The ULTIMATE Debate: Old Truck OR New Truck?? Brian & Ronen Compare
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- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2024
- The ultimate debate between Ronen and Brian is here! Let's have a final verdict on old vs new trucks, and settle once and for all what's the better option.
In this video, they will list out the pros and cons for both new vs old trucks. Do you agree with any points they say?
What do you prefer? Older Trucks OR New Trucks? Let us know in the comments below!!
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If you run a big fleet, it makes sense to run new trucks but if you have 1 or 2 trucks I would recommend getting a pre emissions and pre elog truck and save your self the big payment and all the complications
Correct, holding 1 or 2 spare trucks in a big fleet is a small percentage of extra trucks to cover downtime. It's not viable with a small fleet it someone needing to sell to afford the next one
Exactly. No one like unexpected breakdowns and high finance rates,etc.
exactly what i was thinking
Hay bro in 100% with old school and I'm 30. The mega carriers that is the game for the big guys not me owner operator. Also instead of inviting in the mega way is bad because you need to have a perfect run and year. I'm in the USA and I'm seeing loads pay 3500 to 4000 for 2 day trips. So unless the new guy can come at me with some crazy statistics of how to think and how it works small guys like me will reject his way of thinking out of hand. I wish instead of making a video of old vs new he did a video of small vs big because then you will rely see the difference because I can bet you anything I can give compelling arguments that the mega guy has never head of and didn't even know existed.
Wise fucking words.... wordtoomymomma yo
As a Company Driver...
*drive a 2020 Cascadia auto
*run your ass off in comfort
*run 3000 miles per week
*take home as much or more than OO
*truck breaks down: cost to driver is ZERO and company provides loaner at no cost to driver
*cheap but good health insurance
*401k
*paid holidays
*periodic bonuses
Unless you plan to build a fleet of 5 trucks or more... I don't believe it is worth owning just one single truck... way to risky... way to expensive... not enough profit...
I think the days of the 'single truck owner operator' is coming to an end pretty dang fast...
If you're doing it for the money then it's not worth it. If you're doing it because you enjoy having less restrictions then I think it's worth it.
@@Nihil2005 ... regardless... OO or Company Driver... the government (FMCSA) runs the trucking industry... what the FMCSA says... goes...
Safety Deparments and HR Departments are just there to make sure all drivers conform to the government rules and regs...
The only decision an OO has the 'power' to make... it seems... is when to go home... and that's sad...
@@KittyKrazeWithDar ... I had to decide whether I was gonna be married to my wife... or married to my truck...
I almost made the wrong decision...
As a Company Driver I have the best of both worlds...
No stress... good money... financial security... and my home time is 'my wife and family time'... NOT truck repair or maintenance time... ya know what I mean...
@@KittyKrazeWithDar ... I feel you sweetie... my wife pulled no punches... she said I MUST choose... she said she was NOT going to play second fiddle to a 'stupid' truck...
(she was serious and she was mad)...
She showed me on paper that I could make the same amount of money (and even more)... build security... have less stress... and most important... not lose her and the kids to that 'stupid' truck...
She was right... life is too short and unpredictable...
@@KittyKrazeWithDar ... not gonna happen... so long as you remain silent... he believes that you're ok with the truck... but I hear ya...
God Bless You...
Down time for repairs of a new truck - lose of profit. That is where 8+ mpg goes down the drain.
I am 70 years old
I totally agree trucks are not built to last . I have bought new trucks because . I have a small fleet 11 trucks a d 14 reefer trailers .
We go to cali weekly .
I do agree i have a less issues with new equipment..
But i still buy Peterbilt s
I think this is a case of owner operator running 1 truck vs a company running a fleet of 100 trucks. Having an older truck for an owner operator with simple reliable motors are better regardless of fuel economy because of less down time and repair costs as opposed to someone with 100 trucks that can afford the down time and repair costs and spread it out over more trucks
Exactly right. Companies can afford spare trucks to keep everything moving.
Less downtime is the key point here. An individual driver loses not only repair costs but also income revenue when those emission systems fail. Burning a bit more fuel but keep moving with reliable motors is much better for an individual driver down the line
Bingo!
This is the key 🗝️
Bullseye right there.
I'm not in trucking business, but I found this discussion fascinating. Brian said he cares most about Comfort... but he actually cares more about long-time reliability. Old trucks you can repair easier using independent shops, while new ones require the services of dealership... looks like a "right to repair" issue.
Comfort also includes running the AC when sleeping during the summer. There goes your 8% idle time right there
The problem with Brian is he's size for the W900 . He's to high for this type of truck . There made really tight inside the cab . The rest it's more comfortable then the newer models . Gages , isolation , even the way they keep the road it's more safer and comfortable .
Thats not true. millions of newer trucks running. All these guys today know is run the computer and it tells you what to repair. They screw up your old truck in todays world. They dont know how to repair them.
@@lifeofshawnI84sounds like your hitting up the wrong shops come to Houston lots of one stop shops
@@jmit3491that’s correct but that adds easily another 10k to the price tag but really good to avoid dpf from clogging
Every company need owners like Ronan he wants his drives to make money.
When your drivers make money, you make money. Mega carriers don’t seem to realize this
One thing that I consistently do not see in these discussions is the price of def fluid over the life of the new truck.
2021 volvo VNL 860 average mpg variable elevation: 6.3 mpg
My 2007 kenworth t2000, no emissions, same route 5.9 mpg.
Kenworth: $25k
Volvo: $160
Maybe I’m missing something but the fuel he saves he spends the $ on def?
@@gr1099 I don’t know if that’s the case or not. I would say that the cost of def fluid should be included in the equation of the cost, however. I have no doubt that the newer trucks are more comfortable and driver friendly, however when it comes to the costs of operation it seems that we are not getting a true comparison.
Good observation
2g a year
New trucks not getting 8.5 unless you hauling light
they need the toyota mindset, keep the engine and transmission the way it is and upgrade everywhere else that does not affect the reliability, such as the comfort
Couldn't have said it better myself.
I hear you. I've bought an 04 corolla brand new, 2022 and I'm still driving it.
As on o/o an older truck is just much better in the long run as far as turbo prices overhaul hoses oil changes
What about the new classic style ones?
Comfort is not just physical comfort. I am much more comfortable not having to worry about warnings coming up and deciding to ignore them and get the job done or stopping and waiting for the mechanic to decide what to do and often deciding that I keep going. False warnings cause damage because we then ignore real ones. I am also more comfortable in the way different trucks function. DAFs wanting to shut down an engine after idling a while is annoying. A Merc going into neutral while idling at lights is annoying. I find those things reduce comfort and I would be more comfortable in a truck with a rougher ride but operates in a nicer way
Now this is top quality trucking content!!! Great job guys!!! 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Chrome don't get you home but it damn sure makes you look good trying to get there
Great job on the video. Need more content like this that brings multiple points of view to a single topic. That’s how you come up with effective solutions to issues.
the math doesn't lie. Good to here the freightliners have less sensor problems.
My take. Buy new w/ the warranties then sell them while they still hold value. 5 years @ 750,000 miles @ 60% depreciation. Should have bought 3 replacements in those 5 years already. Know your Entry and know your Exit strategy in this business. Fall in love with the family not the truck. lol.
I like your strategy ..1 question ,does the warranty cover the damage if the truck breaks down.
Good luck selling them for any money
When a shop charges 5k to change a clutch actuator on a auto shift plus down time and hotel's and schedule headache's i don't want one.
Looking forward to seeing the analytics for comparison. Interesting topic, thanks guys!
You will also, gain value on the older truck vs the newer truck
I think it's great that Ronen looks at the numbers so closely for the different trucks & drivers, and informs them of what he sees. Ultimately, it's all relative; how you are doing is judged by how others compare to you & vice versa. Both of you have great arguments and reasons for them. I do think there is close to zero doubt that the newer trucks are definitely the way to go if you look at it as a economic business; that the main objective it to make money. The big trucking companies all have Ronen's analyzing their numbers, too. What do they do? The dump the trucks in 3-5 years. Once the warranty's are gone, the trucks are not far behind. They all cannot be wrong. Even individual on RUclips that bought new trucks and operate as a business will verify they make more money with the new trucks. My guess is that Brian will likely order a new truck (maybe a Pete or KW) after the 90 days are up.
One thing that isn’t discussed, old truck with title in hand also gives more freedom because when I decide to take 2 months off I don’t have any payments I’m responsible for. No fuel used no truck payments owed!
happy to see your channel growing, u guys doing a great job , keep it up
Saw a few videos by Ronin before ....for a desk jockey he really knows his stuff... And you can learn from him. Listen up new guys ...
🚛🚛Brian's the Man.💪🏽💪🏽
Going through school now and just got my permit. Love the content here especially for an up and coming trucker.
You should've said the fact that you lose 150k after your new truck is worn out where as with a pre emission they actually are increasing in value if u keep it nice
Numbers don’t lie. But.. Most drivers today are steering wheel holders. For big companies it makes sense to have new trucks that are automatic, computerized and have warranties. Drivers today don’t have to learn to shift or keep an eye on the pyrometer when climbing a mountain. Today’s drivers don’t know what that is or why it was on older trucks. As an O/O you are by yourself and better know your truck and be prepared for anything because it will happen on the road. Changed tires, turbo, fixed a dead cylinder on the side of road, got myself where I needed to be. Today’s drivers? Call a 1-800 number. Lol.
@@Bradgilliswhammyman manual trucks aren't that hard to drive. those automatics are worse than anyone but the very beginner skill level drivers. The computer's aren't even close to doing what our brain does with just one of our senses used for driving let alone all of them. For one thing a computer can't see what's developing in a roundabout as your approaching it to know whether to stay in 4th or down shift to 3rd so when it's time to go it's still screwing around wasting time and fuel shifting. About 5 percent of the time the convenience of the auto is appreciated but 95 percent of the time it's a liability.
Acting like shifting gears is hard to do lol. I prefer an automatic because I would rather my job be a bit easier than impress some boomer I could care less about.
@@mainSPECdestro I prefer autos only because it allows me to focus more on other drivers - the most dangerous part of being on the road.
@@derrickzenner9300 kevin is right auto are becoming far more efficient than manuals an soon ... trucks won't even need human drivers... imagine trucks using sensors, sonar, radar, satellite, advanced HD cameras, GPS etc..... that's a lot more info/ data to use to avoid accidents or traffic jams. Alot more the a pair of eyes and a radio
18 speed is driving a BIG Rig!
Automatic is just driving a truck that's castrated!
Hi guys, you both have good points , I have driven old and new , I have 20 years under my belt of driven experience an trust me , I just to have a 96 Freightliner fld120 doing 6.5 mpg awesome truck sero down time and I can take a month or two off without the worry of a truck payment but with this new trucks an emissions problems they have, I can't afford the down time, just my two cents, love the channel.
They both not wrong just different perspective
Love the debate. I'll be buying a newer Freightshaker soon.
New trucks for employee's. Old truck for me.
😂😂😂 Brian my RUclips friend if you don't see Sir. Ronen want to give you a new 2022 truck please take the truck remember your health come first and comfort. please take the new truck change are good trust Sir. Ronen wish I had a Boss like Sir. Ronen he is a good guy.🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
I have to agree with Brian, an older truck you can get atleast 1 million miles on the engine. Most Crapcadias and volvas turn to mush after 450-500k miles. The resale value is atrocious. But a W9 or 379 will hold it's value for decades!
When they compare fuel mileage old trucks vs new trucks. I love how they neglect the cost Diesel Exhaust fluid for the newer trucks. Yes I saved on my fuel mileage on my new truck but I spend it in DEF and I have more expensive repairs.
There is one video I kind of like to see. Is a interview with a broker and why are there are so much bad brokers.
But I agree 100% with Brian.
Love your channel bro veteran trucker knows best though !!!
Newer trucks require special care like sensor cleaning and other stuff which some drivers are lazy or forget to do and that's when they have mechanical problems. With older trucks you can slack off on maintenance and still survive. Buy a new, not a used truck, stay on top of the mfg maintenance requirements, drive it properly, and that truck should give you no mechanical problems.
I'm in trucking but not OTR. Salute to you guys from Austin, TX. Absolutely love the channel. Lots of good info and great entitlement value.
Nice to see u guys joking around smiling and having fun get a new volvo Brian
This was probably the best video comparison I've seen. Thanks, great content.
The little back and forth at the beginning was a total hoot! Not really what they were here to discuss, BUT, a lot of companies send their dispatch and other staff including execs on a driver course for a day or 2 to give them a taste. A days ride along can be a real eye opener for them as well. I think both a re a terrific idea. GREAT vid btw!
appreciate the positive feedback
Fantastic video! It's great to hear the different perspectives from people that actually have experience.
This was really good 👍Great information guys
At 120k miles a year his Kenworth is costing him around $80k in fuel where as a new cascadia will cost around $50k. You are spending about $30k more a year for a hood truck. You aren't going to spend $30k more in repairs every year on a new truck. BUT the biggest expense is losses revenue from the truck being in the shop. So a hood could be more efficient if it has less downtime. With today's market a 3 week downtime could cost you 30k in lost revenue
Depending where you run you can get decent fuel mileage out of the older truck but you have to go slower then 70 lol. I drove a w9 280" wheelbase 13 speed and when I drove slower I was able to get about 7 mpg, probably could've did a little better perhaps with a shorter wheelbase keeping the air from getting between the truck and trailer but hey I think 7 mpg is pretty good plus had a CAT motor
@@michaellee5399 thats not bad what model cat
@@ICYPROFITS it was a 2ws
Both are right on their own ends, but will go with technology🤓
Great content guys can't wait to see!!
Great video! Waiting for the analytic
We want a truck tour of your old truck
That will be an interesting comparison after the 90days.
we are looking forward to it.
I'm a company driver, operating in Indiana and the states that surround it. My previous truck was a 2016 Freightliner Cascadia, currently I'm in a 2019 Mack Anthem. I'd go back to the Freightliner in a heartbeat.
Great information guys love the content
Great video! Looking forward to the results of the 90 day challenge!
Appreciate the honest views from the owner operator.
I can't WAIT to see the results
I finally found a great trucking company that I’m working for! After years of hell with other companies! You guys give great advice and a great trucking company and family! If more trucking companies were honest like my boss and you guys the industry would be great.
I am relatively new to driving, only 1.75 yrs, but even I noticed, and so have to agree with Brian, that Volvo cabs and sleepers are flat out ergonomic. I also agree with Ronen that newer trucks are more economical - gimme the ching ching $$, BB! Many comments say old vs new depends on fleet size, where 1-3 trucks vs 4 or more? I hope the follow-up video addresses the fleet size. Can you make us a spreadsheet on this, Ronen, on what the critical mass is for a fleet size to begin running newer trucks? And ya, insurance costs matter as well. Nice job!
Why you never calculate more expensive insurance for brand new truck (up to 1000$ more per month) +def fluid 300$ per month ?
Nobody spends 300 a month on DEF. I use $150 max
love this vid! great conversation from two different sides
My 2021 truck has been down 3 weeks in the last 3 months
I’ve lost a lot of money on the time as a company driver I can’t imagine what my company had lost
My 2019 was just down for a month (DPF system, DEF sensor FINALLY came in). Part that time it was at the crane shop having a 1/2" line swapped back to a 5/8" line. Plus it was down for a week 2 months ago for the heater core.
Low constant cost vs variable random cost.
At the end of the day it comes down to your luck/warranties.
Fantastic debut
What came out?
Really well done video, and fascinating topic. Thank you. Bless you for your efforts.
There is one element I'm missing in this discussion: What about Gliders?
With a glider you have a nice new truck with all the advantages regarding comfort, but you don't have to deal with the emission problems
You're right.... but they don't make them anymore. I think the EPA made them stop in 2016. Trump administration tried to make them legal again but couldn't
@@darrenhanson7696 New gliders may not be an option anymore, but what about used one? I could imagine that owner operators are better off with a used glider and a new emission truck...
Have you priced used gliders lately?
The great debate🤙
I chose a 2015 Columbia glider with a 12.7 Detroit and a manual transmission. The truck provides the comfort for otr and the drivetrain keeps my operating costs down
I’m excited for this one! I personally drive a 2021 Kenworth T680 with a Cummins. I’m a company driver right now. Before this I drove a 2016 freightliner and that thing was in the shop a lot! The Kenworth I have no oh 75,000 miles and I have only been in the shop for maintenance. I personally love the look of the W 900 it is my favorite truck but for making money I would agree with Ronan. If old trucks made more money everyone would be doing it but from what I can see on the road is that the all trucks are fading out.
_This was so exciting to watch_
As a 25+ Year trucker. Just tell the truth man. The new technology is better. Always will be...
If you're going to use the argument "Why do you feel different about buying a new truck every few years when you buy a cell phone every few years?", then could we assume that the same logic applies to buying a house every few years? Do you expect your $200k house to be worthless after 5 years? No. Why can't we expect the equipment that has previously proven to last 10 years to continue to be as durable?
Exactly. Trucks these days costs the same as housing 😑.
read jay world post above
Yes truck can cost as much as a house, but this is a poor comparison. A truck depreciates way faster than a house. The minute the truck is driven off the lot you have instantly loss money. For most houses that is not the case. Also the longevity of a house is 5 time that of a truck at least. The cell phone comparison to the truck is a lot more logical. Not that cell phones break down.....they just become out dated and literally force consumers to buy newer phones. If DOT or law makers said ok if your truck does not have DEF than you can only do local runs than everyone would be forced to buy newer trucks if they want to do OTR. So even the cell phone comparison isn't accurate but more logical than a house. The best comparison was driving a new car vs an old car
I think this was the beginning I love you guys starting a great RUclips channel. Period love you guys
Good job guys!! Amazing video
What about the driver control ?
I understand the thaught of a driver !
A driver has much better control on his rig with a manual transmission in bad weather.
Sorry for my bad spelling I'm french !
🤣🤣🤣
I run 4 trucks and drive one my self, yes the newer trucks give more electrical problems at times but the new trucks are more comfortable and are nicer to drive and the automatic gearboxes are now good and with good drivers being hard to get nowadays the new trucks are more appealing to them over old trucks, also newly qualified drivers today cant operate a manual gearbox!
I'm newly qualified and I can shift. I don't even have a restriction on my license, except for eyeglasses.
@@sandasturner9529 Facts , I drive manual & auto 🚛 put me in whatever!
I’m relatively new and can shift and I prefer a 96 over a 21
Thank you guys for sharing
i am 30 years old and i hate the emissions truck nothing like old school thats where i learnt everything i was 13 at the time i was getting in to trucking and those trucks are still running
Good video. Like them two together, old vs young. Different views. 👏🏽👏🏽😎🤟🏽💯🇺🇸
I don’t mind spending that extra money in fuel for an old school unit…..all the technology kills the reliability of the new units….
I'm leaving in Brazil, I am a Brazilian truck driving, and I just love all your videos thanks a lot for your job, god bless your my brothers
Great back and forth without arguing.
Drove 15 years, accident free, now back in office and love it
Excellent video . . GREAT JOB guys
I would quit truckin before I would drive a gaycadia at any cost
Very good video, very informative
8:30 I think you intentionally cornered him !!😄😄😄😁😁😁😁👌👌🤣 I enjoyed it
Very entertaining video, Brian, your a star mate!!!. Who won the discussion, well Rohan edged it 55% 45%, you both made your case very well. Another interesting vid from ET.
Ronen not "Rohan." He's not from Lord of the Rings.
Very good conversation, learned a lot.
Super interesting, wanna see that video
Great discussion! It's the eternal battle, New vs Old. One metric that I think is important to measure is how do you feel walking out of the truck stop and looking at your truck. Are you excited thinking, "man, that thing is cool." Or, do you come out and look at your newer truck and think "yeah, it makes me a little more money, but the thing is generic and boring." For myself, I love the classic look and it makes me happy just driving it. I drive a '86 International CO 9670 cabover by the way. People smile, honk, wave, and that's worth money to me.
End it amazes me how you always know everything but nobody else knows it’s so amazing
I got my class A CDL in 1980 when I was 18 and soon I'll be 60. New trucks are simply better all around. You are free to disagree. I don't waste my time arguing anymore.
Good video, the discussion view points reminded me of an LT talking with a Senior NCO
Thanks for making the great and honest videos.
great discussion. i think a panel or 3 on 3 would be great.. management vs drivers & owner operators..
Yall keep it up, best wishes.
This was an excellent discussion! A lot of the pros and cons really thrown on the table there. I think the fuel economy is a big factor that I've always thought that a lot of drivers didn't take into account enough. While I drive a Pete with the old foxy style body, I work in the oil field where highway fuel economy is almost a complete non-factor. That said, I've never understood how so many people go for that style on an over the road truck.
Guy who sits behind a desk defends the newer trucks.
Guy who actually drives for a living goes for the older trucks. I agree with the latter.
The new trucks are awesome but I have a peace of mind knowing that I can diagnose and fix anything that can fail on the old rigs. They're simple compared to the new very complicated trucks. Also i only see about 0.5-0.7 mpg difference in my 96 N14 to my 2019 X15
i love you guys! 😂😂😂 New truck wins!
I enjoyed this so much
Ronin should’ve been a lawyer LOL
I'm on your side. Part of a business is making good business decisions especially financially. A new truck that runs more miles per gallon, some trucks like mine today usually get 10mpg cost half as much to run as a truck getting 5. A lot of owner ops I noticed go out and order long noses that are brand new AND GET 18 speeds making 605hp and 2050ft-lbs of torque. Then they get 5 miles per gallon in a newer truck. Eaton recommends 10-13 gears for long haul. Anything more is for oversize/ over 80,000lbs total vehicle weight. Same with the engine. If I can climb any hill and maintain speed with a motor making 300hp and 1000ft-lbs of torque there is no justification to go bigger.
Also I've noticed out of the 2 trucks I've driven once they go to the shop once they will not have another problem in the first 200,000 miles. I've never driven a truck with over 200,000 miles so I can't tell you how my first one is doing. But 1 time in the shop under warranty is no big deal. If you can't afford a week at the very most of being down you don't know what you're doing enough to own your own truck.
Lastly with speed. In the US which is different from Canada, we have 11/14/70. In your 11 driving hours, @62 mph your theoretical max is 682 miles, @65 max 715, @68 max 748, @70 max 770, @ 75 max 825, @80 max 880. If you want to drive faster it doesnt make sense to go more than 68 with all the efficiency technologies that are put in now that expect you to run full throttle because at faster speeds you start hitting bottlenecks, like lower posted speed limits on the highway, or traffic since you're catching everyone constantly. Why deal with the pain.
Let's say there is a half an hour slow down where everyone is averaging 10 mph through it, very common situation... An 80 mph truck loses 35 miles off their theoretical max, a 65 mph truck loses 22.5 miles off their theoretical max. So the new max is @65 max 692.5 miles, @80 max 845 miles.
That may seem pointless but my point is the faster you go the more barriers you will hit that will impact your mileage for the day. Some parts of the U.S that I drive instead of getting my theoretical max of 715 I end up getting 580 because of road and traffic conditions. So if I can be impacted that hard @65mph imagine how hard the 75 and 80 mph trucks get impacted. I can promise you unless you're running the right areas where you can stay open throttle and not have to accelerate constantly it is just a huge waste of fuel to not slow down. Only in the northern US can you avoid these bottlenecks....