Really nice tutorial on these grinds -- and it is a tutorial, despite the opening disclaimer :-) I just came across your channel yesterday, loved the chokecherry projects, and subscribed. I had the pleasure of attending a workshop that Stuart gave, so some tidbits from that: Stuart much prefers an elliptical flute, and immediately starts rolling the grind to remain tangent to the curve all the way around. In his experience that provides an entirely consistent angle of attack all around the edge. Next preference is a V or modified V, with a U flute a distant third. He also grinds the 40/40 in continuous sweep, which I found intimidating at the time. I still do :-) He also designed a set of angle gauges, now carried by Woodworker's Emporium, that permit you to set a platform angle in seconds -- so I now sharpen everything on the platform. I use a 35/35 for spindle gouges. Woodworker's Emporium also carries a bunch of other tools he designed. Last, he heavily relieves the heel of the grind, leaving less than half of the original bevel, and emphasizes that you should "glide" the bevel, not "ride" it. And really last: if you ever get a chance to see Stuart in person, jump on it. You'll be hard pressed to watch something more amazing than him turning an 8-10" thin walled bowl in a matter of minutes, all while talking to bystanders, answering questions, and telling funny, funny jokes. (Sorry for the thesis length comment...) Clyde
Clyde Ulmer Thanks for the kind words and for your subscription Clyde, much appreciated! I do remember Stuart suggesting the elliptical flute and that the v-shape can cause you to get a bit of a "beak" on the tip of the tool. That is something I came across and had to be very mindful of to make sure it doesn't happen. With the v-shape you can't make a continuous movement across the wing because you have to grind the wing almost separately from the bottom rounded portion to avoid a beak and to maintain the 40* wing sweep. So the elliptical flute would definitely eliminate these problems, so your suggestion is very important! It still works very well with the v, but elliptical would be optimal for sure. This is one reason I told people to check the demo on RUclips because I knew that I would be leaving too much out to get a satisfying explanation. The points you covered again are very important and I appreciate you taking the time to explain it properly, it helped me to understand it much better. There is so much to this grind that it takes a few minds together to understand it almost lol I would love to see Stuart do a live demo. The few I've seen on RUclips really shows he's one of the most skilled turners on earth. Much like his (late) father Allan. Brilliant turners. I usually relieve the heel on most of my grinds but I didn't do that and I should have. Your observation is keen. How do you find the 35-35 for spindle? Maybe I should try it out and make an amendment to this tutorial.....I mean this entertainment based video lol And yes I agree about glide versus ride. Too much pressure can cause vibration and burnishing and even heat build up. Thanks again Clyde, your comment should be added to this video! Kyler
And one more thing, I do want that angle tool he developed. I looked for it in lee valley but they don't carry it. I will look into woodworkers emporium. Thanks again!
Hey, Kyler -- glad you found my comment worthwhile. Wrt spindle sharpening, I just use Stuart's angle gauge to set the platform to 35 degrees. I have both 35 and 40 degree lines scribed on the platform, so it's then just a matter of remembering which tool I have in hand -- not necessarily a sure thing :-) The mechanics are the same, although you have to be aware of the depth of the flute on a spindle gouge. Oh, and it helps to grind a notch into your platform; I take the wings way far back on a detail gouge when I'm doing really delicate stuff. Clyde
Clyde Ulmer Thanks for all the info Clyde, it's greatly appreciated! I'm going to give that grind a go, it seems like very sound reasoning. I haven't experimented with detail gouges yet, although I understand they have a much shallower flute? Btw I'm going to pin your comment so that it shows up at the top of the comment section of this video because I think the information will be of great help to people. Again much appreciated!
Very nice job explaining how to make the grinds, especially the 40/40, which as it turns out I didn’t know how to do properly. Well worth the few minutes spent watching this video.
Cigar Smoka Thank you kindly! I had to watch Stuart Batty's demo several times before I could figure out how the grind was formed. Of all the grinds I use, it is by far the most complex. But it was well worth learning as I use this grind for a majority of my bowl work now. Kyler
Think you so much for the excellent tutorial. I just Got my 1st lathe a few days ago but I haven't bought any tools yet. I've been looking at the bowl gouges to start with And I found your video to be the most helpful.
I have heard all of the great reasons why 40/40 is better in some situations but have never seen a demo comparing the two on the same piece. I suggest this is a good video for you.
Gary Zeff Thanks for the suggestion Gary, that is a very good idea! I will start planning what I should go over and when I think I know what should be covered I will put a video together for that. Much appreciated!
For your 40/40 grind, that looks like one of the Thompson V gouges. I do have several of them. As for Stuart's 'swing the wing', that refers to a slight difference in how you sharpen a V flute compared to a parabolic flute. You don't swing the wing with a V flute, but do with a parabolic flute, and this is due to a straight wing (Thompson), compared to rounded wing on parabolic flutes. So no swing on the V because that can get you that little dip near the nose if you roll the flutes too slowly.
New sub for the excellent explanations for sharpening. Your method for the swept back grind is the first to be so detailed that I've come across. I will be implementing your quick set up methods. Thanks!
with the help of yours and a few other videos I tried this grind. (I turn everything dry) in soft wood I had awesome results, super clean. then tried a hard wood and not so impressed. my 'standard grind' worked better but i'll experiment more. thanks for your video
Hi Ty, I've tried a few different grinds but can't really decide which one I like better.I doubt if there's any one grind that suits every situation but being retired I only have one bowl gouge to play with and hate to keep grinding it down! I'm 74 years old and have been turning for almost two years and know I should be doing much better but the older I get the longer it takes me to learn new things! I want to do it all but I think that life's candle is starting to dim a tad! LOL Great tutorial on sharpening Ky! Thanks for the video,,, Tom
Thomas C Kuzia Lol you have a great sense on Humour Thomas! If you are wanting to stick with one bowl gouge that can handle most situations, the swept back grind (Ellsworth) is probably the best. I used it for the first 2-3 years of turning and there wasn't much it couldn't do. I said in the video that I don't use it as an all purpose tool but that was only because I now use it mostly for heavy roughing cuts and sheer scraping, and use the 40-40 for everything else except the bottom of bowls. I do use a bottom feeder bowl gouge for the bottom of bowls (ground to a traditional grind with a 75* bevel) but I didn't include it because I'm still experimenting with the grind. But a swept back (Ellsworth) grind would be the best all around tool. It has a 60* nose angle. If you search google images there are some really good diagrams of both the tool itself, as well has the jig settings if you don't buy the jig system from one of the manufacturers. I would however suggest the Oneway sharpening system with the vari-grind jig as it's very repeatable and user friendly. I hope this was helpful! Let me know if any further clarification is needed! Sometimes my explanations can be clear as mud lol Kyler
Tom - I will be 73 in April and love wood turning. Do not get down on yourself, thinking you “should be doing much better.” Don’t compare yourself to other turners and don’t worry about how long it takes you to learn something new. JUST ENJOY THE RIDE! As long as you enjoy the feeling you get when turning (it usually puts me in a great “zone”), and as long as you can do it safely, just keep doing it at your own speed and at your own level. Don’t try to rush it. .......Randy
Good Stuff, I hope you're feeling better soon, I see I need to either make or invest in some jigs, not that I can make a CBM wheel but it seems I need one of those also, I've been looking at that Robert Sorby sharpening system, but the price tag on it will knock you down ! it's suppose to be the cat's meow for sharpening tools, but it still doesn't tell you how one can sharpen the tools, great video my friend.
The Pohl Barn Projects Thanks for the kind words and concerns Doug, much appreciated! The CBN wheel I bought was around $200 CAD so it wasn't cheap, but it sharpens the same as the week after break in and it's been over 2 years now. Long term it is by far a good investment. Not to mention how cool the tool stays and the lack of sparks and dust from dressing wheels. Is the Robert Sorby the one what uses a belt system? If that's the one, I have heard good about it too. Much like the tormek. But I've noticed many production turners rely on wheel based low speed Grinder systems. Might be some food for thought. Thanks for tuning in my friend! Kyler
It is the belt system, but at 525 USD it's a big bite out of the pocket. then from what I understand you have to get different belts for it depending on what you want to use it for. I have the same grinder as you and a wheel and a couple of those fixtures would probably be a better way to go for me. but I do have a better understanding on how to sharpen those tools now, LOL I always wondered what the 40/40 grind was, Now I know.
The Pohl Barn Projects Wow that is crazy expensive! It better sharpen things so well they don't require sanding afterwards for that price! Lol the jigs and fixtures really make sharpening a breeze and saves tool steel as well.
Just randomly found your channel , good job on the “non tutorial”…lol I would beg to differ though on your comments regarding the non Asymmetrical grind for a gouge. You might want to check out some of Richard Ruffins videos where he specifically has a couple of gouges that are ground to an asymmetrical grind for the purpose of speeding up production turning Very much enjoyed this video and will check out more of your others Thank you
Lotta preparation before turning I see, and did not know,great tutorial Tyler,kinda like "getting the gullet" Ahaha I hope you get better this week ahead, The only suggestion I have is more rest, Take care and try and have a relaxing weekend..
Cynthia Herr Thank you for the kind words and concerns Cynthia, it's greatly appreciated! You're spot on that it is very much like getting the gullet. You have to remove the right amount of metal in the right place to get the cutter to cut properly. I will definitely make sure to get the rest I can so I can get back to normal. Thanks for tuning in Cynthia, your comments always brighten my day! Kyler
The second gouge has one lip higher than the other from the start. This is a fault that should be corrected from the beginning. When the video was over, it was still the same. A video camera, from the top view, would be necessary. I hope to see some day, a demonstrator teaching sharpening techniques with gouges that are really damaged or at least with a defective edge. Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge. Greetings
Just saw your video and liked it very much. The only "dimension" you didn't mention was the distance from the wheel. You indicated you have a line on the post. Can you tell us that dimension for the swept back gouge?
Just wondering did you buy your oneway lathe new and if so what has been your experience with a company? I see very few Post in the last couple years of anybody talking about unboxings or new purchases from one way lathe I'm interested in purchasing one.
I have the feeling you do a 40/50 grind... The wheel is set to 40 degrees in regards to the flute. But you move the flute a little of your 45 degree lines which is then 50 degrees in respect to the flute... Overall I guess it does not matter that much, since you like to work with your grind. I just want to point this out. Thanks for your video!
Stuart Batty makes it look easy, using his 40/40 grind. Then there are people saying that a bottom feeder is needed, with a 60 +grind. I find it hard to decide what to put on my gouges, any suggestions?
Joseph Wise Hello Joseph! I mentioned in the description that I also use a bottom feeder but I hesitate to demonstrate it yet because I'm still experimenting with the grind. So far I sharpen it similar to a traditional grind with very little sweep back and I sharpen it to about 75*. My sweptback grind is around 60* but at that angle I still tend to have the tool run into the rim of the bowl when cutting the bottom because the angle of the grind dictates the angle of the tool. I find at 75* that rarely happens unless it's a very deep and steep walled bowl. At which point it's approaching more of a closed mouth bowl or very open hollow form. 60* would cut more cleanly but if the tool runs into the rim then you can cut the bottom with bevel support anyways. 75* with light passes still leaves a good clean surface, just can't handle a heavy cut. Stuart Batty's bottom feeder is sharpened unlike any other I have seen and looks like it should be more what I should aim for. He demonstrated it in the video I linked in the description and well worth the watch. I hope this somewhat addresses the issue! Kyler
You need more than one gouge. I have a 60 degree Irish grind for bottom of the bowl work and use my 40/40 for everything else. However, I can freehand pullcut with the 40/40 off the bevel very well and that takes me close to final on the bottoms, leaving usually just a touch up with the bottom feeder or scraper. If you listen to Stuart he talks about not riding the bevel but gliding near it, that is what I do by pull cutting the bottom of my bowls with th e 40/40. Keep her sharp!
Please check out Clyde Ulmer's comment that I have pinned at the top of the comment section! It contains a lot of good information that should accompany this video! A big thanks to Clyde!
So you are blessed with many talents. I always look forward to your woodturning but this was a great surprise. This has been by far the best explanation of using the vari grind system that I have watched.That even includes the one produced by Oneway. Also I have watched a few videos on the 40/40 and again yours has made it as clear as Oregon water. And that is clear! What size is that 40/40 you use? It is time for me to get an early Christmas present. That comes before my birthday so why wait? Well done Kyler....and God Bless you as well Gary
ThePapa1947 Thanks for the kind words Gary! I know that Oregon water is clear by the beautiful photos you have posted in your videos. Amazing scenery and landscape out there! The bowl gouge with the 40/40 grind is a 1/2" Jimmy clews special made my Doug Thompson tools. It has a v-shaped flute and is made of some really nice steel. Holds an edge really well and sharpens really sharp. And I would say it would make a perfect early Christmas present lol God bless you Gary, I appreciate our friendship. Kyler
Hey brother what tool do you suggest for hollowing out bowls ? Do you like the carbide tip tools ? Thanks just did a green oak bowl and it was a bitch I had a hard time doing it. I just ordered my nova chuck set it was an anniversary set came with 3 sets of jaws and wood worm screw great deal 135.00 . Good to see you back ! John
Like all gouge grinding you want to minimize the grind on the tip or you will be grinding more on the sides of the tip. I find it much easier to just do a straight grind by rotating the tool and not worry about the wings. Having long wings on t he 40/40 grind is ok with softer woods where you can take more material away but for hardwoods you won't use so much of the wings. I only grind the wings when needed, otherwise I do a quick pass on them to keep them shaped but only worry about the tip and a bit to the cutting side of it, like Stuart I tend to do touchups only on the part that i will be cutting with.
Hi, I'm new to your channel and I would like to ask you, what is the name of the tool that used to sharpen the gouges, I live in Brazil and I want to import it. Can you help me? Which store can it be found? Amazon? Ebay? or on websites in China? hug.
Wanilton Oliveira Hello Wanilton. The Grinder itself is a 8" Rikon 1/2 hp slow speed Grinder. The sharpening system is made by Oneway. It comes with the two bases that sit under the wheels, one platform, and one v-arm. The jig that clamps on to the gouge is called the Vari-grind jig by Oneway and it is used with the v-arm. I've always ordered directly from Oneway. They are located in Canada. You have to phone your orders in with them. Other companies that carry woodturning supplies carry them (Lee Valley, Craft Supplies) but they may also be on amazon and eBay. Check google to see if there are any woodturning supply stores more local to you first to see if it's cheaper that way. And if all else fails, Captain Eddie Castelin has a video on RUclips that shows how to make your own at home. Other companies make very similar jig systems as well. Hope this helps! Kyler
Lots of good info, Kyler! I use the same system but a slightly different process. Whatever gets you there, right? I sure do like the CBN wheels but I made a costly mistake. I went with 1" instead of the 1 1/2". Dang, it pisses me off just bout every time I sharpen! Another great video, Kyler. Sorry you are under the weather. Hopefully you'll kick it to the curb, soon! Keep 'em coming!
madronawoodworks Thank you Phil! And yes you are right that whatever gets you sharp and ready, is what you should do! Sorry to hear you regret the size you purchased. I've done that with quite a few tools in my life and it definitely stings. Now it can take me forever to finalize a purchase because I have a fear of doing it again lol I spend so much time overthinking things now that by the time I buy it, it feels like half of my excitement has disappeared lol I'm slowly getting back to feeling my normal self. Thanks for your concerns! Kyler
I can't help but chime in on this. First of all I hope you feel well soon. As far the fear of buying the right thing. Believe me I have many more years of experience at doing that than you can imagine. Case in point 2 years ago I looked at the Laguna 1836 and was ready to buy it. I can't tell you why I didn't. I found a Jet 1442 on Craigslist and bought it. It was a fine lathe. Fast forward to a month ago and guess what? I end up buying the Laguna 1836.Had nothing to do with cost...it was....Is that the lathe I really want. Duh! New cars are another great adventure. I guess that is why we keep them for way more years than most do. I also have the same grinder as you. But no CBN wheel...now I know I need one. If you and Phil use it then it has to be good. What grit is yours? It is late here in Oregon but what better to do than watching RUclips. Take care of yourself, Gary
We keep our cars a looong time, too, Gary. I had my favorite truck for 17 years. I'd still have it if that semi hadn't rear-ended me while I sat at the red light. I have a Porter Cable grinder and it is grossly under-powered. It'll spin the twin CBN's but it takes awhile to get up to speed. Didn't know about the Rikon's at the time. I have an 80 grit and a 180 grit. I use the 80 for reshaping and for sharpening scrapers. I use the 180 for everything else. Some of the best money I've ever spent. It's almost as late here in Washington! Good night, all! Phil
ThePapa1947 Thanks for the concerns Gary, I'm pretty much better now but it was quite a long cold for me, especially for summertime! Phil is exactly right that 80 grit is best for reshaping and 180 is perfect for sharpening. Mine is 180 grit and sharpens things up really nice and about as fast as an 80 grit aluminum oxide wheel would. Just much cooler. One thing that is important to note is that CBN is for good high speed steel only. If you sharpen anything that is high carbon steel, it will plug up the wheel. Robo Hippie says when he has done that, he just sharpens a large HSS scraper and it cleans it out well. But I don't want to risk it. I noticed even my benjamins best tools were close to building up in the wheel so I still have a while aluminum oxide wheel on the left side to sharpen those while I still use the few I still do. It might not really build up that badly or permanently and may only get to a certain point, but I still decided to use aluminum oxide for them until they are used up. Hope this helps Gary!
madronawoodworks Getting rear ended by a semi doesn't sound like a fun experience, hopefully it didn't beat you up badly Phil! Have you ever had problems with softer steels building up in the wheels? I know CBN is for HSS only, but I've even had my benjamins best build up in my 180 wheel (seemingly) before. I know they are supposed to be HSS but it's hard to know for sure because they are somewhat of a less reputable company. It's why I still have a while aluminum oxide on the left. Just curious if others found this as well, or if it's just in my imagination? Lol
Will Mitchell I'm not actually sure, I never thought about that! But I would assume the bearings can handle it. If my bearing go early, then I will know I should have heeded your advice! Lol Sorry for late reply! Kyler
balance doesn't really refer to how much weight you have on each end of the shaft, but on the variation in weight from one side of a grinding wheel to the other side ofthe same wheel , caused by excentricities inthe wheel mounting or variations in density within the wheel itself, making one side heavier that the opposite side. Should be no problem for the bearings. Same as if you run a nylon buffing wheel on one side and a grinding wheel on the other--no problem for bearings.
Hello, I found your channel and I find your explanations of work pleasant. Unfortunately many Latinos do not speak English and we have to be seeing the subtitles instead of seeing your work. My suggestion is, translate your voice into Spanish for thousands of Latino turners ... I await your kind response ...
I don’t think I will EVER get the 40/40 grind. I got an A in every single math, geometry, calculus, trigonometry, that I ever took,, and I still don’t get it!
I really have no idea why you expect people to believe your videos are not instructional when all you do is tell us how and why you do things a particular way. You must think that by stating that caveat you are protected from some sort of liability. Perhaps you should consult an attorney to find out about liability.
Really nice tutorial on these grinds -- and it is a tutorial, despite the opening disclaimer :-) I just came across your channel yesterday, loved the chokecherry projects, and subscribed. I had the pleasure of attending a workshop that Stuart gave, so some tidbits from that: Stuart much prefers an elliptical flute, and immediately starts rolling the grind to remain tangent to the curve all the way around. In his experience that provides an entirely consistent angle of attack all around the edge. Next preference is a V or modified V, with a U flute a distant third. He also grinds the 40/40 in continuous sweep, which I found intimidating at the time. I still do :-) He also designed a set of angle gauges, now carried by Woodworker's Emporium, that permit you to set a platform angle in seconds -- so I now sharpen everything on the platform. I use a 35/35 for spindle gouges. Woodworker's Emporium also carries a bunch of other tools he designed. Last, he heavily relieves the heel of the grind, leaving less than half of the original bevel, and emphasizes that you should "glide" the bevel, not "ride" it. And really last: if you ever get a chance to see Stuart in person, jump on it. You'll be hard pressed to watch something more amazing than him turning an 8-10" thin walled bowl in a matter of minutes, all while talking to bystanders, answering questions, and telling funny, funny jokes. (Sorry for the thesis length comment...) Clyde
Clyde Ulmer Thanks for the kind words and for your subscription Clyde, much appreciated! I do remember Stuart suggesting the elliptical flute and that the v-shape can cause you to get a bit of a "beak" on the tip of the tool. That is something I came across and had to be very mindful of to make sure it doesn't happen. With the v-shape you can't make a continuous movement across the wing because you have to grind the wing almost separately from the bottom rounded portion to avoid a beak and to maintain the 40* wing sweep. So the elliptical flute would definitely eliminate these problems, so your suggestion is very important! It still works very well with the v, but elliptical would be optimal for sure. This is one reason I told people to check the demo on RUclips because I knew that I would be leaving too much out to get a satisfying explanation. The points you covered again are very important and I appreciate you taking the time to explain it properly, it helped me to understand it much better. There is so much to this grind that it takes a few minds together to understand it almost lol
I would love to see Stuart do a live demo. The few I've seen on RUclips really shows he's one of the most skilled turners on earth. Much like his (late) father Allan. Brilliant turners.
I usually relieve the heel on most of my grinds but I didn't do that and I should have. Your observation is keen.
How do you find the 35-35 for spindle? Maybe I should try it out and make an amendment to this tutorial.....I mean this entertainment based video lol
And yes I agree about glide versus ride. Too much pressure can cause vibration and burnishing and even heat build up.
Thanks again Clyde, your comment should be added to this video!
Kyler
And one more thing, I do want that angle tool he developed. I looked for it in lee valley but they don't carry it. I will look into woodworkers emporium. Thanks again!
Hey, Kyler -- glad you found my comment worthwhile. Wrt spindle sharpening, I just use Stuart's angle gauge to set the platform to 35 degrees. I have both 35 and 40 degree lines scribed on the platform, so it's then just a matter of remembering which tool I have in hand -- not necessarily a sure thing :-) The mechanics are the same, although you have to be aware of the depth of the flute on a spindle gouge. Oh, and it helps to grind a notch into your platform; I take the wings way far back on a detail gouge when I'm doing really delicate stuff. Clyde
Clyde Ulmer Thanks for all the info Clyde, it's greatly appreciated! I'm going to give that grind a go, it seems like very sound reasoning. I haven't experimented with detail gouges yet, although I understand they have a much shallower flute? Btw I'm going to pin your comment so that it shows up at the top of the comment section of this video because I think the information will be of great help to people. Again much appreciated!
Probably the best sharpening video I have seen on RUclips. Nice job mate.
Very nice job explaining how to make the grinds, especially the 40/40, which as it turns out I didn’t know how to do properly. Well worth the few minutes spent watching this video.
Cigar Smoka Thank you kindly! I had to watch Stuart Batty's demo several times before I could figure out how the grind was formed. Of all the grinds I use, it is by far the most complex. But it was well worth learning as I use this grind for a majority of my bowl work now.
Kyler
Fantastic explanation for sharpening gouges, thank you 🏴
Think you so much for the excellent tutorial. I just Got my 1st lathe a few days ago but I haven't bought any tools yet. I've been looking at the bowl gouges to start with And I found your video to be the most helpful.
Very good tutorial. To the point and easy to understand.
Best/simplest tutorial on this subject - no fuss, simple plain language - I'm off to the shed/workshop/studio, to have a crack at all three. Thanks 👍
I have heard all of the great reasons why 40/40 is better in some situations but have never seen a demo comparing the two on the same piece. I suggest this is a good video for you.
Gary Zeff Thanks for the suggestion Gary, that is a very good idea! I will start planning what I should go over and when I think I know what should be covered I will put a video together for that. Much appreciated!
For your 40/40 grind, that looks like one of the Thompson V gouges. I do have several of them. As for Stuart's 'swing the wing', that refers to a slight difference in how you sharpen a V flute compared to a parabolic flute. You don't swing the wing with a V flute, but do with a parabolic flute, and this is due to a straight wing (Thompson), compared to rounded wing on parabolic flutes. So no swing on the V because that can get you that little dip near the nose if you roll the flutes too slowly.
New sub for the excellent explanations for sharpening. Your method for the swept back grind is the first to be so detailed that I've come across. I will be implementing your quick set up methods. Thanks!
Tim Rhodes Thanks for the kind words Tim! I'm glad you found this helpful. Let me know if you have any questions. Safe and happy turning to you!
Kyler
with the help of yours and a few other videos I tried this grind. (I turn everything dry) in soft wood I had awesome results, super clean. then tried a hard wood and not so impressed. my 'standard grind' worked better but i'll experiment more. thanks for your video
oops didn't I tried the 40/40
Hi Ty,
I've tried a few different grinds but can't really decide which one I like better.I doubt if there's any one grind that suits every situation but being retired I only have one bowl gouge to play with and hate to keep grinding it down!
I'm 74 years old and have been turning for almost two years and know I should be doing much better but the older I get the longer it takes me to learn new things!
I want to do it all but I think that life's candle is starting to dim a tad! LOL
Great tutorial on sharpening Ky!
Thanks for the video,,,
Tom
Thomas C Kuzia Lol you have a great sense on Humour Thomas! If you are wanting to stick with one bowl gouge that can handle most situations, the swept back grind (Ellsworth) is probably the best. I used it for the first 2-3 years of turning and there wasn't much it couldn't do. I said in the video that I don't use it as an all purpose tool but that was only because I now use it mostly for heavy roughing cuts and sheer scraping, and use the 40-40 for everything else except the bottom of bowls. I do use a bottom feeder bowl gouge for the bottom of bowls (ground to a traditional grind with a 75* bevel) but I didn't include it because I'm still experimenting with the grind. But a swept back (Ellsworth) grind would be the best all around tool. It has a 60* nose angle. If you search google images there are some really good diagrams of both the tool itself, as well has the jig settings if you don't buy the jig system from one of the manufacturers. I would however suggest the Oneway sharpening system with the vari-grind jig as it's very repeatable and user friendly.
I hope this was helpful! Let me know if any further clarification is needed! Sometimes my explanations can be clear as mud lol
Kyler
I have a Oneway sharpening jig and also have my gouge sharpened to (basically) and Ellsworth grind!
Thanks for the reply,,,
Tom - I will be 73 in April and love wood turning. Do not get down on yourself, thinking you “should be doing much better.” Don’t compare yourself to other turners and don’t worry about how long it takes you to learn something new. JUST ENJOY THE RIDE! As long as you enjoy the feeling you get when turning (it usually puts me in a great “zone”), and as long as you can do it safely, just keep doing it at your own speed and at your own level. Don’t try to rush it. .......Randy
Very informative and well presented! Off to get a better wheel!
Gene Rozea Thanks Gene! I hope the video was helpful!
Kyler
I’m going to be setting up my wolverine for a 40 40 grind soon. I’m not sure how measure the angel of the tool rest relative to the wheel
Ty, this is a wonderful, detailed video. Just discovered your channel.
Good Stuff, I hope you're feeling better soon, I see I need to either make or invest in some jigs, not that I can make a CBM wheel but it seems I need one of those also, I've been looking at that Robert Sorby sharpening system, but the price tag on it will knock you down ! it's suppose to be the cat's meow for sharpening tools, but it still doesn't tell you how one can sharpen the tools, great video my friend.
The Pohl Barn Projects Thanks for the kind words and concerns Doug, much appreciated! The CBN wheel I bought was around $200 CAD so it wasn't cheap, but it sharpens the same as the week after break in and it's been over 2 years now. Long term it is by far a good investment. Not to mention how cool the tool stays and the lack of sparks and dust from dressing wheels. Is the Robert Sorby the one what uses a belt system? If that's the one, I have heard good about it too. Much like the tormek. But I've noticed many production turners rely on wheel based low speed Grinder systems. Might be some food for thought. Thanks for tuning in my friend!
Kyler
It is the belt system, but at 525 USD it's a big bite out of the pocket. then from what I understand you have to get different belts for it depending on what you want to use it for. I have the same grinder as you and a wheel and a couple of those fixtures would probably be a better way to go for me. but I do have a better understanding on how to sharpen those tools now, LOL I always wondered what the 40/40 grind was, Now I know.
The Pohl Barn Projects Wow that is crazy expensive! It better sharpen things so well they don't require sanding afterwards for that price! Lol the jigs and fixtures really make sharpening a breeze and saves tool steel as well.
Just randomly found your channel , good job on the “non tutorial”…lol
I would beg to differ though on your comments regarding the non Asymmetrical grind for a gouge.
You might want to check out some of Richard Ruffins videos where he specifically has a couple of gouges that are ground to an asymmetrical grind for the purpose of speeding up production turning
Very much enjoyed this video and will check out more of your others
Thank you
Very good tutorial.
Lotta preparation before turning I see, and did not know,great tutorial Tyler,kinda like "getting the gullet" Ahaha
I hope you get better this week ahead, The only suggestion I have is more rest,
Take care and try and have a relaxing weekend..
Cynthia Herr Thank you for the kind words and concerns Cynthia, it's greatly appreciated! You're spot on that it is very much like getting the gullet. You have to remove the right amount of metal in the right place to get the cutter to cut properly. I will definitely make sure to get the rest I can so I can get back to normal. Thanks for tuning in Cynthia, your comments always brighten my day!
Kyler
Nicely explained!
The second gouge has one lip higher than the other from the start. This is a fault that should be corrected from the beginning. When the video was over, it was still the same. A video camera, from the top view, would be necessary. I hope to see some day, a demonstrator teaching sharpening techniques with gouges that are really damaged or at least with a defective edge. Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge. Greetings
Thanks, New to turning and am wanting to learn to sharpen my turning tools.
Stephen Emerson I'm happy to hear you found this video helpful Stephen, and I appreciate you taking the time to comment. Sorry for the late reply!
Just saw your video and liked it very much. The only "dimension" you didn't mention was the distance from the wheel. You indicated you have a line on the post. Can you tell us that dimension for the swept back gouge?
Great vidio. very easy to understand.
Just wondering did you buy your oneway lathe new and if so what has been your experience with a company? I see very few Post in the last couple years of anybody talking about unboxings or new purchases from one way lathe I'm interested in purchasing one.
I have the feeling you do a 40/50 grind... The wheel is set to 40 degrees in regards to the flute. But you move the flute a little of your 45 degree lines which is then 50 degrees in respect to the flute...
Overall I guess it does not matter that much, since you like to work with your grind. I just want to point this out.
Thanks for your video!
Stuart Batty makes it look easy, using his 40/40 grind. Then there are people saying that a bottom feeder is needed, with a 60 +grind. I find it hard to decide what to put on my gouges, any suggestions?
Joseph Wise Hello Joseph! I mentioned in the description that I also use a bottom feeder but I hesitate to demonstrate it yet because I'm still experimenting with the grind. So far I sharpen it similar to a traditional grind with very little sweep back and I sharpen it to about 75*. My sweptback grind is around 60* but at that angle I still tend to have the tool run into the rim of the bowl when cutting the bottom because the angle of the grind dictates the angle of the tool. I find at 75* that rarely happens unless it's a very deep and steep walled bowl. At which point it's approaching more of a closed mouth bowl or very open hollow form. 60* would cut more cleanly but if the tool runs into the rim then you can cut the bottom with bevel support anyways. 75* with light passes still leaves a good clean surface, just can't handle a heavy cut. Stuart Batty's bottom feeder is sharpened unlike any other I have seen and looks like it should be more what I should aim for. He demonstrated it in the video I linked in the description and well worth the watch. I hope this somewhat addresses the issue!
Kyler
You need more than one gouge. I have a 60 degree Irish grind for bottom of the bowl work and use my 40/40 for everything else. However, I can freehand pullcut with the 40/40 off the bevel very well and that takes me close to final on the bottoms, leaving usually just a touch up with the bottom feeder or scraper. If you listen to Stuart he talks about not riding the bevel but gliding near it, that is what I do by pull cutting the bottom of my bowls with th e 40/40. Keep her sharp!
What type of steel is used to create that bowl gouge? Is it tool steel? Very practical video.
Please check out Clyde Ulmer's comment that I have pinned at the top of the comment section! It contains a lot of good information that should accompany this video! A big thanks to Clyde!
So you are blessed with many talents. I always look forward to your woodturning but this was a great surprise.
This has been by far the best explanation of using the vari grind system that I have watched.That even includes the one produced by Oneway.
Also I have watched a few videos on the 40/40 and again yours has made it as clear as Oregon water. And that is clear!
What size is that 40/40 you use? It is time for me to get an early Christmas present. That comes before my birthday so why wait?
Well done Kyler....and God Bless you as well
Gary
ThePapa1947 Thanks for the kind words Gary! I know that Oregon water is clear by the beautiful photos you have posted in your videos. Amazing scenery and landscape out there!
The bowl gouge with the 40/40 grind is a 1/2" Jimmy clews special made my Doug Thompson tools. It has a v-shaped flute and is made of some really nice steel. Holds an edge really well and sharpens really sharp. And I would say it would make a perfect early Christmas present lol
God bless you Gary, I appreciate our friendship.
Kyler
Hey brother what tool do you suggest for hollowing out bowls ? Do you like the carbide tip tools ? Thanks just did a green oak bowl and it was a bitch I had a hard time doing it. I just ordered my nova chuck set it was an anniversary set came with 3 sets of jaws and wood worm screw great deal 135.00 . Good to see you back !
John
Like all gouge grinding you want to minimize the grind on the tip or you will be grinding more on the sides of the tip. I find it much easier to just do a straight grind by rotating the tool and not worry about the wings. Having long wings on t he 40/40 grind is ok with softer woods where you can take more material away but for hardwoods you won't use so much of the wings. I only grind the wings when needed, otherwise I do a quick pass on them to keep them shaped but only worry about the tip and a bit to the cutting side of it, like Stuart I tend to do touchups only on the part that i will be cutting with.
Whats a good angle for that swept back one? tradiotionel is 45* no? I will try to make one of those, a 40/40 and spindle. To get started.
What grit is your CBN? Awesome video, thanks
Please check out Clyde Ulmer's comment below for additional information on the 40-40 grind! It compliments this and Stuart's demo very nicely!
Good instructional video
icespeckledhens Thanks and sorry for the late reply!
Kyler
Thank you for your valuable efforts
Very informative as always my friend 😁 feel better soon 👍
Woodturning by Alan Scannell Thank you Alan, I appreciate the kind words and concerns!
what is the grit number on your CBN grinding wheel? thanks
Hi, I'm new to your channel and I would like to ask you, what is the name of the tool that used to sharpen the gouges, I live in Brazil and I want to import it. Can you help me? Which store can it be found? Amazon? Ebay? or on websites in China? hug.
Wanilton Oliveira Hello Wanilton. The Grinder itself is a 8" Rikon 1/2 hp slow speed Grinder. The sharpening system is made by Oneway. It comes with the two bases that sit under the wheels, one platform, and one v-arm. The jig that clamps on to the gouge is called the Vari-grind jig by Oneway and it is used with the v-arm. I've always ordered directly from Oneway. They are located in Canada. You have to phone your orders in with them. Other companies that carry woodturning supplies carry them (Lee Valley, Craft Supplies) but they may also be on amazon and eBay. Check google to see if there are any woodturning supply stores more local to you first to see if it's cheaper that way. And if all else fails, Captain Eddie Castelin has a video on RUclips that shows how to make your own at home. Other companies make very similar jig systems as well. Hope this helps!
Kyler
Very informative! New visitor to your channel and new subscriber.
Don Bomer Thanks for the kind words and for your subscription Don!
Kyler
Very helpfull,thanx🤠👍
Lots of good info, Kyler! I use the same system but a slightly different process. Whatever gets you there, right? I sure do like the CBN wheels but I made a costly mistake. I went with 1" instead of the 1 1/2". Dang, it pisses me off just bout every time I sharpen!
Another great video, Kyler. Sorry you are under the weather. Hopefully you'll kick it to the curb, soon! Keep 'em coming!
madronawoodworks Thank you Phil! And yes you are right that whatever gets you sharp and ready, is what you should do!
Sorry to hear you regret the size you purchased. I've done that with quite a few tools in my life and it definitely stings. Now it can take me forever to finalize a purchase because I have a fear of doing it again lol I spend so much time overthinking things now that by the time I buy it, it feels like half of my excitement has disappeared lol
I'm slowly getting back to feeling my normal self. Thanks for your concerns!
Kyler
I can't help but chime in on this. First of all I hope you feel well soon.
As far the fear of buying the right thing. Believe me I have many more years of experience at doing that than you can imagine.
Case in point 2 years ago I looked at the Laguna 1836 and was ready to buy it. I can't tell you why I didn't.
I found a Jet 1442 on Craigslist and bought it. It was a fine lathe. Fast forward to a month ago and guess what? I end up buying the Laguna 1836.Had nothing to do with cost...it was....Is that the lathe I really want. Duh!
New cars are another great adventure. I guess that is why we keep them for way more years than most do.
I also have the same grinder as you. But no CBN wheel...now I know I need one. If you and Phil use it then it has to be good. What grit is yours?
It is late here in Oregon but what better to do than watching RUclips.
Take care of yourself,
Gary
We keep our cars a looong time, too, Gary. I had my favorite truck for 17 years. I'd still have it if that semi hadn't rear-ended me while I sat at the red light.
I have a Porter Cable grinder and it is grossly under-powered. It'll spin the twin CBN's but it takes awhile to get up to speed. Didn't know about the Rikon's at the time.
I have an 80 grit and a 180 grit. I use the 80 for reshaping and for sharpening scrapers. I use the 180 for everything else. Some of the best money I've ever spent.
It's almost as late here in Washington! Good night, all!
Phil
ThePapa1947 Thanks for the concerns Gary, I'm pretty much better now but it was quite a long cold for me, especially for summertime!
Phil is exactly right that 80 grit is best for reshaping and 180 is perfect for sharpening. Mine is 180 grit and sharpens things up really nice and about as fast as an 80 grit aluminum oxide wheel would. Just much cooler. One thing that is important to note is that CBN is for good high speed steel only. If you sharpen anything that is high carbon steel, it will plug up the wheel. Robo Hippie says when he has done that, he just sharpens a large HSS scraper and it cleans it out well. But I don't want to risk it. I noticed even my benjamins best tools were close to building up in the wheel so I still have a while aluminum oxide wheel on the left side to sharpen those while I still use the few I still do. It might not really build up that badly or permanently and may only get to a certain point, but I still decided to use aluminum oxide for them until they are used up.
Hope this helps Gary!
madronawoodworks Getting rear ended by a semi doesn't sound like a fun experience, hopefully it didn't beat you up badly Phil!
Have you ever had problems with softer steels building up in the wheels? I know CBN is for HSS only, but I've even had my benjamins best build up in my 180 wheel (seemingly) before. I know they are supposed to be HSS but it's hard to know for sure because they are somewhat of a less reputable company. It's why I still have a while aluminum oxide on the left. Just curious if others found this as well, or if it's just in my imagination? Lol
Well explained
Isn't the grinder out of balance with tg CBN wheel on one side and the regular stone on the other? Risk of ruining the bearings?
Will Mitchell I'm not actually sure, I never thought about that! But I would assume the bearings can handle it. If my bearing go early, then I will know I should have heeded your advice! Lol
Sorry for late reply!
Kyler
balance doesn't really refer to how much weight you have on each end of the shaft, but on the variation in weight from one side of a grinding wheel to the other side ofthe same wheel , caused by excentricities inthe wheel mounting or variations in density within the wheel itself, making one side heavier that the opposite side. Should be no problem for the bearings. Same as if you run a nylon buffing wheel on one side and a grinding wheel on the other--no problem for bearings.
Great explanation! Thanks!
Bravo
thank you
Peke's Repose No problem! Hope you found this helpful, and thanks for watching!
Kyler
How do I clean my cBn 😊wheel
Hello, I found your channel and I find your explanations of work pleasant.
Unfortunately many Latinos do not speak English and we have to be seeing the subtitles instead of seeing your work.
My suggestion is, translate your voice into Spanish for thousands of Latino turners ...
I await your kind response ...
When are you gonna make another wood turning video? I hope you’re doing ok and all is well. Have a great day.
Looks like it's a dead channel. Been 2 years and nothing.
good teacher, thanks :)
You have to leave barely a 1/8 bevel, you did not take yours off.
Ooo you poor love 😂 ill bet it’s a job to even talk
Why do people make the "entertainment only" statement? Was someone sued over being dumb or something?
Hi
Jasurbek Masharipov Hello there!
@@woodturnerky8556 Hello happy new year!
Jasurbek Masharipov Happy New Year to you as well!
@@woodturnerky8556 Thank you!
On the Woodprix website, you buy access to thousands of projects once.
Cubic Boron Nitride. Not Nitrate
I don’t think I will EVER get the 40/40 grind. I got an A in every single math, geometry, calculus, trigonometry, that I ever took,, and I still don’t get it!
We do it by folding space. 😂
I really have no idea why you expect people to believe your videos are not instructional when all you do is tell us how and why you do things a particular way. You must think that by stating that caveat you are protected from some sort of liability. Perhaps you should consult an attorney to find out about liability.
Thank you