nothing but MONEY MONEY MONEY. Idiots need to understand that there's a falling for Pat's music as well as Kenny's music. JUST DIG WHAT EVER MUSIC AND MUSICIANS YOU DIG AND QUIT THE BS HATING
Big Pat Metheny fan but this is a bit harsh. As a musician, I liked Kenny G when he played with Jeff Lorber Fusion. I was much less a fan during his solo career. Either way, I think he's a decent musician but I wouldn't consider him one of the best jazz sax players out there. Not even close. In the end, all music should be pleasing to someone. Kenny G's is pleasing to some but it's probably not a very good representation of jazz as an art form.
Pat talks about Kenny G playing with Jeff while opening for Pat, along with the context and the reason for his Kenny G hatred, in this blog post: www.jazzoasis.com/methenyonkennyg.htm
.First time i listen to kennyg 's song is when i were walking by a jazz club, i didn't know who is KennyG, or how popular is he or or how many CDs he have sold at this time . but one thing i know for sure that his song " songbird" magically made me walkin to that club, bought a coffe and listen to the rest of the song. THAT IS ALL MUSIC ABOUT , MAKE THE CONECTION BETWEEN THE MUSICIAN'S & PEOPLE'S FEELINGS.
guys like Kenny G are jazz for people who like to say they like jazz but really don't know anything about the art form. The other way I once heard it said (and its the best) is Kenny G is mall jazz.
I went to a Kenny G concert in the late '80s, primarily because Stanley Jordan was opening for him that night. I have to admit I was well impressed by Mr. Gorelick and his band, they all took long, impressive solos. I have nothing on Kenny G, trust me. I have utmost respect for his ability. I just uploaded this video for the comedy aspect. Cheers, dagrote!
In college when I was in jazz, the director played with Kenny G... he gave made props to Kenny G, said that Kenny G could play the crap out of his horn and had tremendous chops. Then went on to say the music sucked, but it pays the bills.
I was hoping that this was more of a parody in nature... 😃
@@tomloya7366 Kenny G was playing some pretty good jazz funk in the early 80's. Didn't go mainstream so he eventually went commercial. Sa how the masses buy garbage music ruclips.net/video/CNr-6pxm4v4/видео.html
Funny, I have a similar story. Went to a jazz festival in the 80s to see Stanley Jordan, and Kenny G, whom I knew nothing about, was playing as well. He played an impressive set, and I was very pleasantly surprised. Based on this performance, I went out and bought his album (Duotones). It was terrible! But from that live gig, he earned my respect.
kenny g is a great musician, theres nothing to whine about :)
Pat Metheny,is in a class by himself.There is NOBODY like him.I have seen him so many times.Each show is a new experience.The 2010 tour,he played one older tune,and the rest was new,and improvised. He had the audience ,in the palm of his hand. He is a great person,too Thanks for posting!
that don’t mean he has to shit on someone because he is better, there is always someone better than you!Some people criticize Pat for being too commercial, so in the end, keep your critics to yourself, maybe one day you will be the clown of another musician
"That's the dumbest music there ever could possibly be in the history of human beings"
Makes me think this dude hasn't heard much music. Tacky.
Ironically I always thought of Pat's music as sort of a mainstream smooth jazz - but I liked it. (guitar player).
Kenny sure made a buck though and he brought millions of people, restaurants and elevators happiness and good feelings.
Props in context.
Eddie, exactly. I know jazz purists who think Pat sucks too. I guess that point of view is relative. Personally, I think the guy is a genius (if a jackass), but it must be said that a fair portion of his catalogue is also cheesy and repetitive.
Pat is just jealous, that Kenny is the best sold instrumental musician on this planet. Kenny enjoys success, is pilot of a private airplane and has more listeners than Pat. So I think there is a personal frustration in Pats words. Whyever should somebody on the musical level of Pat speak with such an anger.
“Mainstream smooth jazz”...isn’t that redundant? There is no underground smooth jazz. It can’t exist. In regards to Pat, I’m sure some of his records to border and even cross the line and back of smooth jazz at times. One can even argue he created it 1975 of sorts.
@@LarsTaylorMusic nah Kenny G is just bad
@@RoeserFan1 Pat has one of the most versatile styles of jazz, he even has many “pure” jazz clubs such as 99/00, as well as fusion, modern jazz, even a mix of jazz with Brazilian music. If there are people who think that Pat sucks, they should simply leave music because they must be the worst musicians on the planet... Pat is a legend, in addition to being a great guitarist, he is one of the best composers in all of history.
He has a point… I’ve met sooooo many people who have said they don’t like “jazz” and they reference music like Kenny G… it’s like people saying they hate bananas and then show you the box of grapes they just ate
Kenny G is just Kenny G. He never mentioned himself as Jazz musician. But he made people more familiar to Saxophone with his music and that is enough. I like Pat but no point to attack Kenny.
Part of the issue was that in the early days, people who only knew him from his records had no idea that he could blow back the walls with any standard or bop tune you could think of, something that those of us who had the good fortune to witness him in small Cambridge clubs around 1974-75 knew well.
Less success? Metheny has won 20 Grammy awards. Kenny G? 1.
I always like to say that if Pat Metheny wanted to wash all of his Grammys in the dishwasher, he'd still need a pretty big dishwasher.
@Donde Merlin Just because something sells doesn't necessarily means that it's good. Conversely, just because something doesn't sell doesn't necessarily mean it's bad. People have a long history of buying crap music - bubblegum of the 60's, disco of the 70's, rap and so on. It's about integrity, which Kenny G has little of.
My view us that Kenny holds a bigger capitalistic value. His music speaks to a lot of people. On the other hand, Metheny has a larger artistic value and thus his expression is greater.
Grammys vs records sold is no match. KG definitely made more money in record dales in the 90s than PM. If money is the goal then KG won that battle. But KG will never enjoy the respect and longevity that PM gets. No one even mentions KG now. He was just a footnote in the 90s though he still performs today. PM is world renowned and respected as an artist and ambassador of jazz and still a prolific composer.
I don't know how much richer Kenny G is than Pat Metheny but I would rather be poorer and still rich and go down in history and go down as a great Jazz musician than be remembered as the most hated man in Jazz.
It wasnt that Kenny G was a bad musician- its that he didnt deserve to be the poster child of the art form nor the amount of popularity the public gave him for it. He was definitely the watered down version.
Go pat! We're so lucky to have such a deep gentleman at the forefront of the guitar music scene. God bless the perm
+Django Brecker I didn't think Pat acted like a gentleman in this interview.
Pat's too gentlemanly for you to ever comprehend. god bless the perm
greetings from switzerland
This hasn’t aged well. I’ve heard a lot of awful jazz by Pat Metheny. Meanwhile Kenny G is making a cool comeback and only jazz anoraks know who Pat Metheny is.
Do a search. You'll find this all came a from a question Pat Metheny was asked on a Polish TV program. He was asked what he thought of Kenny G. He decided to say what he really felt. Isn't it interesting how so many people say that they like honesty until somebody is truly honest, then, they criticizing them for being honest.
If you don't like his opinion, tell us why he is wrong. That is, defend Kenny G.
JazzKeyboardist1 Nope. This is a response to a question he was asked on Polish TV. He was asked what he thought about Kenny G. Well you can research his response, but it had to do with Kenny G over dubbing himself on a Louis Armstrong recording. This video was done to clarify what he said.
KW jumped on stage and then back stage berated the Grammy for awarding Beck best album.
In this video Metheny is partially wrong because some people actually don't like what he considers good jazz and actually like Kenny G's so called jazz.
He could have said I don't want to talk about Kenny G, but I guess that recording over Louis Armstrong must have been burning him up for a long time.
Metheny never volunteered his op[-inion. He was asked on a TV show what he thought about Kenny G. KW was never asked what he thought about Taylor Swift of Beck. He's the one that brought it up. he's the one who went on stage and interrupted TS and almost Beck. That's the difference.
D Anton Read this to get the background on this video.
www.jazzoasis.com/methenyonkennyg.htm
Metheny's initial rant if you want to call it that was a response to a question he was asked on Polish TV; "What do you think about Kenny G." Did he asked Kenny G to give any of his Grammy up? No. Did he storm the stage because Kenny G won a Grammy? No.
If KW was asked his opinion on Beck's and/or Taylor Swift's music and he gave us his opinion, then it would be the same.
@Gilyslas i absolutly agree with you...jazz musicians and fans seem to see themselfes as a "better class" of music lovers/players...i guess those people don`t know what music is all about..it`s for sure not about noodling the most complicated skales and chords ...it`s all about feeling,melody and transporting it to the people..thats the reason that kenny g is touching millions of people with his music..and that`s the reason he sold millions of albums...
I'd heard that he hated Kenny G's music, but wow, that was a trip to the woodshed. I would like to know a bit more context to this, maybe it would make it more understandable. Otherwise, Pat is coming across as a "Get off my lawn'' guy. The fact that it is true doesn't mean he should have stated it this way.
He is not only coming across like that, he is like that. A friend opened for him, a concert in Basel. He is not the friendly, easy going character he appears to be. He shows his "smily" teeth in interviews, but this guy has a big ego.
This is the same Pat who played guitar on one of David Bowie's worst records - This Is Not A Miricle and made a huge pile of cash in the process .He is a complete hypocrite and should pull his huge huge ego out of his posterior .
He may be right, but speaking like this isn’t going to make people want to listen to his music. It even alienates him from people who don’t and won’t understand what he’s talking about, making it counterproductive. Imho
He's got 20 Grammys and has been nominated 36 times. I don't think he cares.
This is the first time I've ever heard Pat Metheny speak. And I have to say, after watching this video I rather just hear him play his guitar. There is a Bible proverb that says "Jealousy is as cruel as the grave". 🤔
Quelle jalousie? Il n'y a aucune jalousie là-dedans. Premièrement, Pat Metheny est un musicien prolifique, virtuose, innovateur et un maître de la guitare reconnu, un improvisateur jazz hors pair. Kenny G est un musicien de niveau scolaire correct (pas mauvais) mais qui n'a rien inventé, et qui ne fait pas évoluer son instrument. On parle de deux niveaux à des années-lumière. Deuxièmement, si Pat a prit la parole, c'est parce que Kenny a osé l'irréparable, l'immondice de se superposer sur What a Wonderful World de Louis Armstrong pour dire qu'il avait fait un duo (un faux duo) avec Satchs et vendre plus de $$$. C'est ce qui a outré Pat qui lui, est un musicien reconnu qui restera à jamais dans l'histoire de la musique. Vos comparaisons sont ridicules. Tant qu'à ça, Kenny serait plus jaloux: Pat a 20 Grammys, Kenny un seul! Ohhhhh! C'est qui le jaloux maintenant (ridicule)?
The fact is that Kenny G's music is MUCH more popular than Pat's. Kenny G is definitely NOT the reason people "hate" jazz. If anything, Kenny's music probably acts as a gateway to the kind of music Pat considers legitimate jazz. A kind of bridge from pop to jazz. Yet even if Pat thinks Kenny's music is terrible, there is something pathological in his invective. Is there more to the story? Did Kenny wrong Pat in some way? If not, I think Pat should apologize. Why would you denigrate someone like this, just because the music they make is not to your taste? It;s embarrassing for Pat.
my guess is he is a left wing social justice warrior and he felt that defending Louis Armstrong wins him points for virtue signaling
Pat had a very good reason to go after Kenny G this way because Kenny G recorded saxophone over Louis Armstrong's original classic song.
The Jazz culture very passionate about their art I'm Kenny G should have shown more respect.
Although I am a fan of Pat's music, I have to say that Pat's views are arrogant and disrespectful to Kenny G
It's refreshing to hear Metheny talk so candidly about another musician.
He's not talking about another musician, he's talking about Kenny G.
@@bigswingface5847 Ha! 😁
I think he was going thru somethings In the business/his life. Never heard him attack anyone..and he’s usually very articulate but not here.
Hey, they play Pat and Kenny on The Weather Channel Local on the 8's. That means you've made it!!!!🤣
I'd rather see them in the MGM Grand Garden, Kenny wearing padded gloves, and Pat wearing ropes dipped in honey and glass shards, JCVD style. :D
@@jazztom86 lol
I think, in general, that it is not done or professional to talk bad about other musicians in public, Whatever the kind of opinion you may have about somebody.
I have been a musician most of my life, I've loved Pat's music since I was a kid and have the utmost respect for him and his music but here he greatly diminishes. Pat has insulted millions of people around the world here by insinuating that they are the dumbest people that ever lived because they enjoy "the dumbest music that ever was!" Mr. Metheny should know that musical taste is subjective, like food, clothing or ones favorite color. People of course have different tastes and their preferences must be respected not shit on by a snob. The problem here is that Metheny has been the proverbial Boy in the Plastic "Jazz Bubble" all of his life not realizing that 99.9.9% of people on the planet not only do not worship at the altar of Miles, Trane, Bird, or Metheny; they don't even know who they are! Pat, this may come as a shock to you but Work-a-day John and Jane do not spend their days contemplating the Phrygian Dominant scale but most enjoy listening to music with pretty, singable, memorable melodies. People tend to enjoy what makes them FEEL happy, sexy, pumped up or even calm. Monk's chromaticism and dissonance will just never do it for the masses brother. Having said that, there is no doubt that PM is a musical genius despite his arrogance and musical Messiah complex. Pat says, "99 percent of rock music sucks! It's just the really good stuff that stands out." Oh, I guess if Pat says it's good then it's good and if Pat says it sucks then it sucks??? Pray tell Father Pat, what shall we moronic mortals eat or wear? Who should we date? Where should we work?
RATHER THAN RESENTING KENNY G'S MASSIVE FINANCIAL SUCCESS AND GLOBAL POPULARITY METHENEY SHOULD BE MORE FOCUSED ON THE FACT THAT HE HAS A 4TH GRADE VOCABULARY AND ALMOST NO ONE LISTENS TO HIS MUSIC. LOVE YOU PAT.
Absolutely amen...
Yep. All that resentment reminded me of people's accounts of Jaco's utter despise and rants against disco and funk music 😂
You’re right of course, Frank. That said, thank you Pat for stating the obvious.
I wonder if Pat thinks we should all wear the same horizontal striped shirt and have the same hair for 50 years too.
I have a friend in London who owned a successful wine bar in the 90's and early 00's .To keep the punters happy he played a regular selection of Grover Washington , David Sanborn , Bob James , Candy Dulfer , Kenny G , Najee etc .If he wanted to clear the bar quickly at the end of the evening he would stick on Giant Steps and it would empty within five minutes .
It is interesting that a legitimately talented musician like Pat Metheny would so roundly and meanly criticize a 'smooth jazz' artist like Kenny G. I would argue that Metheny's music, which at one point had some teeth to it has been significantly diluted to the point where he is kind of just a caricature of what he was in the 70s and 80s. Whereas Kenny G -- like him or lump him -- has been consistent the whole time He makes unapologetic elevator music, Some people actually like it. I used to...
In terms of record sales, there is no comparison. Kenny G sold 75 million records, while Metheny never had a platinum record in his career. Kenny G had mainstream appeal, whereas Metheny catered to a niche audience. But in terms of musicianship and the ability to play his instrument, Metheny is light years above Kenny G.
I’m surprised Metheny was so open with his criticism of another artist.
You just described the entire music industry.
Disagreed. Many of my normie friends know who metheny is. He wrote and played many mainstream instrumentals thats very easy on the ears.
Pat is just made because CLIVE DAVIS labeled Kenny Gs music as "jazz," when Kenny himself never put a label on it. Kenny actually plays INSTRUMENTAL POP with SOME of it having smooth jazz connotations.
I started paying much more attention to Pat after hearing his trio album with Roy Haynes and Dave Holland years ago. I knew from that where his heart was. he's earned my great respect as a musician as well as someone who know's the history of jazz and probably who is more curious about seeking truths more then any career clone type of musician who has to do so to even get noticed at all.
Funny, it's exactly how I feel about Pat's music.
@WonderWhaz he's the eric clapton of jazz
It’s ok Kenny…
Pat Metheny's music has a smooth jazz vibe sometimes, but it's so much more complex that that.
DAH
No, it isn't.
Pat Metheny - Says his opinion on Kenny G.
Me - I listened to your opinion. I respect your opinion... but it is still an opinion, and therefore I reserve the right to ignore your opinion about Kenny G.
This is ironic, because there are a lot of Classic Jazz fans that don't like Pat Metheny Group music. If such people were disrespectful and narrow minded, as Pat is here, would it be okay for them to say that PMG music sucks? I don't like Kenny G's music, but I don't mind that he plays it because if he likes it, and his fans like it, that's all that matters. Kenny G and his fans don't need Pat's approval, anymore than Pat and PMG fans need the approval of Classic Jazz fans that feel the need to put down the musical tastes of others, in order to feel good about themselves. I like both PMG music and Classic Jazz a lot.
Albert Haust I know some of those “classic Jazz” people who dont care for PM. None are musicians.
After this interview Kenny and Pat met accidentally at a Greenwich Village pub, sat across a table and had a few beers. Folks who were there thought a collaboration album might be in the offing.
No Pat, im sorry. Kenny G is not the reason people hate real jazz. Its the abstract, practically inaccessible music of jazz snobs that turn them away. You cant just drop Coltrane on people used to pop music and expect them to get it. Kenny G actually opened the way to more people being interested in jazz. You should thank him.
People that like jazz, and I mean real Jazz, do not like Kenny G, so I think Pat Metheny was right.
The people criticizing Kenny never heard him play with The Jeff Lorber Fusion, when he was just "Kenny Gorelick." The dude does have legitimate jazz and funk chops, he just doesn't really use them with his commercialized product. He's able to hang on some hard bop or funk with the best of them, IMO, but you have to dig deeper than his "Kenny G" commercial product to find it. Pat should know better than this. He obviously has a very personal axe to grind with Kenny, both over the version of What A Wonderful World that Kenny made with him soloing over the Louis Armstrong classic, and also because it's fairly obvious that Pat is very jealous and resentful of Kenny's commercial success.
I was a HUGE Metheny fan for years and years, considered him an idol, have actually met him in person and talked to him, and have seen him in concert many, many times. As time went by, and the more concerts of Pat's I attended, I realized I was beginning to get rather bored by it. It was becoming "musical masturbation" at its best. Don't get me wrong, Pat has also written and played some insanely beautiful and musical pieces through the years, but he has also kind of evolved into a "technique slut" snob.
OK, sure, Pat has technique chops that pretty much nobody can match, but does his music SPEAK to people? To many, many people, it certainly does, but Kenny's certainly does as well. Music does not have to be complicated and overly-technical to be valid and connect with people. Music is about conveying and triggering emotion and feeling, and Kenny does manage to do that with his syrupy commercial stuff, whether Pat likes it or not. It may not appeal to me or you, but there sure are plenty of people that it does appeal to. I have to admit, I lost a lot of respect for Pat over this obviously jealousy-driven personal vendetta against Kenny.
The term JAZZ SNOB exists for a reason and here it is. Hey Pat, I guess your parents never taught you this but, there's just something to be said for being kind and not cruel or mean-spirited. I hope you've grown up since then. What happened to the hip, liberal, musicians Creed of live and let live? Let people just be who they are? I guess that only goes so far huh?
That's a real way of putting the opinion of music together. That's why these guys were such great musicians
Awesome Channel- I really enjoyed watching!
Best wishes, Max
It's about exposure. Opera is a good example. People say they don't like opera, but loved the short excerpt from Mozart's The Marriage of Figaro in the movie The Shawshank Redemption. Once you've listened to certain types of music, and your ear becomes "trained" it becomes difficult to tolerate some types of "music". Pat is a bit blunt here but accurate. While Kenny G laughs his way to the bank Metheny racks up the Grammys! Like Mozart, it's Metheny who has the staying power.
The music of Kenny g isn't bad. It's nice for a alarm clock, you always wake up automatically 5 minutes early to turn of the alarm before it starts to play.
Brilliant.
LOL !
I think "dumbest music on earth" might be an understatement.
Charles Paraiso Yup, if I don't like your art, it's absolutely the worst. Because my opinion is the worldwide standard... Just like yours, and Pat's, and my neighbor's down the block, and his Meth smoking brother's...
@@csmith7404 Um... I don't think Pat is the one smoking meth...
@Jazzkeyboardist1 You are completely wrong. People hate Kenny for destroying a Louis Armstrong classic. You're the asshole, not the musical geniuses.
Dumbest music on earth isn't true though is it? Listen to Lily Allen or Katy Perry. That is really dumb.
Back at that era, i also think some critic or random non-jazz listener (same thing) probably either tried to pigeonhole, categorize, or compare some of Pat's more accessible music from PMG with Kenny G and he took offense to it. Rightfully so. Kenny G music is not jazz. The "smooth jazz" (or "pop' or 'bubblegum' jazz" as I call it) genre is basically instrumental r&b grooves with a sax or piano improvising over it or a female singer. It's not jazz but its too late to say it isn't when most of the patrons have made those artists rich by buying the music and attending their shows and you can go to any record store jazz section or online search and find KG, David Sanborn, Dave Koz, etc in the jazz section. And it doesn't help that some of the many revered jazz artists have ventured into the waters of smooth jazz for a quick buck. Smooth jazz is jazz for people who hate jazz.
Kenny G isn't Jazz...
Kenny G is smooth jazz.
xxhardforcorexx which is like smooth shit... shit but smooth...
+Richard Brighton Right, shit, the stuff responsible for the slushing sound your head makes when it moves.
xxhardforcorexx no... I listen to John Coltrane...
So do I, thanks for confirming my point.
I said there is no GOOD or BAD music. You're the one who is still assimilating good music to "smart" and not being "superficial."
Wise words
Kenny is the Carrot Top of Music.
10 -4
LMFAO!!
This is good enough for a tshirt! Wear it and every musician you pass would stop you and shake your hand and ask where they could buy one. LOL
Different people enjoy different things. Everything you said can be applied to nearly every activity human beings actively engage in, be it sports, arts, literature, whatever. And like I said before, there's no lack of music in the world. The world wouldn't fall apart if Pat Metheny stopped making music.
If you have proof that Pat Metheny's music is able to do all the things you described, and Kenny G's isn't, I'll be happy to hear you out.
I listen to both kinds of music: country AND western!
Pat Metheny is a jazz great. One of the best I've ever heard play. He knows jazz. He just doesn't understand people's taste. When he plays, it's like a pizza with tomato paste, cheese, sausage, pepperoni, mushrooms, green peppers, onions, olives, pineapples, etc. And that's cool if you want all that on your pizza. Pat wants everybody to eat Pat Metheny pizza. To him, that the only way to serve up jazz music. Everybody doesn't want all those ingredients in their jazz music. Some people just want sausage and cheese Pat. That's what Kenny G serves his fans. At the end of the day, both pies are pizza pies. Different strokes for different folks. My definition of jazz is: 1. A melody. 2. An improvisation. 3.An ending to the song. That's what Pat does and so does Kenny G. Stop playa hating.
Love this analogy. You put your finger on something real, too: The plain cheese pizza with pepperoni will always, always outsell the artisan specialty pizza, even though the true connoisseur knows the artisan pizza to be superior in every way. Plain wins out every time with a mass audience every time. That's why we have pizza chains, and it's why Kenny G got rich off his music being played in elevators and shopping malls. Doesn't mean his music is any better or worse; that's just how the world works. Speaking for myself, I'll listen to Pat Metheny any night of the week. Not for the songs. For the whole album.
This is so true. And it really does not have to be either/or. Now that I'm in my 40s, I can say as a child of the 80s Kenny G is probably a big part of the reason why I began to explore jazz at all. I can enjoy Kenny G and, say, Ahmad Jamal at the same time. I never would have found the latter had it not been for those early Kenny G albums my sister and cousins played back in the day when I was just a kid.
This is taken completely out of context. If you don't mind spending a few minutes reading, then this is article written by Pat is more likely to paint a better picture:. Pat Metheny on why he's so disdainful of Kenny G: www.jazzoasis.com/methenyonkennyg.htm
Pat speaks the truth. Too blunt and too brutal for the weak of spirit, though.
johnsoncm65 Oh, yes. Because it matches your opinion, it's 'truth'. I used to think the exact same way, can't lie. But then I decided that accuracy is better than feeling 'right'. Even now, if you don't agree, tell me to go to hell. It's all subjective, but especially art. I would expect another artist to understand this.
@Buster Friendly its true SOME of his music can be abit lobby jazz, elevator music. but if you listen to his more jazz stuff, he is much more deep, in so many levels. that it cant even begin to compare. and musically Pat is just thousand times the musician K G is. just his compositions. Pat is not richard kliederman.
Jazzkeyboardist1 You are absolutely correct about Kenny being Mozart when compared to mainstream rap music
Pat Metheny showed himself to be a small man.
@@jvossos3855 I love pat but after hearing this, I feel little different about him. Not ina good way.
The long story that parallels this story.When I was 18 and a college DJ I soon burnt out on the Eagles,Zep, &. Mac after 5 million spins so I listened to Herbie Mann's Push Push.I liked Duane Allman and thought this is interesting( or more interesting than the same 3 chord Blues or Folk)This was my access to Jazz. At the time Herbie was a genius, he softened up an instrument most don't listen too, put some rock hooks in it and bang... money in the bank.Because of Herbie I listened to Miles ,Weather Report and Spyro Gyra.So Kenny is a one trick pony that introduces you to a larger circus,great I'm sure Herbie and Kenny could give a rip about what we think. They make themselves happy.Don't Hate, Create!
I’ve never realized how much Pat is like Kenny G until now
I've just been introduced to this drama, an your comment is a hot take if I ever saw one, and I am very, very, very intrigued.
Please would you be so kind to elaborate?
@@opposumness3107Pat and Kenny have same mother. This feud goes waaaaay back…
Lol Pat sounds like that one guy in music history class
Hahaha, always hilarious. Surprisingly low vibes from the master of high vibe music
The Jazz snobs and elitists are out for blood! George Benson and Stevie Wonder with 10 and 22 Grammys have both played with Kenny G on stage and recordings. That is humility and respect for your fellow musician. Its good to be courteous to your fellow musician even if you feel their music and skills are not up to snuff.
Pat is a great musician and great musicians should never talk shit about other musicians regardless the genre. I`m a saxophone player with degree in jazz but have been working with pop, wedding bands for many years now, that is what pay my bills so kudos to Kenny G for being super rich doing what most musicians hate. LMFAO
After what Kenny G did, I am glad pat spoke out against him.
Though I’m majorly into Pat Metheny music , yet I like to chill with some Kenny G at times as well …
Music is music … Why hate ?
I don't care how "silly" Kenny G's music might be, it sounds good. Of course it's not Jazz, but it's not bad if it sounds good. There's no such thing as bad music. There's just stuff you might not be into.
When people have been telling you that you are great for 50 years
Ive seen Kenny G rehearse backstage... and whilst warming up hes pulled off some of the most fantastic bebop lines out of the box, 'Muzak' = money, guess hes just sold his soul to the devil. Metheny is a Legend! he can have a say in music and Jazz whenever he wants!
Sorry Pat, but Kenny G’s music is beautiful! (Just like with the blues, you can sometimes say more with less)
Kenny G isn’t the best improviser in the world but he’s moved a lot of people’s souls with his artistry/craft.
No, it's crap music for crap people.
Big Swing Face Judging from your personality, (you’ve portrayed with your comment) the crap people hate him.
@@jazznotes3802 Thanks, Captain Crap.
Some people think Hallmark Christmas movies are moving. That doesn't mean they're good. Some people just fall for sentimental mush.
Kenny G's music may suck, but he definitely has a sense of humor about himself, something I doubt Metheny does: www.funnyordie.com/videos/db3a84286a/my-imaginary-friend-is-kenny-g
I'm a big Metheny fan, but I have trouble figuring out where all this vitriol comes from. All music is about personal taste - there is no objective good or bad, just what people like and dislike. The ugly comments are the antithesis of what Pat's music is all about.
+big dawg I agree that good or bad is completely subjective. But I do believe that there is a difference between mediocrity and greatness. And most serious jazz musicians that I've talked to think that Kenny G is a mediocre musician. A person with a musical ear can recognize that he plays out of tune, and hasn't worked on his pitch. Kenny G once had the potential to be great, but he sadly sold out to the general market, and now much of his music sounds the same.
It came from this: www.jazzoasis.com/methenyonkennyg.htm
Big picture...it doesn’t really matter...if a thousand years from now any musician is remembered from our time it would be surprising.
The complexity of music is a part of human evolution. I am a jazz saxophonist myself and I have been playing since I was 8 or 9 years old. I didn't like jazz at all when I started. I was more into more commercial music forms. When did I start listening liking jazz? Right when I realized that all the kids like me could easy play(improvise) noodling over any one-single-keyed 4X4- straight note song but none of us was able to improvise over "Giant steps".
I think it’s cause Kenny G has 12 platinum selling albums(48 million units)and Metheny has 3 gold albums. Who cares about Grammys, it’s the bucks.
PM is absolutely correct except for one thing:
If we put the structure, the music aside for a moment, and I don't think there's any question that PM is an absolute master playing his instrument while KG is pretty much a hack, if we think only about the actual tonal quality of KG's soprano sax, it's one of the more beautiful musical sounds you'll ever hear. If we think of the actual tonal quality of PM's guitar, especially the synth stuff, much of it is very good, but too high a percentage of it sounds like hammered dog shit, beautiful note choices notwithstanding.
To excel as a musician you have to know how to play and what to play. Both of them know how to play. PM knows what to play, while KG simply does not. He has a completely tin ear. But you also have to have an instrument that's pleasing to the ear, tin or not. KG's sax sounds a thousand times better than PM's guitar on most days.
PM had a problem that was fixable, yet he did not ever fix it. KG had a problem that was impossible for him to fix.
It's also pretty important to have a great band behind you. KG never did. PM had Lyle Mays, and a run of pretty great songs once he got out of the acoustic phase.
One thing they both have in common is that they have possibly the two worst haircuts ever.
You’re just jealous of KG’s hair
Wrong. Pat's tonal quality is much better than KG and his acoustic material is amazing.
@@joaquindelarosa1215 In your opinion, only, which is not based in fact. You are free to express an opinion, but that is not what we have here, is it.
You can't and don't know who might actually be 'wrong', (and are in no position to pronounce who might be). it could even be you.
Many of PM's songs have what I think is the worst tonal quality imaginable. God, do I wish he would bear down a little on that.
But he is also as good a musician as there ever was, and quite often, musicianship can transcend tonal quality.
KG has as GOOD a tonal quality as can be imaginable (but comparing soprano sax to guitar? Apples and oranges).
Despite that, I consider him about the WORST musician there ever was. Still, he was more successful.
But that is not a measure of ability. Tonal quality can NOT transcend musicianship.
It happens in all art, and art is never perfect. Dan Brown sold 300 million copies of a novel that had a seriously muddled Act II and a totally missing Act III. Go figure.
@@tomlewis4748 You are only basing your opinion on opinion, as well. However we all need to call it as we see it. I happen to believe pat metheny has amazing tone.
@@joaquindelarosa1215 You missed the point completely. Both of us are expressing opinions and not fact. Nothing wrong with that. That is actually what comments on YT are supposed to be.
I tried to be gentle and diplomatic about explaining what the point was, bc I am not someone who acts antagonistically, and I was cutting you half a break.
Where it goes wrong is when you present opinion AS IF it were fact. Which is exactly what you did above.
So many people who love & listen to KENNY G for different reasons the like listening to PAT METHENY also .
MUSIC IS MUSIC ..
To be fair this was done a while back so it would be interesting to see if PM still feels as strongly and even if it matters. I remember Kenny from The Jeff Lorber Fusion. As a kid this was my introduction into jazz soloing and the guy was pretty good, The problem is that instead of pursuing into Jazz, he sold out for cash. Kenny knows his stuffs not jazz but he found an audience willing to pay for wishy/washy melodies. Good luck to him but media must stop confusing people about what Jazz is.
Pat Metheny is excellent, and he is speaking the TRUTH! Kenny G has fooled many people into thinking that his music is good, but those people should not consider themselves fans of Jazz, they should consider themselves fans of Muzak :)
I absolutely love it!!
When you’re exploring the backrooms and run into Pat Metheny.
"Let's face it, that's the dumbest music there ever could possibly be in the history of human being, there could never be music any worse then that." HAHAHAHAHAHAHA so true.
Mainstream rap music takes the cake all day
I know, right? Sheer poetry, regardless of whether you agree or not.
If only he could've heard the gangster rap horseshit we've got in 2020. What would Pat have thought of Tekashi 69 or Cardi B? Kenny is fucken *Beethoven* next to that shite.
godisbollocks you know he’s still alive, right?
@@kidcharlemagne3044 I mean the Pat of 199_ or whenever that footage was shot.
There was a great Jazz Times cover with a photo of jazz great Kenny Garrett and a caption that read, "The Real Kenny G." I'm also reminded of a sign in our jazz station studio which was a take on a no smoking sign with the words, "No Kenny G" instead of a cigarette.
The ironic thing is Jan Garbarek, who i truly admire, sometimes sounds alot like Kenny G (e.g. on the CD "Visible World") and Pat has worked alot with Garbarek.
If it's wasn't for Lyle Mays.... he was what made PMG.... should have been the LMG.... RIP
There is something more to this. This is personal. Also Pat M has music without teeth as well.
Sure, Kenny G earns much more with his records ;-)
Okay but seriously, this clip is reminiscent of every armchair youtube comment music reviewer on every song older than 20 years talking about "now this is REAL music! not like today's garbage with it's autotune and sex and drugs, blah blah blah". I'm almost glad I'm not a bigger fan of him.
@ireneew12
I was surprised also.
However, Kenny G was good enough for George Benson! (ha ha!)
Benson has recorded with "G" many times..and George is the finest guitarist ever.
Frankly, in that moment, his disgust with Kenny Gorelick’s music was understandable. It was pretty damned insipid, and it did pervert the notion of what was Jazz for, if not an entire generation, then certainly multitudes of people ignorant to Jazz across various generations. I’d figure some of his resentment was probably compounded by the fact that the dude had some actual chops, yet chose to do THAT.
Is kind of sad to hear it like that, above all I'll expect Pat to show a bit more class and respect about music you don't like. Although I agree that Kenny G's music is mislabeled as jazz, I totally respect his space to play whatever he feels like playing, he has fans that support him and like his music and that's cool. There is something for for everyone, love Pat's music but I think he could have articulated this in a different way making it more diplomatic, no one owns the absolute truth.
I would add that even before social media and RUclips, it wasn’t hard to learn the difference between the giants of jazz and the commercial guys/schmaltzy guys/flavors of the month.
I agree I love Pat. But to be honest although Kenny might put out seemingly simple music. He is actually an incredible sax player . Just because he doesn’t choose the most complex lines on stage doesn’t mean he can’t play :)
@@99TECHN0TRASH Simple, complex… all I know is his music doesn’t interest me one bit.
@@SmelOdies Respect, not my favorite either ;) but I’ll still give the man his flowers.