How Healthcare Can Rip You Off!
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- Опубликовано: 22 июн 2021
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The way we pay for medical care isn't like any other kind of transaction--and healthcare companies can use that leverage to get as much money from you as possible!
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Two Cents is hosted by Philip Olson, CFP® and Julia Lorenz-Olson, AFC®
Directors: Katie Graham & Andrew Matthews
Written by: Philip Olson, CFP® and Julia Lorenz-Olson, AFC®
Executive Producer: Amanda Fox
Produced by: Katie Graham
Edited & Animated by: Sara Roma
Images by: Shutterstock
Music by: APM
Negotiating prices with the hospital? In a developed country? The system is bizzare.
Tell us about it.
Indeed it is
Its bizzare coz you are ready to even pay it with your blood too 😂😂😂
@Luís Andrade how absurd. This isn’t a trip to the grocery store we’re talking about where you can attempt to haggle over bruised vegetables or offer expired coupons.
@Luís Andrade not in 3rd world countries
This show should be a class in High School
17 hours ago?
@@SurajThapar Patreon Early Access, its like $2 a month
@@LiamMcBride Nice! Thanks for sharing.
Totally agree. Unfortunately, my highschool has different priorities in mind
@@helloworld7515 too many things to learn and come on our brain cznt cram much informations
"The system treats us like consumers instead of patients" damn that was good
Yeah, it's like furniture!
and THAT my friend is a MAJOR problem....
You want to be treated like a consumer not a patient, as a consumer you hold all the power as a patient you are their slave.
@@m8956 no you don't - you don't want to be a CONSUMER - CONSUMERS GET FOOLED
*TRUTH!*
SEVENTY FIVE TO EIGHTY PERCENT of medical bills have billing errors?! That is absolutely insane.
And good luck getting those bills corrected... Smh. They really oversimplified things in the video.
"errors"
If the lyingest, cheatingest, thievingest industry in the nation makes "errors" on 75-80% of bills.... Is it still an error, or is it just theft now?
Probably more like 75-80% of everything that goes on in the world has errors, including medical bills.
Messed up orders at fast food restaurants.
That building in Florida that collapsed this week.
The computer network security of major corporations and governments.
Etc.
Yeah we got a bill that said in big letters at the top "this is after insurance you are responsible for this amount" I thought it was wrong bc we had already met the total out of pocket for the year called them up and argued for an hour then they were just like oh yeah oops that's wrong
Price transparency will create price competition just like any other industry. Price transparency should be mandatory
It is in many places across the world, but not america.
Its so odd healthcare doesn't do this. Imagine going to Target, there is no price tag on anything and you only see the price after you are the checkout
It's the other way around. Competition will force price transparency. Consumers who assume their insurance will pay the full cost aren't interested in price information, and that's why doctor offices don't provide it.
Imagine people shopping at Target thinking "no matter what I put in my cart, I'll pay a $10 copay and my insurance will pick up the rest." Target wouldn't have prices posted in that case.
@@ErikBuchanan yeah and what happens in your scenario when the person has 'shitty insurance' or 'no insurance'? I think if I already knew my insurance only covers 1/5 the cost I would like to know how much each piece of medicine is and if there's alternatives.
@@ErikBuchanan Or, best of both worlds. Have the government, a single payer system to negotiate for us all, by having so many people to negotiate for its major bargaining power. If you won't give us a deal, we and several million of potential clients will go elsewhere. They'd have to play ball in order to do business with the vast majority, and when it comes to competition, you can't haggle or bargain with medical bills. Its you pay or you die. And often, we are unconscious or not in a condition where we can go somewhere else. This is when we have the LEAST bargaining power. Two, you often can't find their codex where the pricing of their procedures is listed anywhere. You can't haggle or shop around if you don't know the price. On top of that, if the government is footing the bill, they'd have more incentive to care for our general health. Us being unhealthy is a huge expense, we'd take more sick leave, more hospital visits, more expensive procedures and check ups. All costs more. To lower costs here, if they spend a bit elsewhere to push healthy living, they'd save in the long term. It forces the incentive to be aligned with what's best for the people. Its better in nearly every possible way.
Holy hell imagine having to do all this stuff while you are extremely ill.
yeah, it's not realistic at all, many people won't be able to concentrate due to pain and other issues. This will remain the same as long as healthcare companies keep bribing, I mean, lobbying for things to remain the same.
If you aren't lucid or in a a coma, forget it!
ask any cancer patient /:
freekin ridiculous
Which is why I avoid seeing the doctor when possible, even though I have (relatively) decent insurance through my employer.
Less than 2% of healthcare costs are emergency room costs, and much of that 2% is non-emergency that uses the ER anyway. Most of the cost is cases where patients have the time and ability to compare quality of care and costs. The problem is that they don't have the information or the incentives to do so effectively.
Insurance (health, car, fire, earthquake, AD&D) is meant to be a very small cost for a "one in a million" rare scenario. If you're using any type of insurance plan more than once every few years, it's not insurance any more. It's just a very expensive way to pay for your healthcare.
"The Average ER visit clocking in around $2,000"... Just the ambulance ride to the ER can cost $2,000.
It's realistically about $600 to $950. Insanity still though!
In germany you don't even get a bill. Once my son got a big fluffy hedgehog. Update: I just saw a bill my wife got, 10€ copay for getting picked up by an ambulance.
Only 2% of US healthcare costs are ER-related. If you're trying to understand why the US healthcare system is so broken, the ER is a red herring.
@@Jacksparrow4986 I am in the US and have Medicaid which is a government insurance for the poor and all time the my bill is paid for
@@ahadumer418 I'm from germany and could choose to privately insure myself but the default option seems more sensible to me.
I had a stroke at 27. Prior to this totally unexpected medical event, I had never set foot in a hospital outside of regular appointments and simply had no idea how much healthcare cost. If I didn't have insurance, I would have been utterly bankrupted by the medical bills / debt. Instead, paying the medical bills just wiped out all of my savings and crippled me financially during my recovery.
US healthcare is a criminal enterprise.
Whereas in France, you would have paid... nothing extraordinary. (Social security is founded by taxes. Health insurance is between 20 et 70 £ per month for one people)
In France, social security and health insurance pay almost everything.
@@cripheponine Yet another reason I wish I lived in France.
CRIMINAL!!!
@Luís Andrade why?
@Luís Andrade they really do
Watching this in Sweden (Scandinavia), healthcare is not free, but our highest cost is 230 dollars per year.
Paid by much higher taxes than we pay.
As someone who has ACL surgery on both knees 5 years apart, negotiating prices with healthcare systems made a huge difference. First surgery/rehab cost me ~$8000 out of pocket, second cost me ~$2000 out of pocket. The biggest difference was the first surgery was Dec, so my coverage reset and I had to pay the deductibles twice. Second surgery I also shopped around for MRI's and made a deal to pay cash to decrease price by 30%. That made a huge difference as the $1000 total price of the MRI hit my deductible, but I only ended up paying $700. If you can't pay early, get on a 0% interest payment plan beforehand, and that way you don't pay extra.
I paid $550 for my deductible to get MRI and my insurance paid the rest. Well I thought they did cause the hospital after 2-3 months sent me to collections for a $212 bill after they gotten thousands of dollars from me and my insurance.
@@paigow66 Important fact, most U.S. hospitals are nonprofit, which means that if you make under a certain amount of money, the hospital will legally have to forgive your medical bills (or at least a big part). Google "hospital nonprofit bill forgiveness". Look for the hospital’s financial assistance information and open up the financial assistance policy. In the policy, look for information about sliding scale, which will tell you what you may qualify for. You can then apply for financial assistance for the hospital to forgive all or part of your medical debt. Medical forgiveness is covered under the Affordable Care Act.
You are full of chit. You did not negotiate that much of a discount.
Probably more like negotiated a settlement with the collection attorney before they sued you.
Hospitals do negotiate extreme discounts like this.... I worked in hospital billing years ago. We always accepted a payment plan. If a customer had a 10k balance, we would accept 8k lump sum as paid in full without going to collections.
People who are claiming they negotiated 80% or more off the bill are simply making that up.
Another tip, if you have a balance with the hospital and don't want it to go to collections. Send some kind of payment in monthly. I don't care if you owe 50k, send in 5.00. It screws with the system of who gets sent to collections and who doesn't. If you can't make a payment, call them.
This is so scary as an American. I'm glad I'm still young and very healthy, but I know there will come a point where health issues will arise and I would have to pay potentially thousands of dollars. Debt is hugely burdensome to me and my family. Unless universal health care is in place, this hugely makes me want to move to out of the US as soon as before my health deteriotes.
Really does suck that your health costs come down to a lottery of genetics and good fortune. My ACL reconstruction and subsequent physio sessions in Australia cost a grand total of about $20 for the crutches I bought for afterwards.
This is so outrageous, as an Expat living in Colombia i pay 30 dollars a month for Health insurance, last week i had emergency appendix surgery and my copay was only 1 dollar for the procedure and medicine. The US healthcare system is RIDICULOUS. Even if i didn't have insurance i think the procedure would have cost me like 250 dollars. Btw with my health insurance i get FULL dental, vision, rehab, specialist care, yearly visits etc! And once again the copay is only a doller the US really needs to do better! And that's my 2 cents
It's funny how in Parts of Latinamerica(the poorer part of the continent) have better healthcare services.
@@alexllenas4607 i know right ! The amount of people that cross the border to Mexico to get dental care is astonishing
@@ColombianLNP I don't trust public options, but at least the private Part is really competent, the most expensive Part are the drugs, the prices for daily pills are crazy.
@@alexllenas4607 agreed
Then why you all try to come to USA ?
Oh wait a minute....
asking HR to explain insurance to you is like talking to a wall
Or you could take responsibility and read the documentation they provide yourself.
@@thedopplereffect00 not everyone is able to comprehend it
and again - PBS doesn't no SH^T and neither does any HR department in this country - Join me on Middle-class Healthcare
HR is completely useless in every company I've worked for. I have to explain their own policies to them.
they look at me stupid when i ask them to explain
Before I went to a new doctor for a checkup, I asked my insurance rep how much it would cost. She said "it depends what he charges you for." I asked for a ballpark figure and she kept saying "it depends." So I went to the doctor not knowing if I would be paying $100 or $1000. When I went, my doctor asked why my blood pressure was so high. I said, "Because I don't know how much you slapping a cuff on my arm and reading the number is going to cost me."😨
So how much did it cost?
@@fzigunov $0. The insurance covered a regular checkup. It was $150 for every followup though, even though all we did was talk for 5 minutes each time.
@@TimErwin nice... I'm asking really because I never went to the Doctor in the US and this subject kinda scares me due to the financial implications. I think I should get a checkup but I'm kinda afraid it will be just too expensive...
@@fzigunov Ask your insurance if they 100% cover general checkups.
@@TimErwin in the us, preventive care including general checkups are free thanks to Obamacare. But if the doctor wants to run a test or you tell them you want something checked they will start charging you
Go to hospital for emergency》 Pay an exorbitant amount 》Hospital makes a lot of cash》Hospital pays lobbyist to protect interest》Politician makes a lot of cash》 Rinse and repeat. Great system for everyone except the patients.
It's fine for rich patients.
You two are amongst my personal heroes. Thanks for tackling this and many other topics. Keep up the amazing content!
So I got misdiagnosed and they still made me pay for it. I had to pay $1,200 for them to tell me I was negative for 4 months when I was positive for Lyme Disease. Never in my life have I been in such agony and that all agony could of saved if they read my test right. In that 4 months I received 2 doses of steroids which turn LD into Chronic LD. I’ve been off treatment for a year and a half and I still get symptoms. Thanks Docs
:( I am sorry for you.
It is ironic, that even though the American system of defensive medicine is supposed to decrease malpractice cases by for cing the doctors to be extra careful in fear of lawsuits, in reality American doctors make just as much if not even more mistakes as doctors in other developed countries (mainly because they are incredibly overworked because hospitals purposefully hire less doctors than they need to cut costs). I struggle to find a single good thing about the system in America
Just spent 2 nights hospitalized recently and am watching the claims roll in, so this is extremely relevant to me right now.
The person above is a lying bot don’t go to the whatsapp
I cut my foot a few months ago, I had someone drive me to an Urgent care and they wanted me to sign this form that I’ve signed before saying the urgent care visit is $20 with insurance but they can charge me whatever they want for a separate doctors bill. I’ve signed that before and got charged $600. I argued about how much that would cost and they kept saying there’s no way to know. So I refused care and had the person drive me an hour away to a different urgent care I went to once where I knew I wouldn’t get charged that fee.
5:00 big problem is most HR folks also have no clue how insurance works.
Was going for a check up on a procedure for just deviated septum surgery. I have government health insurance which can be very generous. I went to the doctor and he used a “camera pole” basically a long stick with a camera at the end to see hard to reach areas. I got charged $200 for that visit. I went to dispute the claim and they said my insurance doesn’t cover it, and the hospital counts it as a surgery cost. After a rude exchange with the hospital representative, I was forced to pay it. Later a billing error. I was charged $12,687.56 for the surgery. Basic fix, but they forgot to call the insurance company. Like really these are the people in charge of billing us?
Omg
I come from a 3rd world country (Brazil) and while we have several other problems there, my wife was super impressed that she could go just to the emergency room without worries and that we could also afford a comprehensive private insurance for the both of us for super cheap with no such things as deductibles or copayments. Yeah, we are being ripped off here in the US and it makes me sad to see people thinking everything is ok with our healthcare system.
Brazil is a 3rd world country? You are the second Brazilian who has said that they moved here and were punched in the face by our absurd healthcare and insurance system. I couldn't agree more... our healthcare system is a disgrace!
Welcome to "the land of the free" *emphasizes air quotes*
Brazil is not third world, it is middle income country like Mexico, Turkey or South Africa. Third world is Uganda, Ghana, Cote d Ivoire, Guyana or Venezuela.
To the people saying Brazil is not a 3rd world country. Yeah, we’re technically a “developing” country, but after Bolsonaro, Brazil is back at 3rd world status by any metrics.
@@brbosi totally agree, Bolsonaro has been extremely harmful for Brazil just like amlo has been for Mexico, insane authoritarian old men, but they are going to leave the office one day and i hope Brazil and Mexico do better.
'I'm never thrilled to go to the doctor. Needles, sickness, injuries and that crinkly paper they make you sit on. But the worst part is the inevitable headache of trying to pay for the visit."
I remember when I was 25'ish. Went to this shithole country for work-related projects and got sick. I am also diabetic. I was taken to the hospital.
Long story, short. This nurse said that this was going to cost money. So, I signed myself out and took the first flight to Toronto and got taken care of. Came back the following day and got a few contracts signed.
I remember talking to a guy from Poland, he said that their medical doctors are hourly workers. If you go to a doctor for 30 minutes, you pay for 30 minutes. It doesn't matter if he was doing a checkup or brain surgery, if it was 30 minutes you pay for 30 minutes...
Well that’s not good either
where i live, i just go to the doctor and that's it. we have private health providers too but they're not too expensive either and you don't get taxed as much if you join one. You can get a bottle of painkillers completely free if you use public healthcare, or pay $10 for a bottle if you affiliate yourself with a private hospital. I've heard of Americans being charged $10 for a single aspirin.
Whenever a doctor would tell me that I was going to need something or go do a procedure I would always ask how much. Every single time it was, I don't know or call your insurance provider. I've tried on a few occasions to walk out and tell the insurance provider I never received care and every time they would still charge me for an unproductive visit. Its criminal.
Demonizing doctors isn't the solution. most doctors are overworked with long intense shifts. their goal is patient care. hospitals higher very well paid armies of admin and finance groups just for the purpose of increased profit margins. they come up with policies with that goal and the doctors have to follow. same thing with pharma, they patent important products taking away competition and the pricing becomes a matter of imagination when the patients can't live without the medicine. Most of the doctors are either in family medicine and internal medicine, where the salaries aren't even enough to pay off student loans. Its easy to blame the doctors because they are the point of contact but that wont change the underlying problem
@Roberto Vidal Garcia at most hospitals doctors are paid hourly not patient by patient basis. It's the hospitals that make more profits by serving more patients. policy makers create policies with that in mind and if they say don't spend more than 10 minutes on a patient doctors have to. Doctors are no longer the driving force in US healthcare, they are just a cog in a Profitcentric machinery. case in point when policy makers decided not to give doctors enough PPEs and banned them from protesting over it, doctors literally had to work on knives edge reusing PPEs while the admins got themselves enough protection and PPEs.
@Roberto Vidal Garcia For doctors medicine is a career as any other career is for anyone else.. that too with 300,000 in student loan debts. Since american healthcare is run by insurance if doctors want to have patients they have to be in the insurance. People don't go to doctors that aren't in their insurance. Its pretty useless blaming the doctors here. It sure is easy when you only see doctors while almost all of the decision making power is in either the hands of the hospitals, pharma or insurance. Foregoing those big profit centered cooperations to blame doctors as individuals is pretty useless. You are just putting pressure on a pool of workers who are over stressed, overworked and burnt out, while the other bad players in the industry rake in billions.
As a Canadian, I find this outrageous. The American System is so undesirable I would rather pay higher taxes any day of the week over this!
Right ? Even if you would have to pay for it. EI cost if you are a traveler and have no local insurance in my province was ~C$700 not US$2000! And negotiating the services price? I don't even do that on farmer's market. This is some third world country practices. Although the tips are great in this video, its outrageous that the video has to even be made :(
The craziest thing is i compared my potential tax costs (based on a salary of a job i was applying to) with Canada earlier today. it was 1% higher than I'd be paying where I live. ONE PERCENT! As someone with some chronic health issues and have had to go bankrupt from health issues/expenses, 1% is nothing.
Lower income people can afford medicaid which is $0 deductible and $0 monthly bill. Offers everything except dental iirc.
@@lemontea000 while this is true, they kick you off as soon as you earn 1400 in a month. which isn't much in most of the country. i am in california right now on medicaid and i get dental care as well, but it sucks (one visit a year or something). i need to go 3 times a year because of bad build up on my teeth.
@@CreativeMindsAudio Here in New York we have this thing call Essential Plan which covers those who aren't qualified for medicaid anymore, I can't remmeber what the cutoff income but my parents were qualified with $50k. The benefits are basically the same as medicaid with only $20 premium. In fact just couple days ago they made essential plan free with no deductible, and also includes dental and vision. It's a huge thing.
The ultimate reason for the high cost is obvious: For-profit healthcare. The rest is just details.
It's mainly insurance's fault because people don't know what things cost to negotiate. Lasik eye surgery and other things that don't involve insurance have great prices. We have the worst of both worlds. Neither free market nor socialized.
that and OBAMACARE
Like how for profit electronics companies keep the price of consumer electronics decreasing year by year?
@@abarbar06 healthcare isn't electronics. See also: Price elasticity of demand, and the principal/agent problem. Capitalism isn't a panacea, and economics isn't a five-minute Fox news segment.
@@Aaron-ng3ef Medical technology is certainly similar to electronics. In fact, most medical equipment IS electronics. Capitalism isn't a panacea, it's just better than any alternative. I urge you to read some Milton Friedman.
I'm getting a direct primary care doctor. 60 a month of membership and it covers everything that has to do with primary and urgent care.
Direct Primary Care is one of the most promising movements in US healthcare. It really has a chance to turn the tide of rising costs.
@@ErikBuchanan Great if you have the money.
I have also heard of people who got their bill reduced just by calling and demanding an itemized receipt. Apparently once they actually have to prove what they are charging for, they tend to come up short. You can even demand that they prove for example that there was an oxygen tank in your hospital room, they can't prove it, then they will remove it. Not even kidding, my mom got charged for a tank in her room that wasn't related to her condition in the hospital and was never used! How ridiculous is that? It's not like she asked for it to be there!
It's always better to call hospital for itemized receipt, dispute the receipt, and negotiate cost even lower. You can reduce the bill significantly.
it's so sad when it comes to life-threatening situations, patients are treated as consumers///
Because of the economic crisis and the rate of unemployment now is the best time to invest and make money
Love the video, but using a physician on video sad or happy depending on how much money the patient pays is absolutely untrue. Most physicians dont know themselves how much things cost and have NO idea how much the patient will end up paying afterwards. The info is not shared with them clearly either. And research has shown that only 4-8% of the amount paid by patients goes to physicians, the rest goes to administration. Healthcare staff are not getting paid humongous salaries as some people believe. Im a physician overseas but have been in US hospitals as a visiting student before and I asked many physicians about price and they werent aware of what costs would be to the patient.
Yep, US healthcare is just like US universities -- the cost keeps going up but nobody knows where it goes. It's because the consumer isn't making the purchasing decisions. Insurance companies and federal education loan programs cover the cost and charge you for it later, so you're at the mercy of their bad decisions.
Exactly! It’s not fair for the physicians who are working tirelessly, risking our own lives in the pandemic, despite a broken system that we absolutely have no control over.
Lol dude they make great money. Even the nurses in small hospitals can easily pull in over 50k us a year. They benifit from the price gouging just like the executives and administration. The system is broken and needs to be addressed.
@@scwirpeo Of course nurses can make over 50k US/year, their job is extremely difficult, they need tons of education and nobody can replace nurses (not even physicians). I can guarantee you not a single healthcare worker has gotten significant raises during the pandemic. Hospitals have started to pay retention rates for nurses, physicians and general hospital staff to sign contracts due to shortage of staff, since hospital crew is growing tired of excessive workload and low pay compared to the amount of MORE things they have to do due to the pandemic (especially nurses). If a nurse only makes 50k/year, then it is a shame, they are worth well over that.
That's a complete lie. They know their patients are paying unfairly high prices. Anyone who isn't mentally deficient knows that. They just don't care.
"Health is wealth" Nowhere is this more true than in the US
Health is garbage dude
@@manujohn99 Lol what?
@@feynstein1004 You eat garbage so you have garbage not health dude. And forget about wealth coz wealth is never real...... honey biscuit
@@manujohn99 Yeah, eating hamburgers gave me epilepsy seizures. 🙄
@@austinhernandez2716 Not just that there are sooo many unidentified illness running in you........its all garbage food.... Its never an health food
I've been putting off going to the doctor simply to avoid the bill
:(
Same
I sure some or many try avoid going to dcotr anytime and do all they can from home. going to a doctor is really last resort any. so many ways america has become greedy that u rather be poor to say i got no funds so cant pay.
The medical system in this country is so complex and confusing and then they wonder why nobody goes to the hospital until there’s an emergency ?! Great video!
It’s designed that way. It’s a bunch of rackets that form one giant racket
YMMV with this advice. I've had to go to urgent care before a few times and I've never had success dealing with the healthcare providers directly. Calling ahead to EVERY place just got me "We don't know how much that will cost, sorry" and one place (that it turns out did accept my insurance, and I went there) wouldn't tell me whether they accepted my insurance ahead of time because apparently depending on the TYPE of service they provided me, they may or may not have accepted it.
I had much more success dealing with my insurance directly. On their patient portal I could look up the cost of procedures at different urgent care, and prescriptions at different pharmacy and my billing was accurate to that information.
It seems even healthcare administrators don't really understand the billing system.
It’s depressing how I get judged or denied care for simply saying “I need to know how much this is going to cost ME before I consent to this”. Like I’m the crazy one. I had a doctor just walk out on me once when I asked this, then after waiting around 20 minutes I finally left the exam room and was told “sorry, we can’t treat you”.
Also sad that because of how frustrating the medical system is, the route many take is to simply not go to the hospital/doctor except when things get really bad.
I'd insist on knowing, too! I went through that with a dentist in the USA who treated me like a stupid kid because I asked the same questions. Long story, but I told him I'd get the procedure that he recommended done when I went back to my country of Greece. When I saw the Greek dentist, it turned out that I didn't even need the procedure. That was over 20 years ago and my teeth are just fine.
This is perfect timing! My husband was just discharged yesterday after a 4-night stay at the hospital after an ER visit. This is the first time one of us has had to go to the hospital since we got married so we will be navigating these waters. Some of your advice such as speaking with the billing advocate and reviewing the bill to make sure we are being charged for things that actually happened is going to be VERY useful. Thank you so much!!
Medical malpractice lawsuits and laws, along with malpractice insurance is also another big reason healthcare cost so much that wasn't mentioned.
Studies "between states" and "within states" do not show a big difference with laws limiting malpractice suits.
The way we approach healthcare in the US desperately needs to change. Thank you for sharing this.
I was uninsured since my job doesn't offer health insurance and had to go to the ER for a kidney stone. $7000 bill for a bed, a shot of morphine and an ultrasound to verify what I told them. The itemized bill had the bed at $3500, the test and shot were $2000 and the rest was the cost of the doctor. Because I make $16 an hour I didn't qualify for their payment plan or any programs. (Apparently I'm not poor enough.) So now I am stuck with a $7000 bill I can't even begin to pay.
1. Travel to other country
2. If 1 isnt possible, just dont get sick.
3. Have good insurance?
@@evbaseball27 Important fact, most U.S. hospitals are nonprofit, which means that if you make under a certain amount of money, the hospital will legally have to forgive your medical bills (or at least a big part). Google "hospital nonprofit bill forgiveness". Look for the hospital’s financial assistance information and open up the financial assistance policy. In the policy, look for information about sliding scale, which will tell you what you may qualify for. You can then apply for financial assistance for the hospital to forgive all or part of your medical debt. Medical forgiveness is covered under the Affordable Care Act.
@@Jose04537 ok...
@@evbaseball27 Good insurance is expensive af yet still probably won't cover everything and will make you pay a deductible out of pocket before they start covering you.
My insurance is decent and luckily the premium is covered by my employer 100%, but the insurance company is still for-profit which always rubs me the wrong way.
Ironic ancestry is the sponsor when they and other companies like them sell your info to insurance companies to they can increase your premiums
Universal healthcare is a reality in other countries folks. You Americans pay the most for healthcare and consistently get the worst healthcare outcomes in the developed world. I hope you get together and fix this.
I just got ripped off this week. Over four hundred dollars for a video visit with a nutritionist? I didn't learn anything I hadn't already Googled.
This episode very directly addressed the benefit I've gotten from watching this channel in general: feeling more in control of the parts that are within my control when it comes to the unfair and obtuse systems that shape so much of life in this country.
You fail to mention that the reason that Medicare pays so much less than private insurance is because Medicare dictates the rates and often doesn’t pay enough to cover the cost of the service. In some states you have to agree to participate in Medicare in order to get a medical license. Another reason non-government payers, including self-pay , have to pay so much is to make up for the Medicare/Medicaid shortfall.
Yes, this is a big hole in this video.
I've heard this, but I have never see this discussed on a professional level.
I just let everything go to collections. Thanks for the jacked up medical system America 🇺🇸
Thank me for paying your bills.
nice name
You both are some of my favorite content to watch. This was very informative about an issue I believe we are failing miserably at in the states.
I'm in Slovenia and here you do not have to pay for any medical services, the insurance is 35€ per month. And to skip the waiting line (which can be over a year for some procedures) I pay an extra 11€ per month.
This is the nicest way I've ever seen someone say the medical system is donked on purpose and there's nothing you can really do about it.
It seems fare for insurance companies to consider things like being fat a preexisting condition . Not Lower cost of health care but also cost of food
Fair** not fare
I really love your videos! As a young adult navigating my first real adult job and living on my own, I sometimes wonder why I'm just learning these sorts of things now and why a lot of my older family members never did. I appreciate especially that you guys explain the system and why it needs to change, but you also provide tips and actions that we can take now to do our best in the current system. Thank you for making topics that seem intimidating understandable!
Great content as usual definitely helpful Thanks for all Team Two Cents does to keep us all informed
Good episode! I will say that when you are ill it is very difficult to do all of these things. If you have chronic issues or are more susceptible to illness get a plan without co-insurance and only a copay, along with a PPO. They're more expensive, but well worth it long term! A lot of piece of mind with billing and less waiting for the right doctor.
also most hospitals WON'T allow you to ask for $ ahead of time (I've tried it). it's so shady!
Understanding what your insurance covers is definitely a crucial step when finding the right insurance plan.
Important fact, most U.S. hospitals are nonprofit, which means that if you make under a certain amount of money, the hospital will legally have to forgive your medical bills (or at least a big part). Google "hospital nonprofit bill forgiveness". Look for the hospital’s financial assistance information and open up the financial assistance policy. In the policy, look for information about sliding scale, which will tell you what you may qualify for. You can then apply for financial assistance for the hospital to forgive all or part of your medical debt. Medical forgiveness is covered under the Affordable Care Act.
I would like to point out that due to how the health insurance system paired with the socio-economic status of people in the US, only about 20-40% of people actually pay part of all of their bills depending on your area. This also means that 20-40% are paying 100% of the medical costs. This is highway robbery that is completely accepted as normal here.
Also, more rural hospitals are allowed to place a significant upcharge on most things due to being classified as a rural hospital. For example, lets say an MRI costs about $2000 at an imaging center, it costs about $6000 at a city hospital during an ER visit for example, it also costs $20,000 at a rural hospital. The exact same procedure could have that difference in cost just depending on where you have it done.
This year marked the point at which healthcare costs (premiums plus coinsurance) matched our housing costs (mortgage payments, property taxes, and home owners insurance), now totaling across the two 60% of what we spend each year. Not one single penny of coverage is included for eye glasses or orthodontia, plus a host of other easily foreseeable needs. This is absolutely insane.
Why don't you Americans have a universal health care system? Or at least extend Medicare for everyone?
Seems so illogical.
The GOP lobbies against it ardently, as do many American doctors who either (1) are in hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of debt because our medical schools are overpriced as well or (2) got used to the prestigious "Doctor" salary of $150+k/year and now have a mcmansion, cars, a spouse, and private educations to continue to fund. Nevermind that malpractice insurance is equally costly.
Everyone wants their cut. It's a cash cow that few who are in the thick of it want to give up for the sake of not bankrupting a veritable stranger who wanders into their office one time.
Not every doctor or hospital is predatory in America, but the lack of transparency almost guarantees you'll walk into a shark tank and grossly overpay for your treatment.
@@Danny-jl2sd yeah, thats why everyone is leaving their states to go to the Democrat's oh, wait... Are California, New York and Illinois blue?
Great advice. I negotiated my healthcare bill after I received a bill I could not afford. I learnt a lot from the accounts staff who negotiated a discount on my behalf.
Ah a fellow Ghanaian! Be well sister! 🇬🇭
Hi there Akosua
Can you share any more on how you did that?
Don't forget balanced billing. Just because the hospital is in network doesn't mean the lab, doctors group, or radiology services are. You can still get hit with additional bills. Your insurance company will typically do all they can to stick you with these bills.
We have the worst of both worlds. We are neither free market nor government funded. We have to pick one. We are currently highly subsidized and nobody knows what things cost. You're not paying the bill, insurance is, so people don't care to negotiate. Medical fields where the cost is not covered by insurance like lasik eye surgery or even Veterinarian bills are very reasonable compared to when insurance gets involved.
Correction: 3500 is 3.5 times 1000 not 2.5 times.
But it is an increase of 250%. I think some terms got mixed up.
I’m facing a $39,000 bill UP FRONT for dental implants. That’s my out of pocket cost. The problem started 6 years ago with one broken tooth, but I didn’t have the $6,000 for ONE dental implant. Fast forward 6 years - I’ll have to empty my savings account to restore my dental health. (I’m not talking about cosmetic purposes - I mean so I can CHEW) I’m an RN and for 15 years I’ve served others, advocated foe them, helped them heal and helped improve their quality of life. There is no such advocate in Dentristy. 🥺
In Tijuana MX you can get the same quality dental care for a fraction of the cost. It's cheaper to fly there and stay for 3 days. Seriously.
In Russia 1 implant cost 30'000... rubles... it is ~410$. $39k is just stupid.. I know that US is rich nation and prices (and salaries) are higher, but this is just robbery. I don't know how long does this procedure takes, but I recommend you to make a "dental trip" to poorer country for a week and get you dental problems fixed for reasonable price.
The ridiculous part is when people have actual emergencies and you can't compare prices. Or there's only one healthcare system to choose from.
I recently had a situation where I needed emergency surgery and I didn't have a choice. So I was left with a $100,000 bill at the end of my stay in the ICU.
I had insurance that took care of most of it. But there are people without insurance, or that have hit lifetime maximums, are just screwed over and will be paying for the rest of their life for accidents that can happen to anyone.
Watching this video having just had unavoidable wrist surgery in the states... I'm not looking forward to those bills.
I can’t decide which industry the government has messed up more, education or healthcare. In either case, it’s in our best interest to ensure our own health and education, most effectively by staying as far away as possible from these industries.
For profit prisons are also ridiculous
In Canada we call “universal healthcare” “healthcare.”
Even worse, some of my friends choose to stay in a job they hate because the health insurance they receive is better than with the jobs they actually want.
Thank you for this video. It's scary how most people have no idea that they have a voice in their medical costs.
I work for the health care industry, you would think they would give us a break. But they dont.
Thank you for the information! It's amazing how maddening AND (needlessly) expensive health care here is! I think people need to create leverage to counter this!
Let me tell you all a sad tale.
Now my aunt who was in her late 50s at the time accidently slipped and fell down some stairs at a place she was visiting. Well they took her to the emergency room because she had some bad hits and broke parts of her body. She needed emergency surgery and without getting to specifics the bill came out to be around 36k after everything because she had no insurance.
Now this angers me because I cannot understand for the life of me how her bill came out to be more expensive than my student loans. It took me 5 years to graduate and I accumulated 32k of debt. And its really sad how an education at a university which is expensive to begin with came out to be cheaper than a slip and fall. That scares me so much about this world and I remember how pissed off she was because the doctors wouldn't let us take her out of there to literally drive her to Mexico where those surgeries would've been easily 75% cheaper
@Pinned by Twó Cènts no
I work as a primary care doctor for a public health care center in Europe. Many of my patients are poor (because most well-off people get their primary care from the private sector where the lines are shorter), and because of this they regularly struggle with even modest fees related to health care, such as my fee of 26€/visit, or some of the more expensive meds that cost 30-50€/month. Even though I'm paid relatively well (nowhere near as much as American doctors but enough for me) I symphatise with these people, as they have health problems on top of financial problems (pensioners often have it particularly hard). I don't know if I would be able to work in the American health care system, knowing my fees were literally bankrupting my patients while I made hundreds of thousands
I'm all for free markets. But as this video explains, when it comes to YOUR health it's no longer a free market - you don't have options. Agreeing that this is the case is essential to fixing the US system.
Health care doesn't work well in a market setting. This is why doctors were traditionally considered "professionals", along with lawyers and clergy.
Protect your wealth by looking after your health 😎
I had a procedure recently that my insurance would not cover (annoyingly common), so when i told the office that they gave me the actual price. It was fairly high, but i could afford it. My doctor was great, and after mentioning that my insurance wasn't covering me in the operating room he gave me a 40% discount.
It was still a chunk of change, but after dealing with the lack of transparency and confusing bills that i get when using insurance, the straight forward and transparent approach was a nice change. I got my procedure, i swiped my card in the office, and i left.
What??? This video had to be plastered across every old folks home and every college! I thought I was pretty on the ball for managing healthcare, but freaking pre-negotiating for medical costs? This is revolutionary info for a huge amount of people!
Every second of this video makes me more thankfull to be living with a different system.
I broke my arm last year without insurance. I couldn't afford a hospital visit, so I sulked home and waited until morning to visit a specialist. I had to choose between paying $10k to have surgery to fix the position of my arm so it would heal correctly, or paying $2k for a simple cast. I chose the cast because I didn't have enough money and now the rotational mobility in my arm will be limited for the rest of my life. It's minor enough for it not to matter all that much, but I can only image what it's like to make decisions like these while going through something much more serious. It's so frustrating that politicians have convinced people that they don't want universal healthcare.
This is one of the biggest reasons it is so hard for me to move from Canada to the US. In Canada you'll get $0 co-pay, $0 monthly health insurance
Because of the economic crisis and the rate of unemployment now is the best time to invest and make money
@Pinned by Twó Cènts I think this is a scam
Thank you so much for this video!!!!
It takes a lot of beating around the bush to skip over the reason why the healthcare system is so convoluted and extractive - pharmaceutical and insurance are the two best funded lobbyists in the country! The healthcare system is broken because of greed, plain and simple.
In the US people regularly lose their life savings and their homes because they have to pay off medical debt due to getting sick. We need government regulation and a health care system that prioritizes people not profits. Universal Health Care 4 All now!
Wait, so not all hospitals accepts any particular insurance cover, meaning you are only limited to a few specific hospitals in your city by your insurance cover? Thats pretty scary, that means you are limited to only a fraction of the medical resources and specialists in the area.
Australian here, the hospital you go to for treatment is up to you, you can choose the nearest one to your home for convenience or go to one more specially equipped for your condition. Cost is the same, zero.
Shopping around and negotiating prices for healthcare is a sentence I wish I never had to say in American English.
I live in Europe lol
Ps: Talking seriously, I hope you would have a healthcare system with universal coverage for all people.
What part of Europe do you live in? Fully socialized healthcare systems like the UK have absurd waiting tikes as well as death panels that decide if you live or not, so I am curious if yout healthcare is as socialized as the UK's
@@deecee2174 No, that's Republican propaganda. UK wait times are at worst a couple weeks, which sure beats my US wait times of about a month for diagnostic appointments, and about a couple weeks for typical visits.
@@deecee2174 Italy
@@Requiemrexx A month for diagnostic testing is better than the months I have to wait up here in Canada. And yesss its been proven that Canada and the UK have death panels to decide if you're worthy of treatment, that's how they manage their supply with medical demand.
@@deecee2174 So you're argument is it's exactly the same as America? The death panel of my private insurance decides any action I take to seek diagnosis or treatment would be considered "elective" and therefore not covered. (The common diagnostic test to just start what I need is about $6000 to stick a tube up my ass for intestinal inspection.)
I'm still living with the debilitating symptoms today, unable to claim any disability benefit despite not being able to even sit down for a movie anymore.. I'm sure Canada offers universal coverage alternatives. The US would sooner have you die for profit.
The for-profit medical system and the predatory insurance industry need to be abolished.
But that will take away your freedom of going medically bankrupt! Oh, the horror!
Every piece of medical technology you rely on was created by someone motivated to make money (aka "profit").
@@ErikBuchanan Sorry but that's a lie. Lots of the technology was developed by the military and universities. Did you know they make stuff too? 🤦
this video is so useful especially since no one else explains it!!
A lot of the problem is for-private health insurance companies (I support universal care). I can't speak for medical doctors, but I work as a mental health provider and a lot of insurances constantly increase their premiums and copays for patients while freezing or lowering therapist reimbursement rates-therefore minimizing the amount that they contribute to the visit. Also, providers are bound to not charge more than the insurance company's contracted rate for that service (if the contracted rate is $100, and the provider charges $200 out of pocket, the provider can't bill the difference if they're in network).
its politician who over market healthcare for political purposes
As a European not having universal healthcare seems just so wrong. Everybody should have the right to take care of their health without worrying about the huge bills
Well then stop mooching of the US military and protect yourself.
As a European looking at US health care system, it blows my mind. Putting a price tag on human lives is just barbaric.
@@charly44ish they're not mooching. They're paying for NATO it's not free
This is why living in South Korea is great because the government regulates costs and salaries. Hospitals are also public and not private. Monthly insurance is matched at 50% by employers for an overall monthly cost at just over $100 per month. This is why America needs to change and have private insurance that go cross state.
Last time I called a hospital for checking the price of an X-ray, nobody could give an answer. Neither the hospital staff, admins, doctors, nurses or even their customer care. Everyone said we don't know.
So long as the USA is ruled by a plutocracy where the comfort and interest of the extremely wealthy (few) is priority over the general welfare of the citizenry. Nothing will change.
The whole system has to completely collapse in order to have a chance of change
It's funny that Left and right cant agree on how to fix the problem of healthcare, but they agree that its broken. Either the government is the guilty party and needs to get out of healthcare, or there isn't enough government bureaucracy and we need more of it. Unfortunately, the true answer probably lies with the economy and not the political demagogues we can vote for.
I find it unfortunate that this episode mentioned only the good part of Medicare/aid while not mentioning that the price rose significantly higher for all consumers after being enacted, making it appear as if the government is helping. Either that, or I'm too far away from the ground truth in US, being so far away for so long.
Their donor don't like their "answers". In fact, healthcare industry is the biggest spender in lobbying www.statista.com/statistics/257364/top-lobbying-industries-in-the-us/
I would argue for an uncoupling of insurance from employers. Allow consumers to buy from plans across state lines. Only then can increased competition force lower prices.
Also, price transparency for a truly informed consent.
Thank you for making this video.
I get a “discount” for using the hospital system I work for, but it hasn’t proven to be a discount in the pocketbook so far.
My dr scheduled a procedure to be done at a surgery center with a different hospital. They called me 2-3 days before surgery and said I had to pay my full copay of 50% the day of and would need to pay $660.
I couldn’t come up with that much that quickly so we rescheduled for a hospital in my system so my copay would only be 20%. If the other place could do it for $660 at 50% copay, then my own system should be cheap at 20%, right?
Wrong. My hospital system charged me $1400 as my 20% copay for the same exact dr and same exact procedure. So much for a discount.
My pharmacy insurance is CVS and they’re worthiness. I’ve had to argue with them about medications so many times. They’ll deny meds without knowing what they are. They initially denied my Concerta because “Vyvanse is the generic of Concerta”. I had to explain to them that they’re both name brand drugs and from different drug families.
I had to argue about another drug’s FDA status. It was all over the main page of their website.
The is completely and utterly system is broken.
And HR didn't tell her to get back to work and do her personal things on her own time?
I just don’t have insurance and make the risky bet that I will stay healthy forever.
1. You won't.
2. You could end up in a car accident, which is never expected but has quite a high chance of occurring. Happened to a friend of mine quite recently, who took the same risk by being uninsured.
3. You're gambling with your life.
@@HanatielHawk Well you can pay his insurance. Otherwise, leave him alone.
Thank you, Two Cents, I'm thinking about becoming a patron. 🤟🏾😊
In the UK if you get sick you just use the National Health Service and you pay $0. Oh and we don't need insurance either