The Truth About Tonewood: 52 Years of Experience | w. Roger Sadowsky
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- Опубликовано: 21 июн 2024
- Join Roger Sadowsky, founder of Sadowsky Guitars, as he explores the significant influence of wood on the sound of solidbody instruments. Drawing on his 52 years of experience, Roger argues against the common belief that wood has no effect on the sound of electric guitars and basses. He explains how different types of wood, particularly in the fretboard, affect the tonal quality and playability of an instrument. Whether you prefer the bright, tight sound of a maple fretboard or the warm, sweet tones of rosewood, Roger provides valuable insights to help you understand how wood choice shapes the voice of your instrument. Roger shares anecdotes from his extensive career, including how fingerboard materials have solved specific tonal problems for top session players. He emphasises that the differences are more about what the player feels and hears than what the audience perceives, and how this affects the player's touch and style. This video is a must for anyone interested in the nuances of guitar and bass construction. Tune in to explore the world of wood and sound with one of the most respected luthiers in the business.
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best insight: it doesn't matter for the audience, but esp. for the player.
Then doesn't matter.
I don't have 50yrs of experience, but what Roger kindly shares is what I can hear too.
What matters the most is what the player hears, more than what others do. Great phrase and very true! The relationship with the instrument brings out emotions and indeed the player feels what is playing more deeply ❤
Thank you for sharing this with us.😎👍✨
Thank you Mr. Sadowsky!!
Very informative, thanks Roger! 😍
Thanks, Roger!
Very nicely presented, Roger!
I've seen too many beginners that insist that they can't hear any differences in any type of bodies or fretboards. I believe that they can't. The problem arises when they flame anyone who actually has experience and good ears.
I also agree with the point that the sonic differences and 'feel' of the instrument make a huge difference in touch, and how an experienced musician will play. Someone at the back of the room may not be able to distinguish alder from swamp ash, but they certainly should be able to tell differences in the players' approach.
At 4:10.. bingo! It doesn’t matter if the listener can’t tell the difference, if the player can and he’s not bonding with the instrument it can affect his playing. Thank you Mr. Sadowsky.
Very interesting video, thank you for the presentation.
I like your ending takeaway "it's what the player hears..." so true.
thanks Roger good to see you, looking good!
Terrific, Roger - agree 100%. I know you're mainly addressing bass guitars but as a guitar player I came to the same conclusions many years ago. My '68 Custom Ebony board, FGN Roland '81 Strat w Maple board and my preference these last few years for Strats with Rosewood have made it all pretty clear to me in the studio. They all have a place - no 'favourites' per se - it comes down to the track, really. Thanks for the clear overview - I guess the debates will continue.
Firstly, let me express my solidarity to the bass community and my gratitude to Mr. Sadowsky for sharing this information. This is truly very valuable to us! However, I would also like to express my opinion. At some point in my life I wanted to experiment with basses, electronics, finishes, pickups and so on. I made several experimental versions, with different woods, with different electronics, including moving pickups, to see from my own experience whether the position of the pickups makes a difference. And this is my opinion.
If we do not consider Sadowsky guitars, but look in general, then in electric instruments there are much more variables that affect the final sound - electronics, pickups, height of pickups, position of pickups, type of fastening of the neck to the body, material and type of bridge, and so on. In acoustic instruments, the main sounding element is the body of the guitar, the shape of the guitar body, the position of the sound hole, and of course the material of the guitar - the type of wood.
Mr. Sadowsky makes a lot of guitars with constant elements - same scale, strings, pickups, electronics, bass tuning, pickup position. And, of course, Mr. Sadowsky is very good at hearing the difference between types of wood and how they affect the sound.
But if we look at the whole situation, the effect of wood type on the sound of bass guitars is not as dramatic as the effect of electronics, string type and material, pickup position, pickup type, and, perhaps, the way the neck is attached to the body. There have only been a few researches on the effect of wood on the sound of electric guitars, so little is known about the science.
But I absolutely agree with Mr. Sadowsky - first of all, the sound of a bass guitar is formed by the hands of the musician, and in conditions of stable production of musical instruments with identical pickups and electronics, different types of wood will, of course, affect the sound. But my opinion is that the wood does not have such a dramatic effect on the sound as electronics.
I started playing bass in '67 and have owned many brands and configurations. When I bought a Sadowsky in 2006 I stopped trying other brands and have picked up snippets from Roger over the years and in the Talkbass forum from him. Great to see the recent collection of videos where you can get all the true facts in one place. There's so much crap on RUclips now. Trust this bloke.
Amen something I have said for years and years
Thanks for your sage advice.
Going back to '79, when I bought my very first real quality guitar, LP Gold Top (brand new '78), I chose it after playing it a while and listening to it - not having plugged it in AT ALL the whole time. Not kidding. Once I found one that felt good, I (uncomfortably) pressed my ear down on the shoulder and listened to the (wait for it) GUITAR. Not the pickups. not the tone knobs. The wood. The instrument.
When I found one where all the notes rang even and true, and chords were clear and sounded all the notes together with sounding mushed or mixed, then I checked the neck (3-piece maple [loved it]) and made sure everything else was in order, I ended up with one of my favorite guitars I've ever owned. Great tone, Even note balance. Enjoyable sustain.............
Every guitar or bass I've ever bought or built since then had to pass that test before I have ever considered anything about the electronics.
The sparky stuff has massive affect on the output sound, for sure. But you have to start with the instrument first. IT has to be right first.
I won't do it any other way. 🙂
You are too humble, sir. As the proud owner of a Sadowsky Metroexpress, I take your words as gospel. And I 100% agree with your assertions about the fingerboard tones.
maple: brighter & tighter
rosewood: sweeter & warmer
ebony: more immediate response & stronger fundamental
(the note blooms shortly /after/ striking with maple & rosewood fingerboards.)
Seasoned guitarist that are musicians know this. People that deny it just want it to be false. The difference between maple and rosewood is very noticeable. Mahogany and Ash are completely different when used in a body. A maple stave compared to a mahogany stave will make the neck sound different. I like Maple, Ebony, Alder, Swamp Ash, and Mahogany. These are the woods that get the sounds that I like. Poplar is horrible. Some cuts of Mahogany used in a body will create a hollow sounding bloom in the body which I can't stand. I like a body that mutes the mids and the bottom and has a ton of mids and sustain. Thank you for making this video. Mahogany, Alder and Swamp ash all accomplish this to different degrees. Mahogany mutes the mids and overall resonance most it attenuates the sound best and sounds super sweet and balanced. Alder has a growl to it and is more open sounding with more volume than Mahogany. Swamp Ash cuts and has good balance across the frequencies and it's a little honky and has a lot of snap and attack.
The sound of a string vibrating causing pressure waves in the air that we can hear is different from the sound that is produced by a conductive material creating eddy currents in an inductor (electromagnetic pickups) sent through a length of cable and then amplified, filtered, amplified again and finally transduced through a speaker. While both of these are sounds, they are derived from entirely different processes that don’t have very much at all to do with each other.
Amen Roger!
Second comment;
I remember the first time I heard the name; "Roger Sadowsky". It was in early '82. I was working as a tech for a (then) up-and-coming guitarist no one had yet heard of.
He got connected with a similarly rising singer/songwriter. As part of the record deal, some new gear was purchased. One, a 50's gold top Les Paul. I remember being told it was a '52 but it was certainly a few years after that. I believe it was purchased at Styvesant Music on 48th St. (I could be not remembering that part correctly). It had humbuckers, and the bridge/tailpiece was original. Big, chunky neck and sounded great. But; it somehow had super-tiny frets! We joked they must be banjo frets! So it needed refretting and complete set-up. This is the part where Mr. Sadowsky comes into the picture. When we got the guitar back, it couldn't have been better. It really was a gem.
And though I, personally, never had need of further business with Mr. Sadowsky, his was a name in the industry I never forgot, and mentioned often.
I'm with ya Roger. I once built myself a solid body LP style with an ebony fretboard. I played one gig with it and absolutely hated it. Replaced it with Indian rosewood, loved it, played the guitar for years. Ever since I always use rosewood on electric guitars. On acoustic guitars I think it's too much, so there I use ebony or even better African blackwood. Anyway, I've been telling people for many years that it's pretty much all about the fretboard wood, and practically nobody believes me. Maybe if I tell them you said so too, they will!
I think everything adds up together. The wood, bridge type, pickups, strings, etc. If you play long enough you’ll find the combination you like that feels and sounds good to you.
Tell 'em, Roger! ❤
10/10 agree, I like the look of rosewood and that's what my first bass was, but after playing more basses I have grown to like the sound of maple. I've heard maple described as kinda scooped too
So the player hears the difference, so it's an acoustical/feel change. The audience/studio will not notice. Agee's with what I've always thought, I mainly play at low volume and the acoustic sound can be heard by me. But when I record I don't notice it on playback. Someone who makes sense, thank you.
Roger do you find this difference to be less given our recent use of roasted woods?
This really makes sense and it's very individual to the person and the instrument even though in general this is all right
I´ve had an Alembic Europa 5 for many years. Ebony fingerboard, multi laminate neck through of maple and purleheart, mahogany body wings with maple top. Lovely bass! Some years ago I bought another Alembic. Same pickups and electronics, same construction, and I was expecting it to sound the same as the Europa. But it didn´t. It had a much brighter sound. I found this strange since it was the same bass. But after some investigations I found out that it had maple body wings instead of mahogany. And it made a lot of difference!
It must be said that the pickups on Alembic are a bit microphonic and are screwed tight to the body without any springs, and thus make a more solid connection with the body.
My sentiments exactly as a player
Bass in particular is sensitive to tonewood. IMO the bass midrange is in the same resonant frequencies as are predominant in the woods. Roger's observations are very similar to my own. The better the bridge, as well, the better the relationship between strings and wood. This is why the Leo Kwan Badass bridge became the archetype replacement bridge. Heavy brass plate and heavy duty saddles. Don't overlook the composition of the saddles either. Brass seems to give me more of that growl from the wood than steel.
This topic will never be settled. There could be two maple fingerboards out there that sound more different than a maple and a rosewood one by comparison; two exactly the same J basses by design might sound and feel completely different due to the properties of the wood. When we say wood makes a difference, I've for some time believed it's the material's density, moisture content and make-up, rather than the differences being due to species of wood. I do agree that the key factor that matters is how the player perceives the instrument!
I'd say you can hear a bigger difference between body woods with a maple fretboard. Ash always sounds more firm and compressed to me than alder. Alder sounds like it has more lower mids and rounder bass and treble. I never could understand people saying it doesn't make a difference. To me it makes the most difference because the pickups no matter how they're wound will amplify natural frequencies of the bass. Also I think, with and without the graphite neck reinforcements, a huge difference in tone can be heard. There is a lot more of attack and faster response with a graphite rod, makes the bass sound much more modern. My favourite setup is swamp ash body and a rosewood neck, I feel it gives a nice tight tone and fits into most situations. Just my opinion.
Thank You for sharing your life long luthier experiences. The bass community values your insights & appreciates your dedication. ❤
I believe the more important point is good guitars sound good acoustically and they resonate. From switching necks on Stratocaters I have also noticed that rosewood and maple boards have fairly significant impact on overall tone. Roasted Maple also brings more brightness to the table. I think any of us that have made partscasters can agree on these things, though I have a couple of 9lbs Strats from the 70's that sound amazing.The amplifier is still #1 as far as tone goes though. Even Stevie Ray couldnt make a Deluxe Reverb sound like a Marshall or a VOX or an Orange.
What the player *feels* is what matters. I don't think you'll ever hear a difference playing with a band or on a recording that you couldn't do with EQ. Feeling is everything to the player and their performance.
How does the guitar ring on or resonate? That will be reproduced by the pick up. I’ve played dead sounding guitars, they should be avoided. Otherwise the amp with all the buttons give you different sounds. Pickups are just magnets and wire. A magnet is just a magnet any way you look at it.
Tonewood matters for those who can actually hear the difference.
Great explanation. Thanks for what you have done for the bass community.
Well said sir!
It's all about the wood, Each piece has natural frequencies that either excite the strings via sympathetic vibration, amplifying and prolonging the strings vibrations or the wood dampens the vibrations and mutes the strings. This is what Paul Reed Smith refers to when he says a good guitar rings for 45 seconds and a bad guitar for 15. Wood of the same species varies from tree to tree. You need to test each piece acoustically.
This is simply a physical phenomenon, called sympathetic resonance. This is how acoustic guitars work, but it also applies to electric guitars. To a certainly smaller extent, but not insignificant.
What’s the song on the outro?!
If I listen carefully I can tell the difference between my alder and my swamp ash bass.
It makes no difference however when I have 3 layers of distortion on, in a dodgy venue with a crappy PA and a crackhead behind the console, which is all I seem to play these days it seems (shocking for crust punk/hardcore, I know)
Interesting and what is said might be correct. However a demonstration using measuring tools and sound samples is what is needed to convince me. Demonstrate how an alder body sounds different to a poplar one, a maple fingerboard sounds different to a rosewood one all other things being equal for example.
Do your own work. It's not hard.
@@jonathonmcmillan9410it costs money and time. I think it’s much more appropriate for the salesman to prove their wares right?
What is being described sounds like it could be easily tested with an oscilloscope. I'm more inclined to think wood has an effect on bass than guitar because the lower frequencies are closer to the natural resonance of the woods. That said, an EQ can sculpt the sound way more than having multiple basses so maybe only the sustain is the relevant quality here?
The lower frequencies travel much more slowly through the wood than higher frequencies. This is why bassists are all about the woods, and guitarists are all about the signal processing.
The best electronic measurement tools can't detect the subtleties the human ear and brain can. That's why this will always be a subjective discussion.
For those with ears to hear - I don't think this a very controversial take, or news at all. But there does seem to be a rejection of the reality of tonewoods and apparently this needs addressing. I will say however that body wood and neck wood has a bit more subtle of an impact on sound.
Finally a no nonsense video, no unboxing or a lot of BS. Roger just tells it like it is! Thanks Roger!
Yes Roger. All of those things can make a difference. I think the biggest reason for the disparity in this argument is the individual human ear. We are not born knowing the difference between the sound of a plate hitting the floor and a set of keys hitting the floor. We had to learn that. 52 years of listening has educated your ear to a much higher level than musician who has been playing for a comparatively short while. My musical mantra is "All you hear is not all there is to hear". When someone tells tells me they can't hear the difference, I tell them "You mean you can't hear the difference yet."
I am blown away by your mantra! That is great! I am going to remember that one.
It’s true, the ear is just the transducer of the ear-brain system. When the brain is lacking, the hearing has more learning to do. This is the entire fundamental concept behind audio engineering, to name just one extremely critical field within the music industry.
Tl;dr: Tonewood isn't perceived with your ears, it's perceived with your heart.
As I always say, people who think wood doesn't matter fall into one of these two categories:
1. Lacking experience
2. Simply cannot hear the difference (again lack of experience with sound analysis, or just simply lacking an ear or hearing skills)
That´s what we need. Experience! I´m tired of people saying wood won´t matter but it does. And 4:00 is the most important point!
ROGER IS ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!
Man, I love this video Mr. Sadowsky!!!
I wonder if the material of the neck in addition to the fingerboard also makes a difference
Of course it does
Thank you for a humble and balanced opinion shared.
I agree in part. In my opinion you're 100% right about the boards. However, it's been my experience as a player/builder that the bodywood has a significant effect on the sound as well. While I hear a tremendous difference between bodywood species, I've always felt that the single most important characteristic of a body is its overall resonance. For example: as much as I love the sound of Alder or Mahogany, I'd pick a highly resonant piece of Ash over a more "normally" resonant piece of the other two. Anyway, that's what my ears tell me after 35 or 40 years of playing.
P.S. your basses ROCK!! They're awesome axes, thanks.
Some random everyday person on youtube: does blind soundtests, swaps parts, gives frequency charts
Gutar brands with big budgets: umm believe us cause we say so
I used to change strings every 3 days because they would start to sound dull after playing them for 3 days ( only an hour a day ). So WTF are you people talking about. Just some sweat on the strings makes a difference after a few days. Even that Glen dude in string tests said how bad some expensive strings sounded then in the following video proceeds to say how nothing on a guitar makes a difference ( WTF ). Everything makes some difference. The problem is most of you are deaf and in the mix some things make a lot of difference and some very little, but everything makes a difference. Just changing picks while playing will produce different sounds which anybody can hear while playing, but probably not in the mix.
In order of importance, sure just work it backwards, speakers, amp, guitar, guitar parts, etc.... which usually makes the most difference
And by the way Sadowsky has swapped probably a 1000+ body parts more than some stupid youtuber hunting for clicks
He hand makes some of the fines instruments in the world - you don't. Unlike you, he does and has done more than just "say so".
@@cooljp1531 still just word of mouth
@@deanallen927 You don't have to be a chef to know when the eggs are overcooked
@@ileutur6863 Fine - go eat your guitar.
I was A scension player for 52 years I agree with you young people have to trust the gray hair
I've yet to see anyone pick them out in a blind test.
In my experience, tone is really for the player, not necessarily for the listener. I've played some basses that "feel" laid back, some that "feel" more alive and immediate. I've no doubt the physical properties of the materials are a big part of the difference.
Saying that, I honestly don't know if I could pick out a maple board from a rosewood board if I was playing blindfolded.
"Blind tests are flawed"!!!
Anyone can see, sorry hear, that gold-cables sound "warmer" than silver-cables!!
Yes there are differences.after about 40 guitars "Mahogany" Is my choice of wood and a Rosewood fretboard. But hey as to talk about such things with an nay sayer will be all the same as to talk food and drink with an Hill Billy.
Of course.
Okay, so do the thing that nobody has yet done and measure the tonal differences of the woods and show them. Then do the other thing that nobody has yet done and blindfold test several independant players and listeners
YOU should do that...
@@italoop7850 Am I the person making claims about the effects of different woods on what anyone can hear, especially when a solid bodied guitar with pickups is amplified? So who is responsible for proving that it even exists?
Warmoth has tons of videos along these lines.
Jim Lill
@@lordgraga guessing they proved themselves right. shock!
I am really impressed with Roger's ability to explain with his knowledge the differences. I am now a subscriber. Was wondering if the Precision style body sounds different than the Jazz style body if pickups and wood are the same? Only difference is the shape of the body.
I don’t think anyone is claiming outright that wood in solidbody instruments has zero effect on sound. I think the claim is that the effect is negligible compared to that of the strings and the electronics. Where wood, and/or build method, can most affect the sound is in sustain and ‘aliveness’. For example, a neck joint that is less than top-notch will reduce both of those qualities. And a hard maple neck will preserve a brighter tone than a neck made of more absorbent wood. Body wood is probably the least important part of the overall tone of the instrument.
Correct, tone wood has barely any meaning for solid bodies as almost 95% of the tone comes from electronics, even more so for active instruments and electric guitars with distortion. The biggest difference in tone you'll get is from Pots, pickups, and especially pickup placement (example, 60s vs 70s jazz basses)
Thanks for Sharing 🎶🎵🎸
I'm convinced that anyone who really believes that fretboard wood doesn't make a difference in tone and feel is probably suffering from significant hearing loss.
Or is just a contrarian.
Cool, listen to them blindfolded and pick which is which. I'll wait.
@@alittlebitgonethat has been done many times, troll.
Great words, I have one of your sweet basses. Great quality
It does not affect the tone? Guess they never played a '78 Jazz Bass with rosewood and maple fingerboards. 😂
👍👍👏👏🙏🙏
I agree !
So, if no one can feel it it doesn't matter. Let's be honest.
"I feel very strongly....".
OK, that proves it, case closed.
But you left off: "... after 52 years of experience (I feel very strongly) ..." This isn't a gut feeling.
after 52 years making great guitars seems that his feeling is way more important than your comment.
@@toliskoskinasnah, he has too much at stake in the myth of tonewood.
He makes some of the world's finest instruments by hand. You're right, case closed.
Every other company agrees with him. So, yes.
❤👌👌👌
Feelings vs. science
👍👌
100% Rosewood oils dampen most.
👍👌😎
You forgot about players should can play. There is no difference between wood if you can't play bass.
of course different woods affect the tone of the bass! and we all also know that different woods has no effect on the tone of electric guitars!
Yep
Just compare an aluminium guitar with a wooden guitar and you'll here a very stark difference. The strings interact with the vibration of the body and that has an effect on the signal the pickups "pick up"... Is this something to fetishize about? No, but this man is still right.
Blind test it
Audiologists will tell you that no one has ever heard the sound of their own voice, because the sound is colored by the bones of the skull. If you listen to a recording of your voice the sound is distorted and colored by the recording and playback equipment. So the tonewood debate is settled. The reason some people can’t hear the difference between maple and mahogany is the very thick bones of their skull.
Tone is stored in the balls
Blind test or it didn't happen 🙄
In my opinion, this video is the end of that discussion.
Amen to that! 😀
The video that ended this discussion was Jim Lill's.
Lmfao no
Cognitive bias, for the win.
pffft what would this boomer grandpa know, just because he worked on thousands of actual instruments, i'll go take my advice from that cool young dude who strapped some strings to his bench and therefore scientificly made proof. This guy sounds like that other grandpa from prs or whatever
It's funny to sift through a decade of know-it-alls with their home-brewed sham science experiments and pronouncements. They usually all end their videos by insulting the viewers intelligence, "if you don't believe me you're stupid". And here's the real deal guy saying "here's what I've heard with my ears, but make your own decision". Well, give me the real deal 24/7 over the low life RUclips influencer. Thank sir, for sharing your expertise.
No, it doesn't.