Reaper vs. Pro Tools - Do They Sum The Same?
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- This is an [Unofficial] follow up to a video titled "ProTools vs Reaper vs Neve Analog | Stream Records"
in regards to Pro Tools' vs. Reaper's Summing engines.
Please watch this video first in order for my video to make sense.
Original video and link to the files provided found here:
• Video
Stream records shootout files:
drive.google.c...
Video 1 concludes an answer.
My video finds flaws in that answer and opens the question back up in hopes of further discussion.
Thanks for watching.
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Short Answer: They Do.
Long Answer: They Don’t.
True Answer: It doesn’t matter.
Why am I shouting? I’m American, and it’s also rude to point out peoples deficiencies. I calm it down in my other vids 😎
Even if they were different (which they are not) my money would be on Justin Frankel, the creater of both WinAmp, and Reaper. I left Pro Tools after 20 years as I saw Avid ruin the once mighty Digidesign... its like the SW story of Gibson Guitars. I switched to Reaper last year and ABSOLUTELY LOVE REAPER!
Indeed! Reaper Continues to amaze and has never let me down! - Bahrum
Hey there, I'm the guy in the Stream Records video. It looks to me like the noise you're seeing in there is just the noise floor of your DAC. If you shoot a pure 1000hZ sine wave through Pro Tools or Reaper, and then look at it on an analyzer, if you go down low enough, you will see this same sort of noise floor activity. I could be wrong of course, and I am going to go back and revisit the experiment in a day or two to see for myself.
Steve Dandrea Hello Steve, I was hoping I would get your attention at some point and you could chime in further. This topic certainly is a rabbit hole and one that many would roll their eyes at... To me, it’s just fun and interesting, but on the flip side, I agree that at the end of the day, use what you have and make it work to the best of your ability.
I’m not sure how the DAC could effect it since I was just looking at the files you created. ( could be wrong )
After some further digging and help in the reaper forums, the gurus discussed a little more about dither and noise shaping and how its used. Of course in reaper these things can be shut off but I am not sure about in ProTools. My closest bet is that this noise was from the pro tools noise shaping (or both).
And yes it is very low, way to too for me to care but interesting enough for me to have discovered for my own curiosity’s sake.
I’d hoped I have made it clear in the video that even with this sub -150db noise the daws still virtually sum the same, just not technically.
I guess one of use will have to make a follow up. ;)
Interestingly enough, I recreated the same tests in Studio 1 vs Reaper and got really weird results (random blips much louder) I plan to show in another video if I ever get around to it.
You operate not too far away from where my studio is. (Santa Ana)
Hope the music is going well.
Cheers - Bahrum
I’ve used both. Pro Tools for 6-7 years, reaper for 10. They sound the same. I will say Pro Tools built in compressors and eqs sound “better” (ei, smoother in how they react to adjustments). But I can do things in reaper that Avid just doesn’t care to add to pro tools (ei. Sub projects within projects). I love reaper! But both are good daws. Great vid!
Thank you !
Why the yelling?
Noise shaping? Compare a PT render to another equal PT render or Reaper vs Reaper. You'll likely have similar results.
You may have hit the nail on the head... but turning off noise shaping and dither in reaper and trying what you suggest gives me a true null. (although, I was able to recreate the noise with dither on of course) I guess I will have to completely recreate this test to know for sure. We won't know if "stream" had dither or noise shaping on in either pro tools or reaper. Interesting enough, I just created this same test in Studio One (dither off) with some very interesting (and completely different) anomalies.
@@BlueHouseSoundStudio Perhaps disabling dithering in Studio One may not disable noise shaping? Maybe that's always on?
@@dougd1573 I may just do a video on it after I look into it more... I am not very familiar with studio one.. what I saw was these random blips happening with the null test... it looked like a shelf across the whole frequency spectrum... An almost smooth but uneven line. It would shoot up at different decibels and even got up above -100dbs sometimes! Some type of sampling error in the studio one mixdown? Either way, it was a much more troubling find... Again, not familiar with Studio One's options but they look much more limited as far as what you can turn on and off vs Reaper in this regard.
This could be thermal noise IMHO.
So low it is definitely not musical info, but noise.
The question is, what kind of noise.
2020. Reaper.
Overlapping the two signals with one's phase inverted, is an awesome way to compare them and hear the difference (which is way more logical than listening to adjectives like 'more Warmer, Crispy, Wide" that some people say) 😂😂
How else do you explain the feeling of the sound? Everybody in the industry used the terms warm, crisp, and wide lolol
But using such terms can be ambiguous because not everyone's definitions matches anyone else's.
why you yelling? :)
hes not very good at mic'ing vocals up obviously
This kind of reminds me of the "building blocks" of recording & mixing music. Can every effect and plugin be broken down into parametric/graphic EQs, time, LR bandwidth (in stereo dimensions) and other basic axes? For example, a video mentioned how "transparent" Ozone's EQ could be compared to Fabfilter's Pro Q 2
2:00 STATEMENT OF 2000 😍😍😍 Respect !!!
Thanks haha
The more buses you use, the bigger the difference between the Daws! Logic Pro X WAS an example of a very bad sounding Daw. Whatever the problem was, it's fixed with the new versions! Here are the Kings: 👉 Sequoia and Samplitude Pro X 😉
Interesting! As I have gone deeper into Reaper… I have found unexplainable things I would consider flaws left and right in regards to folders/ busses and fader gain staging. Care to give any more insight into why the Magix software is superior? Cheers
@@BlueHouseSoundStudio I'm not familiar with Reaper, can't say anything about this problems... At that time we did a shootout between logic pro x and the first version of Samplitude pro X (about 6 or 7 years ago) the more tracks we routed into buses, the bigger the difference. I don't remember exactly and I can't tell you what it was. Maybe logic used to have a problem with delay compensation. A friend did the test again a year or two ago and told me there was no audible difference anymore. Samplitude and Sequoia are also marketed as the best-sounding "sound engine". What I do know for sure is that many mastering engineers use Sequoia. To be honest I won't be going the rabbit hole again lol. The biggest problem with Samplitude is that it cannot open Pro Tools projects. Should that be possible at some point, I am sure that they can take over large parts of the market.
Cheers
You need to have really ultra expensive monitors like focal 20,000 dollar or adam 20,000 dollar S series to hear the difference but most people wont hear the difference.
I think REAPER is getting better and better with each updates.
Agreed!
yeah this all very well but what happens when you have multiple busses and a few hefty plugs?
CU NEXTTUESDAY Are you asking anything to a specific daws performance? It’s very relative to your computers abilities. More plug ins = the need for more cpu and ram power. I can speak for reaper in more depth and it handles things very efficiently... Ive had projects with over 100 plug ins before running and although my PC begins to struggle.(this was later in the mix) it was able to work relatively amazing. Of course... printing is always the answer to relieve the strain. Cheers, - Bahrum
@@BlueHouseSoundStudio No. What i am asking is for you to try a more real world example of the null test. It is trivial for code to sum a few tracks regardless of the DAW.
But when people talk of 'science' and null tests they are not doing real world examples, just simple mix a few tracks.
I would love to see a null test where there are multiple busses with plugins on each buss and the busses sub mixed to stereo AND THEN do a null test.
A simple mix of a few track is not scientific. You need to push the mix engine alot more than that.
@@shallowfakes593 Perhaps I or someone else will do this some day soon! I like where you're thinking! - Bahrum
After +20 years of using PT I finally got totally fed up with Avid's "Gibson-like" monopoly arrogance and mismanagement of a once leading platform. Discovering WinAmp creator Justin Frankel's DAW (REAPER) and especially Kenny Gioia's instructional videos on REAPER in 2019 (which were an essential help in managing the learning curve) was an absolute revelation to me, and I've been happily using REAPER on my last 4 albums as my workflow sped up nominally 2x from the days of PT. Sorry, but in my life, unless I need to do the occasional file conversions - Pro Tools is history to me.
Word up bro.
If DAW is using the same sound card or the same primary audio driver such as INTEL® Display Audio, REALTEK® Audio, NVIDIA® HD Audio, ASIO® V2 (Asio4All) that is should be the same quality. The quality of sound if having noises better u check or change your audio cable or audio jack plugins 3.5mm or 6.35mm adapter. If you using the cheaper cable or audio jack plug that using more plastic than metal or normaly mild steel on it bcoz raw steel that have many rusty inside and outside however, if that is not pure copper for a cable or audio jack adapter cannot electrify or cannot penetration so well and it will be erupted.
WHY ARE YOU SHOUTING?!
Ok dude
While "we" are arguing which DAW is better, the top producers are arguing which of the two Taylor Swift or Billie Eilish should get better marketing.
Awesome shirt bro!
Thanks !
why you are shouting?
keep calm, we understand what you say.
N Rahbar Good! So it worked! sorry, I was using “Auto- Shout”. ;D
@@BlueHouseSoundStudio if you have a good mic there is no need to use auto-shout. I believe if you redo this video you will definitely get more views
Cool video
Thanks!
Hello, thank you for your contribution, I think it is necessary to contribute as you do, but within that I do not take away the reason more than something psychological I think it is something that is within the genetic nature of each human, by nature humans do not hear the same, our ears respond differently to the sound of a human to another, I know that the differences are tiny but it is another truth, as what you say, I for some reason, I can hear differences in each daw as seeing colors in front of my eyes, I wanted to believe and I did all the tests by gears and I could not believe or perceive that all the daws are the same, I firmly believe that your hearing system as that of every human or a group of humans is different and will not change unless we have the same hearing genes, it seems crazy but those tiny differences somehow inexplicable some of us perceive it and so one seems to sound better or lower or brighter etc. Thank you
thank you for insight!
I’ve been using reaper exclusively for about as long as you and I do(and I really hate to say it.REALLY)but I think that pro tools sounds better I’m in the process of determining if it is pan law that I am hearing ...pro tools in so unnecessarily convoluted that It make me mad every time I see the logo 😂
That’s fascinating to hear! Definitely check the pan laws, they are differing but in reaper can be changed easily to act like protocols. Cheers !
Man I'm a mix and mastering engineer and to me reaper sounds bigger more open more analog than pro tools even reaper stock plugins kill profools rubbish
I feel the opposite... since ProTools is way more cpu hungry, my computer is way hotter... and so I know for a fact that ProTools is warmer... So I tend to use ProTools in Winter and Reaper in Summer... LOL
@@deadbongo epic ^^
@@deadbongo when its a really cold winter, i like to turn on my 10 uad satellites and overload them. warmest sound ever
@bighousemusic if reaper sounds better then why are all major label funded releases all on pro tools? If reaper was better then they would use that and so would institutions. So thanks for proving that you listen to music through a toaster. 🤡
maybe the differece was the dither
No need to worry about a "noise" even a cat cannot hear.
This guy looks high 🤜🏻🤛🏻
I really do... but it's just the 2 ridiculous LED lights that are blinding me and are right in my face in order to make these videos.
@@BlueHouseSoundStudio I hope you don't get glaucoma from those lights! Looking forward to more content on your channel as I'm currently recording my first EP from a garage, i could use the tips 🤝🏻
@@gloriboigaming7583 Thanks man! More are definitely coming! and good luck on the EP!
@@BlueHouseSoundStudio Check us out! 'The Slums' local to the IE 🤙🏼 ruclips.net/video/bNSh48d0iwc/видео.html
@@gloriboigaming7583 Cool Stuff! Played shows in Rialto before and use to live in Riverside. If you find you are needing help still on the mix or recording. You could hire me, haha or I know of a few good places around the area that I can recommend.
Why are you shouting
is anyone else here to compare the fact that one is a free, and the other robs your wallet? no? ok, thanks
reaper is not free. it´s cheap.
People still use Pro Tools? Ahahahahahahahaha
Let hope not. 🤗
It could be the Dither! Pro Tools has got an automatic Dither that keeps happening even if you unselect the option when exporting. Weirdo unexplained shit btw!
Pro tools don’t have automatic dither when bounce at all
Digital is digital. Period.
hahahhaha good one :)