Good luck on that. G4 cubes never went that cheap, before bottoming out and prices rising again. It won’t be as bad though - there are more trashcans than cubes, because the cube wasn’t a true Pro machine at any given time. I for one never plan to sell mine, and it’s frankly easy to store it. I also love my PowerMac G4 Dual 1GHz but it is taking up valuable space. And it will never run Windows 10 or a decent Linux, whereas 12 Xeons will be handy to do some odd jobs like that for, what? 10 more years? 20?
Not gonna lie, I would LOVE to see the trash can re-released with an M1 Max. All those pesky thermal issues disappear with Apple Silicon. And I still love the way it looks!
@@JoshSchaidt now I am wondering how much work and how much money that might be because I really want that setup thanks for helping me spend some money.
To be honest, I absolutely love my Trashcan. I called him Henry, after the vacuum cleaner (specifically, Henry the Third after the first two being Mac minis). I know it's not really a rational choice, but I like my computers to have personality. Henry absolutely does.
Still the best looking Mac ever… if anything given their new SoC approach to ultra efficient hardware the Trashcan design would work great today…. A dual M1 Max SoC with 20 cpu cores, 64 gpu cores and 128gb ram and 4TB ssd….in a trash can …would be my fantasy
hopefully they won't go there; people buy mac pro so they can put PCIe card into them; and that will probably be the main reason to buy one given how the M1 max is powerful (and given the fact it will probably end up in a mac mini)
@@valdir7426 …what PCIe card would people need to add? The dual M1 max has built in video encoders/decoders and graphics … as for anything else, my Fantasy double M1 Max trash can would have dual 10GB Ethernet ports.. 4 usb 3 ports …8 thunderbolt 4 ports…. HDMI 2.1 and latest Bluetooth and WI-FI 6e. … and there should be room for 4 nvme pcie4 connectors inside … for up to 32TB of internal storage…. Not clear to me what internal cards people would be looking for.
@@valdir7426 it's entirely up for debate if an Apple Silicon Mac Pro will have the same kind of upgradability and modularity of the current cheese grater one
@@silvestrocrino3256 the Mac Pro is a very niche product for people with very specialized tasks. People don't always buy mac pro to do things related to graphics; the audio world use a lot of dedicated PCIe cards with or w/o DSP; as well as fast storage as PCIe. There are many reasons to need PCIe slots. Apple has stopped the nonsense of slim and light above all else and got in a good direction for pro users with the 16"; the Mac Pro; and now the M1 pro/max macbooks. They will likely not go back to something like the trash can; and they'll probably keep what was appreciated with the lastest Mac Pro; and that is expandability. I suggest you take a look at Neil Parfitt's channel who (justifiably) uses every single PCIe slot from the mac pro for his setup (he even removed the included one with usb ports); then you'll understand why people would need PCIe slots (and why people would need a mac pro period).
These are now like $200-$300 all day on eBay.. if you're patient you can even get ones below the $200 mark. In a year I could see these being $100-$200. At $150 I'd buy a decent condition one just for display / to mess with.
Film industry editors work almost exclusively on these trash cans in the post houses in London. They work pretty flawlessly when you're using Avid systems.
What trashcan owners will find is that it is the FIRST Mac Mini that is overall equivalent or better in most tasks. Up until now, all those cores were beating down every Mac Mini and MacBook Pro. I’ve kept editing on the trashcan using Final Cut Pro despite having several MacBook Pros 2014-2020, but after the M1 they are finally caught up.
That’s fine if you are content with a measly 256 gig of storage and a mere 8 gig of DRAM, neither of which can you ever upgrade nor change! I’d go through 256 gigs of SSD just transferring stuff from my old computer to the new one!
Mac Pro gets completely destroyed at 6:00 because MacOS does not support Crossfire, so for those "gaming" benchmarks, it's a single d700 vs the other single GPUs.
I use my MacPro 2013 for photo editing. Paid $200 on eBay, it came with the original 1TB ssd. I put a 12 core processor in it ($18 on eBay). It works great for graphics. It can run Sonoma with open core but I am fine with the Monterey OS it came with. For games, I use my home built PC running Windows with a RTX 3090Ti on Steam.
But the biggest issue with trying to replace a 2013 Mac Pro with a M1 Pro / Max Mac Mini is that there are too few ports. 6 TB2 ports and 4 USB-A ports is critical for pros like me who need RAIDs, multiple monitors, docks, etc. connected to power our post-production workflows. A Mac Mini Pro most likely won’t be able to handle everything I have: 3 Promise Pegasus RAID arrays 4 monitors (one is a for A/V Output in FCP) A hard drive dock A USB hub A media card hub (SD, microSD, CF) I can’t hook all that up to a Mac Mini. But I don’t want to spend $10k+ on a Mac Pro. I want the trashcan but with M1 Pro/Max.
You convinced me... even at this Christmas's price of ~$179 I think these are not really worth picking up. A cube would make a more interesting anachranism.
I recently bought a used “trashcan” for US$650. It was sold to me as base model, but it had the dual three gigabyte graphics cards (D500), a 1 terabyte SSD, 8 gigs of 1333 DDR3 ECC DRAM, AND THE 4-core Xeon processor. I installed 64 Gigs of 1600 DRAM, and upgraded the processor (myself) to the faster of the 2 available 12-core Xeons. My total cash outlay was just a hair over US$900. Now, I vacillated between buying a 2013 Mac Pro and the new M1 Mac Mini. What made up my mind for me was that a new Mini, for pretty much that same price would have come with only 16 gigs of RAM, and only 512 gigs of SSD storage. But more importantly than that, the M1Mini is totally NON UPGRADABLE! If I had bought one with a 1TB drive, it would have upped the price to just about $1100! A 2TB drive would have added US$600 (which is ridiculously outrageous). But however I would have configured the Mini, whatever I would have bought, I would have been stuck with. That made the decision for me. Adding another 8 gigs of RAM adds US$200 to the Mini’s base price, but I was able to replace the 8 gigs of 1333 DRAM that came with my Pro with 64gig of brand new Samsung DDR 1600 ECC RAM for US$65! If I want to, I can add up to 4 gigs of SSD, to the pro, and go all the way to 128 Gigs of RAM (and do the latter for less than Apple wants to increase the Mini’s RAM from 8 to 16 gig). Non-upgradability is a cynical ploy by Apple to make one buy new hardware when one needs more RAM or a bigger internal SSD. Mr. Miani, you need to understand that people have different needs, and although to you the 2013 Pro might be useless, speed and benchmark performance do not tell the whole story here. I love mine, it’s perfect for my needs. I’m a writer. My work consists of word processing, image manipulation, and occasional graphics, CAD and schematic capture. For these tasks the Trashcan is perfect and it will likely serve me for a lot of years.
That's great! But I think the key point is, 2 years ago it was 10,000$ to get maxed out trash can. Soon it's likely you can get much more performance from a 1000-2000$ Mac mini. You can't upgrade the mini, but the amount of performance on the table is still future proof for many years ahead (just like the 10k trash can).
@@oliverhughes169 Thanks for your comment, but I think the point is that Mr. Miani’s blanket statement that the 2013 Mac Pro is “absolutely worthless”, is, like most blanket statements, wrong. The performance of this 12-core computer is very good, and the upgradability is definitely worth the price of admission.
I have to say, mine remains very useful (and pleasant) for heavy office tasks. It handles multiple retina 4K very nicely, and I recently added a third HDMI display. I’ve got a 16 TB storage array on Thunderbolt, and for these kind of “digital hub” jobs it continues to outperform every Intel CPU laptop and Mac Mini. All those cores make it very smooth, so it’s got a fine luxury feeling when you keep it off the racetrack. You just need to stop giving it large 4K encode jobs and H265 compression tasks.
Hi. I se you connected "multiple retina 4k". I'd like to connect 5 4k, NOT THUNDERBOLT monitors to it. Is it possible? I read somewhere: "Up to three 4k monitors or 6 Thunderbolt monitor". Thanks
@@paolopetrozzi2213 If you want 4K60, it does need to be DisplayPort monitors with MST (Dell UP2414Q is the example used in Apple Stores back in 2014). You could use up all 6 Thunderbolt ports doing this, but to keep full bandwidth, you'd use only 1 of: The top 2 on the left, the top 2 on the right, and the bottom row of 2. The HDMI is separate and can generate 4K30.
I have the same trashcan. It's fairly close to maxed out with 64GB RAM and 2TB, 12 core etc. I bought it new and it was a lot of money. When it was new it was pretty decent and ran my music studio with Logic Pro quite well, and TBH it still runs it reasonably well. I waited for an age for a new Mac Pro but when they arrived they were a huge amount of money and there were instantly rumours that Apple were switching to Arm so I didn't want to spend another £10k on a machine if I wasn't going to get the mileage. When the M1 appeared it was amazing, the Mini was killer, however it was a bit limited as my studio has 3 screens on and 30TB of attached storage, I couldn't do that with a Mini. I could buy a new MBP and just use it as a desktop but it seems a bit sub optimal. As soon as there's an M1 Max Mini available then I'll flip the trashcan in a blink. So stop talking their value down for a moment :)
This form factor was ahead of it's time . It should have been used with the M1 series chip . Imagine the Mac studio in this chassis with an anodized black finish , instead of that glossy black. It would have stayed nice and cool since it only has one chip to cool with that massive heatsink. This chassis would have made sense now .
Running with 128G of memory makes the 12 core config run at less than 1/2 the normal memory speed so that’s not really showing the full potential of the trash can.
Luke, thank you so much for making this video! I recently looked up various tests of yours trying to compare. At work I’m currently running a 2013 Mac Pro with a (self upgraded) 1tb ssd and 64gb ram. It’s a 6 core Xeon + D500. I have wanted to upgrade for a while now, and I just ordered the 16” pro max (fully maxed except for the SSD) and after watching this I’m expecting it to do backflips, lol. Thanks for all the content, you and Max Yuryev have been indispensable. God bless you.
I think the reason why I prefer a trashcan Mac over the mini is because the trashcan has way more ports available for me to plug in more monitors and things to it than the mini.
I use a trashcan for my main work computer for 3D modelling and rendering. It was cheap and works great. My backup is a maxed out 2008 Mac Pro that honestly still feels fast today.
In the trash can Mac Pro’s defense, it has USB ports. That’s so valuable nowadays, I still have yet to own or find someone else who owns a USB-C accessory.
Well… I got mine in early 2014 yeah not this beast you have but the 5k option back then plus later added 32Gb of RAM and a 1T SSD, it is however still going like new, fully supported and thats a lot to say for a 7yr machine. I agree the new machines are a new world but as you clearly point out, the new ones are monsters even compared to newish super expensive window pcs as well!
Still rocking the dual processor 16 core 5,1 here. I like having several internal drives including NVME. I hope the next Mac Pro is a bit more affordable than the latest version.
censoring the shit word with the new apple start up is honestly the most iconic thing luke has ever done so far in his career (next to making his onlyfans)!!
I'm about to make the move to Apple Silicon. I'm holding out for the Mini for sure. For now my trusty 5,1 maxed out and my 2012 15" MBP maxed out are holding up quite well for audio production. This reminds me of the PPC to Intel transition. I still have and use a G5 Dual 2.5GHz, 8GB of ram with Logic 9 on it at our practice spot. It's still up to the task even 16 years later. Luckily I only do audio. lol
I agree they are overpriced for the performance the offer. But … most people just don't need the M1 like performance. And looking at those charts, I was actually surprised this thing was keeping up with the Mac Mini M1 in most cases.
you say that, but considering how many trashcan videos you've made i'd say it's priceless! how much has it earned you by now! that said for all the flack luke talks, all im seeing is a computer that held its value for nearly a decade and has to be compared to the latest and greatest, and that final cut is still king.
I think for music production though, this is why it still sells…IMO. That’s what I use my Mac Pro for, not for gaming or anything like that. I’m still rocking a 2010 Mac Pro…thanks to you bro! But for real, I think music producers buy it primarily for that reason; plus it looks dope!! LOL
I know it’s been a long time but I really have to applaud you for being able to film this sick, even with your voice sounding like hell, the video was great as always. And nobody’s gonna blame you for the voice if they know you’re sick. Also I must add, lookin’ sharp as always 😁
Virtualization is one use case where the old Intel Mac Pro still offers a unique advantage over other desktop Macs. x86 CPU emulation isn't here yet for M1. For a home lab scenario, the compute to size offered by the trashcan combined with the quiet fans is excellent when you compare against similar rack-mount options.
except geekbench and cinescore and all of those have been bias for years to processor manufactures and geekbench makes its money from supporting intel processors
You mean cinebench? That one software Intel publicly tried to shame for not being a real benchmark because they got destroyed in it? That one you're referring to?
I have a 2013 Mac Pro and love it!! Mine has 10 cores, 64 GB RAM, dual D500 video, 1 TB storage…does everything I need, is whisper quiet and looks really cool sitting on my desk!!
In real word application, editing 4k rendering is 3-5 minutes more on the trash can. I can live with that. Plus having LightRoom, photoshop for free (cs6) it’s worth the price.
I really like the design and the way the cooling was done. I wish the case could be used for other machines. And I wish they made a transparent cylinder/cover :-)
I was always expecting someone to come out with a clear (possibly acrylic?) cover for this Mac Pro. I always loved the dark-colored internals--dark mode on the inside :-)
Honestly, I'm of the opinion that the 8 core Trashcan is the superior CPU of the bunch in today's market. The 12 core gives up so much single threaded performance and doesn't come that far ahead in multicore either.
I am sorry that you tried to use your machine for the wrong purposes, but for those of us who knew what we were doing, it was, and still is, a great machine.
@@seshpenguin You probably could build a pretty incredible modular home server setup with one? Have a whole basement or closet cabinet dedicated to thunderbolt accessories and raid ssd. You could have document/media storage, virtual machines running 24/7. It’s basically a very adaptable and cheaper way to build a pretty competent infrastructure for a small business or home use. Wouldn’t be perfect, or small, but ports and cores galore.
I have 2 and they are great for what I do. I am able to run multiple Linux a windows VM as well as the VMware running Oracle 19c. With very little performance degradation.
I bought Mac Pro 2013 recently, cost me about 1600 dollars for the top spec. I knew it wasn’t going to to be the best performing machine seeing as it’s old but I always loved the way it looked on the desk and it was the top spec, so I’m happy with my purchase. I think you’re wrong to call it worthless, it serves the purpose I need for a computer and it looks pretty cool while doing it.
agree. I myself use one and am not going to change it yet. it works as it should and it looks good)) I think it was love at first sight. I have several apple thunderbolt monitors plus massive storage volumes, I am a composer and edit video, I am also fond of modeling and photography. And he copes with all this without problems. yes, perhaps the new ones are faster, but they do not hold as many monitors. undoubtedly the future belongs to ARM architecture. but after that I will not sell it. let him live with me with honors)))
The people want to spend this money on a machine, because they can install like Mojave and produce some music or graphics. The most Plugins are working best with Mojave, I spend last month 5k on a MacBook Pro 16 inch i9 so that I can work with Catalina.
Hey Luke if it’s worthless to you buddy I could really make use of it in my studio as I don’t have loads of money but that machine could do so much for me. Not as useless as you may think, all depends on your specific application requirements. I think you summed it up perfectly with the slim desktop offerings from Apple at the moment. 😊 If an M1 pro or max Mac mini was available, well Jesus I would wee a little I think 😂
23 April 2023: I just checked ebay and that loaded 2013 Mac pro would cost about $1200 CAD from ebay today based on current postings. The low end M2 macbook pro, current model, with 24G ram, 2T ssd would be $3600 CAD (all prices tax included). This means the 2013 mac pro is 1/3 the cost but offers over 1/3 the performance and so is still a good value compared to current products.
"It's just old. And bad."🤣 The hilarious thing about the trashcan Mac Pro is that it was billed as being 'innovative' at all. This very same concept for the 'future' of the professional desktop computer, was already done in the form of the G4 Cube - a machine that, thanks to its fancy resin enclosure and proprietary ADC monitor connection - remains the embodiment of failure. That is, until the TrashCan Pro took the throne of useless. Great video. Sorry you're sick. Fortunately, iFixit has a conversion kit available to turn your 2013 Mac Pro into a Neti Pot.
Just bought my trash can a few weeks ago to run Logic X on Mojave (for 32 bit plugins). 6 core, 32GB RAM, D500’s, 512GB SSD for $400. The only two “issues” with it are the power cable being a cheap 3rd party one and the couple of minor scrapes on the case (but they’re on the back so I can’t see them anyway)
"can't innovate anymore my ass" Phill was not wrong this Mac Pro continues to innovate in the uselessnes/dollar metric even after 8 years. Come back in another 8 years it'll be even more useless for every dollar paid 😂
The Trashcan is not as bad as you make it out to be. It was pretty good (but not great) for its time. Comparing the Trashcan to today's M1 Macs isn't much of a comparison.
I was interested in purchasing this model but the price was way too high for something is over five years old. Even to this day, it is still way overpriced. I was still using my mid 2012 Mac Pro and wanted to upgrade. So I was looking around and then the new M1 iMac came out and I almost got one. Just wasn't feeling the size of the screen. I kept looking and ended up finding a 2017 iMac 4.2Ghz which was a step below the iMac Pro. The original owner didn't need it after purchasing a 16" inch Intel MacBook Pro. The iMac was used only for 3 months and put it away in storage after purchasing the MacBook Pro. Guess what? I only paid only $800 for it and it was spanking brand new and it was still in the original packaging that it was purchased in. When I transferred all my stuffs from iCloud. I was blown away at the speed of this iMac. This model I got is a 4.2 GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7 with a Retina 5K, 27-inch. Spanking brand new when I got it pretty much. So I have NO REGRETS at all at this point. Like I said I almost got the m1 iMac but I changed my mind cause I wanted the 27 inch instead. I'm waiting on the next 27 inch iMac that is in the works. If it's worth the upgrade from the one I have, I will go for it. As of now, I'm pleased with it.
I use a Trashcan Mac Pro everyday for web development and honestly it still holds up pretty well. That said though I can't wait for an M1 Pro/Max Mac mini, that would be fantastic
we have 35 of them in our office. I Cannot wait until the m1max mac-mini is available we just got 4 of the MBP- max machines and we will be buying the minis on day one !!!
I have a 2013 Mac Pro with 32GB Ram/256GB HD. This unit drives three 27" Thunderbolt displays that work great for what I do (financial work and some graphics editing). Would the 2022 Mac Mini M1 Pro have enough ports and power to be practical replacement for my current 2013 Mac Pro? Seems like a good fit, but would appreciate your input.
Hello, I have a question for you, I recently purchased a Mac Pro "Apple Mac Pro ME253LL/A 4-Core Xeon E5-1620v2 3.7 12GB 256GB (Late-2013) MG7251" and my question is, can i put 128 gb RAM without any problem to this Mac Pro thanks
There are still few reasons why people may want to buy a 2013 MacPro: larger RAM, (cheaper) storage and virtualization. In some cases you just need a lot of RAM, and I think this is the main reason why those Macs are still holding value. As much as they're beautiful (I always loved how they look) there's not much use-cases left where they can still shine.
I have always loved the form factor of this machine. It would be cool if they brought it back with Apple silicone. Maybe half as tall, if you don’t need expansion slots, IMO it would be very cool
How’s Aperture running on you macOS 10.14 on your Apple silicon MBP? You keep forgetting that these machines are still more than capable running older, unsupported and not updated apps that just work
It's now only 2 years later and the price has already considerably gone down. A unit that's maxed out on specs is only $500, a "normal" unit can range between $150 to $300. Do you think they're worth buying now?
I work at a small print shop and we have 3 graphic designers, one just got a new Mac Pro (our shop flooded that’s a whole other story) one has a trash can Mac I think it’s a 2014 and I’m using the original cheese grater Mac Pro from 2012… and honestly mine is just as if not more reliable than the trash can it overheats so quick you can hear it gasping for air 😂
I always wanted one of the trash can macs.. but no way I’m paying $2,000-3,000 for one. I’ll wait until they fall in price and get one when they are under $500.
In case it wasn’t clear from the audio, I filmed this video while battling strep throat, a fever, and a common cold 😅 hope it wasn’t too bad lol
Feel better soon
Sounded pretty nice actually 😂👌🏼
Get well soon 🤒🥰
Hope you get better soon! Take the time you need to get better, we'll happily watch videos a little late or a little scratchy
A good honey in luke-warm water is the best remedy for throat infections. Acacia is my fav
I'm still going to buy one, when they sell for about $200. I just want it on my shelf. It's pretty.
I want one under my desk, as a trash can.
Good luck on that. G4 cubes never went that cheap, before bottoming out and prices rising again. It won’t be as bad though - there are more trashcans than cubes, because the cube wasn’t a true Pro machine at any given time. I for one never plan to sell mine, and it’s frankly easy to store it. I also love my PowerMac G4 Dual 1GHz but it is taking up valuable space. And it will never run Windows 10 or a decent Linux, whereas 12 Xeons will be handy to do some odd jobs like that for, what? 10 more years? 20?
Could it be converted into a bin??
Lol.....
Same here!
Not gonna lie, I would LOVE to see the trash can re-released with an M1 Max. All those pesky thermal issues disappear with Apple Silicon. And I still love the way it looks!
Or M2 Max
I would like to see that as well but I wouldn’t hold my breath. Best best is to take an M1 mini and shove it into the trash can case.
@@morganwin350 agreed.
@@JoshSchaidt now I am wondering how much work and how much money that might be because I really want that setup thanks for helping me spend some money.
@@morganwin350 if you can figure it out I’ll buy one too!
To be honest, I absolutely love my Trashcan. I called him Henry, after the vacuum cleaner (specifically, Henry the Third after the first two being Mac minis). I know it's not really a rational choice, but I like my computers to have personality. Henry absolutely does.
Underrated comment
I personally loved this comment, ignore @@Zebra_Paw.
Add a smily face and you can chat to it😆
this comment section is so wholesome. I love it
I named my previous computer "for sale" and he quit me for someone else.
Still the best looking Mac ever… if anything given their new SoC approach to ultra efficient hardware the Trashcan design would work great today…. A dual M1 Max SoC with 20 cpu cores, 64 gpu cores and 128gb ram and 4TB ssd….in a trash can …would be my fantasy
yes
hopefully they won't go there; people buy mac pro so they can put PCIe card into them; and that will probably be the main reason to buy one given how the M1 max is powerful (and given the fact it will probably end up in a mac mini)
@@valdir7426 …what PCIe card would people need to add? The dual M1 max has built in video encoders/decoders and graphics … as for anything else, my Fantasy double M1 Max trash can would have dual 10GB Ethernet ports.. 4 usb 3 ports …8 thunderbolt 4 ports…. HDMI 2.1 and latest Bluetooth and WI-FI 6e. … and there should be room for 4 nvme pcie4 connectors inside … for up to 32TB of internal storage…. Not clear to me what internal cards people would be looking for.
@@valdir7426 it's entirely up for debate if an Apple Silicon Mac Pro will have the same kind of upgradability and modularity of the current cheese grater one
@@silvestrocrino3256 the Mac Pro is a very niche product for people with very specialized tasks. People don't always buy mac pro to do things related to graphics; the audio world use a lot of dedicated PCIe cards with or w/o DSP; as well as fast storage as PCIe. There are many reasons to need PCIe slots. Apple has stopped the nonsense of slim and light above all else and got in a good direction for pro users with the 16"; the Mac Pro; and now the M1 pro/max macbooks. They will likely not go back to something like the trash can; and they'll probably keep what was appreciated with the lastest Mac Pro; and that is expandability. I suggest you take a look at Neil Parfitt's channel who (justifiably) uses every single PCIe slot from the mac pro for his setup (he even removed the included one with usb ports); then you'll understand why people would need PCIe slots (and why people would need a mac pro period).
These are now like $200-$300 all day on eBay.. if you're patient you can even get ones below the $200 mark. In a year I could see these being $100-$200. At $150 I'd buy a decent condition one just for display / to mess with.
Film industry editors work almost exclusively on these trash cans in the post houses in London. They work pretty flawlessly when you're using Avid systems.
Same here in Germany. Nobody in serious movie post production edits 4K raw footage. Never had a problem with these running Avid.
Same shit in Russia. I’m sound supervisor in films
I’ve never really taken benchmarks serious
@@Nummer6 Can you please give the full name of the software by Avid? I wanted to google it. Never heard about it before.
I think the really interesting part is how competitive my M1 Mac mini is to this …considering I paid $599 for it 😳😳
Exactly. The M1 Mac mini is the second brand new computer I ever bought from Apple. The first was the G4 Mini in 2005.
I was thinking the same as he was going over the results. I think the real winner here for what it costs is the M1 Mac mini
What trashcan owners will find is that it is the FIRST Mac Mini that is overall equivalent or better in most tasks. Up until now, all those cores were beating down every Mac Mini and MacBook Pro. I’ve kept editing on the trashcan using Final Cut Pro despite having several MacBook Pros 2014-2020, but after the M1 they are finally caught up.
That’s fine if you are content with a measly 256 gig of storage and a mere 8 gig of DRAM, neither of which can you ever upgrade nor change! I’d go through 256 gigs of SSD just transferring stuff from my old computer to the new one!
Incredible value and performance...as documented on UTube many times over.
Mac Pro gets completely destroyed at 6:00 because MacOS does not support Crossfire, so for those "gaming" benchmarks, it's a single d700 vs the other single GPUs.
Few old games had Mac Pro 2013 support for dual GPU but assigning different task to them.
Funny enough, the trash can in fact does support Crossfire, albeit Windows only
I use my MacPro 2013 for photo editing. Paid $200 on eBay, it came with the original 1TB ssd. I put a 12 core processor in it ($18 on eBay). It works great for graphics. It can run Sonoma with open core but I am fine with the Monterey OS it came with. For games, I use my home built PC running Windows with a RTX 3090Ti on Steam.
But the biggest issue with trying to replace a 2013 Mac Pro with a M1 Pro / Max Mac Mini is that there are too few ports. 6 TB2 ports and 4 USB-A ports is critical for pros like me who need RAIDs, multiple monitors, docks, etc. connected to power our post-production workflows.
A Mac Mini Pro most likely won’t be able to handle everything I have:
3 Promise Pegasus RAID arrays
4 monitors (one is a for A/V Output in FCP)
A hard drive dock
A USB hub
A media card hub (SD, microSD, CF)
I can’t hook all that up to a Mac Mini. But I don’t want to spend $10k+ on a Mac Pro.
I want the trashcan but with M1 Pro/Max.
I sold mine last week and i was surprised how much attention it got. It is still a nifty piece of engineering.
You convinced me... even at this Christmas's price of ~$179 I think these are not really worth picking up. A cube would make a more interesting anachranism.
Alternate title: The most expensive trash can money can buy.
I recently bought a used “trashcan” for US$650. It was sold to me as base model, but it had the dual three gigabyte graphics cards (D500), a 1 terabyte SSD, 8 gigs of 1333 DDR3 ECC DRAM, AND THE 4-core Xeon processor. I installed 64 Gigs of 1600 DRAM, and upgraded the processor (myself) to the faster of the 2 available 12-core Xeons. My total cash outlay was just a hair over US$900. Now, I vacillated between buying a 2013 Mac Pro and the new M1 Mac Mini. What made up my mind for me was that a new Mini, for pretty much that same price would have come with only 16 gigs of RAM, and only 512 gigs of SSD storage. But more importantly than that, the M1Mini is totally NON UPGRADABLE! If I had bought one with a 1TB drive, it would have upped the price to just about $1100! A 2TB drive would have added US$600 (which is ridiculously outrageous). But however I would have configured the Mini, whatever I would have bought, I would have been stuck with. That made the decision for me. Adding another 8 gigs of RAM adds US$200 to the Mini’s base price, but I was able to replace the 8 gigs of 1333 DRAM that came with my Pro with 64gig of brand new Samsung DDR 1600 ECC RAM for US$65! If I want to, I can add up to 4 gigs of SSD, to the pro, and go all the way to 128 Gigs of RAM (and do the latter for less than Apple wants to increase the Mini’s RAM from 8 to 16 gig). Non-upgradability is a cynical ploy by Apple to make one buy new hardware when one needs more RAM or a bigger internal SSD.
Mr. Miani, you need to understand that people have different needs, and although to you the 2013 Pro might be useless, speed and benchmark performance do not tell the whole story here. I love mine, it’s perfect for my needs. I’m a writer. My work consists of word processing, image manipulation, and occasional graphics, CAD and schematic capture. For these tasks the Trashcan is perfect and it will likely serve me for a lot of years.
That's great! But I think the key point is, 2 years ago it was 10,000$ to get maxed out trash can. Soon it's likely you can get much more performance from a 1000-2000$ Mac mini.
You can't upgrade the mini, but the amount of performance on the table is still future proof for many years ahead (just like the 10k trash can).
@@oliverhughes169 Thanks for your comment, but I think the point is that Mr. Miani’s blanket statement that the 2013 Mac Pro is “absolutely worthless”, is, like most blanket statements, wrong. The performance of this 12-core computer is very good, and the upgradability is definitely worth the price of admission.
I have to say, mine remains very useful (and pleasant) for heavy office tasks. It handles multiple retina 4K very nicely, and I recently added a third HDMI display. I’ve got a 16 TB storage array on Thunderbolt, and for these kind of “digital hub” jobs it continues to outperform every Intel CPU laptop and Mac Mini. All those cores make it very smooth, so it’s got a fine luxury feeling when you keep it off the racetrack. You just need to stop giving it large 4K encode jobs and H265 compression tasks.
Hi. I se you connected "multiple retina 4k". I'd like to connect 5 4k, NOT THUNDERBOLT monitors to it. Is it possible? I read somewhere: "Up to three 4k monitors or 6 Thunderbolt monitor". Thanks
@@paolopetrozzi2213 If you want 4K60, it does need to be DisplayPort monitors with MST (Dell UP2414Q is the example used in Apple Stores back in 2014). You could use up all 6 Thunderbolt ports doing this, but to keep full bandwidth, you'd use only 1 of: The top 2 on the left, the top 2 on the right, and the bottom row of 2. The HDMI is separate and can generate 4K30.
What version of the thunderbolt does it have?
Fun Fact: The Tin Can Mac Pro is the only mac that only made in USA
I have the same trashcan. It's fairly close to maxed out with 64GB RAM and 2TB, 12 core etc. I bought it new and it was a lot of money. When it was new it was pretty decent and ran my music studio with Logic Pro quite well, and TBH it still runs it reasonably well. I waited for an age for a new Mac Pro but when they arrived they were a huge amount of money and there were instantly rumours that Apple were switching to Arm so I didn't want to spend another £10k on a machine if I wasn't going to get the mileage. When the M1 appeared it was amazing, the Mini was killer, however it was a bit limited as my studio has 3 screens on and 30TB of attached storage, I couldn't do that with a Mini. I could buy a new MBP and just use it as a desktop but it seems a bit sub optimal. As soon as there's an M1 Max Mini available then I'll flip the trashcan in a blink. So stop talking their value down for a moment :)
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Bump. How you doin?
Thank you for devaluing them so I can buy one for a not absurd price
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It still trades in for about 1k at the Apple Store
5yrs from now everyone will say how great the design was like the G4 Cube
This form factor was ahead of it's time . It should have been used with the M1 series chip . Imagine the Mac studio in this chassis with an anodized black finish , instead of that glossy black. It would have stayed nice and cool since it only has one chip to cool with that massive heatsink. This chassis would have made sense now .
Good point.
Mac Studio.
A good point but I think the M-macs don't need to be very big. With an A100 GPU tho' maybe!
Running with 128G of memory makes the 12 core config run at less than 1/2 the normal memory speed so that’s not really showing the full potential of the trash can.
Luke, thank you so much for making this video!
I recently looked up various tests of yours trying to compare. At work I’m currently running a 2013 Mac Pro with a (self upgraded) 1tb ssd and 64gb ram.
It’s a 6 core Xeon + D500.
I have wanted to upgrade for a while now, and I just ordered the 16” pro max (fully maxed except for the SSD) and after watching this I’m expecting it to do backflips, lol.
Thanks for all the content, you and Max Yuryev have been indispensable. God bless you.
That cold, Luke. Go to bed.
MacPro - still dead. Still beautiful.
I really liked the design. Would be a great fit for the new M chips.
I think the reason why I prefer a trashcan Mac over the mini is because the trashcan has way more ports available for me to plug in more monitors and things to it than the mini.
I use a trashcan for my main work computer for 3D modelling and rendering. It was cheap and works great. My backup is a maxed out 2008 Mac Pro that honestly still feels fast today.
I think the idea is not that it's useless, but moreso that it doesn't make sense to pay ~$3000 today when you can get something cheaper+faster.
In the trash can Mac Pro’s defense, it has USB ports. That’s so valuable nowadays, I still have yet to own or find someone else who owns a USB-C accessory.
Well… I got mine in early 2014 yeah not this beast you have but the 5k option back then plus later added 32Gb of RAM and a 1T SSD, it is however still going like new, fully supported and thats a lot to say for a 7yr machine. I agree the new machines are a new world but as you clearly point out, the new ones are monsters even compared to newish super expensive window pcs as well!
Sounds good. Get well!
Still rocking the dual processor 16 core 5,1 here. I like having several internal drives including NVME. I hope the next Mac Pro is a bit more affordable than the latest version.
censoring the shit word with the new apple start up is honestly the most iconic thing luke has ever done so far in his career (next to making his onlyfans)!!
The thumbnail is perfection
The company I work for bought base model trashcan pros a few months before the new mac pro launched for our graphics team
1:14 I mean you could take the board(s) out of the M1 Mac Mini and put them into a trashcan Mac.....
That's an interesting project ...
Apple could have easily upgraded the trashcan, they just decided not to.
we love a good ifixit toolkit sponsorship and showcase
minimum ebay buyout price for this model has dropped 30% since this video was posted
I'm about to make the move to Apple Silicon. I'm holding out for the Mini for sure. For now my trusty 5,1 maxed out and my 2012 15" MBP maxed out are holding up quite well for audio production. This reminds me of the PPC to Intel transition. I still have and use a G5 Dual 2.5GHz, 8GB of ram with Logic 9 on it at our practice spot. It's still up to the task even 16 years later. Luckily I only do audio. lol
Paper weight ….U got Covid Dude🤨 Rest and recover!!!
I agree they are overpriced for the performance the offer. But … most people just don't need the M1 like performance. And looking at those charts, I was actually surprised this thing was keeping up with the Mac Mini M1 in most cases.
Video actually starts at the 5 min mark
you say that, but considering how many trashcan videos you've made i'd say it's priceless! how much has it earned you by now!
that said for all the flack luke talks, all im seeing is a computer that held its value for nearly a decade and has to be compared to the latest and greatest, and that final cut is still king.
Don't feel too bad. In 1992, Cray sold the million-dollar super-computer that he was building, because desk-top computers were catching up.
I think for music production though, this is why it still sells…IMO. That’s what I use my Mac Pro for, not for gaming or anything like that. I’m still rocking a 2010 Mac Pro…thanks to you bro! But for real, I think music producers buy it primarily for that reason; plus it looks dope!! LOL
Yep this is what I'm trying to decide for music production. How much noise does it generate?
I know it’s been a long time but I really have to applaud you for being able to film this sick, even with your voice sounding like hell, the video was great as always. And nobody’s gonna blame you for the voice if they know you’re sick. Also I must add, lookin’ sharp as always 😁
I love MacPro 2013 so much, a future reissue with M1 Max will be a dream. I’m still waiting for the new MacMini, I’m very curious about it!
It is strictly a collector's item now, like the G4 Lamp and the Cube.
Yes, I will be adding one to my collection in January 2022.
to be fair, Intel didn't exactly improve in processor speed at the time. But indeed, classic apple, focus (to much) on form, design
Wrong, apple was stupid/dumb with their courage thing back in 2013, the 2019 macpro is actually a computer that is useful with all upgrades possible.
Virtualization is one use case where the old Intel Mac Pro still offers a unique advantage over other desktop Macs. x86 CPU emulation isn't here yet for M1. For a home lab scenario, the compute to size offered by the trashcan combined with the quiet fans is excellent when you compare against similar rack-mount options.
except geekbench and cinescore and all of those have been bias for years to processor manufactures and geekbench makes its money from supporting intel processors
You mean cinebench? That one software Intel publicly tried to shame for not being a real benchmark because they got destroyed in it? That one you're referring to?
This is not the trash can anymore, it's trash *can't*
BA dum tss
I would definitely love an M1 Max based Mac desktop with this premium trashcan design.
I have a 2013 Mac Pro and love it!! Mine has 10 cores, 64 GB RAM, dual D500 video, 1 TB storage…does everything I need, is whisper quiet and looks really cool sitting on my desk!!
You sound unwell, Luke. Take care of yourself!
Yeah I noticed that, hope is not covid.
In real word application, editing 4k rendering is 3-5 minutes more on the trash can. I can live with that. Plus having LightRoom, photoshop for free (cs6) it’s worth the price.
It is very very pretty, and there is much satisfaction from taking the aluminum cylinder off and then putting it back on again… 🙃
Can’t wait for a Mac mini that has M1Max or M2 chip
*Condolence to the people who bought that garbage*
How could someone buy Macintosh 128k? Seriously, it was introduced 8! years ago.(ARM was total crap at the time)
Got one for $100, it's sitting nicely next my G4 Cube..
I really like the design and the way the cooling was done. I wish the case could be used for other machines. And I wish they made a transparent cylinder/cover :-)
I was always expecting someone to come out with a clear (possibly acrylic?) cover for this Mac Pro. I always loved the dark-colored internals--dark mode on the inside :-)
Honestly, I'm of the opinion that the 8 core Trashcan is the superior CPU of the bunch in today's market. The 12 core gives up so much single threaded performance and doesn't come that far ahead in multicore either.
My university uses these things like crazy. I wish i could take em 😭
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Feel better soon, Luke!
I am sorry that you tried to use your machine for the wrong purposes, but for those of us who knew what we were doing, it was, and still is, a great machine.
Mate spot on!!
I'm curious, what purposes would be these days? I get it when it launched, performance was decent and you got lots of Thunderbolt.
@@seshpenguin You probably could build a pretty incredible modular home server setup with one?
Have a whole basement or closet cabinet dedicated to thunderbolt accessories and raid ssd. You could have document/media storage, virtual machines running 24/7.
It’s basically a very adaptable and cheaper way to build a pretty competent infrastructure for a small business or home use. Wouldn’t be perfect, or small, but ports and cores galore.
That Mac Pro, looks really sus in the intro 🤣
I’m betting that Luke could make all his videos on the $10k trashcan and it would work super easy, barely an inconvenience.
I have 2 and they are great for what I do. I am able to run multiple Linux a windows VM as well as the VMware running Oracle 19c. With very little performance degradation.
I bought Mac Pro 2013 recently, cost me about 1600 dollars for the top spec. I knew it wasn’t going to to be the best performing machine seeing as it’s old but I always loved the way it looked on the desk and it was the top spec, so I’m happy with my purchase. I think you’re wrong to call it worthless, it serves the purpose I need for a computer and it looks pretty cool while doing it.
You could have bought M1 mac mini for less and it is more powerful
agree. I myself use one and am not going to change it yet. it works as it should and it looks good)) I think it was love at first sight.
I have several apple thunderbolt monitors plus massive storage volumes, I am a composer and edit video, I am also fond of modeling and photography. And he copes with all this without problems. yes, perhaps the new ones are faster, but they do not hold as many monitors. undoubtedly the future belongs to ARM architecture. but after that I will not sell it. let him live with me with honors)))
The people want to spend this money on a machine, because they can install like Mojave and produce some music or graphics. The most Plugins are working best with Mojave, I spend last month 5k on a MacBook Pro 16 inch i9 so that I can work with Catalina.
Hey Luke if it’s worthless to you buddy I could really make use of it in my studio as I don’t have loads of money but that machine could do so much for me. Not as useless as you may think, all depends on your specific application requirements. I think you summed it up perfectly with the slim desktop offerings from Apple at the moment. 😊 If an M1 pro or max Mac mini was available, well Jesus I would wee a little I think 😂
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23 April 2023: I just checked ebay and that loaded 2013 Mac pro would cost about $1200 CAD from ebay today based on current postings. The low end M2 macbook pro, current model, with 24G ram, 2T ssd would be $3600 CAD (all prices tax included). This means the 2013 mac pro is 1/3 the cost but offers over 1/3 the performance and so is still a good value compared to current products.
his voice is different now.. miss his old voice :(
He might be a little sick
he’s just sick check his twitter
"It's just old. And bad."🤣
The hilarious thing about the trashcan Mac Pro is that it was billed as being 'innovative' at all. This very same concept for the 'future' of the professional desktop computer, was already done in the form of the G4 Cube - a machine that, thanks to its fancy resin enclosure and proprietary ADC monitor connection - remains the embodiment of failure. That is, until the TrashCan Pro took the throne of useless.
Great video. Sorry you're sick. Fortunately, iFixit has a conversion kit available to turn your 2013 Mac Pro into a Neti Pot.
I still love the look of those things and hope to find a cheap one as an heirloom
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Just bought my trash can a few weeks ago to run Logic X on Mojave (for 32 bit plugins). 6 core, 32GB RAM, D500’s, 512GB SSD for $400.
The only two “issues” with it are the power cable being a cheap 3rd party one and the couple of minor scrapes on the case (but they’re on the back so I can’t see them anyway)
"can't innovate anymore my ass" Phill was not wrong this Mac Pro continues to innovate in the uselessnes/dollar metric even after 8 years. Come back in another 8 years it'll be even more useless for every dollar paid 😂
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The Trashcan is not as bad as you make it out to be. It was pretty good (but not great) for its time. Comparing the Trashcan to today's M1 Macs isn't much of a comparison.
I was interested in purchasing this model but the price was way too high for something is over five years old. Even to this day, it is still way overpriced. I was still using my mid 2012 Mac Pro and wanted to upgrade. So I was looking around and then the new M1 iMac came out and I almost got one. Just wasn't feeling the size of the screen. I kept looking and ended up finding a 2017 iMac 4.2Ghz which was a step below the iMac Pro. The original owner didn't need it after purchasing a 16" inch Intel MacBook Pro. The iMac was used only for 3 months and put it away in storage after purchasing the MacBook Pro. Guess what? I only paid only $800 for it and it was spanking brand new and it was still in the original packaging that it was purchased in. When I transferred all my stuffs from iCloud. I was blown away at the speed of this iMac. This model I got is a 4.2 GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7 with a Retina 5K, 27-inch. Spanking brand new when I got it pretty much. So I have NO REGRETS at all at this point. Like I said I almost got the m1 iMac but I changed my mind cause I wanted the 27 inch instead. I'm waiting on the next 27 inch iMac that is in the works. If it's worth the upgrade from the one I have, I will go for it. As of now, I'm pleased with it.
I use a Trashcan Mac Pro everyday for web development and honestly it still holds up pretty well. That said though I can't wait for an M1 Pro/Max Mac mini, that would be fantastic
The craziest thing to me is that the M1 Mac Mini basically equals or outperforms the fully specced trash can 🤯
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we have 35 of them in our office. I Cannot wait until the m1max mac-mini is available we just got 4 of the MBP- max machines and we will be buying the minis on day one !!!
The trashcan Mac Pro screamed "Avoid me!" on launch.
The only remarkable thing about it was that ANYONE bought one.
I got congestion listening to this! Get well soon!
I love the startup sound covering the expletive!!
I have a 2013 Mac Pro with 32GB Ram/256GB HD. This unit drives three 27" Thunderbolt displays that work great for what I do (financial work and some graphics editing). Would the 2022 Mac Mini M1 Pro have enough ports and power to be practical replacement for my current 2013 Mac Pro? Seems like a good fit, but would appreciate your input.
The question of what you are doing here is why are you surprised a 8 yr old comp/cpu is much slower then a brand new M1 cpu?
Hello, I have a question for you, I recently purchased a Mac Pro "Apple Mac Pro ME253LL/A 4-Core Xeon E5-1620v2 3.7 12GB 256GB (Late-2013) MG7251" and my question is, can i put 128 gb RAM without any problem to this Mac Pro thanks
Oh poor Luke! Get well soon :)
There are still few reasons why people may want to buy a 2013 MacPro: larger RAM, (cheaper) storage and virtualization. In some cases you just need a lot of RAM, and I think this is the main reason why those Macs are still holding value. As much as they're beautiful (I always loved how they look) there's not much use-cases left where they can still shine.
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yeah, I do have 16 maxed out MAX now, but I will buy Mini next year and at the end of Mac Pro. AS is getting insanely good
I have always loved the form factor of this machine. It would be cool if they brought it back with Apple silicone. Maybe half as tall, if you don’t need expansion slots, IMO it would be very cool
Thanks for talking me out of one. I really like the design, it's a crying shame it can't be brought up to to today's specs.
How’s Aperture running on you macOS 10.14 on your Apple silicon MBP? You keep forgetting that these machines are still more than capable running older, unsupported and not updated apps that just work
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Is there anything wrong with using your M1 Macbook pro in clamshell mode?
It's now only 2 years later and the price has already considerably gone down. A unit that's maxed out on specs is only $500, a "normal" unit can range between $150 to $300. Do you think they're worth buying now?
The "trash can" has a beautiful design and I really like it! The efficiency now is low and will get lower and lower....
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I work at a small print shop and we have 3 graphic designers, one just got a new Mac Pro (our shop flooded that’s a whole other story) one has a trash can Mac I think it’s a 2014 and I’m using the original cheese grater Mac Pro from 2012… and honestly mine is just as if not more reliable than the trash can it overheats so quick you can hear it gasping for air 😂
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I always wanted one of the trash can macs.. but no way I’m paying $2,000-3,000 for one. I’ll wait until they fall in price and get one when they are under $500.
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Oh man you sound so sick! Get well soon buddy