As soon as I get all the parts My next project is a 1650 gas that I acquired from Ross the Oliver Man so I’m looking forward to your 1600 rebuild series
Thanks for sharing all this Chris, appreciate the detail on getting the clearances correct! A strong case for ‘Don’t Assume’! Makes an Ass out of u and me.
Do you have to put rod bolts in one time 1855 had low oil pressure pull pan oil pump was flopping back-and-forth. It broke put new oil pump on and it was OK.
It's best to replace the rod bolts with new ones that are stronger. Replacing the 2 piece wrist pin bushings with one piece is probably the most important thing to do.
Good job! Thanks so much for videoing and explaining. I learned more with your explanation of building motor than I did with 2 years of school!!! You are amazing!!!! THANKS!!
I've had to do it to several engines, I really have had some great teachers on engines. I've built alot of small and big block chevys . A bunch of 310s n fleet line ones . Chris you ever balance the crank rods n pistons ,makes them run so smooth . I did it to are 1855 like your building there , good to show everyone this information. I have a Mac tourqe tool like you have nice tool . Great video from turkey creek farms be safe n thankful
I had a 310 come in once with a broken crank, so I replaced the harmonic balancer and had the rods, pistons and flywheel balanced. It was the smoothest running 310 I ever set up.
That's why good engine overhauls take a lot of time. Anyone can throw together a engine fast, but it takes talent to check everything while rebuilding. I once had a chevy small block come in with some weird sounding engine noise and the owner said it was a brand new rebuild by his buddy. When I opened up the engine I found std pistons and rings in a block bored .030 over and std bearings on a crank ground .020/.020. I told the guy, this is why you should check everything. Good work Chris
That must have slapped and rattled like crazy. My machinist was telling me about a customer that rebuilt Chevys all the time and finally did a Ford. It took a hammer, but he got that thrust bearing to go on the same main he had always put them on.
Chris I have one more question . Have you ever purchased parts from Jensales? They have a main bearing kit that is 002 under that would be perfect for my application. They offer alot of parts for the oliver tractor . I figured that you might be familiar with that company. Again thanks for your time
Great Video. I have a 1800a gas block how do I verify if its original. The original 1800a block I'm told is hard to get sleeves and pistons. I started to rebuild it and came up against that problem.
If you get the build card for the tractor , the original engine serial number is written on the back. Search for the Floyd County Museum, they have the build cards.
👌. Looks like a good solution to your problem. Should be very little wear on front side of that bearing and you still have full thickness on the back for wear. Gonna put that in my memory bank if I can remember it if I ever run into that. 😜
Lapping those thrust bearings is old school but good school. I have lapped my share of stuff and it is an accepted way of fitting parts. As long as the numbers are correct no harm no foul. Even if it were a bit tight it will wear in shortly after you run the engine some. Only thing I disagree with is I have always plastigauged my cranks dry. That thick film of assembly lube can fudge your numbers but then again you are smashing a piece of plastic so just how accurate can it be. I think you are doing a fine job...
I have often wondered how much the assembly lube throws off the plastigauge. I have done it dry and recall the work it took to get that stuff off the bearings and decided that the small difference wasn't worth the frustration. When I do the 1600, I'll check a bearing dry and then with lube to see how much difference there really is.
Lapping that thrust bearing is exactly what should be done in this situation. Good call Chris. Taking your new bearings to the machinist with block and crank are the right way to do it next time.
I usually wait for a report from the crank guy as to what he is going to grind it to, then buy my bearings. I did the same tthis time, but they ground as soon as they decided what spec it was going to. I used to have a guy nearby who was excellent, but unfortunately, he passed away a couple of years ago, so this was my first try at a new place.
Chris I'm refreashing a 1650 oliver gas engine with new sleeves and pistons. My crank is with in specs but will say the crank has alot of end play. The old thrust bearing is worn severely on one size of the face. I have checked for tolerances yet until I get the new bearings. So now for my question if I need too instead of have the crank welded and ground for the proper endplay. Are these oversized thrust bearings easy to locate?
I don't think they are. For awhile there a lot of the Oliver bearings were hard to find, but the supply chain seems to be catching back up. Korves Oliver should be able to get you what you need, but if you have trouble, post back again and I will do some checking around.
Thank you for your advice. I really enjoy watching your videos. There's alot of your stuff that I watch that doesn't have anything to do with anything I'm doing now but most of it might come down the road. Thanks again
We always did crank measurements using engine oil. Assembly lube, being thicker can throw your measurements off a thou or 2. After checking then the STP application to the bearings would take place. It might be interesting to do an end play test with the bearing dry, then with engine oil, then with assembly lube. After all, we used to install heavier-weight engine oil to offset wear and be able to get more hours out of an engine before a rebuild. We had a pipe that would hold almost 2 qts of engine oil and a line that screwed into the oil gallery. We used it on turbocharged engines to guarantee oil pressure to the turbo during the first start. We always gave thought to installing an engine pre-oiling pump kit. They were available. On engines that sat for months at a time the pre-oiler would definitely earn its keep. One could wire a Murphy switch into the starter engage wire so the starter would not engage until oil pressure reached a pre-set pressure. No one gives a 2nd thought today when you turn the key and the computers do their systems checks (or run the air intake heaters) before the starter actually engages.
For as much as the plastigauge stuck to the bearing and crank, I think it was pusjing almost all the lube out of the way. I really hadto scratch with my fingernail to get it off. I think I'll take one off and try it each way to see. I think it will make for interesting video.
.002 clearance might have worked ok, or it might have spun that thrust bearing once everything expanded in the heat. I feel good about where it is now.
Last time I did an engine rebuild was in the 80's. I didn't do some of the steps you did, like the plastigauge or end thrust, but we were doing a garage fix and I did regret not being more thorough. I let the pros do it now a days, oh my son and I did replaced a head gasket on his Massey Ferguson 285 a few years ago. Nice one Chris, good luck on the remainder of the rebuild. Have a nice week ahead.
I agree with cutting the thrust face ive done it before. Use a sheet of 1/4" glass on top of the bench glass is dead flat . Or buy a cheap Granite or cast iron surface plate off of amazon. I have a Starrett Surface plate i use .
Good morning Chris What do you think about those oil priming things that you can buy? I made my own out of an old R134A. Refrigerant canister lol. I just filled it about halfway with whatever engine oil I'm using then put 35 or so psi of air into it, then flip it upside down, thread the hose into the oil gallery port, Open the valve and it blows the oil in throughout the engine. Usually I will do that until I register oil pressure on the gauge and then fire up the engine. Seems to work pretty good and I think it helps the engine run cooler from the residual R134A in the bottle.😂
I've never tried one. Typically I have pressure from the pump by the time I get the injection system bled out. That assembly lube is as slick as snot and clings like a booger. I always worry that a primer could be pumping in dirty oil since it doesn't go through the filter. But a former Oliver Service rep told me, "dirty oil is better than no oil"
Do you know what that's a very good point… I've never thought of that. The risk for dirty oil is a lot higher. I try and keep that tank clean. And yes, helium would be better than refrigerant. Haha
It's starting to be years. I usually don't work on restorations from planting to harvest, just the winter months. I should be a lot farther along on this one. Hopefully, it gets done before spring work starts.
Do you get nasty grams in the comments? I never really read them so I don't know. If I said you should just plop a IH DT-466 in there, would that count?
Lol. I do get the occasional hater in the comments, and knew I would going into this. It's actually been less than what I thought it would be. Would I have to paint it red with a 466 in it? 😆
@@ThatOliverGuyChris Well, if I ever can come up with a 45 or 47 or 4960 Deere with a destroyed engine, I am going to put a DT-466 IH in it. Paint the engine red, with the rest normal..............Make everyone mad. I actually bought a 4960 cheap intending to do it, but the engine was no where close to what I was told, ended up fixing it and we use it. I do have a IH 560 Diesel that I might drop a Deere 329 in and do it in reverse. As brand loyal people are in my area, I won't have any friends, which could be great!
Another awesome video sir, thank you for sharing your infant knowledge it’s really helping me with my 1955 rebuild
I'm glad to hear it helps. That's my main goal with these videos.
As soon as I get all the parts My next project is a 1650 gas that I acquired from Ross the Oliver Man so I’m looking forward to your 1600 rebuild series
Hopefully I'll get to that one next winter.
Love your professionalism and willngness to take tyhe extra steps/
Thanks!
Thanks for sharing all this Chris, appreciate the detail on getting the clearances correct! A strong case for ‘Don’t Assume’! Makes an Ass out of u and me.
Use a piece of glass. With sand paper taped to it
I seen old mechanics sand those thrusts befor
Hey Chris! You can’t be wearing gloves during critical stuff like bearing installation. Can’t feel the dirt… 😁. Nice rebuild
😂😂😂
I enjoy watching not for learning just entertainment.
Do you have to put rod bolts in one time 1855 had low oil pressure pull pan oil pump was flopping back-and-forth. It broke put new oil pump on and it was OK.
It's best to replace the rod bolts with new ones that are stronger. Replacing the 2 piece wrist pin bushings with one piece is probably the most important thing to do.
Good job! Thanks so much for videoing and explaining. I learned more with your explanation of building motor than I did with 2 years of school!!! You are amazing!!!!
THANKS!!
Wow, I honestly don't know what to say other than thanks!
Lots of engine building knowledge in episode
I've had to do it to several engines, I really have had some great teachers on engines. I've built alot of small and big block chevys . A bunch of 310s n fleet line ones . Chris you ever balance the crank rods n pistons ,makes them run so smooth . I did it to are 1855 like your building there , good to show everyone this information. I have a Mac tourqe tool like you have nice tool . Great video from turkey creek farms be safe n thankful
I haven't gone as far as balancing them. Some say it's a must with the 310, others not so much. I'm sure it would smooth it out.
I had a 310 come in once with a broken crank, so I replaced the harmonic balancer and had the rods, pistons and flywheel balanced. It was the smoothest running 310 I ever set up.
Awesome job showing and explaining everything. Loving the rebuild videos. Can't wait for the next video. 👍👍
Thanks 👍
That's why good engine overhauls take a lot of time. Anyone can throw together a engine fast, but it takes talent to check everything while rebuilding. I once had a chevy small block come in with some weird sounding engine noise and the owner said it was a brand new rebuild by his buddy. When I opened up the engine I found std pistons and rings in a block bored .030 over and std bearings on a crank ground .020/.020. I told the guy, this is why you should check everything. Good work Chris
That must have slapped and rattled like crazy. My machinist was telling me about a customer that rebuilt Chevys all the time and finally did a Ford. It took a hammer, but he got that thrust bearing to go on the same main he had always put them on.
G'day mate great video
Thanks Murphy! How are you doing?
@@ThatOliverGuyChris Good and extremely busy starting a new life and farm in a different state is lots of work. I need to catch up on your videos mate
Sounds like lots of changes for you. Are you going to be making some new videos for us?
@@ThatOliverGuyChris Yes mum and I want to start putting videos up again so we are going to start very soon
Chris I have one more question .
Have you ever purchased parts from Jensales? They have a main bearing kit that is 002 under that would be perfect for my application. They offer alot of parts for the oliver tractor . I figured that you might be familiar with that company. Again thanks for your time
I have heard of them, but have never bought from them. I don't recall hearing any complaints.
I think you done the right thing. I have learned the hard way that we have tolerances for a reason. And as always. Great video.
Sweet digital toque indicator. Can't wait for more.
You were thinking just like I leave a bit more material on the thrust side.
Great Video. I have a 1800a gas block how do I verify if its original. The original 1800a block I'm told is hard to get sleeves and pistons. I started to rebuild it and came up against that problem.
If you get the build card for the tractor , the original engine serial number is written on the back. Search for the Floyd County Museum, they have the build cards.
You remind of me helping my dad rebuild a Chevy 235 ci straight line 6. He was a master Machinist. Thank you for the memories
Nice job, I think my brother has my dad's old torque wrench like that one. We put together a lot of motors with it
So interesting and really enjoy the thorough explanation. Thanks
Thank you!
is this gas or diesel?
It's a diesel.
👌. Looks like a good solution to your problem. Should be very little wear on front side of that bearing and you still have full thickness on the back for wear. Gonna put that in my memory bank if I can remember it if I ever run into that. 😜
Lapping those thrust bearings is old school but good school. I have lapped my share of stuff and it is an accepted way of fitting parts. As long as the numbers are correct no harm no foul. Even if it were a bit tight it will wear in shortly after you run the engine some. Only thing I disagree with is I have always plastigauged my cranks dry. That thick film of assembly lube can fudge your numbers but then again you are smashing a piece of plastic so just how accurate can it be. I think you are doing a fine job...
I have often wondered how much the assembly lube throws off the plastigauge. I have done it dry and recall the work it took to get that stuff off the bearings and decided that the small difference wasn't worth the frustration. When I do the 1600, I'll check a bearing dry and then with lube to see how much difference there really is.
@@ThatOliverGuyChris You could be right. I have never made the comparison. Looking forward to that video as you have got me curious now...
Lapping that thrust bearing is exactly what should be done in this situation. Good call Chris. Taking your new bearings to the machinist with block and crank are the right way to do it next time.
I usually wait for a report from the crank guy as to what he is going to grind it to, then buy my bearings. I did the same tthis time, but they ground as soon as they decided what spec it was going to. I used to have a guy nearby who was excellent, but unfortunately, he passed away a couple of years ago, so this was my first try at a new place.
Great attention to detail Chris. These small things make a huge difference in the end.
This video reminds me of the Reagan phrase "Perestroika"...trust but verify. Patience at times is key to being a great mechanic. Thanks for the video.
Chris I'm refreashing a 1650 oliver gas engine with new sleeves and pistons. My crank is with in specs but will say the crank has alot of end play. The old thrust bearing is worn severely on one size of the face. I have checked for tolerances yet until I get the new bearings. So now for my question if I need too instead of have the crank welded and ground for the proper endplay. Are these oversized thrust bearings easy to locate?
I don't think they are. For awhile there a lot of the Oliver bearings were hard to find, but the supply chain seems to be catching back up. Korves Oliver should be able to get you what you need, but if you have trouble, post back again and I will do some checking around.
Thank you for your advice. I really enjoy watching your videos. There's alot of your stuff that I watch that doesn't have anything to do with anything I'm doing now but most of it might come down the road. Thanks again
We always did crank measurements using engine oil. Assembly lube, being thicker can throw your measurements off a thou or 2. After checking then the STP application to the bearings would take place. It might be interesting to do an end play test with the bearing dry, then with engine oil, then with assembly lube. After all, we used to install heavier-weight engine oil to offset wear and be able to get more hours out of an engine before a rebuild. We had a pipe that would hold almost 2 qts of engine oil and a line that screwed into the oil gallery. We used it on turbocharged engines to guarantee oil pressure to the turbo during the first start. We always gave thought to installing an engine pre-oiling pump kit. They were available. On engines that sat for months at a time the pre-oiler would definitely earn its keep. One could wire a Murphy switch into the starter engage wire so the starter would not engage until oil pressure reached a pre-set pressure. No one gives a 2nd thought today when you turn the key and the computers do their systems checks (or run the air intake heaters) before the starter actually engages.
For as much as the plastigauge stuck to the bearing and crank, I think it was pusjing almost all the lube out of the way. I really hadto scratch with my fingernail to get it off. I think I'll take one off and try it each way to see. I think it will make for interesting video.
Good call and nice job on getting the thrust in spec. Peace of mind is a good thing when assembling an engine
.002 clearance might have worked ok, or it might have spun that thrust bearing once everything expanded in the heat. I feel good about where it is now.
Ive used a piece of glass for a sanding base
That's a great idea.
What do you use for sleeve seal lube i use lube from jd 308 part number
I use Parker Super oring lube.
Some impressive tricks!
Last time I did an engine rebuild was in the 80's. I didn't do some of the steps you did, like the plastigauge or end thrust, but we were doing a garage fix and I did regret not being more thorough. I let the pros do it now a days, oh my son and I did replaced a head gasket on his Massey Ferguson 285 a few years ago. Nice one Chris, good luck on the remainder of the rebuild. Have a nice week ahead.
I agree with cutting the thrust face ive done it before. Use a sheet of 1/4" glass on top of the bench glass is dead flat . Or buy a cheap Granite or cast iron surface plate off of amazon. I have a Starrett Surface plate i use .
I thought I was the last guy to have an old torque wrench like that.
No moving parts, I gotta think it never needs recalibration.
@@ThatOliverGuyChris mine is 50 years old and still seems to be close enough for the job.
I still have to use my clicker one for the head. It's the only one I have that goes that high.
Good morning Chris
What do you think about those oil priming things that you can buy? I made my own out of an old R134A. Refrigerant canister lol. I just filled it about halfway with whatever engine oil I'm using then put 35 or so psi of air into it, then flip it upside down, thread the hose into the oil gallery port, Open the valve and it blows the oil in throughout the engine. Usually I will do that until I register oil pressure on the gauge and then fire up the engine. Seems to work pretty good and I think it helps the engine run cooler from the residual R134A in the bottle.😂
I've never tried one. Typically I have pressure from the pump by the time I get the injection system bled out. That assembly lube is as slick as snot and clings like a booger. I always worry that a primer could be pumping in dirty oil since it doesn't go through the filter. But a former Oliver Service rep told me, "dirty oil is better than no oil"
I do have an empty helium tank that's the same size as a 134a tank. Maybe that would help with compaction....
Do you know what that's a very good point… I've never thought of that. The risk for dirty oil is a lot higher. I try and keep that tank clean. And yes, helium would be better than refrigerant. Haha
I was thinking hone the bearing instead of grinding the crank get a stone they use for injectors
You are amazing, did you go to college preschool in the dealership?
I took some college photography courses, does that count?
@@ThatOliverGuyChris well I think you must have learned a lot at the dealership plus I think you are just farming genius
... just like downtown.....!!!
Just curious how long it takes you to restore a tractor start to finish, months, years?
It's starting to be years. I usually don't work on restorations from planting to harvest, just the winter months. I should be a lot farther along on this one. Hopefully, it gets done before spring work starts.
Shoot I’m just doing an engine swap with updates and I’m going on a year…..lol
Dang auto spell I meant collage or dealership?
It's all from growing up at an Oliver dealership. The most important thing a person has to pay for in education is attetion.
👍👍👍👍
Do you get nasty grams in the comments? I never really read them so I don't know.
If I said you should just plop a IH DT-466 in there, would that count?
Lol. I do get the occasional hater in the comments, and knew I would going into this. It's actually been less than what I thought it would be.
Would I have to paint it red with a 466 in it? 😆
@@ThatOliverGuyChris Well, if I ever can come up with a 45 or 47 or 4960 Deere with a destroyed engine, I am going to put a DT-466 IH in it. Paint the engine red, with the rest normal..............Make everyone mad. I actually bought a 4960 cheap intending to do it, but the engine was no where close to what I was told, ended up fixing it and we use it. I do have a IH 560 Diesel that I might drop a Deere 329 in and do it in reverse. As brand loyal people are in my area, I won't have any friends, which could be great!
slow but sure!
Slow seems to be the theme with this engine.