Pathfinder Religion Guide: Proteans
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- Опубликовано: 28 июн 2024
- In this video on the outsiders and demigods of Pathfinder we look at the Porteans. The Proteans are a unique and iconic Pathfinder outsider type; among the eldest of the creatures of the Great Beyod, those outsiders hail from the Maelstrom - the outer plane that represents elemental chaos.
▬ Contents of this video ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
0:00 - Intro & Preamble
2:28 - History of the Proteans
12:32 - Types of Proteans
20:47 - Il'surrish
21:47 - Narriseminek
22:56 - Ssila'meshnik
24:07 - Ydajisk
25:01 - The Speakers of the Depths
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CREDITS
The large high-res map I use is not a Paizo official map, but the work of the incomparable Rob McCaleb ( www.artstation.com/robmccaleb ) used here with their gracious permission.
Content for this video came from "Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Concordance of Rivals"
If you enjoyed this video, please support Paizo publishing by purchasing this product or others.
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#paizo #pathfinder #golarion #innersea #roleplaying #rpg #history #lore #d&d #proteans
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The Proteans seem like a prime example of when worldbuilding clashes with game design. Like, these are wild beings who are living embodiments of anarchic cosmological chaos... also they have a hierarchical caste system so GMs can easily keep track of encounter scaling for different points in their players' level progression. Still a cool creature concept, I just find that aspect funny.
Yeah, you nailed it 🤣
Should have just made mandatory that they only appear as enigmatic NPCs that give out plot tokens & quests.
Same issue with demons to a lesse extent.@@namelesssomebody2557
A contradiction but onethat would make sense. You expect chaos to be non hierarchical so having Chaos be Hierarchical probably will drive one mad if they think about it.
@xo-1320 same with the oddly consistent serpentine appearance; they're so unreliable that you can't even rely on them being unreliable.
It is my headcanon that Protean language & society is basicly 4Chan
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Lol😅
So, all Proteans are actually named Anon, then?
I feel attacked. But ya.
Why do the purely chaotic Proteans have a more consistent theme and form than the Lawful Archons?
Thanks for sharing; this was pretty cool. I like that the Proteans’ story of creation offers an explanation of the origins of Order-and by implication Neutrality-but is silent to where Good and Evil come from. It leaves mysteries and questions for the Game Master and Players.
I love these explorations of the Outer Planes. I hope you’ll eventually do one or two on the miscellaneous lesser know. Celestial/Good-Aligned Ousiders and the various “Outsiders” native to the Material Plane (Oni, Rakshasas, Garuda, etc.).
We're getting closer and closer to the native outsider videos, I promise they are totally coming.
Genuinely enjoyed this video quite a lot. Glad to support this kind of content and that all of us get such insightful and interesting information. Love the proteans, as they do feel like they belong in fantasy and have a really complex history with the planes. Have a spectacular day everyone! Thanks for the vid.
Much appreciated! Thanks for watching and commenting as always
I have to dwell on the planar videos yet but I really enjoyed the Proteans.
This and the upcoming Aeon and Inevitables videos are really fun.
WOO! First my favorite faction, with the Firebrands, and now one of my favorite outsiders with Proteans. (I'm a big fan of Chaos)
2 for 2!
If I may suggest, perhaps you could do some videos that take a more in-depth look of some of the demi-planes of Pathfinder in the future, or maybe even do a series of videos on the Pathfinder solar system and its other planets.
Thanks for the suggestion. I will try to find a slot for the solar system. I did do a video on the popular demi-planes, but probably didn't spend as much time with each plane as you might have liked ;-)
@@TheMythKeeper I saw your video on the popular demi-planes. They all sounded very interesting I think for the most part you just glossed over them really quickly. It might be a good idea to tackle each demi-plane individually and go into more depth of them.
I would especially be interested in learning about the Worldscape. I'm also curious about that one plane, what was it called? The Lost?, The way you describe it it basically sounds like Pathfinder's version of Neverland.
I absolutely adore the proteins. They're one of the most unique concepts I see in the Pathfinder methos and do a really good job of making the interdimensional part of the universe feel more complex, though it is very strange for being of chaos and independence to have such a hierarchy in their biology and I kind of like to think that the hierarchies that are observed are actually not present but interposed by outside observers and the true nature of their society is more free-flowing
I said in another comment, but this is also a function of the fact that this is a game, and GM needs stats for things. If "every protean is totally unique" that just makes things a bit harder.
@@TheMythKeeper That's totally fair, but I do think that there's the option to explore some really interesting territory of an entirely non-hierarchical society
I'd like to think their uniformity is also a play on a chaos and in that chaos often creates order of its own without intention.@@devinsweet983
Like the brief brush with the fourth wall. Unclear for a moment which side you intended to knock on, quite material appropriate.
😅
Best wishes to you and yours as the year comes to a close, and thanks for all the lore you brought us in 2023 :) It's no wonder that Proteans are regularly mistaken as being evil. Most lives are a collection of many delicately balanced processes, and for every beneficial mutation there are many more lethal ones. Frequent change is incredibly hazardous to a healthy existence.
The Maelstrom sounds very entropic. It is, as far as I know, a cosmic "blender" that destroys any identifying characteristics of quintessence and outputs a completely homogeneous flow of soulstuff. Constant change destroying orderliness paradoxically seems to make everything uniform and uninteresting beyond potential. It's only once that quintessence starts taking relatively ordered forms again that anything interesting happens.
That leads to the problem with having a fantasy race that is genuinely "chaos incarnate" - they'd be mostly useless, unidentifiable, and uninteresting. There are infinitely more ways to have aimless piles of dust/clouds of particles than to have those particles usefully arranged to manifest limbs, intellect, motivations, etc. Actions like moving around, fighting, etc require multiple sustained efforts in the same "direction" to be meaningful, which precludes true randomness. So perhaps Proteans should be more dedicated to possibility, variety and change. Less about the nihilism of actually formless chaos, which isn't that interesting and would destroy them all. More about exploration of infinite combinations of possibility and making sure no one such combination becomes a long-standing "normal" that restricts variety.
So they wouldn't hate the other planes because they have patterns, they would hate that the patterns are generally predictable and enduring thus shackling the true potential of reality. The constantly mutating Abyss would approach acceptable, but the static nature of Axis where there's very few "correct" orders to existence would be anathema. An Akizendri may usually destroy knowledge by rearranging text at random but perhaps it's not the destruction or formlessness they crave. Perhaps they simply hate that books always say the same thing and every combination of words isn't explored. Maybe they live for the rare moments when their meddling results in the creation of an incredible alchemical formula or philosophy that might not have been discovered by "normal" science/debate.
You are a gentleman and a scholar. I always look forward to your thoughtful comments. I think Pathfinder has done a really good job of zigging when they might have zagged for their chaotic creature type, and it makes them far more interesting than "everything they do is random". They get riled up when it comes to resistance to change, and they see death in stagnation. Axis is anathema to them in some interesting ways.
unexpected but appreciated, what about the astral plane outsider type?
Sahkils are just around the corner ;-)
I would love a Video on the Aeons and possibly why the holders of cosmic balance are now Lawful Neutral (2E) rather then True Neutral (1E)
Seconding this.
@@balrighty3523 - I have Sahkils dropping in 3 weeks, and then Aeons dropping 3 weeks after that. So not long now hopefully! (Maybe I will skip a week over the holidays as I'll be afk for a bit.)
The Proteans are much more interesting than the Slaad, but I do agree they seem oddly... non chaotic in appearance and culture. On a future note, any chance of a deep dive on Kelesh?
I will definitely do a Qadira deep dive, because that's the portion in the Inner Sea, and I'll touch on the greater empire when I finally get around to that.
Voidworms seem derpy-cute, like axoltlols. I kinda want one as a pet; or would that be a mistake?
No, not a mistake. This is an excellent idea. 🤣
Every notification from this channel puts a smile on my face :) A deep dive Darklands would be so much fun to listen from you. I don't think there is one for that place yet, I couldn't find.
Not yet, its in the works though!
Maybe a "how Pathfinder became Starfinder" lore video.
That would be a very short video. It happened during a period called the Gap. No one in the galaxy knows what happened during the Gap.
@@scottread2979 - Haha! pretty accurate, but I'm sure I could pull together another 2 hour megavideo stringing together all the bits of lore and tidbits that have been dropped to string together a best effort narrative.
@@TheMythKeeper hmm. I did not think of that. That would be an unusual video.
@TheMythKeeper would be a pretty awesome video.
Ssilla Meshnik seems inspired by Stuart from The Loading Crew. Both make arguments about allignment, while claiming their own allignment is chaotic neutral.
I hope you do a regional deep dive on Lastwall soon!
Its in the works!
In light of recent events in our sister community I'd like to say I really like your content. it's been amazing to get into pathfinder and lore is something I never really got into until I got into pf2e. Your videos have made the entrance into the world of Golarion all the easier. Thank you.
Rock on! Thank you so much for the kind words!
love your content - stumbled upon your channel a few weeks ago and I think i'm almost caught up now. Looking forward to the last Mwangi Video, since we are currently playing Strength of Thousands, so seeing that will be great. I'd also be interested in something about content about the darklands - although it would be very niche most likely since not a lot of groups really use any of that area of the game world
Welcome to the channel! My Sodden Lands video just hit the Mythwatchers Club today when this video went up, (they get videos 4 weeks ahead of schedule.) Central Mwangi will be another 6 (maybe 7 with holiday skip-week) behind that.
Great vid, as always.
Very interesting !
I like how this race of infinitely shifting formless beings of chaos all look _exactly the same_
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As usual, great stuff MythKeeper. informative and impeccable diction. You might want to give a go at audio-books :D
Finally high quality content
Thank you for the kind words!
I admit when I first learned about Proteans I sort of just went...okay. So this is what "Slaad" are in Pathfinder. But, as Paizo has worked to estabolish their IP I've grown to appreciate Proteans a little more then I do Slaad. Slaad are cool. But, they were just....lacking something that didn't really distinguish them from some of the more brutish demons.
Seeing how some of the novels presented Proteans as strange NPCs. I rather enjoy the serpentine Skehksie/Coautls.
Yeah the Proteans are actually totally cool and honestly pretty different from the Slaad.
that war between proteans and qlipots sounds rel good as an inspiration fr a campaign....does the protean have something against rovagug?
Yes the Proteans also hate Rovagug too. TBH, it certainly sounds like the Proteans hate a lot of things that aren't Protean. 😅
😆@@TheMythKeeper
Protians opened a portal to the Abys: just for the Hell of it. 😎
Why not? Seemed like a groovy place at the time
Proteans are an enemy type I really just don't care for (same with d&d slaadi). I prefer my CN critters to be more lovecraftian and alien
Oh, comon. the concepts of Chaos anarchy and freedom arn't that hard to understand. Besides, is the Speaker of the Dephs, and the fact protians illegedly predate all other life in the outer planes not "Lovecraftian" enoguh?
My issue with Pure Lovecraftian stuff is that they just seem like more of the same in fantasy worlds like Pathfinder and DnD. Trust me. I love creatures like Mi-Go and etc. And I wanna run a Pathfinder game based in the Dreamlands. But, when the creatures of the mythos stand alongside fiends, Caulborn, and etc. They get lost in the mix.
The religion series is my absolute favourite what's coming next? Also I know in dnd there are demi and quasi elemental planes are they also in pathfinder? Would there be a video on them?
Along these lines I do have a video coming up on the new wood and metal elemental planes that also patches the lore for some of the 2E cosmology updates coming out that should be a good time for you.
👏👏👏
Proteins were such a nice addition to pathfinder, excluding the reproductive aspect, they are much more interesting than the slaadi
100% agreement from me on this
Between the Slaadi and the Proteans I think the Proteans are better (but still not great) creatures of chaos, but the Slaadi are more interesting with their weird life cycle. They would be better as just an alien species rather than the poster outsiders for the whole plane, though.
That's a pretty fair assessment. I also like the Slaadi, but not so much in this position I think. Love the idea of incorporating them as aliens though.
@@TheMythKeeper I think the best truly chaotic outsider would have variables in all stat blocks, where you randomly determine every few rounds what size it is, how many attacks it has, what creature type it counts as, and the first time it takes damage in a round it takes half damage from all attacks of that type for the rest of the round.
Would it be a nightmare to run and fight against? Absolutely. But as organisms chaos is in a lot of ways more antithetical to us than order is. It should be a nightmare to non-natives of the plane to highlight just how strange it is to us and how out of place we are.
@@flibbernodgets7018 - Yeah, totally, Love this idea.
Chaos incarnate has castes?
Yes, that's the lore, but TBH, I think this is as much a function of the fact that the game world requires creatures to have reasonably consistent attributes so GMs know what their stats are on the battlefield as anything else.
Great study of xaos.
What are your thoughts on Pathfinder moving away from the alignment axis? What kind of impact will the decision have on the rich (and nuanced) lore?
I'm all for Pathfinder moving away from alignments. TBH, I have not played with alignments since the 90s. Alignments in the mortal world have been stupid for a very long time. Having wizards be able to go around and "Detect Evil" on random people would just lead to a world where everybody was setting each other on fire all the time (or carrying big planks of lead a la Order of the Stick).
I think its still helpful when it comes to the entities of the outer planes for them to be 'themed' in accordance with some ethos. So Proteans will forever remains creatures of Chaos, its just that "Chaos" isn't really a useful descriptor of a humanoids moral or ethical frameworks.
That said, I would love to see the Fiends get re-skinned ever so slightly so their schtick is more crystallized. For example:
Demons - "Chaotic Evil" - Better associated principals - Desire, Hedonism, Mockery
Devils - "Lawful Evil" - Better associated principals - Ambition, Cruelty, Tyranny
Daemons - "Neutral Evil" - Better associated principals - Competition, Predation, Anger
Aaaah hell, as a perpetual CN player, I always end up inadvertently worshipping the Proteans in one way or another. Not because lolrandumb, but my own view on pure individualism and pure freedom of choice despite how others demand I act.
6:55 I see what you did there.
5:57 as soon as I saw what was going to be Axis, I instead thought to myself, “what’s Seattle space needle doing here”
Seattle is the Axis of our world...
Wait I'm confused if the Proteans seeks the destabilization of all planes how can they not be considered evil?
They seek to return the universe to the state it was before - without planes - just an endless sea of chaos. From their POV order stole their universe from them, as they were there before everything else.
@@TheMythKeeper I see so in their pov they’re just taking back what they consider their own although it is kinda funny they hate demons athough one would think they would get along with humans considering how chaotic humans can be but the demon hate is kinda surprising though but I guess Proteans don’t see what they do as destructive they only see it as returning things back to their natural state
The one suggestion I might add is an outro.
I am always disappointed when the closing music plays suddenly from the last lore cut. I am not looking for a unique one for every video, just plug the channel & Discord then a That's All Folks to make it less jarring.
Sure, I'll still not like the end of the lore.
Yet, as is, it seems so sudden.
Interesting “Others”. Older than all others, but not squid faces.
Haha, yeah, they are kind of like Golarion's mind flayers, for sure.
Pathfinder Writers: Chaos is just Postmodernism with ADHD!
Of course they got distracted! If they are not the embodiment of ADHD, I don't know who is!