Hello ! this comment is directed to Dr David burns. I saw the title of the video about Self. I remember his thrilling highly enlightening discussion on the principle of " language out of gear" ( words like real , unreal, free will , self worth etc.) .This was way back in around 2001 or so. those discussions happened in the internet in his Ask david q and a section. Internet was just getting to reach out all over the world. He had talked about his Ludwigg wittgenstein, Memoirs of ludwigg book written by malcolm . Those series of discussions immunised me very much from being affected by philosophical and psychological sickness of meaningless words that appear to have meaning. I think those discussions are still there in the net. I had saved those discussions and used to read them often. Over time there were so many other tons of materials and interesting stuff to read that I have a hard time seaching where those discussions were saved. I felt that David could publish them in a chapter in one his books. The concepts were absolutely fascinating. I wonder if Dr David remembers those conversations .
I'm really excited for philosophy month! I appreciate Rhonda's practicality, David's transcendence of philosophical concept games, Matt's compassionate use of free will skepticism, and your ability to have that play of perspectives on the podcast! Matt, please consider doing a further video somewhere about free will and therapy!
I am so excited to see this favorite title on free will . It is a concept that requires some exposure to quantum physics , thomas young's double slit experiments etc.which i gained over time. After reading all those , finally i started with what david had earlier advocated. what is your problem? what do you want? let us talk about that rather than discussing whether free will is there or not. We have to accept the principles of " free will within predetermination" It is not this OR that but this AND that . The implications get so complicated that I have to think that : I will have to exercise my will to the maximum extent while knowing that all things will happen the way it has to happen. the only problem is I will never ever be able to know the future without utilising my efforts. Some time the implications of this will come to the conclusion that Nature or god or Universe is unfair. I really have to interview god to know . The spiritual and scientific lessons I have learnt over time simple is insufficient to get the answers i want to know. But we human beings simply do not have the senses to know timelessness, infinity , and the mystery of creation as long as we live.
Dr Burns's explanations of Wittgenstein's ideas were clear to me, they resemble a buddhist sutra. However, I didn't quite get Matt May's position, since he was at the same time agreeing with and confronting them. Looking forward to watch the other videos of this philosophy month (if they happen)!
As the kids would say, ooof! Of course free will exists! The fact that few will get there doesn't mean it doesn't exist! Though I have read the book Feeling Good inside and out, I am new to this podcast. I can agree with utilizing the denial of free will as an emotional coping technique, which is clearly something you all are doing. But, I think we need to simultaneously accept the limits of that intervention. In fact, I would go so far as to say the denial of free will can be another self-defeating belief, because it impedes Maslow's self-actualization aka Kegan's Level 5. So if this podcast is only about coping with emotional pathology, I accept there is no free will. But if we are to be interested in human flourishing, of course free will exists, even if the pathway is largely "free won't"
Great comment! I strongly agree with you. Our beloved Matt May is the one who is arguing that there is no such thing as free will. I love Matt and have profound respect for his incredibly brilliant brain, but in this instance, I have to confess that claims for and against free will make no sense to me. It is at Wittgenstein might say, "Language out of gear!" Words like "free" only have meaning in specific contexts, so if I say, "Are you free to join our hike this Sunday?" we both know exactly what that question means. And if you are ever in this part of the world on a Sunday morning, I hope your answer is yes! :) best to you, david
@@daviddbmd I’m glad you appreciate the comment David Burns, because I hope this one can let you know how much I appreciate you. You’ve helped me a great deal navigating this ‘depression’ of mine, and I really do thank you. I’ve read Feeling Good and Feeling Great. I’m glad I chose to read Feeling Good, which was recommended to me (and others who view the specific blog/article) on Mark Mansons site, as a book that he’d “give to a friend who couldn’t afford a therapist”. Now, Ive read Feeling Great, and respect you so much as a human being, I’m truly in awe of your teachings. Others might not appreciate your teachings, but I’m glad I happened to click on Mark Manson’s blog, and choose to read your book. Feeling great is great, and I do the daily mood log everyday, for at least 15 minutes as you recommended in some podcasts. Someone really can’t go wrong with your work. I love your work! I just love your open hands approach and I could go on, but I think I’ll leave it here! Enjoy your day!
I've had patients tell me that it is because of their free will that they have the right to commit suicide. They believe they have it, therefore it would be unfair for someone to prevent them from exercising it. They say other people should not try to minimize their own pain by preventing them from committing suicide. I argue that we don't have completely free will. For example, humans, being social beings, are almost always factoring in the social impacts or attachments to others their decisions will have, as evidenced by guilt. Also, did we get to pick our parents, or the language we speak, or how intelligent we are? The list goes on. Indeed, it is a red herring, but it's an interesting clinical point in the case of patients like I've encountered.
Thank you for your thoughtful comments but did not entirely grasp what you were saying. It sounds incredibly important and an awful lot of our drives and preferences result from our genes and our environment when growing up. Best, David
@@daviddbmd You're right! I wasn't very clear. I'll try again. Sometimes I encounter suicidal ideation/impulses in patients. When we talk about the impact committing suicide will have on their friends and family, i.e., how much they are loved and cared about, they justify their urges by saying if they were to consider others' feelings about their urges, that would unfairly restrict their free will. They then go on to say it is therefore selfish of others to be concerned about them killing themselves - this infringes on their right to die and free will. When I have tried to work with patients on their flawed thinking about free will, they have unable to consider that there may not be such a thing as free will and if they gave up on that concept, they might not be so angry at others (which can be a suicide-driver for some). I'm sure it's a problem with my technique around handling the suicidal patient, but I thought I'd bring up these examples to illustrate some of the problems over-valuing free will can cause.
This podcast is genuinely amazing
Hello ! this comment is directed to Dr David burns. I saw the title of the video about Self. I remember his thrilling highly enlightening discussion on the principle of " language out of gear" ( words like real , unreal, free will , self worth etc.) .This was way back in around 2001 or so. those discussions happened in the internet in his Ask david q and a section.
Internet was just getting to reach out all over the world.
He had talked about his Ludwigg wittgenstein, Memoirs of ludwigg book written by malcolm . Those series of discussions immunised me very much from being affected by philosophical and psychological sickness of meaningless words that appear to have meaning.
I think those discussions are still there in the net. I had saved those discussions and used to read them often. Over time there were so many other tons of materials and interesting stuff to read that I have a hard time seaching where those discussions were saved.
I felt that David could publish them in a chapter in one his books. The concepts were absolutely fascinating.
I wonder if Dr David remembers those conversations .
I'm really excited for philosophy month! I appreciate Rhonda's practicality, David's transcendence of philosophical concept games, Matt's compassionate use of free will skepticism, and your ability to have that play of perspectives on the podcast! Matt, please consider doing a further video somewhere about free will and therapy!
Thanks! And I'll pass this along to Matt!
❤❤❤❤ what an amazing podcast. Dr.Burns is the greatest psychiatrist and the most empathetic❤ along with the greatest philosopher Wittgenstein ❤
I appreciate your kind comments and enthusiasm! warmly, david
I am so excited to see this favorite title on free will . It is a concept that requires some exposure to quantum physics , thomas young's double slit experiments etc.which i gained over time.
After reading all those , finally i started with what david had earlier advocated. what is your problem? what do you want? let us talk about that rather than discussing whether free will is there or not.
We have to accept the principles of " free will within predetermination"
It is not this OR that but this AND that .
The implications get so complicated that I have to think that : I will have to exercise my will to the maximum extent while knowing that all things will happen the way it has to happen.
the only problem is I will never ever be able to know the future without utilising my efforts.
Some time the implications of this will come to the conclusion that Nature or
god or Universe is unfair.
I really have to interview god to know . The spiritual and scientific lessons I have learnt over time simple is insufficient to get the answers i want to know.
But we human beings simply do not have the senses to know timelessness, infinity , and the mystery of creation as long as we live.
Right, some things are very difficult and perhaps impossible to grasp. But trying our best can be an exciting and meaningful journey! best, david
Dr Burns's explanations of Wittgenstein's ideas were clear to me, they resemble a buddhist sutra. However, I didn't quite get Matt May's position, since he was at the same time agreeing with and confronting them. Looking forward to watch the other videos of this philosophy month (if they happen)!
Thanks, people seem to be liking this approach. I think we're all yearning for a deeper meaning in our lives.
As the kids would say, ooof! Of course free will exists! The fact that few will get there doesn't mean it doesn't exist!
Though I have read the book Feeling Good inside and out, I am new to this podcast. I can agree with utilizing the denial of free will as an emotional coping technique, which is clearly something you all are doing. But, I think we need to simultaneously accept the limits of that intervention.
In fact, I would go so far as to say the denial of free will can be another self-defeating belief, because it impedes Maslow's self-actualization aka Kegan's Level 5. So if this podcast is only about coping with emotional pathology, I accept there is no free will. But if we are to be interested in human flourishing, of course free will exists, even if the pathway is largely "free won't"
Great comment! I strongly agree with you. Our beloved Matt May is the one who is arguing that there is no such thing as free will. I love Matt and have profound respect for his incredibly brilliant brain, but in this instance, I have to confess that claims for and against free will make no sense to me. It is at Wittgenstein might say, "Language out of gear!" Words like "free" only have meaning in specific contexts, so if I say, "Are you free to join our hike this Sunday?" we both know exactly what that question means. And if you are ever in this part of the world on a Sunday morning, I hope your answer is yes! :) best to you, david
@@daviddbmd ❤
@@daviddbmd Next time i am in the bay area, i would love to join yall for a Sunday morning hike! ❤
I’m sad that the app is not available in South Africa, could you please make it available for us? Blessings, Nkosana.
Thank you for your kind comment. I'll pass it on to colleagues who are working on that problem. Appreciate you!
@@daviddbmd I’m glad you appreciate the comment David Burns, because I hope this one can let you know how much I appreciate you. You’ve helped me a great deal navigating this ‘depression’ of mine, and I really do thank you. I’ve read Feeling Good and Feeling Great. I’m glad I chose to read Feeling Good, which was recommended to me (and others who view the specific blog/article) on Mark Mansons site, as a book that he’d “give to a friend who couldn’t afford a therapist”. Now, Ive read Feeling Great, and respect you so much as a human being, I’m truly in awe of your teachings. Others might not appreciate your teachings, but I’m glad I happened to click on Mark Manson’s blog, and choose to read your book. Feeling great is great, and I do the daily mood log everyday, for at least 15 minutes as you recommended in some podcasts. Someone really can’t go wrong with your work. I love your work! I just love your open hands approach and I could go on, but I think I’ll leave it here! Enjoy your day!
❤happy by choice 😊
Good choice!
hello I just saw the previous video on self before seeing this video. i had a comment made in it and I am copying the same in this also
I've had patients tell me that it is because of their free will that they have the right to commit suicide. They believe they have it, therefore it would be unfair for someone to prevent them from exercising it. They say other people should not try to minimize their own pain by preventing them from committing suicide. I argue that we don't have completely free will. For example, humans, being social beings, are almost always factoring in the social impacts or attachments to others their decisions will have, as evidenced by guilt. Also, did we get to pick our parents, or the language we speak, or how intelligent we are? The list goes on. Indeed, it is a red herring, but it's an interesting clinical point in the case of patients like I've encountered.
Thank you for your thoughtful comments but did not entirely grasp what you were saying. It sounds incredibly important and an awful lot of our drives and preferences result from our genes and our environment when growing up. Best, David
@@daviddbmd You're right! I wasn't very clear. I'll try again. Sometimes I encounter suicidal ideation/impulses in patients. When we talk about the impact committing suicide will have on their friends and family, i.e., how much they are loved and cared about, they justify their urges by saying if they were to consider others' feelings about their urges, that would unfairly restrict their free will. They then go on to say it is therefore selfish of others to be concerned about them killing themselves - this infringes on their right to die and free will. When I have tried to work with patients on their flawed thinking about free will, they have unable to consider that there may not be such a thing as free will and if they gave up on that concept, they might not be so angry at others (which can be a suicide-driver for some). I'm sure it's a problem with my technique around handling the suicidal patient, but I thought I'd bring up these examples to illustrate some of the problems over-valuing free will can cause.
❤❤❤
Love you, too!
🙏
You're welcome!
@@daviddbmd
💓💓💓
@@daviddbmd
Oh thank you dear 💌💌💌