The Most Noble Order of the Garter: Past and Present
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- Опубликовано: 6 фев 2025
- I have found myself talking about a lot of Knights of the Garter recently, but what does this actually refer to? What can we find out about this chivalric order’s past and present?
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Intro / Outro song: Silent Partner, "Greenery" [ • Greenery - Silent Part... ]
SFX from freesfx.co.uk/...
Images (from Wikimedia Commons, unless otherwise stated):
Photograph of Camilla, Duchess of Cornwall taken at and by “The Big Lunch” (17th April 2018).
Baroness Valerie Amos pictured during a meeting with UK's International Development Minister Alan Duncan (not shown) in London, taken by Simon Davis/Department for International Development (16th May 2013).
Photograph of Tony Blair, taken by Pavel Golovkin (19th March 2010).
Illumination showing Philippa of Hainault from Jean Froissart’s Chronicles (15th century).
Portrait of Lady Margaret Beaufort by Meynnart Wewyck (c.1510). Held by the Master's Lodge, St John's College, University of Cambridge.
Portrait of Alexandra of Denmark by Luke Fildes (1905). Held by the Royal Collection.
Knights Companion of the Most Noble Order of the Garter, in procession to St George's Chapel, Windsor Castle for the annual service of the Order of the Garter, taken by Philip Allfrey (19th June 2006).
Photograph of the interior of St George’s Chapel, Windsor, taken by Josep Renalias.
Garter stall-plate of Henry Bourchier, 1st Earl of Essex (c.1452). Held by St George’s Chapel, Windsor.
Garter stall-plate of Edward Courtenay, 1st Earl of Devon (c.1494). Held by St George’s Chapel, Windsor.
Garter stall-plate of Walter Blount, 1st Baron Mountjoy (c.1474). Held by St George’s Chapel, Windsor.
Garter stall-plate of George Cadogan, 5th Earl Cadogan (1891). Held by St George’s Chapel, Windsor.
Screenshot of HM The Queen, HRH The Prince of Wales and HRH The Duke of Cambridge in Garter Robes from www.royal.uk/o...
Details of a photograph of the insignia of the Order of the Garter taken by DJM (2nd June 2009).
Portrait of Henry VIII after Hans Holbein the Younger (after 1537). Held by the Walker Art Gallery.
Portrait of Queen Victoria by Herbert Luther Smith (1848). Owned by Aberdeen City Council under the curatorial care of Aberdeen Art Gallery & Museums.
Battle of Crécy between the English and French in the Hundred Years' War, from an illuminated manuscript of Jean Froissart's Chronicles (15th century). Held by the Bibliothèque nationale de France.
Illuminations of the first Garter Knights from the Bruges Garter Book (15th century). Held by the British Library.
Arms of the Most Noble Order of the Garter reproduced by “Sodacan” for Wikimedia Commons (21st July 2010).
Portrait of Edward Stafford, 3rd Duke of Buckingham by an unknown artist (1520). Held by Magdalene College, Cambridge.
Photographs of: Emperor Franz Josef of Austria, in uniform, 1903; Kaiser Wilhelm II by Court Photographer T. H. Voigt of Frankfurt, 1902; Prince Ernest Augustus, 3rd Duke of Cumberland and Teviotdale; Prince Henry of Prussia; Prince Ernest Ludwig of Hesse; Frederick William Victor Augustus Ernest, Crown Prince Imperial of Germany; Prince Charles Edward, Duke of Albany, and Duke of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha; and Wilhelm II, King of Württemberg.
Photograph of Victor Emmanuel III, King of Italy taken by Atelier Bettini, Roma-Livorno (1919).
Photograph of Hirohito, Emperor of Japan (1935).
Quoted texts:
Richard Barber, “Founding Knights of the Order of the Garter” from ODNB
W. M. Ormrod, “King Edward III” from ODNB
Also consulted, were:
Gillespie, James L. “Ladies of the Fraternity of Saint George and of the Society of the Garter.” Albion: A Quarterly Journal Concerned with British Studies, vol. 17, no. 3, 1985, pp. 259-78
Ormrod, W. M. “The Personal Religion of Edward III.” Speculum, vol. 64, no. 4, 1989, pp. 849-77
Morgan, D. A. L. “The Political After-Life of Edward III: The Apotheosis of a Warmonger.” The English Historical Review, vol. 112, no. 448, 1997, pp. 856-81
Other relevant entries in The Oxford Dictionary of National Biography Online
#History #EdwardIII #OrderOfTheGarter
EDIT: Mary II and Anne were also Sovereigns of the Garter - I failed to make it clear that I was jumping between the first female Sovereigns of the Garter (ones that took the role after the pause in the inclusion of Ladies of the Garter to the Order) to Victoria, who was the last female Sovereign of the Garter before the tradition for Ladies of the Garter was restarted.
I apologise because I did not make it clear that this was what I had in mind when I listed these queens.
I love starting my day with a nice cup of coffee, my kitty on my lap and another great bit of history from Dr. Kat! 😻
I find a little grappa or slivovitz goes down well with my coffee.
Same, but with tea. 🙂
Me and my cat duchess do that too 😸
As an American, I prefere coffee as a morning beverage of choice, and also as a descendant of Edward IV, and Elizabeth Woodville, like to keep up with these stories as well. I dont think I have a drop of tudor blood in me even though many ancestors were cousins and intermarriage with some tudors, but Henry VIII killed killed off many of my ancestors including Margaret de la Pole. Mary Boleyn is also a direct ancestor on my mother's side. 4 of Henry VIII wives were aunts or cousins.
Loved this one. The fact that Andrew can keep this honour, dishonors the very idea
I don't believe that Prince Andrew is a member, I read the list of members but I do not see his name?!? I may be wrong, I just realized, I was and I do agree that it's a disgrace that he is permitted to hold that title.
@@zackerylamb9511 There are permitted royal members who I don't think count toward the limit and so may not be listed as such.
@@zackerylamb9511 I saw Andrew, Duke of York, listed but he wasn’t named Prince. William and Edward were each named Prince, and Anne named Princess. Not sure what it means.
@@dale3404 I think it's because he was stripped of his HRH title, (I think) that means he can't be styled as Prince anymore
@@kirstenrussell3055 👍
From the book ‘1066 and all that’ comes their version/translation: Edward III said, “honey, your silk stocking’s hanging down’.
🤣🤣🤣
Such an interesting video. Thanks, Dr Kat!
Andrew should absolutely be forced to return this honor.
Blow my mind then you a time traveler too lol I’m only listening on 21 April 2023 loving you wish more teachers were like you . I have four grandchildren two over ten n they love watching yr channel with me I’m amazed at the attention you get myten year old said “ Nan wish my teacher explained like Doc Kat blessed be 🙏🏻 my lifeline when children are here n I relax in bath listening again without questions 😂❤❤❤❤👏👏👏👏👏👏👏🏴
I just realised that I have been watching your channel for 2 years now cause I found your channel in Ramadan 2020 and now it's Ramadan 2022. I often watch your videos while having my pre-fast meal at 4am lmao. Much love from Pakistan x ✨
For Majesty & for Country.
And what do you and all fellow followers think about the Garter for a man like Tony Blair? I personally think that some errors have been made lately. Andrew also comes to mind.
As a former prime minister I believe the appointment is automatic
Camilla is a much worse choice but here she is!
And Camilla.
@@justanothergoogler6436 it is customary for the Consort of the sovereign to have this honor whether they actually deserve it or not. I believe the Queen gave it to The Duchess in recognition of her future position and (my assumption here) to deflect criticism from Charles and Camilla when they become the sovereign and consort.
@@jameshamilton8245 I think Camilla with or without the Garter will be critized as she deserves, now and then. An adulterer and a divorcée as a Queen. God help us.
Thirty plus years after graduating from Sydney Uni in Australia, I finally realise the origins of the name of the student newspaper (called "Honi Soit," still going I think). Thanks for the education Dr Kat, really interesting.
Andrew is still a member of an order of chivalry! Oh dear.
However, I am delighted to hear that Valerie Amos has been added. We were friends in our late teens/early 20s but our paths diverged - widely. She was always very focussed and was clearly serious about her future. A fine person from a fine family. I have followed her career with pleasure and admiration.
Hot take. Andrew didn't break any laws. Get over it.
Q: What happened to the order during the interregnum? I can't imagine Cromwell wanting to keep it?
I have just recently discovered this channel and I love it so much! As an American whose knowledge of English/British History is a little shaky, I love that these videos are helping me to fill in the gaps. Thanks so much for an informative, and entertaining channel.
Your voice is calmly authoritative, and wonderfully clear. I noticed that you did not read your script verbatim. I think that was wonderfully done. You interpreted your wording in the context of the way in which you meant to say it at the moment. I think that rocks. Thank you for this.
What a great video! Loved that you leaned into heraldic themes this week, a video explaining the achievement of arms of the current monarch or even other orders like the Order of the Thistle or the Royal Victorian Order would be great, I think the History of the College of Arms is so unknown.
I always wondered what this ceremonial Order was about. Thank you so much for sharing this historical ceremony. My family was from England and I enjoy hearing about the history.
Always a pleasure ❤🙋
I’m always happy to see a new video I start each one with a cheerful “Hi Dr Kat!”
The order is a lovely idea …. It might be a good idea for them to think about what it means to be chivalrous in the modern context and possibly look at the membership….
Fabulous video. Thanks you for choosing this topic. I have been interested in heraldry since childhood, and I find everything about the Order of the Garter fascinating.
The RUclips algorithm had not suggested a video of yours for quite some time....I was happy to be reminded of your channel when it did today. I watched this channel a lot while laid off from work for 6 months in 2020....I have a lot of catching up to do!!! Gladly!!!
I can think of at least 3 current members of this order that have been less than chivalrous in their behaviour, thereby debasing the idea on which it was founded. Nice history lesson, thanks.
Oooh. This was great! I’d love to think that the origin really was a lady losing her garter and a gracious king made a point of making sure that the lady would not be ridiculed. But, Dr. Kat, you nonetheless supplied us with a variety of other reasons for the origins of the Garter, about which I have always wondered. The fact that Prince Randie Andie has kept his is equally as monstrous as the alleged manner of death of Edward II. There is much here to be cynical about!
That was my favourite origin story too and the motto makes good sense about not shaming people who err, even in this early version of a public wardrobe malfunction
I think Andrew should have been stripped of this along with everything else. However, as far as King Edward II and his death it's never been proven that's how he died. However, I'm not saying it didn't happen. The Male Nobels that he was rumoured to have been involved with thought that they along with the King could rule their kingdom. Story goes that I think the Duke of Buckingham (it always seems to be the Duke of Buckingham who has affairs with the kings and queens and/or wind upon the chopping block)was one of the Kings favourite and he was murdered and that King spent so much of his time with these men the Nobility had had enough hence the way the King died. Anyone can correct me if need be. I haven't read about it in a while so may have some things not quite right but I'm sure I'm close.
@@l.plantagenet I agree that the several Dukes of Buckingham have been in the thick of things on the regular 😄
I don't think we have a current Buckingham though 🤔
Those darn Dukes of Buckingham who married Katherine Woodville and Died in Buckinghams Rebellion was also one of my ancestors. His son was crown bearer at Henry VIII 's Coronation and by golly Henry VIII executed him too.
@@Anna_Key The version I heard was that they were lovers and she dropped on purpose, so he could state that no one could think ill of their relationship
My goodness Dr Cat! Finally I now understand. Thank you 🙏🏻
Thank you so much for this explanation. I’m American and always wondered what it was when mentioned.
Wow.
This was a great video Dr. Kat, as always! Thank you!
I just wanted to say, your channel has been a HUGE help on the writing project I'm working on, allowing me to fill in huge, important gaps in the necessary background and letting me flesh out the world in new and interesting ways. Thank you so much for all your hard work!
Very interesting video Dr Kat, it's wonderful to learn what's behind all the pomp.
You are a fount of knowledge! 👏✌
Out of all the titles Andrew had this title of chivalry is the 1st they should have taken. My opinion.
I love your channel I always look forward to these with coffee watching the sun rise. Have a beautiful day. ☀️
I have never really been interested in the history of England, (much to the disappointment of a former boyfriend) and my college English Lit class was so many decades ago as to be a very faint memory. RUclips is my only “social media” venue. Imagine my annoyance when I found myself watching, enjoying and anticipating each of your episodes!! Thnx for your clear and interesting snippets of the country you so obviously love.
oh thank you for explaining that, always thought it ws about the lady's garter slipping. Like your hair down too,
Ah another fascinating video, thanks! I always wondered about the Order of the Garter.
This presentatioin was much appreciated, as there were many things on which you touched of which I was unaware! You always add so much to our knowledge about so many different subjects!😄~ ~ Our family is related to #26 William FitzWarin, who was awarded the garter in 1349. In reading about him, he probably deserved it, as he was going all over the place, battle after battle, for the King, and supported the King heavily. I think it was wonderful to want to honour the service of brave men, who continually left the warmth of hearth and home to serve king and country. I must say I was rather dismayed that the gravity and significance of the garter, in my humble opinion, has been seriously watered down over the centuries.🙄 I believe that it should be kept to honour those that have done major service to the crown and country, and should be given to only those within the realm, itself. To have to take back the garter from those who are not even citizens of the country didn't shock me, but the honouring those outside the realm in the first place would have bothered me, as an English citizen, and I would have thought that within England, they could find at least 26 very deserving English citizens who have fought and supported their Queen/King and the people well enough to have been considered and then awarded this high honour. Dr. Kat ~ What do you think? 🤔ruclips.net/user/sgaming/emoji/7ff574f2/emoji_u1f644.png
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_knights_and_ladies_of_the_Garter
Yes! I can’t wait for this one!!!!
Hugh de Courtney is a progenitor of mine. I really need to learn more. This helps. Thank you.
Fabulously told, fantastic history! Thank you Dr Kat 👏🏻👏🏼👏🏽 Happy St George's day! T 🇬🇧 🏴 🏴 🏴
I have ancestors who were members of the Order of the Garter,the Feltons of Northumberland. The name plates are displayed in St.Georges Chapel. Our family line goes back to 1045 in Normandy and begins in England 1066 with the conqueror and continues through at least the 18th century. The family is entwined with almost every reign,every battle and many historical events including Crecy,Poitiers,Sterling bridge,Bannockburn, and many others. One of them assassinated the Duke of Birmingham and one was a bible translator,scholar and personal clergy to the king and queen. Really fascinating family!
I did not know what the Order of the Garter was about. Thank you for this video!
As a child I wanted to become a knight. The dream changed, but it is interesting to know a bit more about that order of chivalry, thx
Bonza work Kat! But order of the Bath is my favourite ;)
Excellent video, as always. I admire your work so much. I noticed in the portraits of the first members of the Most Noble order of the Garter that the members are holding What looks like four escutcheons in most cases. However they seem to be displayed in a way that quartered arms normally are not. Do you have any insight into this, please? Thank you very much! I cannot find my copy of Fox-Davies. misplacing a book of that size might imply "Oh, I think I have too many books?" Nah!
Interesting. Looking forward to the new additions.
This was so interesting and thought provoking. Thank you very much. The UK must be one of the countries with the most orders of chivalry. I wonder if those stranger knights, heads of state, who if they are struck off the list, have to return their insignia. Another matter that interests is how the blue velvet and silk mantles are made, as well as the intricate insignia, and by whom..
Hello from America Dr Kat! I miss the Henry and Anne bath ducks on the shelf. I hope your son and husband are well. I work remotely, if my company has UK offices, can I visa to the UK? I would be happy all my days. Our architecture is 🤢. I LOVE stall plates! I have chosen a panther incensed in a lozenge as my own badge. (I am unmarried, and my cat is white with a black tail.) You have such beautiful buildings! Bless You Dr Kat.
Thank you for this interesting video. I will keep my personal opinion of those I feel don't rate such honours to myself. You advice re: checking subscribing has helped. Not on this channel because it is one of the first things I check, though on others I've not upgraded to all content. Bless you.
With all these Edwards, Johns, and Georges, did they all have different names they called each other back then? When you had a room full of 8 Johns would they have had nicknames they used in general conversations?
Buzz, Eddie, Blackie, Tripod, No thumbs, Butch, etc.
@@bonnieweeks8383 😂
I work in day care for the elderly a small group of 12 and there were five John's who all attended on the same day. Used to use full names so they were know which one we were talking to.
I think that’s where title become really helpful - “my lord Surrey / Suffolk / Essex etc” would be an easy way to separate all the Henrys, Thomases and Edwards 😂
I love hearing over and over and over about the 6 wives of Henry viii. But apparently English history actually has more topics than just those 7 people. Who knew ?!
I seriously used to think Henry 8th was the 8th because he married 8 times. Or something like that. I’m all better now
Dr Kat, thank you from the USA. I have enjoyed your knowledge, of history, and your sharing. Can you direct me to someone with as much US history as you have English history. Since I found out I was 3/4 English, 1/8 Irish and 1/8 Scottish, I have done a 2 year English history obsession, with many different Ytube channels. You are on my notification. Keep up the great work.
Thank you for this! I had heard the fallen garter tale, with additional embellishments I won't bring up here. This is the most believable of the origin stories, imo.
In this age of cancel culture, I find these old practices intrinsically a part of keeping our history alive. I can see why Princess Ann has said that she'd prefer to be a Knight. I have to agree with her!
Here in 🇺🇸, those if us who have ancestry in the UK appreciate keeping history alive with our many Rennaisance Fair's
which are set in the Elizabethan era. They are loads of fun! From combat, jousting, Fools, archers, knights in armour, music, pirates, a Queen E, the Green Man and games for children. There are many guilds who work on education.
Some offer the ability to try your hand at an old forgotten skill, like weaving or spinning.
Especially with the massive influx of migrants, I believe it's more important than ever, to keep these old
rituals and celebrations alive. It helps newcomers to appreciate their new homes. Keeping culture alive matters. Plus, this club allows both genders! How forward thinking! I love the regalia! That's my take on it.
I always think Renaissance fairs look like marvellous fun! Maybe I’ll get a chance to travel over and go to one someday… I could even vlog it 🙌
@@ReadingthePast
I was in a vlog at a Ren Faire. A friend found it on YT. I was totally in bawdy character.
My avatar pic is me dressed up at a Faire!
We have one twice a year. You'd love it!
Both the Colorado Faire in Larkspur and the one in Charlotte, NC, (the only two I’ve been to) are set in the Tudor era. The royal parades feature Henry VIII and usually Anne Boleyn. Great fun. My daughter worked in Larkspur several summers. One year she portrayed one of the seven deadly sins, She played wrath. I said she should have played sloth!
@@ReadingthePast I'd love to see a leatherworking skills booth to see if it's changed much from the way I do it today.
Please can you make some videos explaining heraldic symbols, and all the gold ropes etc worn as part of uniforms and regalia. What do they represent, what's their meaning and where did they come from?
Other explanations of the Order of the Garter and its history have read like a stale sermon compared to your insightful and concise version. Thank you!
Thank you, Dr. Kat for a very insightful video. Fridays wouldn’t be complete without me, scotch in hand, sitting in my hot tub(it’s a California thing!) and your channel. 🤗
Has the Order of the Garter lost a step since it’s inception? I think so. It was created to advise and go to war with the monarch and that’s something 20th and 21st century monarchs don’t engage in. It seems more pomp and circumstance then anything else. Especially if Andrew is permitted to be one of its members 😢
love your videos
I think Tony Blair detracts from the glamour of the Garter.
You don’t say 😂
Unfortunately I believe past prime minister are automatically included
But it is in line with tradition. I feel like upholding tradition is more important than your personal feelings about a politician
I think it's fantastic and The Queen looks amazing in the Garter garb
Great video, thank you!! But....where is your little dragon that always sits at your right shoulder??
Enjoyed this history and current status.
Epic info!
To paraphrase Jane Austen “people who receive a KG seem to live forever”, she said “annuity”. I’m always struck how extremely old most members of this order are. If the people of the UK want these arcane, aristocratic traditions, who is this American to object? It would never happen here in the US.
As time goes on the US will have traditions that look out of step with the times. Do you throw them out or do you enjoy the variety and the history of it all?
Britain has many Royal traditions and Local area traditions and many of these have been going for centuries and are part of the fabric of our lives.
During Lockdown it was notable how the lack, or limited nature, of these events made our lives so much less colourful and fun. Be it Trooping the Colour or our local Fetes and Highland games, the Jubilee or Cheese rolling there’s something for everyone.
Never heard of the Senate?
I always enjoy your videos! As an American with about 99% of my ancestry being Irish, English and Nordic, I feel like I'm learning more about some of my ancestry when I watch your videos. Although life happens and I haven't been to the UK in a couple of decades, I hope to return someday to continue tracing my ancestry and see more of your beautiful Country.
KG to precede all other postnomial honorifics save one: VC.
Thank you again, Dr. Kat, for another great video. The Order of the Garter is a quaint throwback to yesteryear, but it really serves no purpose in today's world.
Really? I guess you don’t really understand it.
Really interesting video.
Great job. Here because of kevrow university. You have to call him, Kev Gillespie tomorrow and talk about this order of the garter. His logo is the Garter... King Colonel president George "Washington" Gillespie of the Virginia Company
have you heard about the sacophagus found at Notre Dame? you may want to add it to your next news of the month
Another great, informative, enjoyable video! Very well researched! God bless you, Dr. Kat! 🥰
I have to say, though, seeing the photo showing some of the current members dressed up in those costumes and feathered hats gave me a laugh. I think since they are continuing with this tradition, which in today's day and age seems just pomp and circumstance, they would have redesigned them to something more modern.
Well, that's my 2 cents. Have a great weekend!
If you go to Italy you will see people in Medieval costume riding in a horse race round a square. If you go to Spain you will see many religious processions and events where people dress in special clothes. If you visit The USA you can see a huge St Patrick’s Day Parade or traditional Native American ceremonies. Each country have their way of doing things. Each to their own.
happy new year
Interesting talk as ever, Dr Kat.What century are we living in ? What a theatrical performance those members perform..I'll just leave it at that ,I'm keeping my thoughts to myself. 😱
Ques....outside of cheers and applause...do winners get financial awards or stipends for knighthoods etc.?
I recognise two or three of those names who were also High Sheriffs too
Being an American, I never understood what The Order Of The Garter was. Thank you for an interesting look into this bit of the UK.
We need another Moat Watch update 💕
I’m heading over that way in a few days ✨ an update will be forthcoming 🤩
I always wondered if the order was created partly in reference to the story of Sir Gawain and the Green Knight, since the knights of the Round Table all decide to wear garters like Gawain's (he sees it as a badge of shame and humility) in solidarity with him at the end of the story. The French motto takes on a new shade of meaning in that light.
I am having a hard time forming my question; What qualifies an individual to become a member "now". I understand using it to bolster allies or showing all is forgiven but...Does anyone know why randy andy was allowed to keep his garter perhaps just because his mother wants him in that circle - is it a non-important appointment that tradition dictates its use...Camilla will be consort queen - perhaps she gets it simply because there are no other medals or groups (??) for her to get into or is it because she will be near the monarch? Was the queens husband a member? What do members of the garter do now besides dress up - do they have duties? Are they paid? Who provides them with the robes and hat?
These are excellent questions! Officially all appointments are made by the Queen - I assume she takes suggestions as well, maybe?!? The decision to raise the Duchess of Cornwall does coincide with the Queen’s announcement that she wishes her to be known as Queen when the time comes. The Duke of Edinburgh was a member of the Order.
To my knowledge they have no duties, outside the ceremonial ones discussed in the video. I don’t believe they are paid for being in the order.
I have no idea who is responsible for the purchase and upkeep of the regalia 🤷🏻♀️
@@ReadingthePast thank you so much for these answers. I think this video is one I am going to rewatch == again ty! :)
I think the consensus was that Blair would turn it down. After all I would not call him pro British. Other Prime Ministers awards were being held up because of Blair. They had to offer him this with fingers crossed he would reject it. Alas Tony’s ego won.
Interesting to see Sir Miles Stapleton….just learning about family genoeplogy
6:06 I've read that numerous methods were tried, in order to kill him, but that his constitution was such that he survived all attempts.
There are certainly lots of suggestions as to what happened; we can’t even be sure he was murdered (although I think that murder was the most likely cause of death)
I have heard the "Poker" story was made up a good few years later by someone who thought this was how Edward ought to have died because of his having homosexual relationships.
Fantastic video as always, thank you very much.
As to my personal view of this institution, I'm a Republican and would like to see the monarchy abolished. Situations like this are a part of why I feel that way. Tony Blair getting the 'honour' is a pretty appalling choice. 'Prince' Andrew being able to keep his makes me feel quite unwell. What does that say about us as a nation? Nothing good.
I must say I understand why you may feel this way. However, the Monarch themselves choose the members and it is supposed to be people who are devoted to the monarch and willing to give their lives. Hence Duchess Camilla and PM Blair.
Andrew and Chivalry mentioned in the same sentence? Well, the language is characterized by its flexibility.
The Queen seems to be doing everything possible to make the future queenship of Camilla more palatable to the British people. For all the extreme privileges the royals have, they still don’t seem able to follow the basic rules: 1) no adultery or divorce and 2) no criminal activity. It doesn’t seem that much to ask of a royal, especially a future monarch, but most of them are unwilling to sacrifice a single personal whim for the good of their country. They don’t have to be perfect, but they should behave decently, especially future “heads of the church”. Her Majesty excepted, she is simply the most dutiful and hardworking royal ever, and has my respect.
Let he or she who is without sin, throw the first stone.
@@iriswaterford8881 ....Nevertheless doesn't make Camilla's indiscretions go away. It will follow her to her grave
@@nmc398 I find it interesting that all the iniquities of that adulterous relationship are heaped on Camilla. After all, both the people involved were married to others. The marriage of Charles and Camilla appears happy, mutually supportive and free of scandal. There's no hint of friction or acrimony in her dealings with the rest of the family; unlike the first wife.
Ahhh, my Friday afternoon Me time :)
And being in the Pacific Coast USA I get to start my morning in the best way.
lol weird I never noticed Henry's garter in that portrait...I wonder if perhaps something else draws the eye?
In the late 1960s, probably 1968, I stood with my parents and sister and watched the Garter procession.
Mein Gott, there was almost no one left in the Order of the Garter after George V finished hastily disentangling himself from his German cousins.
I didn't realize that foreign monarchs were inducted in recent times. That's fascinating. Also, Andrew continues to be an embarrassment. I can't imagine members of the Order outside his own family will be very pleased to share a table with him this June.
Sir Ernest Scott's The People of The Secret and Idries Shah's The Sufis mention that the Order of the Garter was called the Order of Saint-George (no wonder England's original flag was the symbol of Saint-George the red cross with a white background and the Union Jack seems built on top of that) and came from Syria as Al Khidr (The Khidr Order) which precedes Order of Saint-George/Garter by a 150 years (13th century). Also it seems to me that Sigismund the Holy Roman Emperor's Ordo Draconis (Order of the Dragon) was originally named the Order of Saint-George as well. Any more to add to the story?
I think that the Order has lost the majority of its chivalry and all of its honour. The latter especially after a certain next-PM has been admitted (but for other reasons as well).
Yes, but . . . What do they all DO?
Veeery interesting!!
I think that the point of the poker up the backside was that Edward 2 had neglected his queen in favour of his boyfriend even apparently giving a wedding gift meant for him and her (a bed) to his male lover. His wife was very badly treated by him as she was also considered to be a sign of humiliation as he had been forced to agree to the marriage by her father, the King of France.
Dr. Cat, are these appointments just for those mentioned or does the honor get passed down??
It's not hereditary like a coat of arms. A single appointment means the individual enjoys rights, not issue.
Edward was no more of a war monger than any other monarch of his time.
Correct. The problem with many so called historians today, especially on RUclips, they judge people on today’s standards.
Did I have a little daydream about being made a “Lady of the Most Noble Order of the Garter” when I learned being American doesn’t technically preclude me?
Yes I did 🎩🥂👑
I'll join you.
Why? Why do you need someone or something outside of yourself to lift you up?
Me too !! Im thinking of changing my name legally to add kg at the end.
@@alainaaugust1932I sprained both my ankles
@@Neddoest excellent reply, worthy of a member of the Order of the Garter. Well done!
Henry of Grosmont, 1st Duke of Lancaster, 4th Earl of Leicester and Lancaster, KG is MY 20th great uncle.
→ Oliver Hokanson
your father → Ellen Louise Yada
his mother → Nellie eldora Yada
her mother → Horace Greeley Hurd
her father → J. Alanson Hurd
his father → Susannah Hurd
his mother → Heli Foote
her father → Dr. Ichabod Foote
his father → Capt. Joseph Foote
his father → Lt. Robert Foote
his father → Nathaniel Foote "the Settler"
his father → Robert Foote of Shalford
his father → Helen Hall
his mother → Richard Warren (alias Waller), of Bassingbourne
her father → Margaret Legh, of Lyme
his mother → Ellen Legh
her mother → Katherine Savage
her mother → Joan Goushill, Baroness of Stanley
her mother → Elizabeth FitzAlan, Duchess of Norfolk
her mother → Richard FitzAlan, 4th Earl of Arundel (Second Creation)
her father → Eleanor of Lancaster, Countess of Arundel and Warenne
his mother → Henry of Grosmont, 1st Duke of Lancaster, 4th Earl of Leicester and Lancaster, KG
her brother
Shortest in-law relationship
Henry of Grosmont, 1st Duke of Lancaster, 4th Earl of Leicester and Lancaster, KG is ALSO MY fourth great uncle's 14th great grandfather.
→ Carol-Len Smith
your mother → Leonard Emmett Smith
her father → Viola Winifred Smith
his mother → Jones David Waggoner
her father → Martin Franklin Waggoner
his father → Mary Pendleton Yates
his sister → George Woodford Yates, II
her husband → Elizabeth Strother Yates
his mother → Mary Wade Browning
her mother → Mary Willis Strother
her mother → Joseph Wade
her father → John Thomas Wade
his father → Edward Wade, II
his father → Edward Wade, Sr.
his father → Ann Browne
his mother → Anne Moore
her mother → Anne Hussey, Baroness of Sleaford
her mother → George Grey, 2nd Earl of Kent
her father → Edmund Grey, 1st Earl of Kent, Baron Grey de Ruthin
his father → Constance Holland, Countess of Norfolk and Kent
his mother → Elizabeth Plantagenet, Duchess of Exeter
her mother → Blanche of Lancaster
her mother → Henry of Grosmont, 1st Duke of Lancaster, 4th Earl of Leicester and Lancaster, KG
her father
It' is still most relevent to stand for chivalry. It is not as though values of decency and nobility are out if fashion. Nor should they be.
How interesting
Hi Dr Kat-was Margaret Thatcher ever a Lady of the Garter? (and is the Prime Minister usually awarded the honor?)
She was and it is commonly the case that former PMs will be offered the honour, but it is not a requirement that they will be.
@@ReadingthePast Thank you Dr Kat.
If prince Andrew can keep it, it can hardly be the most noble order...
I love and honor the noble tradition of The Order Of The Garter. The past history of any nation state should be preserved as part of the unique fabric of its traditions and culture.
The whole red hot poker thing I always thought of as a reaction to him having a male favourite/ lover
It has certainly be read as a comment on that, rather than being what actually happened.
I recently discovered that my 19 x great grandfather, Sir Sanchet d'Abrechicourt, was a founding knight of the Order of the Garter, and was allotted stall no.25 in St.George's Chapel. He had arrived in England as a young boy, with his father, Nicholas d'Abrechicourt, who was an escort to Queen Isabella. I have no idea whether or not he fought at Crecy, though it's likely he would have been knighted along with several other companions of Edward's shortly before or after the battle.
Hugh Courtenay, 2nd Earl of Devon is my 19th great grandfather.
→ Oliver Hokanson
your father → Ellen Louise Yada
his mother → Nellie eldora Yada
her mother → Horace Greeley Hurd
her father → J. Alanson Hurd
his father → Susannah Hurd
his mother → Heli Foote
her father → Dr. Ichabod Foote
his father → Capt. Joseph Foote
his father → Lt. Robert Foote
his father → Nathaniel Foote "the Settler"
his father → Joane Foote
his mother → John Brooke
her father → Robert Brooke
his father → Edward Brooke
his father → Reginald Brooke, MP
his father → Joan Brooke, 5th Baroness of Cobham
his mother → Joan de la Pole, Baroness Cobham
her mother → Joan Cobham
her mother → Lady Margaret de Cobbham (de Courtenay)
her mother → Hugh Courtenay, 2nd Earl of Devon
her fatherCon
Shortest in-law relationship
Hugh Courtenay, 2nd Earl of Devon is my husband's fourth great uncle's wife's 13th great grandfather.
→ Charles Gonzales
your husband → Sarah Burchim
his mother → iowa iola Birchum
her mother → Susie Street
her mother → Caroline Street
her mother → Alvin John Hash
her father → James Hash, SR
his brother → Mary "Polly" Hash
his wife → Hartwell Martin, Sr
her father → Martin Martin, II
his father → Martin Martin, I
his father → Unity Martin
his mother → Col. John West, II
her father → Capt. John West
his father → Anne Knollys, Baroness De La Warr
his mother → Catherine Carey, Chief Lady of the Bedchamber
her mother → Sir William Carey, Kt.
her father → Thomas Cary
his father → Sir William Carey, Kt.
his father → Philip Carey of Cockington
his father → Margaret Carey
his mother → Sir Philip Courtenay
her father → Hugh Courtenay, 2nd Earl of Devon
his father