Terrifying Moments as Two Massive Jets Nearly Collide on a Foggy Providence Runway (With Real Audio)
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- Опубликовано: 14 июл 2021
- A United Boeing 757 fails to follow its taxi-in clearance after a night landing in fog at Providence, Rhode Island, and ends up in the same active runway it just landed on. At the same time, the air traffic controller clears a FedEx Boeing 727 to take off. As a result, the 727 begins its takeoff roll, accelerating towards the holding 757. Find out what happens next.
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Игры
Can we all just respect how the US Air crew declined takeoff clearance multiple times probably saving hundreds of lives?
Yes sure👍👍👍 salute to them!!!
Bravo BRAVO To that crew....talk about making the RIGHT call.
Bravo
Bravo!!
Including their own!
Pilot: I'm on an active runway.
Tower: Be quiet. Standby til I call you. U.S. Air cleared for takeoff.
Me: Is she insane?
Maybe. But the pilot told her that he was on 23R the first time when he was actually on 23L, that's why she was confused. 23R wasn't an active runway. He misspoke at 7:12 and said 23R. She shouldn't have cleared the other flight for takeoff without more confirmation, but the United pilot is partially to blame.
She's not insane. Politics put her where she wasn't comfortable.
@@iamtheowl9631 doesn't matter. He was clearly confused. Your job as the controller is to confirm 100% there's no one on an active runway before clearing other aircraft to take off. Also, "someone just took off" is pretty clear to me
@@thehair9236 Yes, she clearly holds most of the blame. But let’s not pretend that this pilot doesn’t need some training. If you are almost struck by an aircraft you need to say that, not “someone just took off.” Then you add the fact that he miss read the sign and said the wrong runway. He holds some of the blame also.
@@iamtheowl9631 Yes but 1448 later said they were on 23L then the controller cut off the pilot before they could explain themselves then cleared a jet full of people to take off on 23L. Staggering negligence. When the takeoff clearance was given 1448 EXPLICITELY said they were on an active runway. Still... again gives takeoff clearance.
Why is it everyone else listening in, that night, can figure out the obvious danger except the controller? The controller who won't be killed in a fiery crash if these two planes collide on the runway.
I am thrilled that the USAir pilots received an award for their performance. Ultimately, the captain is responsible for the safety of their aircraft, and they did 100% the right thing by declining takeoff clearance. All potential pilots should watch this video or listen to the ATC audio as a learning tool. Lives were almost certainly saved here.
can you give a link about that ?
That’s great! They actually got an award ! Wow
Medal to the pilot and unemployment for the ATC
@@asdf3568 She was relocated. Not unemployment. She had additional training.
@@bambicrandi you must know her pretty good
I love how the female pilot on the United flight got so fed up with her other pilot being treated like that by ATC that she ended up talking to ATC like they were a child
Yelp
Lol
Its their fault in the first place for not knowing where the fuck they were
@@hurpaderpp yes, but you also need to factor in the fact that its dark, in thick fog, and an unfamiliar airport.
@@hurpaderpp Yes their mistake started the whole problem, but the controller instead of listening to the information UA was trying to convey decided to continue to give clearance for takeoff on a runway that United reported several times they were blocking. A disaster never is caused by a single event, there is always a chain of multiple critical events leading up to it. United ended up on an active runway, then realized their mistake when a FedEx takes off above them. They then convey that they are on a live runway to the controller, and for whatever reason the controller decides to ignore the info despite UA warning them about their incursion and clear another aircraft for takeoff before confirming that the runway she was giving clearance for was clear.
The break in the chain in events was when USAir declined the clearance not once, but twice, because they had the awareness to realize that something was not right with the situation. Had they accepted clearance and taken off, we would unfortunately be watching a new episode of Seconds From Disaster
One of greatest responses in aviation history. “ Until we figure out what’s going on down there we’re just going to stay clear of all runways!” USAIR pilot Gods!
The correct answer to give when things don't add up. Not pilot god, but a pilot that knows his job and the inherent dangers of it. In the end the captain of the plane has the last word, and he used his the way it should have been. In that situation, if the potential for a fuckfest is not zero or less, choose the safer choice. Sit it out until things are sorted out.
Great piloting, but please don't call any human being God.
@@jamespenny9482 correct, because there is no god. Not wise to call a human by unexisting imaginatory things.
@@user-rw7xg6wg1h In plain English, please.
@@Pdor_figlio_di_Kmer At least in 19th or 20th century English, if 21st century isn't available.
I give evangelicals a huge part of the blame for the USA being as messed up as it currently is.
The controller definitely has a “do not argue with me” mentality. This is not the job for her.
Hopefully sacked.
Exactly. Has she not watched the flight channel's worst aviation disaster in history. The Dutch captain who failed from the same "don't tell me I know better" attitude. Holy h.
A controller’s job is to control. She is supposed to be authoritative.
@@timonsolus Whilst true, she was ignorant of the information other pilots were giving her and adamant she had the picture right in her head which made her disregard what she was hearing.
@@timonsolus Authority is one thing, argumentative stupidity is another.
I’m a pilot and I can attest that being on the ground taxiing around at night or in poor visibility can be absolutely nerve racking.
Novice!🤣
@@stephencarlsbad excuse him for not having owl eyes, and anti fog advanced systems, you're literally calling names for something every normal person would say
@@anasl9094 Anus calm down, I was ribbing the guy. Obviously, he's a skilled pilot. 😄
@@stephencarlsbad ive seen this joke like thousands time and i laughed the first time now its just meeeh
@@anasl9094 (sigh) oh'kay...
The words "Till we figure out what's going on down there we're just going to stay clear of all runways" sound like gospel to my ears. Declining takeoff clearance, despite the very hostile attitude of the ATC saved hundreds of lives. Everything that went wrong on Tenerife in 1977, went well here. Deep respect to the amazing US Air crew, they are heroes.
In the extended version of this conversation between them and ATC they actually continued holding short until United had reached their gate, just to be extra safe.
The USAir pilots received a safety award from ALPA for NOT taking off!
Very well deserved! Towards the end I was thinking I must post and ask if that pilot had received any recognition for refusing to take off. First comment I saw was yours, already answering my question. Thank you so much for sharing this information.
@@FinnishLapphund Ditto! Multiple thumbs-up regarding this incident!
Ohh Wonderful!!! They deserve it
Its good to see a pilot take the RIGHT action here and save many lives!
The USAair pilot made the right choice at the right time. That ATC chick should have been written up for not paying attention to the communication of the lost pilots and clearing another flight to take off. Glad that pilot overroad her demand
that controller almost killed a bunch of people, she clears a plane for takeoff? kudos to the pilot that had to refuse twice takeoff clearance
To look
@@tanishcqmehta9984 Controller did a poor job and they certainly can be blamed. Very clear confusion amongst the pilots and ATC can’t just go ahead when it’s obvious the pilots aren’t sure with themselves. She was warned of a confused aircraft on an active runway. She’s lucky it wasn’t a crash because she would’ve been in serious trouble. It’s clear she lost her cool and the other aircraft had no faith in her and therefore refused take off clearance.
@@tanishcqmehta9984 listen to it again - they very clearly explained where they were when they realized they were on active runway and she told them to be quiet and that she had other things to take care of - proceeds to clear plan AGIAN for takeoff
did the controller get fired?
@@tanishcqmehta9984 United pilots told ATC they saw a plane took off near them and they were on an active runway, while at that time only ONE runway is in active condition, but ATC still cleared the takeoff for USAir when she could not figure out the exact location of United, you think the controller is innocent???
The controller was NOT wanting to listen to the United crew because she couldn’t accept she made a mistake that could have cost lives. BRAVO to all of the pilots whom took charge.
The United crew made the wrong turn into an active runway, idiot! The controller was slow and confused, but it was the United crew's mistake.
She didn’t initially make the mistake though. United took a wrong turn. Her problem was thinking she knew everything and refusing to really listen when she heard something that made no sense at all (‘somebody just took off’ at an inactive runway, among various other strange things said that didn’t add up with her mental picture of where everyone was).
I think this illustrates how difficult being a ground controller is and how many skills it takes. Good diction, calm head, great spatial awareness, great situational awareness, AND the ability to listen (not hearing what you expect.) Not many people have that. Such as this controller.
You just have to pay attention. It’s not difficult. You literally are the person the tells pilots when they can and can’t take off or land. Therefore, as long as you act professional and don’t get lazy, it’s not hard.
ROFLMAO
@@michaelscott33in fairness, a plane took a wrong turn and the ATC had zero visibility. She def didn’t seem in control though. Clearing another flight for takeoff was insanity.
"Don't talk, I have other things I need to do"
Controlling traffic evidently wasn't one of those other things.
she was looking for her CYA manuel
She was right because 1448 kept saying at 07:14 that they are at 23R which doesn't correctly describe his position. 737 pilot realises the inconsistency at 09:53 and says that pilot doesn't even know where he is therefore makes 1448 to recheck at his position at 09:59 when asked then he changes at 10:05 that he is on 23L. It's like saying hey, I'm in London next to World Trade Center which confuses the controller. Then the other pilot says he doesn't know where he is. Then he corrects that with, I'm in NYC next to World Trade Center then now everyone speaks the same language. He was the problem here. The controller was dealing with what she was being told and 23R is not 23L.
@@BS-kl9yf Yeah, but the pilot ALSO told ATC that he was on an active runway and that "someone just took off" right in front of him. ATC should've figured out right there and then that he wasn't on the cleared runway and should've calmly handled the situation to avoid further confusion but she acted like a bitch instead, disregarding what the pilot was saying with an "I'm right, you're wrong" mentality, even clearing the other plane for take-off. There was no need for her hostility, that isn't what she is trained to do.
She shouldn't be on that job.
Even the US Air crew knew what was happening and it wasn't even their job.
@@abnnizzy 06:26 that is what she was doing. Told them to stop so that she can figure out. If you read my comment well you would understand that her trying to figure out was complicated with contradictory information. She cleared the flight knowing 1448 is lost on 23R. So she was trying to locate where on 23R. The others were on 23L. The whole airport doesn't come to a halt because someone on the entry gate is lost, those who are exiting continue. But if they say they are around exit route, that is when you stop exit! Common sense. Everyone is just mad because she shouted, but you forgetting she was being pushed by continuous wrong information that didn't add up. The person who solved this situation is the person who caused it when he gave the correct information. Problem solved at the source.
@@BS-kl9yf The moment the pilot said "I'm on an active runway" and "someone just took off" , yes, the airport should've come to a halt. Even more so with contradictory information, cause if the pilot is saying he is on 23R, which isn't an active runway, but he is seeing some other plane take off right in front of him, anyone smart enough would've figured out that he isn't where he is supposed to be.
Instead, she acted like Ms. Kown It All with a "lol ur not" attitude and procceded to clear the other pilot for take off. If it wasn't for said pilot common sense to not move and the female pilot to take charge and confront ATC, this would've been a disaster.
That controller's thinking process and temperament are not compatible with aviation. Even though the United pilots made a mistake (it happens), the controller needed to calm down and listen to the them, like the US Air crew did.
Exactly what i was thinking
She had heavy fog and no ground to tell her where planes were or werent. What I want to know is was she the only person in the tower? Handling everything? Like wtf. This airport is ass backwards. Cannot blame it all on her. She sounded incredibly stressed.
@@theaveragesimmer4780 if she had just listened for 2 seconds she would have realized what was going on and acted accordingly
@@Browhoisyou well again, your comment goes back to my question of if she was the only controller in the tower. Ever done that job? Ever done it alone?
@@theaveragesimmer4780 well then you STOP EVERYTHING on the airport and figure out what's going on you do not just assume everything is where it is supposed to be and continue as normal
Big round of applauses to the USAir pilots and crew. They definitely saved hundreds of lives on that day by refusing to take off.
That US Air pilot is a great airman. He listened to what was going on, kept his cool and simply declined taking off. The weakest link in this, the ATC did not listen to what United was saying on a foggy night.
I like how the female pilot basically said “LOOK BITCH, THIS IS WHERE WE ARE” in the most professional way possible 😂👏🏾👏🏾
also probably said "let me do the talking" to the other pilot in the cockpit.
@@ahmads5889 stfu
Haha.
I didn’t hear her say that?
@@urmom9873 right
I remember this from training like 17 years ago. This one sticks on your brain because of all the pressure this controller added to the situation with her hostility toward the crews who truly prevented a catastrophe.
Had the aircraft that took off over the other aircraft on ground know that it was there before pulling up it would of been better to hear their cockpit voice recorder as they approached the near collision
Please tell me she was fired...
@@rich_edwards79 the pilot? Prob not, but should have been. Both of them.
@@MACQ98 no the atc lady 🙃
@@rich_edwards79 probably not. The controller was one link in a chain. Retrained? Definitely. But you can be sure she’ll never make that mistake again.
US Air Captain: "Ma'am, me and my co-pilot like living. In this fog, the only possible way that United saw that plane taking off and over them is in fact that there are on an active runway. They've told you twice, they are on an active runway. So you can keep clearing me to take off all night, but I am not slamming my plane into another plane at 300 miles an hour, no matter how much you want me to. Figure shit out and get back to me. K THANKS BYE!"
My dad’s good friend was an air traffic controller in Oklahoma and trained controllers there later in his career. He used this situation with the United flight and the air traffic controller as the prime example of what not to do if a situation like this occurs. However, the US Air pilot showed professional, exemplary airmanship and was right on with his choice. The controller was so hostile, aggressive, and unforgiving of the potentially confusing and no doubt really hard visibility. My heart goes out to the United and US Air pilots for their professionalism while the controller made a fool of herself.
Jesus the tower really just ignored all the calls of them saying they are on an active runway
It’s funny how your mind works when you are convinced that you are right and other person is wrong that you will ignore the danger. This is not uncommon.
@@jaknap1 what's that phrase, "only a fool is SURE"?!
@@jaknap1 VERY true!
@@jaknap1
Better safe than sorry.
I'd rather lose time and make sure the runway is clear.
I said elsewhere they ought to just have people in carts come out and guide planes in heavy fog. It sounds stupid, but planes ending up on active runways is a bad deal.
Id rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
I’m glad no one was killed. It was also a good thing that the US Air pilots realized something was wrong and refused to take off.
Absolutely !! ATC should have grasped the situation earlier.
The USair 737 pilot was the hero of the day. Once he sensed the confusion, he correctly decided that there was no way he was going to take-off despite getting clearance.
@@mikeweaver8790 Absolutely, he probably saved many lives.
They had just landed
He's worked w females enough to know yes... while equality is cool and everything... they are prone to EMOTIONAL stress. And when one is being emotional u gotta give them space! (Hence her telling everyone to 'be quiet' like a mom chaperone a sleepover)
We covered this particular case in our recurrent ATC training about 10 (?) years ago. We were all shocked that the controller didn’t pick up on the “an aircraft just took off” comment from United. Sure, the United made a mistake which almost led to the initial collision, but my oh my, how the controller did her best to make it a certainty by then clearing US Air for takeoff. Good job on that pilot for acknowledging the fustercluck that it was. What perhaps saved everyone, and isn’t mentioned anywhere, is that there weren’t separate ground & air frequencies. You could almost be sure a disaster would’ve happened had that been the case.
That USAir pilot. Thank you for staying in command of your aircraft and mastering the situation. Countless lives were saved because of your attentiveness and composure.
That controller was hellbent on making this a much worse situation.
She clearly wanted to but the pilot told her nope! That pilot deserves free Beers for life!
She was doing all she could to make it worse while acting like a stroppy teacher at the same time.
She wanted to show everyone who was boss. She wasn’t listening. Good thing the pilots stood their ground.
She should have been fired and made a public example of
that was the devil occupying a human for a time.... jesus Christ lol
What gets me is, if she is relying on the pilots to self report their locations, there should never be a situation where the pilots identify themselves at a spot and the ATC declines to accept that as an answer. Remember ATC, you are BLIND at the moment. If something doesn't make sense, ground everyone until you regain a mental map of where everyone is. No assumptions.
What gets me is, she did take pilot's report of his location at face value. They said they were on 23 RIGHT. The only time they say 23 LEFT before USAir gets involved, the transmission is blocked. She tells everyone to shut up and stand by for a minute to clear her head and try and get it straight, but United continues to talk on frequency, and is also giving her incorrect information. That is the 'ground everyone' moment you're asking for, you missed it. Unfortunately she was given incorrect information. To the controller, the pilots are on 23 Right, as reported, and they seem to be wanting to make sure that 23R (where they reported they are) is not an active runway. This is reinforced by her clarification that 23R is a taxiway under IFR conditions. She then clears USAir as United self reported their position to be at the intersection of 23 RIGHT and 16, nowhere near 05R where USAir was taking off from. In my opinion the root cause in the chain of events was an insufficient after-landing briefing. Call me paranoid, but in that low of visibility I would have been checking headings as I taxied. That would have prevented them getting past the bend on Bravo and back onto 05R in the first place. Yeah, they should have been expecting a left turn, but not that quickly after exiting, and also not that sharp a turn. It should have felt wrong and caused them to halt on Bravo. That being said, the root cause of something does not always have the most impact on its outcome, or indicate where blame should ultimately lie, in this case, the self reporting system for low vis conditions completely broke down, exposing the weakness of a such a system, when one party is intimately familiar with the airport (ATC), and there's only a chance of that for the other party (the pilots of UA1448). There is a bunch of second guessing, but rarely the right amount, and rarely at the right time. But that second guessing does sometimes save lives (USAir)
@@schwig44 maybe more signage and closer together would help?
@@englishmadcow7461 If placed properly, sure, but the thing is, the signage is already up to snuff in terms of the regulations. This incident was a result of multiple complicating factors, primarily being the inoperative ground radar.
Like I mentioned above, this would have never happened had the pilots been checking the heading they are pointing towards throughout the taxi procedure, and requires no additional equipment.
If we want to talk about new equipment though, I just threw a sloppy design together in my head for a system of magnetic field emitters on the field and hall effect sensors on the planes to 'code' a magnetic signature to each taxiway, the hall effect sensors would be able to read the signatures, and interpret it thanks to an onboard database. This would enable the plane to display the current taxiway (or even ramps, etc) on the NAV display, which certainly should have alerted the United pilots to their error, but it could also be coupled with CPDLC (built into the plane text messaging for getting clearances) to ensure that the plane is complying with the given taxi clearances.
It would be a similar principle to standard radio navigation, but without congesting the already overwhelmed bands
@@schwig44 I'm so sorry, I'm not looking to buy aviation aids. I don't drive or fly. But thank you for replying.
@@englishmadcow7461 that's a shame, you were my best lead on funding so far
He rememberd the tenerife crash and he was like: hell no
First time hearing this audio/about this event. As a controller my reaction in thd very beginning of the video was negative towards the united for taking the wrong taxi route. However as the video/situation progressed, the controller literally could not have handled this situation any worse. Cudos to ALL pilots here for handling it well and avoiding a tragedy. Were all a team with aviation
United: “I’m on an active runway”
ATC: “No you’re not!”
That still absolutely blows my mind.
I would have been like.. Bitch i just saw an airplane take off and almost hit us. ...
@@davidholman6276 Exactly my thoughts
What gets me is, if she is relying on the pilots to self report their locations, there should never be a situation where the pilots identify themselves at a spot and the ATC declines to accept that as an answer. Remember ATC, you are BLIND at the moment. If something doesn't make sense, ground everyone until you regain a mental map of where everyone is. No assumptions.
Yeah, "The runway you're on isn't active even though I don't know which runway you're on, so stop talking!".
LOVE the situational awareness of the USAir pilots!
He didn't only listen his callsign ,something to learn from!
Yep! That guy deserves a gold star. Hope he got one!
Exactly he just stated that he's staying clear, great awareness this is was the most logical thing to do kiddos to the us air pilot 🙏🎉🍻
@Gurumurthy V
Also the USA pilot remained calm and stuck to his guns on that decision. Cool, calm, and collected.
A seasoned, aware, and confident Captain.
We thought you worked at a bowling alley. Where did you get your training?
Yes, oftentimes it DOES PAY to ignore what the ATC tower orders you to do.
Go ... WITH ... YOUR ... GUT!
WOW!!!!..talk about nail biting suspense and near tragedy. Thank goodness for well trained, observant and patient pilots whose better judgement saved multiple lives that night.
wow, that controller let her emotions get in the way and her incompetency almost got people killed. and the lost pilot definitely couldve helped alot by giving more info than just 'somebody just took off'
That controller almost caused a tragedy by clearing the takeoff despite the fact of knowing there was still a confusion going on. She should have been fired.
Maybe she just got confused but I agree, but maybe not get fired
Indeed the controller is not capable.
Agree, incompetent.
A typical social media comment. She should be retrained and by now...there is ground radar.
@@weiSane being confused and still giving takeoff clearance versus being confused and holding everyone until you figure out what's going on are two totally different things.
The atc controller was determined to be right even though everything pointed at her being wrong. She sounded like an angry momma yelling at everyone over the radio. Emotional and unprofessional.
And dangerous.
Seriously. Hope she is nowhere near an airport right now. Unless she's mopping bathroom stalls.
She was confused. The United 1448 pilots were telling her that 1448 was on Runway 23Right, when in fact 1448 was on Runway 23Left. She placed too much credence in the information 1448 was giving her. Also United 1448 did not clearly tell her “We have made a wrong turn” when they knew they had.
Can we guess the name of the atc controller?
Begins with K... LOL
She just wanted to go home early😂
@@timonsolus that is why she should have remained calm and act professional, regardless of what they didn't tell her, they infact said, "someone just took off", that is more than enough reason to treat the situation with more serious urgency, she should have been fired or suspended period.
The US Air Pilots were heroes. Honestly, they saved this from being a Tenerife situation.
Respect to the smart guy who turned down the take off clearance and saved innocent lives👍
That US Air pilot deserves a few rounds of beers for that, what a hero.
@@HEDGE1011 great to know!
What part of they just said they're on an active runway makes you think I'm about to try and take off?? Safety first! We all remember Pan Am in Tenerife.
@Roy M WTF dude? Beer? Really? He deserves a fucking medal! He saved fucking lives!!!
@@HEDGE1011 AWESOME! So we’ll deserved!!
RIP US Air though,
They literally just saw a plane fly over them. And she’s still telling others they’re clear for takeoff? 🤦♀️ Bravo to the other pilot for refusing to take off. That there is using critical thinking and taking charge of the plane and doing what’s best for everyone, including himself, in that plane.
Yes, like, that's a clear giveaway of their position, as only one plane takes off at a time and the controler knows which plane just took off. How the hell could she ingore that? And yes, mad respect to the pilot of the other plane for refusing to take off when he thought it wasn't safe.
United 1448 did not clearly state that a plane had taken off OVER THE TOP OF THEM. They just said ‘a plane just took off’, they didn’t say that the takeoff happened near them.
@@HEDGE1011 Thanks for the link! Good to know they received some recognition for that.
@@timonsolus True, but the controller had to (should) know that is the only plane that just took off. On the only active runway. That's where reasonable doubt should be taken into account. Are you the karen that almost killed all those ppl?
He was exerting his rights as pilot-in-command. You are the one in charge of and responsible for the safe operation of that aircraft. If ATC makes a mistake you speak up
Wow. Really good one to cover. Really technical too. This is why I never get too pissy when there’s a delay after pushback and we just sit there for a bit. Sometimes there’s a mundane reason for the delay but usually there’s some seriously complex routing going on with absolutely no margin for error. I don’t fault anyone here, not even the controller, and I’m just glad everyone played it cool and didn’t make matters worse.
Wo!! That could have been a horrible disaster! My respects for the USAIR pilots for staying put until things got sorted out!
8:45 so much respect for this person. and i love how he said “… until he- _we_ figure this out”
Agree! He made it a concerted effort instead 😊
“ He doesn’t even know where he is” Airport should of been put on hold for ALL in and out traffic until they figured out what the hell was going on. I am not making light of that quote.
Absolutely! How can you have planes taking off and landing when there is potentially another plane sitting in the middle of the runway??
@@ZenkaiAnkoku2 AGREED
@JafoCharlie Dude you're righteous as fuck!
This. And we're not talking about the Marfa municipal airport. If you've got a staffed tower, safe bet you've got somebody else wandering around that could be in a car with a radio going to confirm any situation where there's even the slightest confusion, and/or lead the aircraft to where it needs to be.
@@kd5nrh Amen dude Amen!!!
06:15 somebody just took off. This definitely chilled the spine of the pilot 👨✈️ at the active runway
2998 pilot was super professional!!! She kept pushing tin!! Pretty ballsie to hear an almost miss & keep sending planes down that runway!!!!
"How many times would you like me to tell you I'm on an active runway?"
"I want you to tell me you're where I told you to go, otherwise you're wrong and need to standby [for impact]." - Bullying people while willfully ignorant of the situation ("I can't see you from the tower, but you're wrong about what you see"??) is the antithesis of the primary purpose of ATC, which according to the FAA is preventing collisions.
"The air traffic controller is responsible to give first priority to the separation of aircraft," Aeronautical Information Manual, Section 5-5-1 paragraph C.
@@uus4938 AMEN! Hallelujah!!
Sounds like a few phone calls needed to be made afterward.
n+1
ATC = Yes
The US Air Pilots basically averted a second Tenerife. Also did the FedEx pilots not see a Boeing 757 poking halfway into its takeoff path?
US air 2998: I’m going to pretend I didn’t see that
Great captain on the US air declining take off out of an abundance of caution. The Air Traffic controller should have been disciplined and retrained keeping that plane on an active runway.
US Air pilots did a spectacular and professional job, Kudo's to them, I am wondering if the Fedex plane ever saw the united plane and then why the controller did not ask them?
Nah, Tenerife was way worse.
A true professional pilot refused take off clearance, twice.
All the pilots were terrific. They all saved each other.
This is reminding me of an Air Canada flight, in San Francisco, flight 759. I can't remember the details, I just remember how crazy close it was, the Air Canada plane was like 50 or 60 feet above another plane that was on the taxiway.
I remember it because even though it happened in SF, the flight started here in Canada, so it was in the news quite a lot at the time.
I have had zero experience or training in the field of air traffic control but even I know clearing a plane for takeoff when YOU DON'T KNOW if there's another aircraft on the runway is just mind boggling levels of incompetence and negligence.
Exactly!! Don't have to be an atc, just have a smidgeon of common sense. Or perhaps should be called uncommon in this day and age.
I agree! But here I suppose the ATC thought that 1448 was on an inactive runway. She thought she knew where it was and the pilots were mistaken. That's where she went wrong.
@@sanyasharma80 Indeed, for much of the time the ATC was absolutely sure she knew where 1448 was.
Actually, the controller DID know, as United just told her with no reservations that they were on an ACTIVE runway and a plane just took off. When there is only ONE plane taking off, you know what runway they are on. Thankfully, the 727 was designed for short field ops. I am sure the pilots were sweating when they saw the lights only a few hundred meters ahead. I wonder if they were thinking 'Deja vu' Tenerife....
What does she mean “I need to know what runway you’re on”?? He just said somebody just took off…. The only plane that took off was the fedex, it’s obvious what runway they were on
Agree and the tower would have knowledge of this on their system. Jack Shit must be her boyfriend or husband
In all fairness, saying you just saw somebody take off, is next to useless information to ATC. Need to be more specific, like, hey, a plane almost hit us, as it was taking off. Also, it is the most insane thing anybody can do, just taxi on a runway in fog, just saying. The ATC was out of order though in the way situation was dealt with IMO.
@@collincovid6950 Nah....she doesn't know Jack Shit.
@@tensevo The right thing she could've done is to HALT any further activity until they locate the exact position of the aircraft. She did not carry out her job properly and almost caused 2 collisions!
@@siesaw1 The reason she did not halt, was because she assumed the plane was in a different location, away from danger. I am old school in that I think it is everybody's duty to avoid collision, not just ATC.
Superb, sensational job 2998. Wow. Paid attention to all the chatter, understood the situation better than tower did, and refused to budge until the confusion could be straightened out. Practically deserves a commendation, as far as I'm concerned. BOY, this was nervewracking to watch. There goes my blood pressure!
Thank God, someone had the guts to challenge ATC
Whooboy! That's a mess. Thank goodness that one pilot was like, "Aw, HELL no!"
Lucky he didn’t have ‘get-there-osis’.
Even refused with an adamant and aggressive sounding ATC
Agreed
He's had nightmares of Tenerife disaster after watching the flight channel
I really hope that US Air pilot received the FAA highest award or recognition. This is one case every airline should use to train pilots. Always go with your gut even if you feel you'er beeing bullied by ATC.
Yeah and the ATC lady should have been fired!
Smart Pilot to say I'm staying clear of all runways till this is figured out..... I applaud that pilot !!!
Kudos to that second Capt. For one, paying attention to the radio traffic and two, standing his ground and refusing the go ahead from the ATC.
The USAir Captain needs an award omg!!
The crew received the ALPA Airmanship Award that year fwiw
@@bigB6flyer Good to hear they got some recognition. Thank you for that information!
@@bigB6flyer I am SO happy to hear this. Excellent recognition for them, kudos, US Air!
Why isn't anyone appreciating the Fedex pilot for fighting all odds to get the packages on time to us?
because his plane took off so early, that he missed all the fun, he never knew what was going on.
They didn’t know of a runway incursion. It’s a good thing a 727 is a STOL aircraft.
Why didn't the FedEx pilot let ATC know they narrowly missed hitting the United plane on the runway? It seems like that would have cleared things up faster.
@@tatergirl36 Given the visibility (or lack thereof) I am guessing the 7-2 crew never knew that it even happened as they had already rotated and started climb out. If they did know though, I would love to hear the playback of the flight deck recording!
While almost avoiding a collision and losing theirs lives
It must have been awful for the United pilots to be ordered to remain on what they knew was an active runway. Thank God the alert USAir pilots prevented a disaster. It is painful and terrifying to listen to the tower controller's mistakes.
This is routinely used in airline crm. It’s a reminder to pay attention, maintain sa, and not be afraid to speak up if something seems off.
Wow the setup for this was precisely like Tenerife.
Exactly what I was thinking, except this time the pilot of the other aircraft had the intuition not to start a take off roll because he was aware there was confusion and potential for a collision. Good job US Air. Thank God The FedEx 727 wasn't too heavy and got off the ground without needing to use more of the runway.
Exactly my thoughts. Tenerife 2.0 was avoided thanks to the FedEx plane being lighter. Otherwise... This was crazy, divine luck.
Yes. Thinking this also. Complacency and arrogance sadly in both.
@@JasonWardStudios Agreed, totally. I couldn't believe the Tenerife particulars, especially from 4705. The radio thing was bad timing and luck, but it would have been completely inconsequential if procedures were followed before that takeoff roll. I can only guess that someone in that US Air plane remembered that tragedy before moving the throttles.
Yeah, hauntingly similar.
"Everyone stop talking because I have other things to do, like crashing two planes on a runway!"
yeah that comment was a doosie, she needs to adjust her attitude and find a new job.
Clearly, what ATC needed to do for herself was stop and think, but before she did that she needed to stop every other moving part.
All ground aircraft, all ground equipment, and anything in the air looking to make approach final.
The evidence suggests, at least on that night, the controller did not have the temperament to hold that position safely.
This is now funny 😄😄
Crazy part the pilots would’ve been at fault & not the controller for clearing the U.S Air for takeoff
Eyeliner and lipstick
Much respect for the pilot that kept his head, paid attention and stuck to his guns putting safety first
This sounds similar to the tragedy in Tenerife in 1977, where a KLM 747 took off without clearance and smashed into a Pan Am 747 that was taxiing on the same runway. Both planes were on the same runway by mistake. 583 passengers and crew died. Fortunately, that didn't happen in this instance. Close call! 🥵
ATC should have held all take-offs until they located United 1448.
Typical female in charge-itis
@@dezznutz3743 Mommy was too strict honey?
IFR conditions + no ground instrumentation + confusion as to location = hold all ground traffic NOW.
@@RLTtizME a case of the cramps?
@@irongoatrocky2343 Or is it just like you leading up to the first volley of explosive diarrhea?
The USAir pilot saw what was up and was like: "I would like to be excluded from this narrative"
That man love his life. He’s also watched every episode of Air Disaster. Happy everyone is safe!
I completely understand the controller's desire to get as many planes out of her way so she could focus on the one that was having issues, but god bless those other pilots for paying attention and remaining firm! What a crazy situation!
9:48 I like how she adds "BTW 1448 is NOT on the runway" with absolute confidence and then follows with "k, do whatever you want"
She was insane!
The pilot of the second plane pulled a pro pilot move
Who is that pilot? He needs a hefty bonus in his paycheck!
At least a few ATTABOYS
This pilot did just opposite of what Pierre Bonnin did while flying AIR FRANCE
Nope he didn’t crash into the other plane not a pro move
@@lamboodabest bruh
That ATC was NOT having it. "DONT TALK, I have other things to do!" Jeez.
Then promptly clears US Air takeoff even though both United pilots expressed that they could see a sign stating 23L. lmao
Reminds me of my ex-wife.
Reminds me of the Titanic radio crew who said, "Shut up, I'm talking to Cape Race!" when advised by other ships of large chunks of icebergs in the area.
As she left the one plane sitting across an active runway and then decided to once again insist the other plane take off on the same runway. You sure do have other things to do lady, like find a new job!
Like try to kill hundreds of people!!
it baffles me how the controller knew that the united aircraft was lost and didn't know where it was, and even was reported that someone just took off where the united aircraft was, but still cleared the us airways aircarft for takeoff???? what were they thinking
my only guess is that since the fedex airline didnt crash or report a sighting of the united airline, the controller was confident they were at 23R / 16
US-AIR-2998 captain was the real MVP for paying attention to what was about to happen
That controller needs to find another job. She’s not cut out for this.
Yeah, Walmart...
As an active air traffic controller, we do not claim her.
I did not understand... please explain.
her man HER
@@The_Beast_666 that's some hunger games analogy or some shit, idk
@@The_Beast_666 he doesn't accept her as part of their group (i.e. air traffic controllers) "not one of ours"
There are many instances where people fail to process unexpected or new information, particularly when they are already under stress having to control the airport 'blind'. Its just in most other jobs the stakes are not as high. I would not be vindictive or try to fire her because she for sure is never going to make this type of mistake again. But I'd focus on better training for all controllers. They're under just as much pressure as pilots, it's just a different type of pressure.
New to channel but what you do here is so fascinating! Really minimal but good story telling!Thank God nothing happened!
I’m not a pilot but had 20 hours of instruction and it was the darned radio that I could never get comfortable with. To this day I wonder how commercial pilots and controllers understand one another. This was a good example. I can’t help but think that besides the fog, the rapid verbiage played some role in this near-tragedy. Anybody else have similar thoughts or am I out to lunch? Can a pilot or ATC comment? As naive as this question may sound, I’d really like to know.
Thank you.
0 experience here but I feel like I'd also have trouble understanding a lot of what is said..and I'm a native speaker lol
Can you imagine being a passenger on the right side of the aircraft and seeing that FedEx jet coming???
@Kristina
You can bet there was screaming!
Not if it was very foggy.
@@chrisgast The lights from the 727 were probably bright enough they did see it coming.
@@watershed44 Probably. Probably not. None of us know how low the visibility truly was that night.
@@chrisgast I can promise you when the 727 was right near they saw it.
The amount of times the united pilot had to repeat himself was completely ludicrous.
I mean…wow! What I want to know is, why aren’t there trackers on every single aircraft? Just as how TFC displayed graphics of the aircrafts on the runway and in their respective positions, that’s how ATC should see every single plane in their area. At no time should an aircraft be near an active runway and not on radar flashing flight number and an active GPS or something. Perhaps airports need redesigning as well. One side for incoming, one for outgoing. And another for the resting area.
@@norahelaine6041 I was thinking the same thing, but early in the video they note that there's no "surface radar" at this airport. Which means it's a thing at some other airports I suppose. Seems kind of important...
I think it wasn't like nowadays that we can even track the planes ourselves through a website on our phones. This was 22 years ago. I am thinking the technology back then must have palled in comparison to today's standards. A lot of what we use today probably wasn't even invented.
listen again carefully. The UAL Captain (the male voice) reported their position incorrectly 3 times (he reported 23R) to ATC. That is why she kept trying to clear USAir to takeoff. ATC really screwed the pooch on this one but the UAL Captain didn't help with 3 incorrect position reports even though he had the frappin signs right in front of him. His First Officer was trying to help but all around this was really FUBAR
@Bryce he definitely said the wrong runway (clearly didnt know where he was) but if theres any reason to question or second guess where he might be you cant clear another plane for takeoff.
I came here from another TFC vid about Air Lingus & US Airways near-miss incident where 2 pilots with US Air demonstrated superb airmanship to avoid a would-be disaster.
Here, again, the US Air pilots save many lives with stern determination to put safety first. Then, of course, the miracle on the Hudson. There's something special about US Air pilots.
Wow. Imagine being an air traffic controller and after hearing a pilot that just landed and shouldn't have been on a runway state "I'm on an active runway" and "someone just took off" not *immediately* tell every other plane to stay where they are until they could sort things out.
KPVD is my home airport. This was quite the story back when it happened. I think the controller was either suspended or lost her job shortly afterwards.
GOOD. I really hope she was fired. She sounded like the female version of Anatoly Dyatlov. The way she talks to other professional adults and performs her job shows she was completely out of her depth and cannot calmly or humbly react to a difficult situation. She lets her emotions overrule her reason and becomes a bully.
Seriously she admits she can't see anything. And then proceeds to act like she can. What the???
@@DarkFilmDirector Democrats, all democrats like pelosi&AOC, you give em some power and people die!
@@davidrobbins3018 relax, david
@@davidrobbins3018 what does this have to do with an incident that happened 22 years ago?
I sure hope that controller was terminated and banned following this incident.
This easily could have been a situation where hundreds of people could have been injured or worse..
Thank God the US Air crew stood their ground and demonstrated good resource management.
Kudos to the US Air Captain. United mucked it up and the controller got frustrated and lost it. Give the US Air Captain a medal.
Controller definetly lost it. Respect to the pilot who refused twice for taking off!
Yes, 2998's pilots were the heroes here. Everyone else had no clue what to do, where they were, or how to proceed. But Flight 2998 said "We're not going anywhere!"... and probably saved a lot of lives. That ground controller needs re-training, and the airport needs ground radar...
Retraining? She needs a new career.
@HardWorkingNoGovHelpLowClass Great comment!
@HardWorkingNoGovHelpLowClass love your comment
The 757 co-pilot giving the heading 200 and repeating it calmly, together with visual observations went a long way to resolving the situation. Fog is very disorientating but the ATC did not do well.
It was her stupid attitude, telling everyone to stop talking when *_she_* was the one who needed to shut up and listen.
ATC did fine. Incompetent pilots that cannot follow directions is not ATC fault.
@@user-br6od2qq1f - They couldn't see. Yes, they made a mistake. They were trying to correct that mistake, but the ATC's attitude made it difficult. Attitude isn't just an honest mistake. It's a character defect.
@@user-br6od2qq1f No, the pilots informed ATC that they could see their plane was on an active runway, but the ATC obstinately chose to ignore that information the pilots gave her.
That is in no way "doing fine".
Some intensive re-training and attitude adjustment for the ATC, that's for sure. A great deal of education goes before they attain those positions and they usually don't behave like that.
After this incident, airport protocols were changed to prevent ATC duties being undertaken by members of the overnight cleaning staff.
So very true!
Surprised FedEx never chimed in to mention that they nearly had a catastrophic collision!
I assume that, because of fog, FedEx pilots didn't even see the aircraft they'd just flown over. If I'm wrong, I can't understand their silence.
Exactly my thoughts. And yes, maybe they did not even see what was beneath them.
Because of take off angle?
probably plane upwards attitude immediately after taking off, and imposibility to see the plane due to fog during the take off run.
@ Funniest line of the month.
My airline has used this multiple times during CRM discussions in recurrent training. This has to be the scariest ATC/pilot interaction I’ve ever heard. PVD has a very confusing layout, and I can see how taxiing errors can and did occur in fog. I am greatly impressed by the US Air crew here, and completely appalled by ATC. There is no reason to try to get traffic airborne when there’s a plane in an an unknown position on the ground. This controller makes all the wrong moves and I’m grateful that nobody was hurt; thanks to US Air this wasn’t a tragedy.
The controller was so horrible. Not only was she refusing to listen to an aircraft that was literally telling her they were on an active runway, but she also was being extremely rude and passive aggressive towards the US Air crew for their decision to not takeoff. I hope she found a new profession.
@@LunaticTheCat I understand that the foggy conditions were stressing the controller out, but holy mother of God, as some others have said in one way or another, if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. She was *CLEARLY* in the weeds with this incident. Then, to make a bad situation even worse, she starts sniping at people?!?!?!? Oh, HELLLLLLLLL NO. 🤬
I notice incredibly strange weather in winter, almost like a warm summer humidity but it gets frozen in fog. Every year it’s more regular. Can’t imagine having to fly in that crap. Bless the pilots
The controller reminds me of some colleagues of mine that simply cannot do things out of the order that they were planned. To them, they are so afraid of getting things wrong that they will hammer in on the same order even when all the signs are telling them that there's something wrong.
Very good presentation, TFC. This incident is presented and discussed in many ground school classes, as a very close call. The US Air captain indeed made the right decision. Many airports now have equipment and better taxiway markings to allow controllers as well as pilots to see where they are on the airport, even in dense fog. Even many corporate turboprops built in the last decade or so give pilots the ability through GPS to see their location on the taxiways and where they are on the airport. Most don't have ground TCAS though, so they see only their own airplane's icon on the airport diagram, not where other airplanes are. Only the ground or tower controller can see and coordinate all the moving pieces.
I wonder if they ever whip out FlightRadar 24 on their phone just to double check...
@@PureGlide good idea
@@PureGlide I don't know of pilots who do that while on the taxiways, but that does indeed show on the map where those other airplanes are. All situational awareness helps. When I learned to fly about a century ago we were told to keep our transponders off while on the ground (it cluttered up ATC's screens of that period). Today ATC prefers they be on as soon as the airplane starts taxiing.
why didn't the pilot who took off come back on the radio with a code red warning or what have you, what is his responsibility. HE would have seen the taxi'ing aircraft would he not//?? Also th taxi plane should have said Maam a plane nearly just hit us as he rotated but 3-4 mins later she works out the taxi plane position after giving 2 take off clearances, wow unreal !
@@livingadamman7994 I agree
Not everyone is cut out to be an air traffic controller...
AMEN
But she's strong! She's empowered! SHEEE'S EEEQUAL!
@@robertgantry2118 right, no man ever went on a power trip and caused an accident (see KLM disaster).
@@SinAlameda, or in all likelihood >99% of the others.
Robert Gantry, you're misogyny is showing.
@@robertgantry2118 Don't make this a gender issue. A man could have made this mistake just as likely as a woman. There are terrible male and female ATC's, just as there are fantastic male and female ATC's.
Also, the fact that she's got an attitude is not bad PER SE. It was however her fault that she didn't listen to clues about 1338's position and the fact that she, amidst all confusion, still let 2998 take off is unacceptable and is more than enough reason to get fired for
Good on those pilots for seeing a problem before disaster! Good job where its do. A mistake can be made but if it can be caught before catastrope, then props
United pilot kept on telling the ATC that they were nowhere near where they should have been sitting, she refused to listen, that lady should not be in that job. Pilot that realized that and refused to give in to pressure to take off, proved he has ultimate authority and responsibility over the aircraft and much respect to him for respectfully declining to takeoff despite multiple clearances under unsafe (and probably disastrous) circumstances.
UsAir: I’m gonna sit my happy ass right here and not move a muscle until you people sort this mess out. I’ll turn this plane off istg.
ROTFFLMAO.. dude you totally got me @happy ass #happy_ass
Kudos to the crew of US Air 2998 by preventing this from turning into another Tenerife.
Kudos to the US Air Captain who made the right call, he declined multiple clearance call outs until he had an exact understanding of what was happening..
I'd be willing to bet that 100 years from now a "Top Ten Greatest Moments In ATC Recording History" will feature the US Airways pilot refusing his takeoff clearance at around entry 5 or 6.