Larys Strong = Best Strong, so very helpful and concerned with everyone else's problems despite his own. He's such a little trooper putting on a brave face after suffering the tragic loss of his family.
@@vidarrboot72 It really is a burning question as to why someone awful would want to reduce most of the house of Strong to smouldering embers like that? Poor Larys.
@@J1283-s1k I blame the ghost of Black Harran... That and Westoros' woeful fire safety regulations, I'm amazed more stone castles haven't gone up in flames tbh.
@@J1283-s1k It's the curse of Harenhall the actual killer doesn't matter In the books Littlefinger is the current Lord of Harrenhall he will clearly die in the show too he died(I hated his death tho)
If Larys is indeed a Greenseer it would make an interesting trend of Greenseerers having physical disabilities, (Bran's paralysis, Bloodraven's missing eye, and Larys' club foot) and having them overcome these disabilities with their magical abilities.
Late to this, but also very interesting that Larys, Bran and Bloodraven are all physically disabled in some way (Larys' club foot, Bran's legs, Bloodraven is a one-eyed albino). I wonder if perhaps Bloodraven will take cues from Larys, further paralleling how Bloodraven taught Bran after his 'death'. Very interesting.
I think the link here is the old gods are clearly trying to cull house targaryen and their dragons. First it was Larys being a sparkplug for the Dance of Dragons, then its Bloodraven and his revenge in all the blackfyre rebellions, and now Bran who has been promised he will learn to fly (likely warging a dragon). The old gods' motives are coming into focus.
Well if they’re all connected via the weirwood hive mind. No need for inspiration. Bran, Bloodraven, and Larry could all be literally working together as a single entity towards a shared goal.
I think an important thing to note is that in the books it's mentioned several times that too lie in front of a weirwood is a really bad idea, and here we have Rhaenyra lying in front of a weirwood only for a apparent greenseer to suddenly start moving against her
Yeah but in fairness she did answer them question truthfully since alicent just asked if she screwed d.... Which is a bit ghastly to straight up ask. Also i thought the lie had to be presented to the tree and old gods?
@@The-Doctor6969 no she said they didn’t lay together- that was the distinction she used No- she didn’t lay with Daemon (But she did lay with Criston) At least that’s what I rmbr from that scene I don’t rmbr the words “daemon didn’t touch me/ I didn’t touch him” in any vatistion
@@zekemyers4444 I understood it in the context of “he never effed me” not literally he never touched her. The wordplay was what Rhaenyra was doing throughout the convo I don’t know why that particular phrase would be different.
Isn't it also said that skin changers can take on the characteristics of the animals they possess if they stay in the same one too often and too long? Maybe Larys has taken on some characteristics of rats, who will eat their own to survive and thrive in the same way Larys metaphorically consumes his own family to get ahead?
The rat cook story also comes to mind. I wonder if there’s any connection with his family. Also, his family is seated at Harrenhall which is believed to be cursed. Lots to go on here!
There is also a moment, when Larys is talking to Alicent, right before he goes to the dungeons, you can hear the sound of rats 🐀 whyle the camera is still on Larys face
Larys is one of the creepiest character ever created. He is literally the demon who whispers into the ears of powerful people who he can manipulate by playing on their weaknesses and ambitions.
Anyone noticed the rats didn't start showing up until the strongs entered the picture? Like seriously episode 1&2 no rats, then larys enters and so do the rats
@@JoeMagician that is true! I completely forgot lyonel was there. But yeah it wasn't up till his son showed up. Maybe this is why when it comes to game of thrones they mentioned having a cat problem 🤔
@@Smalltown_Man well by Robert Baratheon’s time maybe Bloodraven had made sure there was an established colony of cats to catch the rats in the Red Keep, especially if they smelt a bit Strong to him?
One of my favorite J-cuts in GOT is when Tommen jumps out the window the audio cuts to Frey saying "For House Lannister!" then the video cuts to a toast at The Twins
He appeared at the right time too. During the reign of Viserys dragons were proliferating, and everyone a potential threat to the realm (except possibly Cannibal).
I was thinking, he probably knew something. He definitely working with Daemon but why? What makes Larys want to work with Daemon? He literally saved ALL his children. He saved Aegon's iii lives in return of his own life. He must be knew something
I watched your video about Larys being a greenseer, because Alt Shift X mentioned it. Seemed plausible, but kinda far fetched. A few days later, Episode 6 came out and I was astounded how on point you were. Congratulations!
Same here. I thought ‘man that’s cool, but the show runners don’t have the balls, surely’ and then bam, next episode Larys is fully cosplaying as Bloodraven. I’m curious to see if they’ll even touch on the Isle of Faces, or just leave the green seeing as an Easter egg for fans. Great stuff either way!
Once you realize that just about every event of import in the War of the Five Kings was facilitated or orchestrated by BR, you begin to suspect any and all well-informed persons with a drop of First Men blood as wargs and skin changers. Any adult with a disability is only alive due to some massive advantage. Missing an eye or limb doesn't always count but I don't think many small folk would survive an amputation
@@jeffreyruttibaker1081 People congratulate eachother for having birthday... If you only congratulate someone for curing cancer, then you obviously have zero experience in this area and therefore I don't value your opinion. Thanks for trying to be so constructive and helpful
at some point, the red keep became home to cats. back in book 1 if i remember correctly, arya was made to catch cats as assignment from her waterdancer swordmaster. i wonder if there is a deliberate reason for the cats being there.
@@gholamdapantaloonsniffer8218 yea true. but i think i remember tyrion saying that at some point, the red keep had a rat infestation. these could just be bits of unconnected things, but my interest is piqued.
Great point! Maybe there was a hostile takeover of some kind. I also think the cats were being controlled to lead Arya to the tunnel entrances in preparation for her escape. Rhaegar is probably Serio. And the black cat missing part of its ear most likely belonged to the princess that had just been killed. So maybe the cat was a royal spy as well.
Spoilers for Fire and Blood In Fire and Blood, it says that Otto Hightower brought in a bunch of cats to catch rats after Aegon II had all of the rat catchers in King's landing executed due to the Blood and Cheese plot.
Considering what Bran and 6 skins are capable of in ASOIAF, if Larys can warg rats couldn’t he have survived his execution in the books by warging into say…Tyland Lannister? Would explain a lot about the “hooded hand” in Aegon III’s reign.
I really like the Greenseer/Earth magic theme in the books. The Greenseers are the balancing force in the struggle between Ice and Fire. The First Men have a relationship of balance with the Children, but under the influence of the Andals and then the Targs, they neglect it - except in the North. Something has to bring it back.
I enjoyed that bit involving Viserys observing the rat. It's as if he has a different understanding of the world than most around him, just to become so fixated on something that subtle and supposedly ordinary, which could lead to tremendous ripples through Westeros.
This is a great analysis. The greenseer magic really adds another dimension to the various goings on in Westeros. Alas, the conflict between Alicent and Rhaenyra still seems to petty in comparison.
Did anyone else clock when helaena was playing with a spider at driftmark and she shut the spider in a shell with her hand, it cuts to larys instantly regaining his balance (I think?)
Maybe we’ll get a scene of Brynden Rivers coming into the weirwood cave with a nearly 200 year old larys wrapped in the weirwood but instead of the tree coming through his eye it’s grown into his foot. Would be a funny post credit scene.
I wondered about the rats and also thought he knew way too much to not be informed. I didn't put two and two together until I watched this video...actually it was you that put it all together tbh! Because of this alone, I'm subscribing to your channel, if I haven't already.
If the rat in Viserys's chambers is controlled by Larys as a silent observer then why is it doing everything in its power to be noticed by racing across the mantle like a bull in a China shop rather than quietly watching and listening from the shadows?
Perhaps the rat is confused as to why it always finds itself in the king's chambers even though it was clearly on its way to the kitchens for some cheese? As soon as Larys leaves the rat, it hastily scurries off by the most direct route.
Larys Strong reminds me a bit of Zaheer in Korra. "New growth cannot exist without first the destruction of the old." "When you base your expectations only on what you see you blind yourself to the possibilities of a new reality."
lol they’re nothing alike 😂 If anything, Larry is working for the old gods. Not destroying the old ways, but bringing them back. Also Zaheer was just a poorly written character made for babies.
This video could go along with your Strongs being secret Starks video. If they had Stark blood that could explain why Larys can greensee through the Weirwood.
IIRC anyone with the blood of the first men can be a warg and/or greenseer. Isn't like 1/1000 first men descendants are wargs and 1/1000 wargs are a greenseer? Going by memory, so those ratios could be off, but it's something like that. Edit: maybe I am wrong, I can't find the quote I'm looking for
@@rhaenyralikesyoutube6289 that is correst but I was just saying the Starks because he has a video saying the Strongs are actually lost Starks so I was trying to tie it together but you are absolutely right any one with first men blood can be a greenseer.
Once again Joe, fantastic video. I've been a fan of this channel for a bit now and am so so glad to see you getting huge props and shoutouts from everyone from Alt Shift X to In Deep Geek to New Rockstars!! You deserve all the attention and recognition for your hard work. Keep up the amazing eye for detail and thank you for your time and dedication!
I think that it is not explicitly mentioned in the book because there is no POV from Larys. The Maesters who mostly composed the history either where oblivious to Greenseers or they had not interest to mention a "magical" help in the plot since they were some much against the idea of magic...
Book canon for Fire and Blood is tough because it’s not a character POV. It’s not a first hand account. It’s histories told by people who didn’t even witness the events unfold.
Larys also meets the physical requirements of a Greenseer - Greenseers have the blood of the first men. The Strongs are a first men house - Greenseers are physically weak or crippled in some way. His club foot
Thank you for acknowledging Bran's agency in the atrocities. He put Daenerys on the path to genocide, and does so knowingly. Once you become a part of the Children and their Gods, you can no longer be relied upon to possess a sense of human morality. Bran is the host to an amoral alien intellect. If Larys was taken in at the isle of faces, it stands to reason he might be as well.
@@lesliemisaacs It's touched on in this video. Daenerys learning of Jon's parentage is what started her on her path to madness, and the show runners confirmed this for whatever that's worth. That knowledge found it's way to Daenerys only because Bran passed of that knowledge to Sam (exactly when Sam was most likely to want to take action against Daenerys). For any other character that sort of sequence of events cannot be blamed on the person who starts the snowball, so to speak. But Bran can see the future. So when he begins a chain of events that just happens to result in him taking over the world, it's entirely reasonable to wonder how much he knew about what was going to happen. "But Bran is a good kid!" you might say. And maybe he was, once. But he's not Bran anymore, something he says directly.
"Bran is the host to an amoral alien intellect.". So. The white walkers were created by the Children of the Forest by magically integrating dragonglass in them. And there are hints that there is something greater going on. The religion of the Lord of Light is centered on belief in the existence of two deities, in the words of Melisandre: "A god of light and love and joy, and a god of darkness, evil, and fear, eternally at war." R'hllor is the god of fire, which provides light, heat, and life, and struggles against darkness, cold, and death, represented by an opposing deity, the Great Other. At Castle Black, Melisandre refers to the Others as the "cold children" of the Great Other. So the White Walkers are the servants of the Great Other, who is Death, and the prince that was promised was destined to fight him according to the religion of the Lord of Light. If Bran is with the Children of the Forest and the Children have made the White Walkers then is Bran an extension of the Great Other, of Death? In search of the last dragon. And Jon Snow aka Azor Ahai, destined to fight the Great Other. The story of Game of Thrones, if anyone's is that of Bran and Jon. is the final battle for the iron throne be between Bran and Jon? Ice and Fire.
I like the Larys theory, I think you're right about the Weirwood editing. But I think the rats are foreshadowing something different, and it's not necessarily Blood and Cheese. I think it is conspicuous that the rats have always shown up when Viserys is around. They appear when Viserys is talking with Rhaenyra and he is revealing the Song of Ice and Fire prophecy, just after the death of his wife. They appear when he is sleeping with Alicent and we see his rotting back. They appear at the wedding after he collapses and they drink the blood on the floor. They appear when he is alone and doing nothing of significance other than mourning Aemma. The connection is these all have to do with death and weakness and Viserys. What this foreshadows, I think, is a change or additional detail regarding his eventual demise. I believe that either he will be consumed by rats after his death, or that he may even be killed by rats during a nap. That he will be too weak, too feeble to defend himself against rats or to even call for help. The rats, symbolically, are like vultures, or even like the crows that he compares his small council to in the first episode.
Absolutely brill analysis. The kudos from other talented ASoIaF/HotD RUclipsrs is well deserved. If Joe had written GoT S5-8, it would've continued the mastery of S1-4 rather than Derp& Derpier's Project Ruin.
Antoer thing to watch for in Larys case is that the animal you skinchange to changes your behavior, if you choose a bird you might lose yourself to the sky, choose a deer a you'll become a coward so I wonder how does skichanging into rats has changed. While they are not exactly cowards, they can defend themselves, but their mindset is to survive/adapt, him killing his family with little remorse makes sense considering rats will sometimes eat eachother if they need food.
This video made me a subscriber. You’ve done an amazing job piecing this together using subtle and more direct clues provided in the show both through the audio and visuals beyond just the dialogue, absolutely bought in to this theory and look forward to watching more of your stuff.
I think Larys is the current version of the Three Eyed Raven. If the three Eyed Raven is just a compendium of knowledge connected to the weirwood net and working on behalf of the children then it could be a role that's been passed down for generations and used to weaken the realm steadily until it was weak enough for Bran to take over as the supreme overlord of Westeros
@@lesliemisaacs He's not Bran anymore. He tells you that. And even when he was still Bran he was totally willing to use mind control to steal his friend's body to go spelunking, an act which explicitly caused his friend intense terror.
It's plausible. In this era the Isle of Faces would have been home to a functional weirwood overmind, and wouldn't have lost that functionality until magic goes dormant south of the wall much later. So a crippled boy with First Men blood living right by the God's Eye would have been an obvious candidate to act as an agent. The mistake, I think, is treating the Three-Eyed Crow as a fundamentally separate entity from the rest of the weirwood collective intelligence.
In a cyclical world, all we need is to know who/what happened first bc it will happen later. I knew Larys was up to something important when he made a comment about hibiscus growing "only in Braavos" just like stories we've heard about lemon trees a century later. He holds a hibiscus flower at other times. But not before he sits down with all of the women, who've always got the gossip, and eats a lemon cake! It's put together beautifully.
@@ThatSB No he didnt. You are saying this because he wrote the books? Id love a source for your claim. The books say that there are no weirwoods in kings landing and Ive heard plenty of these asoiaf channels that know the books inside out say the same. Also GRRM isnt directly involved in the series.
@@xLovepieGRRM is directly involved in the series. He is with all the shows based on his world. He’s also executive producer on the upcoming Dunk and Egg show.
I just subscribed loved this in-depth video that no I was not aware of. But I totally see it now. The clues are there.. and apparently so are the rats. Great video!! Can't wait too see more.
Great content! I noticed the tree & the snake analogy & saw your video about this character & was like "something to think about." When I saw the rat in the last episode, I was like "he"s right!" Viserys most likely Knows what the rat really is. Viserys knows a lot, but he purposely plays dumb (on the show). The problem is he is too forgiving, not stern, and refuses to take action in the name of keeping peace. Yet, playing feeble (if he is) in this case, is the smartest thing to do. He is too clever to be really feeble to me. About the 3 Eyed Raven, Bran- I was on to him thanks to the books. I believe that He could also see through the 🔥 as well & in the intro he stood in the background mean mugging Dany - I was like "right" she is his opponent.
I have found lots of these videos from other channels have spoilers(mostly minor but some major) here and there so hearing that thing about "the rat thing from the books" and how he fully avoided it, this seems like the best channel to ensure no spoilers. I went through the Willem Blackwood video just waiting to pause and exit if I started hearing spoilers haha.
Really enjoyed your Larys Greenseer video and I'm glad to see you've made another video on the conniving rat-spy. I think we can all agree that character is starting to become one of the most intriguing characters in HOTD **sniffs flower**
this is such a good theory! iirc the weirwood tree isn't in the books so adding it into the show had to be for a reason. same sort of principle as chekov's gun.
Holy fuck. I just watched this and am floored. To think that the show is being done on such a high level. Man I read the books, I pay attention, I think of myself as highly intelligent, but if you sat me down and made me watch raptly for ten years, I would of never came up with that genius conclusion. My hats off to you sir. You should be working on that show. This video just revolutionized how I'm gonna watch everything from now on. And I would guess that max I could count on one hand the number of shows/series that are at this level of complexity. I would love your recommendation of anything out there that is at this level. You really deserve so much credit. Like I seen some of your older stuff, from this show as well as Game Of Thrones and just wow. The show after the show podcast was just great. 👏 👏 👏 👏 👏 You are next level bro. I still have the last of the three books on the GOT series and I just ordered them again and even the Fire & Blood...I'm gonna start over now. 🙏
Those of us Deep Space 9 fans definitely got some strong Odo the shape shifter vibes when seeing those rats. Odo would often change into a rat to spy on criminals and some of the rat-laced scenes in HotD made me think of him!
Here's a thought I had after watching this video and the one you did about Helena; What if the beast beneath the boards is *not* the dragon, but Larys; that whole episode is full of him sneaking around, likely interrogating those imprisoned that included Talya, which would be how he knew about the White Worm's location to send his fireflies, who had to move through Flea bottom to accomplish it. His behavior is certainly beastly, and the very first time we hear Helena say "There is a beast beneath the boards," she's doing it with a sense of urgency and perhaps even anger *just after talking to the nursemaid* about how if someone has something, other people will try to take it away- probably the most coherent bit of dialog we get from her. There's that cut to her twins as they are taken away that stands out to me. During the coronation scene, there's also a very quick shot of Larys smiling more to himself than anything, and I think that may be more to do with him taking over White Worm's spy network in addition to his own possible abilities than what's actually going on in front of him. Helena on the other hand, is constantly focused on Ageon *until* the crown goes on his head, where she looks away. It is, after all, because of this moment that we ultimately end up with Blood and Cheese. Blood and Cheese being found for the task by the white worm herself for Daemon, and they move through tunnels into the Red Keep. Larys has everything he wants in this moment, and her world is about to crumble. That boom, dragon, happens just a few moments after is a visual impact of the war that has just started, too.
If Larys is a greenseer, and Helena is a dragon dreamer, it may very well produce some kind of magical friction we're not presently aware of as well. We do know dragon dreaming tends to be more vague than the way greenseeing works, so she might feel a threat, but not be able to identify that it's a person.
At about 54:15 in that same episode, she's looking away again and she seems agitated, she's been moving around, so she might be aware of more danger, but you can see part of her face, profile in the shot. She looks more like she's about to cry than afraid, like she's having a vision after just having gone into her own head a bit
Haven't clicked that fast for a video in a while. I'll be watching Larys' career with great intent. And yours, of course. This video brought me back to my heyday of ASOIAF theorizing in such a great way.
Speaking Howland Reed. I have always been baffled by Meera's tale to Bran about him going to the Isle of Faces. Without actually telling Bran or us the reader she tells Bran one of two things either Howland reached the island more then 40 years prior to the day he left or carried a boat overland 100s of miles before entering the lake somewhere nowhere near harrentown because he has never scene Harrenhall before which he couldn't have missed when entering the gods eye and at very least would have heard about Harrens castle If he had trekked overland and detoured so far out of the way of the route he would have taken which it seems like she tries to explain that he always tried to make the times he exited the water minimal. Since being out of water meant danger also has to carry a boat every time he does. Anyway given all of this him having never scene or heard about the castle prior to seeing when he leaves and the fact that it took forty years to build had it not been there when he first goes to the gods eye would make sense to his utter surprise of finding it there after but from its creation to when that tourney would have been is literally like 340 years so is the gods eye a place where time doesn't move the same way it does on the rest of the planet or does this show the long life of the children and it being passed on to the reeds who supposedly married and breed with children of the forest.
Also with Meera's story and the way in which she describes his fear of the lord of the crossing made me think on top of great place for bridge it is In a key area to try and block people in the neck from being able to travel down river and Harrenhal now blocks and guards anyone's easiest route from Trident to gods eye entrance made me wonder if these two castles were built in these key locations to stop access to the gods eye from neck dwellers. Meera also talks about how many knights are drown and under the bog waters but there are never any direct wars or key histories that explain why a group of people so secret and so alienated by rest of world that prefer solitude would in such modern times still be such a disturbance that people want to clear them out. Wonder what your thoughts are. Am I reading into a over exaggerated children's bedtime tale or key details to the story are said between the lines
The fact that Lyonel's bedroom door was nailed shut but Harwin's obviously wasn't begs the question; was Harwin actually a target or just collateral damage?
Shit, what a theory that popped into my head. The entire Dance of the Dragons was set up by Larys only for Lord Stark to come south and marry the Blackwood woman. The descendant of this pair will be Bran Stark endowed with the magical powers of the Blackwoods. The Green Seener has created the Ultimate Green Seener.
man i can't wait for your review on Sunday/Monday or whichever day you decide to do it after the next episode i have become an overnight superfan of your videos :) i'll admit i didn't watch the aftershow streams because they're a tad long, but i have watched every single episode deep dive you've done since the first episode by now. it really helps me establish extra aspects of the character's personalities (and intents), and i absolutely cannot get enough of it. i did have a suspicion in regards to the rats before i came upon your channel, but i couldn't really nail what was going on with them. needless to say; now i can. at this point i am fully convinced that Larys is a skinchanger/warg(or is it worg?)/greenseer or a variation thereof. please more.
Great video love the talk about the editing found your channel after Larys was subtly introduced in episode 3 and wanted to know more because I knew he wasn't going to be a simple character
Love this theory. Who else finds this character fascinating? I wonder if the beetle that Larys uses for his emblem is one of the creatures he can skin change into as a warg or green seer.
What do you think Larys is going to ask Alicent for when he calls in the favor? Does he just want chaos? His motivation? He's already the heir of Harrenhall now after murdering his father and brother.
Tbh I got some sexual vibes when he plucked the flower but that was the flower they were discussing together before the timeskip as well so it could just be a symbol that Larys is patient and willing to wait so idk. Looking forward to finding out
@@xPooogle515 I got that impression as well. Yes, he's very cunning and ambitious just like Littlefinger, and Varys later will be, but I got the impression that he could be "looking for dead men's shoes," to quote Anne Boleyn; meaning that should Viserys die at some point, he might seek to become King through her, or something along those lines.
another thing i noticed was during the fiery murder of his father and brother. what I would assume would be men loyal to Lary. some what scurry off into the sewers/underground. cloaked and unseen (for the most part) i noticed these visuals being a little off but i didnt really put the rats and Lary together until this video. thank you for that. his scene in the garden with her did have a lot more than just a 'friendly alley' to it so i hope this is what we find out later in the series. great eye there sir
Watching this after the "Ratcatchers" episodes I think this theory is even more confirmed. Larys being aware of (and certainly having influence over) ALL of the rat catchers being killed really puts the nail in this coffin for me.
After your first video on this noticed that cut this episode. Watched it after alt shift x shoutout, immediately came back and subscribed. Love this content duder!
I'm think its interesting that every major generation that we've seen in the books has had a seemingly supernatural master of spies. Aegons sister was the master of whispers and was believed to be magical in her abilities, Larys, Bloodraven, and Varys. Is there anyone else that would fit this pattern? Of course, magic is faded out in the world now, and Varys has been shown to be far more practical and physical than magical, but that too seems to be a theme about magic fading and being replaced.
"The enigma that is Larys Strong the Clubfoot has vexed students of history for generations, and is not one we can hope to unravel here. Where did his true loyalty lie? What was he about?" - Gyldane Of course Gyldane would say this if he didn't know (or refused to entertain) that Larys was a greenseer. When you can see or hear nearly everything going on of course your loyalties are going to be ambiguous and shifting. People can complain about there "not being any evidence" of Larys being a greenseer/skinchanger in the books but thats literally only because its the exact thing Gyldane wouldn't admit to himself was a possibility
Yes, a lot of people need to be reminded that the book is intentionally written as a very unreliable and biased history book. It was never meant to be accurate, so them using it as the evidence for their argument is a little ridiculous.
@@mariavi33 The problem with this argument is that while it’s true the book isn’t accurate, that really only brings us back to square one. The book being biased still doesn’t prove Larys is a greenseer, and the book is our only source on the matter. “The book doesn’t support it” is absolutely a fair argument. For the people who are claiming Larys is a greenseer, the burden is on them to come up with solid evidence. It’s not enough for them to just say that all the sources against their argument are unreliable (especially when their own arguments rely on the exact same sources.) Lack of counter-evidence does not serve as evidence, but lack of evidence does serve as counter-evidence. Fire and Blood is inaccurate or unreliable because it’s meant to create ambiguity. As far as we know, Gyldayn could still be 100% right about all his speculations and theories. Or he could miss the mark on everything. However, it doesn’t mean the opposite of everything he thinks must be true.
@@Former_Halo_Fan I didn't claim that it proves they're wrong or anything else. I was just talking about the people who claim that they have to be right (because of the book), that the source they use as evidence isn't reliable.
Another thing I think is interesting is how Bran got his abilities after he was rendered motionless. Larys is also born with a deformity that hinders movement. Just a fun similarity.
You've earned a subscriber, this analysis is so well research and explained, Im glad I now have you to follow through the next decade of westerosi television xx
I've never even heard of your channel before but the algorithm sent me this and I loved it. Guess you got a greenseer in the algorithm helping you out! I never considered this Theory but now I'm sold
I've only ever come up with one theory of my own in GOT. Even though I never had too much evidence to back this up aside from what a messed up person she is and all the messed up deeds that she did. Melesandra mention that she serves the Lord of Light against the Great Dark One. I think she was unknowingly serving that very devil she was trying to defeat.
Maybe Larys is the Lord of Light's Rival's version of Bloodraven? I mean he plays a huge role for the Greens, and he's way more loyal to the Hightowers than the Dragon Lords (who know about the coming Long Night). Plus, we know this war wipes out House Targaryen's most formidable weapons against wights
Really fascinating theory, I think you've convinced me. Can't wait for the next season. Have some audible credits, thought about getting the book... but I think I'd rather wait for the show. Did the same with LOTR when I was in high school, ASOIAF, and The Expanse... oh, and Dune. I like reading/listening to the books after getting some visual context.
Dude, this video is a gem. I don't know if you heard about this movie called RRR yet but it has a lot of these cuts you have been talking about. Give it a try in your free time. It is an entirely new form of filmmaking. I thought you might be interested, highly recommended. Great videos you make. Enjoying them all.
You are correct. Somehow, I wound back to this video after I commented Harrinhal is directing the story to kill off the Targaryans for torching the castle and trees. I don't think the show will make this know to those who have not paid attention. It will just be something there that makes sense to us.
Nothing in film and television, or even literature, is on screen to further the narrative. Nothing is pointless. We were showm those rats everywhere for a reason and that reason has to be this. Dope catch, man.
Another awesome theory, keep up the great work! I actually just made a video about Larys myself, dissecting why his sigil is a firefly. I reference your original theory in that video and was sure to credit it properly and link to it in the card, I hope that's okay! The idea that Larys could be a warg has made him one of my favorite characters.
Glad you enjoyed it. Larys fandom is only getting started, they have big plans for him. To the Moon errr Isle of Faces. And yes perfect, a link to it is all I ask and thank you for doing it.
@@JoeMagician Wonderful, thank you so much! When I was first watching the episode I didn't realize that the firefly pins were pins, rather I thought that they were actual bugs that Larys could be warging into.
I hope that they never make this explicit, but it would be cool if they have Larys knowing something that he could have known only if he or a spy were in a godswood - but they should make it clear that he is elsewhere at the time and (somehow) that there could be no practicable way for someone to spy on the scene (except through the weirwood). Preferably, they would space out the original scene and the reveal that Larys knowsby at least the majority of a season, if not more, so that only astute watchers will even realize that he should not know it. As you lay out, they do come close, but it would be good to have the time delay along with a near-guarantee of the impossibility of Larys knowing or figuring it out via any means other than magic. Still, they are doing some very close to that right now.
Larys Strong = Best Strong, so very helpful and concerned with everyone else's problems despite his own.
He's such a little trooper putting on a brave face after suffering the tragic loss of his family.
I hope they one day catch the real killer
@@JoeMagician I do hope so. There were several eye witnesses, but they appear to be silent on the matter.
@@vidarrboot72 It really is a burning question as to why someone awful would want to reduce most of the house of Strong to smouldering embers like that? Poor Larys.
@@J1283-s1k I blame the ghost of Black Harran... That and Westoros' woeful fire safety regulations, I'm amazed more stone castles haven't gone up in flames tbh.
@@J1283-s1k It's the curse of Harenhall the actual killer doesn't matter
In the books Littlefinger is the current Lord of Harrenhall he will clearly die in the show too he died(I hated his death tho)
If Larys is indeed a Greenseer it would make an interesting trend of Greenseerers having physical disabilities, (Bran's paralysis, Bloodraven's missing eye, and Larys' club foot) and having them overcome these disabilities with their magical abilities.
That sounds like a fair observation.
Physical loss and magical compensation
Euron’s missing eye
@@silvertrimhill9844 Aemond also losing an eye, then becoming a super-arsehole who mans the world's most powerful known weapon of mass destruction
@@joywagner979he did by his own efforts become the best sword in, all 7 Kingdoms?
@@JohnnyCatFitz I don't know! It just kinda fits the theme of physical loss leading to a leveling up, whether it was supernatural or not!
Late to this, but also very interesting that Larys, Bran and Bloodraven are all physically disabled in some way (Larys' club foot, Bran's legs, Bloodraven is a one-eyed albino). I wonder if perhaps Bloodraven will take cues from Larys, further paralleling how Bloodraven taught Bran after his 'death'. Very interesting.
I think the link here is the old gods are clearly trying to cull house targaryen and their dragons. First it was Larys being a sparkplug for the Dance of Dragons, then its Bloodraven and his revenge in all the blackfyre rebellions, and now Bran who has been promised he will learn to fly (likely warging a dragon). The old gods' motives are coming into focus.
Well if they’re all connected via the weirwood hive mind. No need for inspiration. Bran, Bloodraven, and Larry could all be literally working together as a single entity towards a shared goal.
I think an important thing to note is that in the books it's mentioned several times that too lie in front of a weirwood is a really bad idea, and here we have Rhaenyra lying in front of a weirwood only for a apparent greenseer to suddenly start moving against her
Yeah but in fairness she did answer them question truthfully since alicent just asked if she screwed d.... Which is a bit ghastly to straight up ask. Also i thought the lie had to be presented to the tree and old gods?
@@datumzinememories she said daemon didn't touch her- which is a lie
@@The-Doctor6969 no she said they didn’t lay together- that was the distinction she used
No- she didn’t lay with Daemon
(But she did lay with Criston)
At least that’s what I rmbr from that scene I don’t rmbr the words “daemon didn’t touch me/ I didn’t touch him” in any vatistion
@@zoeshaclarke8315 she literally says Daemon never touched me
@@zekemyers4444 I understood it in the context of “he never effed me” not literally he never touched her. The wordplay was what Rhaenyra was doing throughout the convo I don’t know why that particular phrase would be different.
Isn't it also said that skin changers can take on the characteristics of the animals they possess if they stay in the same one too often and too long? Maybe Larys has taken on some characteristics of rats, who will eat their own to survive and thrive in the same way Larys metaphorically consumes his own family to get ahead?
Yes absolutely
Excellent observation.
I was just thiing about this, I also wonde how does skinchagind into a raven changes you, in the case of Bloodraven.
The rat cook story also comes to mind. I wonder if there’s any connection with his family. Also, his family is seated at Harrenhall which is believed to be cursed. Lots to go on here!
this isn't an actual thing rats do
There is also a moment, when Larys is talking to Alicent, right before he goes to the dungeons, you can hear the sound of rats 🐀 whyle the camera is still on Larys face
Ooo I missed that, good catch
I’ll look out for that, when I rewatch the episode.
@@JoeMagician it's very subtle, just as it transitions to the dungeons
Could he be the rat in Viserys bedroom
😶
Larys is one of the creepiest character ever created. He is literally the demon who whispers into the ears of powerful people who he can manipulate by playing on their weaknesses and ambitions.
Anyone noticed the rats didn't start showing up until the strongs entered the picture? Like seriously episode 1&2 no rats, then larys enters and so do the rats
No I didn't but that is really interesting. At least until Larys showed up, Lyonel was there in episode 1 and 2.
@@JoeMagician that is true! I completely forgot lyonel was there. But yeah it wasn't up till his son showed up. Maybe this is why when it comes to game of thrones they mentioned having a cat problem 🤔
@@Smalltown_Man
..
Lyonel comes across as a completely transparent and decent person.
No one would suspect him of being a greenseer.
I didn’t notice this, but I’ll surely be rewatching and paying attention
@@Smalltown_Man well by Robert Baratheon’s time maybe Bloodraven had made sure there was an established colony of cats to catch the rats in the Red Keep, especially if they smelt a bit Strong to him?
I'm thinking about the scene where Alicent is getting rodded by Viserys and she looks up at the ceiling rafters and sees a rat.
He's got a thing for Alicent I think
"rodded" holy fuck 😂
We just need him to look at her and tell her how pretty she was.
@@Drew_Thompson Oh god
Oh. Oh no. Oh NO.
One of my favorite J-cuts in GOT is when Tommen jumps out the window the audio cuts to Frey saying "For House Lannister!" then the video cuts to a toast at The Twins
This fits so well. The Strongs are descended from the First Men. Larys being in the godswood was just perfect on the writers’ and director’s part.
Even more interesting, because Bloodraven on his mother's side is a descendant of Lucamore Strong
He mostly uses all his powers to look at feet.
He definitely looked at Alicent feet before. That's why he chose to help her?
Feet that smell of cheese. Maybe the rats like the scent and it rubbed off on him?
😂😂😂
Well its actualy geniuse why he likes feet
Of course someone would misuse such a gift for feet p0rn 😭
If Larys' objective to get rid of all dragons, setting the Targaryen's to civil war is definitely the best course of action
He appeared at the right time too.
During the reign of Viserys dragons were proliferating, and everyone a potential threat to the realm (except possibly Cannibal).
I was thinking, he probably knew something. He definitely working with Daemon but why? What makes Larys want to work with Daemon? He literally saved ALL his children. He saved Aegon's iii lives in return of his own life. He must be knew something
I dont think its his objective. Its the old gods' objective and they are working through Larys.
I watched your video about Larys being a greenseer, because Alt Shift X mentioned it. Seemed plausible, but kinda far fetched.
A few days later, Episode 6 came out and I was astounded how on point you were. Congratulations!
Same here. I thought ‘man that’s cool, but the show runners don’t have the balls, surely’ and then bam, next episode Larys is fully cosplaying as Bloodraven. I’m curious to see if they’ll even touch on the Isle of Faces, or just leave the green seeing as an Easter egg for fans. Great stuff either way!
Once you realize that just about every event of import in the War of the Five Kings was facilitated or orchestrated by BR, you begin to suspect any and all well-informed persons with a drop of First Men blood as wargs and skin changers.
Any adult with a disability is only alive due to some massive advantage. Missing an eye or limb doesn't always count but I don't think many small folk would survive an amputation
Congratulations?? He POSSIBLY made a correct prediction, not cured Cancer.
@@jeffreyruttibaker1081 People congratulate eachother for having birthday...
If you only congratulate someone for curing cancer, then you obviously have zero experience in this area and therefore I don't value your opinion. Thanks for trying to be so constructive and helpful
@@jeffreyruttibaker1081 it’s called enjoying your hobbies, you should try it Jeff
Larys constantly interacting with plants and having specific knowledge of them, is a tell
Absolutely, he's constantly around plants and flowers
Hibiscus
Just remember this is still GOT style. Until they pay off some foreboding we can just assume this is b.s. to keep us guessing.
at some point, the red keep became home to cats. back in book 1 if i remember correctly, arya was made to catch cats as assignment from her waterdancer swordmaster. i wonder if there is a deliberate reason for the cats being there.
I mean Larys could just as easily Warg a cat, like Arya does in the books
@@gholamdapantaloonsniffer8218
yea true. but i think i remember tyrion saying that at some point, the red keep had a rat infestation. these could just be bits of unconnected things, but my interest is piqued.
Great point! Maybe there was a hostile takeover of some kind. I also think the cats were being controlled to lead Arya to the tunnel entrances in preparation for her escape. Rhaegar is probably Serio. And the black cat missing part of its ear most likely belonged to the princess that had just been killed. So maybe the cat was a royal spy as well.
Spoilers for Fire and Blood
In Fire and Blood, it says that Otto Hightower brought in a bunch of cats to catch rats after Aegon II had all of the rat catchers in King's landing executed due to the Blood and Cheese plot.
blood and cheese kill one of the princes and they hang all the rat catchers in response and release 100 cats to deal with the rats in the castle.
I'm still in mourning over the Harwin and dear old dad. Great chatacters! Such a bummer.
Harwin we hardly knew ye.
Considering what Bran and 6 skins are capable of in ASOIAF, if Larys can warg rats couldn’t he have survived his execution in the books by warging into say…Tyland Lannister? Would explain a lot about the “hooded hand” in Aegon III’s reign.
I really like the Greenseer/Earth magic theme in the books. The Greenseers are the balancing force in the struggle between Ice and Fire. The First Men have a relationship of balance with the Children, but under the influence of the Andals and then the Targs, they neglect it - except in the North. Something has to bring it back.
I already miss Emily Carey's Alicent. She was superb.
I've been a Larys fan since listening to fire and blood
I've been a Larys truther since episode 3
We all coming around to Larry. Didn’t read fire and blood.
But oooooo man is the show fantastic, and Larry is the guy.
I enjoyed that bit involving Viserys observing the rat. It's as if he has a different understanding of the world than most around him, just to become so fixated on something that subtle and supposedly ordinary, which could lead to tremendous ripples through Westeros.
This is a great analysis. The greenseer magic really adds another dimension to the various goings on in Westeros. Alas, the conflict between Alicent and Rhaenyra still seems to petty in comparison.
The themes are synchronizing smartly so far in this series.
In episode 7 Larys' demeanor towards Alicent mirrors those rats we have been seeing until now 🧐 Amazing video btw
Did anyone else clock when helaena was playing with a spider at driftmark and she shut the spider in a shell with her hand, it cuts to larys instantly regaining his balance (I think?)
Maybe we’ll get a scene of Brynden Rivers coming into the weirwood cave with a nearly 200 year old larys wrapped in the weirwood but instead of the tree coming through his eye it’s grown into his foot. Would be a funny post credit scene.
LOL
I wondered about the rats and also thought he knew way too much to not be informed. I didn't put two and two together until I watched this video...actually it was you that put it all together tbh! Because of this alone, I'm subscribing to your channel, if I haven't already.
If the rat in Viserys's chambers is controlled by Larys as a silent observer then why is it doing everything in its power to be noticed by racing across the mantle like a bull in a China shop rather than quietly watching and listening from the shadows?
Perhaps the rat is confused as to why it always finds itself in the king's chambers even though it was clearly on its way to the kitchens for some cheese? As soon as Larys leaves the rat, it hastily scurries off by the most direct route.
The rat woke up wondering where the hell it was once Larys jacked out of the Matrix.
@@pankratos5017 The Rat 🐀 is also seen licking Visery’s blood 🩸
@@pankratos5017 yeah bc the rat shows up after viserys and alicent do the deed. maybe after hes out of the rat, it just wonders around?
Larys Strong reminds me a bit of Zaheer in Korra. "New growth cannot exist without first the destruction of the old." "When you base your expectations only on what you see you blind yourself to the possibilities of a new reality."
lol they’re nothing alike 😂
If anything, Larry is working for the old gods. Not destroying the old ways, but bringing them back. Also Zaheer was just a poorly written character made for babies.
The show is getting more interesting with every new episode!
There are quite a few videos put out recently about Larys the Greenseer, but this is easily the best.
Helps to be the originator of the theory!
This video could go along with your Strongs being secret Starks video. If they had Stark blood that could explain why Larys can greensee through the Weirwood.
IIRC anyone with the blood of the first men can be a warg and/or greenseer. Isn't like 1/1000 first men descendants are wargs and 1/1000 wargs are a greenseer? Going by memory, so those ratios could be off, but it's something like that. Edit: maybe I am wrong, I can't find the quote I'm looking for
@@SalsaStork yeah I think your numbers are right. 1 in 1000 can warg and then 1 in 1000 of wargs are greenseers. It sounds right.
True. Anyone with strong enough blood ties to the First Men can be a green seer, it doesn't rely on families like the Starks.
@@rhaenyralikesyoutube6289 that is correst but I was just saying the Starks because he has a video saying the Strongs are actually lost Starks so I was trying to tie it together but you are absolutely right any one with first men blood can be a greenseer.
@@rhaenyralikesyoutube6289 I mean Bloodraven the second best greenseer is a Blackwood. A first men strong family.
Once again Joe, fantastic video. I've been a fan of this channel for a bit now and am so so glad to see you getting huge props and shoutouts from everyone from Alt Shift X to In Deep Geek to New Rockstars!! You deserve all the attention and recognition for your hard work. Keep up the amazing eye for detail and thank you for your time and dedication!
A lot of people noticing these and shouting them out, the recognition feels great.
This is a true story. Rearranged and transformed into fantasy.
Larys is an excellent character, I'm really enjoying his portrayal in the show, the actor is doing an awesome job.
As much as I can't stand him. I agree. I think that goes to show how good he is.
I really love this theory. Even if it's not book canon, but show only canon, it's bringing a much needed mystical element into the story.
Karen Targaryen... nice name lol.
Because dragons under human control isn't mystical
I think that it is not explicitly mentioned in the book because there is no POV from Larys. The Maesters who mostly composed the history either where oblivious to Greenseers or they had not interest to mention a "magical" help in the plot since they were some much against the idea of magic...
Book canon for Fire and Blood is tough because it’s not a character POV. It’s not a first hand account. It’s histories told by people who didn’t even witness the events unfold.
Larys also meets the physical requirements of a Greenseer
- Greenseers have the blood of the first men. The Strongs are a first men house
- Greenseers are physically weak or crippled in some way. His club foot
Thank you for acknowledging Bran's agency in the atrocities. He put Daenerys on the path to genocide, and does so knowingly. Once you become a part of the Children and their Gods, you can no longer be relied upon to possess a sense of human morality. Bran is the host to an amoral alien intellect. If Larys was taken in at the isle of faces, it stands to reason he might be as well.
What!? How did Bran have anything to do with what Dany did?
This is fascinating! Thank you!!
@@lesliemisaacs It's touched on in this video. Daenerys learning of Jon's parentage is what started her on her path to madness, and the show runners confirmed this for whatever that's worth. That knowledge found it's way to Daenerys only because Bran passed of that knowledge to Sam (exactly when Sam was most likely to want to take action against Daenerys). For any other character that sort of sequence of events cannot be blamed on the person who starts the snowball, so to speak. But Bran can see the future. So when he begins a chain of events that just happens to result in him taking over the world, it's entirely reasonable to wonder how much he knew about what was going to happen. "But Bran is a good kid!" you might say. And maybe he was, once. But he's not Bran anymore, something he says directly.
"Bran is the host to an amoral alien intellect.". So. The white walkers were created by the Children of the Forest by magically integrating dragonglass in them. And there are hints that there is something greater going on. The religion of the Lord of Light is centered on belief in the existence of two deities, in the words of Melisandre: "A god of light and love and joy, and a god of darkness, evil, and fear, eternally at war." R'hllor is the god of fire, which provides light, heat, and life, and struggles against darkness, cold, and death, represented by an opposing deity, the Great Other. At Castle Black, Melisandre refers to the Others as the "cold children" of the Great Other. So the White Walkers are the servants of the Great Other, who is Death, and the prince that was promised was destined to fight him according to the religion of the Lord of Light. If Bran is with the Children of the Forest and the Children have made the White Walkers then is Bran an extension of the Great Other, of Death? In search of the last dragon. And Jon Snow aka Azor Ahai, destined to fight the Great Other. The story of Game of Thrones, if anyone's is that of Bran and Jon. is the final battle for the iron throne be between Bran and Jon? Ice and Fire.
@@ProYada you just turned my brain inside out
I like the Larys theory, I think you're right about the Weirwood editing.
But I think the rats are foreshadowing something different, and it's not necessarily Blood and Cheese. I think it is conspicuous that the rats have always shown up when Viserys is around. They appear when Viserys is talking with Rhaenyra and he is revealing the Song of Ice and Fire prophecy, just after the death of his wife. They appear when he is sleeping with Alicent and we see his rotting back. They appear at the wedding after he collapses and they drink the blood on the floor. They appear when he is alone and doing nothing of significance other than mourning Aemma. The connection is these all have to do with death and weakness and Viserys.
What this foreshadows, I think, is a change or additional detail regarding his eventual demise. I believe that either he will be consumed by rats after his death, or that he may even be killed by rats during a nap. That he will be too weak, too feeble to defend himself against rats or to even call for help. The rats, symbolically, are like vultures, or even like the crows that he compares his small council to in the first episode.
Next episode should reveal your theory. I’d love an update on your theory after it shows.
Absolutely brill analysis. The kudos from other talented ASoIaF/HotD RUclipsrs is well deserved.
If Joe had written GoT S5-8, it would've continued the mastery of S1-4 rather than Derp& Derpier's Project Ruin.
Antoer thing to watch for in Larys case is that the animal you skinchange to changes your behavior, if you choose a bird you might lose yourself to the sky, choose a deer a you'll become a coward so I wonder how does skichanging into rats has changed. While they are not exactly cowards, they can defend themselves, but their mindset is to survive/adapt, him killing his family with little remorse makes sense considering rats will sometimes eat eachother if they need food.
Note: Humans have a long history of eating each other, don't need to be a rat for that.
This video made me a subscriber. You’ve done an amazing job piecing this together using subtle and more direct clues provided in the show both through the audio and visuals beyond just the dialogue, absolutely bought in to this theory and look forward to watching more of your stuff.
I think Larys is the current version of the Three Eyed Raven. If the three Eyed Raven is just a compendium of knowledge connected to the weirwood net and working on behalf of the children then it could be a role that's been passed down for generations and used to weaken the realm steadily until it was weak enough for Bran to take over as the supreme overlord of Westeros
That would make Bran a really evil character and I don’t see that for him.
@@lesliemisaacs He's not Bran anymore. He tells you that. And even when he was still Bran he was totally willing to use mind control to steal his friend's body to go spelunking, an act which explicitly caused his friend intense terror.
It's plausible. In this era the Isle of Faces would have been home to a functional weirwood overmind, and wouldn't have lost that functionality until magic goes dormant south of the wall much later. So a crippled boy with First Men blood living right by the God's Eye would have been an obvious candidate to act as an agent. The mistake, I think, is treating the Three-Eyed Crow as a fundamentally separate entity from the rest of the weirwood collective intelligence.
@@pallen2645 "abomination"
- me, through every Bran chapter
Larys is Larys. The three eyed Raven is who he is. Every character in SOIAF is unique and exist on their own.
"If anyone is controlling the face tree or the rats they would know everything" - frig too right
Looks like you have unlocked one of the biggest mysteries of Fire and Blood. I love it. ❤
In a cyclical world, all we need is to know who/what happened first bc it will happen later.
I knew Larys was up to something important when he made a comment about hibiscus growing "only in Braavos" just like stories we've heard about lemon trees a century later. He holds a hibiscus flower at other times. But not before he sits down with all of the women, who've always got the gossip, and eats a lemon cake! It's put together beautifully.
I’m a holdout for “Three-Eared Rat”, but I’ll accept it.
Your previous video about him is amazing. He is the best player so far, Larys become my favourite. The actor is so good.
Now we know why the showrunners added a heart tree there... For Larys.
George RR Martin added the weirwood there
@@ThatSB No he didnt. You are saying this because he wrote the books? Id love a source for your claim. The books say that there are no weirwoods in kings landing and Ive heard plenty of these asoiaf channels that know the books inside out say the same. Also GRRM isnt directly involved in the series.
@@xLovepie Not agreeing or disagreeing but GRRM is a Executive producer on the show
@@xLovepieGRRM is directly involved in the series. He is with all the shows based on his world. He’s also executive producer on the upcoming Dunk and Egg show.
I just subscribed loved this in-depth video that no I was not aware of. But I totally see it now. The clues are there.. and apparently so are the rats. Great video!! Can't wait too see more.
Great content! I noticed the tree & the snake analogy & saw your video about this character & was like "something to think about." When I saw the rat in the last episode, I was like "he"s right!"
Viserys most likely Knows what the rat really is. Viserys knows a lot, but he purposely plays dumb (on the show). The problem is he is too forgiving, not stern, and refuses to take action in the name of keeping peace. Yet, playing feeble (if he is) in this case, is the smartest thing to do. He is too clever to be really feeble to me.
About the 3 Eyed Raven, Bran- I was on to him thanks to the books. I believe that He could also
see through the 🔥 as well & in the intro he stood in the background mean mugging Dany - I was like "right" she is his opponent.
Maybe larys was the boar that tried to kill rynaera
Hmm..maybe. As a greenseer, or warg, he could use a few animals to skin change into to be a better spy, rather than rely on 'little birds.'
I have found lots of these videos from other channels have spoilers(mostly minor but some major) here and there so hearing that thing about "the rat thing from the books" and how he fully avoided it, this seems like the best channel to ensure no spoilers. I went through the Willem Blackwood video just waiting to pause and exit if I started hearing spoilers haha.
Really enjoyed your Larys Greenseer video and I'm glad to see you've made another video on the conniving rat-spy. I think we can all agree that character is starting to become one of the most intriguing characters in HOTD **sniffs flower**
Warging and green sight isn't exclusive to the Stark bloodline. Moreso of ancient houses that tie back to the First men and the Children of the forest
And actually the Strongs and Stark most definitely have crossed and share roots in the North going far back
@@PatJWilliams I really hope the show introduces Larys as a greenseer, would suck if not.
We have magic in the form of dragons but it would be nice to see some magical humans too like Quaithe, Melisandre, etc
*sniffs feet*
Wow the camera direction is incredibly detailed 👍
this is such a good theory! iirc the weirwood tree isn't in the books so adding it into the show had to be for a reason. same sort of principle as chekov's gun.
Holy fuck. I just watched this and am floored. To think that the show is being done on such a high level. Man I read the books, I pay attention, I think of myself as highly intelligent, but if you sat me down and made me watch raptly for ten years, I would of never came up with that genius conclusion. My hats off to you sir. You should be working on that show.
This video just revolutionized how I'm gonna watch everything from now on. And I would guess that max I could count on one hand the number of shows/series that are at this level of complexity.
I would love your recommendation of anything out there that is at this level. You really deserve so much credit. Like I seen some of your older stuff, from this show as well as Game Of Thrones and just wow. The show after the show podcast was just great.
👏 👏 👏 👏 👏
You are next level bro. I still have the last of the three books on the GOT series and I just ordered them again and even the Fire & Blood...I'm gonna start over now. 🙏
Love these videos! Larys is so fascinating, and you're doing an awesome job of unlocking that for us here 👏🏻
Larys is top tier, excellent character. Littlefinger could learn a thing or two.
Those of us Deep Space 9 fans definitely got some strong Odo the shape shifter vibes when seeing those rats. Odo would often change into a rat to spy on criminals and some of the rat-laced scenes in HotD made me think of him!
Here's a thought I had after watching this video and the one you did about Helena;
What if the beast beneath the boards is *not* the dragon, but Larys; that whole episode is full of him sneaking around, likely interrogating those imprisoned that included Talya, which would be how he knew about the White Worm's location to send his fireflies, who had to move through Flea bottom to accomplish it. His behavior is certainly beastly, and the very first time we hear Helena say "There is a beast beneath the boards," she's doing it with a sense of urgency and perhaps even anger *just after talking to the nursemaid* about how if someone has something, other people will try to take it away- probably the most coherent bit of dialog we get from her. There's that cut to her twins as they are taken away that stands out to me.
During the coronation scene, there's also a very quick shot of Larys smiling more to himself than anything, and I think that may be more to do with him taking over White Worm's spy network in addition to his own possible abilities than what's actually going on in front of him. Helena on the other hand, is constantly focused on Ageon *until* the crown goes on his head, where she looks away. It is, after all, because of this moment that we ultimately end up with Blood and Cheese. Blood and Cheese being found for the task by the white worm herself for Daemon, and they move through tunnels into the Red Keep.
Larys has everything he wants in this moment, and her world is about to crumble. That boom, dragon, happens just a few moments after is a visual impact of the war that has just started, too.
If Larys is a greenseer, and Helena is a dragon dreamer, it may very well produce some kind of magical friction we're not presently aware of as well. We do know dragon dreaming tends to be more vague than the way greenseeing works, so she might feel a threat, but not be able to identify that it's a person.
At about 54:15 in that same episode, she's looking away again and she seems agitated, she's been moving around, so she might be aware of more danger, but you can see part of her face, profile in the shot. She looks more like she's about to cry than afraid, like she's having a vision after just having gone into her own head a bit
Haven't clicked that fast for a video in a while. I'll be watching Larys' career with great intent. And yours, of course. This video brought me back to my heyday of ASOIAF theorizing in such a great way.
Absolutely brilliant video! Very interesting theory that seems to completely add up. Good job man
Glad you think so!
Speaking Howland Reed. I have always been baffled by Meera's tale to Bran about him going to the Isle of Faces. Without actually telling Bran or us the reader she tells Bran one of two things either Howland reached the island more then 40 years prior to the day he left or carried a boat overland 100s of miles before entering the lake somewhere nowhere near harrentown because he has never scene Harrenhall before which he couldn't have missed when entering the gods eye and at very least would have heard about Harrens castle If he had trekked overland and detoured so far out of the way of the route he would have taken which it seems like she tries to explain that he always tried to make the times he exited the water minimal. Since being out of water meant danger also has to carry a boat every time he does. Anyway given all of this him having never scene or heard about the castle prior to seeing when he leaves and the fact that it took forty years to build had it not been there when he first goes to the gods eye would make sense to his utter surprise of finding it there after but from its creation to when that tourney would have been is literally like 340 years so is the gods eye a place where time doesn't move the same way it does on the rest of the planet or does this show the long life of the children and it being passed on to the reeds who supposedly married and breed with children of the forest.
Also with Meera's story and the way in which she describes his fear of the lord of the crossing made me think on top of great place for bridge it is In a key area to try and block people in the neck from being able to travel down river and Harrenhal now blocks and guards anyone's easiest route from Trident to gods eye entrance made me wonder if these two castles were built in these key locations to stop access to the gods eye from neck dwellers. Meera also talks about how many knights are drown and under the bog waters but there are never any direct wars or key histories that explain why a group of people so secret and so alienated by rest of world that prefer solitude would in such modern times still be such a disturbance that people want to clear them out. Wonder what your thoughts are. Am I reading into a over exaggerated children's bedtime tale or key details to the story are said between the lines
The fact that Lyonel's bedroom door was nailed shut but Harwin's obviously wasn't begs the question; was Harwin actually a target or just collateral damage?
How do you figure Harwin's door "obviously wasn't nailed shut"? He couldn't get out, duhh!
@@tyrroo He was in the hallway trying to break his father out when the ceiling collapsed on him. What do you mean he couldn't get out?
@@chrisw1966 ignore him 😆 🤣 He spoke without comprehending the question. You know how people be on RUclips
@@chrisw1966
Probably collateral.
His death wasn't necessary to reinstate Otto as Hand.
i thought larys killed them so he could be lord to harrenhall? trust me, larys's motives are a mystery@@alanpennie8013
In season 2 episode 7 after Alicent gets her cut tended to, she says “nothing is clean here” and looks at a rat and the next scene is Larys’s 👀
thanks Joe, I hadn't made the Stark/Strong family link connection with Warging until now. good job my man.👍
Good point that Larys knows quite a lot to plan that first bomb drop. Wouldn't work as he wishes without an awful lot of knowledge.
Also when Larys is in the jails recruiting his mercenaries, we can hear quite loudly rat sounds.
I’m sold on this theory JM. Thanks for pointing out the cinematic clues. Now I know to have a sharper eye as I watch.
Shit, what a theory that popped into my head. The entire Dance of the Dragons was set up by Larys only for Lord Stark to come south and marry the Blackwood woman. The descendant of this pair will be Bran Stark endowed with the magical powers of the Blackwoods. The Green Seener has created the Ultimate Green Seener.
I thoroughly expect Larys to have a hand with the Blood and Cheese incident.
man i can't wait for your review on Sunday/Monday or whichever day you decide to do it after the next episode
i have become an overnight superfan of your videos :)
i'll admit i didn't watch the aftershow streams because they're a tad long, but i have watched every single episode deep dive you've done since the first episode by now.
it really helps me establish extra aspects of the character's personalities (and intents), and i absolutely cannot get enough of it.
i did have a suspicion in regards to the rats before i came upon your channel, but i couldn't really nail what was going on with them.
needless to say; now i can. at this point i am fully convinced that Larys is a skinchanger/warg(or is it worg?)/greenseer or a variation thereof.
please more.
Im glad I watched your previous vid on Larys cuz it got me so hyped when New Rock Stars gave you a shoutout.
Great video love the talk about the editing found your channel after Larys was subtly introduced in episode 3 and wanted to know more because I knew he wasn't going to be a simple character
Love this theory. Who else finds this character fascinating? I wonder if the beetle that Larys uses for his emblem is one of the creatures he can skin change into as a warg or green seer.
If beetles are skin changed often, I could see that being reason to smash & smash them.
@@kneau “smash the beetles, smash em, clunk clunk”
The Three Eyed Rat lol
2:27 i swear, baby jon snow has a 5 o'clock mustache shadow.
This comment popped up at exactly 2:27. AI is getting outta hand 😅😂🤣
@@eddieglover7774 Burt Reynolds' 5 o'clock mustache!
What do you think Larys is going to ask Alicent for when he calls in the favor? Does he just want chaos? His motivation? He's already the heir of Harrenhall now after murdering his father and brother.
F*** off the two brothers and marry the daughter and become some pseudo King
Tbh I got some sexual vibes when he plucked the flower but that was the flower they were discussing together before the timeskip as well so it could just be a symbol that Larys is patient and willing to wait so idk. Looking forward to finding out
@@xPooogle515 I got that impression as well. Yes, he's very cunning and ambitious just like Littlefinger, and Varys later will be, but I got the impression that he could be "looking for dead men's shoes," to quote Anne Boleyn; meaning that should Viserys die at some point, he might seek to become King through her, or something along those lines.
@@rhaenyralikesyoutube6289 I have never been less pleased to be right 😩😭
It AAAAAALL made sense when those feet came out! LMAOOO
Damn, that makes him really powerful and a useful ally for Alicent.
Gosh I just love coming back to these types of vids again in the GOT universe. I would never guess any of this. Love it.
another thing i noticed was during the fiery murder of his father and brother. what I would assume would be men loyal to Lary. some what scurry off into the sewers/underground. cloaked and unseen (for the most part) i noticed these visuals being a little off but i didnt really put the rats and Lary together until this video. thank you for that. his scene in the garden with her did have a lot more than just a 'friendly alley' to it so i hope this is what we find out later in the series. great eye there sir
Watching this after the "Ratcatchers" episodes I think this theory is even more confirmed. Larys being aware of (and certainly having influence over) ALL of the rat catchers being killed really puts the nail in this coffin for me.
After your first video on this noticed that cut this episode. Watched it after alt shift x shoutout, immediately came back and subscribed. Love this content duder!
I'm think its interesting that every major generation that we've seen in the books has had a seemingly supernatural master of spies.
Aegons sister was the master of whispers and was believed to be magical in her abilities, Larys, Bloodraven, and Varys. Is there anyone else that would fit this pattern?
Of course, magic is faded out in the world now, and Varys has been shown to be far more practical and physical than magical, but that too seems to be a theme about magic fading and being replaced.
"The enigma that is Larys Strong the Clubfoot has vexed students of history for generations, and is not one we can hope to unravel here. Where did his true loyalty lie? What was he about?" - Gyldane
Of course Gyldane would say this if he didn't know (or refused to entertain) that Larys was a greenseer. When you can see or hear nearly everything going on of course your loyalties are going to be ambiguous and shifting. People can complain about there "not being any evidence" of Larys being a greenseer/skinchanger in the books but thats literally only because its the exact thing Gyldane wouldn't admit to himself was a possibility
Yes, a lot of people need to be reminded that the book is intentionally written as a very unreliable and biased history book. It was never meant to be accurate, so them using it as the evidence for their argument is a little ridiculous.
@@mariavi33 The problem with this argument is that while it’s true the book isn’t accurate, that really only brings us back to square one. The book being biased still doesn’t prove Larys is a greenseer, and the book is our only source on the matter. “The book doesn’t support it” is absolutely a fair argument. For the people who are claiming Larys is a greenseer, the burden is on them to come up with solid evidence. It’s not enough for them to just say that all the sources against their argument are unreliable (especially when their own arguments rely on the exact same sources.)
Lack of counter-evidence does not serve as evidence, but lack of evidence does serve as counter-evidence.
Fire and Blood is inaccurate or unreliable because it’s meant to create ambiguity. As far as we know, Gyldayn could still be 100% right about all his speculations and theories. Or he could miss the mark on everything. However, it doesn’t mean the opposite of everything he thinks must be true.
@@Former_Halo_Fan I didn't claim that it proves they're wrong or anything else. I was just talking about the people who claim that they have to be right (because of the book), that the source they use as evidence isn't reliable.
Another thing I think is interesting is how Bran got his abilities after he was rendered motionless. Larys is also born with a deformity that hinders movement. Just a fun similarity.
You've earned a subscriber, this analysis is so well research and explained, Im glad I now have you to follow through the next decade of westerosi television xx
Welcome aboard! I'm gonna do my best
I've never even heard of your channel before but the algorithm sent me this and I loved it. Guess you got a greenseer in the algorithm helping you out! I never considered this Theory but now I'm sold
I've only ever come up with one theory of my own in GOT.
Even though I never had too much evidence to back this up aside from what a messed up person she is and all the messed up deeds that she did. Melesandra mention that she serves the Lord of Light against the Great Dark One. I think she was unknowingly serving that very devil she was trying to defeat.
I love this video, AMAZING video. i couldnt wait for a in depth discussion on Larys Strong.
Maybe Larys is the Lord of Light's Rival's version of Bloodraven? I mean he plays a huge role for the Greens, and he's way more loyal to the Hightowers than the Dragon Lords (who know about the coming Long Night). Plus, we know this war wipes out House Targaryen's most formidable weapons against wights
Really fascinating theory, I think you've convinced me. Can't wait for the next season.
Have some audible credits, thought about getting the book... but I think I'd rather wait for the show. Did the same with LOTR when I was in high school, ASOIAF, and The Expanse... oh, and Dune. I like reading/listening to the books after getting some visual context.
Dude, this video is a gem. I don't know if you heard about this movie called RRR yet but it has a lot of these cuts you have been talking about. Give it a try in your free time. It is an entirely new form of filmmaking. I thought you might be interested, highly recommended. Great videos you make. Enjoying them all.
I hope HotD lasts long enough for us to see Lord Bloodraven in all his glory (or infamy depending on one’s perspective).
Awesome content as per usual.
Your editing on this one *chefs kiss* good stuff Joe
Much appreciated!
Whoa, now you're at 33,000!!! Awesome, you deserve it! Much love!!
He deserves 100k. There's guys im subscribed to who don't even try they just say what everybody else is saying. This dude is actually original
I do my best, really appreciate the kind words
...hm very VERY interesting! i love that Jcut Lcut info. thank you
Folding ideas is a wonderful channel
You are correct. Somehow, I wound back to this video after I commented Harrinhal is directing the story to kill off the Targaryans for torching the castle and trees. I don't think the show will make this know to those who have not paid attention. It will just be something there that makes sense to us.
Nothing in film and television, or even literature, is on screen to further the narrative. Nothing is pointless. We were showm those rats everywhere for a reason and that reason has to be this. Dope catch, man.
Another awesome theory, keep up the great work! I actually just made a video about Larys myself, dissecting why his sigil is a firefly. I reference your original theory in that video and was sure to credit it properly and link to it in the card, I hope that's okay! The idea that Larys could be a warg has made him one of my favorite characters.
Glad you enjoyed it. Larys fandom is only getting started, they have big plans for him. To the Moon errr Isle of Faces.
And yes perfect, a link to it is all I ask and thank you for doing it.
@@JoeMagician Wonderful, thank you so much! When I was first watching the episode I didn't realize that the firefly pins were pins, rather I thought that they were actual bugs that Larys could be warging into.
I hope that they never make this explicit, but it would be cool if they have Larys knowing something that he could have known only if he or a spy were in a godswood - but they should make it clear that he is elsewhere at the time and (somehow) that there could be no practicable way for someone to spy on the scene (except through the weirwood). Preferably, they would space out the original scene and the reveal that Larys knowsby at least the majority of a season, if not more, so that only astute watchers will even realize that he should not know it.
As you lay out, they do come close, but it would be good to have the time delay along with a near-guarantee of the impossibility of Larys knowing or figuring it out via any means other than magic. Still, they are doing some very close to that right now.