Caleb Williams and CJ Stroud comparisons aren't fair! - Orlovsky on rookie year | First Take
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- Опубликовано: 25 авг 2024
- Dan Orlovsky and Chris "Mad Dog" Russo join Christine Williamson on First Take to debate if rookie QB Caleb Williams can have a CJ Stroud-type impact on the Chicago Bears.
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They're not fair because we have not seen Williams play a single NFL snap yet.
Maybe he’ll have a good year, but CJ type QBs don’t come out of the draft every year. Wish him a good season
CJ went 10-7 thats shouldnt be asking too much of the bears
@@marklumar2034he went 9-6, he missed 2 games. but its not the record as much as how well he played and picked apart defenses as a rookie
@@marklumar2034Caleb can maybe add one win. Bears are still trash.
@@ramnale I'm not totally sold on C.J. especially after ONE season at 10 - 7. His last p/o game was brutal! I hope his career is great but Geesh they got him at #6 QB in NFL??!!
@@foolmenow00 against the best defense in the league. i can tell u didnt watch that game his whole team was all over the place and wasnt ready
who is this mad dog guy and y is he making such a silly face whenever dans talking 😭
are u kidding me? u dont know mad dog Russo?
oof....that profile.and name...
@@FunGamerFever Ayoo 😂
There are 14 playoff teams every year and on average half of those teams don’t make it the following year. So whenever they say “Well Detroit, GB, Dallas, Philly, 9ers, and Rams are all making it back” history has shown us half of those teams won’t. And Dan saying the schedule is “brutal” is such a stretch. The Bears have the 3rd easiest strength of schedule in the NFL. And 6 of their last 9 games are division games, I understand chalking the GB games as losses cuz that’s how it always is, but the Vikings aren’t contending this year, and the Bears were 4 minutes away from sweeping Detroit last year. Dan said the defense will probably be top 10, but then made it sound like the offense also has to be top 10 just to make the wildcard. If the defense is top 10 then the O just needs to be average to slightly above average to make that 7 seed
Did the Bears fix their weak offensive line? I don’t see Williams overcoming such a weak offensive line with no running game, WR are not as important as the trenches and running game ask Pat Mahomes
@@IAmAbunduntbears had a top 5 rushing offense last 2 years. And they did add some pieces on the o line as well as depth. Will it be perfect? No. But they're should always be someone open with the receiving core and running isn't a problem. And the o line is middle of the pack. Not terrible like a lot of people say. Fields just held the ball forever. Really it comes down to Shane Waldron and Caleb Williams. If Caleb/Shane sucks, the bears will be bad.
@@nuisancejones4908 They had a top 5 rushing offense because Justin Fields was their leading rusher both years. Replace JF1's rushing yards with an average QB runs, and they fall to the bottom half of the league.
What CJ did for Houston last season was remarkable and will be incredibly hard to copy. To even ask Caleb to try is unfair to him, ppl forget the Texans were an absolute dumpster fire before CJ and DeMeco came to town
It is not an unrealistic expectation. Caleb is set up with 2 pro bowl wide receivers, a blue chip rook WR, a solid RB and a solid TE.
Either Caleb lives up to the hype, or he is a complete bust. There is no in-between for him.
As a Bears fan, people are setting their expectations too high on Caleb. I do think that there is a possible chance that we will make the playoffs, but I don't think it will be likely. Give him a season or two.
The only big problem I see for the bears offense is oline tbh, everything else looks good.
Not that high. If the bar is CJ and the texans then the bears just have to win 3 more games than last year
@@marklumar2034 That's my point. Why do most KEEP forgetting even with J1 missing games, a backup QB, injuries AND sadly giving away games in the last quarter we STILL could have made p/o's. I know it's hypothetical too but it is a reality!
Bears schedule kinda light
After week 10, we’ll truly know what they’re made of. That back half of the schedule is a GAUNTLET
@@jamesjefferson3809it’s really not that bad when the only real competition they play is Detroit who they should have swept last year and San Francisco who the Bears get to play play coming off of a Thursday game
@@BG.994you don’t think Green Bay is competition to the Bears? The Packers have owned them no matter who’s the Quarterback for the Packers.
@@OtesTube9-8 team that didn’t improve
1st half yes. 2nd half is 1 of the hardest in football
I think while Caleb will be good,he will not be as good as Stroud,and if he is,it will be more because he has a better supporting cast than CJ.Also,as stated in the video,stroud was more pro ready.
Ppl sleeping on the Vikings in that division
Besides the 49ers I think the bears can beat anybody on that schedule
Likely, but... I'm still scratching my head after we beat them in our first game last year..
They can also lose to any of them. And when did they last beat the Packers?
@@ttaylor758 I never said they will win every one I said winnable not guaranteed win
@@foolmenow00 yeah but it’s in San Francisco and we played trey lance lastime in a hurricane
@@ttaylor758 any given Sunday🤷♂️
Dan been hating on Caleb since Day 1..he's also the same guy who said Justin Fields would play MVP football last year
I agree with Dan, against a real defense in Notre Dame Williams came up small, I see the Lions sweeping the Bears, we prefer smaller, slower QB’s vs playing someone as fast and athletic as Fields
Yeah right Dan, we all saw you fart on national television and blame it on a windshield wiper.
You mad at him huh😂he’s wrong about the Bears tho, I see the Bears taking a major step back 6-11 or 5-12 in sole possession of last place in the north, and Williams losing the ROY vote to the Vikings JJ Macarthy
Stroud played in the worst division and 15 of his 17 games were either indoor or decent weather. I’ve been watching Caleb for years now, I know he’s better regardless of his rookie stats
I get some of what they're saying but I don't understand why everyone act like the bears were a horrible squad last year they were 3 insane late blown leads away from the playoffs with better play calling & recievers that can catch they would've been in the playoffs instead of green Bay & they should've swept the lions honestly, not saying they are the best team in the division but with all the offensive playmakers & "generational" qb they added with a top 10 defense they should have just as good chance as DET & GB
They are casuals
The problem is that y'all overhype players
And when they both turn out to be wrong, they’re going to act like none of this was ever said.
Yeah every 1st round QB throws like CJ right?
@@oscararredondo9672 most of them actually do. But pretty much none of them have an all pro left tackle that is at the least top 2 in the entire league. And we all know that’s the 2nd most important position on the team if you have a right handed throwing QB. Especially if he’s a talented rookie. Also most of them aren’t blessed with a very talented ascending young offensive Coordinator that comes from the most successful coaching tree since the late great Bill Walsh. The guy is 100% Guaranteed to land the first open HC job that comes available after this season if CJ stays healthy this year. And last but not least, most rookie QBs don’t have WRs like the ones CJ had last year who people are now calling the best overall WR group in the entire league. Me personally, I think it’s criminal that they never mention this when they bring up CJ’s success. Football is the Ultimate team sport but they act like CJ’s a one man band.
@@InfernoFireStyle bro the season over. There’s no need for hindsight. I didn’t predict what they were going to do. I’m going off of what they did and what ppl are now saying about them far as WR wise. And first and foremost, I never slighted CJ at all. I rocks with him bc I think he’s a stand up dude and I have a lot of respect for him for that. I think he deserves all the praise he gets. I also believe his teammates deserve the praise they don’t get. And I don’t understand why ppl feel as though they can’t do both.
Cj stroud supporting casts in 2 years = 7 first rounders CW supporting cast = 1 first rounder and no one else higher than the 4th rounder
Lol what?
@@demond7l3 lmao what is he even saying
that’s irrelevant to CJ’s rookie year and regardless of how many there were it’s oversimplification. before CJ got there everyone on that roster was underperforming and considered a miss.
And everyone seems to forget that CJ’s best game wasn’t against Georgia in 2022. It was the Rose Bowl against Utah
100% agree with Dan, CJ was just so good last season
He don’t need to be our defense and offense are way better than the Texans were when CJ got there.
Nah Bears suck and overrated lol. Y'all getting carried away before the kid even play
Comparisons aren’t fair? Stop calling every above average qb coming out of college, “generational”.
Let’s not act like even tho Stroud was drafted 2nd, analysts were calling him a possible bust bc of a bad preseason game against NE or test score pre-draft…
This guy saying Trevor taking a step back is crazy he’s still a great qb and I’m a Texans fan afc has very good teams
Flus is not under fire lol
How do you get smaller and slower at QB and still improve your record? Fields is Bigger, stronger and faster than little Caleb Williams, never in NFL history has any team improved going smaller and slower at QB, as a Lions fan so glad to see Fields in the AFC North, this should be easier based off history
Mad Dog out here lookin like Skip.
Dan is either clueless or gets paid for idiotic takes lmao
Thank you!!!!!
Honestly, it's both.
What take was idiotic? The Bears ain’t 💩
1-Lions -14-3
2-Packers-12-5
3-Vikings-9-8
4-Bears-5-12
J.J. McCarthy -ROY
@@IAmAbundunt Vikings 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🗑️🗑️🗑️🗑️🗑️🗑️🗑️
Why is he acting like Minnesota and Seattle are some world beaters 🤣
Cj went to a horrible franchises with a bottom five roster and still smashed. The bears are stacked, caleb better come close at least. Especially after the bears passed on stroud the year before.
as much as i am a caleb fan, you can’t compare until caleb plays a snap of football.
however, caleb has stepped into a better situation AND the bears have the 3rd easiest schedule in the league.
The question was impact. He more than likely won’t put up the same stats as Stroud, but his impact could propel the Bears to the playoffs
They really think Chicago gonna beat the patriots is crazy wild
Dan is still salty he was so wrong about Justin.
Final 8 games are brutal? What schedule are you looking at DO? 😂 We have one of the easiest schedules in the league. Aint nobody scared of our division opponents.
Buddy stop the cap and get out your biaseness. Don't overrate your team before y'all even play a game. Caleb can very much be a bust buddy so cool your jets cause he's not in college anymore where it was a bit easy for him, but in the NFL he'll get humbled very quick
@FunGamerFever Literally nothing I said was cap. I didn't say one word about Caleb. But since we want to play that game...yeah he could have a bad year. So can Mahomes, or any other QB. Elite players can get hurt for the season. Average players can have a great year. Caleb can look dominant. We can do what if all day.
@@BoomorBust You literally just said y'all had the "easiest" schedule. I'd calm down with that logic cause again y'all have a rookie qb that's about to get himself humbled in the big boy league
@FunGamerFever First of all, I said one of the easiest. Second, literally tied for 4th in lowest strength of schedule. Third, again...didn't mention Caleb. You are driving a narrative that Caleb is going to be bad which you have zero evidence to stand on. Stop arguing with me, just say you wanted to hate on Caleb and move on.
@@BoomorBust Um...maybe because that's gonna be your starting qb slow boy 😮💨 That's why I said to calm down before you say easy cause that same "easy" doesn't apply when you have a rookie. This isn't college
Orlovsky should be an OC
Vikings and bears would be an even match-up, it won't be as brutal as you think. You guys keep forgetting that vikings have a rookie QB too, JJ isn't some 10 year elite QB.
The afc south was good last year… the colts and jags both had 9 wins the Texans got lucky that Trevor was hurt. The bears can make it in the nfc
Patrick Mahomes had the same qualities coming into the NFL ran the same offense at Tech and did fine.
I dont remember everyone thinking Stroud was hoing to do what he did before the season started...
He had excellent rookie year(not unprecedented despite what certain people say(Luck, Herbert) and now Stroud is the greatest qb that ever lived...
You can't have it both ways.
It’s not fair to Caleb because he’s already so far ahead of Caleb as a player.
Dan may be right on this, but unfortunately if Flus does Not get to the playoffs, he's likely gone, especially with this roster
It’s hilarious how they already lining up the excuses not to expect the same from caleb. CJ went to a bad team. Caleb getting a legit team. If he ain’t throwin over 4K yards and make it to the playoff he ain’t him
He's a rookie. Most ppl understand that. Clearly you don't
Brain dead take lol
@@MikkiChavez so was CJ and Caleb is the most hyped 1st overall pick ever. It comes with the territory.
@@Soggs101 articulate your take instead of attacking ppl if your tiny brain is capable of doin that
@@Obyak you made no point lol he's a rookie. Doesn't matter the hype. The hype isn't for their first year. It's for their career. Have some sense
They're two totally different people. Came from 2 different programs and styles of playing just stupid to compare apples and oranges 😂😂😂
Its stupid to compare fruit to fruit?
@@marklumar2034 Apples you can eat the skin, Oranges you have to peel. Helpful for ya buddy? lol
Caleb might not have a Stroud type year, but if it isn't similar the dude is a bust. Stroud's offense was much worse than what Williams is walking into
I'll say he isn't bust IF he/Bears are competitive! Fans want the Bears to make p/'s but... IF they just miss out yet have close games, this bodes well for an upcoming rebuilding team, agree?
@@foolmenow00 I'll bite on that. But that isn't really different from what I'm getting at. Williams' performance isn't solely based on W/L rate. There are other stats that matter. Though I think it would be surprising if the Bears weren't extremely good if Williams isn't horrible. They have an elite defense and an incredible receiving core. That said, if his stats are impressive despite not winning enough games to make it to the playoffs, that will still be fine and will bode well going forward
@@Zeffpenguin Thanks for a concise and respectful reply. Are you an alien and not from earth 🌎 😊!?
@@foolmenow00 lol not a robot, just autistic
My boy Michael Penix 🏹 🎯 let's go 💪🏾
He has the weapons to come close. BEAR DOWN
He's wrong about Stroud putting on the best rookie QB performance we've ever seen. The Texans had a good season with a good rookie QB. Cam Newton had the best rookie season we've ever seen. He went to truly the worst team in the NFL.
Cam Newton - 4051 pass, 21 pass Tds, 706 rush, 14 rush Tds
CJ Stroud - 4108 pass, 23 pass Tds, 167 rush, 3 rush Tds.
I know you guys forget to remember.
We have a lot of reasons absolutely to believe that Caleb Williams (if he plays all 17 games) will have the best rookie QB performance we've ever seen. "We've never ever seen" a #1 pick generational QB join a team this talented.
Caleb Williams - 11 wins, 1-2 playoff wins, 4500 pass yards, 40 Tds, 400 rush, 5 rush Tds.
Smart man not including interceptions in your argument
@@williamwoods9669 You're right. He averaged an int a game but 36 combined TDs with 4800 total yards on the weakest team in the NFL...as a rookie. If you want to crown Herbert as the best rookie run I'm good with that. Stroud though...that's the team and coach just as much. 21 TDs ...I don't know. He's quite a bit more clutch. I'll give him that. We'll see if he's the truth this year with an even better team.
@@kelsowilz2522 and you could make the argument that it was just as much coaching and team for Herbert if not more. He came into the league with Allen and Mike Williams who had 1,000 yards receiving season the year before and his oc was one of the best offensive minds in the game today Shane Steichen.
The vikings are not brutal 😂😂
The Caleb hype is real 😆
Caleb will be another bust by Chicago sad to say with the upgrades in the wr room
This take is horrible. Ryan Day was Justin Fields coach.. 😐 Dan is turning into a goof
Dan not wrong
Yes he is lol Caleb was more highly touted coming out of college for a reason.
Dan has clearly never watched Caleb play a full game. The in structure talking point is so false. The only reason he is saying that is because all of Caleb’s highlights come from improvising when in reality he was one of the most in structure quarterbacks in college. There is a reason why he is the highest rated quarterback prospect of the decade and it’s because he has an almost flawless game
@@BG.994You moron he said Caleb isn’t used to a pro-style offensive scheme, he was running a spread offense RPO college-style offense that has training wheels on it compared to the league.
@@BG.994lol
@@hockeyfan1799watch Caleb man he likes to look for big plays instead of the small details
naw naw the way yall hyype caleb up plus the the talent he has aroung him naw he better be just as good as CJ 😒
The question was can Caleb have a stroud like impact…if you believe Caleb to be as talented or more so than CJ and these experts would have selected Caleb #1 last year, then that answer is yes.
Nobody really knows if CJ Stroud is even that good. Nobody watches AFC South football and he snuck into the playoffs off of a historic Jax and ind collapse. Then he got to play the broken browns before getting completely destroyed by the Ravens who then got completely destroyed by the chiefs defense.
It's a great season to start but it's not an indicator of future success. Dan even hinted at that with the third down comment. Texans weren't performing well on 1st and 2nd, but made up for it on 3rd down. That's not sustainable. That's like a defense letting up a bunch of yards but having a bunch of ints. It just doesn't continue like that. The pendulum always swings the other way.
Let's just hope CJ can adapt as the pendulum swings.
@@josephpayton7522 You sound like a hater. Maybe take your own advice and watch Stroud play for once. Don't try to sugarcoat thinking Caleb can play better cause he won't. Only reason for those 3rd downs are thanks to Stroud cause Texans running game was not bright but the passing was. Not to mention they beat Bengals with Burrow, Saints and Bucs defense were legit which showed Stroud's clutch moments, and his consistency. He didn't "sneak" into the playoffs, he got them to playoffs by performing well. Browns still made the playoffs and even still had the number one passing defense which a rookie destroyed. Not even Myles Garrett could do anything so what does that say? Or did you also forget Texans also had a ton of injuries with most players out for the season like Tank Dell and Jimmy Ward along with some backup o-lines. Do some research buddy
He's a rookie in the big boy league so no. It's not college so don't expect much from Caleb and overhype before he actually does something
@@josephpayton7522 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I’m not letting a guy who went 0-16 bad mouth Heisman winner Caleb Williams yes CJ looked great against Georgia did we forget what Caleb did against Texas I’m sorry Caleb can do things other QB’s can’t and we beat the Lions last year!🖕🏽🤯🔫
People are talking like they know everything about football. THEY clearly dont i really dont understand for the life of me why America can handle any of the things that they talking about. Do we have to be so pathetic with conversatitons about facts that need to be mixed?
Bears dominated the lions last year
Yeah except for the 4th quarter when the Lions scored 14 unanswered points with 2 sacks and a forced fumble, that’s not dominant, weak offensive line with no running game showed up in the 4th quarter
Secondly- the Bears were bigger,stronger and faster at QB last year, this year their worse at QB with the little Williams and the offensive line has not improved at the same time the Lions d-line has improved, adding 6’7 Markus Davenport and getting the problem James Houston (8.5 sacks in 8gms in rookie year) back from injury…. Expect to take a step back from last year and to be swept by the Lions and Packers
Worse at QB?😂 How?
Bears own the Lions...lol
Iight bro tell me what QB came out of Ohio State doing what Stroud did? I’ll wait. 😂
"C.J. only eclipsed it by 100" 🤦♂️ 🤦♂️ 🤦♂️
And he missed two games
While missing 3 games with a concussion
CJ Stroud also had a better team around him. With better coaching, but now since teams have tape on him this season can be more difficult. But with everything around Caleb Williams he should have a very impressive rookie season. 12-5
Y’all keep sleeping on them titans I love it
Man as long as ya have Ryan we always going to sleep
Comparison, the their of joy.
Ignorance and stupidy daily.
I agree with Dan, CJ Stroud is more Pro-Ready QB than Caleb Williams. Caleb is more along the lines of Justin Fields like QB.
Caleb is a much better player
And the Bears roster is so much better than they realize. They were 3 blown double digit 4th quarter leads from making the playoffs last year. The division isn’t nearly as good as people are making it out to be when they almost swept the Lions and the Packers were a 9-8 team who didn’t do much to improve this offseason
@@BG.994”Almost” doesn’t count. They didn’t sweep Detroit. That’s that. Caleb is in a better position than CJ was anyway
@@TYreLL0416 they had a 12 point lead with 4:15 left on the clock and dominated Goff in both games. Plus they also improved their roster even more when the Lions didn’t improve at all. They are the better team
@@BG.994 can’t wait till the texans embarrass that garbage ahh team 🤣🤣🤣🤡🤡
@@TYreLL0416there is the difference. CJ made the team better rather than the Bears team will make Calab play better. At least that’s the plan anyway.
CJ Stroud didn't have the best rookie season. Cam, RG3, Andrew Luck all played good with less if were beig honest. CJ made the playoffs because Jags & Colts QB got hurt
What? 😂😂😂😂😂. U stupid boy. No QB in history had a better year is documented dipshit 😅
They still would have make the playoffs. He is the best qb in the division
@@Slickmac2323 no they wouldn't have can u read? It's because Jags lost a lot of games after Trevor was hurt & Colts QB was hurt. Anthony Richardson beat Texans when they played. Next game Colts had Minshew lol Stroud is seriously over hyped. When they don't play good this year ppl will come back down to earth. Colts have best QB in division
No they didn't are you crazy LoL 😆. Luck had Reggie Wayne and ty Hilton and cam had Steve Smith rg3 you can probably argue
So those QBs led the NFL in TD/INT ratio and passing ypg in their rookie seasons? Nah son
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