Thanks for putting this together. It seams the real tonality differences is most pronounced at breakup. Hardly anyone pushes a 50 watt head to break up anymore.. lol
I have EL34 in my Mezzabarba MZero amp and they kick serious butt with massive thump and wall of sound. The KT77 tubes in my Bogner Uberschall sound great but different.
I like the clean KT77 and the dirty KT66. EL34 will always have a place in my heart, but as I'm getting older, I'm liking the cleaner KT tubes. The KT66 clean had a little more "sonic holography" or "frequency separation" that I just have grown to dislike. The KT77 clean have more of a focused tone, like a single amp instead of a dual mono stack at far ends of the stage. Every situation is different, but this was a great demo, and hey, real world, tubes and tube sockets go bad, usually right before the gig!
Tbf even at low master the power tube does add some characteristics to the sound. Probably not enough to come through the youtube compression, but you definitely could have noticed slight differences in the room. So don’t be too hard on your old self!
I had the 3120 some years ago and tried many powertubes. It did not really make that big difference because the 3120 takes all it's drive from the preamp.
@@kiesshauer I appreciate you getting back to me, but there's no way the cable in the lower right-hand corner of the screen there is a basic gold monster. Looks like some low-radius cable + right angle jack thing. No?
@@kiesshauer you have to be careful because not because an amp is cathode bias you can swap tubes like that. I build amps and a cathode biased amp has a cathode resistor with a value selected for a specific kind of tubes (the ones that came with the amp). Every type of tube has different impedance characteristics that make the tube conduct current differently. That means different type of tubes require different cathode resistor value to be biased properly. Otherwise your tubes can be biased too cold or too hot. You can damage the tubes or worse the amp.
@@kiesshauer ok. I guess the amp was designed to handle that but if there is no automatic bias circuit then different tubes will not be biased to their sweet spot. Some too cold, some too hot and won’t sound their best as you said.
You're obviously new at this... although you can switch out tubes in a cathode biased amp without the need to adjust the bias as you would a fixed bias amp, the biggest factor you are overlooking is the impedance of the output transformer; the impedance is wound to a specific tube type, and it's not adjustable. If the transformer impedance is for EL34's... you're wasting your time trying to see the difference in a different tube type. Any of Aspen Pittman's "The Tube Amp" books are good at explaining how this stuff works to the novice like yourself.
Good to know. Maybe the amp designer didn’t know either - or at least didn’t want to point it out, since he highlights switching tubes as viable. Still, there are some differences I could hear once the tube broke up, so maybe it’ll still be useful to some folks who would want to tube swap anyway even with only subtle differences.
@@kiesshauer Glad I could help. The fact that the tubes being made today (only in China and Russia now) are garbage compared to the tubes that were made in the 60's and 70's doesn't help either.
Thanks for putting this together. It seams the real tonality differences is most pronounced at breakup. Hardly anyone pushes a 50 watt head to break up anymore.. lol
KT77 & EL34 dirty are my favorite. Thank you for doing the shootout again!
I have EL34 in my Mezzabarba MZero amp and they kick serious butt with massive thump and wall of sound. The KT77 tubes in my Bogner Uberschall sound great but different.
I like the clean KT77 and the dirty KT66. EL34 will always have a place in my heart, but as I'm getting older, I'm liking the cleaner KT tubes.
The KT66 clean had a little more "sonic holography" or "frequency separation" that I just have grown to dislike. The KT77 clean have more of a focused tone, like a single amp instead of a dual mono stack at far ends of the stage.
Every situation is different, but this was a great demo, and hey, real world, tubes and tube sockets go bad, usually right before the gig!
Thanks for the video. Obvious differences .
Tbf even at low master the power tube does add some characteristics to the sound. Probably not enough to come through the youtube compression, but you definitely could have noticed slight differences in the room. So don’t be too hard on your old self!
Very kind in my ignorance haha
I like the 6L6 tubes the best from the demo but EL34 sound awesome
Thank you! Is this PP or SE and what are tube brands?
The tube brands were all JJ I think...but I don't know what PP or SE are. :)
Hmmm…. My amp doesn’t have a gain knob.
for metal and rock do you think that the preamp is more important than power tubes?
i swapped out my 6l6 eh tubes for jj kt 77 tubes in my peavey 3120 and i think im going to put the electro 6l6 tubes back in !
I had the 3120 some years ago and tried many powertubes. It did not really make that big difference because the 3120 takes all it's drive from the preamp.
@@tubeaddicted485 true , but there is more depth I think with the 6l6
The cable you are running looks sweet. What is it?
Just a basic gold Monster cable!
@@kiesshauer I appreciate you getting back to me, but there's no way the cable in the lower right-hand corner of the screen there is a basic gold monster. Looks like some low-radius cable + right angle jack thing. No?
Oh gosh you’re right, haha - it had been awhile. Now I think I used a George L’s patch cable. :)
@@kiesshauer Ahh that looks much more the part. Thanks!
Get vht converter and it can do el84.
6L6 was the best
Does that amp has a switch to select cathode resistor?
It’s just a cathode-biased amp is all - which is why you can swap so many tubes.
@@kiesshauer you have to be careful because not because an amp is cathode bias you can swap tubes like that. I build amps and a cathode biased amp has a cathode resistor with a value selected for a specific kind of tubes (the ones that came with the amp). Every type of tube has different impedance characteristics that make the tube conduct current differently. That means different type of tubes require different cathode resistor value to be biased properly. Otherwise your tubes can be biased too cold or too hot. You can damage the tubes or worse the amp.
Yeah, that’s fair. I only did it because the designer said it was fine. To be fair he probably didn’t care if the tubes sounded their best. :)
@@kiesshauer ok. I guess the amp was designed to handle that but if there is no automatic bias circuit then different tubes will not be biased to their sweet spot. Some too cold, some too hot and won’t sound their best as you said.
Yeah; I think getting tubes rated for numbers close to the set bias is pretty key…which I probably didn’t do, haha.
So.Much.Talking.
Just.Play.
We get it.
You're obviously new at this... although you can switch out tubes in a cathode biased amp without the need to adjust the bias as you would a fixed bias amp, the biggest factor you are overlooking is the impedance of the output transformer; the impedance is wound to a specific tube type, and it's not adjustable. If the transformer impedance is for EL34's... you're wasting your time trying to see the difference in a different tube type. Any of Aspen Pittman's "The Tube Amp" books are good at explaining how this stuff works to the novice like yourself.
Good to know. Maybe the amp designer didn’t know either - or at least didn’t want to point it out, since he highlights switching tubes as viable. Still, there are some differences I could hear once the tube broke up, so maybe it’ll still be useful to some folks who would want to tube swap anyway even with only subtle differences.
@@kiesshauer Glad I could help. The fact that the tubes being made today (only in China and Russia now) are garbage compared to the tubes that were made in the 60's and 70's doesn't help either.
Turn the gain up