John Muir Trail Lessons Learned / Tips and Advice
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- Опубликовано: 17 май 2015
- In this video I discuss what worked and what didn't work on my 2014 JMT hike. I offer trail advice, food and gear tips and general knowledge of an experienced hiker that may be helpful to future hikers.
You can watch my 2014 hike of the JMT here: • JMT 2014 17 Days on th...
this dude is super helpful and conscientious of this beautiful trail and wilderness, that he clearly loves... Thanks a ton Ape Man....Good on ya!!!!!
Excellent video, full of good info, gives one a lot to think about and many many tidbits about the JMT. Thanks so much!
Wonderful job, Sir. I am planning my first JMT and this is the most info packed youtube I have seen abt JMT.
I really appreciate you touching on the personal topics. I took a lot of notes!
Very informative. And an eye opener. I had no idea there were that many people out there. Most of my Sierra hiking happened when I was much younger and I hardly ever saw anyone. Perhaps one or two other people in a week. Thanks for sharing. Much to think about.
Awesome video! Sent this to the guy I am backpacking with who has less experience, but all good details and tips I wouldnt have thought about
got it now on most things did a lot of home work since I last talked to you. I think Ill be good ty for your patience
Thanks.. really good stuff on this video.. Im doing a short stint in Yosemite for 4/5 days, but I'm new so this was helpful.
Thanks Ape Man, nice video. Going NOBO starting at Horseshoe Meadow in July. I liked "eat what you like", "bring olive oil", and the baby wipe tip. Thanks again.
Thanks for the water tips on Cathedral pass. I will be hiking this section of the JMT this week and expecting little water.
Hey, thanks for the info. Your 17 day hike video was also useful for distance planning.
Very helpful info - thanks for your videos!
I've done the trail and this guy has some good advice. I always say sleep is king. I have always carried a 2-1/2' x 2-1/2' foam pad for sitting and to put under my air mattress to minimize the chance of getting a hole in it. I roll my tent poles up in it and it gets carried outside of my pack. I use the Frontier gravity filter for water and haven't found anything better. Don't forget sun tan lotion and something to cover your neck.
Helpful video, thanks!
Regarding noisy/crowded campgrounds: I've resorted to packing earplugs on any overnight backpacking trip...some of those spots in the Sierra backcountry are as crowded as Yosemite Valley. But usually, I only need them for a night, and of course they weigh nothing.
Great information and insights Ape Man. Thank you for taking the time to share what you know about hiking, trees, wildlife, fishing, and more. Your practical advice is appreciated. I really enjoyed watching your vid of hiking the JMT with your daughter. Reading all the comments and your responses has really helped me plan my trip (fall of 2020.) I recently retired and now have the time to take longer hikes. My husband and I, with a few friends hiked The Rae Lakes loop, a Mineral King loop, and a loop out of Hetch Hetchy, to name a few, all of which were 5-6 days depending. So I have some past experience. However our last hike was 9 years ago. Gotta get back on the trail!
I have a gear question. In trying to cut some weight from my old gear, I’m looking to replace my old sleeping pad with an ultra light one. My sleeping bag, is a 15 degree bag with a sleeve for the pad (no down is in that sleeve). My old pad is rated 4.5, while the ultra light one is 2.0. Do you think that this will be adequate for my type of bag (Big Agnes Ranger 850 down, extra wide mummy) while hiking the JMT? I’m also replacing my 4.8 lb pack, and water filtration to a Sawyer instead if an older pump style filter. Will try to keep my weight below 30# (from the 45# packs of the past).
If/when you do guide trips, I’d sure like to know.
Hi Meg. Congrats on your retirement. I will be joining you in retirement in 2-3 years and if my body cooperates I hope to be able to guide a few trips. I've also considered offering a different type of service I haven't really seen. I would plan your whole trip or just parts and include everything to getting you equipped properly, get your food, setting your itinerary, pick you up at the airport and get you to your trailhead. I would arrange camp spots at or near your trailhead and pick you up at your exit trailhead. If so desired we could even do other side trips after your hike is over before I take you back to the airport. Just some ideas I'm kicking around.
On the pad question - sounds like you have something like the neo air uberlite. That is a low r-value but for summer trips in the Sierra that should be fine. Depends if you are a cold sleeper too. Down offers zero warmth value when compressed as you lie on it so the pad is important if you expect conditions down to 20 degrees. Any trip completed by mid to late September should not see temps lower than that but it sometimes happens. A 15 degree down bag with 850 fill is perfect for the JMT. If it gets cold then just wear your layers to bed and you will be fine.
Ape Man. Yes, the new pad is the neoair uberlite which is less than half the wt. of my other pad. Dang, those suckers are pricey even with a discount. On the bright side, by the time I’m done, I’ll have a chunk of moola from my REI dividend that I can blow on more gear! I bought the large pad to better match what I already have, but am thinking of trading it for a smaller size to knock off a few ounces more. I also replaced my tent with the lanshan 2 from China. It’s my first experience with a tent that uses trekking poles instead of tent poles. I’ve practiced setting up/tearing down. I’ve got it figured now thanks to other RUclips videos. After seam sealing a couple of areas, I hosed it down. So far, so good. No leaking at all. A bit more than $100.000. Given the prices of the Dyneema tents, I decided to give this one a go. I’ll see how it tests out.The footprint is a bit smaller than our old tent, but after we both went in it and stretched out, I got a thumbs up from my husband who’s over 6’. I’m also planning to replace my pack. I’m vacillating between the GG Mariposa 60L and the ULA Circuit. If I can’t make up my mind or can’t get it before planned hikes, I’ll use my old 4.8#er since our fall hikes will be weekenders to maybe four days. With all the suggestions you’ve offered on your videos and to others in the comments section, I have lots of hiking options. Really want to explore the Eastern side. Thanks so much for sharing spots that are off the beaten path.
Another question for ya. Have you heard anything about whether California is planning to, or has tested the Ursack bear bags? While I have a bearvault 500, it sure would be nice to have that option. I’ve heard that other states have ok’d it. I was thinking of getting the small one for things like chapstick, toothpaste, sunscreen, wipes, etc... in order to pinch out a bit more room for food in my canister. However, I certainly don’t wish to contribute to creating a problem for bears or break the law.
Your idea to set up all inclusive hikes is a really good one! That would fill a nearly empty niche in helping a wide range of hikers access the Sierras. While those outside the state/country would be great clients, so would those like me. While I may not need the gear, I’d willingly pay to have high caliber consulting and transportation services. We’ve typically been limited to “loops” because we didn’t have anyone to hit up for a ride at the end of a long hike. In addition, your years of experience in the backcountry uniquely qualifies you as one I’d go to for advice on great places to explore that I’d never know otherwise. Keep that idea brewing Ape Man!
Thanks again for your response. As we get closer to setting out, I may be hitting you up again to bounce ideas or concerns.
Hey Meg
I haven't seen the Lanshan tent but I've heard decent things about it and you can't beat the weight or the price. I'm 6'3" and that style of tent doesn't work for me because of the slant of the walls. I've been tent bound for 3 days before and I like my vertical walled tents for the space. Tarp tent has some great tents that are affordable and some use trekking poles to save on weight. I'm lazy and don't like fiddling around with tent setups so I still stick to free standing which suits me because I tend to play a lot above tree line where there is little soil. Still it is easy to set up a tent like yours anywhere with some ingenuity and boulders.
I am not a fan of Ursacks. I don't see them being approved in the national parks. Bears can still smell them and be attracted to your camp. To me they are not worth the effort. There are areas on the JMT where counter balancing is still legal but most people do it incorrectly. All it takes is a few lazy hikers sleeping with their food or hanging improperly to get a bear killed. I've gotten used to my bear can and usually bring it in areas where it's not required. It's so easy and as you eat the food you can stuff other crap in their and it's waterproof and a fine camp chair. I solve the overflow problem with Opsack odor bags for toiletries and chapstick. As soon as I have room in the can those items go in the can. It's not ideal but it has worked for me. Your pack choices are both great options.
Yes the shuttle option opens up many more hikes. Many times I've dropped a car off at one trailhead and hitched or ridden my bike to another trailhead to solve that problem but some areas it's hard to get a ride and I found out the hard way riding a bike down a steep road overheats the tires from brake use and causes your tubes to explode. Almost bit it on the Whitney down Whitney Portal road. I figure shuttling people around will get me gas money and I can camp, fish or backpack before picking them up at the end of their trip. Sounds like a win win to me. The High Sierra Trail is one such trail that comes to mind where this would be ideal.
Feel free to hit me up with any questions. Remember to train as much as possible walking up and down hills with a loaded pack. Nothing is better training.
What would the best time of year to try and plan a hike with fewer people and the best weather? Great video with lots of great pointers, tips and rethinks.
Lots of rain in the Sierra this past week. There is still plenty of water along the JMT. Yes in the usual dry places maybe carry 2 water bottles instead of 1. Everyone should know where their next reliable water is and plan accordingly.
Richard Flores - You only have to carry out the poop between Guitar lake and Whitney portal but the paper and wipes need to be carried out on the whole trail. They will issue a poop kit when you pick up your permit and there is a bin full of them at Crabtree meadows not far from the ranger station there. There is also a sit down toilet in Crabtree which I like to unload my troubles at so I don't have to go in a bag. You are going in prime mosquito time so bring repellent and maybe a head net. Normally a late June start would present snow and water crossing issues but not this year. You will encounter a little snow at the passes but there will be a well worn tread from the PCTers. Have fun!!
+Ape Man Bears crap in the woods and they make you bag your crap and take it out? I don't get that!
Billy Barton Look at it this way. If 200 bears were crapping in the same place every night you'd end up with a heck of a lot of bear crap. Bears spread out but people don't. There are at least that many people crapping in the Whitney zone every night. It was getting hard to find a rock with out human poop under it and who knows what was washing into the streams and lakes. That is the one area I'm really diligent about filtering my water. It's not that hard to carry out your poop. Just shit in the bag and hide it in the bottom of your friends pack! Now the marmot poop in Crabtree Meadows is another story.
Funny! Ok, I get that! I wouldn't go cheap on the crap container. Are there deposit boxes along the trail to "dump" those?
Billy Barton They should give you one when when you pick up your permit. They are called WAG bags. You can be fined if you don't have one with you while in the Whitney zone. It's basically a couple of plastic bags and some kitty litter. No deposit boxes along the trail. You have to carry it out. There is a sit down toilet in Crabtree meadows so go there before entering the Whitney zone and hold it the rest of the way if you don't want to carry a bag. There is usually a tupperware container of empty WAG bags at the creek crossing by the Crabtree ranger station. It makes a nice souvenir.
Thanks for the video and all this advices they gonna help me.
Can you please tell me what is the best airport to go: Fresno or Reno because of the transportation to go to Happy isles or Lone Pine and how to get there.
Thanks once again. Good trails and Happy New Year
I used to spend the entire summers in the John Muir Trail area, and nearby. My standard food was powdered potatoes, dried onions, a little oil, and dried sheet beef from a Mexican tortilleria, mixed to make hash. My poncho doubled as a tarp, and I didn't bother with a tent. I slept between two large pines about 6 to 8 feet apart, because there was always a raised mound of needles between them, and water ran down the branches away from the trunks. I slept well off the trail. Like Ape Man, a folding pocket knife has always met all my needs.
Each year, with more experience, I walked fewer miles each day, and made more side trips, and off the trails trips. I find that if I just sit silently in one spot, after about 10 minutes the wildlife reappears, and I see the changing light, and the subtle beauties of the area.
Another suggestion. Find out where the rangers dump the bad bears they trap in the parks, and definitely avoid that area. They used to use the Kern river valley, and I once met three guys with no food and everything they had in shreds, coming out of there. The met all the bad bears.
tom jackson My backpacking setup was much more spartan in my youth and I didn't use a tent until I was 30. A salami, a bag of rolls and a fishing pole would keep me in the backcountry for a week. As I get older and can afford good gear I have enjoyed being more comfortable without the weight.
The use of bear canisters has vastly improved the bear problems in the Sierra and most bears no longer associate people with food. I have backpacked in some of the most bear infested areas of the Sierra the last few years and rarely see bears anymore. Yosemite used to dump the bad valley bears in Hetch Hetchy area and we would wage nightly wars with the bears to protect our food. It's not like that anymore.
Good point on getting off the trail. Leave any Sierra trail and you can find solitude. I enjoy some secret off trail areas as much as possible. The JMT seems overcrowded to me because I'm used to going to places with very few people.
Ape Man I'm retired now, and have nice gear. I too like the comfort of top notch equipment. But I had more fun as a kid, with a $20 Kmart pack and worn out redwing work boots.
excellent video very informative, thank you
I have a permit to start June 21. So, I have been watching a lot of videos. This one is easily the most useful and informative. I have watched it twice and will probably watch it again before I leave. Thank you very much for all of the information and suggestions.
john squires Hey John. Glad you found it useful. Now go out and have fun! Don't worry too much about making all your miles early on or plan too much. Just go with the flow. Some days you may be tired and not get in all your miles and some days you will feel great and hike further. Later in the trip you will get your legs and be able to crank out big days if you need to. Bring your Deet or a headnet. There will be skeeters in late June. Try to camp in windy areas on ridges if the bugs start to drive you insane.
Ape Man I didn't follow your advice about making a lot of miles early on and finished the trail on June 27. I did follow much of the rest of your advice and it was very helpful. You were right on about the skeeters and they were the one negative to an otherwise great experience.
john squires You did the whole trail in 7 days? Congrats on completing the trail! The scary thing is the mosquitoes can actually be worse in a normal precipitation year. Hope you had protection. When the wildflowers are out so are the skeeters so I hope you got to enjoy the flowers. My favorite flowers in all the Sierra are the Polemoniums (Sky Pilot) which generally only grow above 10k. Forester and Whitney have lots of them.
Ape Man 6 days, 14 hours, not bad for a 60 year old. Yes, there were a lot of flowers and I saw a lot of Polemoniums. Had a great time.
john squires Nice going John. That would be very impressive for a 20 year old! 60 is the new 30....for you anyway. My worn out joints decide for me when it's time to quit for the day and 20 miles is about my max.
Great video ! Can't wait to hit the trail myself. Next year if my left knee agrees!
+Larry Kaminski Larry I have really bad knees and am already a candidate for a knee replacement but I plan on postponing it a couple more years. I find my knees feel really good on long hikes. They actually hurt all the time at home. They seem to lube themselves with all the use on backpacking trips. Just get some good compression over the counter braces and a good anti inflammatory and go for it. Hiking poles are a must as well. I also have done the syndvisc and orthovisc injections and they help me for 6 months or so. I already have my insurance approval for another round that I will get in a month or so to get me going for the spring. They don't work for everyone.. They are pricey but my insurance covers it. Hope you get out there.
yeah kind of figured on the planning. I'm clueless to where the places you mentioned for restock. Do they even have address and how can I get them? Does that book you suggest have the address so I can preplanned shipping. I think thats a great idea be so much less money. I was planning on spending a night in a lodge somewhere down the road.I Know about mount Whitney Portal but my question is after we get to Lone Pine. Is there a bus station that we can hop on to get to La, Fullerton,or Pomona . I know I can take the Yart system to Yosemite unless your talking about hiking the opposite direction. I just need to know how I can get back home from there. I will get that book now hope Barnes and nobles has it.
hey thanks for all this info, it really helped me. i just have couple of questions. I live in LA and i wan to know how long will it take to finish this trail, going and and coming back? will be a place on my path to resupply for food? and how much will this camping cost if i want to but everything(equipment and food )? and for ur info im going to do this trail with my two other friends and we are 2 years old and out highest hike has been Mt. Boldy.
Great vid - heading out there in late August.
I agree with you on those Sawyer pouches - not very durable, lol. I have had great success with the Platypus 1L Plus Bottle instead...so far so good.
cyclety68 Late August is the best time to go in my opinion. Have a great trip.
Being dog walker, my tip for handling TP / wipes is to use a doggie bag. Just turn it inside out over your hand to grab what you've used and then pull it back over, squish out air and tie off, and put in your baggie. I fold them in half 3 times to make little squares to carry. They take up no space this way.
If it works for dog poop then why not people poop. Great tip David. As you know I have unlimited access to doggie bags and I know from experience that they are very light.
Super helpful. Thank you.
Glad to see someone finally post a really informative video on tips and advice for the JMT that you can ACTUALLY use! lol
I found myself pausing the video and Google-ing some of the stuff you mentioned in it. This hike is definitely on my "to-do" list.
When would you say is a good time to hike it where there are moderate temps, few mosquitos, and less people?
fyrman4 Thanks! It's impossible to cover everything. There is a lot of planning to do the JMT. Use has doubled over the last few years. The hardest thing is to get the permit. Go to the Yosemite NPS page for the process. You have to put your request in EXACTLY 6 months in advance to get a reservation. In a normal snow year mid July through September are the best times. Best weather is early September and the crowds start diminishing but it gets a little colder. Late August is probably the best time to start. By then the mosquitos are gone. Early season is beautiful with the snow and the wildflowers but Sierra mosquitos are really bad and there are 2 water crossings that can be difficult early season. Those are Bear and Evolution creeks. If you are solo or in a small group you can start at Tuolumne Meadows and try for a walkup permit if you can't get a reservation. You can always do a section hike and enjoy a segment of the trail and the surrounding areas. Start planning!
Thanks for the tips.
Very useful info!
Great video, I have a question about Mt Whitney. If you leave from guitar lake is there a place you can leave your pack if you want to exit the same day after the descent down the mountain. I don't want to carry my pack 30-pound pack up to 14,000ft if possible.
As soon as you reach the junction where the left fork goes to the top of Whitney and the right fork goes to trail crest and Whitney Portal, the majority of people leave their packs here. Grab some water, your wag bag and snacks and head for the summit. Be sure to have your food secured in the pack you leave behind.
Great video. Very helpful. My husband and I are hoping to do the full Jmt once he retires but for now we are planning on doing section hikes. This August we plan to hike from Agnew Meadow to Tuolumne Meadows. I have a question about the TP subject. This may seem like a silly question but where do you stow the ziplock bag with the used TP and wipes at night? We had the Yosemite rangers advising us to of course stow all scented items in our canister including sunscreen, insect repellent and even first aide supplies like ointments and wipes. So could the used wipes attract bears? I don't like the thought of stowing it in the canister and I would prefer not to have a bear decided to tear through my pack looking for something he smells.
Ron Anders Not a silly question at all. Just make sure to get unscented wipes and tp. I just store mine in the outside flap of my pack. I always leave all my pack flaps open at night so mice or squirrels don't chew through my pack while exploring. You can try these if you are worried.www.amazon.com/dp/B0012RK0M8/?tag=whois03-20
I have used them for smellables when my canister is overflowing. Do not store these or other smellables in a tent ever. I usually stash the bag in a tree branch. The odor bags will still pick up smell from your hands when you seal them so keep your hands as clean as possible when handling the bags. Be careful with DEET around plastic-it melts it. I take the bear issue very seriously and it's really important to protect them with proper food storage. Sometimes you have to improvise. You can keep the toothpaste in your canister but deodorant or bug juice you can put in the bag. Bears might smell it and mess with it but most likely they won't be interested and it's not a great reward for them. Get everything in that canister as soon as you can but don't worry about the TP.
In reply to your comment about Reds Meadow being a rip off and busy... My girlfirend and I (hiking N-bound) stopped at reds for a burger and a shower as well as some snacks. We loved it so much that we stayed there all day, did laundry, chatted with other hikers and waited until we were hungry for dinner so we could have another burger haha. We basically hung out and drank beers all day when we originally planned on staying for about two hours and passing through. Well, we wanted to stay at the campground but were flabbergasted by their prices. We just filled our water bottles, bought a few beers to go (cans cause they're crushable) and hiked 10 minutes down the trail and pitched a tent. You don't need to camp at Reds Meadow if you're in the area. It was really nice. We each had a beer in our tent and read our books then went to sleep. I really recommend stopping by. It's quite the paradise when you've been on the trail for so long (well for us n-bound hikers at least, it had been a while!).
+Brandon Davidson I could see Reds Meadow as even more of a paradise for northbound hikers. It was mostly the 20 dollar fee for a crappy campground that I had a problem with. I would have done what you did and camp somewhere else but 1st enjoy the luxuries to be had there. We had one of the 85 dollar cabins which was nice and allowed us to pace our food and beer consumption. It was fun chatting with other hikers and the store was very backpacker friendly. They had such delicacies as plums and bananas and travel size toothpaste and shampoo to hit the showers with. In the old days there used to be a free natural hot spring shower which a lot of us old timers are grumpy about them now being closed. The pay showers they have now are awesome. A tall can of Sierra Nevada Torpedo and a burger was paradise for me too as a southbounder and my daughter was only 1 month away from her 21st so I bought her a beer too. She was still in college so i was pretty sure she had tasted beer before. The resupply stops are part of the whole JMT experience and food cravings and conversations on where to eat at the end of the hike get us through many miles of trail. Where did you eat at the end? We had a beer and fries at the Whitney Portal store but then drove to Bishop where we got a motel and an extra large gourmet pizza a couple hours later.
+Ape Man The cabins seemed nice, we never saw the inside though. Oh my god, those showers were the best $7 I have ever spent. It was totally worth it for five minutes of hot water haha. That was nice of you to buy your daughter a beer. Up here in Canada the drinking age is 18/19 depending on the province so it always sounds weird to me when I hear it being illegal for a 20 year old to drink, but noticing these little differences is bound to happen while traveling to different countries. The general store was awesome especially since our MTR resupply never showed up and we had been living off power bars from the free buckets for the past 8 days. We had a little sandwich and some beers in happy isles (holy cow that place felt like disney land with the crowds after being on the trail) while waiting 5 hours for a bus to take us to lee vining. We got a motel in lee vining and had burgers at a restaurant there then enjoyed the luxury of a soft bed and a television. Oh, and we are very jealous of your beer prices down there. Alcohol is taxed a lot more up here which increases the prices. The next morning we caught a bus back to Reno and then flew back to Canada. Overall, it was a beautiful trip and I would love to go back and hike it s-bound to experience both directions. Also, it would be nice to experience the trail with a little more moisture. It was so dusty with the drought!! Oh, one more thing I would like to mention. I don't travel to the states very often. I've been to a few military bases for training exercises and some vacations while I was younger but this was my first time experiencing the US on my own. I really don't know how you guys got the stereotype of being a "rude" nation but everyone was extremely friendly and hospitable. Even more so if they found out I wasn't from the U.S (i never noticed my accent until i had every hiker ask me where I was from).
Ty for the tips. My buddy and I had questions that you just went over. I do hike but this my first JMT run. Wont be going till next year. I 'm always worried about water and places i get it but I use water pump and the mini.DO need the aquamira tablets though for sure. My first hike i wore boots from Walmart (mistake), never again .My feet were so sore and my toes felt like they were being jabbed into my foot. Always wore wool socks. Same kind of tent, no bear canister. I'm pushing 50 and most people I know think me hiking is for younger men. I dont ultralight pack never have. I carry 40-50 lbs on most my hikes. I buy good gear so weight isn't a problem for me. Maybe pushing 50 but I'm not dead. thanks again for the video
Rey Lindsey Remember there are stretches of trail where you will have to carry 8-10 days worth of food which is a lot of weight. If you can lose a few pounds on your other gear it will make your trip more enjoyable. You are a young man with many years of hiking ahead of you if you haven't even turned 50 yet.
Do you know what stretch that is or what is by. We were planning a very precise budget for the hike. Planning our meals accordingly. I was planning going to pack 2 weeks work of food just on myself, I guess we can carry more If I save 10 # off .Going on a shoe string budget of 800 a piece.We both live in southern California.Getting there isnt an issue getting back and the expense is. We dont really know if we can do it 30 day top maybe a 1 month and a half. We were thinking 2 months. We didn't want to hurry the trip.So Im guessing 400 a month. I dont know the prices in these stores either.I know when I go hiking I dont buy anything cause I already bought. They're expensive as hell in them stores and most dont have what you need anyhow. If you can maybe point me in the right direction on food buy so when restock that would be helpful.thanks for you reply too.
Rey Lindsey OK Wolverine you have LOTS of planning to do. You don't have to buy any food along the way. You ship your food to the resupply points. Those are Toulumne Meadows Post office, Reds Meadow, Vermillion Valley Resort and Muir Trail Ranch. Some people take the shuttle out of Reds Meadow/Devils Postpile and spend a night in Mammoth and buy food there. Others hike out over Kearsarge Pass and hitchhike to Independence to get food but selection is slim there. Our whole trip for the 2 of us cost us less than a 1000 dollars. That was including the luxury of a night of lodging and getting fed at MTR at 150 each and a night in a cabin at Reds Meadow for 85.00. We also stayed at reasonable motels the night before and after our trip in Lone Pine and Bishop. You can take a bus from LA to Lone Pine and then use ESTA and YARTS to get to each end of the trail so you can save a lot of money by not driving. Camp instead of cabins and motels. Hitchhiking is pretty easy on the east side of the Sierra. The longest stretch with no resupply point is from MTR to Whitney Portal which is 110 miles. 30 days is a very long time to do this trail and you would have to carry a LOT of food do it in that time. I would love to do it in 4 weeks and enjoy some areas but I can't get off work that long. You can't leave the trail for more than 1 night and reenter so not sure your 2 month plan is feasible. The section I would spend the most time in if I could is the stretch between MTR and Whitney. Lot's of great side trips and it is all spectacular. Do you guys fish? You could supplement your food with fish if you are a capable fisherman. Other ways to get food out there is pay a packer which is really expensive or have a friend meet you. Kearsarge Pass is a popular rendezvous point for this as it is a 5 mile hike in from the trailhead at Onion Valley. You do know that the trail has 50,000 feet of elevation gain and loss and 10 major passes and lots of elevation over 10,000 feet. If you are not used to hiking at high elevations with lots of climbing and descending then you will be miserable hiking with 50 pound packs. 25% of people do not finish the trail because they are unprepared for how hard it is or they are inexperienced. It's not that hard but it is very physically and mentally demanding and there is a certain amount of suffering that you will experience. Buy Elizabeth Wenks book on the JMT. It will help you plan your trip and increase your chance of finishing it and enjoying yourselves.
Thx...I should be at mtr by sept 17....cutting it close but I spoke to the folks there, they said will be around a week or so beyond if was delayed. As far as temps go mid sept u think marmot helium will be sufficient with light weight base layer? Im trying to keep my pack wt light as the tight schedule..15 days...hoping to be -30 lbs out of mtr with 7 days of food.thx again
Richard Moran Yes I would even sleep on Whitney in my Helium but I sleep warm. If it gets really cold put all your clothes on and a beanie. Keep your stove nearby if you wake up at 2am shivering for a warm drink. Now if you are using a tarp, windy cold nights could be really cold and campsite selection is important. September is my favorite month in the Sierra. No bugs and fewer people and reliable weather with very few thunderstorms (USUALLY). You have a chance of getting up to a foot of snow in late September if a cold front rolls through so pay close attention to the weather. You could have to stay put for a day or 2 but probably not. Know the bale outs. If trail crest became impassible you could go out via cottonwood pass etc. It is no time to be playing around with ultralight equipment unless you know what you are doing. Get a 800 fill down jacket which compresses to nothing and will weigh less than a pound. In 2013 in early September my daughter and I were hanging out in French Canyon which is near the MTR portion of the JMT. It was 14 -25 degrees at night but the days were nice and we saw 0 people the middle 3 days of our trip. Perfect! We were toasty at night and carried slightly warmer clothes than a midsummer trip. Long trips require sleep and comfort so don't skimp on your sleep system. Of course I'm 56 and suffered mightily through some below 0 nights in my youth and survived and had fun. I can afford not to now.
I hoped to do the trail someday but now that I know there are so many people there I don't want to do it... Ape Man, excellent video and information!!!
That's why the quotas are there to preserve a wilderness experience. The crowds at the start are not indicative of the whole trail. If you go after labor day it is not unusual to see less than 10 people a day in the remote sections of the trail. It is possible to camp alone everyday with very little effort except maybe carrying extra water for that choice dry camp with a view up high. I remember once hiking a 20 mile stretch from Vidette meadow to Guitar Lake and seeing only a mule resupply train on forester pass. That was 2007 before all these damn hiking movies came out.
Thanks for the info
enjoy you and your videos. equipment ? will a Asolo Sylva 0' -32' sleeping bag be warm enough for female in August at Mt. Whitney?
Don't know much about this bag. A quality bag will have temperature ratings for men and women and this one does not differentiate sex. That's a red flag. Women sleep much colder than men. A bag that is comfortable to a man at 32 degrees will be cold to a woman at the same temperature. Are you just doing Whitney as a 2-3 day trip or the whole JMT? For a short trip you could tough it out but for a longer trip I would look for a bag rated in the 20 degree range for women. The average lows at 10k in the Sierra in August are the mid 30's but it is not unusual to have few days in the 20's.
Great info, especially about the food/brands. On the batteries, I'd add, try to find a way to buy ones you think are fresh, or at least not the cheapest brand/price. The Steripen ones are expensive, and I bought cheap ones off Ebay once for a short trip, and they were DOA (didn't test beforehand). I did have iodine for backup, but I was a little mad at myself the whole trip about those cheapo batteries.
+Timothy Roper Been there done that. Steripens are notorious for gobbling up batteries and I would only use lithium ion batteries in those. They don't like cold weather either. I only use my steripen on trips of 5 days or less. I love it but it has failed on longer trips and I don't like carrying lots of batteries. I'm looking at the platypus gravity filter as my new filter for group trips and probably stick with my cheap sawyer squeeze for long solo - 2 person trips with backup tablets or iodine of course. Thanks for the input!
Just watched this video again to reminisce about my trip. You're bang on when talking about clothing. To those reading this, say NO to cotton! Polypro is definitely good but merino wool is another fiber to consider. All of my shirts were merino wool. They dry quick and don't stink like polypro does. Mine were icebreaker shirts but most brands have merino wool shirts nowadays. They're damn expensive though.
+Brandon Davidson Also, bring a good book. I never read at home but my favorite part of the day was unwinding after a long day of hiking and crawling in to my sleeping bag to read my book. I could only ever read for 30-45 minutes because i was exhausted but it was great to go in to this other world and give me something new to think about (you run out of things to think and talk about after a few weeks). If you're concerned about the weight, tear the pages you've read out of the book and burn them.
+Brandon Davidson Great input. Unwinding at the end of the day is nice. Some people tear books in half and send the 2nd half ahead to their resupply. I listen to a little music when I go to bed. Takes my muscles a while to cool down before I can go to sleep. The polypro does stink but it's bomb proof. I've been wearing the same smelly shirts for well over 5 years. I buy the REI brand ones when they go on the outlet clearance site for around 15 bucks. I'm just too cheap to spend 50 bucks on a t-shirt. Icebreakers are really nice and cost a fortune like you said and I destroy those too fast. They started making an icebreaker model that is a wool / poly blend to make it stronger so I might try that. They make a lot of expensive shirts that have stink soaking materials infused in them like coconut fibers. Again expensive. I just live with the stink. Knocks me out at night so I sleep better and no one wants to be around me so I have a better wilderness experience.
+Ape Man Yes merino wool's major draw back is their durability. It's a shame you spend so much on a shirt only to have it covered for a year by warranty. As far as polypro being durable you're completely right. I have several military issued polypro baselayers that are 7 years old and still look great. They would be full of holes if they were merino. The poly/merino blend you're talking about is their "corespun" technology. They spin merino wool around a poly fibre to give it the strength of poly but still have merino against your skin. I have one of these and yes it's a little stronger but it's still frail. If you know what you like stick to polypro.
I dumped the Polypro since as always it causes a person to sweat even while in a bag or with a jacket on, Polypro SUCKS.
Merino is a gift from God. But too warm for summer. Only expensive synthetic materials.
Ape Man, do you remember seeing string cheese or any type of cheeses in the resupply locations? I am having cheese for some of my lunches, but am worried about it staying ok in resupplies especially the MTR resupply. Did you pack any cheeses or see any in the resupply locations along the JMT, specifically Reds or MTR?
Love my cheese. I use the individually packed cheddar cheese by Tilamook at the start of my hikes. Resupply is limited to those slim jim type meat and cheese stick combos. I've sent those to MTR and they were fine. Mozzarella string cheese may be ok - it's the lowest in moisture standard cheese. The hard cheeses from the deli will work. Ship 'em and see what they look like when you pick them up. Reds may have some in the store - they had fresh fruit which was nice but they are sporadic in what they stock.
The best, most useful, informational video on hiking the John Muir Trail or any 200+ mile through hike. I second the dehydrated refried beans. I even use them at home now. I think they taste better than canned. I get handfuls of taco sauce packets and use a couple per burrito to spice them up a bit. I also found that a couple of tbsp. of olive oil mixed in with the beans improves the flavor a bit while increasing the fat and calorie content.
I typically use peanut M&Ms for my chocolate fix as they won't melt. While I like Snickers, I'm afraid of what condition they will be in after spending a couple of weeks in the mail and at MTR. Is that something to worry about, or should I go ahead and toss a few in my MTR resupply package?
Michael Burgess I also go with peanut M&Ms. I shipped 20 Snickers in my bucket at MTR and they were fine. Put them in the middle. We eat them early am or after dinner when it's cooler. They stay surprisingly hard if you bury them in your pack. They are very high in calories / oz so are ideal. Paydays are pretty good if you are worried about melting but we haven't had any problems for years. If you have ever watched the movie Mile...Mile and a Half there is a scene at Rae lakes where they are celebrating over some Snickers in their tent. I'm the guy "they may have murdered" to obtain them. It's on Net Flix if you haven't seen it. Awesome footage of the JMT! Chocolate pudding is another fun lightweight treat if you have a sweet tooth like I do.
Remember you will be hungrier on the 2nd half of your trip so you'll devour anything - so dense high calorie foods don't even have to be that tasty - you'll eat anything but why not have some stuff you like too!
Ape Man I hadn't thought about instant pudding. I haven't eaten it since I was a kid. Can you just substitute Nido and water for the milk that you would normally use to make pudding? I could see making my own instant pudding mix with the Nido already added then just add water on the trail. Have you ever added protein powder to up the calories and protein content? I might give that a run through as well during one of my shake down hikes before I hit the JMT in about 7 weeks.
Thanks
Michael Burgess Yup Nido works great - pre mix the milk before adding the instant pudding. Chocolate flavored protein powder sounds like a great idea. I will have to try that. I don't see why it wouldn't work. A good way to get food and gear tips is to chat up the PCTers when you meet them. We met an old timer last year that lived almost exclusively on a mix of idahoan mashed potatoes and a powdered soup mix. He didn't even carry a stove. He just had a big plastic bag of this mixed up and added cold water when he got hungry. He was heading into MTR that day and was looking forward to raiding the hiker barrels but he had hiked from Horseshoe meadows to MTR on this concoction.
I'm hoping that someone does a step by step video of Flights to the area, hotel, transportation to the site at both ends and best places to camp. It's always good to get the most updated info from someone who just hiked it.
Just hit me up in Fresno CA and I will give you a ride to Yosemite valley.
Great tips and thanks for posting. I have a permit for July 29 out of glacier point but can't exit over Donahue pass so will connect with JMT at the pass or past it? Usually I am totally unprepared for these types of hikes and just show up, have no schedule and hike the trail ( worked for a section hike 600 miles on the AT). Love tuna and potatoes, Knorrs, MM and raisins, TJoes bars and instant coffee also love Tang ( yup the weight is bad). In one of your reply's you mentioned a walk up permit for a section , do they have those for a section to Donahue pass? If so, I could then use the other BC pass from glacier point for the rest of the trail.
ochams2 Well I assume you have Whitney Portal as your exit point on the permit you already have. Once you start from Glacier Point you technically can't leave the trail for more than 1 day so it's a gray area. The problem with the walk up permit over Donahue is the time it takes to try and get it. You line up at 3-4 am at the wilderness permit station to get on a list and then at 11 am they issue the walk up permits to the 1st ten people in line for a start date the next day. The 1st guy in line could be getting a permit for a group of 10 and you would not get one so it's a crap shoot. If you are solo on a weekday you have a better chance. I have succeeded at this but it was in 2009 before the JMT use exploded after 2011. You will get checked going up Lyell towards Donahue so don't do it without the proper permit. If you have time you can get the permit before your start date. If you get it leave most of your stuff in a bear locker in the permit parking lot. Hitch to the Yosemite Valley backpacker camp and get up really early and day hike from happy isles back to the permit office. It's a LONG hike with around 6k of elevation gain and something like 23 miles. The other option is to just use the permit you have and use Isberg pass and link back up with the JMT at Devils Post Pile. You will miss 1000 island lake and the crowds around it. The southern half of the JMT is the most spectacular so you will still get the best of the trail. In my opinion Glacier Point is one of the most beautiful vistas in the world so you will start off your trip with a bang. Donahue is beautiful but the hike up to Toulumne meadows is not that great, it's crowded and you really aren't missing that much plus a lot of it was burned by the meadow fire last year.
ochams2 I just read my post and I realized I didn't mention which wilderness permit station to line up at. The Yosemite Valley wilderness office no longer issues JMT walk up permits. I was talking about the Toulumne meadows wilderness permit station. They issue 10 walkups a day for the following day departure. You could get lucky and get 1 for the same day if someone didn't show up for their reservation. That's why they wait until 11am. Good luck and have fun. It's awesome!
Like the videos but I'd suggest breaking them up into short segments so we can choose which topics we are interested in. Anyway great work and thanks for the tips!
I'm still figuring this you tube stuff out. I will take your advice on future videos. This long rambling video proved more popular than I expected and was my first attempt at giving trail tips.
Great video! How much hiking to you recommend doing before the JMT? I'm thinking of doing it in the next few years. I'm doing about 10 miles a hike easily in the bay area elevation without a pack. Any good trips you recommend that are less crowded than the JMT?
David Guard You need to have some experience to take on a multi day hike like the JMT and you need to be able to hike about 10 miles a day with a pack at elevation. Get out and do some weekend overnighters. I grew up in the Bay Area. Good Bay Area spots for backpacking are Big Basin, Castle Rock and Point Reyes. I did 2 backpacking trips a few weeks before my 2014 JMT just to get my hiking legs. You can do the same with day hikes or climbing the stairs of your building. Less crowded trails are everywhere. Closest Sierra area to you that is uncrowded is the Emigrant Wilderness. I love the east side of the Sierra trailheads off hwy 395 for their high elevation starts and access to spectacular wilderness but it's a 4-5 hour drive for you. I'm backpacking in Desolation Wilderness this weekend which isn't too far from you but can be crowded. It's 1 1/2 hours from my house so I go there a lot and it's my training area for longer hikes. I day hike a lot of peaks in the area. Around the Bay Area you could do Diablo, Tamalpais, Fremont, Skyline to the Sea Trail, Henry Coe and our newest National Park - the Pinnacles.
Great video!! I would love to do this trail but would need to break it up into 2 sections. Would this be possible? Where is the halfway point? Can you get off the trail and back to civilization?
Most parts of the trail are no further than a 2-3 day hike back to a trailhead where you could hitch hike back to civilization. The halfway point is around Muir Trail Ranch. You could break it up into several sections of a week at a time. Transportation and permits are the logistics you have to figure out. The east side trailheads have better transportation options so are better options for tying 2 trailheads together for a section hike.
Apeman, do you have suggestions on what to do with travel clothing and stuff you wouldn't be taking on the trail with you? Can you leave it at hotels or is there some kind of storage area that it can be kept in. I am thinking of just a small bag with travel clothes and or something like that. Would you have any interest in making a video on the travel aspect of arriving in mammoth lakes, staying at a hotel, picking up fuel canisters, and then shuttling around to and from Yosemite? Also, you could include details of when you finish Whitney, what is the primary way to get back to mammoth lakes?
You can mail your stuff to a hotel from any post office. Most hotels will hold a package for you if you stay there. From Whitney Portal just hold out your thumb and I promise you will get a ride to Lone Pine within 5 minutes. I was at nearby Onion Valley this weekend and gave some PCTers a ride to Independence and Lone Pine. Other hikers always pick up backpackers. Check the bus schedule for ESTA = Eastern Sierra Transit Authority. Once in Lone Pine grab a room at the Dow Villa or the Whitney Hostel right next door. Only 1 bus comes a day. It picks up at the McDonalds across the street from the Dow Villa at 6:15 am and will have you in Mammoth at about 10am. To get around in Mammoth you can use the free shuttles and you can link up with YARTS to get to Yosemite. Fuel canisters are available in lone Pine, Mammoth, Tuolumne Meadows store and Yosemite Valley. Let me know if you have any other questions.
Thank you so much for your detailed response. You really have been so helpful. Starting my thru hike July 16th this year.
I'm pretty sure that if you dry out your Baby Wipes, all of the alcohol will evaporate rather quickly, and all you'll have left is the fragrance. The resulting alcohol-free Baby Wipe won't do anything to sterilize your hands.
I've been practicing Mike Clelland's procedures for pooping without TP in the backcountry. You get used to it pretty quickly and it's so nice to not pack anything out.
Edgar Anolin Hey Edgar - Thanks for the input. A lot of PCTers use the no TP method but you have to use your hand to clean yourself and then you have to use soap to wash your 1 dirty hand. If you have to use soap in the backcountry it should be at least 200 feet from a water source. I bring a very small amount of concentrated soap for emergencies but never use it because I feel it harms the environment. I don't think enough people use soap responsibly which is why I suggest baby wipes. I consider Mike's method a more advanced technique and my suggestion with wipes is meant for inexperienced hikers. Mike also condones wiping your butt on stones and sticks which is not cool in my book. It is so easy to just carry out a little TP and way nicer to those that have to pass through the area where you just smeared poop on the stones. I will use Mike's technique when I'm traveling well off trail. The JMT is just too heavily used in my opinion for that.
You do have a valid point on the baby wipes though. Not all of them rely solely on alcohol for killing germs so yeah it's important for people to check the ingredients or not let them totally dry out. Thanks for the heads up. I don't let mine dry out completely and the drying out thing is really only meant for those who are fanatics about weight. Happy trails!
Great Video, thanks for the information. My Army buddy and I are planning on a 2018 Summer hike.
Is a Whitney portal permit worth trying to get or are there better options? We are also driving out from Colorado, do you have any recommendations on best place to leave our vehicle? Appreciate any assistance.
A Whitney Portal start would be brutal with a heavy load of food and the competition for permits is high but if interested google the whitney permit lottery for more info. I don't find that a desirable option and you will hit high tough elevation too early in your trip. Watch my 2017 permit video for other permit options. Most people start from Happy Isles or Tuolumne meadows in Yosemite. The northbound option starting at horseshoe meadows is the easiest permit to get and adds a couple of bonus days. You hike 2 days to Crabtree meadows and set up a base camp. Then you day hike Whitney from the backside and then back to your camp and continue northbound on the JMT.
Lot's of places to leave a vehicle depending where you start or end. I always recommend a stay in the Dow Villa motel in Lone Pine and they will let you leave your car in their overflow lot. Tuolumne Meadows and the happy isles trailheads both have free longterm parking. Check out YARTS and ESTA for good transportation options between the trailheads at either end of the JMT. I have used them and have also hitch hiked.
It all depends on which permit you score. Hit me up when your trip approaches. Remember to request your permits 6 months before your start date.
Ape Man Thanks so much for the reply, we definitely appreciate the information. I watched your 2016/2017 last night as well and they were both a big help.
I'll be reaching out to update you once we get our permit.
We are hoping to get a permit to hike the JMT in 2016. Thanks for this super helpful video!! Looks like you & your daughter had a great time! I'm curious what you used to take your video & pictures with?
Mark Jaynes We used a Sony Nex3n for all but a few I-phone pictures. It has a very wide angle lens that makes it easy to capture great images. I am a novice photographer and we set it on auto mode and the JMT was almost the 1st time I used it. It's a mirrorless camera and fairly compact and has great battery life. We used 1 battery with 1 recharge at MTR for the entire trip. We brought 2 extra batteries that we never used. I much prefer it to a go pro because I don't like the fish eye image although durability of a go pro is better. I wore the camera around my neck for most of the trip.
Sweet! Thank you kindly for sharing your wisdom! Very useful stuff.
Few questions if you get a chance.
I'll be hiking with someone else. Should we each carry a bear vault? When you hiked JMT with your daughter, did you both carry a bear vault, or was one big enough for both of yous guys?
Same subject...If we choose to try a day hike at some point along the trail and leave behind a base camp, should the bear vault be carried along with us or stashed somewhere?
More bears! Ahhh!!!...Would you recommend carrying bear spray?
Any advice is always much appreciated! Thanks!
N Hensley You will only need one Bear Vault 500 for both of you between MTR and Yosemite Valley assuming you resupply at Reds Meadow. You can ship a full one to MTR and pick it up there if you are going southbound. You will need 2 between MTR and Whitney Portal and it will still be hard to fit all your food depending how many days of food you have. You have to be creative to fit 8 days of food for 1 in a BV500. That's why food selection is more important on that long stretch. Remember that you can carry your lunch and dinner for that day outside your bear canister. You also need all your smellables to fit - toothpaste, lip balm, sunscreen etc. and your trash.
Sierra bears are friendly and you will be lucky to see one. DO NOT bring bear spray - that is for grizzlies and dead weight on the JMT. When you do a day hike leave everything set up and leave your bear canisters outside of the tent. A bear will sometimes kick them around so don't leave them next to a cliff or river. Your bigger worry is mice and marmots. I like to leave my pack flap open so critters can check it out without biting holes in it. Most likely bear areas are LYV, Half Dome Sunrise junction, Lyell Canyon, 1000 Island Lake, Rae Lakes and Lower Vidette meadow. They are more active at night. I love bears and feel lucky when I see one. The canisters are working and Sierra Bears don't associate hikers with food as much as they used to in the old days. I saw bears almost daily in those days but last year we saw 0 bears but heard of a few encounters from other hikers. Enjoy your trip and don't worry about the bears.
You’re awesome
Thanks for the video. I'll be heading out June 26. Quick question regarding pooping... did you carry out the poop and the baby wipes or just the baby wipes? Silly question but I want to do the right thing out there.
I'm planning on leaving June 20th of this year! Haven't picked a exact date yet with my hiking bud, but I still have time until the 24 weeks before for the permit
This is a trip you have to plan for. Check out my JMT permit video. They may change the process soon to an online lottery type but it looks like the current process will be in place 1 more year. 90% of permits were denied this year due to high demand so be flexible and look for alternative ways to get on the trail. It's worth the permit hassle and logistics. Remember the northbound option starting from Cottonwood as a fall back and an easier permit to obtain.
I plan on hiking the JMT next September into Oct, I'm looking for any info on how to prepare ... what gear do I need during what sections of the trail in order to conserve weight, do I need to send food and gear ahead to resupply places or can I get necessary stuff there. What weather should I expect? Thanks i enjoyed the videos
+Steven Feyers That's a great time. Weather is usually good, no bugs and few people. You could get some snow in October so need clothes and a 15 degree down bag and a tent in case you have to weather a storm. The problem is that MTR closes about the 3rd week of September so you really need to be there before they close because it's 120 miles to the end of the trail with no more resupplies unless you hike out. Vermillion Valley Resort will probably be open later but you will have too far to go without another resupply. If you have a car you can drop of some food in a couple places so let me know and I will give you some options. The usual place to get the last resupply is to hike out over Kearsarge Pass to the Onion Valley trailhead. Google the Mt Williamson resort for info on that option. The usual resupply points are Toulumne Meadows store/post office, Reds Meadow, MTR and VVR. You can ship food to all those places and I take advantage of as many as I can so I can carry less weight. You could get by buying food at the Toulumne Meadows store and reds Meadow but the selection is just ok. From MTR on you would need to send a resupply because the distance and space limitations of your pack make it necessary to send dense calorie rich foods. You can't just do a bunch of freeze dried stuff like you can do in the first half cause it just won't fit.
+Ape Man thanks for your reply. Great information. I think I have what I need. keep treking
I'll be doing the JMT northbound starting July 28th this summer. I'm an avid winter camper from Canada so cold doesn't bother me but what kind of low temperatures should i expect on the JMT? I'm curious what kind of sleeping bag I should bring with me. Thanks!
Brandon Davidson You are probably a warm sleeper like me. It can get below freezing and snow any day on the JMT but it's not likely. Normal lows at 10k in your timeframe will be in the low 30's. I would say it's more important to stay dry and be able to set up camp and get warm if you don't. A good quality 20 degree down bag will work great. I use a 15 degree Marmot Helium and love it but it's PRICEY but I never get cold. Being a winter camper you know the importance of a good insulating pad. You can go with a lighter sleeping bag and just wear all your clothes and a beanie on the few really cold nights. Have a great trip!
Ape Man Yes, I do sleep rather warm. There's nothing worse than having too warm of a sleeping bag and being uncomfortable inside your tent. It looks like I'll need to bring a warmer sleeping bag than i anticipated though. Thanks for the info!
Brandon Davidson Well you are using a tent rather than a tarp so that adds a couple degrees and keeps the wind off you. You could use a liner to add a few more. August most likely won't be that cold and you could easily get by with a 30 degree bag and you might be cold a few nights. I wouldn't plan on sleeping on Whitney but you are Canadian so you are probably used to it eh. We hiked a lot last summer with 4 fit people from Ontario and we had 1 night we were cold and they said they were too. We were both in the tent cabins in MTR and used sheets and blankets instead of our bags. I backpacked and shivered for years with cheap bags in the Sierra and love never being cold now. A through hike like the JMT is different than a 3-4 day one. You need to be comfortable and sleep so your body can rest and recover for the next day. In August your biggest worry is afternoon thunderstorms and getting over the passes in the mornings.
wow you telling me I got to travel there to mail these item to each section or city and than travel back home. Its kind of silly to do all that when you on the trail. I just wanna restock and move on. I guess Im not getting the mailing part. I have to travel from fullerton, go to Tolumne meadows than Reads meadows vermillion valley resort and Mrt than come back too fullerton ca in 2 days. I thought you can mail these item at once and the hold them for an x amount of time. Wow I got a lot to learn I guess lol
Rey Lindsey What part of mailing are you not understanding? You mail food resupplies from your home in Fullerton a couple weeks before you leave for the start of your trip. Get the book. It will answer all your questions. I didn't use any books and learned all I needed from internet searches but I have been hiking the Sierra for 40 years. As far as transportation you can take a Metrolink train from LA to Lancaster and then catch the ESTA bus to Lone Pine. I think the hostel is 20 dollars. The ESTA bus to Mammoth, Toulumne and Yosemite Valley leaves from the McDonalds at 6:30 am. You transfer to the Yarts bus in Mammoth or Lee Vining.. Google it. Your biggest worry is scoring a permit. You need to start applying one exactly 6 months before your start date. They are hard to get now as the trail has become very popular. Check the NPS website on wilderness permits. Good luck. It's seems daunting but it's worth it. I don't like planning so much for a backpacking trip but it's necessary for a 30 day trip.
Ape Man are there any free camp grounds on the JMT? don't have alot of money. Cant find pricing anywhere online this whole time i thought it was free to camp the JMT.
In the Sierra all backcountry camping is dispersed and free. The walkup wilderness permits are free as well. If you choose to stay in one of the backpacking campgrounds before or after your trip those are $5. Those are not in the backcountry. If you already have your gear all you need is food and to get to the trailhead. Still on the cheap the JMT is at minimum a few hundred dollars. It's mostly food and resupplies but that can be done cheaply and supplemented from the free hiker boxes that you can find at Reds Meadow, Muir Trail Ranch and Vermilion Valley Ranch. The main money temptation is beer and food in the front country.
thanks!! Ape Man you have been vary helpful..
Whoa it's Ted Danson haha. Thanks for the video.
I am late planning my hike and don't think I will get a reservation for June. What I'm wondering is how the "day of" permits work. Do I get there early as heck and hope I'm first in line? I'm traveling from Florida, what if I don't get the permit? What happens if I just take off on the trail with no permit? (Sorry if this is sacrilege for you)
+Rachel Mailliard I'm only planning on hiking 7 days and would love suggestions for which portion of the trail to spend my time on, in terms of ease of access as well as best scenic spots.
+Rachel Mailliard Just a heads up that June will involve a lot of snow travel in a normal snow year and many of the high passes will be a little treacherous. You will need excellent navigation skills as many portions of the trail will be buried in snow. The last 3 years of drought have made the trail accessible in June but this year we have a normal snowpack so far and it will most likely be very snow covered in June and some stream crossing can be difficult. You could get a walkup at Lyell in this timeframe if you show up at 4am. The demand won't be as high in June. I have been successful by showing up at 4am. The fine is not worth it for getting caught without a permit - $500 and immediate escort out of the wilderness. Watch the movie "Mile Mile and a Half" on netflix for an idea of what trail conditions would be like in June. They went in Mid July during the high snow year in 2011. I ran into them the last week of July at Rae Lakes and Glenn Pass was still totally covered in snow. They told me Muir Pass had 7 miles of continuous snow and Mather was scary.
A great 7 day trip would be north lake to south lake - google it. It's 50 miles and you get to see Evolution Valley, McClure Meadow, Muir Pass and Leconte Canyon.
Another great stretch would be to enter at Onion Valley and head over Kearsarge Pass to Whitney. You would have to exit at Horseshoe Meadows because you won't be able to get an trail crest exit permit to exit at Whitney Portal. But you could camp at Crabtree Meadows and summit Whitney as a day hike and then continue south to horseshoe meadows on the PCT.
These permits are available on recreation.gov but would probably involve crampon and ice axe skills in June unless the drought returns with a vengeance. These are great trips in August or September. The very best of the JMT is the southern 100 miles but it is the highest with most altitudes over 10k.
Sorry to rain on your plans but early season is dangerous. Let me know if you have any other questions.
Thx for posting...good info...how heavy was ur pack out of mtr? In heading north from Devils and shuttling back to head south....pita...but only way could get permit even mid sept!! U think it's worth mailing food drop to tul meadows for last day and a half...buy food there?
Richard Moran My pack was at 45# coming out of MTR without water - 20# of food. My daughter was at 36# so the climb up Muir was a workout. Are you leaving mid Sep? MTR closes September 19th. By late August the stores at Reds and Tuolumne Meadows tend to not restock their backpacking foods but have plenty of food. Tuolumne will have stuff you can buy so I wouldn't bother sending a resupply there. They do carry freeze dried stuff but will be slim pickings late in the season. On your schedule you are wanting to be there for lunch. Have a beer and pig out and grab a salami, cheese, candy bars and some rolls and some fresh fruit and head for Cathedral lakes or Sunrise. You really won't miss anything walking down Hwy 120 instead of looping around the meadows on the trail and you will be at the store anyway if you want to save a little time.
"There were Peruvian flutes" amazing!
+Mollie Church Yup. Normally I love Peruvian flutes. At 2am my love for them waned since my alarm was set for 5:30am. Just a heads up that it can get quite loud in Little Yosemite Valley. You don't truly enter the "wilderness" until you take a right turn towards Sunrise and leave the Half Dome hordes and their instruments behind.
What map would advise for the JMT ,Ape Man?
The JMT is well marked and easy to follow so detailed maps are not that important unless you plan on doing some off trail or side trips. I use the Tom Harrison Maps but I'm pretty familiar with the trail and exit points. There are only a couple confusing areas. Tuolumne Meadows and Reds Meadows come to mind. Do bring a map and compass or GPS - I NEVER go anywhere in the Sierra without a map. I don't do GPS and enjoy navigating with a topo map but there are good GPS options but I can't help you with that. I've heard good things about the Eric the Black maps and Elizabeth Wenk has a great book detailing the whole trail including great camping spots. Again I'm not a planner and haven't read those and I just go where the day takes me. I always know where I am though.
Hi Ape Man! I'm doing a northbound trip starting from Cottonwood Lakes on August 18, taking 21 days total. Is hiking out to Independence my only option for resupply? I don't want to take that extra day.
Hi Emma. I feel the same. Even if I had time I don't like leaving the trail. Independence doesn't have much but the Mt Williamson Motel has a hiker package that is worth checking out but it wastes a day. Your options are limited but there are some. If you have access to a car you can drop your own resupply in the bear boxes at the Onion Valley trailhead before heading to Horseshoe Meadows to start your trip. Make sure it is well marked with your name and date of pick up. Then you can camp at Kearsarge lakes or the Charlotte Lake Junction and do a quick 10-11 mile round trip hike with an empty pack to pick up your resupply and just leave your camp set up so you can just crash after picking up your food. Kearsarge lakes are way nicer. If you don't have a car you can try calling Paul at eastsidesierrashuttle.com. He was dropping off resupply packages in the Onion Valley Bear boxes for around 50 bucks. If you have money to burn you can have a packer meet you at the Charlotte Lake junction for around 500 dollars. Danica Berner is the local packer that provides this service.
Have a great time. You are gonna love it!
+Ape Man thanks again! (You also helped me get my permit 🤗) I will contact Paul. I'm also thinking about doing that first section really fast until MTR but it's probably to much.
Emma - It's tempting to go fast and skip the resupply but don't do it. First of all this is the very best of the JMT and you don't want to rush through it. You can make up the miles on the second half. The elevation extremes aren't as large and you will be in shape so take your time and enjoy the first part. Also you will be in very high elevations right from the horseshoe meadows trailhead so your body won't be adjusted to it yet. You will easily be able to put in some 15-20 mile days at the end so don't worry if you fall a little behind at the start.
Ok, I'll do that. Thank you again, can't promise this is the last you'll hear from me haha!
Hello Ape Man! I'm here again still figuring ressuply logistics and having fun in the process. So I'm definitely doing a ressuply out of Independence. I think I can make my next ressuply VVR and just skip MTR (my beer craving will be important and it just sounds better) and make that my last ressuply until the end. That would be 2 ressuplies total in 21 days on the trail. What do you think? Greetings from Mexico and thanks for your big help again, newbie here.
great info! I'm wondering what those 14 thumbs down are about... thanks for sharing!
Dennis Lee e
Advise about mattresses is worth in gold. Ive destroyed two expensive ones, before buying sth indestructible and much cheaper.
What type and degree sleeping bag do you recommend for mid Aug to mid Sept trip?
+Gary V It depends? Are you a warm or cold sleeper? Will you be in a tent or under a tarp? Will you be sleeping on a good insulating pad? Is cost a limiting factor and are you concerned with weight and packability? After you answer those questions here is my advice. Get the best down mummy bag you can afford - something in the 750 goose fill rating or higher range. Make sure it stays dry - a simple garbage bag will work for that on rainy days. For an average sleeper a 20 degree bag will work great in that timeframe. You most likely won't see any temps lower than 20 degrees in that timeframe with the norm being low 30's. If it gets colder a few nights wear a beanie and some clothes to bed. People try to go with a 30 or 40 degree bag to save on weight and packing but I wouldn't do that unless you don't mind shivering a few nights. I don't! You can also add a silk liner which will add a few degrees and weighs little and protects your bag from your smelly, oily, filthy body which is pretty much everyone on the JMT.
I have a Marmot Helium 15 degree bag that I love and covers all seasons. I've slept in it down to 10 degrees comfortably but I'm a very warm sleeper. It's too hot sometimes for summer so I just unzip it. It's very light and very compressible and VERY expensive but you could actually pay more. You want something in the 2-3 pound range. Western mountaineering makes awesome bags but I can't afford them. Some REI brands and there is a Kelty cosmic are a couple more affordable decent bags. I bought my first good bag on Craigslist a 0 degree north face which is my winter bag. There are some cool expensive ultralight stuff out there including quilts and hoodless bags so check those out. There are a lot of specialty ultralight companies making great gear but it's pricey and not worth it unless you do LOTS of backpacking. For the JMT in summer don't overthinks it - just borrow or buy the lightest bag you can find.
I'll be sleeping in a tent on a - Therm-A-Rest NeoAir XTHERM. I'm a retired Army airborne ranger so roughing it doesn't appease me anymore. LOL
+Gary V I hear ya. I'm too old to suffer. I tried to get by on the JMT with a cheap light Thermarest z lite and it was not comfortable enough and affected my sleep. The neo air with the extra insulation will help keep you warmer too. A 20 or 30 degree down bag will pair well with that pad.
Awesome. Thanks for the info and informational video.
Anyway you could look at my itinerary and see if it makes sense?
Hello Mr. Ape Man! I've been watching your video's over and over and I appreciate your tips and advice. I'm a newbie. 59 years old. My biggest concern is my feet. I will not skimp when it comes to hiking shoes. As far as I can tell, you never mentioned the kind of hiking boots you use. If you could please let me know the brand and specific model of your hiking boots you use, I would appreciate it. I've really spent a lot of time researching hiking boots, and I'm interested in your brand of boots. You said in your video, not to get Goretex boots. In my research, i found what appears to be a new technology, which is breathable Goretex. Its supposed to let the air in and out of your shoe, but keep the water out. Do you have an opinion on that? If you could elaborate on your brand of shoe, and why you like it, that would be great. By the way, you should start a guide service.
+ttown55 Taking care of your feet is important! Don't forget to use good socks also. Wright socks and Darn Tough are brands I like. The boots that work for me may not work for you so always try them out before a long trip. I assume you will be on trails as I would recommend something different for cross country travel. I used Merrell Moab ventilators for my JMT and I also like Keens for their big toe box. Both are very lightweight - you don't need heavy duty boots. Both these brands come with a waterproof gore tex version but for summer hiking you don't need it. Gore Tex has always claimed to be breathable but your feet will run a little hotter. It is a good product I use when I need it. If there is a lot of snow, water or wintertime hiking then yeah gore tex would be the way to go. I prefer leather boots for winter waterproof needs and for snowshoes etc. You need to treat them to keep them waterproof. I actually love a really cheap boot for this called a Hi Tek Altitude 4. I'm willing to spend 200+ dollars for boots but all the ones I mentioned are in the 80-120 dollar range. For heavier expensive boots I'm partial to Montrail. For long distance hiking though lightweight is the way to go. A lot of people are using cross trainers but I haven't so can't give any advice on that but they are certainly an option worth checking out. I'm 56 so I need the support of a lightweight boot. Also I always pull out the factory insoles and replace them with Superfeet Insoles.
Glad you find my videos helpful. I actually teach a backpacking class for fun and take people out for their first overnighter. I do it for free for the parks and recreation department that i work for. I've thought about guiding but my day job keeps me pretty busy.
+Ape Man thanks for the quick reply. if you ever get a 5 day, beginner class, count me in. anything shorter wouldn't be worth the long trip from Oklahoma. I will probably be backpacking by myself. Im retired, and most of my friends are still working, and/or married to someone who won't let them go. I need to find a backpacking group of people to meet and go hiking with. I don't think I would mind backpacking alone, but I definitely need to hike and camp with others with more experience first. there are several guided backpacking trips for beginners that i need to take advantage of.
+ttown55 The Sierra Club is a good place to meet people and go on group trips and are reasonably priced. REI does classes and trips but are very expensive. I know it's flat out there in Oklahoma but Google local hiking clubs and maybe you can find some groups there. I hike alone sometimes and enjoy it but you are right to get experience first. Of course I always tell people where I'm going. On trails like the PCT, JMT or AT it's really easy to meet people and you can easily join a group if you want to. I will be backpacking to a 9500 Sierra lake next weekend for 2 nights. I will not do such a trip alone because of the time of year and chance of snow but in the middle of summer I feel very secure wandering around by myself in the Sierra. I'm sure you could find a local outdoors group and hook up with some like minded people. If I can still walk when I retire I will start my guiding business.
How heavy is your pack during this hike on average?
+Nick I'm 6'3" 230 so weight is not a huge issue for me. I am also not an ultra lighter but am striving to get there but it is expensive to get really light. If you are hiking southbound when you leave MTR will be your heaviest point unless you arrange a packer resupply or hike out at Kearsarge pass to Independence. My pack weighed 46 pounds leaving MTR not counting water and included 9 days of food. My daughter who weighs 120 lbs was carrying 35 lbs out of MTR. It was uncomfortable until we got over Muir pass and we hiked all the way to Whitney Portal without another resupply. We carry some luxury items like a 3 person extra long tent. You typically need to carry about 2 lbs of food a day so you can use that as a calculation above your base weight. I usually average 35 lbs. To be comfortable you really want to stay below 25 - 30% of your body weight on your back. I'm planning on dropping about 5 lbs from my base weight by getting a smaller lighter pack and a cuben fiber tent. That will cost me 800 bucks to save 5 lbs. I really think ultra lighters who are not really experienced sometimes can get into trouble if bad weather moves in. Just make sure you need everything you bring but make sure you are prepared for bad weather and can get dry and not get hypothermia.
+Ape Man Awesome! Thanks for the quick reply and great information, I really appreciate it.
How serious is this business about wearing a bigger shoe? I have two pairs of the same shoe a half size apart. With the bigger pair my toe is about 1.5 inches from the front of the shoe and I'm worried about my foot moving around and a loose heal resulting in blisters. 1.5 inches seems like a lot of room to me. I think maybe I always wear a shoe that is a little bigger than I need because there is normally a little more room than just a thumb width between my toe and the front of the shoe. Perhaps what I normally wear will work just fine. Thanks for any advice.
mtharvey21 A long hike of more than a couple days and 10+ mile days will result in your feet swelling. I would always lose a toenail or 2 on long hikes but was pretty dialed in on the sock / breathable shoe issue so I had finally conquered the blister problem. I finally had my foot measured at REI and it turned out I was now a size 13 instead of a 12 as the result of fallen arches. Once I went with a bigger shoe the toenail falling off problem subsided although I do have one about to fall off from a recent weekend trip. I have a 2nd toe that is longer than my big toe. 1 1/2 inches sounds like plenty of room. Don't forget about width also as your feet can get wider too. Just soak 'em every chance you get and break in your shoes on some 10 mile day hikes up and down steep hills to see if they give you problems. It's the down hills that are the true test of your toe box space.
Ape Man Thanks for the advice. I don't like the sound of losing toenails. I'll probably go with my larger shoe to be safe. I'll have some time to test both as I don't hit the trail until Sept 2nd.
mtharvey21 September is a great time to do the JMT. Record crowds this year but it should be great in September. September 19th is the last day to pick up a resupply at Muir Trail Ranch. Keep an eye on the forecast and be prepared for a couple days of snow or cold but you should be fine. After mid September I would recommend a high quality 15 degree down bag as a minimum and a tent in case you have to ride out a snow storm. I've been on Whitney 3 times in September. It was 50 degrees once, snow flurries another and 20's with strong winds the last time with some snow the next day. Whitney got 6 inches of snow in July this year. Be safe and have fun.
Ape Man I picked Sept for less crowds, less heat, and less mosquitos. I could do without snow, but my roots are in northern Michigan so I should be able to deal with it. Thanks for the video. I made several adjustments based on your advice.
I was reading the comments, funny today's world.Could you make short er vids.. bahaha😂. sounds like he needs to hit the trail and slow down a bit.😉
I would like to see a video about gear that you took once, and never again. Also I have seen gear left at trail crossings, abandoned as useless. What have you and your viewers found abandoned? Beginners might benefit greatly from experienced hikers, as opposed to useless junk flogged on RUclips by paid reviewers.
tom jackson As I get older I'm getting better at not bringing things I don't use. Too much fishing tackle is an issue I still deal with. Bathing suits are of course unnecessary dead weight. Big knives and multitools are common. I used to bring a candle lantern or a battery lantern for my tent. Food items that seemed like a good idea at home. Drink mixes for water that I usually never use but I'm trying out some all the time for muscle recovery and electrolytes etc. I still often bring a real frying pan when fires aren't allowed to cook fish. Too many clothes is a common problem. I used to bring an awesome gore tex jacket that I love but have converted to layering which is much lighter and packs better. Of course in winter conditions the gore tex still comes with me. I really use everything I bring now but it took many years to figure it out.
I shifted most of that stuff to the car and canoe camping box too.
But I must admit that as I get older, I like the comforts of canoe camping a lot, as I tend toward trips of several weeks. I get away from roads and cars into pristine nature, but can still put my butt in a chair instead of the wet sand on rainy days. I use a 19 foot freight canoe with a little 13 pound air cooled motor at times. It's nice to get away from the mess at the launch ramps or go across the wind, then paddle in peace in the nice places.
all of those things that weight nothing sure add up to a lot.
+knightnvy That's true. I'm not an ultra lighter - I can't afford it. I can do 7 days including food and water at 30 pounds and that is comfortable for me. This video is focused more at less experienced hikers who could get in trouble if they try to go too light. Everyone should look at every piece of equipment and ask themselves "Do I really need this?" This is especially true for through hiking. I do 2-3 day trips where I bring hammocks, my fishing vest and a few beers. You make a good point. On long trips weight is very important. When I hike with my daughter I'm probably 10 pounds heavier than when I go solo. Still better than the 70 pound loads I carried as a youth.
It is soooo long and talks about places I don't know because i haven't hike the trial yet...focus
+Greenswan1000 Sorry it's so long. I guess you are not my target audience. A lot of people take on the JMT as their 1st long multi-day hike and need a lot of general information. I teach a backpacking class that is 4.5 hours of classroom time before we go out on our 1st overnight trip. The JMT is not to be taken lightly. There is a 170 mile stretch with no roads and no help if something goes wrong. You need to familiarize with the places I mention to complete this trip. Even if you are experienced it is not a trip you can just show up to and go. Their are permits, resupplies, altitude acclimatization and lots of logistics. I actually think I did not cover enough and I didn't try.
There are lots of books that will help you with your JMT planning. I suggest Elizabeth Wenk's as a good starting point for you. I wouldn't suggest a youtube video of some random guy as a starting point for your John Muir Trail adventure.
+Ape Man if you don't mind my asking, where do you teach classes at? i'd love to take the course before trying to take on the JMT. i am going to make my first trip to Yosemite this year in August. i have been extremely interested in the JMT and would like to try my hand at it next summer. i am extremely new to the backpacking world and multi-day trips. i really loved the video and would really like to take a detailed course about backpacking in general, especially from someone who's successfully completed a trip i'd like to take. i live in Alabama, so if you take reservations for your classes, i'd love to make the trip a week or so before i try to take on the JMT next year or even before my Yosemite trip later this year.
+Jade Leigh Giles My class is in California but I'm taking a year off due to time constraints. There is a Sierra Club in Alabama. Check out them or other local clubs. They have classes. The best way to learn is to actually go on a trip with someone that knows what they are doing. If you can do a couple 2-3 day weekend trips you can do the JMT. The JMT is just a really long weekend trip. Your gear will be close to the same but food and logistics are a little different. Of course physical conditioning and knowing your gear well and how to use it are important. Get your clothing figured out to. No cotton and don't bring too much.
A lot of people have anxiety about a multi day trip. On the JMT you will see people everyday and most likely will start hanging out with and hiking with others. It actually is not my idea of solitude and I prefer places where I don't see anyone for days. On those trips I am always cautious and hyper prepared. Those of us who hike a lot in the Sierra refer to the JMT as the "highway" and we use it mostly to get to the offramp to some remote quiet basin. My advice is to complete at least 1 multiway hike on your own before doing the JMT. 50 miles in 5-7 days is a good target.
Enjoy Yosemite. I'm lucky that i can be in the park in 2 1/2 hours from my house. Yosemite Valley is a must see but very crowded. Be sure to get up to glacier point and Tuolumne Meadows. You can day hike the first few miles of the JMT on the mist trail up to the top of Nevada Falls. Tip - start that hike at 5am to beat the hoardes. If you can get a permit you can do half dome. For a much less crowded long day hike starting at Tenaya Lake google Clouds Rest. 14 mile round trip. Not as epic as half dome but it has a better view in my opinion.