Why Hellraiser Revelations turned out the way it did
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
- Gary J. Tunnicliffe, who served as writer on «Hellraiser: Revelations», shares what happened behind the scenes of the first Hellraiser movie which saw Doug Bradley recast, then with Stephan Smith Collins. He also explains why the movie turned out as bad as it did, and where his own friendship with Doug Bradley first started showing signs of stress.
This is Part II of the Talking Hellraiser series, where Midnight’s Edge is teaming up with Gary J. Tunnicliffe to give you the detailed behind the scenes history of the Hellraiser franchise, warts and all. No holds will be barred.
Part I of Talking Hellraiser deals with the making of the original sequels:
• Hellraiser: Behind the...
Part III Tells the full story behind «Hellraiser: Judgment» (2018)
Chapter 1: Development, casting and recasting an Icon
• Hellraiser Judgment: D...
Chapter 2: Budget, production and Advice for Aspiring Filmmakers
• Hellraiser Judgment Ex...
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I applaud the long suffering efforts of this man. Among the Cenobites, his sacrifice is legendary.
The story is super cool but the lack of a budget and the shitty actors really sucks, I think the upperclass, kind of suppressed sin is a cool theme to explore
There's a great documentary about the band Coil. Doing the first soundtrack that sadly never got released for the first hell razor. Movie Clive Barker and the 2 main guys from coil. John balance and sleazy Jansen work together.
This is why you guys are one of my favorite channels on RUclips. Please keep it up!
There will be blood.
This is really interesting ! You should try and do more interviews with writers , directors and who worked on movies that went horribly wrong.
yeah definitely!
As Gary quoted in this interview, I also believe that Revelations while not a great Hellraiser film was still a true Hellraiser film in the sense that it was a script originally written to be one from the get-go, unlike the previous 4 that were not. In my eyes, it was the 1st reboot.
The Cenobites didn't even know Frank had escaped until his niece told them...
They didn't even believe her at first either.
Man, I feel so bad for Mr. Tunnicliffe. Having the chance at a dream, and get it ripped to pieces... almost as if the Hellraiser Franchise is the Lament Configuration... hm. 🤔But seriously, it's sad that things turned out the way they did.
The happy ending imo is that he came back for the sequel and did the best movie since the first one.
Pinhead doesn't HAVE fear. Or at least he shouldn't. Pinhead, MY Pinhead, isn't from Judeo Christian "Hell," he's from "The place beyond the room, from which the bell's din was issuing. A world of birds, was it? Vast, black birds caught in perpetual tempest?" So much more interesting than lame, cliché Hell. And the idea of being eaten alive would _delight_ Pinhead. He'd be all in for THAT.
Bijinius Cross
What if being alive led to inexistence? Suffering is one thing. Death and oblivion another.
YES I think it is such a less-dimensional and less-creative application of the Cenobites to fit them into a Christian cosmology. That is so tired.
Back in the day the only reason I went out on bought Hellraiser Deader was out of pure curiosity to see the No More Souls fan film. And I can tell you it was better than Deader by leagues.
GenoX1987 my Miramax dvd of deader doesn't have it...
I cannot wait for Part 3! They need to release a complete collection of these movies!
Right?
Awesome to see you in these comments. Yes they definitely need to release these in a proper collection.
A Part 3 would have to touch the false flag psyop topic.
Those 34 minutes flew by fast..
Loving these videos. I could listen to the entire unedited interview. It's great to hear from Tunnicliffe, and about what Revelations could have been.
You do a great job on these interviews. Editing, questions, pictures, I appreciate the hours of work you put in to put this out. They are wonderful, something truly special.
If Revelations would have been a fan film, we'd be saying it was one of the best Hellraiser fan films ever. The storyline is very good and at least it's an actual Hellraiser story! But it was very poorly cast and executed. It's a way better storyline than the last few films with Bradley. If the studio would have cared and actually put the time and budget into it, I think it had the potential to be a great movie.
Yes! I agree 100% with you, it felt like a Hellraiser movie. Many other Hellraiser movies felt like non-Hellraiser movies where they just added Pinhead to make a quick buck.
If at the very least it had a Hellraiser Judgement-level Pinhead it would have been far better received and one of the stronger made-for-dvd sequels. But I also think it might have been fresh to not have had a Pinhead at all, beyond the pseudo-Pinhead that is created half-way through the movie. The first film and the expanded lore have readily stated Pinhead was simply the "lead cenobite" in that particular gash that appeared when Kirsty opened the box, he wasn't explicitly *the* villain, just the one who spoke the most in that situation. I thought Revelations' pseudo-Pinhead looked amazing with his grafted skin, open flesh and being forged a-new. If you're creating a new Pinhead, why not have a new and very-different "lead cenobite" (of which there's always so many options to draw from, maybe someone like Angelique for example) who would then forge a new Pinhead character; to rekindle the legacy, rather than just recasting the role badly and having him craft a needless mini-me who looks better than the actual character himself? But at the very least, if the producers insisted that Pinhead be the villain (I'll concede that's understandable from a business perspective), one would like to think that the casting should have had a lot more scrutiny, it is surely THE most important aspect of any Hellraiser sequel at this stage? Judgement's Pinhead was fantastic given that it wasn't Bradley (I'd rather have the legend, but Paul Taylor embodied the role well), and was an excellent recasting given the situation, however Revelations' Stephan Collins was sadly just dreadful (though I understand he was actually voiced by Fred Tatasciore who I honestly feel may have been an even larger culprit in destroying this version of the character). That said, no disrespect to Collins for whatever else he's done, but he was woefully miscast as Pinhead; his physical features alone were too strong for such a cold and surgically-precise looking character, traits that are synonymous with his appearance. I'm open to recasting, business is business, but a Pinhead actor needs a Patrick Stewart-like statuesque yet undefined facial structure; small eyes, minimal lips, a strong angular nose, a shallow brow-line, a defined jaw structure, yet sadly Collins' lacked all of these from a basic visual standpoint and had far too strong facial features (and I mean that with no intended disrespect to him, I myself would never make a good Pinhead with my Jagger lips and soft chin). I don't ever wish to be shallow and say someone is a bad actor for simply how they look, but Pinhead is like the sadistic corruption of a Roman statue, he should be both perfect yet awful simultaneously, it ties with his entire contradiction as a being, the blend between good and evil, pain and pleasure. For Pinhead to be anything less than statuesque is misunderstanding the character. And for that I do have to stress I do think Paul Taylor was an excellent recasting, even if I'd rather have Bradley himself involved.... but what can you do for pocket change?
@@ReleaseTheCanines Honestly, I completely concur with you 💯… I’m such a huge HELLRAISER & Pinhead fan. I just finished watching HELLRAISER: Judgement… I was so sad to not see Douglas Bradley playing as Pinhead. I haven’t yet seen HELLRAISER: Revaluation’s… I began to wonder why Bradley wasn’t cast as Pinhead, & thought that possibly/maybe it was bc, Douglas Bradley might’ve been ill, or worse-deceased; or, maybe they believe he’s too old to play as Pinhead now in it and possibly other HELLRAISER movies--if they’re are any more made after HELLRAISER: Judgement
I'm not a fan of Hellraiser but I've really enjoyed these interviews!
Have to admit. With all of Revelations failings, the scene of them pinning the flesh on the guys face is super cool
Revelations looks like a fan made film that I would find on RUclips. I could literally make the same movie with my iPhone camera.
That's what filmmaking is all about, having an idea that you are passionate about and go for it, despite if you have the budget or not.
The Weinstein brothers is what went wrong with the Hellraiser series.
Absolutely loved the first part, can't wait for this. Cheers guys.
The story behind a movies can be more interresting than the movie itself. I really enjoyd this interview.
He is so damn talented to me. Not only did he play the Stygian Auditor in judgement, but also did the special effects makeup, directed, AND wrote it. The guy is genius. To me, Judgement is the BEST sequel that’s been made in the entire franchise (except the second, which is the best movie in the entire franchise to me personally). When I saw him in judgment, I couldn’t believe he wasn’t an actor. He was the breakout star of that film, and that movie’s script felt like it was made by someone who LOVED the franchise.
Revelations would have been the best Hellraiser movie since Bloodlines, but the casting and performance ruined the film.
Can we get a video about the Phantasm franchise?
We will most definitely consider it, i have been wanting to do a video about the difference in the US and Foreign box sets for a while now (-Tom)
Midnight's Edge After Dark would be awesome if you guys could interview either coscarelli, reggie banister or michael baldwin.
KingFossilFER we will try and see if we can get in touch with them perhaps :-)
You have both sets too?
I just wished that the cenobites were still cenobites and not demons from hell wanting to kill people. The cenobites were more interested in pain and pleasure. Wtf happened to them?
Luna Angel Clive Barker stoped being involved & lazy writers took over. Barkers books on hellraiser are SO MUCH better.
@@Corvy952 "The Scarlet Gospels" was awful. The comics were good, but they're not "books". He hasn't written any other books about Hellraiser besides "The Hellbound Heart", which was good but very different to the first Hellraiser film.
Wow, this was a really good interview!
I actually enjoyed revelations, I had below shit expectations when I watched it and obviously the pinhead was garbage but the story and was appealing and if it was doug Bradley it would have been a solid hellraiser.
at last someone who also enjoyed this movie :D The story was very Hellraiser ish, unlike Inferno and Hellworld who felt like other movies that just happend to have a bit of Pinhead in it to sell them. If it was a fan movie, people would love the movie. It even has a fan movie vibe going on. So there are many weak points of this movie, but a last i did enjoy the story and the kills/punishments :)
As a long time fan i can safety say what happened to. This series. Is just to common. The big studios just rushed the creation process. And are only in it for the cash.
Seems like you rushed the creation process of your comment too.
themaybatatter it happens i kinda forget a few thing when. I am righting.
The Original guy for Pinhead PLEASE bring him back if ever there's a reboot in which I would LOVE
Fantastic, in-depth and very honest summary of this terrible turkey
Quality content! i'm looking forward to the rest!.
But you know what is interesting is that what I really liked was the STORY, which this guy gave to it!
Hellraiser is a love story, it has passion and compelling dialogue. Only the 2nd expands on the story
Snap out of it! Its a rubric cube story!
I missed Part 1, and I've never seen any of the Hellraisers; but this was a great interview. I couldn't turn it off!
Love the videos guys keep up the great work
Doug is an actor who really needs to get over himself.
Clive Barker is more important to the Hellraiser franchise, than Doug Bradley is.
[r00t] Clive had nothing to do with the franchise after Hell on Earth.
[r00t] yeah Clive’s books on hellraiser are so much better than the movies
The biggest problem with the movie was not the story. The biggest problem was the guy playing pinhead. He was too young and felt like a spoilt teenager, not a being who has existed since before time. Also his stupid eyes made pinhead look like Mickey Mouse. To play a part like that you need a decent Shakespearian actor. I think Patrick Stewart could do it. No one but Doug Bradley can really do pinhead justice. Even in the worse Hellraiser movies, Doug just shines and makes them worth watching.
what a wonderful and caring guy /, He worships HELLRASER And lives it ,,Very impressed with his passion and action
I LOVE "Revelations" personally
i've met doug bradley and tbh he struck me as kind of a diva. didn't really like his attitude while talking to a fan of the franchise. it felt very dismissive. really great pinhead, but as a first impression didn't strike me as a very good person.
Bad Request I've often thought this of him too while watching some of his interviews on here
Great Pinhead but uppity I'm real life at times
lol. So you're judging him off one encounter. I would say you sound like a sensitive douche, but I don't wanna condemn you for one comment.
I haven’t yet seen HELLRAISER: Revaluation’s. But, I just finished watching HELLRAISER: Judgement. I was like,”Hell FKN Yeah,” bc I’m such a huge HELLRAISER fan, & I absolutely adore & love Pinhead played by, Bradly Douglas. I was a bit keen on its storyline, & the actors & actresses; but, I wasn’t thrilled about someone else playing Pinhead, & thought that maybe they had to get someone else to play as Pinhead, due to Bradly possibly being deceased or ill, or too old to play as Pinhead now. Idk. I wasn’t keen on HELLRAISER: Hellworld neither-until the end, when the father messes w/the box & Pinhead shows up w/the cenobite & kills the father in a way that they only can. I did like HELLRAISER: Deader, about as much as HELLRAISER: Judgement. I kid you not. If I’d ever gotten so lucky to play in the HELLRAISER movies. I’d hope to be a cenobite, or the Queen of hell, & co-rule it w/Pinhead… I have so many good ideas for new cenobite & etc looks. Hell, if I were a multi-millionaire. I’d throw a very interesting HELLRAISER Halloween party-and no one can be Pinhead (except for my man, or Bradley Douglas-if he’d ever be so kind to attend) and no one can dress like me, nor the Princess Angelique. Just saying.
I don’t understand why he didnt call doug as a courtesy before filming.
He explained why in this video.
So do the chains give the one who opens the box pleasure at the same time as pain. Or is it one day pain one day pleasure until they become merged.
i remeber watching no more souls way back when. I loved it. When i found out he was doing judgement i was like hell yes.
Just recently rewatched/watched all the Hellraiser movies. It may very well be the worst movie franchise of all time. Not a single one of the movies is any good. Revelations fits perfectly into the series, they're all equally bad. It actually stands out as one of the more memorable sequels.
No doug Bradley is reason enough why revelations is so bad. But no more souls was awesome and wish there was more to the story
Judgement surprised me. I actually like it. I know they could make an epic film with this idea... But judgement was great considering what they had to work with. I dunno about the angel at the end....
So the question remains - why didn’t they just write pinhead out when Doug refused the casting? They needed to retain the licenses, okay, I understand that but they only needed to use the name.
So why didn’t they just make a movie and have it named Revelation: A Hellraiser Story?!
Have it be a story WITHIN the Hellraiser universe that wasn’t to do with Pinhead? Either use a Cenobite from elsewhere that Clive had written or create a whole new OC and have them lead the story?!
Problem solved. Yeah, it would receive negative reviews because there was no pinhead - BUT it would have missed all the flak it got for having a baaaad Pinhead design!
Pinhead being in it was an ABSOLUTE demand from Dimension, for now other reason than that him being on the cover was the sales pitch.
@@MidnightsEdge huh! That’s an odd demand (in my mind) but it is interesting to know! Thank you :)
I just feel that Hellraiser fans would have been more forgiving and probably more excited to see a story within the universe about someone other than pimhead
@@UlyssesCrab The built in fans might have been, but studio execs don't think that way.
To them, Hellraiser = Pinhead on the cover, which is their salespitch, meaning he has to be in the movie in some capacity.
No arguments, no exceptions.
Gary seems like a real Gentlemen/Fanboy in Hollywood. I would have liked to see a series of direct to video/streaming Hellraiser movies from him.
Hellraiser II : Hellbound is the BEST hellraiser film.
According to a survery done in 2010, Most participants voted Hellraiser 2 as the BEST hellraiser movie of the franchise, followed by Hellraiser 1.
Hellraiser 1 is a classic, with the most dark, gruesome, unnerving atmosphere. The cenobites were scary, mysterious and yet cool. They are not evil nor good. We dont know much of them, and of the box, and we are very eager to know the whole universe of hellraiser.
Hellraiser 2 is an expanded version of Hellraiser 1, based on the premises set by the first film. It fulfilles the desires of the audience to learn more about the box, the cenobites, and how things works in this universe, as well as how the "hell" is like. It explains how the cenobites are created from once humans. It showed us leviathan and the labyrinth, it showed us more movements possible by the box (turning into a a leviathan configuration) which is so COOL and original. Sure this sequel lacks the dark, gruesome and very suffocating feel from the first one, but it expands the story so well, and it covers more ground and backstory and explain the whole universe vastly better than the first one.
I would prefer the seceond one over the first. The second one is basically like a GRAND OPERA, while the first one is a solo piano performance for introduction.
I appreciate his work, but to me, hellraiser is like the Berserk animes, just sadness after sadness.
the idea, what would cenobites do if humanity is gone, is pretty good. If they had the effects to make the labyrinth falling apart and shit I'd be cool. It's not My hellraiser, but I would appreciate it still.
Strange that Doug didn't understand him for Judgement- Like, he does have a bit of an ego, but he was gonna get good money for 3 days. Clearly, he wasn't going to agree to Judgement even if he read the script. I wonder what would Doug Bradley consider to be a not piece of shit Hellraiser movie? Maybe he should make one himself. As far as I remember. He said the offer of revelations was offensive and to me it was always the financial reasons more than not liking the script. he was in Hellworld FFS. . The story for revelations wasn't bad, everything else was.
This is a great video.
In my opinion, Revelations is the black sheep of the series!
Watched it once and never did again!
I gotta give Gary a lot of credit... that and having the guts to sit through a movie like that. I made it through once for that movie and it pissed me off. Much like The Last Jedi and Discovery did.
At least Doug Bradley redeemed himself in Hellraiser Judgment after this abomination because he looked like he gained several pounds in this movie
People are taking about Revelations like it's a bad movie as if the others are good movies...
Hellraiser is a joke of a series since the fifth film and onwards.
They should have told him not to bother.
Pin'ead
Judgment wasn't bad. The cop story was great, but it is really hard to not feel like they added Pinhead and the Auditor to an existing story. Bloodlines gets a lot of unnecessary flack, was it great, well no, but it feels like the last hellraiser that had a script written for it. I watched Deader and Hellworld upon release and didn't mind them back then
Doug Bradley deserves to have one last outing as Pinhead so he can go out with a bang instead of ending with Hellworld. It's a shame he's probably considered too old to do the part anymore
He should have accepted Judgment, which was written for him.
@@MidnightsEdge he might have had the nda been a page, which is what he was familiar with
Usurp*
Yeesh, Revelations gets all the crap that Hellworld deserves.
Just watched both back to back and Hellworld is a masterpiece compared to this steaming hot pile of fuck shit.
"We have such SHITES to show you!"
Gary J. Tunnicliffe, is the balls
Tunnicliffes movie was no better. His one is one of the worst of the lot. And you don't need to have watched the one he wrote to know it was totally awful, I couldn't make it through it. After all his rambling and humble bragging, the movie he made that he had control of was just awful regardless of budget, he just seems like a typical out of touch boomer in the industry.
Tunicliffs Hellraiser ‘no more souls’ completely wipes the floor with this abomination.
Judgement was a mess.
Judgement was a good damn good movie. His character kicked ass. Reminded me of Hans from Inglorious Bastards
poor guy, gets so angry at the movie he wanted to make that it physically makes him shout at the scream
They need to cast gunther from friends as pinhead.
So other cenobites were trying to hunt down pinhead and kill him?
The first Hellraiser was great, other than capitalism there is no reason to make anymore of them, about the only life left in it would be The Scarlett Gospels as a movie
Why do I have to go watch a movie about a Cenobite and a demon fight over political bullshit on a screen?
Hell raiser revelations wtf.. embarrassing to say the least.. I could make a better Pinhead out of paper mache sorry but it’s true..
Basil Ratky Get´s the Shirt "I Sixtynined Pinhead^^
Here is yet another reason why I despise the Scream franchise! lol
I have never seen "Scream" in any form.
First one was great filmmaking.
Doug seems salty as fuck that other actors took on the role of Pinhead.
You should have said no buddy..
The minute i saw that weird looking pin-head i told myself SMH for a good minute
lol. Yep.
Havnt seen this movie and i saw the thumbnail and good god what happened to pinhead
What went wrong? Doug Bradley passed on it & the makeup guy shouldn't have ever been given any 'creative' control. Thee end.
Hellworld was utter garbage.
for 200 grand, Revalations, is not that bad
Will its trash
Will It’s absymal.
The storyline was decent the but the acting in this Hellraiser film was the worst in the franchise and the pinhead look was garbage I loved Hellraiser bloodline when everyone else hated it but Hellraiser Revelations I agree with everyone else I can not even try to defend this Hellraiser film Revelations is pure garbage the only thing this film had going for it was the storyline and this film even failed at fully capitalizing on that
Say like one more time for fuck sake
So he just made a fan film. Smh
It was shit, but you could see what it could have been if the budget was there.
29:30 That is just stupid. I do not need to shove a jackhammer motor up my butt and let it vibrate my guts into ruptures to know that that is a profoundly stupid idea.
I will agree that Doug's not having actually seen Hellraiser: Revelations weakens his judgement that it is a shit film, but come on, Gary. He has read the script, he has heard the budget, he has heard how quickly it was shot, cut, and effect-laden. What other conclusion is he honestly supposed to come up with?
If he did watch it and say he was happy to be proven wrong, then great. But I have seen Hellraiser: Revelations, and it is bizarrely bad.
For what it is worth, Doug is also acquainted with Clive Barker, who was wanting the rights to The Hellbound Heart back for who knows how long. For all you know, Gary, Doug might feel personally affronted that Dimension are churning out films that are of high school play quality in order to keep the rights from going back to Clive. I know that if I were in Clive's position, I would be quite upset and even trying to help change the system so that authors can get their rights back a lot easier. And were I in Doug's position, I would want to aid in that in any way I can. So please refrain in future from giving us this guff that boils down to "if you have not watched it, you cannot make pronouncements on it". Because if there is anyone in this world who is well positioned to make a pronouncement about a Hellraiser film without having seen it, and their name is not Clive Barker, it is indeed Doug Bradley.
Um.a lot.
Know I feel different they ruined his vision!!!! It could have been a better movie. But it turned into a turd💩
Horrible movie
And yet this guy went and made another shit movie called Hellraiser Judgement, and not just that but he went and copied Seven. This is the usual "director" that has 0 knowledge about making movies properly but because he watched a lot of them he thinks he is good(The Tarantino style basically(but Tarantino has actual talent))
Bojan Babic nah man, tarantino is a hack.... it's quite jarring how much the quality of his movies dropped as soon as he started writing his own scripts
Gary has no idea when to shut up. It's so cringey to listen to him recount his convo with Doug.
this guy is full of himself. his movie didn't sound good to begin with, but it's everyone else's fault that the movie turned out horribly. right.
Doug Bradley should be kissing the feet of everyone who made this film because it insured he could maintain his one acting job in future Hellraiser films. Not participating was a dick, diva move on his part and he should have done it for free and felt grateful to everyone keeping the franchise and his small relevancy alive.
"Now you make wanna go rewatch Revelations, giggle" - one of the hosts. Shouldn't the responsibility of the hosts of a podcast or radio show be to do some prep/research into something they're producing? How can you hope to do a good interview or have any insight if you don't do your homework?
He said "rewatch". Our research has been pretty extensive, and I do think you can tell that from the finished videos.
And I did RE watch it, and on second and third viewing it actually is a little bit better than the first time around knowing what it could have been
Midnight's Edge After Dark You're right & I apologize. I'm so used to defending the movie that I heard it the wrong way. I appreciate the response. And I can't begin to tell you what a treasure trove of content I found in your channel. You guys rock. Your dissection of Inhumans, Hellraiser, & Fan 4 Stick... You guys are the best. I apologize again for my snap judgment (get it?). I can't wait to see what else you have & will have in the future!
LOL, sorry but you don't need to watch Revelation to know it is complete garbage! Doug is right, in that if you have a shit Pinhead, no matter the script, the movie will suck balls!
Lol omg buddy relax
It Sucks
Don't makes
Since
And vary
Short
More 👍 a
Mystery
And people
Are borring
With there
Lifes
Or something
Wish it was
Better
Done
1 out of 10
💀💬
Hope b2018 better.
WHo cares about this. Report on what the hell is going on at WB with the DCEU.
Entitlement makes my balls itch.
The whole movie is crap. Pinhead wasn't scary at all.