Vyborg is located in an area that has traditionally been Finnish (and Swedish too, because Finland has been part of Sweden quite a long time :)) - so until 1944 it was a Finnish town.
Alussa näkyvää Viipurin kirjastoa on remontoitu jo lähemmäs 20 vuotta. Käytännössä restaurointiin käytettävät voimavarat menevät lähinnä lisävaurioiden estämiseen. Yhtenä erikoisuutena rakennuksessa on, että sen jotkut osat valaistaan luonnonvalolla pyöreiden kattoikkunoiden kautta.
I'm Vepsian... Viipuri was never Russian... But my dad was under Russians... and I'm still want to be vepsian? Vepsians forever! YOU know who the vepsians are?
And remember what was the unofficial name for the Vyborg Governorate area when it was annexed to the Grand Duchy of Finland in 1809? It was called "Old Finland" back then...
@azdbio I take it that you are a Russian, I have no issues with that. The key point here is that Viipuri was taken by the USSR in an unjust war.The Soviet claim that Finland posed a threat to Leningrad and this was like saying that Belgium posed a threat to Hitler.Russia should return Viipuri to Finland and admit that their war against Finland was a dastardly act, but they won't return it and the sun will still rise tomorrow morning.
Toivonpa tosiaan, että joku päivä Venäjällä olisi niin viisas kaveri päämiehenä, joka ymmärtää palauttaa Viipurin ja sen lähiseudut Suomelle. Ehkä taas olisi jonkinlaisten "korvausten" paikka, että noin kävisi. Olisiko Suomalaiset siihen valmiita? Itse uskon, että kyllä.
@HHHPPP8 Finnish forces were north of Leningrad but they did not surround the city. Nor did Finland bomb or shell Leningrad. Mannerheim refused to commit Finnish forces to the siege of Leningrad.Finland even returned all of the relics to the churches on Kihzi Island, the Russian tour guide told me that herself last year when I was in Russia.
@HHHPPP8 That's were the front was, can't change location of the front. How ever, no Finnish artillery shelled Leningrad (though they were close enough), no Finnish controlled airfields were used to bomb Leningrad, no Germans were allowed to attack from the Finnish section. Finland didn't take part to the blockade. Not saying Finns are saints or anything (no side is) but will strictly say Finland didn't take active part to the siege of Leningrad, front just happened to be where it was.
I hope you understand there was no systematic killing of russian civilians in east karelia. Many were prisoned for fears of loyalty, yes, but much of the deaths were caused by the nationwide food shortage in winter 1941. Also many of them were old people you did not evacuate. Old people tend to die quick. When finnish troops left Petrozavodsk during 1944, they even left for the civilians a weeks supply of food! Wasnt that fair of us?
@StatusFennica Thanks for interesting videos about Vyborg =) I think that borders won't be changed. It is unreal now. Why do you think that it is becoming future, I wonder?
Viipuri is Finnish, Breslau and Konigsberg are German. One day these lands will return to their rightful owners whether by diplomatic negotiation or by the force of arms.
@JohQx3 But the Finnish forces cut off the northern outlet for the refugees and generally just blocked all the way north to the city. Otherwise they would not have had to create the Road of Life.
Aloita lukemalla 10 osainen "Suomen kansan aikakirjat" niin asiat valkenee. Sitä ennen on turha tulla höpisemään. Viipuri made in area of Finland by finnish. Thats a real fact! Turha urputtaa, typerät viestit tulen poistamaan koska mielestäni asioista tietävien ei tarvitse lastenkaltaisten kanssa keskustella. Suomenkielen taitosi viittaa myös siihen että olet ryssä. Onko karmaisevaa tajuta se totuus että Viipuri on suomalaisten kaupunki?
Some internment always happens when invading enemy territory. It can't be helped, it's to avoid "backstabbing". The invasion of east Karelia until lake Svir was necessary for our survival and security. The river made a good natural barrier against USSR attacks. Also it was to give us a card during possible peace negotiations, so that we could trade the invaded area back. Your not from a small country struggling for its survival, you could never understand. This reply-chain has grown too big.
The Stalin Soviet Government commited a criminal act by invading Finland in 1939. The poor Russian soldiers paid a very high price in material and human lives for that invasion. However, Russia must now do the honorable gesture and peacefully return all Finnish land to the pre-1939 borders that include Viipuri and all of the Karelia. Kunnia Isamnaa!
@azdbio Then, we can say by your reasoning that large areas of Russia belong to Sweden because these lands were Swedish provinces during the 16 th and 19 th centuries.Again, I have no issues with Russia or Russians and St. Petersburg is one of my favorite cities in the world even though it was built by Swedish and Finnish prisoners. But anyway, I will forgive you for this misdeed.
@NHLGodfather well in that case, USA can give California and Texas back to Mexico too. And Great Britain give back Northern Ireland to Ireland. And Israel give back their land to the Palestinians. And Kosovo given back to Serbia. And Skåne given back to Denmark, And Istria back to Italy. And Macedonia back to the Greeks. And Australia back to the Aborigines. You see where this is going??
If it werent for the Winter war, St. petersburg would not have had the northern route in the first place. Everything north/west of St.petersburg was Finland until 1939. St. Petersburg itself was founded on finnish land.
Fins are immigrants from Asia. Finland was populated by the Indo-European people before they colonized this land. There is no reason to talk about the past.
youdjin, you said Viipuri is Russian town. You should read European history books instead of Soviet history books to know and learn the facts. Even Soviet Union cant change the history. Have you ever wonder why old buildings in Viipuri doesnt look like Russian build?
To Satarti: It is a pity that such a man got such a power like Stalin did. It was a pity to Russian nation and it was a pity also for Finnish nation. Stalin did horrible mistakes in Russia and in Finland. It would be good for all to recognize those mistakes and correct those we can. If Russia would return Finnish areas that were criminally taken in ww2 it would show new side of Russia to the whole world, confidense and glory. Kuusinen were in his thoughts more Russian than Finnish.
In Finland we are Strong and anybody cannot harm us. If we say Viipuri belongs to us it really mean it Russians are weak always.I know it and I have seen it. Soon you will say Karelia belong to Finland. Very soon.
RussianBoxer84 Varjagian vikings established whole state of Russia and ruled it many hundred years. Rurik was a varjagian warlord from Scandinavia (I think that from Finland´s area), who moved with his family/tribe and army to Russia and established the Russia´s first royal dynasty. The Chronicle of Nestor tells about it. Ivan the Terrible was the last Czar from Rurik´s dynasty. Viborg was the center of Karelia before the Kingdom of Sweden borned. Novgorod´s tries to conquer Viborg failled.
@HHHPPP8 Finland did not participate in the blockade of Leningrad, this is a historical falsehood. On the contrary, it was Finland's refusal to participate in the siege of Leningrad that prevented the Germans from conquering city. This is another reason why Russia should return Viipuri to Finland.
"The invasion of east Karelia until lake Svir was necessary for our survival and security" - only don't acquit all your allies by means of the word "survival"! All of you spoiled to us a lot of blood!
True... What do you know about the truth? Remember August 2008 and Georgia. "For every Finn you killed, atleast 5 Russians were killed in return" - and what about the residents of Leningrad?
Join prokarelia and make finland have back salla kuusamo territory petsamo karelia and the 4 gulf of finlanf islands hogland lövskär tyterskär and seitskär 😁
Youre silly. You support the destruction and slavicization of finno-ugrics All North Russia was finno-ugric. St.petersburg is only 300 years old. Finns dont hate slavs as a group, we just dislike Russia for its imperialism.
@HHHPPP8 Perhaps some Finnish forces did not let refugees pass through their lines, this may have occurred, I do not know for sure.But it was Germany, your ally, that laid waste to your country and conducted a siege of a city with civilians[ this is amoral]. Anyway, I don't want to re-fight WW2. I have no problems with Russia or Russians, I actually like Putin.
@HHHPPP8 Yup, as I said, we aren't saints either. Don't really know how close the front actually was, but of course Finns couldn't let Russian civilians to get behind them...saboteurs and partisans would've instantly been cutting phone lines, railways etc. All in all, I don't think Finns would've actually cared less for Russian civilians during the war...Finnish civilians were bombed practicly daily during Winter War (like my grandfather saw his little sister to burn to death by incendiary bomb)
And how about the fact that you have built 17 camps in Karelia, not counting the seven camps in the Petrozavodsk? Kinnasvaara, Paal, Heposuo, Tahuilov, Vidlitsa...
@villanovakid84 But Finland has participated in virtually surrounded Leningrad. The Finnish army has occupied all northern approach to a city and cut off exits from a city in the north.
@azdbio I like Russian people,but you did not answer my question about the illegality of the Winter War when Finland was attacked without justification and 1/10th of Finnish territory was annexed by the USSR. If you agree with me comrade that this was an unjust war, wouldn't justice be served of Russia returned Viipuri to Finland and the rest of the land that was looted by the Bolsheviks in 1940? I am not advocating that Vyborg be taken by military force, that is not feasible.
"spoiled to us a lot of blood!"? Your English is an atrocity. We could have done somuch more. Leningrad would have fallen if we had helped the Germans with 300 000+ troops, hundreds of artilleries etc. You should be grateful.
Civilians were not sent to the nazis. Finland did trade soviet POWs with germans for Ingrian finns. You have roughed karelia up pretty good. Karelians are now only a 8 percent minority in their own land, before WW2 this was atleast 20. Thousands of karelians were executed and sent to siberia, for having karelian/finnish surnames, whos the racist now? Viipuri is 100 percent finnish/finno-ugric, you destroyed our culture when you replaced the original population with fakes from all over USSR
RussianBoxer, you should read your history. Try to read historybook which has not written by soviet language if you want to know the truth. You can burn all soviet historybooks and buy some foreing books. Start new life as educated man!
RussianBoxer84 Part of people here do not realise that Viborg is older than it´s official founding year 1293. It is older than the Kingdom of Sweden. It was a trade place and Karelian fortress (a finnish tribe, finnish tavastians and swedish tribes populated South Karielen) against Novgorod before the Kingdom of Sweden borned. Hurray really for Rurik, he and varjagians commonly established Russia. It was forbitten to tell those things during the Soviet era in Russia (how Russia borned).
We're sorry Finland is so close to St. Petersburg. You speak as if we imprisoned every single russian, This is a lie. Also it has nothing to do with the siege.
RussianBoxre, you seem to be arrogant child. Please do not contact here anymore. When you know the same history about Viipuri as world do then you can write. Now go educate yourself.
@NHLGodfather That land is useless anyway, and Finland didn't need it at all to rebuild into what it is today. Instead you should be glad Finland paid a small price compared to the countries of Eastern Europe who were invaded by the Soviet Union for almost 50 years. Indeed Finland got away easy compared to most others. Today's Finland has one of the best educations and the economy is strong. Who needs Karelia? Stop living in the past.
As Sareth987, I hope it too and let our hope come true! But anyway, it is not a hope, it is becoming future! Thanks for message Sareth987!
Vyborg is located in an area that has traditionally been Finnish (and Swedish too, because Finland has been part of Sweden quite a long time :)) - so until 1944 it was a Finnish town.
Alussa näkyvää Viipurin kirjastoa on remontoitu jo lähemmäs 20 vuotta. Käytännössä restaurointiin käytettävät voimavarat menevät lähinnä lisävaurioiden estämiseen. Yhtenä erikoisuutena rakennuksessa on, että sen jotkut osat valaistaan luonnonvalolla pyöreiden kattoikkunoiden kautta.
Kiitos RUclips, kun annat ihmisten sanoa kuin asiat on!
Yeah, Novgorod and Sweden ruled that area long time ago, but the civilian population has been mainly Finnish-Swedish-Russian-Karelian...
I'm Vepsian... Viipuri was never Russian... But my dad was under Russians... and I'm still want to be vepsian? Vepsians forever! YOU know who the vepsians are?
And remember what was the unofficial name for the Vyborg Governorate area when it was annexed to the Grand Duchy of Finland in 1809? It was called "Old Finland" back then...
@azdbio I take it that you are a Russian, I have no issues with that. The key point here is that Viipuri was taken by the USSR in an unjust war.The Soviet claim that Finland posed a threat to Leningrad and this was like saying that Belgium posed a threat to Hitler.Russia should return Viipuri to Finland and admit that their war against Finland was a dastardly act, but they won't return it and the sun will still rise tomorrow morning.
Toivonpa tosiaan, että joku päivä Venäjällä olisi niin viisas kaveri päämiehenä, joka ymmärtää palauttaa Viipurin ja sen lähiseudut Suomelle. Ehkä taas olisi jonkinlaisten "korvausten" paikka, että noin kävisi. Olisiko Suomalaiset siihen valmiita? Itse uskon, että kyllä.
@HHHPPP8 Finnish forces were north of Leningrad but they did not surround the city. Nor did Finland bomb or shell Leningrad. Mannerheim refused to commit Finnish forces to the siege of Leningrad.Finland even returned all of the relics to the churches on Kihzi Island, the Russian tour guide told me that herself last year when I was in Russia.
@HHHPPP8 That's were the front was, can't change location of the front. How ever, no Finnish artillery shelled Leningrad (though they were close enough), no Finnish controlled airfields were used to bomb Leningrad, no Germans were allowed to attack from the Finnish section. Finland didn't take part to the blockade. Not saying Finns are saints or anything (no side is) but will strictly say Finland didn't take active part to the siege of Leningrad, front just happened to be where it was.
I hope you understand there was no systematic killing of russian civilians in east karelia. Many were prisoned for fears of loyalty, yes, but much of the deaths were caused by the nationwide food shortage in winter 1941. Also many of them were old people you did not evacuate. Old people tend to die quick.
When finnish troops left Petrozavodsk during 1944, they even left for the civilians a weeks supply of food! Wasnt that fair of us?
Btw, many russians thank Finland for not allowing Nazi germany to use our territory for bombing etc.Some say the finns saved St.Petersburg.
@StatusFennica
Thanks for interesting videos about Vyborg =)
I think that borders won't be changed. It is unreal now. Why do you think that it is becoming future, I wonder?
Viipuri is Finnish, Breslau and Konigsberg are German. One day these lands will return to their rightful owners whether by diplomatic negotiation or by the force of arms.
Выборг... Финнский город... Очень сложно с этим смириться. Вепсы с Выборгом навсегда. я, по крайней мере... Спасибо.
Tulee vielä aika ,että Viipuri on jälleen suomalainen kaupunki ,ryssät on ajettu rajan toiselle puolelle .
@JohQx3 But the Finnish forces cut off the northern outlet for the refugees and generally just blocked all the way north to the city. Otherwise they would not have had to create the Road of Life.
Aloita lukemalla 10 osainen "Suomen kansan aikakirjat" niin asiat valkenee.
Sitä ennen on turha tulla höpisemään.
Viipuri made in area of Finland by finnish. Thats a real fact!
Turha urputtaa, typerät viestit tulen poistamaan koska mielestäni asioista tietävien ei tarvitse lastenkaltaisten kanssa keskustella.
Suomenkielen taitosi viittaa myös siihen että olet ryssä. Onko karmaisevaa tajuta se totuus että Viipuri on suomalaisten kaupunki?
Some internment always happens when invading enemy territory. It can't be helped, it's to avoid "backstabbing".
The invasion of east Karelia until lake Svir was necessary for our survival and security. The river made a good natural barrier against USSR attacks. Also it was to give us a card during possible peace negotiations, so that we could trade the invaded area back.
Your not from a small country struggling for its survival, you could never understand.
This reply-chain has grown too big.
Siat, tääon provosointia!!!
Look who's talking!
@villanovakid84 But Finland did not allow refugees to flee across the northern part of town.
Viipuri was always ethnically finnish.
Not now though
The Stalin Soviet Government commited a criminal act by invading Finland in 1939. The poor Russian soldiers paid a very high price in material and human lives for that invasion. However, Russia must now do the honorable gesture and peacefully return all Finnish land to the pre-1939 borders that include Viipuri and all of the Karelia. Kunnia Isamnaa!
@zheka1780, Can you write any sophisticated language instead of that cave man mur mur? Do you use spear to hunt your daily meal?
@azdbio Then, we can say by your reasoning that large areas of Russia belong to Sweden because these lands were Swedish provinces during the 16 th and 19 th centuries.Again, I have no issues with Russia or Russians and St. Petersburg is one of my favorite cities in the world even though it was built by Swedish and Finnish prisoners. But anyway, I will forgive you for this misdeed.
I know what does it mean. I wanted to ask - who did he mean saying these words.
@NHLGodfather
well in that case, USA can give California and Texas back to Mexico too. And Great Britain give back Northern Ireland to Ireland. And Israel give back their land to the Palestinians. And Kosovo given back to Serbia. And Skåne given back to Denmark, And Istria back to Italy. And Macedonia back to the Greeks. And Australia back to the Aborigines.
You see where this is going??
Joka laulaen tulee,se viheltäen menee.Kuten Viipurissa.
This message is to nurmiar.....
If it werent for the Winter war, St. petersburg would not have had the northern route in the first place. Everything north/west of St.petersburg was Finland until 1939.
St. Petersburg itself was founded on finnish land.
Fins are immigrants from Asia. Finland was populated by the Indo-European people before they colonized this land. There is no reason to talk about the past.
Tämä videoni on alkanut kummallisesti pätkimään. Mikään muu videoistani pätki. Missähän syy?
youdjin, you said Viipuri is Russian town. You should read European history books instead of Soviet history books to know and learn the facts. Even Soviet Union cant change the history. Have you ever wonder why old buildings in Viipuri doesnt look like Russian build?
Maybe some day our flag will again be risen to the tower of Viipuri castle =) hopefully. finland forever.
Kun kävin siellä niin pyysivät sisäänpääsymaksua.
To Satarti: It is a pity that such a man got such a power like Stalin did. It was a pity to Russian nation and it was a pity also for Finnish nation. Stalin did horrible mistakes in Russia and in Finland. It would be good for all to recognize those mistakes and correct those we can. If Russia would return Finnish areas that were criminally taken in ww2 it would show new side of Russia to the whole world, confidense and glory. Kuusinen were in his thoughts more Russian than Finnish.
What should the Russian majority population do after that?
Anton Slavik they have got pretty much land they could shift anywhere in Russia
In Finland we are Strong and anybody cannot harm us. If we say Viipuri belongs to us it really mean it
Russians are weak always.I know it and I have seen it. Soon you will say Karelia belong to Finland. Very soon.
Hmmm... Do you have some nuclear weapons to back it up?
Rakkaus ei tunne rajoja..
Love knows no borders..
RussianBoxer84
Varjagian vikings established whole state of Russia and ruled it many hundred years. Rurik was a varjagian warlord from Scandinavia (I think that from Finland´s area), who moved with his family/tribe and army to Russia and established the Russia´s first royal dynasty. The Chronicle of Nestor tells about it. Ivan the Terrible was the last Czar from Rurik´s dynasty. Viborg was the center of Karelia before the Kingdom of Sweden borned. Novgorod´s tries to conquer Viborg failled.
It is said, this is not helped during the siege. The only way was to Ladoga.
@HHHPPP8 Finland did not participate in the blockade of Leningrad, this is a historical falsehood. On the contrary, it was Finland's refusal to participate in the siege of Leningrad that prevented the Germans from conquering city. This is another reason why Russia should return Viipuri to Finland.
Why? It's a Russian majority town now.
Kuka on venäläinen älymystö?
Im not sure if i understand your point.
We cannot be blamed.
We simply took our land back. SORRY!!!! :(:(:(:(
Mikä laulaen tulee se viheltäen menee.Luulis että olisi pidetty paikat kunnossa..
Tälläisistä viesteistä huomaa kuinka pahaa jälkeä Stalin teki hävittäessään sukupuuttoon venäläisen älymystön.
"The invasion of east Karelia until lake Svir was necessary for our survival and security" - only don't acquit all your allies by means of the word "survival"! All of you spoiled to us a lot of blood!
@azdbio It was Swedish until they lost it to Russia in the early 19th century.
True... What do you know about the truth? Remember August 2008 and Georgia.
"For every Finn you killed, atleast 5 Russians were killed in return" - and what about the residents of Leningrad?
Join prokarelia and make finland have back salla kuusamo territory petsamo karelia and the 4 gulf of finlanf islands hogland lövskär tyterskär and seitskär 😁
Valega, Klooga, Paltiski - these names tell you about something? And the slogan "Long live the great Finland up to the Urals"?
@zheka1780, you speak something about killing me. Please come here and try it but dont start to cry then.
Youre silly. You support the destruction and slavicization of finno-ugrics
All North Russia was finno-ugric. St.petersburg is only 300 years old.
Finns dont hate slavs as a group, we just dislike Russia for its imperialism.
It was all part of Rus or Novgorod Principality since early medieval ages.
Etippä suomesta ihminen joka ei moittis
И можете не орать!! Выборг будет финнским!!!
А я там живу
@HHHPPP8 Perhaps some Finnish forces did not let refugees pass through their lines, this may have occurred, I do not know for sure.But it was Germany, your ally, that laid waste to your country and conducted a siege of a city with civilians[ this is amoral]. Anyway, I don't want to re-fight WW2. I have no problems with Russia or Russians, I actually like Putin.
Viipuri murenee...
At least we try.. Its just hard to correct those million mistakes russians have written
@azdbio Dreams never die.
@HHHPPP8 Yup, as I said, we aren't saints either. Don't really know how close the front actually was, but of course Finns couldn't let Russian civilians to get behind them...saboteurs and partisans would've instantly been cutting phone lines, railways etc. All in all, I don't think Finns would've actually cared less for Russian civilians during the war...Finnish civilians were bombed practicly daily during Winter War (like my grandfather saw his little sister to burn to death by incendiary bomb)
And how about the fact that you have built 17 camps in Karelia, not counting the seven camps in the Petrozavodsk?
Kinnasvaara, Paal, Heposuo, Tahuilov, Vidlitsa...
ё = yo
@villanovakid84 Consider that Vyborg is a payment of Finns for participation in the Leningrad Blockade.
And yet it was. You can not deny that the death of the Slavic population of Karelia was on your conscience.
russians think so now..
@villanovakid84 But Finland has participated in virtually surrounded Leningrad. The Finnish army has occupied all northern approach to a city and cut off exits from a city in the north.
@azdbio I like Russian people,but you did not answer my question about the illegality of the Winter War when Finland was attacked without justification and 1/10th of Finnish territory was annexed by the USSR. If you agree with me comrade that this was an unjust war, wouldn't justice be served of Russia returned Viipuri to Finland and the rest of the land that was looted by the Bolsheviks in 1940?
I am not advocating that Vyborg be taken by military force, that is not feasible.
If it was done immediately - yes. Now it would be inhumane, because this area is populated by Russians who want to be a part of Russia.
"spoiled to us a lot of blood!"? Your English is an atrocity. We could have done somuch more. Leningrad would have fallen if we had helped the Germans with 300 000+ troops, hundreds of artilleries etc. You should be grateful.
@azdbio No, they [Russians] tried to take over Finland and it didn't work. So, they won't try it again.
не дождешся
Civilians were not sent to the nazis. Finland did trade soviet POWs with germans for Ingrian finns.
You have roughed karelia up pretty good. Karelians are now only a 8 percent minority in their own land, before WW2 this was atleast 20. Thousands of karelians were executed and sent to siberia, for having karelian/finnish surnames, whos the racist now?
Viipuri is 100 percent finnish/finno-ugric, you destroyed our culture when you replaced the original population with fakes from all over USSR
Venäläinen älymystö = Russian intelligentsia...
RussianBoxer, you should read your history. Try to read historybook which has not written by soviet language if you want to know the truth. You can burn all soviet historybooks and buy some foreing books. Start new life as educated man!
RussianBoxer84
Part of people here do not realise that Viborg is older than it´s official founding year 1293. It is older than the Kingdom of Sweden. It was a trade place and Karelian fortress (a finnish tribe, finnish tavastians and swedish tribes populated South Karielen) against Novgorod before the Kingdom of Sweden borned. Hurray really for Rurik, he and varjagians commonly established Russia. It was forbitten to tell those things during the Soviet era in Russia (how Russia borned).
We're sorry Finland is so close to St. Petersburg.
You speak as if we imprisoned every single russian, This is a lie.
Also it has nothing to do with the siege.
Выборг Руский город.
No wonder we call you "chuhonsi". Forget the Vyborg. The death of Leningrad residents during blockade lies on your conscience partly.
RussianBoxre, you seem to be arrogant child. Please do not contact here anymore. When you know the same history about Viipuri as world do then you can write. Now go educate yourself.
And who sent the Karelian-Slav prisoners there? And your propaganda - the claim that we have destroyed the Karelians and your culture in Viborg.
@NHLGodfather
That land is useless anyway, and Finland didn't need it at all to rebuild into what it is today. Instead you should be glad Finland paid a small price compared to the countries of Eastern Europe who were invaded by the Soviet Union for almost 50 years. Indeed Finland got away easy compared to most others.
Today's Finland has one of the best educations and the economy is strong. Who needs Karelia? Stop living in the past.