I dont think that this makes sense. If you are a hobby creator, you probably dont need any of those. So i think the only price that would make people think about it is under 200 bucks (max. 300), using them like a soundcard. And if you already have a profitable business, then i cant see why you wouldnt go straight up for the real deal. Having too many different cards is probably too risky for an unestablished market of products. You also need to consider that - if they would like to make that kind of card popular among creators (which are mainly hobby streamer/creator) - they would need to go in with a very good price to get a lot of market share in a short time, so software-engineers/devs have an incentive to optimize their software for it. Edit.: 4 streams are basically enough for everything i could think of what even an advanced streamer/creator might do simultaneously. Stream to Twitch + RUclips, have a replay buffer running + recording something. If people would use Restream for YT+Twitch, then they might use the open slot for recordings in horizontal perspective for clips. But beyond that i think its unnecessary/overkill and wouldnt work to get enough "consumers" to care for a price point of 500.
@@CallMeTeci There is nothing like this on the market. I think $500 is steal for a consumer version. You have people spending $1500+ on gpu's these days. This will sell like hot cakes for $500. They can release a budget version for $200 once they see how demand is and the product has been on the market for a couple years.
@@MrNelahem Read my comment again... for a price like 500$ there wont be a consumer demand. People (and those are few btw) that spend thousand bucks and more on a GPU do that, because it can do more than just rendering. The BY FAR biggest market for GPUs is still in the 200-400$ area. IF they care about making that popular in the consumer market, then it wont matter if professionals are going to buy them. Because most consumers are NOT professionals and similarly small will be the number of people that are interested in this for a price like that, to get an amount of streams they wont use. For 500 bucks most creator would just buy a better regular GPU for this, because the value they get here is much better for the average streamers/creators needs and wants.
Really want AMD to release a more consumer facing, consumer friendly priced version of this but with a twist...also make it an HDMI capture card. All-in-Wonder reborn! Would be sick.
AMD does data center first and in that make foundations to bring it down to consumer. While I don't think a new All in wonder is in the cards atm the professional cards may take this form first and then maybe?
This is basically what I was thinking of... Even cutting down the number of streams supported to say... half or a quarter is more than enough for a capture card/streaming card. It would be insane to drop into the market compared to Elgato or Avermedia products currently in the space. Heck I'd even take one of these slapped onto the unused board space of a 7900 series card with some input ports as say... a $1600 'All-in--One' card with built-in capture.
It's awesome of the team over at AMD to encode some videos for you. Really shows how confident they are in their tech. AMD has been rocking this strategy of data center to consumer for a while now and it seems to be paying off. It really gives them a chance to make big money, and thus justify the large investment in new tech, rather than just relying on the desktop market. Give it a year or two and we'll probably see a consumer card, or possibly a graphics card with this tech built in.
@@EposVox I hope so too! Hell I'm excited and I wouldn't even be the one to hold it! LOL it's all so bleeding edge it makes you imagine new possibilities :D
@@EposVox Looking forward to more comparison charts and results. I still like CPU encoding best as it achieves the correct size to quality ratio for all of the video types I have considered. Including TV and sport broadcast.
WOW. That 8mb sample looked so crisp for that bitrate. That is super impressive. I really hope Twitch will adopt AV1 soon but I have my doubts. As someone who owns an ARC card for just AV1 encoding I'm still impressed with how good QS AV1 quality is. SuperNova seems next level though. Exciting times. You're like the only person bringing us this stuff and killing it lately. Good stuff man!
Which ARC did you get? I am split between the A770 and the A380. I have a 4070 ti as my main GPU which means the next best PCI slot is PCIEX4 in my case. I want to get a dedicated 'streaming'/encoding GPU because no matter what I do, OBS just eats up my GPU usage when streaming/recording, constant ~90% GPU usage aint fun... Couldn't fix it with my 1660 super and now it's happening again on the 4070 ti
@@goblinphreak2132They have been on AV1 though.. High popularity videos are encoded in AV1 for bandwidth savings on Googles end, high resolution videos like 4k and 8k are often AV1 encoded sooner if not always.
I can really see small to medium business implementing these for all kinds of stuff. A small sport stadium, a multi-person vr rink, a bank/business surveillance that actually details that sock face...
I manage an esports studio and we already looked at the Alveo U50 (The predecessor to this) for encoder boxes. There's a lot of different feeds you have to send out from the same source, which these cards are great for. Think multiple platforms, each with their own optimal settings, Clean feeds for localisation (no talent audio, but same video otherwise) and more. Unfortunately there was a lot of weird video artifacting on 60P x264 material on those U50's, but if these AMD cards test to be high quality they make for a great and cheap custom encoder box.
This is such a cool piece of kit. Hopefully they bring it to consumers as well. If AMD made a version that was a quarter of the size, it could still do 8 streams at 10w and 400$. That would make such a big difference in the adoption of AV1. Finally no more H264-deep-fried livestreams. Hurray.
I'm not even a streamer, but one of these in my blue iris server would be a minor miracle. A half length half height card that operates at 35 watts , fits in a 2U server, and can handle 32 camera feeds at full resolution is the holy grail.
I really hope AMD just goes crazy and includes one of these ASICs as a second die on their 8000 GPUs. Half of what this card can do is a significant improvement to the encode/decode segment of their existing chips and at only an 18w penalty
Thank you so much for talking about this card and its potential. I founded a computer vision startup in the sports industry and this hardware could change everything for us. I'll be happy to talk about this, feel free to reach out !
Hopefully that AMF issue gets fixed! AMD should take a scaled down version of this VPU design for their next Radeon cards, that would be such a huge selling point. Even if it was scaled down to just a couple AV1 streams at once.
More then likely a ffmpeg bug that can be solved I'd imagine. It would be amazing to see this come to next gen RDNA4 cards. I'm curious how well the encoding quality in H264/H265 also stacks up as maybe a future look into RDNA4 quality. I see no reason why this tech couldn't make it into AMD's RDNA4 cards.
@@TheXev >I see no reason why this tech couldn't make it into AMD's RDNA4 cards. Those are two entirely different IP families made by two entirely separate teams with entirely separate target markets and goals, too. VCN roadmap is driven entirely by decode power aka the only thing APUs ever care about, everything else is secondary.
This looks amazing! I would love to see a smaller version of this for consumers in the future. Even like half of this power would be plenty for just about any individual or small team
This looks pretty cool. A budget friendly version of this that could add support for AV1 in older machines and take enc/dec load off the older hardware would be amazing.
Really hope this moves the industry forward. On a large scale this saves a lot of bandwidth + power consumption, possibly saving many many currency monies.
Hi my friend, you should make a new "Nvenc vs Quicksync vs VCE vs CPU" Benchmark video featuring the latest versions of these encoders. The video you released 3 years ago had a great success !
This is definitely gonna get me prepared for the Ultimate HorrorNerd Experience Fest and other horror themed festivals/conventions/events in the future that I’ll be running, managing and hosting and definitely livestreaming professionally soon. The HorrorNerd Experience is coming to RUclips and other platforms in big ways.
Reminds me of how back in the 90’s there were dedicated encoder/decoder cards for MPEG-1. Some gaming devices also had decoder add-ons to play Video CDs.
Thanks for this video. It would have been interesting to see the files provided for download, as well as comparisons with current real-time AV1 + non-realtime AV1 at the same bitrates
WOOOW That SuperNova 2/4Mbps looks damn amazingly good. Not to even forget the vmaf scores. Damn, that's so neat. Thanks for making these videos. Much appreciated. For sure just got your Nebula I was supposed to all this time but I really would love to support your videos so thanks
Imagine that being sold as just a seperate card for encoding/decoding. So your graphics card only has to do the gaming and on the other PCIe slot that card does the recording and/or streaming. Would be kinda nice to have for older GPUs without AV1.
Once these hit the second hand market it will be a slot in for my video server. Just gonna have to see if we can get it working with something like jellyfin
I hope to see a future where there is a card like this but cut down significantly for a more stream / encode pc audience. Imagine if this card was less than 600$ but it could do 5ish 1080p av1 streams with compositing. I feel like people might sleep on that compositing aspect of this cards encoding. Im running an a380 and the only bottleneck ive ever hit has been the compositing overhead in obs. Though I have been pushing this card way above what most people would (240fps recordings).
This is one of the most insane pieces of hardware I've seen talked about so far. And with how locked in the concept of content creation ALONE, I hope this opens the doors for a cheaper variant or an incentive to invest in this one offered. Like, if this can be utilized by software like OBS, among others..dude. My wallet. I'm not ready but I also AM.
Cool card! I tested AV1 on an already QTGMC'd 720x576p50 4 minutes music video. Ran the next-to slowest AV1 software encoding @500kbps. Took *7 hours* on a dual-XEON machine. But what a quality! Ended up with a 19MB file, and the video maker even thought I had digitally remastered the video, thinking it looks much better after the AV1 encoding!
I was surprised at just how good the quality was at 2mbps, cant wait for what the future holds in the creator space. Also are there any competitors that are out or coming out to compete directly with the MA35D?
The ffmpeg wiki mentions the odd extra pixels, so its probably more a hardware implementation issue than a software issue, that said for vmaf testing you should be able to use filters to crop the decoded frames but I am not an ffmpeg wizard
The timing couldn't be more perfect. I was just running some tests with AV1 encoding this week in preparation for encoding a ton of stock footage. Been eyeing one for the Arc GPUs for this task as well. I'd love to see a future video on AV1 encode at various resolutions and frame rates.
This is very exciting to me. It's pricey for what it does (cuz it's "professional" hardware and they know unlike gamers, big companies will fork it over) but if they made a card like this that handles maybe less streams for less money? That'd be really cool.
Watching this on a train and observing the quality fluctuate as I go in and out of areas with varying signal strength punctuates the need for this tech.
OMG a cut-down version of this card, maybe with just the 2 mixed-purpose blocks -or- 1 mixed-purpose block and 1 AV1 block would be SICK for us Plex and Jellyfin users!
As a professional in the industry, there's one aspect that everyone misses when talking about those codecs: Scalable Video Coding (SVC). It's a way to encode real-time video at multiple resolutions at the same time at the source, with little additional complexity compared to a single 1080p stream. Imagine if the streamer wants to do 1080p AV1, Twitch would have to reencode the stream for mobile users who can't use all the bandwidth for wasted quality on metered connections, or they don't and then the streamer will not have as many potential viewers. They do that for popular ones, but they cannot do it at scale (at the moment). If the streamer on the other hand streams at 1080p, 720p and 540p AV1 at the same time (at a very modest cost in increased complexity, it's part of the basic codec functionality!), then Twitch could just forward all those AV1 streams directly to everyone, at the desired resolution, at no cost. The problem is that a lot of those encoding cards or GPUs are not yet supporting those features. While they can certainly do regular 1080p, they don't handle SVC encoding, and sometimes those pipelines also have issues with AV1 decoding. It's part of the AV1 specification and they don't always work, it's makes me sad :-(
Reminds me of the old Broadcom Crystal HD (except way beefier). You can put that little chip into old systems and suddenly they could easily handle h264 HD decoding.
Given that it's barely a year since AMD fully acquired Xilinx, It's inevitable that AMD will slap a scaled down version of this ASIC on the RDNA4, The VCN engine that's powering RDNA3 will be succeeded by this.
On my wishlist. I may try to pull a Level1Techs and attempt something on the Linux side or Windows side to experiment with different configurations of it.
I've tried adopting AV1 after getting an RTX 4080. However, I have found not all the software I use is ready for it. I still sometimes use Camtasia for my tech tutorials and it does not support AV1 in any container - and it only recently added H.265 support. I also use DaVinci Resolve (massive learning curve) but I have to remux OBS recording from MKV to MP4 if they contain AV1, but H.264 and H.265 are just fine directly as MKV files. At least to my eyes, there isn't much difference between H.265 and AV1 video at the same quality settings - so I'm just using H.265 for now until AV1 is more widely supported. However, for my type of content, I don't think it matters that much. Even so, I'd like a video on your recommended OBS settings for AV1 capture (recording) for RTX 40xx-series cards.
Interesting. I use a GTX 1660 for encoding and it can do around 20-30 concurrent streams right now but that's with high-latency applications (Jellyfin, plex). My testing shows around 3-4 streams per GB of vram on nvidia cards. Will be great to pick up a couple of these.
I'd LOVE to see more of this, give us/"the people, lol" at least 2-3 tiers for consumers; which is to say not a card that's on the scale of a datacenter application with 32 streams at once- BUT, hey something that's so good at a 1/4 the price and it would still demolish 'mainstream consumer solutions' . On its' own it would eliminate the hassle or additional setup of.. *an additional setup* , in the traditional sense of "Gaming pc" + "streaming pc/box". That and the fact I'd love it to have better quality recordings whilst maintaining actual file sizes even smaller! Encoding higher quality video & compositing even more seamless/efficiently, all the while not making a sacrifice between FPS/bitrate/additional system resources thanks to it being an ASIC, and *single slot* ! YESSS Edit: punctuation rip
I want this card SO bad. I'm on a 1080ti and I'm still pretty happy with it other than its encoder... It'd be great to buy this and not have to upgrade my GPU yet. ... Assuming there's eventually a version that doesn't cost a kidney, of course.
You could get a 7900 xtx and still have money to spare vs getting one of these, but yes, it would be excellent if they had a budget option that did like 2-4 streams.
Great video as always! Really interesting hardware solution. WIth Intel getting into the gpu space recently I figured they might throw their hat in the ring for some production related capture/encoding cards. Vmix is still recommending RTX cards and while rasterization is definately used in production having more hardware encoders / decoders is probably more useful. Great news about 5 streams on nvidia cards though! I missed that one but it's kinda a game changer that my old gaming laptop can now encode 5 streams using hardware encoding.
What about Intel's Data Center Cards, specifically The Flex Series ? (from Intel...) "Built on Intel’s Xe Architecture, the Intel Flex Series GPU has up to 32 Xe-cores and ray tracing units, up to 4 Xe Media Engines, AI acceleration with Intel® Xe Matrix Extensions (Intel® XMX) and support for hardware-based SR-IOV virtualization. Leveraging Intel® oneAPI Video Processing Library (oneVPL) and Intel® Deep Link Hyper Encode, the Flex Series 140 accelerator with its two GPUs can meet the industry’s one-second delay requirement while providing 8K 60 real-time transcode. This capability is available for AV1 and HEVC HDR format."
Good question. As far as what I can comprehend, Intel is a GPU while AMD is ASIC. ASIC is cheaper and more efficient generally speaking. They do seem to have somewhat similar capability.
Since you touched on TV broadcasts a bit it should be noted that AV1 is not a supported codec for ATSC 3.0. HEVC is the standard for HD/UHD broadcast going forward, so you won't see any cable provider or free-over-the-air antenna stations use AV1 in any capacity.
@@EposVox It's probably bigger than you think. OTA nightly newscasts across the 4 majors (NBC, CBS, ABC, Fox) average between 2 to 4 million viewers a night.
@@ArguingMeadows Live TV requires exactly 1 such encoder per TV broadcast channel. Even smaller 1 ASIC version will suffice. NBC, CBS, ABC, FOX - 8 cards in total, 1 active and 1 for redundancy per channel.
I want one! But I want it for encoding my DVD's, Blu-Ray's, and 4K UHD's to AV1. I have an Intel card for this, but it's still limited in speed and that limit appears to be artificial. It'd be so cool to be able to rip say, a 20-disk blu-ray set and then encode ALL of them at once, in a reasonable amount of time.
I can see large content creators or startups creating their own community-based streaming platform most likely not to compete with the mainstream platforms but to be able to have it as a fallback and personal community just in case there main channels go down I am already looking into what it would take to host a full cloud gaming and streaming platform where anyone can just play games and stream them just through the browser on a low end laptop or tablet something with just a internet connection and have my own server with racks full of compute unit servers and flash based storage servers I just have to figure out how the software will work and I want to take ideas I like from the top platforms I already know of and then change them up and make it my own and add a few ideas of my own I wish that where on the current platforms all in all I think it will revolutionize the streaming industry and bring more competitors into the space only time will tell
I saw some blocking in the 2mb and 4mb sample for apex, but the 8mb one was astonishingly good! Would love to see some super problematic samples compared, too, like foliage back in the day in DayZ. I hope these will be ramped and delivered quickly. I need twitch to finally get to AV1. Hope they buy a few thousand of them in Q3. And then I need twitch to drop the ridiculous prerolls, or I'll install a weird-ass proxy browser addon to get rid of ads.
I really wish they make this for individual consumer market instead of targeting business only. By that, I mean they could release a really cut down version probably at a 1/10 of the price. If you remove the premium that they probably charge for business/high end market, use only one block for the encoder instead of 8 (the pic has 1 Chip containing 4 block encoder and the card has 2 of those chip) and sell it for $160, I definitely would consider buying it. The main reason I still don't upgrade my GPU (which is an old RX 580) is because I want to buy a GPU with AV1 encoder. The card that can do that either too expensive (AMD/Nvidia) or not good enough for me in terms of driver (Intel) and I don't want to just buy Intel GPU just to get AV1 encoder (which probably can actually be cheaper than this accelerator even in cut down form!) because I don't really want to increase the overall power consumption of my PC by that much. Having said that it doesn't absolutely have to be this chip. Just strip everything on a GPU and leave only the media engine + any relevant part to make it work and sell it as media accelerator.
So, I think the entire 'streaming' thing is in big trouble. It can't make money, and the players are in a losing state with compute costs and what it entails. My content - for example - goes up, and they bear the cost of a streamer who garners them nothing. The advert rev is meaningless and I don't have viewers (which is probably the mean average.). At least not in any number. This kind of tech is what is or will be needed for the streaming industry to survive. The compute costs of having this fun had/have to come down, or it will see the exit of platform after platform. I'm glad to see it, because for the content makers, the platforms, and the viewers, it would be a shame if it collapsed due to not being economic. Good stuff.
Live stream and VOD sharing sites should test with rolling out av1 as an option, allow viewers to set it as default or leave that as is. It should not depend on hardware support. Most CPUs supported by modern operating systems will play it back. The difference in CPU power consumption for playback where decode hardware doesn't exist is also likely less than that for the difference in transferring the larger streams of AVC.
Basically Alveo u30 next-gen with AV1 supported... I wonder when are AMD planning to add one such chip to consumer-available GP cards... or when older u30 gets discounted...
It's very interesting but the key question is PCIe bus bandwidth. A raw HD video stream can be 480MB a second. The PCIe 5 bus has a theoretical max around 64GB a second. It's going to take some careful design to get 32 HD streams into the card. Unless of course the data coming in is already encoded in some way, but the outcome of that would be a loss in quality during transcoding.
@@EposVox Even so, to get 32 HD streams you'd be dealing with a huge amount of data coming in to the card, and presumably from the network too. All I'm saying is that it's a card with such a high end capacity that it would be hard to drive it to its maximum because bottlenecks elsewhere in the system will be holding it back. That's good thing though - better the rest of the system is the bottleneck then the encoder card then you can optimise for those bottlenecks
I’m curious to know how this stands up to libaom-av1 for VOD use-cases at even lower bitrates. This could be useful for VOD encoding if it has decent rate control. If not, slow SW encoding it is. The low cost of serving and storing the videos makes it worth the time to encode it.
...Alveo has so much untapped potential here, like.. AMD could muscle in on Elgato and Avermedia's market by imbedding some inputs on a cut down Alveo card and have an all in 1 solution for streamers.
This card looks amazing.
Enterprise version 32 Streams $1595
Prosumer Version 16 Streams $999
Consumer version 8 streams $499
Make it happen AMD!!
I dont think that this makes sense. If you are a hobby creator, you probably dont need any of those. So i think the only price that would make people think about it is under 200 bucks (max. 300), using them like a soundcard. And if you already have a profitable business, then i cant see why you wouldnt go straight up for the real deal. Having too many different cards is probably too risky for an unestablished market of products.
You also need to consider that - if they would like to make that kind of card popular among creators (which are mainly hobby streamer/creator) - they would need to go in with a very good price to get a lot of market share in a short time, so software-engineers/devs have an incentive to optimize their software for it.
Edit.: 4 streams are basically enough for everything i could think of what even an advanced streamer/creator might do simultaneously.
Stream to Twitch + RUclips, have a replay buffer running + recording something. If people would use Restream for YT+Twitch, then they might use the open slot for recordings in horizontal perspective for clips. But beyond that i think its unnecessary/overkill and wouldnt work to get enough "consumers" to care for a price point of 500.
@@CallMeTeci There is nothing like this on the market. I think $500 is steal for a consumer version. You have people spending $1500+ on gpu's these days. This will sell like hot cakes for $500. They can release a budget version for $200 once they see how demand is and the product has been on the market for a couple years.
@@MrNelahem Read my comment again... for a price like 500$ there wont be a consumer demand. People (and those are few btw) that spend thousand bucks and more on a GPU do that, because it can do more than just rendering. The BY FAR biggest market for GPUs is still in the 200-400$ area.
IF they care about making that popular in the consumer market, then it wont matter if professionals are going to buy them. Because most consumers are NOT professionals and similarly small will be the number of people that are interested in this for a price like that, to get an amount of streams they wont use.
For 500 bucks most creator would just buy a better regular GPU for this, because the value they get here is much better for the average streamers/creators needs and wants.
@@CallMeTeci and I disagree if you are a youtube steamer or a twitch streamer this card in consumer form for $500 is no brainer.
Gimme 4 Streams $199 don't really need more than 4 for the avg consumer
OR 2 streams included in the next Gen Gpus
Really want AMD to release a more consumer facing, consumer friendly priced version of this but with a twist...also make it an HDMI capture card. All-in-Wonder reborn! Would be sick.
IMAGINE
AMD does data center first and in that make foundations to bring it down to consumer. While I don't think a new All in wonder is in the cards atm the professional cards may take this form first and then maybe?
This is basically what I was thinking of... Even cutting down the number of streams supported to say... half or a quarter is more than enough for a capture card/streaming card. It would be insane to drop into the market compared to Elgato or Avermedia products currently in the space.
Heck I'd even take one of these slapped onto the unused board space of a 7900 series card with some input ports as say... a $1600 'All-in--One' card with built-in capture.
We can dream right?
AND the ability to use it for a Plex server....
It's awesome of the team over at AMD to encode some videos for you. Really shows how confident they are in their tech. AMD has been rocking this strategy of data center to consumer for a while now and it seems to be paying off. It really gives them a chance to make big money, and thus justify the large investment in new tech, rather than just relying on the desktop market. Give it a year or two and we'll probably see a consumer card, or possibly a graphics card with this tech built in.
If they built it into their gpus,which would be awesome and nvidia is doomed ;)
You're literally the only person talking about this kind of stuff...thanks! You think you could get a physical card in the future?
I hope!
@@EposVox I hope so too! Hell I'm excited and I wouldn't even be the one to hold it! LOL it's all so bleeding edge it makes you imagine new possibilities :D
@@EposVox Looking forward to more comparison charts and results. I still like CPU encoding best as it achieves the correct size to quality ratio for all of the video types I have considered. Including TV and sport broadcast.
@@EposVox Please include H266 in your comparison. Thank you.
TechLinked also talked about it though.
Gotta say, that 1080/60 @ 2Mbps is.... wow, that's pretty impressive. 2Mbps on anything else, would look like a mosaic in comparison.
WOW. That 8mb sample looked so crisp for that bitrate. That is super impressive. I really hope Twitch will adopt AV1 soon but I have my doubts. As someone who owns an ARC card for just AV1 encoding I'm still impressed with how good QS AV1 quality is. SuperNova seems next level though. Exciting times. You're like the only person bringing us this stuff and killing it lately. Good stuff man!
Which ARC did you get? I am split between the A770 and the A380. I have a 4070 ti as my main GPU which means the next best PCI slot is PCIEX4 in my case. I want to get a dedicated 'streaming'/encoding GPU because no matter what I do, OBS just eats up my GPU usage when streaming/recording, constant ~90% GPU usage aint fun... Couldn't fix it with my 1660 super and now it's happening again on the 4070 ti
@@D0omscream if it's only for encoding I would get the less power hungry chip you can get that encodes av1 and all it a day
@@D0omscream I ended up getting the
Intel Arc A750 Limited Edition Graphics Card. Though you can do the exact same thing with a A380 card.
RUclips should be on AV1 already in my opinion. The fact they haven't is lowkey bullshit.
@@goblinphreak2132They have been on AV1 though.. High popularity videos are encoded in AV1 for bandwidth savings on Googles end, high resolution videos like 4k and 8k are often AV1 encoded sooner if not always.
I can really see small to medium business implementing these for all kinds of stuff. A small sport stadium, a multi-person vr rink, a bank/business surveillance that actually details that sock face...
I manage an esports studio and we already looked at the Alveo U50 (The predecessor to this) for encoder boxes. There's a lot of different feeds you have to send out from the same source, which these cards are great for. Think multiple platforms, each with their own optimal settings, Clean feeds for localisation (no talent audio, but same video otherwise) and more. Unfortunately there was a lot of weird video artifacting on 60P x264 material on those U50's, but if these AMD cards test to be high quality they make for a great and cheap custom encoder box.
Time to switch to lower res socks for the next robbery then
That is the market for these things, not your average twitch streamer.
The first platform to adopt this will probably see a surge in content creators, content, and/or views. This is only the beginning.
Thanks AMD/Xilinx for doing this man a solid.
This is such a cool piece of kit. Hopefully they bring it to consumers as well. If AMD made a version that was a quarter of the size, it could still do 8 streams at 10w and 400$. That would make such a big difference in the adoption of AV1. Finally no more H264-deep-fried livestreams. Hurray.
I'm not even a streamer, but one of these in my blue iris server would be a minor miracle. A half length half height card that operates at 35 watts , fits in a 2U server, and can handle 32 camera feeds at full resolution is the holy grail.
It would be great for security providers too for obvious reasons.
I really hope AMD just goes crazy and includes one of these ASICs as a second die on their 8000 GPUs. Half of what this card can do is a significant improvement to the encode/decode segment of their existing chips and at only an 18w penalty
Or a mini chiplet version
Thank you so much for talking about this card and its potential.
I founded a computer vision startup in the sports industry and this hardware could change everything for us.
I'll be happy to talk about this, feel free to reach out !
Hopefully that AMF issue gets fixed! AMD should take a scaled down version of this VPU design for their next Radeon cards, that would be such a huge selling point. Even if it was scaled down to just a couple AV1 streams at once.
More then likely a ffmpeg bug that can be solved I'd imagine. It would be amazing to see this come to next gen RDNA4 cards. I'm curious how well the encoding quality in H264/H265 also stacks up as maybe a future look into RDNA4 quality. I see no reason why this tech couldn't make it into AMD's RDNA4 cards.
@@TheXev >I see no reason why this tech couldn't make it into AMD's RDNA4 cards.
Those are two entirely different IP families made by two entirely separate teams with entirely separate target markets and goals, too.
VCN roadmap is driven entirely by decode power aka the only thing APUs ever care about, everything else is secondary.
@@whoruslupercal1891 Not so, you neglect encode power which is definitely a consideration with modern streamers working from APU powered laptops.
@@mnomadvfx streamers are an absolutely irrelevant %% of the overall laptop market. All that matters is decode/SoC power.
I am guessing 8000 series graphics cards will feature a cut down version that can do up to 5 streams at a time. so gamers can game+stream.
For a pro or semi-pro level gig, this paired with something like a TriCaster would be TOTALLY SIC! Game changer is an understatement! 🤯
I can't wait until Linus gets his hands in it! He absolutely has use for this in his main business, and use for multiple of them in floatplane!
yeah looking forward to the 10 videos he milks out of not knowing how to use it and breaking it
I have been thinking for a while that they should just have a standalone encoder card like that. That's amazing and I love it.
This looks amazing! I would love to see a smaller version of this for consumers in the future. Even like half of this power would be plenty for just about any individual or small team
AMD is on fire atm, this card could be a massive gamechanger.
at the 12:50ish mark with 1080p60 at 8mbps, that is crispy clean. WOW. A very very clear difference to my eyes.
HELL YEAH
This looks pretty cool. A budget friendly version of this that could add support for AV1 in older machines and take enc/dec load off the older hardware would be amazing.
Afraid not. Card requires PCIe Gen 5 X4
Intel arc GPUs
Thanks, Doc! You and your blog are truly amazing!
Excited for Emby/Plex transcoding! Efficiency drives 75% of my hardware decisions and this is top tier!
Really hope this moves the industry forward. On a large scale this saves a lot of bandwidth + power consumption, possibly saving many many currency monies.
I did not even expect such wonderful news from this side.
I don't expect anyone else to feature this category of tech except you. Keep up.
Hi my friend, you should make a new "Nvenc vs Quicksync vs VCE vs CPU" Benchmark video featuring the latest versions of these encoders. The video you released 3 years ago had a great success !
This is definitely gonna get me prepared for the Ultimate HorrorNerd Experience Fest and other horror themed festivals/conventions/events in the future that I’ll be running, managing and hosting and definitely livestreaming professionally soon. The HorrorNerd Experience is coming to RUclips and other platforms in big ways.
WOOHOOOO THIS IS WHAT I WANTED. Man i love when we get something new to populate those extra PCIe, lovely. Brings me back to the 90's.
Dear AMD, I totally want one of these. Please make it work with OBS 🙏🙏🙏
Reminds me of how back in the 90’s there were dedicated encoder/decoder cards for MPEG-1. Some gaming devices also had decoder add-ons to play Video CDs.
Yep!!
Thanks for this video. It would have been interesting to see the files provided for download, as well as comparisons with current real-time AV1 + non-realtime AV1 at the same bitrates
AMD could totally sell scaled back versions of these as capture cards and streamers would buy them like crazy. AV1 for the win
WOOOW That SuperNova 2/4Mbps looks damn amazingly good. Not to even forget the vmaf scores. Damn, that's so neat. Thanks for making these videos. Much appreciated. For sure just got your Nebula I was supposed to all this time but I really would love to support your videos so thanks
Imagine that being sold as just a seperate card for encoding/decoding.
So your graphics card only has to do the gaming and on the other PCIe slot that card does the recording and/or streaming.
Would be kinda nice to have for older GPUs without AV1.
Once these hit the second hand market it will be a slot in for my video server. Just gonna have to see if we can get it working with something like jellyfin
I hope to see a future where there is a card like this but cut down significantly for a more stream / encode pc audience. Imagine if this card was less than 600$ but it could do 5ish 1080p av1 streams with compositing. I feel like people might sleep on that compositing aspect of this cards encoding. Im running an a380 and the only bottleneck ive ever hit has been the compositing overhead in obs. Though I have been pushing this card way above what most people would (240fps recordings).
This is one of the most insane pieces of hardware I've seen talked about so far. And with how locked in the concept of content creation ALONE, I hope this opens the doors for a cheaper variant or an incentive to invest in this one offered. Like, if this can be utilized by software like OBS, among others..dude. My wallet. I'm not ready but I also AM.
Cool card! I tested AV1 on an already QTGMC'd 720x576p50 4 minutes music video. Ran the next-to slowest AV1 software encoding @500kbps. Took *7 hours* on a dual-XEON machine.
But what a quality! Ended up with a 19MB file, and the video maker even thought I had digitally remastered the video, thinking it looks much better after the AV1 encoding!
I was surprised at just how good the quality was at 2mbps, cant wait for what the future holds in the creator space. Also are there any competitors that are out or coming out to compete directly with the MA35D?
Maybe Intel could take what they have on ARC...
The ffmpeg wiki mentions the odd extra pixels, so its probably more a hardware implementation issue than a software issue, that said for vmaf testing you should be able to use filters to crop the decoded frames but I am not an ffmpeg wizard
I'd probably prefer something with more function like the ARC series GPU's for resale value and/or repurposing. Still really cool regardless!
The timing couldn't be more perfect. I was just running some tests with AV1 encoding this week in preparation for encoding a ton of stock footage. Been eyeing one for the Arc GPUs for this task as well. I'd love to see a future video on AV1 encode at various resolutions and frame rates.
Damn epos this is just incredible and exciting! I could see this making it cheaper for nebula to run and create better features.
SAME
This is very exciting to me. It's pricey for what it does (cuz it's "professional" hardware and they know unlike gamers, big companies will fork it over) but if they made a card like this that handles maybe less streams for less money? That'd be really cool.
this is huge
Very
Watching this on a train and observing the quality fluctuate as I go in and out of areas with varying signal strength punctuates the need for this tech.
If we can get a consumer version of this, it would be great
OMG a cut-down version of this card, maybe with just the 2 mixed-purpose blocks -or- 1 mixed-purpose block and 1 AV1 block would be SICK for us Plex and Jellyfin users!
Damn this is cool! Thx for sharing this
I wonder if this is something Floatplane would get
As a professional in the industry, there's one aspect that everyone misses when talking about those codecs: Scalable Video Coding (SVC). It's a way to encode real-time video at multiple resolutions at the same time at the source, with little additional complexity compared to a single 1080p stream.
Imagine if the streamer wants to do 1080p AV1, Twitch would have to reencode the stream for mobile users who can't use all the bandwidth for wasted quality on metered connections, or they don't and then the streamer will not have as many potential viewers. They do that for popular ones, but they cannot do it at scale (at the moment).
If the streamer on the other hand streams at 1080p, 720p and 540p AV1 at the same time (at a very modest cost in increased complexity, it's part of the basic codec functionality!), then Twitch could just forward all those AV1 streams directly to everyone, at the desired resolution, at no cost.
The problem is that a lot of those encoding cards or GPUs are not yet supporting those features. While they can certainly do regular 1080p, they don't handle SVC encoding, and sometimes those pipelines also have issues with AV1 decoding. It's part of the AV1 specification and they don't always work, it's makes me sad :-(
Now I wanna build a Thunderbolt-equipped mITX streaming box..
Reminds me of the old Broadcom Crystal HD (except way beefier). You can put that little chip into old systems and suddenly they could easily handle h264 HD decoding.
Wish they'd make a consumer version that could handle 8 or 12 streams.
Given that it's barely a year since AMD fully acquired Xilinx, It's inevitable that AMD will slap a scaled down version of this ASIC on the RDNA4, The VCN engine that's powering RDNA3 will be succeeded by this.
On my wishlist. I may try to pull a Level1Techs and attempt something on the Linux side or Windows side to experiment with different configurations of it.
Years ago I had a media accelerator card for watching DVD on PC. Yes some PC used to need that! A consumer version of this would be cool.
Nowadays most CPUs have some sort of decoding/encoding acceleration built into them. Intel started adding AV1 in the last generation or two.
This is going to change broadcast holy shit.
If you end up testing it please examine how it reacts to different PCIe bandwidth limitations down to PCIe 3.0 x4 (Thunderbolt 3).
Thank you for advocating a broader OBS use! I would definitely buy something like this for recording and streaming.
More like this please! Super interesting stuff. I would like to know more about this.
Exciting times!
great video! Now they just need to cut it into half or 1/4 of the processes and it'd be a great price!
I've tried adopting AV1 after getting an RTX 4080. However, I have found not all the software I use is ready for it. I still sometimes use Camtasia for my tech tutorials and it does not support AV1 in any container - and it only recently added H.265 support. I also use DaVinci Resolve (massive learning curve) but I have to remux OBS recording from MKV to MP4 if they contain AV1, but H.264 and H.265 are just fine directly as MKV files. At least to my eyes, there isn't much difference between H.265 and AV1 video at the same quality settings - so I'm just using H.265 for now until AV1 is more widely supported. However, for my type of content, I don't think it matters that much.
Even so, I'd like a video on your recommended OBS settings for AV1 capture (recording) for RTX 40xx-series cards.
This looks amazing. I don't think NVidia has a direct competitor for just encoding and decoding work without going to their high end Ada Quadro cards.
This is revolutionary. I hope it finds it’s what to consumer GPU too
Interesting. I use a GTX 1660 for encoding and it can do around 20-30 concurrent streams right now but that's with high-latency applications (Jellyfin, plex). My testing shows around 3-4 streams per GB of vram on nvidia cards. Will be great to pick up a couple of these.
And video of the year award goes to 🥁 🥁 🥁
I'd LOVE to see more of this, give us/"the people, lol" at least 2-3 tiers for consumers; which is to say not a card that's on the scale of a datacenter application with 32 streams at once- BUT, hey something that's so good at a 1/4 the price and it would still demolish 'mainstream consumer solutions' . On its' own it would eliminate the hassle or additional setup of.. *an additional setup* , in the traditional sense of "Gaming pc" + "streaming pc/box". That and the fact I'd love it to have better quality recordings whilst maintaining actual file sizes even smaller! Encoding higher quality video & compositing even more seamless/efficiently, all the while not making a sacrifice between FPS/bitrate/additional system resources thanks to it being an ASIC, and *single slot* ! YESSS
Edit: punctuation rip
I would love one of these for my homelab Jellyfin media server!
I want this card SO bad. I'm on a 1080ti and I'm still pretty happy with it other than its encoder... It'd be great to buy this and not have to upgrade my GPU yet.
... Assuming there's eventually a version that doesn't cost a kidney, of course.
You could get a 7900 xtx and still have money to spare vs getting one of these, but yes, it would be excellent if they had a budget option that did like 2-4 streams.
Accelerator cards are back! 😎
Great video as always! Really interesting hardware solution. WIth Intel getting into the gpu space recently I figured they might throw their hat in the ring for some production related capture/encoding cards. Vmix is still recommending RTX cards and while rasterization is definately used in production having more hardware encoders / decoders is probably more useful. Great news about 5 streams on nvidia cards though! I missed that one but it's kinda a game changer that my old gaming laptop can now encode 5 streams using hardware encoding.
I dunno how to tag AMD but I'd buy this in a heart beat. I multi stream and this card would free up so many resources.
What about Intel's Data Center Cards, specifically The Flex Series ?
(from Intel...) "Built on Intel’s Xe Architecture, the Intel Flex Series GPU has up to 32 Xe-cores and ray tracing units, up to 4 Xe Media Engines, AI acceleration with Intel® Xe Matrix Extensions (Intel® XMX) and support for hardware-based SR-IOV virtualization. Leveraging Intel® oneAPI Video Processing Library (oneVPL) and Intel® Deep Link Hyper Encode, the Flex Series 140 accelerator with its two GPUs can meet the industry’s one-second delay requirement while providing 8K 60 real-time transcode. This capability is available for AV1 and HEVC HDR format."
Good question. As far as what I can comprehend, Intel is a GPU while AMD is ASIC. ASIC is cheaper and more efficient generally speaking. They do seem to have somewhat similar capability.
I was dreaming about video encoding just last night youtube must have heard me talking in my sleep...😁
Good job AMD
Since you touched on TV broadcasts a bit it should be noted that AV1 is not a supported codec for ATSC 3.0. HEVC is the standard for HD/UHD broadcast going forward, so you won't see any cable provider or free-over-the-air antenna stations use AV1 in any capacity.
OTA is also mostly an insignificant market at this point lol
I’m not surprised
HEVC is still a good bump over MPEG2
@@EposVox It's probably bigger than you think. OTA nightly newscasts across the 4 majors (NBC, CBS, ABC, Fox) average between 2 to 4 million viewers a night.
@@ArguingMeadows Live TV requires exactly 1 such encoder per TV broadcast channel. Even smaller 1 ASIC version will suffice.
NBC, CBS, ABC, FOX - 8 cards in total, 1 active and 1 for redundancy per channel.
I want one! But I want it for encoding my DVD's, Blu-Ray's, and 4K UHD's to AV1. I have an Intel card for this, but it's still limited in speed and that limit appears to be artificial. It'd be so cool to be able to rip say, a 20-disk blu-ray set and then encode ALL of them at once, in a reasonable amount of time.
6:02 Spotted a Behringer X32!!! 😅❤
That quality with 2mbps CAN'T BE CHRISTIAN
I can see large content creators or startups creating their own community-based streaming platform most likely not to compete with the mainstream platforms but to be able to have it as a fallback and personal community just in case there main channels go down I am already looking into what it would take to host a full cloud gaming and streaming platform where anyone can just play games and stream them just through the browser on a low end laptop or tablet something with just a internet connection and have my own server with racks full of compute unit servers and flash based storage servers I just have to figure out how the software will work and I want to take ideas I like from the top platforms I already know of and then change them up and make it my own and add a few ideas of my own I wish that where on the current platforms all in all I think it will revolutionize the streaming industry and bring more competitors into the space only time will tell
There are a lot of platforms where this card will be killer. Wonder if Rumble and such are looking at it.
I saw some blocking in the 2mb and 4mb sample for apex, but the 8mb one was astonishingly good!
Would love to see some super problematic samples compared, too, like foliage back in the day in DayZ.
I hope these will be ramped and delivered quickly. I need twitch to finally get to AV1. Hope they buy a few thousand of them in Q3. And then I need twitch to drop the ridiculous prerolls, or I'll install a weird-ass proxy browser addon to get rid of ads.
Holy sheeeesh, I would just like that technology in Radeon cards so I can encode with amd on Davinci and unreal instead of nvidia.
I really wish they make this for individual consumer market instead of targeting business only. By that, I mean they could release a really cut down version probably at a 1/10 of the price. If you remove the premium that they probably charge for business/high end market, use only one block for the encoder instead of 8 (the pic has 1 Chip containing 4 block encoder and the card has 2 of those chip) and sell it for $160, I definitely would consider buying it. The main reason I still don't upgrade my GPU (which is an old RX 580) is because I want to buy a GPU with AV1 encoder. The card that can do that either too expensive (AMD/Nvidia) or not good enough for me in terms of driver (Intel) and I don't want to just buy Intel GPU just to get AV1 encoder (which probably can actually be cheaper than this accelerator even in cut down form!) because I don't really want to increase the overall power consumption of my PC by that much.
Having said that it doesn't absolutely have to be this chip. Just strip everything on a GPU and leave only the media engine + any relevant part to make it work and sell it as media accelerator.
so... what you're saying is this is my new PLEX transcoder eh? ;) ;)
that MSRP is definitely targetted towards small to medium-scale businesses, and it's a ridiculously low cost in that context.
So, I think the entire 'streaming' thing is in big trouble. It can't make money, and the players are in a losing state with compute costs and what it entails. My content - for example - goes up, and they bear the cost of a streamer who garners them nothing. The advert rev is meaningless and I don't have viewers (which is probably the mean average.). At least not in any number.
This kind of tech is what is or will be needed for the streaming industry to survive. The compute costs of having this fun had/have to come down, or it will see the exit of platform after platform.
I'm glad to see it, because for the content makers, the platforms, and the viewers, it would be a shame if it collapsed due to not being economic.
Good stuff.
Live stream and VOD sharing sites should test with rolling out av1 as an option, allow viewers to set it as default or leave that as is. It should not depend on hardware support. Most CPUs supported by modern operating systems will play it back. The difference in CPU power consumption for playback where decode hardware doesn't exist is also likely less than that for the difference in transferring the larger streams of AVC.
A single one built in to the IO die of zen 5 would be ideal for the casual streamer.
Basically Alveo u30 next-gen with AV1 supported... I wonder when are AMD planning to add one such chip to consumer-available GP cards... or when older u30 gets discounted...
It's very interesting but the key question is PCIe bus bandwidth. A raw HD video stream can be 480MB a second. The PCIe 5 bus has a theoretical max around 64GB a second. It's going to take some careful design to get 32 HD streams into the card. Unless of course the data coming in is already encoded in some way, but the outcome of that would be a loss in quality during transcoding.
It’s a pcie Gen 5 card :D
@@EposVox Even so, to get 32 HD streams you'd be dealing with a huge amount of data coming in to the card, and presumably from the network too. All I'm saying is that it's a card with such a high end capacity that it would be hard to drive it to its maximum because bottlenecks elsewhere in the system will be holding it back. That's good thing though - better the rest of the system is the bottleneck then the encoder card then you can optimise for those bottlenecks
nice! good coverage
A dual PC setups using this would be god like 😮
With such a card (and a pretty-new PC - with PCIe Gen 5, which is required by the card) - you'll need a single PC.
I’m curious to know how this stands up to libaom-av1 for VOD use-cases at even lower bitrates. This could be useful for VOD encoding if it has decent rate control. If not, slow SW encoding it is. The low cost of serving and storing the videos makes it worth the time to encode it.
It supports ffmpeg, that makes this very interesting. I want one for my workstation.
How come your video looks so good? I'm only watching at 1080p and it looks better than anything I have ever seen before. Is it because of this card ?
...Alveo has so much untapped potential here, like.. AMD could muscle in on Elgato and Avermedia's market by imbedding some inputs on a cut down Alveo card and have an all in 1 solution for streamers.
This seems like the Apple Afterburner card on steroids.