@@Snokkerball No point really. As someone that has used Sunshower Heath a lot over time, I would say he is in a very good spot right now. His counter has a place in the kit due to sinking triggering on hit, meaning there are certainly many situations where you would want to use it, like situations where losing a clash with S1 would take away too much sanity (or getting blunt damage up from his and Dieci Rodyon's passive) It being solely "gain 5 sinking on Battle start" would take away from that. I truly do think he is in a good spot right now, with his sanity management being pretty good even in mirror dungeons (havent tried solo in MD3H yet, but by the end of Season 2 he was pretty fun) which is where N Sinclair usually struggles. And, I would say he is pretty fun to use
Sunshower Heath: A really fun but flawed id that has potential for high damage Shi Heath: 2 attack weight s3 funny and 50 percent hp threshold at ut4 is nice N Heath: Nicely designed unit and important for N corp teams R Heath: He's not gonna sugarcoat it: QUICK SUPPRESSION QUICK SUPRESSION QUICK SUPRESSION
A friend of mine made a good analogy for Sunshower Hearhcliff/Dongbaek, they’re forcing themselves to feel awful, but every clash win reminds them of those sweet memories of the past in the league
I like that, that’s cool. Though I’m not quite sure if our Suncliff was a part of the league necessarily. I don’t think it was mentioned in the Uptie story, but something along those lines. It’s probably also related to the Sunshower Abnormality being related to attempting to block out rain via broken umbrellas, reflecting both of their mental states. But hey what do I know
@@therealESGOO The ID’s are usually based on characters who have already existed, Suncliff talks about destroying technology and preserving the past just like Dongbaek
With canto VI part 3 released I think its safe to say that he was part of the league in his world CANTO VI SPOILERS Suncliff is shown and in his world catherine seems to be in yi sang's place
Every time I release one of these videos, I am always shocked by the support. I should be thanking all of you for enjoying my silly videos. Thank you all.
@@therealESGOO The support, I would say, stems from your videos being both informative and easy to follow. Responding to peoples most requested topics helps as well, though you should obviously only do that if you feel it's right.
@@therealESGOO bro I literally typed limbus company videos and yours was at the top. Also, I stopped playing limbus company but I want to come back but It looks alot different. What happened after chapter 3 boss? That's where I stopped. Please help me😂
In my opinion Sunshower Heathcliffs problems come from being designed with the sanity update in mind. Sanity update that was rolled back because it made every fight a slog. Sanity changes in fight were so small that having ways to manage Sanity would have made you toptier. But the update was rolled back because it made Nclair the only viable identity to have on team. Sunshower had been robbed of his place in the sun before he was released. And his uptie 4 only mitigated his design failures.
I think the real missed opportunity here is not giving him a unique panic type. If he had something like that, where he could actually just like sit at -45, it would make him have a niche over Sinclair. Now N Sinclair is going to be way better than him because uhhh fucking 30 lol, but he does, at least in longer fights, require concessions. You either have to teambuild with Grip Faust to make managing his sanity reasonable through either her support or normal passive, or use his guard to take a turn off so he doesn't start smacking the hell out of your allies. Suncliff being able to roll as consistently as a normal sanity unit without having to make very many compromises would be great for him, especially with Telepole.
To be honest, i would like suncliff to be the first negative coin id with his own niche,like not being able to regain sanity at all,but when he reaches -45 he does not corrode,instead he gets a passive that benefits and hurt his allies, like: when this unit defeats an enemy,all allies gain x strengh and x haste,but lose x amount of sanity,and then to deactivate this buff,you could tie it to using a parry,and the downside would be having his ego locked during the mode.
I remember that when people found out about the panic type update, people instantly thought that suncliff has an unique corrosion, that would have been really cool.
@@katallica6677yes but N-don isn’t conflicted in what shes doing she genuinely believes she is pursuing justice so she wouldn’t lose sanity with her actions
I feel that sunshower heathcliffs cycle is too fragile because its so easy for him to take too many attacks and distort as a result. He shouldn't be clashing but sometimes he has no choice but to because of speed rolls and if he happens to lose when he can't afford it, he can easily distort
my main usage for Sunshower Heath is to solo the final boss of MDH2. So far I've had him solo the frog, centipede and bull. I'll play the dungeon normally and just have Heath sit on the bench. Come last floor, the node before the boss, I'll optimize my team, (mainly Nclair and Reindeer Ish for their passives) and pray I get I get a boss that wont wreck him since u can't see which boss you'll get beforehand. I think it's fun personally but I know others will disagree, and that's okay!
There is a lot of others id's that can solo bossfights. Not to mention having him on bench triggers his support passive that in paper can be really strong, but whith an ordinary team its just a debuff... (His passive is literraly an ally losing 10 sp on being hit) I have sunshower heathcliff myself and i spend ALOT of time on him, and even if he can be fun sometimes more often he is just dissapointing.
@@lurki3954 since you intrigued me in using sunshower solo in the last of md2h boss fight, have you already unlocked the 750 starlight node on the right side? basically im asking if its still possible to solo even if i dont have thst unlocked yet
@@yakeru3356 oh oh I gotcha, I was mega confused since Liu Mr Salt has a skill by the same name. But to answer your question, no I don't not! The farthest I've gotten to is the -10% damage reduction. Working my way to that skill tho. It was definitely a close call tho, I was super close to being staggered but 6-7 protection comes in super handy lol
I've tried Sunshower Heathcliff in Mirror Dungeons, and it's actually quite rough on him. He gains SP from enemy defeats, even by allies, so it's very hard to keep him from rocketing to high SP at all times. He also has a place as a placeholder ID on my Envy Luxcavation team, and it's mainly for the envy skill 1. There aren't many characters I'd consider to have strong envy synergy.
Man, I am so happy that you exist. I suppose that you're the only Limbus content maker, who makes really interesting videos that I can discuss it with my friends. You should be praised
As soon as you released your first video I knew you were going to be one of my favourite limbus content creators thank you for making awesome content Your quality is simply unmatched
6:27 I think PM made s3 pierce to add dmg type variety. If it were blunt, it would be directly competing with Nclair's s3 (won't sugarcoat it) and the blunt dmg up is probably to set up for a powerful s2 which can probably be thought as an alternative for nclair s3. Still a really weird kit with skills that does not synergize with eachother well
I like using him to solo some MD bosses. sometimes including him on some luxvacation too (grew bored using RHeathcliff all the time). and the only change that I wish for him is honestly changing that his counter. from "TAILS hit gain 1 paralyze" to "ON HIT gain 2 paralyze"... other than that, I honestly like him. but at the same time I can see where peeps who just downright hate this ID are coming from. build up sucks ass for sure, but I love it. requires some thinking on how to approach a battle, and considering the majority of the this community... yeah, they'll hate him for sure (just kidding... kinda)
I do the exact same thing LOL. I hate pressing win rate, I like careful and precise calculation but then again, this is coming from an avid library of ruina fan. So far the gameplay is still really easy to steamroll without putting in too much thought, so I appreciate Sunshower for being overly complicated. Makes me use my brain wrinkles
When he first dropped in game my first thought was "Lets go! Babysitting meta!" Embrace your inner helicopter parent to keep him from slipping and falling. He is "usable", a fun challenge for some an annoyance to others. So surround him with ego resources, hp/sp healers and spread out the umbrella of uselessness!
This ID also has the curse that it is compared with R-Heath, as is the case with all Heath IDs. You know, the lad that could one shot the Mexican with quick suppression in the my form empties boss in Refraction Railway.
It’s funny that I have now covered two Heathcliff IDs, while only having 5 videos total…it’s a shame that it will always come down to, just use Rabbit Heath, and it’s a completely fair argument, but there are always going to be new players who don’t have access to top options. So while it’s easy to say to just use Rabbit, I think it’s fun and fair to discuss these undervalued IDs
@@therealESGOO Oh yeah, I totally agree with you. I even like to experiment with team compositions. Recently I tried a Shi team with Shi-Heath and it was fun.
This might sound odd, but I actually tend to think the automatic consumption of sinking in Foxcliff's passive oftentimes works against him. Because Foxcliff wants to be using his counter, wants to be taking hits for the Blunt damage up, there usually is no great difficulty in consuming the stacks of sinking he accrues over time. In many occasions in my personal testing, all the first part of the passive tended to do is make his sanity loss even worse. When you have only one sinking count, the sinking is consumed before Foxcliff can gain protection, and before the count can be increased with Skills 1 and 3. This is particularly relevant in a Dungeon scenario where Foxcliff's passive is activated by previously gained resources, you lose out on the ability to do turn 1 counter, turn 2 skill 1 clash lose to set yourself at -24 without the use of EGO (Side note, -24 is a really awkward number for skill 2 getting buffs at -25). It's an odd thing where an ostensibly key useful aspect of the passive can instead cause so additional difficulty. Maybe it would be best to see Foxcliff's passive be changed to Resonance base so that it would be possible to actively choose between stockpiling Sinking count and consuming it?
I don't mind how it work in dungeon just because you already have a lot of EGO resources built up anyway and it was kinda displayed perfectly for me during the story dungeon where you often get check point before a boss that reset everyone back to 0 SP. With the resources you build up from doing dungeon (and potentially railway), you no longer play the sinking game to achieve low sanity because you just go ahead and overclock a telepole or AEDD on turn 1 and he's ready to fight especially with AEDD to activate his healing. Changing his passive to resonance might actually kill him because it will kill his S3 to S2 to Counter rotation for abno fight. S3 for an unopposed attack or a clash win, followed by S2 to burn his sinking potency and then a counter (reduce SP again or burn off the remaining sp gain from clash win with passive still activating) or another S2 is a very self-sufficient combo to keep Fox Heath in the -25 to -30 zone while doing the most damage he can as his passive+counter will remove all the sp gain he get from winning S3 clash. Making his passive reso mean you will have to force your teammate to use Envy as Heath will be using S2 or S3 or counter for maximum damage and also force him to get hit outside just the counter turn so you added like 3 extra conditions to what he has to do to achieve the same result as just using the mentioned rotation. This also doesn't take into account how much it kind of decimate his human side combat as well.
I disagree with you, partly because that way of using him puts him too much in danger of getting staggered in anywhere else outside of MD2 with the buffs, and making his passive dependent on resonance further weakens his ability to actually survive hits. My main reason, however, is that the way it works now lets me balance out the SP loss with the SP gain from winning clashes, allowing my Heath to go on a constant offensive once he’s got his passive going and enough sinking stacks on him. His counter becomes an occasional supplement to the speed at which he loses SP or for powering up his S2. Even with his low damage output at the start of fights, he quickly rockets up to catch up with it even surpass N Sinclair in total damage output for a fight. He’s weak in MD (though he’s fine for the story dungeons, at least for now; if the next part has the enemies giving you SP upon killing then, that’d really screw Sunshower Heath), but pretty good for the longer fights where you have to finish under a 10-turn count, which is a fine enough niche. The way your suggestion to change him would work, he’d just be a mediocre, if useable, toy to use in MD who’d be outstripped by other IDs you wouldn’t have to employ an impractical play style to make work there.
waiting on ut4 Ego efficiency list. Your style of editing and naration is prefect for any educational content for this silly game with community who cant read (I cant too), and your videos allow me to understand and choose what i need to build.
I promise it will come eventually. The issue is mostly that researching, scripting, recording, editing, everything really about my video making process takes a lot of time, and…people really seem to want MORE videos above everything else. Work has already begun on it and multiple other videos, but usually 1 project takes priority over the others.
i started playing limbus cuz i absolutely loved the lore and worldbuilding done in Lobo Corp/Ruina but was met with a considerable content drought about the game. Very happy to see such high quality content being done, keep it up o/
Back when he released, I did a solo MD run with Suncliff. I thought he was fun, but using him outside of that just felt meaningless. Doesn’t help that Rcliff is a monster. Honestly, playing him solo is my favorite way to play him.
I quickly picked up on how to use Sunshower Heath only after a few fights with him in the story stages that were available on his release and his damage output is incredible. To put it into perspective, despite his low combat effectiveness at the start of a fight in a story stage, he quickly catches up to N Sinclair and can even overtake him, with him as slot 1 and Sinclair as slot 2. With Telepole, though, he just rockets past N Sinclair (who only really has Doomsday Clock, and single-target EGOs just can’t really compare to AoE ones in terms of damage output). Honestly, I wouldn’t change anything about Sunshower Heath (I’d even go as far as to say that I disagree with at least your first two suggestions). Even uptie 4 giving him -10 SP on clash loss was pretty insignificant for me, and personally just feels like a crutch for the benefit of people who don’t really understand how to use him. I think people just don’t have the patience to actually try to learn how to use him, and I suppose I’d include you on this despite your attempt to portray Sunshower Heath positively. At least, I feel like you still don’t really “get” him. Sunshower Heath is great for human fights, since that’s where I actually learned how to use him. Or rather, sure, abno fights can make him easier to use, but it’s really not difficult to make him effective in human fights. He’s great for single stage fights, like in story, and this ties in with understanding how to make use of his SP loss mechanics. And understanding how to make use of his SP loss mechanics leads you to understand why he’s punished hard for hitting heads; because he’s super great once you get him low, as he can maintain a certain range of negative SP more consistently than N Sinclair can (through both his passive and clash wins balancing each other out; if you’re playing him right, you’d be using his S2 whenever you can to clear out his sinking count to stop him from corroding), who does eventually need a “cooldown” period to prevent himself from hitting -45 SP. This ability to remain a constant “low” SP level is what allows him to so quickly catch up with and compete with N Sinclair. I don’t think the confusing mechanics is a real con here, so much as a highlight for the low tolerance level of some people to even attempt to learn something. It only took me like 3 fights to understand how to use Sunshower Heath, yet there are still people to this day who can’t figure out how to keep N Sinclair’s SP low in MD. Literal skill issue. I think Sunshower Heath has a nice enough niche that doesn’t really need changing. However, with the game nerfing how high enemy health is and with the recent event having us face higher level enemies (meaning SP on kill, either by a character themself or by their allies), his utility and effectiveness respectively could get heavily impacted, though I’d need to test it out.
I wholeheartedly agree with the end thoughts. He's such a missed opportunity. It's the first EGO equipment ID in the game, which for those who have been playing since L Corp and Library of Ruina was a super hype prospect. And the fact that it was the second negative ID made it even more something to look forward to considering the insane table flipping potential that negative coins brought in N Sinclair. Those changes would definitely make me want to play him. In fact, I would Uptie IV him if they just fix the passive. I really want to like him.
I almost quit the game because I had to hit hard pity to obtain this ID, lost my entire stash plus some cash, and hit ZERO 000 units, dupes or new, and did not even hit a single missing 00 I had at the time along the way. I eventually got some luck later on (I pulled the new Ryoshu egos each as single pulls during the paid daily pulls on different banners when it was live) and finally got over the shard hump and my team up and grinding in the mirror dungeons, now I have every ID and have 600+ boxes working towards grinding for future IDs, but I generally have an emotional attachment to this ID, for better or for worse because of it. I gratefully accept an in-depth video, because I will convert it into knowledge in how to make this ID work optimally where it can, because it was my first painful lesson in Limbus, even if self-inflicted. Happy Birthday!
I'm late, but the second skill's coin 4 effect to burst Tremor is a cute touch, since the animation for this coin involves Heathcliff smashing in the umbrella he stabbed the enemy with (which is one of my favorite animations, along with Daring Decisions, Self-Destructing Purge, and Ironclad Retribution).
Incredible video production, so clean and informative, great graphics and even a little touch of humour, defiantly a lot of work put into making such videos
I have a lot of feelings towards Sunshower Heathcliff, and I’m glad to see that your review of him was well written and thorough. Sunshower Heathcliff was my guaranteed 000 from the Season 2 Decaextraction ticket from the Battlepass. Prior to getting him I had absolutely no idea who he was or what he did, and since I was shooting for Spicebush Yi Sang I was at first upset. But then I Uptied him to three and saw his story, and I instantly fell in love. Spice Yi is my favourite design wise, but Suncliff is a close second and my favourite in terms of personal story. Like you’ve explained in your video however, he’s ultimately flawed and often times a burden to use, and with that a very big choice. There are other IDs to use, but none of them are as difficult and complex as Suncliff. It’s a brilliant sight to see him succeed, but that doesn’t change the fact his value usually isn’t worth the precision required to pilot him. Regardless however, he is one of my most treasured units (Uptie 4’d him second), and honestly I’ve found good success with him in MD2 Hard! It’s unfortunate that Uptie 4 didn’t give him the value he needed to be viable, but I’m happy with him. P.S. Your videos are all excellent and the quality has made me decide to even set notifications for your upload. I find myself rewatching them simply for how thoughtfully put together they are.
Fellow sunshower enjoyer here (my first uptie 4 lol), how do you use him in md2h? since the sanity up is so high in MDs I often never find success in bringing negative coin ids there. so tips would be appreciated, thanks
@@yakeru3356 As you might expect, due to his protection, high health pool, and average speed, he can serve as a moderately effective interceptiontank. He doesn’t have any healing or shield, but he can tank an attack that your other sinners can’t. This is probably the main reason I use him, using him as a tank with much better damage than most tanks. As for the sanity issue, you are very right about that, however MD allows you to carry sin resources over every battle and, if you’re willing to put in the extra work, leaving a single enemy on stagger and letting excess sinking drain can keep him at a negative or at least neutral sanity level after each battle. I wouldn’t say he’s particularly good, as you say the sanity increase on enemy death is quite prevalent, but if you’re willing to give him a try, he’ll tank any clashes you can’t win against and do good damage on unopposed. Also AEDD is so fucking good please spam the shit out of it. Especially if you’re able to Threadspin 4. Hope this helps!
Hearing that my videos are rewatchable is probably the single highest compliment a RUclips creator could receive, thank you for enjoying and re-enjoying my videos!
The NClair tax: Every future minus coin IDs will have low skill power floor with 0 power ceiling because someone at project moon thought that a character with a skill that have, at worse case 30-18 roll and at best case 30+30+30 rolls was a good idea. I was contemplating a lot between Sunshower Heath vs N Heath, because for the purpose of fueling AEDD (awesome EGO btw) they're the same. I ended up uptie 4 both of them, but rarely used Sunshower because N Heath inherently have good synergies with other N Corp IDs.
He's a very special goodboy hat one has to cheris for him to start giving back. To regain trust is hard ;-; Every Heathcliff has something pure about them - their anger and hate flow from being hurt or rejected, honest to boot, with their heart on their sleeve. Ah, to wash this pain away!
Sunshower Heathclif is very honestly one of my favourite IDs but the way i play him is almost ALWAYS solo, for the sole fact that i actually encourage him to force corrode because yes Corrosion does eat up EGO resources like crazy but, EGO corrosion still in fact procs when there are no resources left. And since Sinking is a persistent debuff, if you stack enough sinking you could basically get a corrosion every other turn. Its a really fun solo ID that basically encourages you to go big or go home
Damn this video is so high quality im surprised you are this low subs count. Man this video is amazing and i hope you get the support you deserve, amazing video
Just started the game like 3 days ago and I got this dude while spinning lunacy. I like him a lot and plan to keep using him, but didn’t know how to effectively use him well enough. This honestly helped me with that issue and I’m happy for it. It is unfortunate that heads does ruin his damage by a lot, but I’m just living with it. It’s a great ID to me (Uptie 4 is nice do not ask me why I got this already)
One thing I find funny about the ID is that if you somehow manage to give him minimum 45 sinking and a lot of count, he corrodes every 2 turns, and on the non corroded turns, he has -45 sanity right away.
I try to use him whenever I can and he is such a hard ID to manage but when the stars align boy does he feel so satisfying to use. He pairs well with AEDD too, the free protection + getting heals from being hit makes him tanky.
It's unfortunate that he got released right after Ninclair, not because of people comparing him but because PM was clearly afraid of the monster (Ninclair) they created so they made their second negative ID too weak. I'm a bit annoyed that they didn't adress his biggest issue in Uptie 4 which is keeping his SP low (S1 change was nice tho), instead they mainly buffed his S2 with another low SP condition when his entire problem is that he can never stay low SP. In fact often if you're forced to clash, you need his SP to be -35 at the very least or the the SP he gets from winning a clash actually ruins his damage. It was such a bizarre change
I could never wrap my head around using him, thought it was an uptie issue so I transferred the body sack refund into sunshower and still sucked at using him lol, I’ll give it another shot after this vid, oh yeah happy birthday 🎉
I've felt the Wrath counter always being available and being a decent option to progress the fight, if Heath gets a heavy Wrath cost EGO that gives him some sort of utility and a massive minus coin corrosion this ID might come around. I do like how this game has a lot of interwoven synergies that can make some units and skills suddenly more useful. Hopefully we get more tools for the ID since it really is fun to use.
for me, the Umbrella will still be in the basket. it is beautiful look, complex id, but reward for understanding his work not enough. a old umbrella in the idea, an old umbrella in the end.
This guy is literally just the average London resident - In rags - Constantly in rain - Uses random object from the street as weapon - Sad and homeless - Looks like he just washed up from the Thames - Furry
ДА, ДААААААА Как же он чувствует. Лиситклиф это моя любимая личность на моего любимого грешника ( почти 500 часов в Лимбусе, немало из которых я наиграл именно с ним ). Я буквально сказал на моменте "что бы я изменил в Лиситклифе" слово в слово перед его словами "нужно 2 каунта на первом скилле". Как же он ЧУВСТВУЕТ.
10:53 I swear, i played this ID with ismael and don and boy, he was crying in the corner at +16 sanity after using warning and usiumbrella twack cuz they kept killing things and boy i was unable to lower his sanity.
I like using him more on MHD, it feels like i can better control how will he loose S1 clashes, wish he had a way to reduce the clash/kill sanity gain like Ninclair instead. One of my favorite IDs, even if he is not as powerful as he could be.
I tend to use Sunshower Heath in my sinking teams because his added sinking on counter and S1 are both really useful for improving the sinking count on especially abnormalities. I've been really enjoying going full Sinking memes in MD2H lately, so he's a good addition to those, and is actually decent against the bull since he can take the one-coin attack pretty easily with his blunt resistance.
It kinda weird that Ninclair are very easy to use with huge output while sunshower is hard to use with mid output. Kinda feel like they accidently switch it or something.
yeah to me he was made for the sanity changes that were reverted. i also think they didnt want a repeat of said sinclair either cuz its hard to deny N-SINC is overtuned to hell and back
I think that may be a matter of Nclair being the last ID of the season, and by far the most hyped up ID…ever, at that point at least. I think it’s fine for there to be more powerful IDs in Gacha games, it’s how they make money after all, but it really is a shame that (potentially) as a side effect, they were far more careful with Sunshower Heath
Very good summary. He is fun and i love his design. Sinclair's existence makes you question why S Heath runs with ankle weights, while Sinclair is free of them. Casual 30 rolls on s3 vs Heath's very conditioned s2, which still can't achieve s3 numbers. Or simply every positive sanity id is already better and they don't have all this problems, so why just not use them instead. About missed opportunity, i believe that S Heath could've been the first counter oriented id but ended up undercooked.
His biggest flaw so far, is what he gains a ton of sp when enemies higher level when him are dying. Literally impossible to use on high floors of md, when his sp lost can't catch up
I think the best way to buff SunHeath is just to give him the same gimmick as SunDongbaek boss fight e.g. "if this skill clashing lose , lose X amount of SP". I know PM already added it to his sanity passive, kinda, but it's still slow to get him rolling.
Thanks to this video i now realize the sinking symbol is supposed be a teary/melting eye. I thought it was a funny horned alien face before seeing it up close lol
I am part of the small percentage of people who know how to use the Bri'ish Man Channeling The Power of Bri'ain. If you know what you're doing, he's a fun dude to play with. And if you're in MD2 and got the left most starlight, seeing him without fail roll all tails is YI SANG. I mean Ideal.
Ive been using him for a while at uptie 3 and can say hes very inconsistent... but he does work sometimes, and his uptie 4 seems very good for.helping with that, i havent gotten to play around with it yet but i definitely will and i feel he could be pretty crazy, plus hes got some of the sickest animations in the game
Potential man has ruined me. I thought just getting him to max level and uptie 4 was enough. Now I realize also I need Pierre Ryoshu (and maybe chef Gregor), Ya sunyata for HP and Telepole for Charge. Even then, I need to reset for a charge item and a heal item to proc AEDD's Healing passive when hit and regular sustain healing. AND EVEN THEN, if I end up fighting Guido or his carpenters on floor 1 that's a reset. I think your solution is more reasonable and realistic, but to me he should just get the same SP loss than Nclair has (to your dismay) OR to gain Sinking potency with each coin loss even if he wins the clash. Because that's the thing, due to negative coins you can still land a hit on your last coin if the enemy rolls low enough and you get a lucky tails hit and win the clash, but if you lose the clash your sanity loss that turn might help you on your next turn but the turn after that if you won the previous clash you're garanteed to be either 15+ sanity and the Sinking you were originally trying to build up has been mostly lost. Gaining extra Sinking potency with lost coins gives you a more substantial sp drop on the same turn since after being hit you drop to a level that garantees a better attack on the same turn while preventing ending with a higher sanity that you started with after successful attacks. Of course that would mean that corrosion would be a more prevalent issue, but people doing solo runs would do so anyway and he would be more welcoming of Fausts Fluid Sack SP heal on being in teams as he can contribute more often into the fight. why am i trying so hard if no one is gonna read this lol
I've loved him ever since the moment I laid my eyes on him, I love the way he looks, and the way he plays, and how unique he is. Thank you for making this very thorough guide about my beloved. I do wish he ended up having a unique corrosion, as they added the sanity tab around the time he released, but honestly I like the way he is, except for his kit having way too many tails hits.
Another top notch vid! N Heath and now Sunshower... Shi Heath guide incoming? Speaking of the Shi, I'd be very interested in a guide on Poise, since I think it's a status effect that used to be laughed at, but now with UT4 might be good? I'm still on the fence about it, lul.
As for the changes to aforementioned passive I believe it should also gain 1 Pierce DMG UP. S3 should do a little more damage imo. I know it's hard to compare any ID to NCorp Sinclair, but higher roll of 21 base would make it more obvious that he can have his own numbers in ideal scenario.
As a certified Suncliff enjoyer, some comments: 1) 12:36 His skill 3 works exactly like his skill 1, so you're not "losing out" on Sinking by clashing with it. In fact, losing clashes with S3 is an important tool at positive Sanity. You mostly want to lose clashes against 1 coin skills, since it leaves you enough Sinking count to add more count next turn. E.g. losing with S3 and adding a counter for good measure, then next turn losing a clash with his S1 loses a total of 73 Sanity and drops you from 45 to -28. Without a second coin slot and therefore without the counter, it still loses 58. 2) he is actually very solid as a tank. He has good HP, only takes either 50 or 60% damage most of the time and with AEDD heals 2.5% of HP with every hit he takes when he has charge or is at 40% HP. In terms of pure tankiness, with the above active he survives 5 Inquisitors ganging up on him, while staggered, *at 30 HP* (yes I tested this, and yes he does delete their existence with several corroded Telepoles afterwards). You need both type AND sin affinity to be fatal for him to really take any damage. Now firstly, he *wants* to take hits frequently, losing clashes with either S1 or S3. He additionally is very good at taking those hits. Even if his motivation is ultimately selfish, this doesn't change that he's perfectly suited for the tank role. When I play MD2 with him, he takes over hits every turn. Secondly, his counter being an actually good skill is very useful for this role too. You mostly want to do this when you already have sinking so you don't miss out on the protection, but since you can "clash" with defensive skills and on the higher floors you aren't winning clashes without EGOs, taking the hit with 50% damage reduction and then doing good damage with the counter is very viable. It's still two 10 coins, 5 Rupture and 5 Sinking. Basically a decent S2. Also fun fact, his counter, to my knowledge, is the only non S3/EGO skill that zooms in and displays total damage done.
With the skill 3, though I did misspeak and talk as thought it were on hit, going unopposed is still better, since the skill 3 is actually likely to win any random clash if you get lucky, or unlucky I suppose. Obviously this wouldn’t happen in MD2H. But using him there is difficult due to sanity gain from high level enemies.
IMO, his 4 colors and 2blunt+2pierce distribution should also be considered a pro because it makes him a unique case of ego fueling. I was already using him before they nerfed Canto 4 and implemented T4 and he was always my top or 2nd best damager until the boss fights (because the random fodder kill keep giving SP there) because he was really good at both AoE with pierce (Telepole as stated in this video is his best move) and AEDD that are both super easy to fuel thanks to his color synergy and how much he benefits from being the team ego user over the other characters who are way more costly. Really the three main things holding him back are 1) Rheath is really just bonker for short fights and MDs with an easy 10/10 score so Sunheath which is like an 8.5/10 just look awful despite being way better than most characters if played properly with huge damage score at the end. 2) He's not a simple character, probably hardest in the game atm. I streamed me using Fox heath in Canto 4 to the friends I play Limbus with to teach them what to do and they could not replicate it and failed with very calm and sane Sunheath. You have to know exactly from turn 2 if you can pull a turn 2 -30SP combo or if you have to go with a slow route instead with counter instead (way easier now thanks to the sp loss on fail clash buff). I will say he's the only character in the game atm that require knowing what you want to do 2 turns ahead nearly every turn and not just "Bodysack, next turn Suppression, do whatever until this pop again" type of planning that is pretty much how you can play 99% of the ids effectively atm. 3)He's a char you plan a team with around EGO usage in limited fight. This imo is where people fail the most because it is very common to just build a team with all the fatal attacks type 000 ids that have the best rolls and color synergy is rarely kept in mind. Often the most people do is plan around Fluid Sac usage for Faust. Sun Heath is actually up there as one of the strongest EGO users in term of damage with very easy to work with color distribution making it easy to avoid the starvation issue. Being a negative ID mean he is actually rewarded even more for spamming them. Unfortunately a lot of players seem to hate this team building aspect and consider it unfair that EGO is factored as part of ID strength.
You S3 him on turn 1 and let your teammate build up the envy passive instead (quite easy considering so many of the meta blunt/pierce units have envy and only Ninclair doesn't) and then go for a double counter on turn 2 with his extra turn from deployment order which would give him -6 (passive) -9 -12 sp or a combination of -9 and -12 from getting hit. If the enemy has a multi-hit on the first action, you go for S1 + counter so you get -6 -6 -9 -9. Assuming you got unopposed attacks (was easy with the K corp healing robot targeting their own allies), that's an easy -27 or -30. This was before they added in the clash loss effect as well which made using S1 to lose a clash even stronger and before T4 which made it even easier to build the sinking potency with 5 sinking instead of 3 on counter.
I personally like using Sunshower Heathcliff against enemies weak to pierce over weak to blunt. His skill 3 is the most reliable skill to use and his counter has the highest attack in his kit so it has really good damage output in spite of rolling the lowest and just makes it easier to roll higher for his other skills cause of the self paralyze. Even if the enemies endure blunt when they are weak to pierce, he still gets the blunt damage up from getting hit so he's still dealing more damage output than the other way around. Most importantly the powerhouse Telepole is pierce. Not that I don't like using AEDD, I love spamming that shit more than Telepole even, it's just that Telepole is simply more damage oriented. It is awkward to go up against someone weak to blunt but endures pierce like N corp inquisitioners and have Telepole do piss poor damage. The same isn't true the other way around cause at least AEDD paralyzes so it makes sense to use even if it is endured.
Happy birthday. I wish this unit was good enough to warrant replacing Rabbit; i just dont understand, they even had uptie 4 to fix his issues. I think N Clair was too strong and they got afraid of giving us a 2nd one. I cant imagine having this guy run through MDH , anytime i lose a clash in there that unit usually suffers a lot of damage. Wanting to take damage but not having the health to back it up, wanting to be risk reward, but not having the coin power to back it up.
When he was announced, I was prob the most dumb person who waited for him. Mostly because I wanted him to be at the power level of the best umbrella wielder, Hatkid, and just slam every living creature with umbrella. Now I truly know that she is too strong, and Hatkid Wannabe Heath (yes, I am calling him like that, and I won't ever now call him sunshower.) qould have never been as strong. But I was dissapointed. My main concern is his counter. I think that it was his best way of losing sanity. Now we have clash lose, but still. Main problem is that he is too slow. Most of the time, he was THE SLOWEST in my teams. And he couldn't interfere enemy with his counter to get some sinking until he gets hit, while if this first enemy was going to hit him, any ally that was faster would interfere and won't allow my Heath to get Heath (get it? Cuz, like, Heath, and getting hit, but hut is similar to Heath? Which is his name???) I think that this guy is one of yhe funnies solo guys. He is the best at soloing things. Especially mirror dungeons. I won't try md2 hard cuz I haven't got all upgrades and threadspun his aedd, but I will one day. He is fun, but strange. Also, Hatkid solo
I noticed that while you talked about suncliff's sp loss on clash, you forgot to mention that losing clashes with s1 would make him lose at least 4 more sp from getting hit with sinking, resulting in a base sp loss of 18 rather than 14
I enjoy using Sunshower Heathcliff in normal Mirror Dungeon where after enough time you should have enough resources to just slam down EGO over and over again. But I can’t deny he’s pretty bad and relies on you being very careful to make him work
Since Linton Gregor was released, I always use Greg as support with some protection supports and use suncliff in the Rupture team. Because his first skill is trash imo, and he has a decent amount of rupture count in skills. I really recommend using it
Honestly I'm still trying to use Sunshower Heathcliff, Mostly in a Sinking team for MD2, It's pretty annoying everytime he gets to high sanity so I have to Overclock AEDD(don't have Telepole) to reduce it. But he's my favourite Heathcliff because his animations are my favourite, His backstory is interesting albeit depressing and it's satisfying to see the max damages of Skill 2 & 3. Even when I got R Heathcliff instead of him in his banner I used his Shards to get him.
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THE PROTECTION NOT APPLYING BEFORE ATTACK IS FINALLY BEING FIXED! IGNORE THAT PART OF THE VIDEO! SUNCLIFF ON TOP!
SUNCLIFF SWEEP SUNCLIFF SWEEP
Now if only they'll make the counter apply its sinking at combat start instead of after the counter... But hey he feels much better after the fix
@@Snokkerball No point really.
As someone that has used Sunshower Heath a lot over time, I would say he is in a very good spot right now. His counter has a place in the kit due to sinking triggering on hit, meaning there are certainly many situations where you would want to use it, like situations where losing a clash with S1 would take away too much sanity (or getting blunt damage up from his and Dieci Rodyon's passive)
It being solely "gain 5 sinking on Battle start" would take away from that.
I truly do think he is in a good spot right now, with his sanity management being pretty good even in mirror dungeons (havent tried solo in MD3H yet, but by the end of Season 2 he was pretty fun) which is where N Sinclair usually struggles. And, I would say he is pretty fun to use
any update video then?
First documented case of ESGOO curse
Sunshower Heath: A really fun but flawed id that has potential for high damage
Shi Heath: 2 attack weight s3 funny and 50 percent hp threshold at ut4 is nice
N Heath: Nicely designed unit and important for N corp teams
R Heath: He's not gonna sugarcoat it: QUICK SUPPRESSION QUICK SUPRESSION QUICK SUPRESSION
GET SUPRESSED GET SUPRESSED GET SUPRESSED
@@sealoverlord5120
BANG BANG BANG BANG
GET SHOT AT GET SHOT AT GET SHOT AT GET SHOT AT
PEW PEW PEW PEW PEW PEW PEW out of ammo out of ammo
@@ILoveLestiI need more bullets I need more bullets I need more bullets
Base heath:s3 rolls 20 unconditionally because I said so
PM really just be adding "Burst Tremor" whenever they don't know what to put on an ID
yet i cant burst tremor with anything except base mersault
A friend of mine made a good analogy for Sunshower Hearhcliff/Dongbaek, they’re forcing themselves to feel awful, but every clash win reminds them of those sweet memories of the past in the league
I like that, that’s cool. Though I’m not quite sure if our Suncliff was a part of the league necessarily. I don’t think it was mentioned in the Uptie story, but something along those lines. It’s probably also related to the Sunshower Abnormality being related to attempting to block out rain via broken umbrellas, reflecting both of their mental states. But hey what do I know
@@therealESGOO The ID’s are usually based on characters who have already existed, Suncliff talks about destroying technology and preserving the past just like Dongbaek
sounds like another roleplay degenerate
@@Quantum1244yeah but thats just TLAs motto, i think he’s just a random user of sunshower just like paper sinc and bad ish
With canto VI part 3 released
I think its safe to say that he was part of the league in his world
CANTO VI SPOILERS
Suncliff is shown and in his world catherine seems to be in yi sang's place
I believe in him.
SUNSHOWER SWEEP
5 videos in and you are already the best Limbus Company creator. I hope you and this game skyrocket into popularity. I love your vids dude keep it up
Every time I release one of these videos, I am always shocked by the support. I should be thanking all of you for enjoying my silly videos. Thank you all.
@@therealESGOO The support, I would say, stems from your videos being both informative and easy to follow. Responding to peoples most requested topics helps as well, though you should obviously only do that if you feel it's right.
agreed
dude is like Shounic of limbus
@@therealESGOO bro I literally typed limbus company videos and yours was at the top. Also, I stopped playing limbus company but I want to come back but It looks alot different. What happened after chapter 3 boss? That's where I stopped. Please help me😂
In my opinion Sunshower Heathcliffs problems come from being designed with the sanity update in mind. Sanity update that was rolled back because it made every fight a slog. Sanity changes in fight were so small that having ways to manage Sanity would have made you toptier.
But the update was rolled back because it made Nclair the only viable identity to have on team. Sunshower had been robbed of his place in the sun before he was released. And his uptie 4 only mitigated his design failures.
his sanity check is actually adjusted to fit the sanity update but even with it he still sucks ass for a 3 star
Alet people of the present!
Potential man has reached full potential, i repeat Potential man has reached full Potential.
Aleph
Aleph Aleph Aleph
Im not a big fan of rich people
Im not a big fan of rich people
I think the real missed opportunity here is not giving him a unique panic type. If he had something like that, where he could actually just like sit at -45, it would make him have a niche over Sinclair. Now N Sinclair is going to be way better than him because uhhh fucking 30 lol, but he does, at least in longer fights, require concessions. You either have to teambuild with Grip Faust to make managing his sanity reasonable through either her support or normal passive, or use his guard to take a turn off so he doesn't start smacking the hell out of your allies. Suncliff being able to roll as consistently as a normal sanity unit without having to make very many compromises would be great for him, especially with Telepole.
To be honest, i would like suncliff to be the first negative coin id with his own niche,like not being able to regain sanity at all,but when he reaches -45 he does not corrode,instead he gets a passive that benefits and hurt his allies, like: when this unit defeats an enemy,all allies gain x strengh and x haste,but lose x amount of sanity,and then to deactivate this buff,you could tie it to using a parry,and the downside would be having his ego locked during the mode.
I remember that when people found out about the panic type update, people instantly thought that suncliff has an unique corrosion, that would have been really cool.
I personally wanted to see an N Don have negative coins as a 00, it would have been a nice surprise
Maybe make him corrode, but you don't get an indiscriminate attack and go down to -20 sanity instead of 0
@@Kalder44that's just better over all.
@@katallica6677yes but N-don isn’t conflicted in what shes doing she genuinely believes she is pursuing justice so she wouldn’t lose sanity with her actions
I feel that sunshower heathcliffs cycle is too fragile because its so easy for him to take too many attacks and distort as a result. He shouldn't be clashing but sometimes he has no choice but to because of speed rolls and if he happens to lose when he can't afford it, he can easily distort
my main usage for Sunshower Heath is to solo the final boss of MDH2. So far I've had him solo the frog, centipede and bull. I'll play the dungeon normally and just have Heath sit on the bench. Come last floor, the node before the boss, I'll optimize my team, (mainly Nclair and Reindeer Ish for their passives) and pray I get I get a boss that wont wreck him since u can't see which boss you'll get beforehand. I think it's fun personally but I know others will disagree, and that's okay!
There is a lot of others id's that can solo bossfights. Not to mention having him on bench triggers his support passive that in paper can be really strong, but whith an ordinary team its just a debuff... (His passive is literraly an ally losing 10 sp on being hit) I have sunshower heathcliff myself and i spend ALOT of time on him, and even if he can be fun sometimes more often he is just dissapointing.
do you have stalwart stance already?
@@yakeru3356 What
@@lurki3954 since you intrigued me in using sunshower solo in the last of md2h boss fight, have you already unlocked the 750 starlight node on the right side? basically im asking if its still possible to solo even if i dont have thst unlocked yet
@@yakeru3356 oh oh I gotcha, I was mega confused since Liu Mr Salt has a skill by the same name. But to answer your question, no I don't not! The farthest I've gotten to is the -10% damage reduction. Working my way to that skill tho. It was definitely a close call tho, I was super close to being staggered but 6-7 protection comes in super handy lol
I've tried Sunshower Heathcliff in Mirror Dungeons, and it's actually quite rough on him. He gains SP from enemy defeats, even by allies, so it's very hard to keep him from rocketing to high SP at all times.
He also has a place as a placeholder ID on my Envy Luxcavation team, and it's mainly for the envy skill 1. There aren't many characters I'd consider to have strong envy synergy.
Man, I am so happy that you exist. I suppose that you're the only Limbus content maker, who makes really interesting videos that I can discuss it with my friends. You should be praised
Potential Man is now good. All thanks to Season 4.
Suncliff is now useful in like 1/10 of the game, it's so over for you
As soon as you released your first video I knew you were going to be one of my favourite limbus content creators thank you for making awesome content Your quality is simply unmatched
6:27 I think PM made s3 pierce to add dmg type variety. If it were blunt, it would be directly competing with Nclair's s3 (won't sugarcoat it) and the blunt dmg up is probably to set up for a powerful s2 which can probably be thought as an alternative for nclair s3. Still a really weird kit with skills that does not synergize with eachother well
I like using him to solo some MD bosses. sometimes including him on some luxvacation too (grew bored using RHeathcliff all the time).
and the only change that I wish for him is honestly changing that his counter. from "TAILS hit gain 1 paralyze" to "ON HIT gain 2 paralyze"... other than that, I honestly like him. but at the same time I can see where peeps who just downright hate this ID are coming from.
build up sucks ass for sure, but I love it. requires some thinking on how to approach a battle, and considering the majority of the this community... yeah, they'll hate him for sure (just kidding... kinda)
I do the exact same thing LOL. I hate pressing win rate, I like careful and precise calculation but then again, this is coming from an avid library of ruina fan. So far the gameplay is still really easy to steamroll without putting in too much thought, so I appreciate Sunshower for being overly complicated. Makes me use my brain wrinkles
yea that tails hit is so damn unnecessary. if they just changed that, he could be slot 1 and start steam rolling really early on
When he first dropped in game my first thought was "Lets go! Babysitting meta!"
Embrace your inner helicopter parent to keep him from slipping and falling.
He is "usable", a fun challenge for some an annoyance to others.
So surround him with ego resources, hp/sp healers and spread out the umbrella of uselessness!
This ID also has the curse that it is compared with R-Heath, as is the case with all Heath IDs. You know, the lad that could one shot the Mexican with quick suppression in the my form empties boss in Refraction Railway.
It’s funny that I have now covered two Heathcliff IDs, while only having 5 videos total…it’s a shame that it will always come down to, just use Rabbit Heath, and it’s a completely fair argument, but there are always going to be new players who don’t have access to top options. So while it’s easy to say to just use Rabbit, I think it’s fun and fair to discuss these undervalued IDs
@@therealESGOO Oh yeah, I totally agree with you. I even like to experiment with team compositions. Recently I tried a Shi team with Shi-Heath and it was fun.
Alright alright I'm really liking the videos, they're so informative and have been helping me out. Happy Birthday!
This might sound odd, but I actually tend to think the automatic consumption of sinking in Foxcliff's passive oftentimes works against him. Because Foxcliff wants to be using his counter, wants to be taking hits for the Blunt damage up, there usually is no great difficulty in consuming the stacks of sinking he accrues over time. In many occasions in my personal testing, all the first part of the passive tended to do is make his sanity loss even worse. When you have only one sinking count, the sinking is consumed before Foxcliff can gain protection, and before the count can be increased with Skills 1 and 3. This is particularly relevant in a Dungeon scenario where Foxcliff's passive is activated by previously gained resources, you lose out on the ability to do turn 1 counter, turn 2 skill 1 clash lose to set yourself at -24 without the use of EGO (Side note, -24 is a really awkward number for skill 2 getting buffs at -25). It's an odd thing where an ostensibly key useful aspect of the passive can instead cause so additional difficulty.
Maybe it would be best to see Foxcliff's passive be changed to Resonance base so that it would be possible to actively choose between stockpiling Sinking count and consuming it?
I don't mind how it work in dungeon just because you already have a lot of EGO resources built up anyway and it was kinda displayed perfectly for me during the story dungeon where you often get check point before a boss that reset everyone back to 0 SP. With the resources you build up from doing dungeon (and potentially railway), you no longer play the sinking game to achieve low sanity because you just go ahead and overclock a telepole or AEDD on turn 1 and he's ready to fight especially with AEDD to activate his healing.
Changing his passive to resonance might actually kill him because it will kill his S3 to S2 to Counter rotation for abno fight. S3 for an unopposed attack or a clash win, followed by S2 to burn his sinking potency and then a counter (reduce SP again or burn off the remaining sp gain from clash win with passive still activating) or another S2 is a very self-sufficient combo to keep Fox Heath in the -25 to -30 zone while doing the most damage he can as his passive+counter will remove all the sp gain he get from winning S3 clash. Making his passive reso mean you will have to force your teammate to use Envy as Heath will be using S2 or S3 or counter for maximum damage and also force him to get hit outside just the counter turn so you added like 3 extra conditions to what he has to do to achieve the same result as just using the mentioned rotation. This also doesn't take into account how much it kind of decimate his human side combat as well.
I disagree with you, partly because that way of using him puts him too much in danger of getting staggered in anywhere else outside of MD2 with the buffs, and making his passive dependent on resonance further weakens his ability to actually survive hits.
My main reason, however, is that the way it works now lets me balance out the SP loss with the SP gain from winning clashes, allowing my Heath to go on a constant offensive once he’s got his passive going and enough sinking stacks on him. His counter becomes an occasional supplement to the speed at which he loses SP or for powering up his S2. Even with his low damage output at the start of fights, he quickly rockets up to catch up with it even surpass N Sinclair in total damage output for a fight.
He’s weak in MD (though he’s fine for the story dungeons, at least for now; if the next part has the enemies giving you SP upon killing then, that’d really screw Sunshower Heath), but pretty good for the longer fights where you have to finish under a 10-turn count, which is a fine enough niche. The way your suggestion to change him would work, he’d just be a mediocre, if useable, toy to use in MD who’d be outstripped by other IDs you wouldn’t have to employ an impractical play style to make work there.
Bro really making the most banger content in all of limbus community
That was the idea
@@therealESGOO thanks for all the great work we really needed content like this
he really is the id of all time but i love using him in abno fights + identities using EGO gear is really cool in general (also happy birthday !🎉)
waiting on ut4 Ego efficiency list. Your style of editing and naration is prefect for any educational content for this silly game with community who cant read (I cant too), and your videos allow me to understand and choose what i need to build.
oh, and as always, nice video. 5/5 as of now are fenomenal
I promise it will come eventually. The issue is mostly that researching, scripting, recording, editing, everything really about my video making process takes a lot of time, and…people really seem to want MORE videos above everything else. Work has already begun on it and multiple other videos, but usually 1 project takes priority over the others.
@@therealESGOOtake your time. Even if you slow down it will be worth the wait.
i started playing limbus cuz i absolutely loved the lore and worldbuilding done in Lobo Corp/Ruina but was met with a considerable content drought about the game. Very happy to see such high quality content being done, keep it up o/
Back when he released, I did a solo MD run with Suncliff. I thought he was fun, but using him outside of that just felt meaningless. Doesn’t help that Rcliff is a monster. Honestly, playing him solo is my favorite way to play him.
I quickly picked up on how to use Sunshower Heath only after a few fights with him in the story stages that were available on his release and his damage output is incredible. To put it into perspective, despite his low combat effectiveness at the start of a fight in a story stage, he quickly catches up to N Sinclair and can even overtake him, with him as slot 1 and Sinclair as slot 2. With Telepole, though, he just rockets past N Sinclair (who only really has Doomsday Clock, and single-target EGOs just can’t really compare to AoE ones in terms of damage output).
Honestly, I wouldn’t change anything about Sunshower Heath (I’d even go as far as to say that I disagree with at least your first two suggestions). Even uptie 4 giving him -10 SP on clash loss was pretty insignificant for me, and personally just feels like a crutch for the benefit of people who don’t really understand how to use him. I think people just don’t have the patience to actually try to learn how to use him, and I suppose I’d include you on this despite your attempt to portray Sunshower Heath positively. At least, I feel like you still don’t really “get” him.
Sunshower Heath is great for human fights, since that’s where I actually learned how to use him. Or rather, sure, abno fights can make him easier to use, but it’s really not difficult to make him effective in human fights. He’s great for single stage fights, like in story, and this ties in with understanding how to make use of his SP loss mechanics. And understanding how to make use of his SP loss mechanics leads you to understand why he’s punished hard for hitting heads; because he’s super great once you get him low, as he can maintain a certain range of negative SP more consistently than N Sinclair can (through both his passive and clash wins balancing each other out; if you’re playing him right, you’d be using his S2 whenever you can to clear out his sinking count to stop him from corroding), who does eventually need a “cooldown” period to prevent himself from hitting -45 SP. This ability to remain a constant “low” SP level is what allows him to so quickly catch up with and compete with N Sinclair.
I don’t think the confusing mechanics is a real con here, so much as a highlight for the low tolerance level of some people to even attempt to learn something. It only took me like 3 fights to understand how to use Sunshower Heath, yet there are still people to this day who can’t figure out how to keep N Sinclair’s SP low in MD. Literal skill issue.
I think Sunshower Heath has a nice enough niche that doesn’t really need changing. However, with the game nerfing how high enemy health is and with the recent event having us face higher level enemies (meaning SP on kill, either by a character themself or by their allies), his utility and effectiveness respectively could get heavily impacted, though I’d need to test it out.
I wholeheartedly agree with the end thoughts. He's such a missed opportunity.
It's the first EGO equipment ID in the game, which for those who have been playing since L Corp and Library of Ruina was a super hype prospect. And the fact that it was the second negative ID made it even more something to look forward to considering the insane table flipping potential that negative coins brought in N Sinclair.
Those changes would definitely make me want to play him. In fact, I would Uptie IV him if they just fix the passive. I really want to like him.
Honestly looking forward to these vids, you might be newer to content creation but it's pure kino, Great work
I almost quit the game because I had to hit hard pity to obtain this ID, lost my entire stash plus some cash, and hit ZERO 000 units, dupes or new, and did not even hit a single missing 00 I had at the time along the way. I eventually got some luck later on (I pulled the new Ryoshu egos each as single pulls during the paid daily pulls on different banners when it was live) and finally got over the shard hump and my team up and grinding in the mirror dungeons, now I have every ID and have 600+ boxes working towards grinding for future IDs, but I generally have an emotional attachment to this ID, for better or for worse because of it. I gratefully accept an in-depth video, because I will convert it into knowledge in how to make this ID work optimally where it can, because it was my first painful lesson in Limbus, even if self-inflicted. Happy Birthday!
sunshower heathcliff is kinda op now due to the currect state of the game and how he is good in his canto for losing sanity easily
I'm late, but the second skill's coin 4 effect to burst Tremor is a cute touch, since the animation for this coin involves Heathcliff smashing in the umbrella he stabbed the enemy with (which is one of my favorite animations, along with Daring Decisions, Self-Destructing Purge, and Ironclad Retribution).
Incredible video production, so clean and informative, great graphics and even a little touch of humour, defiantly a lot of work put into making such videos
seeing the blown-up sinking icon always throws me off, because the little version looks like some kind of horned bull or something.
Looking forward to your future videos its nice to have a good content creator for Limbus.
it technically wouldn’t fix his issues but i think changing the tremor burst on skill 2 to sinking deluge
I have a lot of feelings towards Sunshower Heathcliff, and I’m glad to see that your review of him was well written and thorough.
Sunshower Heathcliff was my guaranteed 000 from the Season 2 Decaextraction ticket from the Battlepass. Prior to getting him I had absolutely no idea who he was or what he did, and since I was shooting for Spicebush Yi Sang I was at first upset.
But then I Uptied him to three and saw his story, and I instantly fell in love. Spice Yi is my favourite design wise, but Suncliff is a close second and my favourite in terms of personal story.
Like you’ve explained in your video however, he’s ultimately flawed and often times a burden to use, and with that a very big choice. There are other IDs to use, but none of them are as difficult and complex as Suncliff. It’s a brilliant sight to see him succeed, but that doesn’t change the fact his value usually isn’t worth the precision required to pilot him.
Regardless however, he is one of my most treasured units (Uptie 4’d him second), and honestly I’ve found good success with him in MD2 Hard! It’s unfortunate that Uptie 4 didn’t give him the value he needed to be viable, but I’m happy with him.
P.S. Your videos are all excellent and the quality has made me decide to even set notifications for your upload. I find myself rewatching them simply for how thoughtfully put together they are.
Fellow sunshower enjoyer here (my first uptie 4 lol), how do you use him in md2h? since the sanity up is so high in MDs I often never find success in bringing negative coin ids there. so tips would be appreciated, thanks
@@yakeru3356 As you might expect, due to his protection, high health pool, and average speed, he can serve as a moderately effective interceptiontank. He doesn’t have any healing or shield, but he can tank an attack that your other sinners can’t. This is probably the main reason I use him, using him as a tank with much better damage than most tanks.
As for the sanity issue, you are very right about that, however MD allows you to carry sin resources over every battle and, if you’re willing to put in the extra work, leaving a single enemy on stagger and letting excess sinking drain can keep him at a negative or at least neutral sanity level after each battle.
I wouldn’t say he’s particularly good, as you say the sanity increase on enemy death is quite prevalent, but if you’re willing to give him a try, he’ll tank any clashes you can’t win against and do good damage on unopposed. Also AEDD is so fucking good please spam the shit out of it. Especially if you’re able to Threadspin 4. Hope this helps!
Hearing that my videos are rewatchable is probably the single highest compliment a RUclips creator could receive, thank you for enjoying and re-enjoying my videos!
The NClair tax: Every future minus coin IDs will have low skill power floor with 0 power ceiling because someone at project moon thought that a character with a skill that have, at worse case 30-18 roll and at best case 30+30+30 rolls was a good idea.
I was contemplating a lot between Sunshower Heath vs N Heath, because for the purpose of fueling AEDD (awesome EGO btw) they're the same. I ended up uptie 4 both of them, but rarely used Sunshower because N Heath inherently have good synergies with other N Corp IDs.
He's a very special goodboy hat one has to cheris for him to start giving back. To regain trust is hard ;-;
Every Heathcliff has something pure about them - their anger and hate flow from being hurt or rejected, honest to boot, with their heart on their sleeve. Ah, to wash this pain away!
Sunshower Heathclif is very honestly one of my favourite IDs but the way i play him is almost ALWAYS solo, for the sole fact that i actually encourage him to force corrode because yes Corrosion does eat up EGO resources like crazy but, EGO corrosion still in fact procs when there are no resources left. And since Sinking is a persistent debuff, if you stack enough sinking you could basically get a corrosion every other turn. Its a really fun solo ID that basically encourages you to go big or go home
it's almost poetic how the community treats sunshower heathcliff
This is pretty good content for a mobile gacha game. Looking forward to more informative videos in the future but don't burn yourself out
happy birthday today
Damn this video is so high quality im surprised you are this low subs count. Man this video is amazing and i hope you get the support you deserve, amazing video
Just started the game like 3 days ago and I got this dude while spinning lunacy. I like him a lot and plan to keep using him, but didn’t know how to effectively use him well enough. This honestly helped me with that issue and I’m happy for it. It is unfortunate that heads does ruin his damage by a lot, but I’m just living with it. It’s a great ID to me (Uptie 4 is nice do not ask me why I got this already)
One thing I find funny about the ID is that if you somehow manage to give him minimum 45 sinking and a lot of count, he corrodes every 2 turns, and on the non corroded turns, he has -45 sanity right away.
I try to use him whenever I can and he is such a hard ID to manage but when the stars align boy does he feel so satisfying to use. He pairs well with AEDD too, the free protection + getting heals from being hit makes him tanky.
Happy Birthday! Probably late but still hope you had a fun B-day
It's unfortunate that he got released right after Ninclair, not because of people comparing him but because PM was clearly afraid of the monster (Ninclair) they created so they made their second negative ID too weak. I'm a bit annoyed that they didn't adress his biggest issue in Uptie 4 which is keeping his SP low (S1 change was nice tho), instead they mainly buffed his S2 with another low SP condition when his entire problem is that he can never stay low SP. In fact often if you're forced to clash, you need his SP to be -35 at the very least or the the SP he gets from winning a clash actually ruins his damage. It was such a bizarre change
I could never wrap my head around using him, thought it was an uptie issue so I transferred the body sack refund into sunshower and still sucked at using him lol, I’ll give it another shot after this vid, oh yeah happy birthday 🎉
I've felt the Wrath counter always being available and being a decent option to progress the fight, if Heath gets a heavy Wrath cost EGO that gives him some sort of utility and a massive minus coin corrosion this ID might come around. I do like how this game has a lot of interwoven synergies that can make some units and skills suddenly more useful. Hopefully we get more tools for the ID since it really is fun to use.
for me, the Umbrella will still be in the basket. it is beautiful look, complex id, but reward for understanding his work not enough. a old umbrella in the idea, an old umbrella in the end.
This guy is literally just the average London resident
- In rags
- Constantly in rain
- Uses random object from the street as weapon
- Sad and homeless
- Looks like he just washed up from the Thames
- Furry
ДА, ДААААААА
Как же он чувствует. Лиситклиф это моя любимая личность на моего любимого грешника ( почти 500 часов в Лимбусе, немало из которых я наиграл именно с ним ).
Я буквально сказал на моменте "что бы я изменил в Лиситклифе" слово в слово перед его словами "нужно 2 каунта на первом скилле".
Как же он ЧУВСТВУЕТ.
10:53 I swear, i played this ID with ismael and don and boy, he was crying in the corner at +16 sanity after using warning and usiumbrella twack cuz they kept killing things and boy i was unable to lower his sanity.
I like using him more on MHD, it feels like i can better control how will he loose S1 clashes, wish he had a way to reduce the clash/kill sanity gain like Ninclair instead.
One of my favorite IDs, even if he is not as powerful as he could be.
God, i love your video editing
I tend to use Sunshower Heath in my sinking teams because his added sinking on counter and S1 are both really useful for improving the sinking count on especially abnormalities. I've been really enjoying going full Sinking memes in MD2H lately, so he's a good addition to those, and is actually decent against the bull since he can take the one-coin attack pretty easily with his blunt resistance.
Once again, another amazing video by you!
There's just something about your voice that's really suited for making RUclips vidoes, lol
It kinda weird that Ninclair are very easy to use with huge output while sunshower is hard to use with mid output. Kinda feel like they accidently switch it or something.
yeah to me he was made for the sanity changes that were reverted. i also think they didnt want a repeat of said sinclair either cuz its hard to deny N-SINC is overtuned to hell and back
I think that may be a matter of Nclair being the last ID of the season, and by far the most hyped up ID…ever, at that point at least. I think it’s fine for there to be more powerful IDs in Gacha games, it’s how they make money after all, but it really is a shame that (potentially) as a side effect, they were far more careful with Sunshower Heath
YES THE GOAT HAS UPLOADED!
Very good summary. He is fun and i love his design. Sinclair's existence makes you question why S Heath runs with ankle weights, while Sinclair is free of them. Casual 30 rolls on s3 vs Heath's very conditioned s2, which still can't achieve s3 numbers. Or simply every positive sanity id is already better and they don't have all this problems, so why just not use them instead. About missed opportunity, i believe that S Heath could've been the first counter oriented id but ended up undercooked.
His biggest flaw so far, is what he gains a ton of sp when enemies higher level when him are dying.
Literally impossible to use on high floors of md, when his sp lost can't catch up
Atleast now we have rags so that's good
I think the best way to buff SunHeath is just to give him the same gimmick as SunDongbaek boss fight e.g. "if this skill clashing lose , lose X amount of SP".
I know PM already added it to his sanity passive, kinda, but it's still slow to get him rolling.
0:45 in and I’ve already seen everything I needed to condemn this awful identity. How dare he fuck OP’s wife?
Thanks to this video i now realize the sinking symbol is supposed be a teary/melting eye. I thought it was a funny horned alien face before seeing it up close lol
LETS GO ANOTHER VIDEOOOO
"What I would change" part seems like T5 concept (tho I want to believe we will get 4th skill or something cool for it)
I know it not the point but I like the music you choose for I am a sucker for ultrakill
I am part of the small percentage of people who know how to use the Bri'ish Man Channeling The Power of Bri'ain. If you know what you're doing, he's a fun dude to play with. And if you're in MD2 and got the left most starlight, seeing him without fail roll all tails is YI SANG. I mean Ideal.
Ive been using him for a while at uptie 3 and can say hes very inconsistent... but he does work sometimes, and his uptie 4 seems very good for.helping with that, i havent gotten to play around with it yet but i definitely will and i feel he could be pretty crazy, plus hes got some of the sickest animations in the game
Potential man has ruined me. I thought just getting him to max level and uptie 4 was enough. Now I realize also I need Pierre Ryoshu (and maybe chef Gregor), Ya sunyata for HP and Telepole for Charge. Even then, I need to reset for a charge item and a heal item to proc AEDD's Healing passive when hit and regular sustain healing. AND EVEN THEN, if I end up fighting Guido or his carpenters on floor 1 that's a reset.
I think your solution is more reasonable and realistic, but to me he should just get the same SP loss than Nclair has (to your dismay) OR to gain Sinking potency with each coin loss even if he wins the clash. Because that's the thing, due to negative coins you can still land a hit on your last coin if the enemy rolls low enough and you get a lucky tails hit and win the clash, but if you lose the clash your sanity loss that turn might help you on your next turn but the turn after that if you won the previous clash you're garanteed to be either 15+ sanity and the Sinking you were originally trying to build up has been mostly lost.
Gaining extra Sinking potency with lost coins gives you a more substantial sp drop on the same turn since after being hit you drop to a level that garantees a better attack on the same turn while preventing ending with a higher sanity that you started with after successful attacks. Of course that would mean that corrosion would be a more prevalent issue, but people doing solo runs would do so anyway and he would be more welcoming of Fausts Fluid Sack SP heal on being in teams as he can contribute more often into the fight.
why am i trying so hard if no one is gonna read this lol
Congrats on blowing up.
Coming here to pay respects since Wild Hunt Heathcliff came out. o7
Such a waste of an ID for the british man with a bat. Great video as usual and happy birthday!
I've loved him ever since the moment I laid my eyes on him, I love the way he looks, and the way he plays, and how unique he is. Thank you for making this very thorough guide about my beloved. I do wish he ended up having a unique corrosion, as they added the sanity tab around the time he released, but honestly I like the way he is, except for his kit having way too many tails hits.
Now i understand why they call Him The Potential Man
I like your funny words, magic man
Another top notch vid! N Heath and now Sunshower... Shi Heath guide incoming? Speaking of the Shi, I'd be very interested in a guide on Poise, since I think it's a status effect that used to be laughed at, but now with UT4 might be good? I'm still on the fence about it, lul.
Someone please send this video to PM
He's just cool
Based
As for the changes to aforementioned passive I believe it should also gain 1 Pierce DMG UP.
S3 should do a little more damage imo. I know it's hard to compare any ID to NCorp Sinclair, but higher roll of 21 base would make it more obvious that he can have his own numbers in ideal scenario.
Hope that whenever PM decides to implement uptie 5, they will make sunshower better.
My Favourite Identity in the game.
As a certified Suncliff enjoyer, some comments:
1) 12:36 His skill 3 works exactly like his skill 1, so you're not "losing out" on Sinking by clashing with it. In fact, losing clashes with S3 is an important tool at positive Sanity.
You mostly want to lose clashes against 1 coin skills, since it leaves you enough Sinking count to add more count next turn. E.g. losing with S3 and adding a counter for good measure, then next turn losing a clash with his S1 loses a total of 73 Sanity and drops you from 45 to -28. Without a second coin slot and therefore without the counter, it still loses 58.
2) he is actually very solid as a tank. He has good HP, only takes either 50 or 60% damage most of the time and with AEDD heals 2.5% of HP with every hit he takes when he has charge or is at 40% HP. In terms of pure tankiness, with the above active he survives 5 Inquisitors ganging up on him, while staggered, *at 30 HP* (yes I tested this, and yes he does delete their existence with several corroded Telepoles afterwards). You need both type AND sin affinity to be fatal for him to really take any damage.
Now firstly, he *wants* to take hits frequently, losing clashes with either S1 or S3. He additionally is very good at taking those hits. Even if his motivation is ultimately selfish, this doesn't change that he's perfectly suited for the tank role. When I play MD2 with him, he takes over hits every turn.
Secondly, his counter being an actually good skill is very useful for this role too. You mostly want to do this when you already have sinking so you don't miss out on the protection, but since you can "clash" with defensive skills and on the higher floors you aren't winning clashes without EGOs, taking the hit with 50% damage reduction and then doing good damage with the counter is very viable. It's still two 10 coins, 5 Rupture and 5 Sinking. Basically a decent S2.
Also fun fact, his counter, to my knowledge, is the only non S3/EGO skill that zooms in and displays total damage done.
With the skill 3, though I did misspeak and talk as thought it were on hit, going unopposed is still better, since the skill 3 is actually likely to win any random clash if you get lucky, or unlucky I suppose. Obviously this wouldn’t happen in MD2H. But using him there is difficult due to sanity gain from high level enemies.
IMO, his 4 colors and 2blunt+2pierce distribution should also be considered a pro because it makes him a unique case of ego fueling. I was already using him before they nerfed Canto 4 and implemented T4 and he was always my top or 2nd best damager until the boss fights (because the random fodder kill keep giving SP there) because he was really good at both AoE with pierce (Telepole as stated in this video is his best move) and AEDD that are both super easy to fuel thanks to his color synergy and how much he benefits from being the team ego user over the other characters who are way more costly.
Really the three main things holding him back are
1) Rheath is really just bonker for short fights and MDs with an easy 10/10 score so Sunheath which is like an 8.5/10 just look awful despite being way better than most characters if played properly with huge damage score at the end.
2) He's not a simple character, probably hardest in the game atm. I streamed me using Fox heath in Canto 4 to the friends I play Limbus with to teach them what to do and they could not replicate it and failed with very calm and sane Sunheath. You have to know exactly from turn 2 if you can pull a turn 2 -30SP combo or if you have to go with a slow route instead with counter instead (way easier now thanks to the sp loss on fail clash buff). I will say he's the only character in the game atm that require knowing what you want to do 2 turns ahead nearly every turn and not just "Bodysack, next turn Suppression, do whatever until this pop again" type of planning that is pretty much how you can play 99% of the ids effectively atm.
3)He's a char you plan a team with around EGO usage in limited fight. This imo is where people fail the most because it is very common to just build a team with all the fatal attacks type 000 ids that have the best rolls and color synergy is rarely kept in mind. Often the most people do is plan around Fluid Sac usage for Faust. Sun Heath is actually up there as one of the strongest EGO users in term of damage with very easy to work with color distribution making it easy to avoid the starvation issue. Being a negative ID mean he is actually rewarded even more for spamming them. Unfortunately a lot of players seem to hate this team building aspect and consider it unfair that EGO is factored as part of ID strength.
what is his turn 2 -30 SP combo? since on turn 2 i always try to go for skill 3 + counter if possible
You S3 him on turn 1 and let your teammate build up the envy passive instead (quite easy considering so many of the meta blunt/pierce units have envy and only Ninclair doesn't) and then go for a double counter on turn 2 with his extra turn from deployment order which would give him -6 (passive) -9 -12 sp or a combination of -9 and -12 from getting hit. If the enemy has a multi-hit on the first action, you go for S1 + counter so you get -6 -6 -9 -9. Assuming you got unopposed attacks (was easy with the K corp healing robot targeting their own allies), that's an easy -27 or -30.
This was before they added in the clash loss effect as well which made using S1 to lose a clash even stronger and before T4 which made it even easier to build the sinking potency with 5 sinking instead of 3 on counter.
I personally like using Sunshower Heathcliff against enemies weak to pierce over weak to blunt. His skill 3 is the most reliable skill to use and his counter has the highest attack in his kit so it has really good damage output in spite of rolling the lowest and just makes it easier to roll higher for his other skills cause of the self paralyze. Even if the enemies endure blunt when they are weak to pierce, he still gets the blunt damage up from getting hit so he's still dealing more damage output than the other way around.
Most importantly the powerhouse Telepole is pierce. Not that I don't like using AEDD, I love spamming that shit more than Telepole even, it's just that Telepole is simply more damage oriented. It is awkward to go up against someone weak to blunt but endures pierce like N corp inquisitioners and have Telepole do piss poor damage. The same isn't true the other way around cause at least AEDD paralyzes so it makes sense to use even if it is endured.
this is kino as fuck, rare actually good gacha game creator, massive L that this game is going through its 9/11
(if you cant tell i love this video)
Happy birthday. I wish this unit was good enough to warrant replacing Rabbit; i just dont understand, they even had uptie 4 to fix his issues. I think N Clair was too strong and they got afraid of giving us a 2nd one. I cant imagine having this guy run through MDH , anytime i lose a clash in there that unit usually suffers a lot of damage. Wanting to take damage but not having the health to back it up, wanting to be risk reward, but not having the coin power to back it up.
> I think N Clair was too strong and they got afraid of giving us a 2nd one
they shouldve expected it when they made a fucking 30 coin bro
When he was announced, I was prob the most dumb person who waited for him. Mostly because I wanted him to be at the power level of the best umbrella wielder, Hatkid, and just slam every living creature with umbrella. Now I truly know that she is too strong, and Hatkid Wannabe Heath (yes, I am calling him like that, and I won't ever now call him sunshower.) qould have never been as strong. But I was dissapointed. My main concern is his counter. I think that it was his best way of losing sanity. Now we have clash lose, but still. Main problem is that he is too slow. Most of the time, he was THE SLOWEST in my teams. And he couldn't interfere enemy with his counter to get some sinking until he gets hit, while if this first enemy was going to hit him, any ally that was faster would interfere and won't allow my Heath to get Heath (get it? Cuz, like, Heath, and getting hit, but hut is similar to Heath? Which is his name???)
I think that this guy is one of yhe funnies solo guys. He is the best at soloing things. Especially mirror dungeons. I won't try md2 hard cuz I haven't got all upgrades and threadspun his aedd, but I will one day. He is fun, but strange. Also, Hatkid solo
ofc its pierce guys
he stabs you with the pointy umbrella ‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️
I wish he was a better unit because his anims are so cool
I watched him get won over by a bag man holding a metal pipe.
He definitely needs justice
I noticed that while you talked about suncliff's sp loss on clash, you forgot to mention that losing clashes with s1 would make him lose at least 4 more sp from getting hit with sinking, resulting in a base sp loss of 18 rather than 14
potential man!
I enjoy using Sunshower Heathcliff in normal Mirror Dungeon where after enough time you should have enough resources to just slam down EGO over and over again. But I can’t deny he’s pretty bad and relies on you being very careful to make him work
Atleast he can solo toad
Since Linton Gregor was released, I always use Greg as support with some protection supports and use suncliff in the Rupture team. Because his first skill is trash imo, and he has a decent amount of rupture count in skills. I really recommend using it
Mam this vid was great, but now I actually feel kinda bad about him being one of the few ID's I don't have 😢
Honestly I'm still trying to use Sunshower Heathcliff, Mostly in a Sinking team for MD2, It's pretty annoying everytime he gets to high sanity so I have to Overclock AEDD(don't have Telepole) to reduce it. But he's my favourite Heathcliff because his animations are my favourite, His backstory is interesting albeit depressing and it's satisfying to see the max damages of Skill 2 & 3. Even when I got R Heathcliff instead of him in his banner I used his Shards to get him.