Wider Options Spreads: 3 Benefits | Options Trading Concepts

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  • Опубликовано: 3 июл 2024
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Комментарии • 98

  • @SK-qj3oj
    @SK-qj3oj 3 года назад +12

    He failed to mention 2 key downsides:
    1. ROC will be much lower for wider iron condors
    2. P/L Fluctuations will be more volatile for wide iron condors due to greeks being more pronounced

  • @CoffeeRoamer
    @CoffeeRoamer 4 года назад +15

    mike's content may be available commonly.. but the way he presents , directly goes to my brain and sits with ease.... gives me lot of improvement ideas for my trade... this guy is a blessing to options community, i would rate his best instructor for options ever.

    • @Engloid
      @Engloid 3 года назад

      I agree. I like his methods.

  • @mistersir2616
    @mistersir2616 4 года назад +43

    5:55 there is some truth in it

    • @quincygunnerson5670
      @quincygunnerson5670 4 года назад +1

      Mister Sir probability of sex

    • @robertkinsall7990
      @robertkinsall7990 4 года назад

      It's all connected! 🤣🤣

    • @everything1
      @everything1 3 года назад +1

      I heard that too. That was awesome.

    • @BlackPanther4577
      @BlackPanther4577 3 года назад +4

      That moment when she finds out you're an options millionaire

    • @AJ-iu6nw
      @AJ-iu6nw 3 года назад +1

      @@BlackPanther4577 goals

  • @martdb100
    @martdb100 4 года назад +21

    Thanks. I wish I saw this video 3 years ago...would have made more money...but you better believe I will be trading spreads this way going forward. Excellent info.

  • @phas714
    @phas714 3 года назад +7

    I did wider spreads mainly to avoid Naked Puts, the only downside i find is i am unable to close the spread due to low volume on the lower strike side.

  • @robertkinsall7990
    @robertkinsall7990 4 года назад

    THANK YOU Mike! Excellent presentation.

  • @mosestighil1179
    @mosestighil1179 7 лет назад +4

    thanks Mike, this is very well explained

  • @stevenniggebrugge6514
    @stevenniggebrugge6514 3 года назад +15

    Mike missed a lot here - wider spreads mean also more downside risk, higher BPR, potentially lower ROC...higher PoP, more positive theta and higher credit received is only one side of the coin.

    • @alexh1954
      @alexh1954 2 года назад +3

      No it's not just higher credit. It's probably of profit, better breakeven points...

    • @nukious
      @nukious 2 года назад

      @@alexh1954 Right, risk management.

  • @tomforstik4899
    @tomforstik4899 4 года назад +5

    This is an excellent video. Very good points, and extremely well articulated

  • @peteallennh
    @peteallennh 5 лет назад +4

    I have been looking for a way to really understand BEPs on spreads, and this video really cements the concept beautifully. Very very well done.

  • @theworkinginvestor
    @theworkinginvestor Год назад

    This video is the best explanation I have found.

  • @khaedhossen4139
    @khaedhossen4139 5 лет назад +1

    Impressive key points.

  • @terribreed7637
    @terribreed7637 7 лет назад

    Excellent explanation! Great info.

  • @Q8Patriot
    @Q8Patriot 3 года назад +1

    Well explained, thanks alot. Also commision wise, its much better to have wider sppreads

  • @magdaliny62
    @magdaliny62 8 лет назад

    Great video and explanation!!!

  • @hyperspace1003
    @hyperspace1003 3 года назад +11

    As other people mentioned here, the ROC will be much lower for a wider spread, which is the trade off.

  • @TheBearsjunkie
    @TheBearsjunkie 4 года назад +1

    Thank you thank you and thank you.

  • @hvac1688
    @hvac1688 3 года назад +2

    Well Explained and Thanks for sharing... Naked Put is my favor Strategy, but it's unlimited risk , Wider wings Bull Put Spread is my favor now.....

  • @yellowbird221
    @yellowbird221 5 лет назад +1

    Great vid!

  • @kamleshratda9008
    @kamleshratda9008 Год назад

    MIKE SIR
    THIS REALLY AMAZING video

  • @zerototalenergy150
    @zerototalenergy150 4 года назад +3

    👍....thank you..but even though you increase the credit on wider spread,you reduce your % return...vs narrower spread...excellent presentation...Thank you !

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  4 года назад +1

      Correct, but max loss is realized at a much higher %, compared to a wider spread where max loss probability is lower, because it takes a larger move in the stock price. Either way, totally up to you!

  • @joesemo
    @joesemo 3 года назад +1

    9:00 mark. The best reason/argument for having wider spreads, starts to act like a Naked Option - with Defined Cost on the 10 wide wing. There will be a much higher Buying Power Reduction though, so small accounts will only be able to do a few at a time. Should save on Commissions, so another good reason.

  • @Engloid
    @Engloid 3 года назад

    Great video.

  • @guitarpassion1
    @guitarpassion1 3 года назад

    Can't thank you enough 👍👍

  • @Ashok.Vaidya
    @Ashok.Vaidya 4 года назад +2

    one more benefit : Double down would cost trade commission. As number of contract increase you pay $6.50 per contract on TOS. Going wider would save you $6.50 and increase your probability even further !!!

  • @Robert-di3kv
    @Robert-di3kv Год назад

    Really good one

  • @tombraon1006
    @tombraon1006 Год назад +1

    But the brake even might be relevant only at expiration... if the stock moves down rapidly, your account will bleed. Isn't that so?

  • @joyjones5097
    @joyjones5097 3 года назад

    Thx for this review. But really, I don’t like naked call options basically because of the break even. It’s very hard to break even.

  • @donnyh3497
    @donnyh3497 3 года назад +1

    This seemed to be a good strategy if you have the luxury of watching your portfolio everyday. Can you set up stops to close spreads at certain points and if so can you do it on ghetto brokerages like robinhood or webull?

  • @goldpyramidsfoodtravelvlog7984
    @goldpyramidsfoodtravelvlog7984 2 года назад +1

    5:55 Reminds me of how we used to calculate things in college! LOL
    14:20 Haha now I know they're just giving Mike a hard time!

  • @jeffreybeck1928
    @jeffreybeck1928 3 года назад +1

    You run into rolling issues with low liquidity underlyings. It works well if your strikes are not breached and IV has not spiked. It is impossible to roll a spread with wide wings, if there is no one on the other side.

  • @SudhakarReddy-kg8xr
    @SudhakarReddy-kg8xr 3 года назад +1

    Good , explained all.postibe things but wider spread will increse the potential of loss as well right??

  • @KBBAKTHA
    @KBBAKTHA 3 года назад +1

    Excellent analysis. My question is when you have to buy back the put spread, the wider the spread (short being at same strike price) we would end up paying more than on a closer spread.

    • @edmandell3064
      @edmandell3064 2 года назад

      I was going to ask the same question. I saw the benefit of the premium differential of the wider spread. But the risk to close seemed more costly as well. So I'm assuming you may have to close these spreads more often to mitigate risk and protect your capital opposed to if spread was very narrow.

    • @mikeJones-zo8si
      @mikeJones-zo8si 2 года назад +2

      Always calculate your max risk. Shorter spreads have a smaller max risk. 5 points is 500$. Easier to get out if it goes bad, or sell the long put and roll the short put or take the shares and start selling calls

  • @GnomeChomsky9999
    @GnomeChomsky9999 5 лет назад +2

    I call this the Naked Spread! 8-)
    I have a question. Will it be easier to roll the wider spread? That is what I see as beneficial about single options positions.

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  5 лет назад +2

      It will be easier to roll for a credit if the short strike is slightly ITM. Narrow spreads have much less wiggle room in this regard.

  • @GodlessPhilosopher
    @GodlessPhilosopher 3 года назад

    Interesting. How do you translate this to call debit spreads?

  • @jdthefirst
    @jdthefirst 3 года назад

    OTM credit put spread.How to adjust for intrinsic value? To benefit, should we place otm credit spreads?

  • @rajataggarwal1378
    @rajataggarwal1378 5 лет назад +1

    nice video.. I have one question. as per your third exaple what will happen if i do not long that lower strike price put option..?

    • @riskwise99
      @riskwise99 5 лет назад +1

      Hi Rajat - you would receive a higher credit as you're not paying for the long "wing". However you'd require much greater margin/buying power as you'd have a naked short put. On top of that should the stock price really drop say below 68 and you held to expiration you'd suffer greater loss as you'd likely be 'assigned' on the short put and end up long 100 the stock @ 78 whereas the long put at 68 would help you out should stock drop below 68. So think of the long put in a credit spread a kind of 'insurance' - hence it's called 'defined risk'. Naked short is undefined risk.

  • @ocrun6765
    @ocrun6765 3 года назад +2

    minor point: you dramatically increase your risk. It feels naked because it almost is naked.

  • @bobdoyle5945
    @bobdoyle5945 4 года назад +9

    the problem with having such wide strikes is the risk if it goes wrong could really screw you.

    • @edg2520
      @edg2520 3 года назад

      Agree, but Mike says at the beginning that wider strikes are more appropriate for those with bigger accounts. Instead of multiple small contracts, one contract with wider strikes might be a better proposition.

    • @alexh1954
      @alexh1954 2 года назад

      What is the difference between buying 5 x $1 wide spread versus buying 1 x $5 wide spread?

  • @thejsonYT
    @thejsonYT 3 года назад +5

    5:55 my probability of s..

    • @wtpg4209
      @wtpg4209 3 года назад +2

      Now that's a tasty trade! :)

  • @joestory1
    @joestory1 7 лет назад

    What is the Rule of Thumb for cutting losses on Verticals even though its a defined risk trade and we kind of like to manage are winners at around %50 profit but what about losers in a time frame between 30-45 to expiration. And will it depend on Credit or Debit ?

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  7 лет назад +3

      Generally we don't do anything with them - if our assumption has changed prior to expiration we can get out for less than max loss, but at the same time if we lock in that loss, it could mean that we don't allow ourselves the chance for the spread to turn around and become profitable again, which is why we usually just leave them be.

  • @kszpirak
    @kszpirak 5 лет назад +1

    Quick question; In that last example with the widest spread. What would you say is a good width (in terms of standard deviations) for sale of naked put and for purchase of the naked put?

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  5 лет назад

      It's really up to you - there are trade-offs with every scenario, but if we're going wide and we want delta neutrality, we typically opt for the "dynamic iron condor" which is based off delta as opposed to strike symmetry. We typically sell the 20 delta options and buy the 10 delta options in that case, but that might not line up with our risk tolerance depending on the stock price. Totally up to you, but that's an example of what we look at.

    • @riskwise99
      @riskwise99 5 лет назад

      I tend to go for +/- 1 std deviation to sell the call/put. In either case you're looking around the 16 delta strike to sell. If more aggressive then go 20 to 30 delta to sell. For the long wing I would not base that on StDev to be honest but more on risk/reward based on how much you're paying for the wing. Just my opinion, not saying it's right or wrong hope that helps.

  • @davidho5714
    @davidho5714 Год назад

    can you explain the situation where max loss is less than net credit?

  • @CoffeeRoamer
    @CoffeeRoamer 4 года назад

    as 4th option, for completely naked put its even higher than 68% which is great, but only to avoid assignment we are buying a distant put correct?

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  4 года назад

      Buying the OTM put defines risk and helps smooth out the volatility of P/L - it doesn't affect assignment risk since assignment risk only applies to ITM short options. Assignment risk has to do with extrinsic value - the more extrinsic value a short option has, the less likely it is to be assigned since the counter-party burns all extrinsic value when they exercise an option.

  • @65sohc
    @65sohc 3 года назад

    Is there a practical limit as to how wide the spread should be, assuming a large account of greater than $1,000,000?

  • @myeo5205
    @myeo5205 5 лет назад +2

    What are the cons of wider spread? Compared to lower spreads More buying power reduction? And larger loss right?

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  5 лет назад +2

      Wider spreads do take more BPR, but not if you're comparing a $5 wide spread to 5 contracts of a $1 wide spread. BPR would be similar in that case, but you have a lot more space before the $5 wide reaches max loss, compared to the $1 wide spreads.
      Only larger losses and BPR if you're comparing ONE contract of $1 wide spread to ONE contract of $5 wide spread. The wider spread will have more profit potential, more max loss potential, but a higher POP as well.
      I hope this helps!

  • @AJ-iu6nw
    @AJ-iu6nw 3 года назад +1

    What are the risks of wider spreads? Is it true that the max loss is greater when the spreads are wider?

  • @reisverhalen
    @reisverhalen 7 лет назад +3

    really great explanations
    Ps :
    5:59 - Happens :D

  • @DaBooster
    @DaBooster 2 года назад

    What’s the negative of wider spreads?

  • @AndrewLander3
    @AndrewLander3 2 года назад

    What about the collateral capital you need the further out you move the wings

  • @mikeJones-zo8si
    @mikeJones-zo8si 2 года назад

    I’m having trouble finding a spread with a 2 point range that pays 1.00 credit

  • @zerototalenergy150
    @zerototalenergy150 2 года назад

    question... say I want to buy QQQ at lower price..If I sell a naked putOTM.. return is very small.. why not a short put and a long put ..wide spread.. return on mpney is better..and if stock finishes between short and long..than I am ahappy .iam assigned the stock(cash secured of course).
    thank you..

  • @brucea550
    @brucea550 2 года назад +1

    Picking up dimes instead of nickels and the steamroller got bigger.

  • @fredcdobbs823
    @fredcdobbs823 4 года назад

    So, why have the offset debit leg?

  • @brendanutt3321
    @brendanutt3321 2 года назад

    So on robinhood, my issues are when still trying to understand how to issue my "bid-ask" and it ends up asking me to 'set my own for better probability of getting filled'... any suggestions anyone?

  • @megynkelly180
    @megynkelly180 2 года назад

    Can u tell me if this is also called a Bear Put Spread. U say this is a Bullish trade. im still not sure if that is also called a Bear Put Spread or not.

  • @saderick52
    @saderick52 4 года назад +1

    What about collateral ?

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  4 года назад +2

      With equities, the collateral used for a credit spread is simply the max loss, unless you're trading futures options.
      The wider the spread, the more buying power will be used, but you'll be collecting more premium as well which offsets this increase somewhat.

    • @saderick52
      @saderick52 4 года назад

      tastytrade thank you very much for answering! I understand that the absolute profit is great with wider spread, but then if you consider collateral, is the profit rate (profit/collateral) typically lower for wider spread? Again, thx a lot!

  • @sanbetski
    @sanbetski 7 лет назад +2

    Is there disadvantage with wider option spread? Needing a higher margin?

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  7 лет назад +1

      There is a higher margin for wider spreads, because there is a higher max loss. That is the trade off!

    • @devennravaliya
      @devennravaliya 4 года назад

      But loss in this strategy!?? How to manage loss!????

    • @mikeJones-zo8si
      @mikeJones-zo8si 4 года назад +1

      Wider the spread the greater the max potential loss could be

  • @NeoKailthas
    @NeoKailthas 4 года назад

    What if volatility increases?

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  4 года назад +1

      If you have a credit spread that is OTM and IV increases, extrinsic value would increase in the spread all else equal, but to a lesser degree than if you were just short the single option, since the long defined risk aspect of the trade offsets a lot of greek exposure.

    • @NeoKailthas
      @NeoKailthas 4 года назад

      @@tastyliveshow thanks.

  • @ra1507
    @ra1507 4 года назад +4

    But your collateral

  • @kpmadness
    @kpmadness 4 года назад

    Is this something that can be applied to debit spreads?

    • @tastyliveshow
      @tastyliveshow  4 года назад

      Sure - the main point in debit spreads to create a high probability scenario is to ensure the extrinsic value collection on the short option is MORE than the extrinsic value paid for in the long option.

  • @Chiortik
    @Chiortik 2 года назад +2

    What happens if the price tanks passed 68? You are so screwed.

  • @cheasmoon8213
    @cheasmoon8213 3 года назад

    Mine is as wide as Putin