Bosch Axial Glide VS Festool Kapex
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- Опубликовано: 5 янв 2021
- I borrowed this Bosch Axial-Glide Miter Saw from my great buddy Jay:). I've used it a few times helping Jay out with some trim work. I've also been testing it for the last 3 weeks in my garage. I've used the Festool Kapex for the last 5 years(I purchased it from KMS Tools). In this review I will be offering my overall thoughts on the Bosch GCM12SD and how it compares to the Festool Kapex120.
PS. Sorry for crushing the saw Buddy- but you do know I'm a fussy son of a bucket! 
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I have the Bosch glide and really do like it. I have not had any issues with deflection and honestly the glide mechanism is my favorite part. On the dust collection I made a custom boot and that greatly improved dust collection. Not saying it’s better than a festool but works great for me.
That’s awesome Gary. modifying your tools to work better is a outstanding move- If u ever make a utube video that would be a good one to share!
Hi Gary, I too have the Bosch 12” glide saw and I would like to see some pictures of your dust collection modifications? I like saw a lot, but I knew going in that the dust collection wasn’t the greatest! Thanks in advance!
Hi Gary, I too have the Bosch 12” glide saw and I would like to see some pictures of your dust collection modifications? I like saw a lot, but I knew going in that the dust collection wasn’t the greatest! Thanks in advance!
@@robertsamagalsky1617 What is the best way to send a photo? It’s really is just an extended versioning the original boot. But catches a nice amount.
m.ruclips.net/video/pRlZGApo6vA/видео.html here is a link to a video of someone who did something similar. I believe I got the idea from him. I just did it in one piece of rubber mat.
My two bits here. I gave my shop guys a festool to try over the glide arm and it took them less than a month to go back to the Bosch and the festool is still sitting where they left it on the storage side of the shop untouched. The saw struggled greatly cutting thru 4x4 or or anything larger and the handle was so bad my main guy said his wrist was killing him at the end of the day. Yes the Bosch is heavy (if your a girl) but it’s meant to be a completely stationary bolted down saw not a job sight saw. But something I’ve learned that I see is true in your videos is Milwaukee fan boys may be staunch and snap on fan boys may be fierce but never.. ever try to persuade a festool fan boy (i.e you)
I have the 10 inch version of this saw, like you said, it stays in my shop in one place, I don't lug it around, I also have a cheap craftsman cordless saw that weights about 25Lbs for working outside, the only thing I really dislike about the saw is changing the blades, wish you didn't have to remove part of the guard to get to it
I use this shop in my shop every day. I don’t hate it-but he’s right on every single point.
So appreciate your honesty and directness
I've had the 12" Glide saw for 8 years now and love it. Main reason for my choice was the glide motion. Every ball bearing slide saw I'd ever used left a noticeable texture on the cut edge of certain materials from the internal ball bearings hitting high and low spots in the slide shafts. This saw leaves a crisp smooth edge.
I do agree the weight is horrendous and I wouldn't consider myself a weak guy. Up and down stairs is almost a two person task. If they put a handle somewhere on top it would help a lot. The side handles make it very cumbersome going through doorways.
I never actually noticed the plastic miter indents before you pointed them out, however looking at mine now they are still in perfect condition and accurate.
The deflection has never been an issue for me, however I rarely take full depth cuts either that would make the saw shift.
It is a pretty complicated saw that even after eight years I still need to think about how to do certain things.
I kept my old trusty 10" Dewalt compound saw for those times when lugging the Bosch out isn’t needed. Compared to the Bosch that thing is light as a feather!
Great video sir!!!
Thanks Rob! Ya the controls are kind of the opposite of counter intuitive. I can see why they ended up just cut and pasting the manual onto the saw!
@@TheFunnyCarpenter And good thing they did! The paper manual has long been gone, if it was even opened.
I just bought the Bosch and use it on a fixed station. I also purchased the dust boot from Shop Nation and it solves 95% of the dust collection issue. The axial arm allows the saw to be station up against the wall and makes the miter station much more compact. It's half the price of the Kapex.
I have the Bosch Glide saw in a fixed miter station in my shop and overall it performs very well. You are spot on in terms of some of its drawbacks, however. Dust collection is horrible. I built a jig to improve this, but it still sucks. The 'kickback' is real and takes getting used to. And it is super heavy. I remember unboxing it wearing flip flops. I bent over and lifted it out of the box then kind of tripped on some of the packaging. Ended up with a huge bruise and some scrapes!
Ouch! lol this is the type of saw you have to put proper shoes on to carry!
Thanks! I'm in the market for another miter saw because of the length of the slide from the Admiral saw that I have. It's 3ft from wall to extension. Of course the Festool is $1500 dollars, but you put me on the right path for what those type saw are called. Axial Glide huh!
Dude you rock! Thanks for doing this review on the donkey!
Thanks Tuan- best wishes!
The bit about hauling it up the stairs was great :D
I recently picked up the Makita 10" 36v, and like it a LOT for a guy that can only have 1. The new 40v miter also looks interesting, if you were to have one big daddy 12" and one more portable saw. But alas, it's can't cut 4x material, so I'll probably stick with the 10" for now.
Your videos are great! I get your knocks on the Bosch saw, but I’ve had two of them, first 12” slide I gave to my son, 12” axial glide is set up in the shop. Kapex is a good tool, and for the price of 1 of them, I can buy a 10” and a 12” axial glide, plus a dust collector and hood setup for the Bosch. The old 12” is on a mobile base which makes it climb stairs like a champ!
As usual , funny and no nonsense review of a tool . Good work buddy , you just got a new subscriber :) greetings from sunny and exotic Oslo
Thanks a lot!
I have the 10” Delta Cruzer, which is similar to this Bosch in being able to put it closer to the wall. It is a bit heavy. I like it a lot, I love the shadow line feature
I have got to say tho for the price difference you could have all the heavy or plastic pieces on the bosch custom machined from titanium and still come in cheaper than the festool.
What's the weight like for Titanium vs Plastic?
Thanks for a great video. I was just about to head out and pick up the Bosch.. I've always trusted your videos, so I'll hold out for the Festool!
I need a new jobsite miter saw...the Bosch just got cut from the list! Thanks for the heads-up!
Some of the battery power Milwaukee saws are pretty interesting.
I’m sure they are, but then I’d have to get into a whole new cordless game...I’m not rich!😂
Haha haha right on all the points.
I had the Bosch 10”for 2 yrs feel the exactly same.
Really like all your videos. Thanks.
Tim at Ottawa ON
Cheers Tim-Thanks for checking out the channel!
Appreciate the review and the honesty very much! However, the capacity difference is huge to me. That is the reason I have ruled out the Kapex for myself. If Festool would make a 12" slider, I'd buy it. Also, there's no reason to try to brute haul the Bosch around that way. There are plenty of wheeled, folding stands that will run it up the stairs pretty easy and take seconds to fold down. Bolt the saw to one and there's no need to ever remove it. I have the Ridgid MS-UV stand but lots of other brands make them. I have a Dewalt DHS790 which cost $800 a few years ago (CORDLESS 12" slider that takes two 60V batteries to run). It is a beast and takes almost FOUR FEET of space from the wall. I've been looking pretty hard at the Makita 12" slider.
Thanks for being honest about this. The bit about the miter detent was the absolute dealbreaker for me - I wish I had payed closer attention to it before I bought it. After 6 months of pro work that plastic wore out and made repeatable cuts impossible. I don’t know how anyone does accurate work with this saw.
If you're not a professional finish carpenter and can leave it set up on a miter station... This is the sole reason I love this saw. Your miter station doesn't need to be incredibly deep like for "traditional" sliding saws. The miter bench can be against a wall too. The DeWalt needs to be on a miter bench several feet deep.
I've got the CM10GD. Agree on all the points. I didn't notice the plastic detent but I am sure it is the same. The recoil is crazy I've never had a saw do that and I thought I had the cheapest prior to this one ( King Canada 10" dscm). Too bad you didn't have this video out a couple years ago before I bought it.
Great video man. Thank you.
I've owned the Bosch for 8 years and I love it, very smooth and a good range depth of cuts, but it is now set up in my workshop where it's perfect, it's too heavy to lump about on site and yeah dust collection is useless. I use a cordless saw on site 100% now because it's small and light. The festool is still the best but costs, I would still have the bosch over a dewalt and makita . Great video.
I used to have the Bosch 5312, which is similar to this but I guess the older model. It has all-metal detents, it has the slide rails, also 12" and most importantly it has the power to turn a 12" full-kerf blade without problems. It would bog a little when sawing through like three 2x4s at a time... BUT it could do that. Never measured its deflection but it felt sturdy and I was able to get repeatable cuts without an issue. It was also very good for its intended purpose of cutting angles. The sliding feature allows you to even fit sheets on there so you're not just limited to boards. Yes, it was heavy, but it came with a stand and I had no problem moving it up stairs while it was mounted to the stand. I had to part with it when moving since I packed light, but I would easily have kept it if I was able to. Bosch tools are generally top-notch and I see "festool" being promoted a lot on YT videos and I guess they're really pushing the influence marketing angle but people ought to realize that their pricey hardware is often not the best. Their tools seem to be a bit under-powered and their prices are difficult to justify (but I guess they have to recoup all that money they pay YTubers).
I have the Bosch I have had it now for seven years and use it every day doing finish work just saw has never went out of adjustment and has worked flawlessly I’ve trimmed over 50 homes had the festool for two months and returned it did not cut all that good and blades were hard to find. I replaced my blade and have them re-sharpened halfway through the job on each home.
I have had this saw for 7 years and use it on site with mobile stand and its never let me down.
Ya I considered this saw before I bought my kapex. Entertaining video well done
Thanks a lot Ben!
Great review
Festool and Dewalt saws tough to beat very entertaining video as always 👍🏻
Thanks Stewart!
Thanks for your very helpful review! I'm considering both saws (to replace my 33-year-old, 8-1/2" Hitachi sliding compound, which still works like new) and was leaning toward the Bosch for the 12" blade size and much lower cost; however, the features (or lack thereof) and, most importantly, the usability issues associated with the Bosch, which you clearly pointed out, have sealed the deal for me with the Kapex. Best, Fred
Great video
Very helpful! I’ve been on the fence between the Bosch and the DeWalt 780.
If I had the room behind the saw I'd probably go Dewalt, but I don't. My miter saw is positioned in a stationary setup against the wall.
90% dust collection my left nut.
It’s the worst. Other than the festool, the Makita front rail is the best saw I’ve used.
Comparing these two saws is a false comparison. The Bosch is not meant to be a job site saw. It is meant to be permanently mounted to a saw bench against the wall, hence the glide mechanism, so weight is not an issue. The Bosch is half the cost of the Festool. If you want a fair comparison, compare the Bosch to other saws in its price range. And as to the dust collection, my Bosch 12” glide produces astonishingly little dust when hooked up to my cyclone collector. Much less than any other miter saw I’ve used. Yes, Festool is an amazing saw, but it’s also $1500, and if you want the stand, that’s another thousand. In its price range, the Bosch is the best saw.
Thanks for offering your experience with the saw
I just bought the Bosch and it's a piece of shit. I'm excited to try the kapex
I disagree. We have 3 of the Bosch at work and they are absolutely terrible. They only seem to last a year or two. And their bevel accuracy is abysmal.
@@kellym3610 please explain what “at work” means. Are they moved from job site to job site, or are they permanently mounted at stations in a shop?
@@Pauken11 permanently mounted. Two of them have tiger stops. 12 foot of solid surface counter top on each side.
I have the Bosch in my shop and love it! But I do HATE the dust collection
Thanks for sharing your experience with the saw Dan
Appreciate the review. However, I dont really understand comparing a $1500 saw to a $500 saw. For the price, I still think the Bosch axial is the best of the zero clearance sliding miters.
The lack of soft start is probably the only thing I don't like about my DWS780. That thing is scary. I can do some very accurate work with it, but holy crap I have to assume the position and brace for impact every time I pull the trigger. It's also the most frightening tool I own by far. I've had it grab work pieces and try to drag my fingers into the blade before, sometimes leaving me with bruising from the workpiece hitting my hand so hard. But that second part applies to all big mitre saws. They are very efficient at finger removal. Stay safe.
Ya the lack of soft start always gets me on the Dewalt saws! Good point on the fingers, always a good idea to anticipate trouble and place your fingers accordingly! Cheers
Thank you for the video. I got rid of my Hitachi slider due to weight... Thanks to you, I'm not gonna have to do the same with this Giant Robot...
I think it‘s designed to be a stationary Saw, so they didn’t really build it lightweight.
True
It’s still bad. The plastic, the recoil *shiver*
"donkey with a drinking problem" haha
Both are very good saws. Most people would never get the benefit of either of these saws because they don’t have the skills to use them properly. However, personally I would have the Bosch simply because it’s over £400 cheaper. And once it’s correctly set up it will suffice. Good video 👍
Very very nice comparaison ! Thanks for the laught as well ;)
Glad you enjoyed it!
I bought the Bosch 8 months ago. Out of the box had issues with accuracy. Watched tons of videos turned all the screws and tried to get it dead on straight and after months of tweaking finally did. But the bevel is why I’m going to buy a kapex. The 45 degree is never truly 45 degrees. I spent full days trying to dial it in. I don’t have as much time as I’d like in my shop and spending hours to get a machine to cut properly isn’t a good use of my time.
I've got the 10" Bosch with the rails. it is still a beast, but kickback is not bad and deflection is almost nothing. I added a little duct tape to the dust port intake and it helps a lot. Festools are hard to beat but you are definitely paying a premium for a premium tool.
Other than the lateral flex, my glider had another problem that I couldn't get over with: the arm joints were twisted. This is really bad. It means the saw cannot be calibrated. If I calibrate it at the down position, it will be slightly off when it's at the up position. If I calibrate it with the arm retracted, it will be off when the arm is extended. The accuracy of my glider was just ridiculous. And I wasn't the only one. I found similar complaints on their customer forum.
Before I got rid of it I bought a used Kapex for cheap because it had a dull blade and the angle finder was missing. The difference in accuracy is like night and day.
That's terrible, thanks for sharing the info
This must be a feature and may explain why no matter what I do I can't get consistent square cuts.
@@bnssoftware3292 This really isn't obvious if you weren't looking for it. When the cut is wonky I usually think it's either user error or bad calibration. I only found out after I installed a laser washer on the blade and see the laser line shift when the head moves.
Thanks for the discussion. There are updates in the newer generation (version 2) Bosch: 1) plastic stops - still the same 2) frost - now clear 3) kick - now soft start 4) accuracy - near perfect 5) weight - still a fat donkey!!
I was actually thinking of replacing mine with the Makita LS12 somethin or other, for anything I need a 12" for. I was enamored with the axial glide arms, because my Dewalt 718 always chattered when it slid, much like the Dewalt table saw does when it you raise it. No matter what I did, it was like the rods weren't aligned. And at the time Kapex was the only thing that had a forward facing mechanism allowing the saw to sit against the wall. Now that seems to be an ubiquitous feature with every brands top line saw. The Makita looks like a nice design.
Hahaha love the staircase warmup! I like the Bosch forward bevel controls for sure! I think the Festool top mount controls are at least a bit better then the rear bottom controls on most saws.
I’ve been curious since the Kapex came out why the other brands have been afraid to make a more premium version when they know ppl will pay 3-4x more for it. They could all make a $1200 version with less plastic and know they’re still just over half the price of the Kapex. Can’t believe you don’t use the UG Stand though.
Tremendous idea on the 1200$ saw. It would be great to have some serious high end competition in that space. Lol gonna make a quick video on my stand for the Kapex, then you’ll see it’s merits vs the UG.
@@TheFunnyCarpenter lol great! I’ve adopted the fat guy policy of anything over 40lb needs to be on wheels lol I always feel so bad for guys that still hand bomb saws and stands on site. Can’t remember if I showed you my old stand version for my Dewalt before I got the Kapex?
When a material is required on installation and its final placement critical, having a well made saw that you tuned to be highly accurate then the confidence you have in it is more important than anything other feature. Each tool being different and the operator being unique will find certain things or ergonomics that work well with them or are a struggle. No perfect saw for everyone no matter price paid.
Very well said:). As you go along using various saws you definitely get a sense of what you like and don’t. I always gravitate to tools that don’t cause a lot of grief and allows you to keep your focus on the task at hand.
I work for a company that provides all the tools, but I have an extremely comprehensive setup of gear that's way better than their crap. I'm fighting with them to let me use my own gear because for example, I simply cannot get good results on their undersized, aging and very abused Makita 7 1/4 mitre saws, especially when I'm constantly being thrown around different trucks with different saws so I can't get used to a particular saws idiosyncrasies.
And it's not even about the quality of the saws, it's being used to them, and having them tuned up for how you use them. Before upgraded, I did some very nice trim work with my dad's old and very worn out Ryobi 10" slider. To it's credit, it's been through hell and still works. But it was almost a given that every other tradie would shit on my poor little saw and complain about how sloppy it was. But I knew the saw, just like my dad knew it before me. He did work on a very high end build with wide colonial trims with it and the work was spot on.
A poor workman blames his tools, but a good workman knows better than to use another man's tools, because he won't necessarily know those tools like his own.
Hey, can I use the extension wings when I setup the saw on the floor?
I like the hard start saws. Saves time
You sound like a framer:)
@@TheFunnyCarpenter Im a everything-er lol. I'm just used to my old faithful makita ls1040.
Hope you are still enjoying your Kapex miter saw, since many pros, while loving the features of the Festool, complain that the motor in the Kapex just doesn't hold up to professional use. Given the price, that's pretty discouraging. Think I'll pass on the Kapex and the Bosch. Thx for the comparison video.
Well, I work at Lowe’s and got one on Clearance for $150 today. So I think it’s a great saw at that price point 😊 I’m not a pro user so it should be more than adequate for my needs.
Yo! That’s a great deal. I’m sure you’ll love the saw.
Bosch made some great tools like their jigsaw for example. Other Bosch tools I have owned have had design flaws. I look closely when buying Bosch...
Exactly, This kind of goes for all the tool brands. Some are great, some not so much!
I tried to like the Bosch and never got a chance. I broke my Milwaukee on a job and needed a “today” replacement. I picked up 3 Bosches in a row from Big orange store that had either cracking or chunks of the base broken off. I wasn’t impressed with the build quality and wasting my evening returning saws so I gave up and bought a dewalt instead.
For most people the most important comparison between these two saws is the one you didn't make , the price !
Can you do a comparison review on a Lamborghini Vs a Prius next?
I’d love to hear your thoughts on the kapex vs the makita 10 inch (1019)? I’ve got the makita and am not that happy with it. I find the dust collection average and saw itself not very accurate. Also real heavy. I’m thinking about selling it at a big loss and investing more money into the kapex but am trying to work out if my problems with it are valid or just in my head and if I really will be happy with the festool. My festool tracky is the best tool I’ve ever brought.
I know what you mean about the Makita, I have only used it briefly for a few cuts and checked it out in the stores. The Kapex will definitely be a nicer saw, but you have to think about if you want to spend that kind of money! It can be a pain in terms of leaving it on a site.
"I don't know why they would build this overly complicated mechanism" - Because a traditional sliding miter saw with rails sticking out the back does not work in on the wall of a crowded workshop, does not play along with 18" or 24" side cabinets. The bench depth of a DWS779 fully retracted is 41 inches tip to tail. One strategy to get past this is Delta et al's gliding mechanism, the other is to move the rails inboard next to the wheel hub, which costs you significant miter angle.
I have to wonder how expensive & difficult improving the glide mechanism by adding & scaling up arms would be vs improving the slide rail mechanism by adding & scaling up rails. How would you build a miter saw if 0.5mm blade play under the same test condition was the goal?
I own one and improved the the dust collection and added a shadow light. And I’m still a grand below the festool.
when I started working as a finish carpenter( that was my first job in Canada) - I tried to carry this saw up the stairs attached to the stand, and dropped it... since that moment I decided that even if it get it for free - I wouldn't use it unless I face a threat of cutting my hands off 😄😄😄😄
Ouch- That's a tough carry even for a big guy from Siberia:)
Haha CrossFit for 1 hour or deadlift this saw once. Love it.
:) thanks Will, that was pretty fun making that part of the vid- best wishes!
I know this video is old, but I just stumbled across it. I'm not discounting that you made some valid points, but this review seemed pretty biased from the start. Even the whole "skit" with carrying the Bosch up the stairs goes overboard in an effort to completely discredit the Bosch saw. Festool makes some great products, but the Bosch saw gets universally great reviews for being a very nice saw for the money. Paying well over $1700 for a miter saw is lunacy in my opinion, and you failed to leave out that "small little detail" in your review. I could go on and on about how the handle on the Kapex is not at all ergonomic and feels odd to use, etc... but apparently we're only discrediting the Bosch saw in this video...
Very useful review. Have you tried the Makita ls1219l? Just wondering. I can't afford the Festool.
SAME here.
Have you had it in comparison or chance to try out their Profactor 12” 18V version of it I noticed seems the motor is not over the blade and seems a little lower into the blade don’t know if that will decrease citing depth capacity at 90
Have a couple of tools and couple batteries from BOSCH as well as Makita and Milwaukee but trying to decide between that Profactor a Makita 36V and a Milwaukee M18
Nice video mate. What is the price difference of the two saws over there? In England the Kapex is roughly £250 -£300 more expensive depending where you search. I had to go for the Kapex though.😉
Have to agree with those here saying comparing this to a Kapex is not a like-for-like comparison. I also don’t think the objections brought up are terribly relevant. 3mm of deflection with maximum lateral force is an interesting stat, but who applies maximum lateral force to a miter swing arm while cutting???? A better measurement would be to measure deflection on bevel cuts or compound cuts. If there is no deflection in those, then the lateral deflection test done here becomes irrelevant. As for weight, all good miter saws are heavy. They are meant to set up in a shop and stay there, or set up in one place on the job site and stay there. My Bosch has no kickback at all, while my Dewalt kicks like a wild mustang. As far as accuracy goes, once you calibrate it, it seems to be pretty accurate.
Personally, the Bosch suits my needs because of space. I had the Dewalt 779, but the rails and dust bag in the back mean that saw needs an ENORMOUS amount of space and clearance. Other saws that had the rails in the front, like the Makita, were significantly more expensive. And I’ll never pay Festool prices.
"DeWaltish" haha that's going to be a new word in my descriptive vocab. Would love that Festool Kapex, but I'm pretty happy with the 10inch cordless Makita. A little less of a thief magnet on jobsites and in the truck.
Maybe once the shop is built it'll be Kapex time. Have you had any issues with the motor?
Thanks for the review!
Lol Dewaltish covers miter saw hard starts and bulky unbalances tools:). That cordless Makita looks like a great saw. I have not had any issues with my Kapex in 5 years. I've been running it plugged into my vacuum.
@@TheFunnyCarpenter Good to hear. 👍Thanks for the feedback.
Besides being a little heavy and awkward to carry it’s been a very good saw. The soft start is very nice, so unDeWaltish. 😆
Woodworking Beginner: New - Update.
This test is only if you want to saw with precision with a miter saw.(test is not intended for rough and hard work).
Tips and Test:
Very important if you would like to saw with precision. (avoid torsion as much as possible)!
Always choose a Miter saw with a handle positioned in a VERTICAL line above the saw blade.
Everything must be aligned, slide rails, handle, and saw blade,it is much better this way the blade will not tilt.
Because there is some torsion in the aluminum housing .
And choose an engine with softstart on it to prevent wear of the gear and worm shaft.
It is very important that everything is aligned.
Here are some examples to show how the handle must be positioned above the blade.
First option: handle vertical positioned above the saw blade.
Bosch gcm 800 sj / Bosch gcm 8 sjl / Evolution rage 3 / FESTOOL KS 60 / Bosch GCM 8 SDE / FESTOOL KS 60 E KAPEX / Metabo KGSV 72 Xact/ Bosch PCM 8 SD / Hitachi C10FSH / Ridgid MS255SR 10-inch / Evolution Fury3-S / Evolution R255SMS / Metabo HPT C10FSBS / Hitachi C10FSB / Hitachi C10FS.
Second optie: handle horizontal positioned above the saw blade / Evolution R185SMS / Evolution F255SMS / Evolution RAGE3R255 SMS3 .
(This also is the case with the Miter saw without the slide rails).
If you want: You can test it yourself at home if there is torsion in the aluminum housing.
Step-1. First you make a saw cut from +-5 mm deep in to a flat piece of wood about +- 20 mm thick to this with the normal handle positioned on the right side of the Miter saw (the wood it will remain in place until the test is completed).
Step-2. Then repeat this by pushing the saw blade down with your hand or finger on the aluminum protective cover were the saw blade is cased in. Just now only do this without the running engine.
Step-3. Now you can see if the saw blade will be positioned in or next to the saw cut. If the saw blade is (+- 0,2 / 0,5 mm) next to the saw cut then there is torsion in the aluminum housing.
(test is completed).
Step-4. Therefor it is much better to choose a Miter saw with the handle positioned VERTICAL in line above the saw blade.
The second option is the handle positioned HORIZONTAL in line above the saw blade.
Step-5. When you measure the vertical 90 degrees angle square (Digital Level Box) of you're sawblade don't forget that there is always some torsion in the aluminum housing.
Conclusion: Remember this, the test is only about torsion and nothing else how further away the handle is from the saw blade how more chance of torsion in the aluminum housing, you better not go for that. (the choices are yours).
Also with a cheap slide miter saw it is still better the handgriff in line a above the saw blade than on the right side. Maybe they will make it someday then we have a winner...
Judith / Rob a lot of great info here:) thank you
Funny Carpenter: Perhaps it is a good idea that you can make a video about torsion as described in the test.
When my dewalt 780 crapped the bed I was looking for a replacement. That Bosch is a hunk of crap. Those arms aren't as solid as advertized and I absolutely hate lasers. I'm happy to hear that Festool embraced the shadow line.
I think the Makita saw with the forward rails is even heavier lol.
How much difference in the deflection is due to a 10 inch blade vs a 12 inch blade?
It’s pretty noticeable if you cut a bevel in hardwood, but not as bad with softer materials.
@@TheFunnyCarpenter I meant specifically in your test here; when you tested full extension deflection, you tested using the blades, correct? I was observing that the Kapex has a 10 inch blade and so likely will measure somewhat less deflection than the 12 inch Bosch regardless of any possible difference in the sliding mechanism deflection. I may have missed something in how you measured, it's hard to see exactly where you applied force in the video.
In all seriousness, I’ve thought the Bosch to be the premium miter saw. (Compared to desalt). I need a saw with a smaller footprint. Why is the festool not right in my face at lowes and Home Depot?
Is there any wobble in the arm - it seems it will start to wobble over time and may not give accurate cuts.
The arm has a fair amount of flex, but I would say it was wobbly.
@@TheFunnyCarpenter thanks I bought one and was not happy, went with Makita. This is one of those not good Bosch products.
I have used this saw for two years I love it dust collection is worthless I bypassed the safety trigger right out of the box once you have a festool you think everything’s a piece of crap.
The safety looks like it would be easy to bypass. I've never really understood the safety on a Miter Saw.
@@TheFunnyCarpenter can I attach a screenshot =) ?
Festool without a doubt has a better miter saw, but it is TWICE as much as the Bosch. The Bosch at it's price range is a awesome saw....Love mine!
I got back into woodworking a year or so ago and looked at the Kapex. I couldn't look at my wife with a straight face. My buddy is a manager at Woodcraft and he couldn't sell it to me in good conscience. After researching, I thought this saw had a good feature set and would make a great miter station. I found one on Craigslist with stand for a good discount over new. The original owner used it for one small project. After using it for a while, i agree with most of your points. The stand is really annoying with long stock too.
Now that my skills have returned, the shop is growing, and the wife wants more done, i don't use it much. I rely on my track saw (another story) and Dewalt 7491RS. What would you recommend that's not Festool?. I've been in the Milwaukee ecosystem for years and still holding out for a track saw.
Gary Becker I have the Makita corded Track saw. It’s nice but I’m looking to upgrade to the cordless version. I’ve done a review on my corded saw.
Gary, I own both the Festool and the Dewalt track saws. I had the Festool TS55, but now I have the TS75. The Dewalt track saw is excellent but does have a slight issue when the track is not a fair bit longer than what you're cutting. If one end of the saw extends off the track at the end of the cut, it can slop around. Otherwise it is awesome. I got the Dewalt because it's the cordless version and I already have tons of batteries and chargers.
@@ligngood3787 i bought the Makita...
@@garybecker4490 I'm sure that's a good one. Do you like it or does it have anything you'd like to change?
I was going to buy the bosch glide but you have totally put me off it. On the kapex one annoyance I have heard is the rubber dust shroud fouls the fence and can be annoying?
For me, I have a smaller mitre saw for carrying about, if I bought the Bosch the weight would not bother me because the saw would be permanently in the one place. I think shear mass is a good thing when working with wood as it can reduce vibration and aid accuracy. However I have not used any of the saws so I accept im not in a position to make any conclusions.
PG Tips the little rubber dust boot can be annoying at time for sure. 90% time I use the saw without the tall fences on so it doesn’t bother me much. The price difference between the two saws is substantial, so if you’re not looking to carry it around and can build some duct collection mods, the Bosch will be a a decent choice.
well u compare saw for 600$ to 1500+ saw ,what do You expect .if You have twice the budget to build it i bet Bosch would make it
I don’t think Bosch intended it to be a job site saw. I have one in my shop, and it out performs any of the dewalts I’ve owned.
Glad your enjoying the saw
Bought one of these as the Kapex wasn't in stock at my local Toronto store... after using it for 3 days, I returned it and placed an order for the Kapex, even the wife approved after seeing how much dust the Bosch made!
I hope the Kapex works out for You! Best Wishes
it is mad in germane ??
Isn't the Kapex like 3 times the price? I'm getting the Bosch 12" with Gravity Stand for $650CA. Unless I get a sponsorship, I don't think Festool is in my future. Great video, and you've got a new subscriber.
I had the bosch glider and I hated it. Sold it for really cheap. I was told the glider is priced about the same as Kapex in Europe. I feel bad for them. If I were to do it again I'd just sacrifice a few inches of bench space and buy a dewalt. Mine deflects a lot too when bumped sideways. I guess Bosch didn't have good quality control over the accuracy of the arm joints.
As for dust collection, the design is just stupid. The dust boot should always aim at the cutting point no matter the cutting height, so it should be mounted on the head instead of the base. It is so obvious. I don't understand why so many tool makers don't get it.
I have the Dewalt and I thought the same as you but trust me, those "few inches" are FEET. I have a 500 square foot shop and I've moved that beast all over and rearranged everything three times and it wastes a HUGE amount of space behind it no matter what I do.
Interesting, I have the 10in Bosch looking to upgrade but had a very different list of likes/dislikes but clearly because I don't work on a job site.
The blade guard and bizarre, bonkers alignment system is my motivation though. Don't get me wrong, my Bosch is a GREAT saw and compared to the others in the price range it's a hands down winner for me. But the guard spring is so incredibly stuff it requires pulling the guard out of the way with my hand as I plunge.
Mine wasn't as square as I needed out of the box and unlike their older saws that you just adjust the fence relative to the blade, this one you move the glide assembly relative to the stationary fence and it's impossible to get square. I don't mean in a perfectionist sense but like no consistency with drift or placement that's really made me be willing to go further.
I love the robot looking glide arm but it's just not quite as stable as a guide rod.
Good review - lots of good points. The worst point for me from what you showed was the plastic underneath. I’m still leaning towards this saw though as I just need the room. For those of us with smaller shops who are more woodworkers / furniture makers than finish carpenters and who work more in our own shops rather than in clients’ homes, the reduced need for space behind it is a huge deal. 12 inch sliders are not compact, and I literally just don’t have the space for it on the counter I want to use.
Also, for woodworkers like us, we don’t move it. We buy the saw, set it up, and it lives there permanently, so being able to move it is a non issue. I think if you’re in clients’ homes and lugging it around, the festool is a clear winner here, but for those who want the extra space and increased capacity, and who don’t have to move it, the bosch is the winner (not to mention the much more reasonable price). I also really want the extra crosscut capacity due to a quirk of my own shop where I have some Lally columns preventing me from using my table saw for crosscuts on long boards - but that’s pretty much unique to me.
The deflection is a bit concerning, but I’m thinking that in normal use it won’t really be a big issue. If you notice more problems with that plastic piece on the bottom, please let us know - that’s annoying. Crappy choice of materials there - I’d expect better from Bosch.
Cheers!
This makes me very sad because that glide system felt amazing trying one in the store.
It’s actually a very good saw, in my opinion.
My bosch is the same as the dewalt u can see through blade guard,Ireland saws look far better finished dual laser dual stop flips on the extension arms
Ya it's awesome when you can see through the blade guard, it really speeds things up.
The fish tool cost twice as much I mean come on dude
Okay, okay...you win the internet today.
I own one of these monsters (the Bosch). You are dead on right about it. I used mine for two good sized projects. Humped it back a forth every day with no rolling stand. Your overly dramatic, overly comical warm up and attempt at carrying that thing is, well, not overly dramatic at all. It's actually quite accurate. That being said, mine has sat on a shelf unused for two years plus. I bought it nearly brand new from a pawn shop for less than half retail price. I just, I just can't seem to get rid of it. A permanent placement in a shop situation is where I hope it ends up. So, whenever I get a shop... Anyway...
Hilarious as always. I got a genuine gut laugh out of this video.
Thanks Mark!
8:28 you might want to get a check-up
The plastics are most likely a high glass fibre or carbon fibre impregnated type which quite a lot of the time have a better wear and impact resistance than aluminium or die cast metals 🤪 I have a kapex so not a Bosch fanboy 🤘
Go buy the Delta version of this pantograph saw at Home Depot - try it, make a video, and then return it (don't feel guilty).
It has belt drive and no soft start, hard to believe.
I know!
Well looks like Festool is twice the price so of course it's better.
I'm confused. You made such a big deal about the weight but, according to the specs online, the Bosch only weighs 17 pounds more than the Kapex. I mean, that's not nothing, but doesn't seem like a dramatic difference to me.
Come on Bosch you are much better than this... Real nice like review. Well done mate
Thanks 👍
Wow the bosch is worse than the DeWalt when it comes to dust collection. I made a duck tape dust boot for my dewalt miter saw. You wouldn't believe how much it improves the dust collection.
That would make a good video Greg! 3$ of ductape vs +800$ is smart economics.
@@TheFunnyCarpenter I'll encourage that video... I'm telling you bro my dewalt miter saw now collects 90% of the dust because of the duck tape... I'll see if I can find you on IG and send you a picture tomorrow.
CraftManGreg can’t wait to see it!
Even less recoil on the Kapex once the motor grenades. Ba dum bump! I own both, been there done that. I agree with the analysis but Festool's handling of the motor issue is atrocious at best. Think Ford 6.0.
Bosch is not a good company anymore, i bought a GKS 190 from bosch and there was no soft start and couldn't make a 90° cut, the max i was able to get was 87°, the base plate wouldn't go any further to get the 90°. So disappointed, had to send it back the next day.
The dust collection on that saw isnt "no better" than any of the other saws out there. It's outright terrible. I like my Bosch, serving me well, but I dont have a lot of experience with other mitre saws. Failed to notice/consider the detent when shopping. Note to self, use it sparingly. The other factor is most def the weight. But in comparing cut/use quality vs moving the saw around, since my saw rarely moves, the weight is more an annoyance rather than a deal breaker. Regardless, I feel a Festool vs any big box tool brand is simply an unfair comparison without comparing prices.