In a previous business endeavour, I was really hung up on this, because my thought was to be fair, honest, and transparent. I felt like the customer would want to know the details and feel like things were super “ethical, and economical”! My teacher was like you, saying I needed to charge more for the service. To ME!!! The price seemed too high and unethical. Then he looked me straight in eye and says, “ you know what your problem is.... you can’t afford yourself!” What an epiphany. He was right. I backslid from time to time, but looking back, you state your price in an estimate, ask the customer to get that date booked because, “if you don’t get on my calendar right now, get things on order, etc., it could be another “six months”! before I can squeeze YOUR project into My schedule. You gotta create scarcity of yourself and your services first, and increase your value. Your there to solve their problems, and you are a hot commodity whether they think so or not. And be polite, but very matter of fact.
Agree 100%. I have never advertised and my reputation and work ethic has kept me busy for years. My customers are my best advertisement for my services. Was working for a customer who wanted a old wooden fence removed. While working on the neighbors side I was careful not to tramp down their lawn or flower bed. At the end of the day the neighbor came out and complimented me. As it turned out they want some work done. The customer I was doing the work for told me her neighbor said they were shocked that anyone would go thru so much work as to not tear up anything on them. There is no way I could afford advertising that good. Best advice I ever received was do what you love and you will never have to work for a living. Its true. I get to meet great people, fix or improve their property and I get paid for it. Life is good. Keep up the great vids. Enjoy watching the work you do and the info you supply.
Many times there is no way to avoid setting up a ladder or scaffold on someone's flower bed. 5 minutes with a rake and a $3 bag of mulch at the end of the job to repair the damage makes a happy client who tells their friends.
Awesome 👍 Advice! When I first started out was 20 per hour then 30 to 40 second year then I started noticing how customers were milking me wanting it done fast so I ditched the hourly and went flat rate I expect to make between 80 to 100 dollars each hour but I won't tell the customer that it's just in my mind that the amount should be no less. This is my fifth year exactly so I'm sure as my skill levels increase so will my value/ prices. God knows that it's physical our work and it just racks the whole body and if you don't care for yourself no one else will care for you. People treat you the way you get them used to treating you. Thanks for the great video!
I'm an a/c contractor, one man show, also do electrical/plumbing and I cherry pick my jobs, I tell my customers to check around on installs because I like to do mainly service (don't like installing) and tell them It will cost quite a bit more if I do it and they do not hesitate in telling me theres no problem on price, it comes down to reputation, knowing your job, completing in a timely manner, being presentable & professional and no haggling ever comes into the picture.
My best sub of all is a one-man refrigeration expert. 72years old been doing it for 50 years. He gives me a price and I argue with him that it is too cheap.
I too, have a pot that I boil heads in...lol. After 30 years as a journeyman cabinet maker and high school shop teacher, I'm very happy to be back working for myself. Your videos are helping me get a better return on my time. Thank you very much!!
Thank you, thank you, thank you so very much for making a video about this. A lot of people do not understand the freedom and power in word-of-mouth. In Atlanta, I only worked by word-of-mouth. Yes, one has to advertise to get a foot hold, but once you start getting work by word-of-mouth, it is all gravy from there. Again, thank you for the video.
You’re absolutely right, especially about working for people who have been referred by past customers. It eliminates tire kickers and pretty much guarantees you’ll be paid. Have worked for myself for 18 years and never advertised and have never not been paid.
I 100% agree. 3 things to remember. 1. Your customer doesn't care or even understand. If you mark everything on paper and mark up supplies your customer can cross reference and will see what you are doing and it makes you look sketchy. 2. Look everything up ahead of time, price it all out and know what the job will cost them. Being confident with pricing means the world to your customers but overcharging means lost customers. 3. Never take a job you are unsure about. If you don't know what you are doing, don't do it. If the customer is a wheeling dealing type, walk away. When you make "deals" it's always a loss for you. It's blood in the water and next time when that person calls it will be the same expectation.
I never mark up materials on my invoice, but if A store sells something 15% less than it was, I still charge the original cost and keep the savings... because I had to go buy it and bring it to the job... most clients won’t even acknowledge the time you took to go get their stuff so it’s fair anyways. That is the only tweak to the materials... and it’s more than fair.
@@paulhunter9613 You do have a point. Where I'm from, we call that panther piss, but nobody's asking so, yeah. But regardless, I like "The Handyman" so I won't bust his chops. Me, I like a nice IPA or a Porter. You, Paul?
Amen! I've never did hourly! I charge per job and what that specific job is worth! Most of my customers I tell them exactly what material to get and it's there when I get to the job! That material markup 💩 is dumb! If I don't have to deal with materials I don't! On big projects I'll just order the materials through home depot and have them deliver it! Great video bro
Thanks, I always had hard time responding to requests of giving them full breakdown on hours/material/pricing per hour... I thought it was just me, now I know what to do without a doubt.
Good information. I picked up on a few things you mentioned that will help. BTW... I always wondered how you got your voice so high at times and now I know.. The placement of your firearm explains it.
Just forwarded this to my brother who has a one man handyman business. I've always felt that good work outways price but there are plenty of penny pinchers out there who will exploit a guy who isn't confident with his own pricing. I hope my bro takes your advice and weeds out the pain in the butt, micromanaging, penny pinchers who waste his time. Good- common sense and practical video, sir!
Good info, thanks! Do you usually have a minimum charge for the small jobs? Like one hour or two hour minimum if you have to run to hardware stores etc as part of the job even if the time to do the work might wind up being a lot less?
As a customer: i don’t care about a breakdown of expenses. All i care about is what the bill is at the end of the day. Marking up materials cost is just wasting your time. I’m not even going to look at that. As a handyman: I am not going to waste my time adding 50% to every line item on my project. I know my cost, and i know my worth.
This is exactly how I do things in my 30+ years of being a tile contractor. You don’t have to itemize every little detail cost wise. The customer is only concerned with the bottom line number & THAT YOU ARE THE MAN FOR THE JOB!(Because you have come highly recommended or have worked for them before). I count on my customers being my unpaid sales force😂
I find that what works best for me is to tell my clients that ask about material costs, that they pay exactly what I pay for materials rounded up to the nearest dollar. Like you I also charge by the job not by the hour. These two strategies have served me very well over the years.
I always let my customers know that I dont charge extra for materials! I even encourage them to go buy the materials themselves, maybe buy it on their lowes card and finance it interest free for 1 year. It happens that the customer goes shopping and just like going to the grocery store hungry they get excited about having their home updated. A simple bathroom remodel turns into a new floor, which turns into a complete interior paint job and on and on. Stayed in one house for 3 months doing things she wanted done for a long time. Point is, she had control over how much she paid for materials! My labor cost doesn't change whether I put in cheap floor or top notch stuff! Preach it! No way I'm doing hourly on a job.
The problem I have with this is that you're accepting, outright, the suitability of the materials the customer has decided to buy without consulting you. Why put yourself in a situation warrantying shit-tier product that isn't to spec for what you bid? The other point of contention is what happens when the customer doesn't furnish materials in a timely manner and causes production slowdowns? Maybe not a big deal if you're a one man show, but a big deal to me when my guys have their thumbs up their ass.
Why have I wasted so many weeks watching videos of everyone who has not one scintilla of comparison to my lifelong experiences ??? Oh yeah, l know why..... so l can finally come across your videos to remind me that it takes patience and long suffering to get to that sweet spot of 1.never having to advertise. ( Shaking hands with everyone who knows you by your trade name is not advertising ) that’s just being friendly ☺️ 2. More profitable jobs than you can book in a year. 3. A greater respect for outstanding customer service (did my apprenticeship back in the 1980’s at the Post & Coach, (NYC, PABT). I saw first hand how much difference outstanding customer service made in our tip box flipping burgers. D. Valuing people, the poor in spirit, the rich w/OCD, the widow, respect for the common man. A sense of purpose to teach another to do the same.
This is a great video and I find it very interesting. Particularly the part about turning your back on the jobs which are characterized by people who scrutinize the numbers. I'm currently in the soul sucking, nightmarish process of getting my MD Home Improvement Contractors License and find this info absolutely invaluable to my future business. I was tempted to advertise in order to kick start but I am fortunate to have a moderate amount of people that I have been doing work for most of my life and know my quality of work. I will slowly expound on that in order to avoid the cheap ass, shit bag customers. I kind of liken it to my relationship with my local auto parts store. When I call them and order a part I don't question the price. Why? Not only does it take a an otherwise brief and stream-lined conversation and complicate it but it also causes me to over analyze, as I am prone to do. more importantly though, I don't beat them up because I know they are good at what they do, work hard, are honest and consistently provide me with legitimately good quality stuff. Do I pay more? Sure, sometimes, but the little extra I pay is well worth the peace of mind and proven service I get. All that to say: Good video dude, thanks for the info. I dig it.
I totally agree with that!!! My best customers are referred and they never ask for a price like that. They do want a ball park figure but I get 95% of those jobs and they are happy not only with the work but what they pay and are repeat customer to this day!
Reality!! The first quote I went on when I was moving to north FL seemed ok. Straightforward job. Gave them the numbers they needed. My numbers were on point. And I noticed some of their questions were odd like “well how would you attach drywall to a concrete wall” turns out after 4 meetings and lots of nonsense they did ask for a spreadsheet and wanted me to use their software. Done. Moved on. But the common question in this area is “how fast can you get it done” problem is if they buy all the materials, and take their time choosing, I don’t know.
I know what ya mean homey. I'm dealing with a butthead now that won't pay because I dealt with a free range customer. Now take that pistol off your pecker!
I've just started doing handyman work recently & I would agree. If I were the customer, I'd just want to know total price before hand, so that's how I treat my customers.
I've been going well for almost 6 months, staying as busy as I want. One question I have is how to reject jobs you know, are a no go. Example, had a person wanted their stair spindles replaced, but they had bought used, hammered wrought iron from 3 different houses and they were 3 different shades of the same color. I ended up bidding it almost silly high hoping they would back out, and they did. My problem with that is I'm assuming they won't call me back for other work, and I'm new so that feels like a bad thing. Any thoughts?
Handyman, thanks for great, common sense info. I started doing what you don't do. You are right. You get those bottom feeders looking for a quality job for peanuts, then you spend time selling yourself for what? Headaches down the road. I'm knew to the Handyman, but have many years in different trades.
I have 10 jobs lined up, been working for a while for myself. Seen your great advice and it works. Do a video and expose some business or trade secrets. Thanks. Things that professionals dont share.
I received a bid to replace a fan motor on a cooling tower. The bid was $3,000. I was a little surprised with that number. I had a hard time justifying that number. The replacement motor was $600 which means it will be $2,400 in labor alone. When I Include picking up the motor it‘s a three hour job. After calculating my hourly wage, it came out to be $900, if I did the work myself. I am a licensed HVAC mechanic, i just didn't have the time to deal with it. After receiving that bid, I made time. I also requested a bid to have an electronic lock install. It's about a 100' run from point A to point B. The cost for the parts maybe $600? My final bid was 16K. I know for a fact that it will only take 3-4 hours to run the cable and maybe another hour to connect to my front end. I understand we're in it to make money, but overcharging for work that takes a person a few hours to do, because the average person can't do that type of work is ridiculous. I agree you should charge to cover your overhead but then adding on more so you can send your kids to collage, sorry that's not me. This is no refection on you. I'm just referring to issues I deal with on the day to day.
So, if someone is new to an area, do you have any recommendations as to how one would ascertain that golden market value? Because I agree that that is the best way to bill for ones time.
I do advertise but only with google and a website. I did get a lot of tire kickers at first but I have a good set of questions to screen them! Took a while but I got them figured out now.
As a locksmith if I buy material wholesale through my wholesale supply house, I will charge the manufacturers suggested retail value. But at that price I also have the flexibility to offer discounts and I always hold back on offering discounts until the job is done. Everything else is usually flat rate which in my case is usually equivalent to an hourly rate (standard rekey is $15-$20, =15-20 mins to do the job at $60hr). I have no employees and no real overhead and this is my side business. In my region, I’m in the middle of the road with my pricing. I get more hassle from charging a trip fee which is standard in most contractors pricing. I’m not gonna get out of bed and go rekey a lock for $15-$20. There’s gotta be a fee that pays for the time I travel and communicate with the customer and procure products which is usually summed up in that trip/service/ callout fee, or whatever you want to call it. Whenever I get a call from someone looking for the cheap rates I’ll pass them on to the most expensive businesses I know.
Amen, I have never advertised my remodeling business or the fact I make cabinets and I have had those customers that want an itemized list and break down in the past which I tried to make happy, those customers will never be happy with something you did, or they will go and price check, which I never upped the price of the material and that's what got me in trouble with the recession of 2008 combined with, "The quote good for 30 days" mentality. So now if I bid a job and they want to wait, the price is subject to change depending on material and those itemized bid people, I do like you did in your video, I go the other way, it is not worth my time anymore. I like the, "Knock it out of the park" mention, those people that I will do work for on that level, they never ask what something cost, they want to know one price and how long before I can get started and they never question anything, in part is, because I will knock it out of the park for that person.
Good video. I charge by the hour what I need to be in business and they are paying for my time shopping for them and delivery. Last week one client gave me a tip and another said "I thought it would have cost a lot more"
Excellent video. I too give one price and only sometimes offer alternative pricing ( a patch vs a fix or upgraded material option) and depends on the customer. If I’m not particularly interested in the job I price it to be worth my while ( kind of a nuisance fee). Sometimes they have a big list and I only want to do 4 out of 5. Sometimes they leave the overpriced one off, sometimes they say do it all. Either way I’m ok with it.
As someone who hires out, I totally prefer 1 number. I want the final number; up front. I hate open checkbook (Open PO's). It makes it extremely difficult for me to budget things when the dollar cost for the job I am paying someone to do is unknown until it's all finished. Most of the time, I get done and then say to myself; "Gonna go a different route next time!"
I truly appreciate your classes. I'm now a licensed contractor since I been watching your videos. Please continue these videos. I'm pretty sure you are helping a lot of people navigate through their professional journey. Keep up the Great work!!!
I fully agree with not charging by the hour. Charge by the job. It is good for all parties. Years ago, I needed some electrical work done at my place. A guy was recommended to me and he said, "Six hundred for the job." I asked him how long it would take, "He said, "Two hours." My immediate response was, "That is $300. an hour." He responded, "Well, if it will make you feel better, I could charge you $100 an hour, but the job will probably take all day." He did do the job in about 2 and 1/4 hours. The electrical inspector did comment on how well the job was done. A perfect job is what I wanted. It is what I got.
Great video sir! EXACTLY, IT'S MARKET VALUE!! I do stone restoration and decorative concrete and I know what the market value per square foot is for someone who can do work the right way....and Stay safe man!
Great point. Also there’s no need to tell exactly how long it will take. The client will automatically calculate your hourly cost and think it’s not reasonable.
What you're describing is flat rate pricing. Plumbers do this all the time. They charge by fixture. As an electrician it took me a few years to figure out my overall labor figure. But once you know how much your labor price is you can estimate pretty quickly. The markup is for larger operations. That do have to do itemizing on bids etc.
Do you write out invoices? What do they look like? I do landscape/lawncare maintenance and have been wondering what the best way to write out invoices to be
I think this applies More to the handyman model as a general remodeling in building contractor it’s industry standard to markup materials. There’s a reason why most building supplies work only on business accounts and will never give the prices to anyone if they aren’t on an account.
In the NYC area "handyman" is used by some people to mean not a professional or below market cost. You hit it perfectly. Avoid the people who are by nature hagglers because they will never be a happy customer. Determine up front the job price and then do top quality work, get paid and move on.
I am set up just like you as far as the one man show at least 95% of the time. My business is probably 50% residential and 50% commercial, mostly repair work. On Commercial projects the companies I work for expect me to mark up materials. Once in awhile I estimate and do larger commercial projects. On those projects I mark up those matrrials too to cover the time and effort in going to the Home Improvement store or the builders supply store to buy material. I'm totally with you on not disclosing labor and material to a customer on a project like purchasing and installing a window. There is a time and place for it though, especially on the commercial side of my business.
Agreed, I never break down the job...here's the cost to do the work, when do you want me to start? I would never devise a mark up spreadsheet like some kid from the West Coast we know...hahaha
No. He just gives market rates. But he is in California. He gives great advice but not all of it applies everywhere. Plus some states require you to have break downs or its not a legally binding contract and if the customer does not pay you then you have no recourse. For instance, in my state, it is far better to jack up materials 35% then to add an additional hour of labor. It is far more important to learn your market and your type of customers in it.
I add $15 per day automatically to whatever I’m charging. That covers gas and lunch. Material is already figured in. With a lil extra on top of material costs.
I have replaced all the windows on my own home for this reason. Too many carpenters are out to get rich. Remember carpenters when you own your home you’ll have to hire for this and you might be too old to do it yourself or handicap in some way and you will be shocked by the outrageous prices they give
absolutely correct. all my customers are all referrals. i don't like to deal with tire kickers at all. and i don't show them any numbers except the total cost time and materials.
As a contractor, I dont mark up material to make a profit, but I do add in a lot of fluff here and there just to account for paying sales tax on items and all of those little things like expendables, rags, sandpaper, caulk, glue, screws etc. I throw 20 to 50 bucks on any small job and usually a few hundred on larger remodels just to CMA.
I charge by the hour . Not a fulltimer . Depending on the jobs and the person . I charger accordingly. I do hive give special rate to the elder (lower income brackets) .
I've personally rejected quotes from contractors because they wanted to "charge " me a markup on supplies! Like I told a contractor that I've wound up doing business with for years, I'm paying for your labor, not your retail skills! If you want to be a supplier/store, then do that! Don't try and overcharge me for supplies because you're too bashful to ask what you're worth trying to pad your bill! Fortunately, the contractor I'm referring to understood this, and we had mutual respect for each other. Sadly, most people in the trades do this nonsense! I recently had an air conditioner replaced, and sure enough, the contractor wanted to chatge me twice what the actual equipment cost normally. It took me calling 3 different hvac contractors before I found a gentleman who didn't use this ridiculous policy, and I got my new system installed! I also hate the policy of contractors wanting hourly rates! Seriously should I as the consumer agree to pay hourly? Wouldn't the contractor simply drag his heals making it take longer to accomplish the job? I would! You want to see me drag my heals ? Pay me hourly and watch me! If I can't get an agreement for a set fee for doing the job to competition, then I won't agree to it . Period! Why would any person with two active brain cells do this? It silly! Contractors would do better if they were just up front and honest! It enrages me when they want to get sneaky about their bill! Just my two cents...
Totally agree with you about marking up materials. Customers can be pretty savvy these days, very easy for them to get online and price shop the materials. I think that it undermines trust with the customer, better to sell them on the value of your work, and craftsmanship.
I learned the hard way with a painting job and letting customer buy materials!! I can laugh now but it was a learning curve for sure. Cheap enamel paint for interior work doesnt cut it!!
Thanks for the tips. I'm going to start showing one line item per invoice instead of showing labor, and materials separate. That makes sense. I think that is better received than showing a mark up on materials. People don't really like that.
I just started... And you are correct... advertising is the worse. Most people want your free estimate. (AKA, tire kickers) Give your estimate to the insurance company and you never hear from them again. I do have a guy who I love... He tells me what he wants, I do it.. And he knows I am not going to rip him off, and job is getting done
I really wish there was a requirement for future contractors to know how to properly ethically price projects, it will only help everyone because let’s be honest contractors don’t have a good reputation as a whole. I just hired someone to redo my front stairs, tear down and rebuild blue stone with stone veneer. Estimates came in ranging from $7200 to $15000 for same scope (I gave them exactly the stone we wanted). The $15k guy asked me what I thought and I was standing in front of the stairs so responded “look at the stairs, material costs are $4000 I do not see this as $11k in labor worth of work…its 2 steps and a landing.” Guys who did the job demo’d, framed then poured new footing in under 8 hours (3 guys) then same 3 built new stairs 1 1/2 days. The contractors that were in same ball park all looked at job and knew exactly what it actually would take to do job, all others were thrown out the door.
As an Electrician in IL, i have the same problem. time&material vs. bid. it is such a pain in the ass. your videos help my confidence. mainly because they have become friends and then recommend me to their friends for the same price. geezh. Love you vids man.
As a customer, how do know what the market value is for the work you want done? I’ve had estimates from different places that varied widely in cost and the advice about what “needs” to be done. This makes me distrust all of them to be honest. How do you know if you’re getting screwed on the price or if someone is not charging enough because they’re going to take shortcuts?
Is there a cap to how much you can mark up an item? I've heard that there is with hvac parts. Of course you can move those charges around. I agree, I like to see one flat charge. Customers have short attention spans and they have other worries
When I was advertising for my painting services, people where literally nickel and dime my services. I had one customer that wanted a large drywall repair done for less than $50 with material and labor. Now I go on word of mouth and have a part time job to fill my time. I think it's good to realize that advertising takes up a lot of your time that could be better spend elsewhere.
Haha. Love it. Right on the heels of a certain someone elses video. I sure do love your style Handyman! Oh yea, and I agree with your information as well. Lol
I usually say that they get a bulk price deal when I bid the project as a whole. If they insist on itemized bid the price per item goes up as if I was only being hired to do that one item and not already at the site with my tools out.
I priced the same way when painting and people loved it. Other painters in my area would complicate estimates. If your price is right you don’t need to mark up materials.
Ok, well Ive got a question. How do you find out the "market value" of every service your willing to do? Am I supposed to call a bunch of companies to see what they charge?
When I first started, I did. Called two plumbing companies. Told them I picked out my fixture and bought it. How much is labor? “$80 service call. $80/hr. Two hour minimum.” Okay. Thanks. That’s $240 minimum. So I charged $150. Took me 45 minutes. That’s good money. Customer is happy. They “saved” $90 using me. Word of mouth spreads FAST, especially in subdivisions. And teacher’s lounges. I never, EVER, Mark up materials. They are expensive enough as it is.
Start charging low, increase prices until you have less work than you have time. Then slightly lower prices until you have the correct amount of work for how much time you have.
I peruse the internet to get local labor rates. Such as: " the local cost of replacing a door". Youll get very close to what is a fair rate for a given area, zip code. Hope this helps. Hometown Handyman and Locksmith
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_research
so truuue
@Rome O lody dody
Gotta get me one of those pots to boil heads in! I'm guessing it might come in real handy in the coming weeks and months.... ;-)
Remodeler Magazine puts out a Cost/value report yearly.
In a previous business endeavour, I was really hung up on this, because my thought was to be fair, honest, and transparent. I felt like the customer would want to know the details and feel like things were super “ethical, and economical”! My teacher was like you, saying I needed to charge more for the service. To ME!!! The price seemed too high and unethical. Then he looked me straight in eye and says, “ you know what your problem is.... you can’t afford yourself!”
What an epiphany. He was right. I backslid from time to time, but looking back, you state your price in an estimate, ask the customer to get that date booked because, “if you don’t get on my calendar right now, get things on order, etc., it could be another “six months”! before I can squeeze YOUR project into My schedule.
You gotta create scarcity of yourself and your services first, and increase your value. Your there to solve their problems, and you are a hot commodity whether they think so or not. And be polite, but very matter of fact.
Wow. So true, thank you for sharing great information.
Agree 100%. I have never advertised and my reputation and work ethic has kept me busy for years. My customers are my best advertisement for my services. Was working for a customer who wanted a old wooden fence removed. While working on the neighbors side I was careful not to tramp down their lawn or flower bed. At the end of the day the neighbor came out and complimented me. As it turned out they want some work done. The customer I was doing the work for told me her neighbor said they were shocked that anyone would go thru so much work as to not tear up anything on them. There is no way I could afford advertising that good.
Best advice I ever received was do what you love and you will never have to work for a living. Its true. I get to meet great people, fix or improve their property and I get paid for it. Life is good.
Keep up the great vids. Enjoy watching the work you do and the info you supply.
Many times there is no way to avoid setting up a ladder or scaffold on someone's flower bed. 5 minutes with a rake and a $3 bag of mulch at the end of the job to repair the damage makes a happy client who tells their friends.
How many times has someone said; “I’ll give you lots of business “ I’m like “I have lots of Business “.
Lol facts. I'll be like please no...
Awesome 👍 Advice! When I first started out was 20 per hour then 30 to 40 second year then I started noticing how customers were milking me wanting it done fast so I ditched the hourly and went flat rate I expect to make between 80 to 100 dollars each hour but I won't tell the customer that it's just in my mind that the amount should be no less. This is my fifth year exactly so I'm sure as my skill levels increase so will my value/ prices. God knows that it's physical our work and it just racks the whole body and if you don't care for yourself no one else will care for you. People treat you the way you get them used to treating you. Thanks for the great video!
You said it. I learned the hard way. You can't abuse yourself and always eat garbage just to make everyone else happy while you are not.
I started out charging 60$ n hr
I'm an a/c contractor, one man show, also do electrical/plumbing and I cherry pick my jobs, I tell my customers to check around on installs because I like to do mainly service (don't like installing) and tell them It will cost quite a bit more if I do it and they do not hesitate in telling me theres no problem on price, it comes down to reputation, knowing your job, completing in a timely manner, being presentable & professional and no haggling ever comes into the picture.
My best sub of all is a one-man refrigeration expert. 72years old been doing it for 50 years. He gives me a price and I argue with him that it is too cheap.
I too, have a pot that I boil heads in...lol. After 30 years as a journeyman cabinet maker and high school shop teacher, I'm very happy to be back working for myself. Your videos are helping me get a better return on my time. Thank you very much!!
“Life plan” literally made me laugh out loud, thank you for that. Haha
Thank you, thank you, thank you so very much for making a video about this. A lot of people do not understand the freedom and power in word-of-mouth. In Atlanta, I only worked by word-of-mouth. Yes, one has to advertise to get a foot hold, but once you start getting work by word-of-mouth, it is all gravy from there. Again, thank you for the video.
You’re absolutely right, especially about working for people who have been referred by past customers. It eliminates tire kickers and pretty much guarantees you’ll be paid. Have worked for myself for 18 years and never advertised and have never not been paid.
I agree completely. Keep the bill clean, simple and to the point$$$! Otherwise it can open a can of worms. Great advice !
I 100% agree. 3 things to remember. 1. Your customer doesn't care or even understand. If you mark everything on paper and mark up supplies your customer can cross reference and will see what you are doing and it makes you look sketchy. 2. Look everything up ahead of time, price it all out and know what the job will cost them. Being confident with pricing means the world to your customers but overcharging means lost customers. 3. Never take a job you are unsure about. If you don't know what you are doing, don't do it. If the customer is a wheeling dealing type, walk away. When you make "deals" it's always a loss for you. It's blood in the water and next time when that person calls it will be the same expectation.
I never mark up materials on my invoice, but if A store sells something 15% less than it was, I still charge the original cost and keep the savings... because I had to go buy it and bring it to the job... most clients won’t even acknowledge the time you took to go get their stuff so it’s fair anyways.
That is the only tweak to the materials... and it’s more than fair.
when I do hourly work I charge all the time including the time to and from the store. I also charge mileage on my trucks
I think this is one of the most needed topics to discuss. I have both customers myself can’t stand the “itemizers”
God dang... got the beer... got the gun... got the knowledge... 'MERICA
In CA ...
'MERICA
Cassidy Campbell
@
Adanesi
That ain’t beer, it’s a Coors, a damn can of water...
@@paulhunter9613 You do have a point. Where I'm from, we call that panther piss, but nobody's asking so, yeah. But regardless, I like "The Handyman" so I won't bust his chops. Me, I like a nice IPA or a Porter. You, Paul?
Amen! I've never did hourly! I charge per job and what that specific job is worth! Most of my customers I tell them exactly what material to get and it's there when I get to the job! That material markup 💩 is dumb! If I don't have to deal with materials I don't! On big projects I'll just order the materials through home depot and have them deliver it! Great video bro
Thanks, I always had hard time responding to requests of giving them full breakdown on hours/material/pricing per hour... I thought it was just me, now I know what to do without a doubt.
That's some funny poop right there!! was wondering if you were gonna call it your woolog again!! Lmao !!!
Good information. I picked up on a few things you mentioned that will help.
BTW... I always wondered how you got your voice so high at times and now I know.. The placement of your firearm explains it.
Just forwarded this to my brother who has a one man handyman business. I've always felt that good work outways price but there are plenty of penny pinchers out there who will exploit a guy who isn't confident with his own pricing. I hope my bro takes your advice and weeds out the pain in the butt, micromanaging, penny pinchers who waste his time. Good- common sense and practical video, sir!
Good info, thanks!
Do you usually have a minimum charge for the small jobs? Like one hour or two hour minimum if you have to run to hardware stores etc as part of the job even if the time to do the work might wind up being a lot less?
As a customer: i don’t care about a breakdown of expenses. All i care about is what the bill is at the end of the day. Marking up materials cost is just wasting your time. I’m not even going to look at that.
As a handyman: I am not going to waste my time adding 50% to every line item on my project. I know my cost, and i know my worth.
Mark up your rate to what you are worth and the customer is willing to pay.
This is exactly how I do things in my 30+ years of being a tile contractor. You don’t have to itemize every little detail cost wise. The customer is only concerned with the bottom line number & THAT YOU ARE THE MAN FOR THE JOB!(Because you have come highly recommended or have worked for them before). I count on my customers being my unpaid sales force😂
I find that what works best for me is to tell my clients that ask about material costs, that they pay exactly what I pay for materials rounded up to the nearest dollar. Like you I also charge by the job not by the hour. These two strategies have served me very well over the years.
I always let my customers know that I dont charge extra for materials! I even encourage them to go buy the materials themselves, maybe buy it on their lowes card and finance it interest free for 1 year. It happens that the customer goes shopping and just like going to the grocery store hungry they get excited about having their home updated. A simple bathroom remodel turns into a new floor, which turns into a complete interior paint job and on and on. Stayed in one house for 3 months doing things she wanted done for a long time.
Point is, she had control over how much she paid for materials! My labor cost doesn't change whether I put in cheap floor or top notch stuff!
Preach it! No way I'm doing hourly on a job.
The problem I have with this is that you're accepting, outright, the suitability of the materials the customer has decided to buy without consulting you. Why put yourself in a situation warrantying shit-tier product that isn't to spec for what you bid? The other point of contention is what happens when the customer doesn't furnish materials in a timely manner and causes production slowdowns? Maybe not a big deal if you're a one man show, but a big deal to me when my guys have their thumbs up their ass.
@@matthoughton1006 facts
No. Never give the client that much power over you. Never let them buy the material. Unless it’s a faucet or ceiling fan.
@@DeadEyeRabbit Yes, and yes and yes. They can buy the finish, not the rough-in.
Why have I wasted so many weeks watching videos of everyone who has not one scintilla of comparison to my lifelong experiences ??? Oh yeah, l know why..... so l can finally come across your videos to remind me that it takes patience and long suffering to get to that sweet spot of
1.never having to advertise. ( Shaking hands with everyone who knows you by your trade name is not advertising ) that’s just being friendly ☺️
2. More profitable jobs than you can book in a year.
3. A greater respect for outstanding customer service (did my apprenticeship back in the 1980’s at the Post & Coach, (NYC, PABT). I saw first hand how much difference outstanding customer service made in our tip box flipping burgers.
D. Valuing people, the poor in spirit, the rich w/OCD, the widow, respect for the common man.
A sense of purpose to teach another to do the same.
Lol, Great Video! Absolutely agree, even tho I don't always adhere to those principals, I absolutely agree with the method.
He drops them bangers straight knowledge, love the man hate the sandels..
This is a great video and I find it very interesting. Particularly the part about turning your back on the jobs which are characterized by people who scrutinize the numbers. I'm currently in the soul sucking, nightmarish process of getting my MD Home Improvement Contractors License and find this info absolutely invaluable to my future business. I was tempted to advertise in order to kick start but I am fortunate to have a moderate amount of people that I have been doing work for most of my life and know my quality of work. I will slowly expound on that in order to avoid the cheap ass, shit bag customers. I kind of liken it to my relationship with my local auto parts store. When I call them and order a part I don't question the price. Why? Not only does it take a an otherwise brief and stream-lined conversation and complicate it but it also causes me to over analyze, as I am prone to do. more importantly though, I don't beat them up because I know they are good at what they do, work hard, are honest and consistently provide me with legitimately good quality stuff. Do I pay more? Sure, sometimes, but the little extra I pay is well worth the peace of mind and proven service I get. All that to say: Good video dude, thanks for the info. I dig it.
“A pot that I boil heads in” 😂
WTF, you always find a way to make me laugh!
I totally agree with that!!!
My best customers are referred and they never ask for a price like that.
They do want a ball park figure but I get 95% of those jobs and they are happy not only with the work but what they pay and are repeat customer to this day!
Reality!! The first quote I went on when I was moving to north FL seemed ok. Straightforward job. Gave them the numbers they needed. My numbers were on point. And I noticed some of their questions were odd like “well how would you attach drywall to a concrete wall” turns out after 4 meetings and lots of nonsense they did ask for a spreadsheet and wanted me to use their software. Done. Moved on. But the common question in this area is “how fast can you get it done” problem is if they buy all the materials, and take their time choosing, I don’t know.
I know what ya mean homey. I'm dealing with a butthead now that won't pay because I dealt with a free range customer. Now take that pistol off your pecker!
Oh I Laughed out loud. Thank you.
Appendix carry is the way to go!
Gold
Appendix carry! Hopefully he doesn’t have a Mexican holster!!! I have a new character for you! PISTOL PETE!!!
Is that a pistol in your pocket or are you just happy to see us?
I've just started doing handyman work recently & I would agree. If I were the customer, I'd just want to know total price before hand, so that's how I treat my customers.
I've been going well for almost 6 months, staying as busy as I want. One question I have is how to reject jobs you know, are a no go. Example, had a person wanted their stair spindles replaced, but they had bought used, hammered wrought iron from 3 different houses and they were 3 different shades of the same color. I ended up bidding it almost silly high hoping they would back out, and they did. My problem with that is I'm assuming they won't call me back for other work, and I'm new so that feels like a bad thing. Any thoughts?
Handyman, thanks for great, common sense info. I started doing what you don't do. You are right. You get those bottom feeders looking for a quality job for peanuts, then you spend time selling yourself for what? Headaches down the road. I'm knew to the Handyman, but have many years in different trades.
I have 10 jobs lined up, been working for a while for myself. Seen your great advice and it works. Do a video and expose some business or trade secrets. Thanks. Things that professionals dont share.
I received a bid to replace a fan motor on a cooling tower. The bid was $3,000. I was a little surprised with that number. I had a hard time justifying that number. The replacement motor was $600 which means it will be $2,400 in labor alone.
When I Include picking up the motor it‘s a three hour job. After calculating my hourly wage, it came out to be $900, if I did the work myself. I am a licensed HVAC mechanic, i just didn't have the time to deal with it. After receiving that bid, I made time.
I also requested a bid to have an electronic lock install. It's about a 100' run from point A to point B. The cost for the parts maybe $600? My final bid was 16K. I know for a fact that it will only take 3-4 hours to run the cable and maybe another hour to connect to my front end.
I understand we're in it to make money, but overcharging for work that takes a person a few hours to do, because the average person can't do that type of work is ridiculous. I agree you should charge to cover your overhead but then adding on more so you can send your kids to collage, sorry that's not me.
This is no refection on you. I'm just referring to issues I deal with on the day to day.
So, if someone is new to an area, do you have any recommendations as to how one would ascertain that golden market value? Because I agree that that is the best way to bill for ones time.
Thanks for the advice. I just try to guesstimate the time that it takes me to get the materials and price accordingly. Again thanks.
I do advertise but only with google and a website. I did get a lot of tire kickers at first but I have a good set of questions to screen them! Took a while but I got them figured out now.
As a locksmith if I buy material wholesale through my wholesale supply house, I will charge the manufacturers suggested retail value. But at that price I also have the flexibility to offer discounts and I always hold back on offering discounts until the job is done. Everything else is usually flat rate which in my case is usually equivalent to an hourly rate (standard rekey is $15-$20, =15-20 mins to do the job at $60hr). I have no employees and no real overhead and this is my side business. In my region, I’m in the middle of the road with my pricing. I get more hassle from charging a trip fee which is standard in most contractors pricing. I’m not gonna get out of bed and go rekey a lock for $15-$20. There’s gotta be a fee that pays for the time I travel and communicate with the customer and procure products which is usually summed up in that trip/service/ callout fee, or whatever you want to call it. Whenever I get a call from someone looking for the cheap rates I’ll pass them on to the most expensive businesses I know.
Great advise. I put too much time into breaking down quotes vs starting with an estimate.
Your the man! The whole time I was asking myself is that a gun? Untill the end of the video hahaha 😂
Me too!
Amen, I have never advertised my remodeling business or the fact I make cabinets and I have had those customers that want an itemized list and break down in the past which I tried to make happy, those customers will never be happy with something you did, or they will go and price check, which I never upped the price of the material and that's what got me in trouble with the recession of 2008 combined with, "The quote good for 30 days" mentality. So now if I bid a job and they want to wait, the price is subject to change depending on material and those itemized bid people, I do like you did in your video, I go the other way, it is not worth my time anymore. I like the, "Knock it out of the park" mention, those people that I will do work for on that level, they never ask what something cost, they want to know one price and how long before I can get started and they never question anything, in part is, because I will knock it out of the park for that person.
Good video. I charge by the hour what I need to be in business and they are paying for my time shopping for them and delivery. Last week one client gave me a tip and another said "I thought it would have cost a lot more"
Thanks for the info , I was wondering what about retai price and contractor price for materials ? Which one would you add on ?
Agree....agree....agree.
As mentioned many times before, you and I operate our business very similarly.
Excellent video. I too give one price and only sometimes offer alternative pricing ( a patch vs a fix or upgraded material option) and depends on the customer. If I’m not particularly interested in the job I price it to be worth my while ( kind of a nuisance fee). Sometimes they have a big list and I only want to do 4 out of 5. Sometimes they leave the overpriced one off, sometimes they say do it all. Either way I’m ok with it.
Good point on the nuisance fee. Dealing with traffic, three flights of stairs etc
Absolutely I never Advertise all my work is thru customer recommendations .
Your lying
As someone who hires out, I totally prefer 1 number. I want the final number; up front. I hate open checkbook (Open PO's). It makes it extremely difficult for me to budget things when the dollar cost for the job I am paying someone to do is unknown until it's all finished. Most of the time, I get done and then say to myself; "Gonna go a different route next time!"
Brother you motivate me to make my business better every time you talk. Thanks for all the videos and keeping it real
Definately one number on estimate. Learned the hard way.
I truly appreciate your classes. I'm now a licensed contractor since I been watching your videos. Please continue these videos. I'm pretty sure you are helping a lot of people navigate through their professional journey. Keep up the Great work!!!
I fully agree with not charging by the hour. Charge by the job. It is good for all parties.
Years ago, I needed some electrical work done at my place. A guy was recommended to me and he said, "Six hundred for the job." I asked him how long it would take, "He said, "Two hours." My immediate response was, "That is $300. an hour." He responded, "Well, if it will make you feel better, I could charge you $100 an hour, but the job will probably take all day." He did do the job in about 2 and 1/4 hours. The electrical inspector did comment on how well the job was done. A perfect job is what I wanted. It is what I got.
Just seeing the title pop up when that "certain west coast hack" put his video out pissed me off......so seeing your video just makes me smile😁
Can you say the name of the west coast hack thanks. What is their trade?
Great video sir! EXACTLY, IT'S MARKET VALUE!! I do stone restoration and decorative concrete and I know what the market value per square foot is for someone who can do work the right way....and Stay safe man!
Great point. Also there’s no need to tell exactly how long it will take. The client will automatically calculate your hourly cost and think it’s not reasonable.
Put up new t1-11 on a customers shed. Both neighbors came out and needed work done. Got two jobs from one. No advertisement.
What you're describing is flat rate pricing.
Plumbers do this all the time.
They charge by fixture.
As an electrician it took me a few years to figure out my overall labor figure.
But once you know how much your labor price is you can estimate pretty quickly.
The markup is for larger operations.
That do have to do itemizing on bids etc.
Do you write out invoices? What do they look like? I do landscape/lawncare maintenance and have been wondering what the best way to write out invoices to be
Like with a pen and paper. I haven't seen that since the 80s. Everything is through email and text. I have invoice and bid templates I use.
I've been working for myself for years. I get too much work, and I don't work for just anybody. Your correct stay away from idiots.
This is honestly lee the best video I have ever seen lol
I think this applies More to the handyman model as a general remodeling in building contractor it’s industry standard to markup materials. There’s a reason why most building supplies work only on business accounts and will never give the prices to anyone if they aren’t on an account.
In the NYC area "handyman" is used by some people to mean not a professional or below market cost. You hit it perfectly. Avoid the people who are by nature hagglers because they will never be a happy customer. Determine up front the job price and then do top quality work, get paid and move on.
I am set up just like you as far as the one man show at least 95% of the time. My business is probably 50% residential and 50% commercial, mostly repair work. On Commercial projects the companies I work for expect me to mark up materials. Once in awhile I estimate and do larger commercial projects. On those projects I mark up those matrrials too to cover the time and effort in going to the Home Improvement store or the builders supply store to buy material. I'm totally with you on not disclosing labor and material to a customer on a project like purchasing and installing a window. There is a time and place for it though, especially on the commercial side of my business.
Agreed, I never break down the job...here's the cost to do the work, when do you want me to start? I would never devise a mark up spreadsheet like some kid from the West Coast we know...hahaha
I saw that one and laugh though the hole thing . Good comedy
Your tips are very often the same thing I've learned and reassuring to hear. Great job my man. Now i need to ditch the ocd people 😂
I add 10% to cover some time/gas to acquire the materials. Do you just add an hour of time to cover that?
No. He just gives market rates. But he is in California. He gives great advice but not all of it applies everywhere. Plus some states require you to have break downs or its not a legally binding contract and if the customer does not pay you then you have no recourse. For instance, in my state, it is far better to jack up materials 35% then to add an additional hour of labor. It is far more important to learn your market and your type of customers in it.
I add $15 per day automatically to whatever I’m charging. That covers gas and lunch. Material is already figured in. With a lil extra on top of material costs.
I have replaced all the windows on my own home for this reason. Too many carpenters are out to get rich. Remember carpenters when you own your home you’ll have to hire for this and you might be too old to do it yourself or handicap in some way and you will be shocked by the outrageous prices they give
Thanks, Good info. Makes since!
absolutely correct. all my customers are all referrals. i don't like to deal with tire kickers at all. and i don't show them any numbers except the total cost time and materials.
As a contractor, I dont mark up material to make a profit, but I do add in a lot of fluff here and there just to account for paying sales tax on items and all of those little things like expendables, rags, sandpaper, caulk, glue, screws etc. I throw 20 to 50 bucks on any small job and usually a few hundred on larger remodels just to CMA.
Today on this episode of brutally honest: the handy man! (Applaud) ... Lol love the episode!
I charge by the hour . Not a fulltimer . Depending on the jobs and the person . I charger accordingly.
I do hive give special rate to the elder (lower income brackets) .
When quoting a job do you add "tax" on top of quote or is tax included in your quote? Thanks, Rick
This dude's videos get more entertaining everyday! Keep it up👍
I've personally rejected quotes from contractors because they wanted to "charge " me a markup on supplies! Like I told a contractor that I've wound up doing business with for years, I'm paying for your labor, not your retail skills! If you want to be a supplier/store, then do that! Don't try and overcharge me for supplies because you're too bashful to ask what you're worth trying to pad your bill! Fortunately, the contractor I'm referring to understood this, and we had mutual respect for each other. Sadly, most people in the trades do this nonsense! I recently had an air conditioner replaced, and sure enough, the contractor wanted to chatge me twice what the actual equipment cost normally. It took me calling 3 different hvac contractors before I found a gentleman who didn't use this ridiculous policy, and I got my new system installed! I also hate the policy of contractors wanting hourly rates! Seriously should I as the consumer agree to pay hourly? Wouldn't the contractor simply drag his heals making it take longer to accomplish the job? I would! You want to see me drag my heals ? Pay me hourly and watch me! If I can't get an agreement for a set fee for doing the job to competition, then I won't agree to it . Period! Why would any person with two active brain cells do this? It silly! Contractors would do better if they were just up front and honest! It enrages me when they want to get sneaky about their bill! Just my two cents...
Just curious how you go about telling the customer you dont wanna do work for them or how you handle that
Totally agree with you about marking up materials. Customers can be pretty savvy these days, very easy for them to get online and price shop the materials. I think that it undermines trust with the customer, better to sell them on the value of your work, and craftsmanship.
I learned the hard way with a painting job and letting customer buy materials!! I can laugh now but it was a learning curve for sure. Cheap enamel paint for interior work doesnt cut it!!
I agree with you 100% no need to mark up materials... just give them a price to replace it!!!
Thanks for the tips. I'm going to start showing one line item per invoice instead of showing labor, and materials separate. That makes sense. I think that is better received than showing a mark up on materials. People don't really like that.
Rust ring on your saw top?
I just started...
And you are correct... advertising is the worse.
Most people want your free estimate. (AKA, tire kickers)
Give your estimate to the insurance company and you never hear from them again.
I do have a guy who I love... He tells me what he wants, I do it..
And he knows I am not going to rip him off, and job is getting done
Awesome video it’s time people realize there is a value for hard work
I really wish there was a requirement for future contractors to know how to properly ethically price projects, it will only help everyone because let’s be honest contractors don’t have a good reputation as a whole. I just hired someone to redo my front stairs, tear down and rebuild blue stone with stone veneer. Estimates came in ranging from $7200 to $15000 for same scope (I gave them exactly the stone we wanted). The $15k guy asked me what I thought and I was standing in front of the stairs so responded “look at the stairs, material costs are $4000 I do not see this as $11k in labor worth of work…its 2 steps and a landing.” Guys who did the job demo’d, framed then poured new footing in under 8 hours (3 guys) then same 3 built new stairs 1 1/2 days. The contractors that were in same ball park all looked at job and knew exactly what it actually would take to do job, all others were thrown out the door.
As an Electrician in IL, i have the same problem. time&material vs. bid. it is such a pain in the ass. your videos help my confidence. mainly because they have become friends and then recommend me to their friends for the same price. geezh. Love you vids man.
What is the best way to find market value on the services you offer? in the specific area which you live?
As a customer, how do know what the market value is for the work you want done? I’ve had estimates from different places that varied widely in cost and the advice about what “needs” to be done. This makes me distrust all of them to be honest. How do you know if you’re getting screwed on the price or if someone is not charging enough because they’re going to take shortcuts?
Is there a cap to how much you can mark up an item? I've heard that there is with hvac parts. Of course you can move those charges around. I agree, I like to see one flat charge. Customers have short attention spans and they have other worries
How big is the window?
When I was advertising for my painting services, people where literally nickel and dime my services. I had one customer that wanted a large drywall repair done for less than $50 with material and labor. Now I go on word of mouth and have a part time job to fill my time. I think it's good to realize that advertising takes up a lot of your time that could be better spend elsewhere.
Was that customer Indian 😂
@@Chris-oz5md or oriental.
Haha. Love it. Right on the heels of a certain someone elses video. I sure do love your style Handyman!
Oh yea, and I agree with your information as well. Lol
Do you have to pay sales tax on the mark up
That beer can sitting on top of that cast iron table saw top is driving me nuts.
As he's about to put it down, I'm saying DON'T DO IT!!!
Can see the ring. My dad would be pissed. Lol
You can say that, but many, many customers now ask for itemized bids. So do you just walk away from them or make the bid work.
I usually say that they get a bulk price deal when I bid the project as a whole. If they insist on itemized bid the price per item goes up as if I was only being hired to do that one item and not already at the site with my tools out.
I priced the same way when painting and people loved it.
Other painters in my area would complicate estimates. If your price is right you don’t need to mark up materials.
So what do you do if a customer asks what your pay rate is before you start the job if we don’t do hourly wage? How do you give them an answer?
"I don't work by the hour. I hard bid all my work"
Ok, well Ive got a question. How do you find out the "market value" of every service your willing to do? Am I supposed to call a bunch of companies to see what they charge?
I'm interested in the answers to this too
When I first started, I did.
Called two plumbing companies. Told them I picked out my fixture and bought it. How much is labor?
“$80 service call. $80/hr. Two hour minimum.”
Okay. Thanks.
That’s $240 minimum.
So I charged $150. Took me 45 minutes. That’s good money.
Customer is happy. They “saved” $90 using me.
Word of mouth spreads FAST, especially in subdivisions. And teacher’s lounges.
I never, EVER, Mark up materials. They are expensive enough as it is.
Start charging low, increase prices until you have less work than you have time. Then slightly lower prices until you have the correct amount of work for how much time you have.
I peruse the internet to get local labor rates. Such as: " the local cost of replacing a door". Youll get very close to what is a fair rate for a given area, zip code. Hope this helps.
Hometown Handyman and Locksmith