Thank you for watching! 💡 What reflections did you take away from this video? Share your thoughts in the comments, I’d love to know what you think! 👇 If you enjoyed it, leave a valuable like 👍 and don’t forget to subscribe to the channel to stay tuned for our future daily reflections! 🔔
Was it better when you didn't exist? Why didn't your lack of existing stop this life from being imposed? If your lack of existing didn't stop a life from being imposed, why would your lack of existing _ever_ stop a life from being imposed?
Important work, yes, but not entirely original. Before Benatar, many philosophers had similar ideas, including Zapfke, Bahnsen, Weininger, Cioran, Caraco, and others. One of the conceptual roots of antinatalism is the concept of "gevorfenheit" (thrownness) in existential philosophy. According to Heidegger, we were thrown into this world without our consent.
@@sandornagy7 Don't forget Schopenhauer. Benatar himself admittedly draws on Schopenhauer. As you rightly said: Benatar's book is important, but hardly original.
@@thomasstergaard4412 Thank you for mentioning Schopenhauer as a major influence on Benatar. Furthermore, we can also mention - to a certain extent - Mainlander (who was also influenced by Schopenhauer), Nietzsche, Sartre, and Camus as having major influences on nihilism and absurdism as well as existentialism ... subsequently infulencing the antinatalists, most notably Cioran and Caraco, and most recently, Benatar.
The "battle against" can sometimes be more like the "dance with". And an inevitable concomitant of the absurdity is a freedom which can be by turns terrifying and exhilarating. Of course, it seems most likely that both the battle and the dance are ultimately meaningless, but perhaps that's an argument for avoiding thinking in terms of "ultimately" and instead, as the sages, ancient and modern, seem ever to counsel, "live in the moment", the only time we really have. Put another way, maybe we're unwise to let (probable) ultimate meaningless rob us of (possible) momentary meaning?
I recently went to a funeral. In attendance there were hundreds of people whose lives were touched by the life of this one man. He was loved and will be missed. S
A category of psychological principle not considered is acceptance of reality. There are, in fact, people who do not sugarcoat horror, who accept that life has ups and downs and that grief and joy both fade and who do not feel the need to compare themselves with others. The author himself could be said to not be accepting reality - the reality that most people experience more than just suffering. Personally, I am not one of them; I do not believe life us worth it. But I don't pretend that my view is an objective truth for everyone else.
Great video. I suppose I'd argue against the critics at the end. Stating that individuals can overcome adversity and find meaning (not all do), this does not justify bringing a new life into the world and forcing them to overcome this adversity. Giving birth to someone so they can have "character development" is unnecessary and absurd.
Einstein said that one can view the universe as either completely hostile, or overwhelmingly beautiful. Both are true. Your attitude determines, - and same with life.
We came from nothing and go back to nothing; have as much fun as you can in between! IMO now 74 I can say it was worth it just to have been a boy. Nature is so beautiful.
I think eternal torment in pretty much any version of Hell would be a lot worse. A LOT worse. It's a simple gedanken experiment: would you trade your current mortal existence, whatever its condition, for condemnation to an existence of torment without end, where even death does not exist to deliver you? Hard pass on that for me.
@@MoreLifePlease That sounds incredibly healthy and uplifting. I wanna join a religion that threatens me of eternal torment if I don’t believe in its mythology. Talk about Nietzsche slave morality.
The pain/pleasure ratio can be mathematically calculated by comparing the length of time for child birth to the length of time for an orgasim. it's like 600 to 1.
if theres a creator…do better! make an existence that doesn’t depend on living things fighting and killing each other for survival. how about one like heaven instead.
@MoreLifePlease God is allegedly all powerful. If that's true, then the possibilities are endless. He could create any reality he wants for us, including one where suffering doesn't exist. It's just difficult to believe that this is the best an all powerful God can do.
Bad is in the eye of the beholder. Some people like challenge. Struggle gives their life meaning, purpose and adventure. Others prefer an easy life that is safe, secure and predictable over an adrenaline rush. Risk, excitement, adventure and suspense are not a priority.
Very complicated question where were you born? Whom were you born too what’s your health status on and on? I think the vast majority of people are quite miserable life‘s a beach and then you don’t die. To a very small degree life is what you make it if you have something to make it with or someone.
Well I m sure he had read Schopenhauer, majlander, zapfee, Albert cara o or Emil Cioran. The main problem of the Main humanity, not western world is aggressivity. The most tragic aspect of human existence is that most people that most humans are t intelectuals and this make them the creators and source of misery and suffering.
Childrens life also is suffering that lead to an inevitable end.even my life was marked by that l didnt feel as good as the germans a complexity,and that leaders like Nero others were so negative ,it sounds stupid but it affects my pianoart,intellect
Another BS philosopher, David Benatar. Sounds like Peter Wessel Zapffe. Philosophy, love of wisdom. Wisdom, knowing how things work. Neither know how things work. They are not philosophers, they are just glorified lamenters. David Benatar Philosophy vs Buddhism's Four Noble Truths and Eightfold Path. Concept of Suffering: Benatar: Suffering is inherent in existence; life itself is a harm. Buddhism: Suffering arises from craving and attachment, but it can be ended through the Eightfold Path. Path to Liberation: Benatar: Does not provide a specific path to liberation, focusing more on the inherent negativity of existence. Buddhism: The Eightfold Path offers a clear and detailed path to liberation from suffering. Role of Existence: Benatar: Existence is inherently negative and harmful. Buddhism: Existence is not inherently negative; suffering arises from specific conditions (craving and attachment). Action and Practice: Benatar: Focuses on the inherent nature of existence and does not prescribe specific practices. Buddhism: Emphasizes ethical conduct, mindfulness, and meditation as practices to overcome suffering. View of Life: Benatar: Life is absurd and fundamentally unbearable. Buddhism: Life involves suffering, but liberation (nirvana) is attainable. Philosophical Basis: Benatar: Secular, Materialist, existential pessimism. Buddhism: Spiritual, optimistic in offering liberation. In summary, while both David Benatar and Buddhism acknowledge the presence of suffering, they differ significantly in their understanding of the causes of suffering and the methods to address it. Benatar’s philosophy is more focused on the inherent negativity of existence, whereas Buddhism provides a detailed path to liberation through ethical living, mindfulness, and meditation.
It cannot be better to not exist, since not existing didn't stop a life from being imposed. You didn't exist, yet a life was still imposed. Therefore, not existing cannot stop one life or another from being imposed, and so, therefore... Not existing cannot be better, since if one life isn't imposed, then some other life will be. The only way not existing can be better is if there's some kind of state of peace we were in before birth... But that'd mean we existed before we existed. Where exactly does this peaceful place exist?
"Suffering outweighs joy." That depends on the individual life in question. Perhaps more people suffer than feel joy but as in my case, the joy far outweighs the pain. Maybe I'm just one of the lucky ones or maybe joy is just a state of mind.
Misteriourstramger , you seem a westerner. Human life isn t like in western Europe , North America Australia , Japan or South Korea. There are lot of place in human world where evilness , viole nce are the norm.
Thank you for watching!
💡 What reflections did you take away from this video?
Share your thoughts in the comments, I’d love to know what you think! 👇
If you enjoyed it, leave a valuable like 👍 and don’t forget to subscribe to the channel to stay tuned for our future daily reflections! 🔔
"Better never to have been" is the most important philosophical work of the past few decades.
Was it better when you didn't exist? Why didn't your lack of existing stop this life from being imposed? If your lack of existing didn't stop a life from being imposed, why would your lack of existing _ever_ stop a life from being imposed?
Important work, yes, but not entirely original. Before Benatar, many philosophers had similar ideas, including Zapfke, Bahnsen, Weininger, Cioran, Caraco, and others. One of the conceptual roots of antinatalism is the concept of "gevorfenheit" (thrownness) in existential philosophy. According to Heidegger, we were thrown into this world without our consent.
@@sandornagy7 Don't forget Schopenhauer. Benatar himself admittedly draws on Schopenhauer. As you rightly said: Benatar's book is important, but hardly original.
@@thomasstergaard4412 Thank you for mentioning Schopenhauer as a major influence on Benatar. Furthermore, we can also mention - to a certain extent - Mainlander (who was also influenced by Schopenhauer), Nietzsche, Sartre, and Camus as having major influences on nihilism and absurdism as well as existentialism ... subsequently infulencing the antinatalists, most notably Cioran and Caraco, and most recently, Benatar.
Life is one long battle against the absurdity of existence.
The "battle against" can sometimes be more like the "dance with".
And an inevitable concomitant of the absurdity is a freedom which can be by turns terrifying and exhilarating.
Of course, it seems most likely that both the battle and the dance are ultimately meaningless, but perhaps that's an argument for avoiding thinking in terms of "ultimately" and instead, as the sages, ancient and modern, seem ever to counsel, "live in the moment", the only time we really have.
Put another way, maybe we're unwise to let (probable) ultimate meaningless rob us of (possible) momentary meaning?
Finding a pathway between order and chaos
Thank you
In a way yes, because i have only found beauty and meaning in random insights, never in the totality of existence. @@MoreLifePlease
I recently went to a funeral. In attendance there were hundreds of people whose lives were touched by the life of this one man. He was loved and will be missed.
S
A category of psychological principle not considered is acceptance of reality. There are, in fact, people who do not sugarcoat horror, who accept that life has ups and downs and that grief and joy both fade and who do not feel the need to compare themselves with others. The author himself could be said to not be accepting reality - the reality that most people experience more than just suffering. Personally, I am not one of them; I do not believe life us worth it. But I don't pretend that my view is an objective truth for everyone else.
Great video.
I suppose I'd argue against the critics at the end. Stating that individuals can overcome adversity and find meaning (not all do), this does not justify bringing a new life into the world and forcing them to overcome this adversity. Giving birth to someone so they can have "character development" is unnecessary and absurd.
People have a hard time grasping the implications of non-existence.
Life has far more suffering than pleasure
It’s really not that bad--it’s worse!
Einstein said that one can view the universe as either completely hostile, or overwhelmingly beautiful.
Both are true.
Your attitude determines, - and same with life.
👉 💙Thanks 💙👈
The world is a big "Ass Hole". we are :
Just passing through.
Existence equals desire. The desire to exist. All desire is a form suffering. Therefore existence is suffering.
We came from nothing and go back to nothing; have as much fun as you can in between! IMO now 74 I can say it was worth it just to have been a boy. Nature is so beautiful.
Good for you man😊👍🏻
Sounds about right.....
Life is the worst thing imaginable😭😭
-ligotti
I think eternal torment in pretty much any version of Hell would be a lot worse.
A LOT worse.
It's a simple gedanken experiment: would you trade your current mortal existence, whatever its condition, for condemnation to an existence of torment without end, where even death does not exist to deliver you?
Hard pass on that for me.
@@MoreLifePlease Do u not see how unhealthy Christianity is??
@@MoreLifePlease That sounds incredibly healthy and uplifting. I wanna join a religion that threatens me of eternal torment if I don’t believe in its mythology. Talk about Nietzsche slave morality.
Sounds like marriage
The pain/pleasure ratio can be mathematically calculated by comparing the length of time for child birth to the length of time for an orgasim. it's like 600 to 1.
Romantic love itself is a biological con that dupes us into breeding.
if theres a creator…do better! make an existence that doesn’t depend on living things fighting and killing each other for survival. how about one like heaven instead.
What if this actually IS the best that putative creator could do?
How scary would that be?
@@MoreLifePlease Reminds me of Lovecraft's blind idiot god Azathoth.
@MoreLifePlease God is allegedly all powerful. If that's true, then the possibilities are endless. He could create any reality he wants for us, including one where suffering doesn't exist. It's just difficult to believe that this is the best an all powerful God can do.
@solomongrundy1467 Of course. All you'd need would be an all-powerful and all-benevolent God.
Got one?
@@MoreLifePlease if God exists, he's more than likely sadistic.
Bad is in the eye of the beholder. Some people like challenge. Struggle gives their life meaning, purpose and adventure. Others prefer an easy life that is safe, secure and predictable over an adrenaline rush. Risk, excitement, adventure and suspense are not a priority.
Very complicated question where were you born? Whom were you born too what’s your health status on and on? I think the vast majority of people are quite miserable life‘s a beach and then you don’t die. To a very small degree life is what you make it if you have something to make it with or someone.
Great insight... Thank you!
Life is sh💩tty. 👎🏻👎🏻👎🏻👎🏻
Well I m sure he had read Schopenhauer, majlander, zapfee, Albert cara o or Emil Cioran. The main problem of the Main humanity, not western world is aggressivity. The most tragic aspect of human existence is that most people that most humans are t intelectuals and this make them the creators and source of misery and suffering.
The Schopenhauer of the 21st century! 👏👏👏👍👍👍
Childrens life also is suffering that lead to an inevitable end.even my life was marked by that l didnt feel as good as the germans a complexity,and that leaders like Nero others were so negative ,it sounds stupid but it affects my pianoart,intellect
The one how has illusions to live on is really happy,often it was just nonillusioned ringsand(E.v.Hartmann)
Thanks for not breeding! 😂😂👍👍
if you're a masochist you got it made in the shade
This is the bad place.
Go with love.
Can’t wait
100% life is really that bad :(
Just think how little you reflect on your life when you are not in pain vs when you merely have a papercut on the tip of your dominant forefinger.
Another BS philosopher, David Benatar.
Sounds like Peter Wessel Zapffe.
Philosophy, love of wisdom.
Wisdom, knowing how things work.
Neither know how things work.
They are not philosophers, they are just glorified lamenters.
David Benatar Philosophy vs Buddhism's Four Noble Truths and Eightfold Path.
Concept of Suffering:
Benatar: Suffering is inherent in existence; life itself is a harm.
Buddhism: Suffering arises from craving and attachment, but it can be ended through the Eightfold Path.
Path to Liberation:
Benatar: Does not provide a specific path to liberation, focusing more on the inherent negativity of existence.
Buddhism: The Eightfold Path offers a clear and detailed path to liberation from suffering.
Role of Existence:
Benatar: Existence is inherently negative and harmful.
Buddhism: Existence is not inherently negative; suffering arises from specific conditions (craving and attachment).
Action and Practice:
Benatar: Focuses on the inherent nature of existence and does not prescribe specific practices.
Buddhism: Emphasizes ethical conduct, mindfulness, and meditation as practices to overcome suffering.
View of Life:
Benatar: Life is absurd and fundamentally unbearable.
Buddhism: Life involves suffering, but liberation (nirvana) is attainable.
Philosophical Basis:
Benatar: Secular, Materialist, existential pessimism.
Buddhism: Spiritual, optimistic in offering liberation.
In summary, while both David Benatar and Buddhism acknowledge the presence of suffering, they differ significantly in their understanding of the causes of suffering and the methods to address it. Benatar’s philosophy is more focused on the inherent negativity of existence, whereas Buddhism provides a detailed path to liberation through ethical living, mindfulness, and meditation.
Beautiful and interesting reflection... Thank you!🙏
ruclips.net/video/9OnaHGkVaFs/видео.html
It cannot be better to not exist, since not existing didn't stop a life from being imposed. You didn't exist, yet a life was still imposed. Therefore, not existing cannot stop one life or another from being imposed, and so, therefore... Not existing cannot be better, since if one life isn't imposed, then some other life will be. The only way not existing can be better is if there's some kind of state of peace we were in before birth... But that'd mean we existed before we existed. Where exactly does this peaceful place exist?
Your reasoning is logically unsound.
Benatar doesn't have a reasoned philosophy. He's just had a miserable life.
🤣🤣🤣you are just an asshole,go sleep
All is well. We just don't know it.
"Suffering outweighs joy." That depends on the individual life in question. Perhaps more people suffer than feel joy but as in my case, the joy far outweighs the pain. Maybe I'm just one of the lucky ones or maybe joy is just a state of mind.
lucky indeed, compared to both humans and animals. but that luck is ultimately temporary.
Your definitely one of the lucky ones
How do you do it ?
Misteriourstramger , you seem a westerner. Human life isn t like in western Europe , North America Australia , Japan or South Korea. There are lot of place in human world where evilness , viole nce are the norm.