A strength of these is the granulation. I use a few of them as convenience colors because the granulation and separation helps the landscape to paint itself.
I have a number of the D.S. Primateks and I love them! My favorites Green Apatite Genuine & Sodalite Genuine and Hematite Gen. I also love Piemontite Gen (pale washes are great for skin tones), Zoisite Gen, Bloodstone Gen for landscapes. The way they granulate paints the landscapes easily. I also love Burnt Tiger’s Eye Gen for animal hair. The Rhodonite Gen is a beautiful color but it is almost identical to D.S. quin rose. I also tried the Amazonite Gen and while beautiful it isn’t much different from viridian. I live in the USA so these paints really aren’t expensive here - the European brands are much more for us. If the color you are wanting is available in a stick it’s an affordable way to purchase. They have 1.6 times the pigment load that a tube and have the volume of more than 3 half pans. They re-wet beautifully and offer additional fun application techniques you can’t achieve with tubes or pans. When Daniel Smith first made the primateks he didn’t add other pigments to them and they were more dull and very difficult to re-wet. That’s why the formulas changed. I agree it would be good for them to list all the other pigments in them. The important thing for me is the color and the other properties such as lightfastness. I hope some day they can find a way to make them affordable for everyone outside the USA and Canada so you can enjoy them the way I do. 😊
Great information - thank you!I think the lack of pigment information is poor, especially for a premium brand. I can see they would be great for landscapes. Thanks for the tips about sticks. I’ve not tried those.
I agree with you, compare to your other sample they fall short. And I own Daniel Smith paints. Thank you so much for your review…Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year
Haha, I do love your commentary Liz and your complete honesty on reviews. They do make quite an overblown deal in their marketing of these. Are the unmentioned added pigments the supposed “scandal” I ‘ve heard other RUclipsrs allude to in recent days? By rights, they really should list them. As you said, I would think they would need them for color consistency and I don’t think anyone would mind. I just ordered a couple tubes and a couple sticks the other day on the Black Friday sale just to see if they’re anything I’d care for. While I, too, prefer the larger tubes, I did order the smaller tubes and sticks where I could just to give them a try as the 15 ml tubes are quite pricey even on sale. . I’d forgotten that the amethyst had some sparkle and now wish I’d included that in my order after seeing your review. Sarah Burns had mentioned it in one of her videos a while back, but I’d forgotten. I ordered the hematite in a stick and will be curious to see if it behaves the same as in your experience. Thanks for another helpful review.
Hey Liz! Better late than never, right? 😊 I’m honored to be a Daniel Smith Brand Ambassador and I have a few of these on my 18 color dot card. I love them for my pet portrait work, the granulation does half of the painting for me! I remember the controversy and have spoken directly with the owner about it. He said they do have to use stabilizer pigments to keep each tube consistent with the last, but that it’s their own proprietary mixture. So everyone has their own opinion on that! I love the company, they are more like a family than a brand and I’m honored to get to be part of that family! Anyways, I enjoyed watching you swatch this selection! You did a very thorough job as always! ❤
I love to hear how much you love the company - they seem to evoke strong feelings. I always thought there were extra pigments. ‘stabilising’ is a good description. I think not knowing what they are is hard, as many artists wish to avoid certain pigments. Glad you enjoyed the review and good luck with your continued ambassadorship.
Liz, I just thoroughly love learning from you! This video was so educational but also gave me a few good chuckles. Yes please review the other set, those colors looked very interesting and possibly more versatile. Thank you for sharing!
Not too long ago I was a newbie to watercolors and when I came across the DS primatek range I really did think they were made with 100% genuine minerals. I was searching for YT videos on the primatek range and then came across a thorough discussion of the mineralogist/ geologist who did their own tests… well you mentioned in the video their findings. I was rather surprised and avoided primatek paints for a while, until I caved and bought a palette of DS paints which contained green appetite genuine and serpentine genuine. Those two are beautiful. I do think DS should be more upfront to dispel any misconceptions.
Been using DS primateks for a few years. To note- Rhodonite oxidises a little after a year or so, have found turns brownish, Amethyst is great as a mixer to neutralise various colours, Hematite is one of the best for granulation.... For landscapes one you didnt have is Green Appatite, its the best natural looking green I've ever come across
I for one never misunderstood the words Genuine Minerals and stones to make the paint. Daniel Smith never stated it's the only ingredient coloring agent in the paint. Only that the ones used for Primatek are real and genuine. When I heard the controversy I thought it obserd because the Actual real Daniel Smith who founded the company actually tried using only the gems for color and it was lifeless, drab, weak and impossible to rewet. I know I bought the 1st stock of it before Mr Dan Smith sold out and retired. The new owner revamped it still using real gems in the formula but didn't disclose the orher pigment ingredients. Bottom line it's been misunderstood. Most people in the US knew and didn't take it that way. The claim that Daniel Smith company uses Genuine stones in the formula was not false. Because the ones used no matter the percentage is genuine!
I have to say I too assumed there was pigment plus the stones, so the controversy left me cold. But their marketing is not clear. it implies minerals are the chief pigment, which is not true, less than a few percent in some I understand. I believe they should be more transparent about what pigments are used. What I tried to address here, was are they nice colours and are they worth the price, rather than focus on the controversy.
I bought a tube of Sleeping Beauty Turquoise when first released. It became a solid brick tube after one year, so I cut the tube open and placed the crushed hardened lump into a dish and added water and gum arabic. After working with it, it became soft again, but that was too much trouble to rescue and I will not buy any primatek unless planning to use it up in a few weeks.
yes they contain the mineral and I have to say I always assumed there wasn’t much in there with plenty of other pigment, so the controversy left me cold. However I would like to understand what else is in there.
I tried out three of these - Mayan blue is now one of the transparenr blues in my main palette - green apatite genuine is a colour I use to supplement my Schmincke Shire supergranulators, a set that needs a dark valued green - after using up all my hematite violet genuine, mixing it with other colours to make them granulate, I decided to switch to WN potters pink which did the same job at a better price If you like the effects of these colours, it might be worth checking out the Schmincke supergranulators at some point. I'd recommend the five colour tundra set. The tundra colours are like a cheat code: everything comes out looking great. but I think the Schmincke supergranulators are better. If you wanted to look at these, I'd recommend starting go with a five colour tundra set.
Well, they're pretty, aren't they?! I love the purple, blue, and the green. I thought the Shadow colours were lovely, too. I'd love to see a video on those.
Hematite and Mayan blue are amongst my favourite colours. Hematite mixes beautifully and is a great alternative when mars black overpowers a mix. Jadeite genuine is lovely and is interesting when used with cling film but you could probably get something similar with phtalo and mars black. Serpentine gen is another interesting one it’s an earthy green with reddish brown granulation but when it bumps another wet colour a very pushy bright almost acid green colour flows out of it. Dsmiths individual watercolour sticks are a more economical option for trying primateks and I’m a lot less nervous about using them than 5ml tubes but they only do a few in stick form.
I do think the marketing has mislead people, intentionally or not I cannot say. it is always best to try them as objectively as possible. I am sure that they are the perfect colours for someone, but not for me
These are very beautiful. Very granulating looks like loads of variation in one color. I've never tried DS. Maybe someday?? Would love you to do a review of the Japanese set
I wonder if the “gluey” tubes need a good mixing. I imagine those gemstone particles are fairly heavy and probably settle a lot in those tubes. It’s strange that I’m just now considering this because I have a tube of the Blue Apatite Genuine and now that I see you using the term gluey, I’d say that describes this tube I have, and now I look forward to giving the tube a good squish squosh next time I’m in my studio and seeing if there is a difference. Thank you for this video! You’ve given me a good chuckle and a good amount to think about as well! 🖤
Absolutely loved your review! No nonsense take on , what is, in the end, basically, only paint. With no bells and whistles attached to help it to sell for the price of small house... almost. 😂 I like couple of paints I have from DS, but to me they are too expensive, even if they would consist entirely of ground rubies and emeralds.
Hi, Liz - I'm not a huge fan of these - let me just say that they sent you the 'best' colors. I have been buying larger tubes and recently bought Garnet, which is one of my favorite stones. It actually comes out more brownish than you'd expect. I have about 8 tubes and some are good and some are questionable. Not going to buy them any more exactly for the reason you mentioned - they are expensive and not much of the actual stone. Those descriptions are hilarious! Glad they sent them to you. Thanks for all that you do! LindaH
Dear Liz, many thanks for the informative video! I really appreciate your testing, reviews of different materials (I was very grateful when I eventually had found found a channel that compared Hahnemühle's bamboo and sugarcane paper (and some more)!!) Many thanks for putting this much time to create these great helpful, in-depth videos! Now I have the following question that I couldn't find any answer on this by now (and my watercolor experience is not yet profound enough - I am still quite new to watercolor but I love exploring it more and more.): Has the WATER I use to paint with has a tremendous impact on the quality or behaviour of the paint(ing) ??? I thought using soft, still water poorly mineralized might be the best option, but if you use tap water or water which high amounts of calcium that might have an impact on the paints behaviour due to the composition of the paint itself? Just like the immediately visible effect of salt....Can I use demineralized water too? In case you know more about this topic I would be super grateful if you shared some information about this as well 🙏👍 Many thanks, wish you a lovely creative day and a wonderful holidays season with lots of happy&beautiful moments ✨️🤗 kind, colorful regards 🖌🎨
yes water will impact how your paints behave. water with a high mineral content encourages granulation in pigments, so if you like that effect then it is worth using hard water. Some people use distilled to help avoid it. contaminated water can encourage mold to grow in your paints, so that is also worth considering. Some people love using sea water for added minerals! To be honest it is a small impact and I would concentrate on enjoying the painting process. I use whatever I have to hand, whether it is tap, lake or bottled! but great question 😊
@LizChadertonArt Thank you sooo much for your quick reply!!! This now helps me a lot and I won't hesitate anymore which water I want to choose for my paintings! Actually, you confirmed what I only supposed could be the answer but I never had a true proof of it, yet, now that you gave me this explanation as a pro artist and this erases that huge question mark that was so on my mind! Again, thank you so much!! Reading this now was like amazing "first December, 1st Advent" "gift" to me and chances are big that I will try to include the characteristics of water to experiment for the painting procress, seeing if I'll notice a difference 🙂 Wish you a wonderful, great day ! Kind regards 😊🎨
@@LizChadertonStudio Yes, sure! But that might take some time because I am working on other projects first and thought of planning the experiment a bit so that I can really have some sort of comparison that makes sense and shows if it makes a big/noticable difference using various kinds of water with different paints perhaps too and on different types of paper... so that seems to become an a bit more time consuming experiment. However, if it turns out successfully and if I manage creating a video of it, I'll do so :-) !! In case the filming doesn't turn out well, then at least I'll get back to you writing if there was something super special I discovered or if the conclusion was just to have had some curious, creative fun with it ;-)
I have at least 15 of these, I do like them, but when I found out that Mayan blue was not light fast, that raised some questions in my mind because I would think that mineral pigments were among the most light fast. Thank you for bringing up the pigment make up of these paints! I really think Daniel Smith needs to include information on what’s actually in them.
Mineral pigments can be very lightfast, but not all minerals are used as pigments. I'm a mineral collector, and many of them have to be kept out of sunlight, otherwise they'll fade. Amethyst, aquamarine, citrine, aventurine, beryl, topaz, rose quartz, opal, sapphire, turquoise, among others. The synthetic pigments added to Primatek paints to strengthen the colors are likely more lightfast than the gemstones themselves.
@@NelaDunato that’s a very good point! I make and sell mineral gemstone jewelry, and we are always told not to charge smoky courts and citrine in the sun because they will fade… I’m surprised I didn’t make that connection!😉
@@NelaDunato when I left that comment, I was thinking more of the earth pigments like yellow ochre burnt sienna Mars black, etc.… But yes, not the same thing :-)
They are very interesting, I’m going to wait awhile, do some comparison work with the other watercolours that I have. All of your comparative work is very helpful and I’m looking forward to more.
I guess for me, I'd be more worried about "pigment" inconsistencies in China based companies that a whole bunch of people seem to "love" because they are given tons of art supplies from them. DS does hype things up...but I certainly would feel a whole lot safer using these paints.
They are beautiful, even though they are not made with only pure gemstones they are beautiful, but still not honest from their side to price them so expensive . I have only one apatite green genuine and it is beautiful.
I love the granulating effect of the Amethist and Hematite, and I love the colour separation of Jadeite and Piemontite, but is it worse 40 bucks? I would love to see you do a whole video about those Shadow Black paint. Please paint a little something with them? It doesn't have to be a masterpiece, but I have those paints too and have no idea how to use them :) With love from your wacko eco-friendly mixed media artist from the Netherlands X
of course every batch would vary and they wouldn’t have much colour and be even more expensive. BUT the marketing blurb rather implies this is the situation. I have tried to judge the paints as paints independent of the hype or controversy
Beautiful color but the granulated effect , the advance of watercolor is you can manoeuvre the pigment , paints that have a own agenda on the paper , not for me , but beautiful colors 💫
Thank you for this review. Some nice colours but I don't think I will be investing in these anytime soon. But yes, I could hear the drums loud and clear :)
Would love to see a video on using the Japanese colors. I've seen others incorporating various Japanese colors and inks into their paintings and want to know if it's worth a purchase.
Love your humor. Do they say anything about lightfastness. The stones themselves would probably be light fast, but depending on what/how much they mix in of other pigments this could change a lot. 😊
As I've already replied to another comment: "I'm a mineral collector, and many of them have to be kept out of sunlight, otherwise they'll fade. Amethyst, aquamarine, citrine, aventurine, beryl, topaz, rose quartz, opal, sapphire, turquoise, among others. The synthetic pigments added to Primatek paints to strengthen the colors are likely more lightfast than the gemstones themselves."
@@NelaDunato Oh this is interesting, I would have thought the other way around - when I look at the web-site of Kremer pigments, all the stone pigments are 8 out of 8. However, they don’t have Amethyst or Rhodonite so maybe they are different. However, what I did notice is, that most of the pigments made from ground stones, are so pale that they are nearly white. So it would really not make any sense to paint with them, unless you add some color.
@@martinanelsonartandpsychol6478 minerals that are commonly used as pigments are lightfast, but the vast majority of minerals are not traditionally used for painting. One main reason is as you've noticed, they're very weak pigments! Primatek is a gimmick.
@@martinanelsonartandpsychol6478 minerals that are commonly used as pigments are lightfast, but the vast majority of minerals are not traditionally used for painting. One main reason is as you've noticed, they're very weak pigments! Primatek is a gimmick.
Use the pretty colours if you enjoy them but basically it's false advertising. The colours are paint pigments not minerals. My son is a geologist and is going to give me a few mineral samples to play with. Do you think there is some PBk11 mixed into most of those colours?
I have several primatek colors. I find them to be extremely interesting. All the colors I have are heavily granulating and add loads on interest. Serpentine genuine is my number 1 favorite green.
Also I have hematite and piemontite in the watercolor stick form as opposed to tubes, and I don’t get any sense of it being too binder heavy in that form. Also sticks can be a better value in terms of cost!
I have Green Apatite genuine which I love. It splits into hooker's green and sap green colours plus fine dark grey granules. It's become my go to green. I have bloodstone which I expected to be a very, very dark red but appears black to me, it does granulate beautifully though. I will buy more green apatite and might also get Serpentine but am not that likely to buy others, not least because I don't do that much watercolour painting and probably have enough supplies to last me a long time.
Liz is keeping it real 💯 for us! 😂😂 Pounding of battle drums 🥁 🥁 🤣🤣 The paints are gorgeous enough to sell themselves. Methinks the hyperbole was for hyper profits $$ I was having de ja vu, too. I have the boku undo set. Now I see why. Would love to see you review the Boku Undo sumi paints.
I’ve done some test and granulation medium, dies and cheap watercolor will give you the same effect. But don’t lift as easily for the “heavy lifters “. They are so precious that I never use them, it’s the worst kind of paint 😅
So, they're a little less than $40 US right now... thats around $6 a tube. They look interesting, and I'm sure they'd be fun to play with, but IMO if I don't have the pigment information they don't even come up to student grade. I would love to see if you could replicate these paints. 😊❤
I feel the marketing for these is misleading. It strongly implies that the mineral is the primary ingredient in each paint. I base this not only the statements in the written materials. I attended a couple of online workshops with brand representatives, and there was a lot of time spent showing slides of the rocks, how they're chosen and prepared and so on, and absolutely nothing about the paints including pigments. I nonetheless had not assumed that these were pure mineral, but figured it to be the way you described it - mostly the gem, with a dash of other pigment(s) to intensify/standardize the hue. However, I know there are plenty of people who assumed it was only the gem, since that was what was listed on the tube and in the marketing, and thus considered these single pigment paints, and I can see why they would! The microscopic slides posted by the geologist appeare to be the opposite - mostly a standard pigment like phthalho, with a sprinkling of mineral crystals. As disappointing as that was, it was the response from Daniel Smith that really turned me off. There was a written statement and interviews where the owner said things to the effect that of course there are other things in it, like the gum arabic! That's how paint is made! He never admitted that there were other pigments in the paints. The company never posted information about the pigments to answer the concerns of those who wanted to know for lightfastness or toxicity concerns. It was very disingenuous, to the point of being insulting by the suggestion that it was just a misunderstanding of how paint is made. I think DS understand that the mystique helps sell the paint, and justifies its price tag. Most disappointingly, that response worked, after a brief furor people pretty much let it go. I think what the paints actually are is more like the colour shifting and granulating paints that are popular now, as well as the kind of thing you compared them with, paints that have graphite or ink added for more muted colours. They're lovely, and you can get some really cool effects with them, but that likely has very little to do with rocks from the Amazon or Alaska, and more to do with clever mixes of standard pigments.
Use the pretty colours if you enjoy them but basically it's false advertising. The colours are paint pigments not minerals. My son is a geologist and is going to give me a few mineral samples to play with.
Yes, it's obviously just a gimmick. Imo, for something to qualify as student grade at the bare minimum, it has to have the pigment information. I'm a little sad about that Mayan blue, I didn't realize it was in the same group. 😮
What does jewelry grade mean? Raw gemstones and semiprecious gemstones are graded according to transparency, saturation of color, and lack of inclusions. AAA is flawless and the most expensive. D is the lowest grade. Chevron amethyst, purple mixed with white, is not Grade A, more like Grade D. Grade D is seldom used for jewelry, in my experience. Why would anyone waste a stone valuable enough for jewelry by grinding it into a pigment? I don't believe it. I think stones rejected for jewelry would be good enough. There's a Japanese company making mica ink, if you want more minerals! I've read the ancient Egyptians used ground lapis lazuli for sacred art. Lapis was prized in Egypt.
@LizChadertonArt Liz these are easy to wet, quite a few are granulating and they are reasonably priced. There are quite a few reviews of the Aquarius colours that they make. One I liked was done by Sketches.n.Scrubs. She mentions pigment numbers and transparency, all with an enjoyable style that I love in your videos too. Cheers from Australia 🇦🇺
Great review! It might sound funny, but I actually like the imaginative descriptions of the colors! 😄 The D.S. paints are expensive, but 6 months ago, I bought a little box of dot card samples of 36 colors for just about $12 (U.S. price). The box says "Daniel Smith Extra Fine Mineral Marvels". I really love the granulation, and some paints do sparkle nicely! 💖 It's a nice range of colors, minus yellow, orange, and red (lots of rusty browns). 🤎
im glad your still making videos, please never stop!
I haven’t missed a week for three years!
A strength of these is the granulation. I use a few of them as convenience colors because the granulation and separation helps the landscape to paint itself.
I can imagine they work well for textured landscapes
Absolutely. My most used greens are Green Apatite Genuine, Jadeite, and Undersea Green (this one is not a primatek).
My favorite granlating colors are the Schminke Horadam selections
@@zenandink3531 I’ve heard good things!
I have a number of the D.S. Primateks and I love them! My favorites Green Apatite Genuine & Sodalite Genuine and Hematite Gen. I also love Piemontite Gen (pale washes are great for skin tones), Zoisite Gen, Bloodstone Gen for landscapes. The way they granulate paints the landscapes easily. I also love Burnt Tiger’s Eye Gen for animal hair. The Rhodonite Gen is a beautiful color but it is almost identical to D.S. quin rose. I also tried the Amazonite Gen and while beautiful it isn’t much different from viridian. I live in the USA so these paints really aren’t expensive here - the European brands are much more for us.
If the color you are wanting is available in a stick it’s an affordable way to purchase. They have 1.6 times the pigment load that a tube and have the volume of more than 3 half pans. They re-wet beautifully and offer additional fun application techniques you can’t achieve with tubes or pans. When Daniel Smith first made the primateks he didn’t add other pigments to them and they were more dull and very difficult to re-wet. That’s why the formulas changed. I agree it would be good for them to list all the other pigments in them. The important thing for me is the color and the other properties such as lightfastness. I hope some day they can find a way to make them affordable for everyone outside the USA and Canada so you can enjoy them the way I do. 😊
Great information - thank you!I think the lack of pigment information is poor, especially for a premium brand. I can see they would be great for landscapes. Thanks for the tips about sticks. I’ve not tried those.
Yes, I agree with your post, have the green apatite and love the granulation of this color,i always mix in my greens.
I agree with you, thanks for the info on the sticks, they are now on my list!
The amethyst gen, sparkles a little in the light.
it does - you can see that at the end
I agree with you, compare to your other sample they fall short. And I own Daniel Smith paints. Thank you so much for your review…Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year
Thanks for watching! And Happy New Year to you too
Making me laugh just before bed time - THANK YOU! Beautiful colors though. Love Your videos, and Your sense of humor. Greetings from Denmark ☺
thank you so much. Hope you slept well listening to the sounds of the drums…..
Haha, I do love your commentary Liz and your complete honesty on reviews. They do make quite an overblown deal in their marketing of these. Are the unmentioned added pigments the supposed “scandal” I ‘ve heard other RUclipsrs allude to in recent days? By rights, they really should list them. As you said, I would think they would need them for color consistency and I don’t think anyone would mind. I just ordered a couple tubes and a couple sticks the other day on the Black Friday sale just to see if they’re anything I’d care for. While I, too, prefer the larger tubes, I did order the smaller tubes and sticks where I could just to give them a try as the 15 ml tubes are quite pricey even on sale. . I’d forgotten that the amethyst had some sparkle and now wish I’d included that in my order after seeing your review. Sarah Burns had mentioned it in one of her videos a while back, but I’d forgotten. I ordered the hematite in a stick and will be curious to see if it behaves the same as in your experience. Thanks for another helpful review.
I hope you really enjoy them. I’d be interested to hear how the sticks are
Hey Liz! Better late than never, right? 😊 I’m honored to be a Daniel Smith Brand Ambassador and I have a few of these on my 18 color dot card. I love them for my pet portrait work, the granulation does half of the painting for me! I remember the controversy and have spoken directly with the owner about it. He said they do have to use stabilizer pigments to keep each tube consistent with the last, but that it’s their own proprietary mixture. So everyone has their own opinion on that! I love the company, they are more like a family than a brand and I’m honored to get to be part of that family! Anyways, I enjoyed watching you swatch this selection! You did a very thorough job as always! ❤
I love to hear how much you love the company - they seem to evoke strong feelings. I always thought there were extra pigments. ‘stabilising’ is a good description. I think not knowing what they are is hard, as many artists wish to avoid certain pigments. Glad you enjoyed the review and good luck with your continued ambassadorship.
Liz, I just thoroughly love learning from you! This video was so educational but also gave me a few good chuckles. Yes please review the other set, those colors looked very interesting and possibly more versatile. Thank you for sharing!
Will do!!
Not too long ago I was a newbie to watercolors and when I came across the DS primatek range I really did think they were made with 100% genuine minerals. I was searching for YT videos on the primatek range and then came across a thorough discussion of the mineralogist/ geologist who did their own tests… well you mentioned in the video their findings. I was rather surprised and avoided primatek paints for a while, until I caved and bought a palette of DS paints which contained green appetite genuine and serpentine genuine. Those two are beautiful. I do think DS should be more upfront to dispel any misconceptions.
yes, I do too. But is they do what you want at a price point you are happy with, then ignore the marketing hype and enjoy….
I’m not a dab hand with granulating paints but they are very useful for creating easy backgrounds.
@@shadowguard3578 that’s very true!
Been using DS primateks for a few years. To note- Rhodonite oxidises a little after a year or so, have found turns brownish, Amethyst is great as a mixer to neutralise various colours, Hematite is one of the best for granulation.... For landscapes one you didnt have is Green Appatite, its the best natural looking green I've ever come across
thank you for the information
Yes please to a comparison video Liz! Thanks & Cheers!
On it!
Hematite Genuine is my favourite Primatek. I love using it in urban sketching old stone buildings and boundary walls.
that’s a good tip!
I for one never misunderstood the words Genuine Minerals and stones to make the paint. Daniel Smith never stated it's the only ingredient coloring agent in the paint. Only that the ones used for Primatek are real and genuine. When I heard the controversy I thought it obserd because the Actual real Daniel Smith who founded the company actually tried using only the gems for color and it was lifeless, drab, weak and impossible to rewet. I know I bought the 1st stock of it before Mr Dan Smith sold out and retired. The new owner revamped it still using real gems in the formula but didn't disclose the orher pigment ingredients. Bottom line it's been misunderstood. Most people in the US knew and didn't take it that way. The claim that Daniel Smith company uses Genuine stones in the formula was not false. Because the ones used no matter the percentage is genuine!
I have to say I too assumed there was pigment plus the stones, so the controversy left me cold. But their marketing is not clear. it implies minerals are the chief pigment, which is not true, less than a few percent in some I understand. I believe they should be more transparent about what pigments are used. What I tried to address here, was are they nice colours and are they worth the price, rather than focus on the controversy.
I bought a tube of Sleeping Beauty Turquoise when first released. It became a solid brick tube after one year, so I cut the tube open and placed the crushed hardened lump into a dish and added water and gum arabic. After working with it, it became soft again, but that was too much trouble to rescue and I will not buy any primatek unless planning to use it up in a few weeks.
oh I’m sorry to hear that
You could have used it without adding gum arabic, when tubes dry out, they are essentially tube shaped pans
Yes there are additional pigments in these paints but each and every one does contain the actual mineral. The amethyst genuine is stunning
yes they contain the mineral and I have to say I always assumed there wasn’t much in there with plenty of other pigment, so the controversy left me cold. However I would like to understand what else is in there.
I tried out three of these
- Mayan blue is now one of the transparenr blues in my main palette
- green apatite genuine is a colour I use to supplement my Schmincke Shire supergranulators, a set that needs a dark valued green
- after using up all my hematite violet genuine, mixing it with other colours to make them granulate, I decided to switch to WN potters pink which did the same job at a better price
If you like the effects of these colours, it might be worth checking out the Schmincke supergranulators at some point. I'd recommend the five colour tundra set. The tundra colours are like a cheat code: everything comes out looking great.
but I think the Schmincke supergranulators are better. If you wanted to look at these, I'd recommend starting go with a five colour tundra set.
Thank you for all the information. I'm a potter's pink fan too!
Well, they're pretty, aren't they?! I love the purple, blue, and the green. I thought the Shadow colours were lovely, too. I'd love to see a video on those.
I have added it to my list!
Thanks, Liz. This was fun and informative.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Hematite and Mayan blue are amongst my favourite colours. Hematite mixes beautifully and is a great alternative when mars black overpowers a mix. Jadeite genuine is lovely and is interesting when used with cling film but you could probably get something similar with phtalo and mars black. Serpentine gen is another interesting one it’s an earthy green with reddish brown granulation but when it bumps another wet colour a very pushy bright almost acid green colour flows out of it. Dsmiths individual watercolour sticks are a more economical option for trying primateks and I’m a lot less nervous about using them than 5ml tubes but they only do a few in stick form.
that’s really useful information. Thank you!
Thank you, Liz! I was wondering what all the controversy was, for sure, but haven't heard much.
I do think the marketing has mislead people, intentionally or not I cannot say. it is always best to try them as objectively as possible. I am sure that they are the perfect colours for someone, but not for me
@LizChadertonArt I hope they get better at it, at least be honest. (Too optimistic? Lol)
These are very beautiful. Very granulating looks like loads of variation in one color. I've never tried DS. Maybe someday?? Would love you to do a review of the Japanese set
I like many of their paints, but these are not for me….
I wonder if the “gluey” tubes need a good mixing. I imagine those gemstone particles are fairly heavy and probably settle a lot in those tubes.
It’s strange that I’m just now considering this because I have a tube of the Blue Apatite Genuine and now that I see you using the term gluey, I’d say that describes this tube I have, and now I look forward to giving the tube a good squish squosh next time I’m in my studio and seeing if there is a difference.
Thank you for this video! You’ve given me a good chuckle and a good amount to think about as well! 🖤
I didn’t see the binder separating out, more that they was lots of binder present, so I’m not sure it’s a mixing issue
Love your sense of humor over these paints. Lovely, yes and I have a few but the marketing is a bit over the top!
just a little flowery! (and I used to work in marketing!)
Absolutely loved your review!
No nonsense take on , what is, in the end, basically, only paint. With no bells and whistles attached to help it to sell for the price of small house... almost. 😂
I like couple of paints I have from DS, but to me they are too expensive, even if they would consist entirely of ground rubies and emeralds.
🥰 I rather love the idea of rubies and emeralds in my paint box…
Hi, Liz -
I'm not a huge fan of these - let me just say that they sent you the 'best' colors. I have been buying larger tubes and recently bought Garnet, which is one of my favorite stones. It actually comes out more brownish than you'd expect. I have about 8 tubes and some are good and some are questionable. Not going to buy them any more exactly for the reason you mentioned - they are expensive and not much of the actual stone. Those descriptions are hilarious!
Glad they sent them to you. Thanks for all that you do!
LindaH
good to try, but they will not become a staple of my palette
Dear Liz, many thanks for the informative video! I really appreciate your testing, reviews of different materials (I was very grateful when I eventually had found found a channel that compared Hahnemühle's bamboo and sugarcane paper (and some more)!!) Many thanks for putting this much time to create these great helpful, in-depth videos! Now I have the following question that I couldn't find any answer on this by now (and my watercolor experience is not yet profound enough - I am still quite new to watercolor but I love exploring it more and more.): Has the WATER I use to paint with has a tremendous impact on the quality or behaviour of the paint(ing) ??? I thought using soft, still water poorly mineralized might be the best option, but if you use tap water or water which high amounts of calcium that might have an impact on the paints behaviour due to the composition of the paint itself? Just like the immediately visible effect of salt....Can I use demineralized water too? In case you know more about this topic I would be super grateful if you shared some information about this as well 🙏👍 Many thanks, wish you a lovely creative day and a wonderful holidays season with lots of happy&beautiful moments ✨️🤗 kind, colorful regards 🖌🎨
yes water will impact how your paints behave. water with a high mineral content encourages granulation in pigments, so if you like that effect then it is worth using hard water. Some people use distilled to help avoid it. contaminated water can encourage mold to grow in your paints, so that is also worth considering. Some people love using sea water for added minerals! To be honest it is a small impact and I would concentrate on enjoying the painting process. I use whatever I have to hand, whether it is tap, lake or bottled! but great question 😊
@LizChadertonArt Thank you sooo much for your quick reply!!! This now helps me a lot and I won't hesitate anymore which water I want to choose for my paintings! Actually, you confirmed what I only supposed could be the answer but I never had a true proof of it, yet, now that you gave me this explanation as a pro artist and this erases that huge question mark that was so on my mind! Again, thank you so much!! Reading this now was like amazing "first December, 1st Advent" "gift" to me and chances are big that I will try to include the characteristics of water to experiment for the painting procress, seeing if I'll notice a difference 🙂 Wish you a wonderful, great day ! Kind regards 😊🎨
@@JustMyCupOfColorfulCreativiTea look forward to all your experiments - do share the outcomes!
@@LizChadertonStudio Yes, sure! But that might take some time because I am working on other projects first and thought of planning the experiment a bit so that I can really have some sort of comparison that makes sense and shows if it makes a big/noticable difference using various kinds of water with different paints perhaps too and on different types of paper... so that seems to become an a bit more time consuming experiment. However, if it turns out successfully and if I manage creating a video of it, I'll do so :-) !! In case the filming doesn't turn out well, then at least I'll get back to you writing if there was something super special I discovered or if the conclusion was just to have had some curious, creative fun with it ;-)
@@JustMyCupOfColorfulCreativiTea thank you!
I have at least 15 of these, I do like them, but when I found out that Mayan blue was not light fast, that raised some questions in my mind because I would think that mineral pigments were among the most light fast. Thank you for bringing up the pigment make up of these paints! I really think Daniel Smith needs to include information on what’s actually in them.
Mineral pigments can be very lightfast, but not all minerals are used as pigments. I'm a mineral collector, and many of them have to be kept out of sunlight, otherwise they'll fade. Amethyst, aquamarine, citrine, aventurine, beryl, topaz, rose quartz, opal, sapphire, turquoise, among others.
The synthetic pigments added to Primatek paints to strengthen the colors are likely more lightfast than the gemstones themselves.
@@NelaDunato that’s a very good point! I make and sell mineral gemstone jewelry, and we are always told not to charge smoky courts and citrine in the sun because they will fade… I’m surprised I didn’t make that connection!😉
@@NelaDunato when I left that comment, I was thinking more of the earth pigments like yellow ochre burnt sienna Mars black, etc.… But yes, not the same thing :-)
agreed
that’s interesting
They are very interesting, I’m going to wait awhile, do some comparison work with the other watercolours that I have. All of your comparative work is very helpful and I’m looking forward to more.
it’s good to go into things with your eyes open
I guess for me, I'd be more worried about "pigment" inconsistencies in China based companies that a whole bunch of people seem to "love" because they are given tons of art supplies from them. DS does hype things up...but I certainly would feel a whole lot safer using these paints.
Understanding what’s in our materials is important, isn’t it? Unless you happen to have a chemistry laboratory, it all has to be taken on trust
They are beautiful, even though they are not made with only pure gemstones they are beautiful, but still not honest from their side to price them so expensive . I have only one apatite green genuine and it is beautiful.
I would like more openness about the pigments included, so we can make informed decisions
I love the granulating effect of the Amethist and Hematite, and I love the colour separation of Jadeite and Piemontite, but is it worse 40 bucks? I would love to see you do a whole video about those Shadow Black paint. Please paint a little something with them? It doesn't have to be a masterpiece, but I have those paints too and have no idea how to use them :) With love from your wacko eco-friendly mixed media artist from the Netherlands X
hee hee….love your description!
I don't think they would be so fabulous if they were made entirely fron minerals. Plus would cost a fortune, Beautiful paint
of course every batch would vary and they wouldn’t have much colour and be even more expensive. BUT the marketing blurb rather implies this is the situation. I have tried to judge the paints as paints independent of the hype or controversy
Beautiful color but the granulated effect , the advance of watercolor is you can manoeuvre the pigment , paints that have a own agenda on the paper , not for me , but beautiful colors 💫
indeed!
Thank you for this review. Some nice colours but I don't think I will be investing in these anytime soon. But yes, I could hear the drums loud and clear :)
…and the battle cries?
I love the mineral colors, some have some sparkles but they are expensive
indeed!
Would love to see a video on using the Japanese colors. I've seen others incorporating various Japanese colors and inks into their paintings and want to know if it's worth a purchase.
Will add to the list!
Yes, please, a full review
will try
Good idea trying salt too on swatched colours. Thanks
You’re welcome 😊
Primateks are my favorite of the DS line … no worries they have the bigger tubes.
i know, but in the UK the 6x15mlset is over £100! and some individual tubes are £25 plus….
Love your humor. Do they say anything about lightfastness. The stones themselves would probably be light fast, but depending on what/how much they mix in of other pigments this could change a lot. 😊
As I've already replied to another comment: "I'm a mineral collector, and many of them have to be kept out of sunlight, otherwise they'll fade. Amethyst, aquamarine, citrine, aventurine, beryl, topaz, rose quartz, opal, sapphire, turquoise, among others.
The synthetic pigments added to Primatek paints to strengthen the colors are likely more lightfast than the gemstones themselves."
this is such useful information
@@NelaDunato Oh this is interesting, I would have thought the other way around - when I look at the web-site of Kremer pigments, all the stone pigments are 8 out of 8. However, they don’t have Amethyst or Rhodonite so maybe they are different. However, what I did notice is, that most of the pigments made from ground stones, are so pale that they are nearly white. So it would really not make any sense to paint with them, unless you add some color.
@@martinanelsonartandpsychol6478 minerals that are commonly used as pigments are lightfast, but the vast majority of minerals are not traditionally used for painting. One main reason is as you've noticed, they're very weak pigments! Primatek is a gimmick.
@@martinanelsonartandpsychol6478 minerals that are commonly used as pigments are lightfast, but the vast majority of minerals are not traditionally used for painting. One main reason is as you've noticed, they're very weak pigments! Primatek is a gimmick.
Use the pretty colours if you enjoy them but basically it's false advertising. The colours are paint pigments not minerals. My son is a geologist and is going to give me a few mineral samples to play with. Do you think there is some PBk11 mixed into most of those colours?
no, I didn’t see evidence of PBk11
I have several primatek colors. I find them to be extremely interesting. All the colors I have are heavily granulating and add loads on interest. Serpentine genuine is my number 1 favorite green.
Also I have hematite and piemontite in the watercolor stick form as opposed to tubes, and I don’t get any sense of it being too binder heavy in that form. Also sticks can be a better value in terms of cost!
a few people have mentioned the sticks, so I plan to investigate
@ they are fun to use!
Thanks for the video! Now I have a better idea about these paints 😁
Glad I could help!
I have Green Apatite genuine which I love. It splits into hooker's green and sap green colours plus fine dark grey granules. It's become my go to green. I have bloodstone which I expected to be a very, very dark red but appears black to me, it does granulate beautifully though. I will buy more green apatite and might also get Serpentine but am not that likely to buy others, not least because I don't do that much watercolour painting and probably have enough supplies to last me a long time.
Ha, ha! I have a feeling I may have enough paint to open my own shop!!
Liz is keeping it real 💯 for us! 😂😂 Pounding of battle drums 🥁 🥁 🤣🤣 The paints are gorgeous enough to sell themselves. Methinks the hyperbole was for hyper profits $$ I was having de ja vu, too. I have the boku undo set. Now I see why. Would love to see you review the Boku Undo sumi paints.
It did make me chortle!!!
I bought this set for a fantastic price.
are you enjoying them?
….But they ARE expensive!
yup!
What kind of brush did you use?
it was an Etchr one, I think
I’ve done some test and granulation medium, dies and cheap watercolor will give you the same effect. But don’t lift as easily for the “heavy lifters “. They are so precious that I never use them, it’s the worst kind of paint 😅
oh no! Paint needs to be used!
Jadeite is a beautiful colour….Paul Wang uses it a lot
I will take a look
“Flowery language” indeed. 😂
indeed!
So, they're a little less than $40 US right now... thats around $6 a tube. They look interesting, and I'm sure they'd be fun to play with, but IMO if I don't have the pigment information they don't even come up to student grade. I would love to see if you could replicate these paints. 😊❤
I think they would come into their own for rocky landscapes, but I am not a landscape painter so I doubt I will replace them
Yes to the review of the Japanese paint.
thanks
I have most colors. Enjoy them.
good to hear that!
I feel the marketing for these is misleading. It strongly implies that the mineral is the primary ingredient in each paint. I base this not only the statements in the written materials. I attended a couple of online workshops with brand representatives, and there was a lot of time spent showing slides of the rocks, how they're chosen and prepared and so on, and absolutely nothing about the paints including pigments. I nonetheless had not assumed that these were pure mineral, but figured it to be the way you described it - mostly the gem, with a dash of other pigment(s) to intensify/standardize the hue. However, I know there are plenty of people who assumed it was only the gem, since that was what was listed on the tube and in the marketing, and thus considered these single pigment paints, and I can see why they would!
The microscopic slides posted by the geologist appeare to be the opposite - mostly a standard pigment like phthalho, with a sprinkling of mineral crystals. As disappointing as that was, it was the response from Daniel Smith that really turned me off. There was a written statement and interviews where the owner said things to the effect that of course there are other things in it, like the gum arabic! That's how paint is made! He never admitted that there were other pigments in the paints. The company never posted information about the pigments to answer the concerns of those who wanted to know for lightfastness or toxicity concerns. It was very disingenuous, to the point of being insulting by the suggestion that it was just a misunderstanding of how paint is made. I think DS understand that the mystique helps sell the paint, and justifies its price tag. Most disappointingly, that response worked, after a brief furor people pretty much let it go.
I think what the paints actually are is more like the colour shifting and granulating paints that are popular now, as well as the kind of thing you compared them with, paints that have graphite or ink added for more muted colours. They're lovely, and you can get some really cool effects with them, but that likely has very little to do with rocks from the Amazon or Alaska, and more to do with clever mixes of standard pigments.
I think your analysis is spot on!
I’ve a few but rarely use them. The green and blue apatite are the two I do like but the rest sit in the drawer. I won’t be buying more
…me neither….
Use the pretty colours if you enjoy them but basically it's false advertising. The colours are paint pigments not minerals. My son is a geologist and is going to give me a few mineral samples to play with.
Yes, it's obviously just a gimmick. Imo, for something to qualify as student grade at the bare minimum, it has to have the pigment information. I'm a little sad about that Mayan blue, I didn't realize it was in the same group. 😮
@ if you enjoy the colour then buy it but don't buy because it's going to ease your chakra 🤣
exactly!
What does jewelry grade mean? Raw gemstones and semiprecious gemstones are graded according to transparency, saturation of color, and lack of inclusions. AAA is flawless and the most expensive. D is the lowest grade. Chevron amethyst, purple mixed with white, is not Grade A, more like Grade D. Grade D is seldom used for jewelry, in my experience. Why would anyone waste a stone valuable enough for jewelry by grinding it into a pigment? I don't believe it. I think stones rejected for jewelry would be good enough. There's a Japanese company making mica ink, if you want more minerals! I've read the ancient Egyptians used ground lapis lazuli for sacred art. Lapis was prized in Egypt.
yes, the marketing puff needs to be backed by useful information such as what is actually used
What do I think ? Hmmm , I think that you are going to get fewer paints to review hahahhahhaha :)
😊 I hope it was a fair and honest review
I don't like these paints at all, or the price.
there are so. any alternatives - which brand do you prefer?
@LizChadertonArt I am liking the Roman Szmal ones that I have very much Liz.
@@Granny9054 That's one brand I haven't tried!
@LizChadertonArt Liz these are easy to wet, quite a few are granulating and they are reasonably priced. There are quite a few reviews of the Aquarius colours that they make. One I liked was done by Sketches.n.Scrubs. She mentions pigment numbers and transparency, all with an enjoyable style that I love in your videos too. Cheers from Australia 🇦🇺
@@Granny9054 they are on my radar already….so much choice! I like @sketches.n.scrubs too
Great review! It might sound funny, but I actually like the imaginative descriptions of the colors! 😄 The D.S. paints are expensive, but 6 months ago, I bought a little box of dot card samples of 36 colors for just about $12 (U.S. price). The box says "Daniel Smith Extra Fine Mineral Marvels". I really love the granulation, and some paints do sparkle nicely! 💖
It's a nice range of colors, minus yellow, orange, and red (lots of rusty browns). 🤎
that sounds a fun thing to experiment with