Just to clarify for Stat Priority: 1 Agility > 1 Attack Power = 1 Strength, but: 2 Attack Power > 1 Agility In Classic WoW 24 Attack Power is about the same or slightly better than 13 Agility - but now since we have Poison AP scaling, Attack Power should be even better, but by how much - I don't know for sure. My own calculation is 1 Agility is about 1.5 Attack Power and I run with that.
Excellent video, thanks for all the concise but detailed info. I ran BFD with a Mutilate combat build last night and while the damage was comparable to the typical Saber build, the energy economy felt so bad and clunky without relentless strikes.
Been using a full combat build with swords, imp sprint, and reposte and haven't had an issue with rogues using daggers and trying to bsckstab their way out of between the eyes stun spam. That, and the imp sprint + will of the forsaken = can't catch me. And the 50% chance to silence with kick has left many Alliance casters ... speechless 😊
Ty for this guide. Is it recommended to go for sword main hand and fast off hand dagger, or can i go both dagger? I've heard Sword offers more damage to Sinister/Saber
You shouldn't apply Poisons if you have Deadly Brew Rune - the rune will do everything for you. Wild Strike, Poisons and Sharpening Stones are all counted as a type of the same Enchant. That's why they overwrite each other.
Hahahaha, well... I'm not really an Alliance player. I love playing both factions and I keep thinking to myself that I made a mistake playing Alliance, I want my Trolls and Tauren :(
You just blew my mind- I didn't know opportunity gave u dmg increase with mutilate if u hit from behind- that's my fav build thank u for showing me this. That's like a neat hidden secret
even with that saber slash still better both you deal good damage 40 energy and bleed. some mobs in bfd are elementals that we can't stack poison on mobs so we lost %20 damage buff on mutilate
@@Mengeneful I mean true, that why I will say 100% of the time that Saber Slash is the best build, but I somehow find Mutilate to be the most fun one :D
Uhhh, with raid Talents I prefer Mutiltate build, but that's probably due to a fact that I have a bis dagger. Sword keeps eluding me from the 3rd BFD boss even though everyone has it. For mob farming I go with Riposte build. 5% hit, 5% parry, improved Sinister Strike, 3% dodge and Saber Slash.
Rupture is a decent finisher, but Envenom offers more. Rupture's base damage + Bleed buff have slightly bigger raw damage than Envenom, but Envenom can Crit so you need to add that into the equation + the envenom buff to massively increase the chance to apply poisons.
My DPS went up after I started keeping better Rupture uptime, specially with a Druid in the party, so for me having Rupture uptime is more important than Envenom. SnD, Rupture and then the occasional Envenom. Envenom doesn’t really do a ton of damage and Deadly Poison is the biggest dps gain out of it which is capped at 5 stacks.
You can definitely do that now, especially since they confirmed that Tooltip was just wrongly written. This video was made before they made and update for Saber Slash. Also it's kinda of a "high tech" for average Classic player :D
Hi just wanted to know your thoughts on the blackfathom ritual dagger with its 1.2 speed over other oh options? And do you run sharpening stone on both weapons over poison if no WF
If no WF, then both Sharepning Stones on weapons - Deadly Brew does the Poison thing. 1.2 Dagger is okay, I don't think it's the best. But no once cay for certain what is the best off hand currenlty, we have no simulations.
09:55 dude, this is on a second monitor while I'm leveling in Ashenvale as 21. I keep getting Vietnam flashback syndrome. EDIT: From the "Stealth" audio effect.
Been playing the back stab PvP spec in both PvP and pve and I’ve had a lot of success with it, but I use slaughter only in pve and use pistol shot for PvP with shadow strike but shiv is also really good if you have a fast offhand to guarantee the crippling in bgs to help peal for your fc
assassination spec is better for PVE saber envenom deadly brew use bleeds if you have a feral druid and you will top DPS. i see a lot of backstab rogues do low dmg in pve, but it’s def great in pvp!
@@moisescott4028 Saber Slash does more damage for sure in PvE, but those bosses roll down just by following mechanics - that's why I recommend going build which is the most fun to you :D
If you have Deadly Brew Rune and you are using it, you don't need to apply any Poison and you'll have both Instant and Deadly Poison online. If you are playing a Backstab build, you aren't running Deadly Brew Rune so you need to apply Poison, but if you have a Druid in your Party - his Wild Strikes Buff interferes with Poison and Wild Strike is better than a Poison, so just don't apply Poison then. (You can't have them both up at the same time on one weapon, you can't have Sharpening Stone and a Poison at the same time, it goes like that.)
I personally don't use it in Mutilate and Saber Slash builds,, since I believe Envenom is a bit better - but you can use it instead of Envenom, just your damage output will probably be slightly worse. However I use Rupture in Backstab build.
You are my go to content creator for everything rogue, thanks for the great content. I got the offhand dagger from Akumai and was wondering if I can play backstab or muti if I get the serrakis dagger or are those builds too inferior to saber slash. Saber slash is crazy good but kinda boring, want to try something different.
I don't put Poison on offhand, I sharpen my Weapon. Druid Wild Strikes only applies on the Main Hand. I have Deadly Brew Rune so I don't need to apply a single Poison.
I’m new to rouge and kind of WoW classic in general, how do you go about getting so many backstabs on an enemy player/mob if they’re always facing you? Sounds more fun to me esp for PVP but it Seems a lot easier to use saber slash or mutilate in scenarios where they are fighting you head on.
When you have Crippling Poison, they will be slower than you - so you can use your movement speed advantage to find their back. It's literally a mini game :D Even when using Saber Slash or Mutilate you want to do that, since attacks from the back can't be Parried or Dodged.
Yeah does seem fun actually lol but just regular mobs/trash mobs in a 1v1 scenario can’t really get behind right?. I’m just leveling right now so using saber slash since it’s more reliable
I just started playing rogue and I'm confused about if I should play double daggers or sword + dagger. I feel bad about needing on multiple weapons in raid :/
On the PvE build why 2 points in Murder instead of 2 in Remoreseless attacks? I feel that Remorseless attacks is way more useful than the 2% at this point of the game. Also, do you feel that the hit % provided by Precision on the Combat tree is not missed (that was not intentional lol)?
You are spending way to many talent points to gain the hit %, just going for Assassination tree is a DPS upgrade. Numbers don't lie :D 2 points in Murder give 2% increased damage, it will add up during the whole fight and it will out weight 40% increased chance to apply a Combo Point after a Finisher. Also sorry for not answering sooner, I didn't get a notification.
Depends on what are you playing against. Humans are good against other Stealth classes, Dwarves remove Bleeds, Gnomes have the Escape Artist to remove Roots which might be the best overall Racial ability for PvP Rogues. Night Elves have the highest base Agility.
I believe that you start the quest in Orgrimmar - The Cleft of Shadow. If you are asking about Deadly Brew Rune, you get a message in the mail at level 20 - which tells you to go in Silverpine Forest.
Why not take opportunity instead of imp sinister strike. Since we are using saber over sinister strike seems like the two points are wasted on Imp sinister. We gain dmg from opportunity with garote....am I missing something?
Saber Slash benefits from all the Sinister Strike Talents - so Improved Sinister Strike talent reduces the cost of Sinister Strike and Saber Slash by 5 energy.
im beginner playing rogue and still use both of sword,am i should change with dagger ? and does the slaber slash build rotation are not dont use synister strike bro mark ?
For Sabre Slash you should use a sword in MH (ideally slow weapon with 2.5 or 2.6 or higher swing time) and for OH you just want a fast weapon with good stats and usually Daggers fit that category perfectly.
Great work, thanks a lot! For the saber slash PVE build: What about 3 points in Lethality vs 3 points in Ruthlessness. +18% on saber slash vs 60% on adding one combo point. Former seems better than latter?
Thank you! Lethality only increases the critical strike damage of your Saber Slash upfront damage. It's bleed can't critically hit. Our critical chance currently is like 16% against level 25 targets (even less on higher level targets), so we don't benefit as much from Lethality as we will in later stages. I would definitely say that atm Ruthlessness is better.
@@Markonicus Makes a lot of sense, thanks! BTW: do you have a way of estimating the DPS gain of 60% on adding one combo point from Lethality? I.e.: Maybe what is the DPS value of 1 combo point?
@@VincentCohen-AddadViallat I don't have anything exact. But it definitely depends on a fight, for example let's say the boss lasts for 2 minutes or something, you'll get 1 full finisher just from Ruthlessness talent. It's hard to quantify it because I don't know how to exactly calculate how much is it going to affect your S&D uptime.
(speaking for rogues) It's insanely unbalanced how easier and faster it is for Horde to get very good gear than for alliance. They even have bis items we just cannot have. 1 or 2 items ok.. but that much. Alliance can always get better gear by grinding bfd, but majority of the gameplay of sod is before getting bis.
I agree, Horde definitely has it easier - especially with the location of the raid etc.. Our time to shine will come eventually, so don't worry about it too much :D
They do two different things. SnD gives you increased attack speed, Wild strikes gives a chance to proc extra attacks. You have to avoid putting poison/sharpening stone on your Mainhand if you wanna get wild strikes, tho.
It does now after the weeklies reset - I thought the tooltip was correct, but the value was off. You can definitely swing in some Sinisters when at 3 stacks of Saber Slash.
@@Markonicus ofc u didnt lose! When horde sees a premade they stay afk hahaha hows rogue tank? Looks good for me but the runes are a pain in the ass so i dont wanna take them till 40 haha if u se mee next time in bg /salute my char Cocasterol :) gl!
@@soslanbaskaev Cocasterol lmao, I'll try to remember that! Tanking seems awesome as a Rogue, just the problem are the Adds/Dungeon since we have no AoE. For Solo Target Bosses thooooo, it's super good - Agroo is through the roof.
I have cruel barb, meteor shard, and revered warsong rep dagger and sword, what would you recommend for 1:pvp daggers build which one in MH and which one in OH and 2:pve saber slash build for my MH OH set up
I also have 2x cruel barbs on my orc rogue and I'm thinking if they could be better against Cruel Barb + meteor shard. But I feel like 2.8 on OH is triggering poisons too slow. +12 ap tho :( . I guess on human rogue it could be better with swords specialization
no offence but you are noob at rogue if you don't know that 2.8 speed OH is bad. especially with deadly brew you have both IP and DP relying on your OH speed.@@Rastendhos
no offence but u are a noob if u didnt know that u dont need posions on weapons to trigger deadly posions, deadly brew fix that for u... going nothing mainhand and sharpening stone OF.@@Kimbo-95
@@Rastendhos Definitely going for faster weapon in the off hand is better, you can go with the Meteor Shard - but if you are missing your Attack Power, buy Cross Dagger of Power from the AH for like a few gold for 1.3 att speed weapon with +10ap
I wish man... I am literally just waiting for Blizzard to make something new. I'm bored of exactly same concept for who knows how many expansions :( What do we get in new expansion - new raid on release, 4 zones and 8 new dungeons :O I hope you understand me.
@@nagyarpinagyarpi lol :D I don't know, I started levelling one and I really dislike drinking mana xD But I'm quite a lot behind the curve there should be some other Mage content creators for sure!
i will try the spec, i see everyone is using it , but i dont see how is it better than pure backstab + hitchance, but ill try, if someone can explain how is it better to go saber it would be nice =)
It's easy, it just does more damage :D Just on itself Saber Slash with the Bleed does more damage than the Backstab with the Feral Druid in the raid and pair that with the fact that you will have a Deadly Poison on Chest, instead reduced Energy.
You actually want to have improved ss talent and use saber slash with the backstab build. Keeping the bleed up (3 saber slash stacks) is a DPS increase in PvE even with backstab build.
I agree and disagree with that. My Saber Slash without counting Armor does about 100 damage (Calculating Crit as well) + 84 damage dot (over 12 seconds), so 3x Sabre Slash is 270 damage + 252 (327 with Mangle) damage bleed + waiting for bleed to do it's full damage = 597 damage - while each Backstab does 244 damage (with crit in the equation) - 3x backstab = 732 damage. Definitely on 2nd boss you could make your argument for the Bleed due to it's high base armor. Another place where you could make an argument is on long bosses like over a few minutes where you only need to maintain your 3x Saber Slash stack, but here bosses are dying within a minute- apart from the ones with long intermission phases where you can't damage them. So currently we literally have no where to experience a DPS buff from applying 3x Saber Slash stacks, I can only see it on Gelihast when you just apply the bleed while he's not taking damage and maybe the last boss when he's at 50% hp. But you still won't need Improved Sinister Strike I think.
Both Instant Poison and Sharpen definitely interfere with Wildstrikes. You can test it yourself - try to apply instant poison on a weapon which has a Sharpen.
It is not true - you can't have both poisons on both weapons to proc Wildsrike. You have to go Instant poison on off hand and nothing on main hand to be able to proc Wildstrike@@Markonicus
@@Markonicus Can I ask for normal pve without feral druid you ofc use 2x instant poison? I do that as rouge tank anyway. Also with feral druid mangle debuff makes bleed much better.
@@Djuntas Yes if you are a tank use 2x Instant Poison or Mind Numbing Poison to slow caster speed or Crippling Poison if you want to slow them down so the mobs run away slower. If you have Deadly Brew tho, you still don't put any Poisons, but you can put Sharpening Stones on both of your Weapons if there is no Druid.
@@Markonicus Oh wasent sure if deadly brew made it so you dont need to apply instant poison. I guess with brew you could still use crippling or mind :)
I am not convinced that is the best pve talent build. 5/5 malice 3/3 imp SnD then combat tree imp SS 3/3 gouge or dodge and then 3/5 hit. Hit is by far the most vital stat for us. All our dmg is from poisons and auto attacks.
Hit is our most important stat, that is true - but 3% hit isn't worth the energy Regeneration of Relentless Strikes, 2% increased damage and 60% chance to generate a CP after a finisher.
@@Markonicus I’m pulling like 120-140 dps as that spec I said above. I’m curious to see how much I can do with the spec u showed. I’m pretty much full bis.
@@Smoothy104 Do it! Here are my logs - vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/crusader-strike/roachela Not the best gear and one kill was with Backstab build, which in my opinion is bad :D
I don't think I said that xD But I did start a boss without it, while trying the Backstab build (I forgot to change Runes) and oh my... It feels bad :D
Strong disagree on this PVE talent build, hit is your most important stat when raiding because white damage is 70% of your damage. 6/10/0 is much better for sword in my experience and nets a bonus 30+ dps in BFD.
Well the only thing I agree is that hit is our most important stat, but it's not as important as Energy Regeneration (which isn't a stat). All of the best logs on BFD were made with 14/2 Saber Slash build.
He means me jumping around while explaining :D It is just a force of habit to keep my APM high (I'm a big League player and constant movement is useful in Mythic+, Mythic raids and PvP)
Rank 1 slice and dice and no hit? Sounds stupid to me, rogues never used SaD rank1 in vanilla. Invest 5 points to get to hit is not dps upgrade? Bro if you use SaD, the biggest dps upgrade is hit with your white attacks.
Huh? I don't exactly understand what are you talking about. You use the first Slice and Dice at 2 Points so you have it immediately up and then when you get to 5 CP you do a new one. This way you maintain SnD the longest.
Please don’t forget to mention that if you are backstabbing/that’s your build, don’t apply instant poison on any weapon. Just crippling, or you’ll just make your stuns other than between the eyes completely useless
? If you’re backstab spec you’re running slaughter from the shadows… instant poison does not break your gouge unless you’re running deadly brew which automatically applies deadly poison…
The only problem for your Sap/Gouge etc. is when you are running Deadly Brew - and you unluckily apply instant and therefor deadly poison when sapping for example. But without Deadly brew, that doesn't happen.
@@MicroMintyHourglass I still want to hear complaints if they are critical of course, not just haters. That's the best way to improve content I believe!
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
Just to clarify for Stat Priority: 1 Agility > 1 Attack Power = 1 Strength, but: 2 Attack Power > 1 Agility
In Classic WoW 24 Attack Power is about the same or slightly better than 13 Agility - but now since we have Poison AP scaling, Attack Power should be even better, but by how much - I don't know for sure. My own calculation is 1 Agility is about 1.5 Attack Power and I run with that.
having 2 chipped tooth daggers do you think i should go mutilate or use a prtectors sword in MH and go saber slash
@@ludnqka I advise whatever is more fun :D
I think that Saber Slash build with Protector still has an edge.
Yes Dave shah with protector is a best in pvp but it's soo slow
Saber slash
Would you still rate saber slash as top rune, even post nerf?
Excellent video, thanks for all the concise but detailed info. I ran BFD with a Mutilate combat build last night and while the damage was comparable to the typical Saber build, the energy economy felt so bad and clunky without relentless strikes.
Yeah, energy is a big issue for us :(
Excellent! Best video on rogue period. Thank you!
No! Thank you for a nice comment!
Thanks for taking the time. 🙂 I’m a bit behind and this is very helpful. ✌️
No problem mate, play the game at your own pace and to your own liking. Fun is the most important part!
Been using a full combat build with swords, imp sprint, and reposte and haven't had an issue with rogues using daggers and trying to bsckstab their way out of between the eyes stun spam. That, and the imp sprint + will of the forsaken = can't catch me. And the 50% chance to silence with kick has left many Alliance casters ... speechless 😊
You do you man :D
These are just guidelines, fun is the most important!
blind with kick? I too am speechless :D
@@smurfaka I took imp kick as my last talent. 50% chance to silence, not blind. My bad.
@@Markonicus absolutely, fun is the best spec!
@@smurfaka He meant Improved Kick :D
I understood him haha
Ty for this guide.
Is it recommended to go for sword main hand and fast off hand dagger, or can i go both dagger? I've heard Sword offers more damage to Sinister/Saber
You are going for a Sword MH since it's a lot slower than the Dagger which offers more Damage in the end.
best SOD Rogue guides no cap! keep on clutching
Thank you mate! I shall try to clutch further on :D
What's the thing with the Wild Strikes buff from Druids that affect poisons on rogues with their Main-Hand?
You shouldn't apply Poisons if you have Deadly Brew Rune - the rune will do everything for you.
Wild Strike, Poisons and Sharpening Stones are all counted as a type of the same Enchant. That's why they overwrite each other.
what is that energy addon?
Nug Energy - just made a video for all my addons xD
"Horde is once again superior" haha. that made me giggle :D Specially when it comes from an alliance player
Hahahaha, well... I'm not really an Alliance player. I love playing both factions and I keep thinking to myself that I made a mistake playing Alliance, I want my Trolls and Tauren :(
Do u use poisons on your weapons when using deadly brew?
Nope!
not sure if i missed it, but what poisons for envenem/saberslash build?
You just put Deadly Brew Rune and you don't apply Poision to your weapons, the Rune will do everything.
You just blew my mind- I didn't know opportunity gave u dmg increase with mutilate if u hit from behind- that's my fav build thank u for showing me this. That's like a neat hidden secret
even with that saber slash still better both you deal good damage 40 energy and bleed. some mobs in bfd are elementals that we can't stack poison on mobs so we lost %20 damage buff on mutilate
@@Mengeneful I mean true, that why I will say 100% of the time that Saber Slash is the best build, but I somehow find Mutilate to be the most fun one :D
@Markonicus do you need to be behind the target for opportunity to apply to mutilate?
good day friend. What is the name of the addon that shows the energy increase? The one below your character's face. Thank you.
Nugenergy
would you say the pve saber slash is best for farming mobs too?
Uhhh, with raid Talents I prefer Mutiltate build, but that's probably due to a fact that I have a bis dagger. Sword keeps eluding me from the 3rd BFD boss even though everyone has it.
For mob farming I go with Riposte build. 5% hit, 5% parry, improved Sinister Strike, 3% dodge and Saber Slash.
Isn’t it better to rupture always the target and then snd when you have a feral
In the group with mangle ?
Rupture is a decent finisher, but Envenom offers more. Rupture's base damage + Bleed buff have slightly bigger raw damage than Envenom, but Envenom can Crit so you need to add that into the equation + the envenom buff to massively increase the chance to apply poisons.
My DPS went up after I started keeping better Rupture uptime, specially with a Druid in the party, so for me having Rupture uptime is more important than Envenom.
SnD, Rupture and then the occasional Envenom. Envenom doesn’t really do a ton of damage and Deadly Poison is the biggest dps gain out of it which is capped at 5 stacks.
So why do we not use sinister strike after we have the three bleed stacks from saber slash seeing as it does more raw damage?
You can definitely do that now, especially since they confirmed that Tooltip was just wrongly written. This video was made before they made and update for Saber Slash. Also it's kinda of a "high tech" for average Classic player :D
@@Markonicus okay I thought I was missing something thanks for the reply!
hey dude what do you think is better 2% hit on oh weapon or +4 dmg stone
2% hit for sure!
Hi just wanted to know your thoughts on the blackfathom ritual dagger with its 1.2 speed over other oh options? And do you run sharpening stone on both weapons over poison if no WF
If no WF, then both Sharepning Stones on weapons - Deadly Brew does the Poison thing.
1.2 Dagger is okay, I don't think it's the best. But no once cay for certain what is the best off hand currenlty, we have no simulations.
09:55 dude, this is on a second monitor while I'm leveling in Ashenvale as 21.
I keep getting Vietnam flashback syndrome.
EDIT:
From the "Stealth" audio effect.
Yeah... Ashenvale is crazy when progress is building up xD
On envenom builds, do you use Crippling on Off hand for unlimited charges? What on main hand if no druid?
On Envenom builds i don't apply any Poison, since Deadly Brew does everything for me.
Thanks, I missed that clause of no poisons on rune.@@Markonicus
Hi, nice guide. I wanted to ask about Expose Armor, are there bosses in raid where you should keep reducing armor of the boss all the time?
Never Expose Armor :D
Warriors are there to do that! It's much easier for them.
@@Markonicus ok thanks
Been playing the back stab PvP spec in both PvP and pve and I’ve had a lot of success with it, but I use slaughter only in pve and use pistol shot for PvP with shadow strike but shiv is also really good if you have a fast offhand to guarantee the crippling in bgs to help peal for your fc
assassination spec is better for PVE
saber
envenom
deadly brew
use bleeds if you have a feral druid and you will top DPS.
i see a lot of backstab rogues do low dmg in pve, but it’s def great in pvp!
@@moisescott4028 Saber Slash does more damage for sure in PvE, but those bosses roll down just by following mechanics - that's why I recommend going build which is the most fun to you :D
The gap between a backstab build and a poison build really isn't that big in PvE, the priority should be what is most fun @@moisescott4028
Why no poison on main hand if playing with feral druid? Thanks
If you have Deadly Brew Rune and you are using it, you don't need to apply any Poison and you'll have both Instant and Deadly Poison online.
If you are playing a Backstab build, you aren't running Deadly Brew Rune so you need to apply Poison, but if you have a Druid in your Party - his Wild Strikes Buff interferes with Poison and Wild Strike is better than a Poison, so just don't apply Poison then. (You can't have them both up at the same time on one weapon, you can't have Sharpening Stone and a Poison at the same time, it goes like that.)
I only have daggers, is saber slash still better than mutilate for pve?
With Daggers, I must say that I prefer Mutiltate.
Do you feel mutilate does more damage than the backstab build?@@Markonicus
is Backstab spec still the best pvp build for rogue?
For sure, I prefer it at least.
I might have missed it, but is rupture part of the rotation at all?
I personally don't use it in Mutilate and Saber Slash builds,, since I believe Envenom is a bit better - but you can use it instead of Envenom, just your damage output will probably be slightly worse.
However I use Rupture in Backstab build.
Do you ever use rupture ?
Only in the Backstab build, but you can use it. It does similar damage output as Envenom, I just value Envenom a bit more.
You are my go to content creator for everything rogue, thanks for the great content. I got the offhand dagger from Akumai and was wondering if I can play backstab or muti if I get the serrakis dagger or are those builds too inferior to saber slash. Saber slash is crazy good but kinda boring, want to try something different.
Thank you mate! Just get the Serakis Dagger and got Mutilate, just like me :D
Saber Slash does more damage, but to hell with it, I want FUN!
Good Video ! But my Question is what weapons do i use with saber Slash build? Sword and dagger or Something Else?
Sword and a fast Dagger usually.
Can you explain why you only put the poison in the offhand if there's a druid with wildstrikes?
I don't put Poison on offhand, I sharpen my Weapon.
Druid Wild Strikes only applies on the Main Hand.
I have Deadly Brew Rune so I don't need to apply a single Poison.
I’m new to rouge and kind of WoW classic in general, how do you go about getting so many backstabs on an enemy player/mob if they’re always facing you? Sounds more fun to me esp for PVP but it Seems a lot easier to use saber slash or mutilate in scenarios where they are fighting you head on.
When you have Crippling Poison, they will be slower than you - so you can use your movement speed advantage to find their back. It's literally a mini game :D
Even when using Saber Slash or Mutilate you want to do that, since attacks from the back can't be Parried or Dodged.
I thought attacks from the back can still be dodged just not parried.
Yeah does seem fun actually lol but just regular mobs/trash mobs in a 1v1 scenario can’t really get behind right?. I’m just leveling right now so using saber slash since it’s more reliable
@@AlwaysSaucedd Oh for farming definitely not :D
It's only for PvP situations.
@@need4boost Mobs can dodge from behind, players can't!
I just started playing rogue and I'm confused about if I should play double daggers or sword + dagger. I feel bad about needing on multiple weapons in raid :/
Sword + Dagger - Saber Slash should be the best.
On the PvE build why 2 points in Murder instead of 2 in Remoreseless attacks? I feel that Remorseless attacks is way more useful than the 2% at this point of the game. Also, do you feel that the hit % provided by Precision on the Combat tree is not missed (that was not intentional lol)?
You are spending way to many talent points to gain the hit %, just going for Assassination tree is a DPS upgrade. Numbers don't lie :D
2 points in Murder give 2% increased damage, it will add up during the whole fight and it will out weight 40% increased chance to apply a Combo Point after a Finisher.
Also sorry for not answering sooner, I didn't get a notification.
What's the best race for Alliance for PVP?
Depends on what are you playing against.
Humans are good against other Stealth classes, Dwarves remove Bleeds, Gnomes have the Escape Artist to remove Roots which might be the best overall Racial ability for PvP Rogues.
Night Elves have the highest base Agility.
@@Markonicus thanks mate, and cheers for a great guide. I'd love if you could show some PvP gameplay in another video!
@@belbobaggins I'm just a Roach as my character names suggests :D
Wait in the woods - see an alone traveler and then I say hello with an Ambush lmao
is there a list for bis gear? :)
Well I went through all the item slots and said what is the BiS - but now when you said it.... I should have put the whole list written down xD
Wowhead list is great. google it for your class.
sorry im confused, so for PVP build what wepons would you want?
A big boy dagger main hand and ideally Sentinel's Blade Off Hand for me.
Where to start quest for Poisons on undead rogue?
I believe that you start the quest in Orgrimmar - The Cleft of Shadow.
If you are asking about Deadly Brew Rune, you get a message in the mail at level 20 - which tells you to go in Silverpine Forest.
Why not take opportunity instead of imp sinister strike. Since we are using saber over sinister strike seems like the two points are wasted on Imp sinister. We gain dmg from opportunity with garote....am I missing something?
Saber Slash benefits from all the Sinister Strike Talents - so Improved Sinister Strike talent reduces the cost of Sinister Strike and Saber Slash by 5 energy.
does sharpening stone in MH prohibit you from receiving the Druid’s wild strike buff?
Yes
Can confirm.
im beginner playing rogue and still use both of sword,am i should change with dagger ? and does the slaber slash build rotation are not dont use synister strike bro mark ?
For Sabre Slash you should use a sword in MH (ideally slow weapon with 2.5 or 2.6 or higher swing time) and for OH you just want a fast weapon with good stats and usually Daggers fit that category perfectly.
What about Prison Shank for OH for pre BIS with Meteor as MH? (other than rep farming) for alliance
That can work definitely for Mutilate build.
Definitely overlooked the Shank.
Great work, thanks a lot!
For the saber slash PVE build: What about 3 points in Lethality vs 3 points in Ruthlessness. +18% on saber slash vs 60% on adding one combo point. Former seems better than latter?
Thank you!
Lethality only increases the critical strike damage of your Saber Slash upfront damage. It's bleed can't critically hit.
Our critical chance currently is like 16% against level 25 targets (even less on higher level targets), so we don't benefit as much from Lethality as we will in later stages.
I would definitely say that atm Ruthlessness is better.
@@Markonicus Makes a lot of sense, thanks! BTW: do you have a way of estimating the DPS gain of 60% on adding one combo point from Lethality? I.e.: Maybe what is the DPS value of 1 combo point?
@@VincentCohen-AddadViallat I don't have anything exact. But it definitely depends on a fight, for example let's say the boss lasts for 2 minutes or something, you'll get 1 full finisher just from Ruthlessness talent. It's hard to quantify it because I don't know how to exactly calculate how much is it going to affect your S&D uptime.
ive been going 13 combat 3 Sub for increased Mutilate crit 5 hit and mutilate dmg while behind target its been pretty nutty
That is a decent build, but as I said in the video, I believe that it's not as good as Assassination path - of course the differences aren't big.
(speaking for rogues) It's insanely unbalanced how easier and faster it is for Horde to get very good gear than for alliance. They even have bis items we just cannot have. 1 or 2 items ok.. but that much. Alliance can always get better gear by grinding bfd, but majority of the gameplay of sod is before getting bis.
I agree, Horde definitely has it easier - especially with the location of the raid etc.. Our time to shine will come eventually, so don't worry about it too much :D
Ok sword racial
@@Usersworld94 Actually for BFD, Orc and Troll Racials are far better :D
Just because the kill times are like 50 seconds on most bosses.
@@Markonicusespecially with phase 2 raid being Gnomeregan !!
Whats the energy tick addon
Nug Energy
do you you slice and dice in pvp
Nope!
isnt gusting wind pretty good? fist weapon raid drop
I honestly forgot all about it, but I should have put it in the off hand bis list :)
Nice spotting, hopefully I didn't miss any other items :D
Thats the off hand I’m using right now and can confirm its really good, much better than the Chipped Bite of Serra’kis Dagger as off hand weapon
So does Improved Backstab 30% crit also affect mutiliate crit? in that case that seems like a must
It does affect it, but it's not a must, you have to use 5 Talent points for absolutely nothing...
That's why Assassination route is better with 11/0/5
does slice and dice stack with wild strikes?? I thought it didn’t?
They do two different things. SnD gives you increased attack speed, Wild strikes gives a chance to proc extra attacks. You have to avoid putting poison/sharpening stone on your Mainhand if you wanna get wild strikes, tho.
Thank you for answering the question instead of me :D
Thank you
Why do you put points in SS if you just use Saber Slash?
Because Saber Slash benefits from all the Sinister Strike Talents.
Why not Sinister Strike instead of Saber when at full stacks? SS does more flat dmg.
It does now after the weeklies reset - I thought the tooltip was correct, but the value was off. You can definitely swing in some Sinisters when at 3 stacks of Saber Slash.
Im playing a bg vs your premade rn! what a coincidence haha
:D
It was a random premade, we didn't lose!
Was just waiting for my BFD run in which I tanked.
@@Markonicus ofc u didnt lose! When horde sees a premade they stay afk hahaha hows rogue tank? Looks good for me but the runes are a pain in the ass so i dont wanna take them till 40 haha if u se mee next time in bg /salute my char Cocasterol :) gl!
@@soslanbaskaev Cocasterol lmao, I'll try to remember that!
Tanking seems awesome as a Rogue, just the problem are the Adds/Dungeon since we have no AoE. For Solo Target Bosses thooooo, it's super good - Agroo is through the roof.
I have cruel barb, meteor shard, and revered warsong rep dagger and sword, what would you recommend for 1:pvp daggers build which one in MH and which one in OH and 2:pve saber slash build for my MH OH set up
I also have 2x cruel barbs on my orc rogue and I'm thinking if they could be better against Cruel Barb + meteor shard. But I feel like 2.8 on OH is triggering poisons too slow. +12 ap tho :( . I guess on human rogue it could be better with swords specialization
no offence but you are noob at rogue if you don't know that 2.8 speed OH is bad. especially with deadly brew you have both IP and DP relying on your OH speed.@@Rastendhos
no offence but u are a noob if u didnt know that u dont need posions on weapons to trigger deadly posions, deadly brew fix that for u... going nothing mainhand and sharpening stone OF.@@Kimbo-95
No need to get personal my boys :D
1. MH Meteor Shard, OH WSG Dagger - it's a super minor difference between them.
2. MH WSG Sword - OH WSG Dagger
@@Rastendhos Definitely going for faster weapon in the off hand is better, you can go with the Meteor Shard - but if you are missing your Attack Power, buy Cross Dagger of Power from the AH for like a few gold for 1.3 att speed weapon with +10ap
what is that energy ticking addon called?
Should be weak aura
Nug Energy
@@florianwerk4505 Hell naw brotha :D
I shall not touch weakauras in Classic - had enough of them in Retail.
Ups to be fair you can make the same thing with a wa
I hate Dot builds, so which build is the burstiest? (Pvp)
I covered the PvP Backstab build
@@Markonicus ty vm
Nice to see you back!! 🎉
can we expect mage videos in the future from you? just like the good old times 😅
I wish man...
I am literally just waiting for Blizzard to make something new. I'm bored of exactly same concept for who knows how many expansions :(
What do we get in new expansion - new raid on release, 4 zones and 8 new dungeons :O
I hope you understand me.
@@Markonicus ooh don't get me wrong, im talking about classic wow mage content in Sod 😀
@@nagyarpinagyarpi lol :D
I don't know, I started levelling one and I really dislike drinking mana xD
But I'm quite a lot behind the curve there should be some other Mage content creators for sure!
i will try the spec, i see everyone is using it , but i dont see how is it better than pure backstab + hitchance, but ill try, if someone can explain how is it better to go saber it would be nice =)
It's easy, it just does more damage :D
Just on itself Saber Slash with the Bleed does more damage than the Backstab with the Feral Druid in the raid and pair that with the fact that you will have a Deadly Poison on Chest, instead reduced Energy.
@@Markonicus fair enough thanks ^^
another great and easy guide! we need some clips with your gameplay in it!
I will record my next raid, should be good!
Leggings of the fang took me 27 solo runs to cobranh I got ptsd
It be like that, working for your bis ^^
Wait for the boots.Why not the 8agil and 6stam boots? Isn’t Stam a pro stat for PvP with agil.
Well, I said that Warsong Boots are the BiS for Horde, but set boots will be better for sure, especially due to the set bonus.
@@Markonicus Thank you
You actually want to have improved ss talent and use saber slash with the backstab build. Keeping the bleed up (3 saber slash stacks) is a DPS increase in PvE even with backstab build.
I agree and disagree with that. My Saber Slash without counting Armor does about 100 damage (Calculating Crit as well) + 84 damage dot (over 12 seconds), so 3x Sabre Slash is 270 damage + 252 (327 with Mangle) damage bleed + waiting for bleed to do it's full damage = 597 damage - while each Backstab does 244 damage (with crit in the equation) - 3x backstab = 732 damage.
Definitely on 2nd boss you could make your argument for the Bleed due to it's high base armor.
Another place where you could make an argument is on long bosses like over a few minutes where you only need to maintain your 3x Saber Slash stack, but here bosses are dying within a minute- apart from the ones with long intermission phases where you can't damage them.
So currently we literally have no where to experience a DPS buff from applying 3x Saber Slash stacks, I can only see it on Gelihast when you just apply the bleed while he's not taking damage and maybe the last boss when he's at 50% hp. But you still won't need Improved Sinister Strike I think.
best professions ?
Engineering and LW for like ultimate DPS at the moment. I'm going for Skinning and LW since I want to earn some gold + I really dislike Engineering.
@@Markonicus ty
been playing with precision and tried this build and my dps dropped because i miss everything
You should have more misses, but your DPS shouldn't fall - that's my experience and all the best current loggers are running non hit Talents.
nice to know that horde are handed pre-raid bis items through easy quests while alliance have to get lucky drops or spend hundreds of gold LOL
It be like that. Hopefully we will be more lucky next phase
i thought that they confirmed that poisons and sharpening stones don't interfere with wild strike buffs
When? Yesterday I still couldn't put them together.
@@Markonicus you cant stack them still. I assume the confusion comes from being able to use deadly brew with the stones/wf.
they interfere with each other for sure
I’m pretty sure instant poison on the MH doesn’t interfere with wild strikes, but sharpening stones do.
Both Instant Poison and Sharpen definitely interfere with Wildstrikes.
You can test it yourself - try to apply instant poison on a weapon which has a Sharpen.
It is not true - you can't have both poisons on both weapons to proc Wildsrike. You have to go Instant poison on off hand and nothing on main hand to be able to proc Wildstrike@@Markonicus
@@Markonicus Can I ask for normal pve without feral druid you ofc use 2x instant poison? I do that as rouge tank anyway. Also with feral druid mangle debuff makes bleed much better.
@@Djuntas Yes if you are a tank use 2x Instant Poison or Mind Numbing Poison to slow caster speed or Crippling Poison if you want to slow them down so the mobs run away slower.
If you have Deadly Brew tho, you still don't put any Poisons, but you can put Sharpening Stones on both of your Weapons if there is no Druid.
@@Markonicus Oh wasent sure if deadly brew made it so you dont need to apply instant poison. I guess with brew you could still use crippling or mind :)
Do you ever NOT jump whats up with that
I like jumping, I have to do something xD
I am not convinced that is the best pve talent build. 5/5 malice 3/3 imp SnD then combat tree imp SS 3/3 gouge or dodge and then 3/5 hit. Hit is by far the most vital stat for us. All our dmg is from poisons and auto attacks.
Hit is our most important stat, that is true - but 3% hit isn't worth the energy Regeneration of Relentless Strikes, 2% increased damage and 60% chance to generate a CP after a finisher.
@@Markonicus I’m pulling like 120-140 dps as that spec I said above. I’m curious to see how much I can do with the spec u showed. I’m pretty much full bis.
@@Smoothy104 Do it!
Here are my logs - vanilla.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/crusader-strike/roachela
Not the best gear and one kill was with Backstab build, which in my opinion is bad :D
Imagine going backstab build without slaughter from the shadows lol
I don't think I said that xD
But I did start a boss without it, while trying the Backstab build (I forgot to change Runes) and oh my... It feels bad :D
first tip: Roll dwarf
Never!
IMPROVED BACKSTAB WORKS ON MUTILATE????
Yes! In the tooltip for Mutilate it's stated that the Talents which improve Backstab also improve Mutilate.
I thought slice and dicewas a dps loss???
Hell naw man :D
It's the most important finisher!
i love you
Strong disagree on this PVE talent build, hit is your most important stat when raiding because white damage is 70% of your damage. 6/10/0 is much better for sword in my experience and nets a bonus 30+ dps in BFD.
Well the only thing I agree is that hit is our most important stat, but it's not as important as Energy Regeneration (which isn't a stat). All of the best logs on BFD were made with 14/2 Saber Slash build.
darn no way to make money in this vid lol great info t hat man
What do you mean? :D
Great video but it would be much better if you were not jumping around for the entire thing, it makes it much harder to watch. Thanks
How did he jump around? Was prebis/bis by each item slot for the first half. Then different builds. Then rotations
He means me jumping around while explaining :D
It is just a force of habit to keep my APM high (I'm a big League player and constant movement is useful in Mythic+, Mythic raids and PvP)
@Markonicus oh okay yeah, I don't even notice that cause I'm used to it
Lol nah bro chill out. Thanks
Your a fool. Just don't comment if your goina be a D-bag. This is for Joe who complained about him jumping at the end for like 2 sec.
ill stick to being a 2x sword rouge... evne if it cucks me in pvp it is what it is~
backstab is just ugh~
Saber Slash can still do a good damage output - especially on Tank Shamans, Bear Druids...
backstab is fun thou :p @@Markonicus
Rank 1 slice and dice and no hit? Sounds stupid to me, rogues never used SaD rank1 in vanilla. Invest 5 points to get to hit is not dps upgrade? Bro if you use SaD, the biggest dps upgrade is hit with your white attacks.
Huh? I don't exactly understand what are you talking about.
You use the first Slice and Dice at 2 Points so you have it immediately up and then when you get to 5 CP you do a new one. This way you maintain SnD the longest.
This is such a candy ass game lol
Stop jumping omg
Jumping is mandatory.
Imagine not jumping
How can I keep high apm otherwise? :D
You shouldn't look at my raiding videos, I keep moving lol
omg, I cannot stand you hoping around in the background its driving me crazy
It seems like a lot of people don't like my hyperactivity xD
Please don’t forget to mention that if you are backstabbing/that’s your build, don’t apply instant poison on any weapon. Just crippling, or you’ll just make your stuns other than between the eyes completely useless
? If you’re backstab spec you’re running slaughter from the shadows… instant poison does not break your gouge unless you’re running deadly brew which automatically applies deadly poison…
There’s only one stun right now , between the eyes
If you think instant poison breaks gouge, you're wrong.
The only problem for your Sap/Gouge etc. is when you are running Deadly Brew - and you unluckily apply instant and therefor deadly poison when sapping for example.
But without Deadly brew, that doesn't happen.
@@tatedoh gouge?
guide for easiest class in wow xD oke boys
Calling a class easiest in WoW classic is a long stretch mate :D
Bro every single class in SoD is piss easy to play
@@erikarnesen6052 Exactly.
@@Markonicus cope. yikes xD
dude the jumping of your char is so annoying
Yeah, I've been told multiple times xD
This guide sucks
Why does it suck?
@@Markonicusit doesn’t ignore him
@@MicroMintyHourglass I still want to hear complaints if they are critical of course, not just haters. That's the best way to improve content I believe!
Lol another terrible gear guide
What you don't like about it, tell me
lmao playing s&d when we are able to two shot people.. 5head
What? I haven't said anything about S&D in PvP :D
Why to spend 2 points in sinister strike in PvP backstab build? I never use Sinister strike. Better to spend 2 points in Lightning Reflexes
Sometimes if someone is nicely kitting you, you won't be able to Backstab him.
It's situational points really.