How to emulate all Atari ST variants
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- Опубликовано: 24 июл 2024
- How to configure Hatari (or steem is you please) To emulate all the variations of the ST computer line. Including the ST, STE, Mega-ST and Mega-STE as well as the TT and Falcon line of computers.
Covers the legitimate, period appropriate, options for each machine and Maxes them out.
Contents
00:00 - Introduction
01:15 - The ST
03:00 - The Mega-ST
03:43 - The ST-E
05:05 - The Mega-STE
06:05 - The TT
08:48 - The Falcon 030
11:50 - Coming Soon
Credits
Sound credits
The Elephant sound came from free sound user: y89312, Link to clip: freesound.org/s/139875/
Image credits:
The mega ST image was by Adam Podstawczyński available in wikicommons link for license at: commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
The Atari TT image came from Wikipedia and was placed in the public domain by Tim Kovack with out a request for attribution, but credit where credit is due.
The Mega-STE image by: Francisco Rodrigo Escobedo Robles, available in wikicommons, link for license: commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Tux Image by: Iwan Gabovitch, original url: commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
68000 Image by: Pauli Rautakorpi original URL: commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
DSP 56001 image by Pauli Rautakorpi, original URL: commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
Atari FalcoN Image by LosHawlos, original image URL: commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi... 
Наука
4:58 STE were delivered with TOS 1.06 then TOS 1.62. The 2.0x versions were later versions for the Mega STE.
You're toatally correct, I checked my notes and I hjave copy pated the wrong specs into the STE
I think later STEs also came with 2.06. I have 2.06 in my 1040 STE (ok, it originally had 1.06 afaik)!
Thank for this video. Aranym is great solution for "new Atari machine". AFROS for the distribution.
Right now I'm swearing at it profusely. With AFROS as you say it's easy enough to come to terms with but other wise, muter, mutter, mutter....
I've owned all the models apart from the TT and even two Falcons. I first saw a Falcon 030 in a pro recording studio in 1992, but on my next visit the owner had got rid of it and gone back to his trusty ST. In 2010 I had a full blown fully upgraded Falcon 030 14MB 60ns, with all the SoundPool interfaces etc and Steinberg Cubase Audio 2.06, but I can see that being an early adopter that studio owner would have had major headaches getting it to run reliably. Mine was fine apart from getting a suitable SCSI hard drive for the audio files. Once that was obtained it ran ok.
all still great machines, emulated or real
More awesome content! It seems you've cornered the market regards in-depth ST / TOS content. Pure gold!
Glad you like it.
I purchased a Mega 4 ST when it came out, I took out my first loan to buy it with a megafile 30 hard drive. I sent a cashiers check to B&H photo and eventually got my computer. I also had the XT IBM emulator cartridge that I had to rob a bios chip from an old XT to get it running. It was my very favorite computer and I miss it. I still have all my floppies from back in the day. I hope to build a emulated or VM system to bring it back to life.
Thats how this whole RUclips channel got started. Me wanting to recreate my old setups! I've never set eyes on a Mega ST or STE, I can't even remember seeing them in the stores at the time. I guess they were more of a US thing?
@@commodoreisnottheonlyfruit They really weren't in the stores here wither. The 8-bit's were everywhere, Sears for example. The ST line was sold though small independent computer shops or mail order catalog. I remember sending that almost 2K$ check in the mail with my order # to New York cities B&H photo. For a 15-16 year old that was stressful! I have a few pictures of my computer setups, I send them to your email.
The internal expansion in the Mega is an VME Bus, and is compatible with (but not 100% the same as) the TT VME slots - There was an Official Atari 19" Monitor SM194, that natively displayed the 1280x960. Somewhere I read an article that said TOS detects an attached "super" HiRes Monitor via the DIN plug monitor connection (different resistance on one pin?), however ALL TOS ROMS contain the ability to use a 1280x960 (not just TT - I found that out by hacking the PCE Atari ST emulation sources, which uses TOS v1.00 by default) when used with the Nova Viking driver (by Ralf Zimmermann, available at the bottom of the Driver Software page, on the Atari Document Archive)
This is intriguing. I'll have to look into it for my real hardware. I wonder if an adaptor and my Open Source Scan Converter can hack it.
@@commodoreisnottheonlyfruit I think its might detect 72Hz (or maybe thats the standard AtariST HiRes monitor) - I read an article about to years ago, and I am pretty sure it said you could fake the SuperHiRes detect in a normal SVGA / multi-sync with a n inline resistor, but I dont remember where I read it, sorry
Nice and informative video! Haven't tried the actual version 2.4.1 of Hatari, but older versions were a bit tricky when it comes to acurate Falcon emulation.
You have to fiddle around with the lower settings in System Options and especially CPU emulation parameters. Settings which work with 2.3x doesn't with newer 2.3x versions etc.
Btw. the first thing to do when starting any emulation in Hatari is pressing AltGr+m for keeping the mouse cursor inside the ST screen!
2.4.1 is pretty solid. No Issues. I was playing around on the 2.5-development branch and Found a few demos tahe now work much better. So I'm looking forward to that comming out. Eventually....
Agree, great video! Thanks. For Hatari (version 1.2.0 at least) I didn't experience the same myself; It was/is excellent for Atari Falcon emulation (didn't need any special settings, it just worked great for all the scenarios I tried and had my Falcon 030 for comparison); I wanted it for running some of the great Demo's I had collected, it was a bit of a pain to have to break out the machine every time I wanted to hear the amazing tunes; Though still can't beat the audio on the original hardware IMO). The only caveat I personally found with setup was making sure I built the source code as a release (or I faced timing issues). Though, with the pre-built windows binary worked just great. Mind you, I am a Windows (7) user, so I can't speak for other platforms.
7:43 The blue box to show where to put the TT-RAM is wrong. The TT-RAM connector is the black 96 pin socket above the golden 68030 CPU left of the blue box.
The board had a daughter board marked "Atari 32 Meg Daughter board / PGA" So i assumed that was what was Ment. But your correct, I mis labeled. Thanks for these comments, I appreciate your knowledge.
@@commodoreisnottheonlyfruit no, problem. I'm just an annoying nitpicker 🙂. As I have a TT and am currently working on extending. I broke a pin of the extension and will have to change the whole connector (96 very dense pins), so I have the layout currently on my mind.
3:28 When Mega ST came out they were available with 2 or 4 MiB, the later also with 1 MiB. Never, ever with 512 KiB.
Correct again. THis was the same as the last copy paste fat fingered error :-)
Hatari doesn't seem to accept a fpu in mega ste mode, you can set it in the menu but after the reboot it is automaticly turned off again. Maybe I'm doing something wrong but i can't seem to get it working, It works fine in TT emulation.
The 68000 could not work properly with a 68881/68882 coprocessor which were defined to be used with 68020/030. It was possible to use a coprocessor with the 68000 but it would have to handle the communication protocol manually. Atari proposed a coprocessor card for the Mega-ST called SFP-004 and proposed a API to use them in programs. The Mega-STE also had a socket for a 68881, but it would follow the same protocol as SFP-004. Normal programs that used $Fxxx coprocessor instructions do not work on 68000 CPU, that's why gembench and sysinfo do not show that there is a FPU.
You can read all the gory details by googling "Atari SFP-004 by example"
Well done, you said EmuTOS right! 😀👏
To para-phrase George Raferty, "If I got it right, I'll get it wrong next time" :-)
Silly question, are you sure the FPU option in Hatari works? No matter I try, after Atari reboot the FPU option is always back to "None".
Have a look at @galier2 s comment lower in this thread. He covers it really well
I'm using hatari, but it doesn't emulate the MegaSTe properly.
The MegaSTe had a 68010, but when setting the CPU to 68010, booting TOS 2.06 crashes.
(I had a MegaSTe with built-in TOS 2.06 and it worked perfectly).
-It's a good emulator, but I really wish the 68010 emulation would work (the only major difference is the RTD instruction, but I don't know if the loop-mode on the DBcc instructions and CPU cache would be emulated). [16MHz without cache would be approximately the same speed as 8MHz, but turning on CPU-cache almost doubles the speed when running 16MHz].
This is strange, I just ran a test using TOS 2.06 uk version Mega STE system and a 68010 running at 8 and 16 Mhz and both worked fine in Hatari.
What version of Hatari are you using?
@@commodoreisnottheonlyfruit v2.4.1 on an 8GB Raspberry Pi 4B.
-If you have a different version, I'll be happy to try and build it and test if it will work for me.
the Mega STe didnt have 68010 CPU, it had 68000 at 16/8MHz. I know few people who used 68010 on their Mega ST (non E) with modified TOS called KAOS. I would suggest to you to give a try to EmuTOS since it has more hardware covered then stock versions of TOS, maybe TOS 2.06 didnt have 68010 full support.
@@madigorfkgoogle9349 - The 68000 did *not* have a one-instruction cache, it did *not* have a VBR either and it definitely did not have an RTD instruction.
I had a MegaSTe, which came with a 68010 installed.
I wrote a debugger, which emulated 68010, 68020, 68030, 68040, 68060 and CPU32 instructions, and I made a CPU-detection.
-I know for sure that all danish MegaSTe came with a 68010 pre-installed. A total of 5 MegaSTes were sold in Denmark, I bought one of those.
According to the web, it seems that earlier variants came with a 68000 CPU, but Atari did ship all the danish MegaSTes with a 68010.
@@Miesiu - That is partly correct.
See my other reply.
My debugger detects the 68010 by checking if the RTD instruction exists (and it also changes the VBR so it's invisible to any software trying to detect a debugger).
On original ST/STF/STM/'STFM/STe/MegaST it reports 68000, on original MegaSTe it says 68010, on Falcon030 it says 68030. This is all by detecting the CPU from the CPUs available instructions.
-Oh, and my debugger works in emulators today and when I change CPUs in the emulators, it still correctly detects the CPUs that are selected in Hatari.
What TOS in the TT?
Any of the v3 versions 3.04 was what I used. Or emutos will also eork
24bit is true colour, i still have my mega ste 8meg and my falcon in my loft....
Lucky you for having a Falcon :-)
Your right about 24bit being True Color these days, but Atari described their 16 bit graphics as TrueColor. So I'm sticking to my guns :-)
So, I think Atari is right to desribe it as true color, as every pixel at 320x200 can be a unique color (e.g. 320x200=64,000). I also recall, as a developer, you specified the color's for the pallet using 24 bit values, 1 byte for each of R G B. So, whilst I cannot speak to how they implemented that and wether there was colour repeats in that range... I can say it was, to a consumer, a true color system. I did a basic check on the internet and the Wiki says the VIDEL chio was 18bit colour (Palette of 262,144 possible colours), so possibly there where colours it 'cheated'. Atari was a bit like that, with the whole 32 bits claim for a 16 bit bus (Not to mention the claim of the Jaguar being 64bits).
@@commodoreisnottheonlyfruit back in days "True Color" was video mode that does not have CLUT (Color Look Up Table) or Palette. It was mode where value of bytes represent a color and not position in palette.
Apple called their modes like "Thousand of colors" and "Millions of colors" but I think that first time True Color was used is some graphic card for Mac that was able to display 24bit colors or 16 millions of colors.
It is funny how these days we have 10bit per color or 30bit colors which we apply sticker "HDR" to these modes...
Even in 90s I was quite surprised that Microsoft gave name "True Color" to 24bit mode since even then it was obvious that human eye can distinct more than 16 millions of colors.
I remember the first time I saw a 256 colour image and was gobsmacked. My MacBook screen is the only hdr screen I have access to, and I have to say it’s amazing looking
@@commodoreisnottheonlyfruit Yes, first time when I saw 256 color GIF downloaded over 2400baud modem from BBS and displayed on PC with VGA monitor using... I forgot the name of famouse program for displaying images in DOS :/
But latter we got e.g. Speed of Light on Atari, or Photochrome that could display more than 512 colors on ST... and Falcon was ok with displaying JPEGs very fast with DSP JPEG viewer...
Linux was developed on Sinclair QL, which was 68008 based.
I know Linus had a QL when he was you and developed gmove for it. But as far as i know (could be wrong) Linux started out as a 386 PC based project.
@@commodoreisnottheonlyfruit - I remember watching an interview with Linus, where he said that he had a Sinclair QL and he wanted something like UNIX and telling that was why he started developing Linux.
-But I don't remember much else, so it's best to get the information from himself, not from me. 😉
I only wanted to point out that the first 68k based machine running Linux would be the QL (well, if what I'm saying is true).
-If you know more about the 386 based project, that would be interesting.
-Anyway, thank you for your great videos; I enjoy them very much. 😃
@@68HC060 I dont think you are right since as far as Im aware Linus coded the Linux at university. Im not sure if Linus ever ported the Linux to QL at all. Besides that, in the video the TT was mentioned to run UNIX not Linux, and there were plenty of computers based on MC68000 running UNIX or GNU long before Linus coded his Linux. Search for AT&T, SUN, HP workstations based on MC68000.
If you're going to talk about Hatari distinct from Atari then, maybe you shouldn't pronounce it as 'Atari. lol
When you record yourself you realize you mispronounce so many words. But I'm pretty ruthless at not doing retakes after the fact as the audio never balances out.
I just did a video on Fluid synth and I pronounced arackno as arcano, every other time.
I do, however, as my mum used to say, mean well :-)
so which machine should i emulate to get the best compatabilty/performance/graphics for games? hoping for a one machine setup does all??
Probably a plain ST system 512 or 1024 memory and TOS 1.62. For games that need a blitter an STE system and TOS 2.06.
Generally I keep a collection of TOS rims and if I get issues, just step down the version numbers till the crash goes away ;-)
@@commodoreisnottheonlyfruit cheers thanks for the advice really appreciate it 👍