This Could RUIN VINGEGAARD'S 2024 Tour de France
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- Опубликовано: 30 май 2024
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Steven Roche said, "Never let a climber get too far." He was talking about Delgado at the time. That is true in every race.
I'm a Malaysian here. Kinda weird to hear my country being mentioned on your channel but cool to know you had a great time doing the tour here!
imho, Chris is exactly right about 1) Sepp Kuss at last year's Vuelta (don't be ridiculous, guys) and 2) Jonas Vingegaard at this year's TDF. UAE will be watching him closely right from stage 1 and Tadej will be ready to take time from him on the last climbs if he can. His team needs to be in top form to keep that from happening in the early stages.
It seems like Visma can only beat Pog by having 2 GC contenders in their team, whereas UAE only have Pog.
@@paddymurphy-oconnor8255 Of course UAE has others capable of top 10 while working for Pogacar.
@@royoser9956 Maybe. But I have to say I didn't respect what Visma did to Tadej with the 3-against-1 thing they did in the Tour, I can't recall if it was last year or the year before. Jonas couldn't eat Pog on his own merits, so had to use his other 2 potential GC riders.
@@paddymurphy-oconnor8255 Yes. But that's road cycling -- a team sport.
@@paddymurphy-oconnor8255bs. Jonas didn’t have Primoz last year and Wout was a non factor. Jonas is obviously the purest climber in the high mountains and way more consistent over 21 days. There was only only 1 jumbo GC in the tour.
I don't mind the video being detailed and over my head. That's how I learn. My appreciation of the sport increases the more I know. And I learn the most from your channel. Congrats on the 80 K subscribers!
Ditto my friend. Thanks for writing that for me, I couldn’t have done it better myself.
Check out lanterne rouge too
Over our heads? We're not discussing quantum mechanics, Chris. I love to hear your opinions, especially those that go against popular opinion. That's where value is added, and it's fun to ponder an alternate viewpoint. However, give your listeners a little more credit. We can handle it. Geez.
Chris, The voice of reason 😎
🦋👊
I have been waiting for 20 years for my legs to flush-out so I can get on form.
Tru LASIX.
Quality commentary. In 2022 Jonas went to altitude prior to the tour to do some sessions that I’ve never seen released. I’ve heard his teammates talk of them but no specifics. In short 20-40min efforts on big high altitude passes is my guess. These are the bedrock or finishing polish to his tour form which has seen him beat Tadej the past two years. Perhaps it’s psychological Chris? To feel like he can go toe to toe with Pogi he needs to do his key sessions prior to the big RV in June/July?
Maybe this year building form at sunny sea level may be better?
We’ll see!!!!
Morning Chris, great call. I’m hearing you. Thanks man.🚴👍😎
Galibier! I drove behind Shanna Armstrong in September of '07 during LeTour Ultime & there were still "Armstrong" graffiti on the road, after Selfies she dropped down the other side into the night, spectacular view ever since the Bernard Thevenet poster for Peugeot in the '70's , peace3ed
🏔️🚵👊🦋
I always enjoy the perspective of a professional who’s been there and done that. The thing I will add is that training at altitude will increase the concentration of oxygen carrying red blood cells in the blood. It’s literally like natural EPO. If your training at altitude the oxygen concentration is lower so you are slowly starving your body of oxygen. As a result your kidneys produce natural EPO to stimulate red blood cell production and bingo a higher packed cell volume or hematocrit
Chris is very aware of the advantages of training at elevation. I know bc he rode w/Levi, who retired and moved to Lake Tahoe where he can ride at altitude for the rest of his life. Dog.
From what i understand it's more about living and sleeping on altitude, rather than training as such.
As far as i understand, riders train a lot on low altitude, but eat and sleep up high.
2100 is not enough altitude and 3 weeks is not long enough. That form and benefit vanishes after 1 week at sea level. They do it to mask their juice.
I remember Bassons going to an altitude hotel to train because he didn't want to take EPO. He said his blood values hardly changed and he didn't go again because he thought it didn't have a worthwhile benefit.
@@cncithe was wrong tho the science is pretty clear on what altitude does to your body
It is wrong to say Sepp Kuss was gifted the win. He worked hard for it, he earned it. But still Jonas and Primoz did hold back to honour his red jersey position.
The team threaded the needle to let their champions take stage wins, secure the podium but take the foot off the gas just enough not to pass Sepp Kuss. It was well calculated and they have achieved a perfect win as a team. The pinnacle of a perfect season.
Those guys did attack Sepp instead of honoring him & protecting the team leader. Social media changed their minds.
Primoz kept on attacking Sepp each time. All Jonas did was following Primoz, and morally caught in the middle. Primoz was the only one that didn't want to come into the fold and ride for Sepp. Maybe not a gifted won for Sepp, but the best rider over 3 weeks did definitely not win. Jonas was the strongest by a long way, Primoz and Remco were 2nd, Sepp was 4th.
@dandutch how the heck you forgot when Jonas started pushing to win stages saying , it's my daughter's bday , it's my cousin bday, it's my father bday It's my neighbour bday ...jajaja , they were holding back for sure , but sepp deserved it.
@@TC-ik9kn he went up the road to gain time and stage wins when he was 3 or 4 min down and 6th place on GC, he wanted to be in the running in case Sepp went bad on the time trial or one of the mtn stages. He stopped going solo up the road when he got into the top 2/3 and just followed Primoz
@@TC-ik9kn no doubt Sepp deserved it though, if nothing else for all the times he saved their bacon on GC in other races. 100% am stoked for Sepp. But he wasn't the best rider in course by a long way. Plus, I think it's unfair calling Jonas a bad teammate, because I don't believe he tried to get top spot at any point. He supported Sepp winning, but didn't want to lose to Primoz, so had to follow him in those last few stages that brought all the drama, including Chris dropping Jonas as his #1
Chris...we tune in because your race experience speaks volumes.
Nice listening to you. Thanks Chris. Have a great day.
Earlier this year, before Vingegaard got injured, Vingegaard seemed to me to be more skilled than he was last year, and I was thinking that he will most likely win this year's TdF despite Pogacar also increasing in skill and strategy. However, since Vingegaard's injury, I'm more open now to thinking Pogacar might win the TdF. I'm just not sure right now who will win.
I still can't see Jonas getting on the podium after that accident. I can see him winning the next 2-4 TdF afterwards but just not now
What were you watching? Really looked like ass on the tt bike. He had no good rides. His team got weaker so they couldn't control the race that is why the crash even happened. With the strong team he wouldn't be challenged. He is over without that team surrounding him.
@@dylangrantz8124 I was talking about how Vingegaard performed at this year's: O Gran Camino and Tirreno-Adriatico. He seemed to be more dominant, daring, and faster than before. It made me wonder if Pogacar has adapted to this.
@@regismonkton exactly Jonas finished 45th in that time trial against a field of nobody. Yep he won the others mountain stages against Bernal and a bunch of nobody.
Beating up on 20 year old Juan is not that impressive man.
Dude was in trouble long before the crash he looked like ass in everything that was not a huge climb
Agreed. It’s close between the three and maybe even Remco to ever bet your house on one rider. 👊🦋
Thanks for this content Chris. I am a big fan. Explaining strategy and mindset of the teams and individual riders for someone who knows nothing about road racing like myself makes your channel invaluable. This years TDF is going to be like The Hunger Games on bikes. Jonas better find a tree quick and hide in it...
Don’t know that I agree with you about Sepp Kuss. He’s a great guy, I’m a big fan and I’m glad he now has a grand tour under his belt but he was hired on as a super domestique. His role is to support Primoz and Jonas. Yes he was in the race lead after the breakaway but his role on the team is a support roll. Both Team leaders could have pulled away from him and taken the win at the Vuelta.
But part of that is the threat to go on and win if let up the road. Now people have to cover him if he goes, giving Jonas a free ride.
If Chris Froome gifted Brad Wiggins TDF, then yes, it was a gift to Sepp. But it’s more nuanced than that. Froome was the best there, but his role wasn’t to win, which is why he didn’t. He could have if Sky decided they were joint leaders. We are all probably just debating the definition of the word gift.
@@tonydaniels404Froome was not 3' stronger than Wiggins in the mountains. Wiggins had to pull on Toussuire at one point for Froome to recover and also on Peyresourde when Froome flinched.
I’m so excited to see if JV has successfully recovered. That last years TT was the most spectacular in TdF history.
That was an amazing TT! Lemond's TT to win the tour on the final day by 8s was pretty spectacular as well
Thanks Chris. Can’t wait until TDF. Would be great if they signed you on NBC/Peacock
Chris your analysis about Kuss not being gifted at the Vuelta was right on. Not only did Kuss win but how many guys rode all three grand tours last year and was in top form on all 3
Sounds good. The best TDF is one where everybody is healthy or close to it. I remember a couple back in the 70s or 80s when riders rode into top form during the race. Those were memorable.
👊💥🦋🪩🕺😜
Thanks Chris...I appreciate the effort YOU put in. !! And Garrett. Be well.
If Jonas shows up with that team he will play catch-up from day one! UAE will wear him out! Pog might be a bit worn from the Giro but he is visibly thinner than last year. I think he is going to be hard to beat. It would have been awesome to see Jonas vs Pog at top form. My money would still be on Pog. I’ve never seen a rider like him. Primoz is too old and Rimco is to unpredictable. Should be a very exciting TDF. I can’t wait. Love to watch Horners take on this stuff.
Super excited to see your TDL jersey and that you actually rode to Penang Is on Stage 2 where I live now since 2011. Several of us rode our bikes up to the iconic Teluk Bahang hill climb to watch the riders ride up from the other side, then ride down after the peloton had left. Was a treat for us Islanders to have the tour come to us! Amazed at the speed the guys rode up!! We ride these hills almost weekly. Yes, it's always warm so we ride in the early mornings, unlike the TDL. Please come back to visit Chris, cycling has grown bigger since.
The Sepp Kuss "gifted" discussion has some great legs 🤣
I love hanging around these guys. I always listen very closely. You never know what they might say. Very interesting is when they talk about doping.
🦵👊🦋
Sepp Kuss is also a skier, Visma Lease A Bike is probably the best cykling team in the world if they should compete in skiing. Those skiers has LARGE hearts. The big heart is a huge gift!
@savagepro9060 chris already explained to you how he wasn't gifted the win. If you're not intellectually capable of understanding this, then that's on you. But then again, a nobody cyclist like you probably thinks you know more than an ex pro.
@@erlendsteren9466 UAE is the best team the world.
Whether you're a Kuss fan or a Jonas fan you need them both to bring their absolute best! I personally think, that that Jorgenson will surprise in a positive way. I have a gut feeling that he might be able to win a Grand Tour one day. He seems to have the right mentality. Both calm and ambitious at the same time. Btw. I'm Danish and would like to see Jonas win The Tour again, but this year will be his biggest test ever.
"would like to see Jonas win The Tour again, but this year will be his biggest test ever."
@Chris Horner--You didn't mention the chesterfield today. Thank you.
He was obviously sitting at his desk studying routes and form! 🙂
Great video and job Chris. It’s that time of year to start watching all ya shows. Really ready for The Tour!🥵🚴
Always appreciate your detailed breakdowns Chris !
Go Chris! Best analysis on the Internet by far. Super insights on "gifting" I concur. Look forward to your insights, thoughts, commentary as always!
TDF podium in order of finish: Pogecar, Primos, Jonas
Forget Roglic. Ving’s participation is still far from certain, so i’ll say Ayuso, Pogacer and Evenepoel, in no particular order.
If Vingegaard makes the Tour, I'd be surprised if he gets a podium. They should let him recover and go for the Vuelta.
We also appreciate the insight Chris. It's good to hear some technical breakdown of the tactics and strategies instead of just fluff.
Epic video as usual!! Thank you
love this level of detail! keep it up Chris!
Great show ❤😊
Good evening dear Chris.....in my opinion it would be a miracle if Vingegaard makes the start of the TDF in good form.....normally anyone would need more than 3 months after suffering a Pneumothorax....but these cyclists have proven before that they are not normal....
You're right, Jonas is definitely not normal. I also think, even with a bone sticking out of his chest, he's a lock to start the TDF. 🛋️🦋
I punctured mine April 14 ish and then again two weeks later and I was at the TdF. 🤞🦋🦸♂️👊
@@ChrisHornerCycling really? Amazing...
Very fit bodies heal much quicker than "normal" ones.
@@ChrisHornerCycling this gives me a little hope. Him missing a few weeks of training and Tadej being on such great form still doesnt leave me thinking he will be able to compete much. Hope I'm wrong though.
I’ve never considered the altitude training question as Chris does, but it’s very interesting. I live in the high country of Colorado, I did a 100 mile MTB. race in Maine a few years back and was convinced I wold do well, how wrong I was, the heat and humidity kicked my ass.
There is another reason, Chris, for training in the sea level heat: the Tour is a lot warmer than the Giro, because of the time of year. The adaptation to extreme heat has to be taken seriously. You can train well at altitude but 200 km in 40 C heat in Southern France is a different show, in my opinion .
If it wasn't for Ving, Roglic wanted that Vuelta. If Visma did not control things and Ving defended attacks from Roglic, things would have been different in that tour. Kuss was strong but not stronger than his 2 teammates. They paid him with the tour win. So people are justified to state the narrative of "Gifted". You gotta go back to watch that Vuelta again.
Thanks, Chris.
From Ving's on bike announcement, that energetic enthusiastic sparkle seems absent, its like the crash has taken a big holistic toll, there's extra weight there and a visable difference in fitnes. He had so many injuries, I can't see him being ready to compete at the highest level in July, then again, with visma 's budget, he'll get world class care .
Tadej henchman list looks formidable. UAE will 100% try and snatch yellow on DAY 1. It seems to be the M.O. and I really dont think anyone pinning on a number is going to be able to stop them. I don't think it'll be a cake walk. You're spot on Chris, If they keep him close week 1 there's a good chance that UAE will rethink the "stomp day 1" approach. Tadej should be careful because guys @ the tour won't roll over and play dead to his attacks like at the Giro. Teams better figure out how to isolate and crack codes quick. If I were UAE I would wait until the TT to take the lead.
Visma TDF24 : Vingegaard, Kuss, Jorgenson, Kelderman, Kruijswijk, van Aert, Benoot, van Baarle,. Substitutions in case one of these riders doesn't make the Tour : Tulett, Laporte, Uijtdebroeks, Kooij, Tratnik.
I don’t see a world in which they don’t take Uijtebroeks, at worst, he’s their alternate GC and white jersey contender.
yep... nothing is carved in stone at this point... the final line up doesn't absolutely need to be sumitted until a day or two before the start... I am looking for a number of swap outs before all is said and done... post Dauphine and training results/form/evaluations, will dictate the final team...
@@josephsong8911 Why would they take him ?
I don't get the hype around him, he never podiums and apart from a vuelta stage last year he hasn't won anything in a while
@@WesternUranus what has he done? Lmao he’s 21, bet you wouldn’t say that about Vingegaard at 21, he placed 8 at the Vuelta with basically no team help, and he was the white jersey holder in the Giro until he had to pull out, AT 21 btw. Sorry that he doesn’t have Pogacar level talent, but he would still be much more useful as a mountain domestique than someone like Kriuijswijk whose 36 and hasn’t done much either recently, or someone between Benoot/kelderman/DVB who are all similar riders.
@@josephsong8911 I don't see a world in they do. He pulled out of the Giro with illness, I think that's what it was, hardly great preparation for the toughest race on the calendar
agree with your logic! Feel like they're trying too hard to check the "altitude camp" box
Love the show babe watchin all the time .
Tratnik is 34, Kruijswijk will be 37 in a week, van Aert is not there at all, Laporte did crash. Doesn't UAE's team look stronger?
No way they don’t bring Van Aert to the tour,but they’ll announce it shortly before the tour.
Van Aert might be Jonas’ best card
Wout we all hope is coming still and he’s game changer but yes, at this moment UAE absolutely do. 💪🦋👍
Perfect 👍🏽
You are the best !
Chris!! Need you as DS at Movistar...
Thank your effort, sorry to see and hear your analysis. May you kick your allergies
Sorry Chris that race would have been between Vingegaard or Roglic if they had raced for it at the end of the
Chris. Can you please do an episode of tactics of each team of the top 4 going into the Tour. The tactics will decide the tour if I've been understanding you. It's an open race but I'd put my dollar on Pog.
It was a gift from Jumbo Visma to Jumbo Visma.
Having the big 3 races won by 3 different riders is an accomplishment. Is as successful and as dominant as any team can be .
As for the win for Sep Kuss, nobody knows what the orders were from the team, still we have to wonder the reasons for Jumbo Visma to let Primoz go.
As a team manager or owner I wouldn't dismantle a winning team. Something to think about.
You love the heat.
I always loved the heat. 🔥🔥🔥🔥👊🦋
Hey Chris I was reading that there seems to be a trend of riders reducing the lengths of their cranks, Tadej was reported as using 7mm shorter cranks this year, including at the Giro. Is there really a trend and does it improve performance? Interested in your views
Yes, it works.
Most former Grand Tour champions, like Chris Froome and Egan Bernal, have just not been able to return to their earlier form, after their own horrific injuries. Whether Vingegaard with his unique physiology - aided by Visma LAB's doctors and trainers - can do so is very much up in the air at the moment. Having said that, I don't think he has anything to lose and a lot to gain by starting the TdF. If he cannot win, he has 'plausible excusability' on account of his injury. Whereas if he does win, his victory will be burnished that much more and give him an even bigger psychological edge over Pog in future Grand Tours.
Froome's and Bernal's were far worse crashes with much worse injuries, you can't compare this to the kind of crash Jonas had at the Basque Country. Their crashes could have been career ending. I don't think he has anything to lose starting the TdF, and you're right if he's not back up to speed he'll have an excuse, although he's not had to have that much time off so I think he'll be fine. Whether he can do what he's done to Pogačar the last few years I don't know, Pog looks a different beast this year, but he's not really been tested yet so we'll see.
JV also won’t have Roglic or Van Hooydonk (can’t spell Dutch names, sorry) at this year’s tour supporting him either. So the support/chemistry will be another variable to consider.
@@maddexq9107 That's true but I think they have brought in some very good replacements. Maybe not on the level Rog was at but having co-leaders can create issues as well if everyone isn't buying into the team winning and have personal ambition, which most riders do have. Also there will be no JV chemistry because it isn't JV anymore (but I know what you mean)!!!
@@maddexq9107 Your Dutch spelling is probably better than mine!!!
yeah i remember your 2013 win, it must of felt great to be on the podium with 2 of the greatest riders of that time either side of you, i know i would of been over the moon & honoured to be in the same class,
this years tour will be interesting as we can all see that pogacar is clearly in superior form, lets just hope he hasnt peaked to early in the season this year, but he seems to just be getting stronger the more he rides, roglic has been quiet this season compared to other seasons & jounas we will have to see how fit he has been able to get after injury, either way the grand race will be an interesting one this year with most if not all the pressure on joanus to defend.
Love from Malaysiaa. And yes very hot and humid here 😂
Thanks for addressing the SK win. Absolutely on point and needed to be said.
We don’t know if Jonas will do any heat training or not. He still has time to do so.
Doubt he’ll be ready though, if he’s not on form and loses time the he’ll probably drop out.
Pogacar will probably win by minutes. I am sure they will try to put it away early and let him wear the yellow to the end. Pogacar is aggressive and wants to put his stamp on his legacy.
I agree with you Chris, Sepp earned that win when Jonas and Primoz weren't in form as Sepp took the lead. As you talked about how suddenly form shows up, I believe that's what happened with Jonas and Primoz during the last quarter of the Vuelta which was impressive to watch, and it helped Sepp win the Vuelta. Wout may be in form for the Tour de France, but I fear he has competing ambitions for the tour which aren't in sync with the GC ambitions. Hopefully there's enough glory for Wout to work within the team if he goes to the Tour.
Kuss got the Jersey when the peloton, focussing on Jonas and Rog, allowed him to go into the break. And he kept it because his team stopped the stronger guys Jonas and Rog from attacking him. It was a tactical win. Nothing to do with him being stronger.
Visma Lease A Bike is a BIG team. If a couple of the TDF riders is out of form they can throw in other super-bikers. On the development team they maybe have the best climber-kid in the world, Jørgen Nordhagen (But I am not sure if its enough to be the best kid in a superhard three week ride). Visma also has Darren van Bekkum, Menno Huising and Johannes Staune Mittet and a lot of very strong riders.
Good point about Kuss and QS's tactical mistake.
It could be argued that Vingo DID let Kuss win by not pulling with Roglic on Angliru. Right move as it would have really looked bad.
Sepp Kuss Vuelta 23 was gifted by Jumbo not allowing to race till the end. Roglič was betrayed they alredy pay for it!
That's ridiculous.
Huh?
Have all riders go solo if you think there shouldn’t be team leaders. A free for all would be interesting as you would have no team mates to pull on the flat and draft on the hills.
You know that sepp kuss was better than all the other GC riders at the vuelta right?
Primos was some minutes back.
True that. Jonas is going to come off that mountain altitude training... with zero heat acclimation. How on earth is that a good plan for a July race? I agree. He should be down in the thick air riding in the heat.
I’m sure the brains trust at Visma have this covered.
If Jonas gets dropped, he can also call on Marc Soler who may go rouge and help him close the gap to his teammate Pogacar 😂 we’ve seen it before. Great take as usual and keep up the good work!
The discussion on Kuss and Chris' Vuelta win brings up some interesting questions about recovery and peaking in cycling (which I know 0.0 about). For example, I'm wondering if Sepp Kuss had an "on" year last year where he peaked at the Vuelta (very similar to Chris' experience?). Is Sepp Kuss recovering this year (so, being on for entire year really took that much out of him?) and aiming to peak for the TDF? Anyone have any info on the science of peaking and recovery at this level? Cycling really seems to be a league of its own with not only incredible endurance, but power as well.
Exactly! Not a gift. They had the chance gaining time in the TT but they could not. A moment on the Angliru but was just a few seconds. Landa was his best teammate then ironically. Nonetheless; never attack your teammate!
I love this channel
❤️🦋👊🙏
Chris I can understand not being ready to do the Dauphine. But why not do Switzerland to get race miles but not go there to win.
I'd look to bag a Vuelta if I were Ving, no stress, he has 2 tours, he could do more bad than good forcing recovery.
Chris according to the numbers this year so far. Pogi is currently at 6.8-6.9 watts per kilo. Rumor has it he will be a 1kg lighter at the Tour. Jonas need to hit those numbers to have a chance to beat him again.
Pogacar will look to take time and effectively win the TdF in the opening week before Vingegaard can ride his way into his top shape.
I was thinking same
I agree , he Will lead big time , nomally vinge would strike back in week 3 but oneone maybe not Even vinge knows where he is , lokking forward to next year poggi wins this
The weather at the TDF will also be a factor. Pogacar doesn't operate at his absolute best when it's hot, others need to use this as a weapon.
Hey Chris,
Absolutely, the team Jonas is with going to the Tour looks about as intimidating as a bunch of cyclists on tricycles, dare I say weak. No van Aert is another blow. Of course, Jonas is exceptional rider, but I'm afraid the tables have turned on him. In 2022, he had a supersquad and the tactics were fantastic. The chaos worked for him too when it was him, Primoz, and GT racing against Tadej. In 2023, Tadej's preparedness was affected by the injury. Even if he had come without an injury, I'm not sure Pog could have done anything against Jonas back then. Now it looks like the situation is reversed, that and the fact that Pog is on another level-an alien level-because it seems like nobody can fly with him. I mean, if he starts sprouting antennas, I won't even be surprised!. The quality of teammates and Jonas' injury are not working in his favor. It's like he's bringing a butter knife to a sword fight!
Van Aert is likely going. He's joining Jonas for training this weekend
Visma have some praying to do that’s for sure and some prayers better get answered quickly. 🙏🤞🦋👊
Did Chris had a few glasses of wine 🍷?
Liking it 😉
💯
Wine? No. Chris is a Tequila man.
Think he's a bit sick. Get well Chris
I’m sick still from the allergies. 🥲🦋😂👊
With your mom.
Chris -oops- I think it was Alejandro Valverde rather that Joachim Rodriguez on the podium with you and Vincenzo Nibali. You sound like you are sick. I hope it is just a cold and you recover quickly. I love your commentary!
Chris what if Jonas can’t hang onto his teammates. Does he let Kuss or Jorgensen fly or not?
I think that they should let one of them help Jonas while the other one stays with pogi remco and primoz if he Can. Honestly,I think that pogi will be unstoppable but I am not neutral so we'll see !
IMO you have to race to maintain your top end speed. Look for his opponents to isolate and him early. One of his teammates will have to jeep in the race until he hits top form.
Ok, to be fair. Sepps win on Vuelta was not gifted but also to be fair Chris, also there was no “left and right” attacks from Jonas and Primož. Jonas yes, but not Primož. He stay with Sepp when Jonas was attacking left and right, consequently losing second place to Jonas. So he only attacked on one stage and this attack would be a very different story if Jonas would stay with Sepp like Primož did in two previous stages. Do you agree?
Well Roglic was the one who wanted to race for it. Jonas wanted to win some stages to not waste his time at the race. One pull from Jonas on angliru and he wins the race, the difference was like 8 seconds or something. It's all been well documented.
@@Kn0s Jonas went for the win on the stage where initial plan was to attack win with Primož and not jeopardise Sepps overall. But Primož still wait with Sepp when Jonas was not playing agreed team tactics and this cost him second place. I think Primož would be more than happy with second place and Sepp wining as there was more important battle with Jonas for internal team ranking as Jonas as TDF winner was above him. And it’s hard to accept not to race for yourself anymore when Jonas still can
@@kurnik2462 this stage has been discussed to death on the forums. The way I see it is this - the last Visma dom was done and something needed to happen. Jonas asked and got greenlight to attack, so they didn't need to set tempo with a leader. That the time difference was anything real was because of the absolute clown show of the competition. Normaly this climb makes much smaller difference. What the plan in the morning was meant nothing if your doms can't bring them in for Roglic's little stomp.
Again Jonas didn't want to really race for it from the first rest day, Roglic wanted to. This is from their own mouth in the different behind the scenes docs.
Roglic and Jonas were TOLD to back off. How that can't be a gift?
@@savagepro9060 still butt hurt, eh??
Also, with Jonas, training in the wet always puts one at risk of picking up a chill which is not good leading up to the Tour De France.
I don’t think weather would affect actual training that much these days. Do it in the trainer if push comes to shove. However, with bad weather 🌦️ , you are more likely to get sick. That got to be the bigger worry for Jonas.
None of this is gonna matter. UAE will employ the same tactics that Jumbo did last year. They will put so much TSS on Jonas that he will eventually crack. It was just math last year. Pog didn’t have enough time to train and they knew the maximum effort he could handle. So they put him over that limit.
Jonas is due the hiccup that comes to every top rider. How he will overcome this hiccup will truly define him.
He already broke his femur. That's quite a hickup
@@LarsRyeJeppesen agreed and how he comes back and into form during the Tour will be defining, or he will lose. Certainly not seeing Van Aert on the list of riders isn’t a good thing, but I am wondering if his time is short.
good point on Soudal actually gifting Sepp the Vuelta..but thats a one off now that Sepps a known qty
Chris if you look at Jorgensen’s race on Puy de Dome last year does that show he is talented on the larger mountains? He was able to stick with Pogacar and Vingegaard up that climb and like you said he’s even stronger now.
It's the consecutive mountain days that usually get the bigger guys like Jorgensen. Take Brandon McNulty for example, he had good days in the Tour too, but not really any back to back big days where there is 4 dudes left in the front group.
WVA needs to ride the TDF. Olympics are just a TV spectacle
I've had similar experiences to Chris, being a pure climber, I could be creeping leading up to a race, then hit the huge climbs and my form would transform and I would suddenly be absolutely flying.
Curious as to why Tratnik is on the TdF team and not Kelderman. He was pretty instrumental in last years race. And agree on Van Aert needing to be there if healthy. Even at 90% hes a better option than LaPorte right now
I really want to see a fit Jonas at the Tour, and see him and Visma smash Pog and UAE.
Let’s hope Jonas is able to at least ride competitively in the Tour. We all wanted the top 3 riders racing against each other and were looking forward to the biggest race on the calendar. Unfortunately two of those riders crashed early on in the season. Remember Pogi crashed last year before the 23TdF. Did a great job keeping the race exciting but coming in at 99% against Visma was a forlorn hope. Going to be a similar experience for Jonas this year I think. Better for Sepp to be given the lead. Jonas should recover properly, miss the Tour and go for the Vuelta in reality.
there could be something more nefarious going on at altitude. ive heard discussion about how riders who are changing addresses/are more expensive to visit, could be less likely to be visited by anti-doping. they have budgets and have to spend them wisely, might not be worth it for them to test one rider on a mountain vs a whole team at sea level.
love jonas though, i want to see him in best form for the tour
Dosnt a punctured lung mean your lung is now scared, and would that not affect ones cardio if part of your lung is scared and that scared part won't be working the same??
Case by case of course like every injury but a punctured lung can heal and have no negative affect on the athlete. 🤔🤞🦋👍
I think Wout will end up on that team probably for Van Barle whos also had a terrible season, Kuss, Jorginson and Van Aert pulling for Jonas would be quite something though, UAE team is full of killers for this race, remco and his ego will want his team on the front also (probably completely the wrong tactics), bora will want to show they are strong enough to ride, Ineos can take a back seat and if they play it smart could suprise alot of people, if they start putting all 3 leaders (pidcock, Rodriguez and Thomas) into breakaways in the mountain's and make UAE and Jumbo have to makr a decision on wether to chase it could be very interesting, this is Geraint's last ever tdf, do something different, take a chance and go in the breakaway, make the other teams have to make a decision, i just hope all the favourites can make it through to week 2 without crashing and this could well end up as the greatest tdf we have ever seen
Sometimes I just ride and ride and ride, and wonder, will I ever be fit again? And then, it’s like popping out of a dark tunnel, and all of a sudden, it’s easy again……
Why aren't we talking about Kuss in the same breadth as Remco, Jonas and Pogi? He won a GT and he's not in the GC discussion. That's odd.
Cause he is not in their league
@@richardwolf6269 clearly
Matteo Jorgenson or Sepp Kuss should be the Visma-leaders at Tour of France! Jonas Vingegaard could be a great help for beeing a little bit competitiv against the best team ever seen at the Tour of France ...UAE Emirates
Well, according to Tim Heemskerk, Jonas' coach, Jonas won't go if he isn't in with a chance for the win and if he's at that level, well, then neither Kuss nor Jorgenson can touch him.
What if UAE impose the same tactics against Jonas as Jumbo Visma did last year against Pogacar? Jay Vine words - As Pogacar lost 4-5 weeks on the bike his CTL (Chronic Training Load) was well bellow his targeted CTL before TDF. Then Visma (knowing this) rode every stage (from the start) ridiculously hard trying to put as many TSS (Training Stress Score) to Pogacar. What they did is made Pogacar form (after 2 weeks) go thru his ass or negative 90 because Visma didn't allow any time for Pogacar recovery and without the base and high CTL there is impossible to survive 3 weeks if the tempo is always 100%. Can UAE do this to Jonas or will they be more conservative with Rogla and Remco in the mix?
I I was UAE I would absolutely try to destroy Vingegaard in the first week because he is the only one that could beat pogi in my opinion. The problem is that pogi looks much better than the previous years and even when he won the TDF back in 2020 and 2021. Lets wait and see!
I really want a reply from you.....i am a huge fan...🇺🇲🏴✌️
The secrecy behind Vingegaard’s condition leads to the obvious answer: We just don’t know.
theres no sun and warm here in Europe anyway for the time being !