Alt Bars Are Better Than Drop Bars On Gravel Bikes | Surly Karate Monkey Gravel Bike | Moloko Bars
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- Опубликовано: 12 янв 2021
- I rode drop bars for years on gravel and just never felt comfortable or capable of tackling the roads and rides I wanted to. That all changed when I switched to a bike that has alternative or alt bars. In this video, I hope to convince you of the same.
Are there people who will prefer drop bars or find them better for their use case? Yeah probably...but I'm not one of them.
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I really like your thinking on this! I’m in the same boat-not a fan of the drop bars and flats are a bit limiting at times. I’m doing a “gravel alt bar build” with my old hardtail. I’m putting a rigid fork on with alt bars.
Nice to see I’m not the only one with the same reasoning.
I love it when people think outside the box for solution and don't give AF about being cool sticking with a popular handlebar cockpit setup.
Well done 👏
Great video- really appreciate your perspective and beautiful scenery!
Right on, nice presentation. I ride a rigid 29er as my gravel bike as well. I've been trying to pull the trigger on switching out my flat bar and have considered giving the Moloko a shot. I just may do it now. Thanks!
Just installed the jones bar on my touring bike today and this video showed up.. lol so much more comfy !! And useful.
Ver good conclusion. I've put long bar ends on the inner side of a wide MTB flat bar, taped them with gel bar tape and came to a similar setup like your professional Moloko bars. But I can subscribe to your statement that this setup is highly versatile and comfortable.
Thanks, great input, i just got a ritchey kyote bar. A little too wide so i cut the end's 16 mm. Put long barends in the bend and smaller ones one the end of the handles. I was thinking about getting a gravel bike, but was a little reluctant to get a drop bar bike. I really love my bike. This was a good alternative i think.
Totally agree. Perfect choose for long runs, more comfort more fun.
Thanks for sharing your insight. I am currently converting my hardtail to more of a hybrid gravel grinder. Half the fun is dreaming up ideas like your doing with your Surly KM. By the way, excellent views down your gravel roads....nice country to ride!
Yeah it’s hard to complain about the views on these roads haha. It’s fun to change things up to make a bike more suited to needs or riding style!
Great video. I've been using Origin8 Strongbow for almost a year now on my gravel bike. With Ergon2 bar ends, it replicates hoods position, especially good on the climbs. The middle hoop lets you get aero when out on the road. With 46/30 upfront and 11/34 in the back, it's become my do it all bike.
Yes for sure! I was a lover of drop bars until I started using the jones bar. I've now owned several others and they are so comfy!
I'm mainly ride the road bike with drop bars- I rarely ride in the drops - I just don't have the body flexibility in the drops. No biggie because I do have back problems or neck and arm shoulder problems at all.
Totally agree. Changed my drop bar gravel bike to bullhorn bars because Im very skeptical if the narrow dropbars can handle rough terrain as they give you inadequate control on these surfaces. Drop bars for me is for long stretches of flat roads. Sure it gives u more aero and nice aesthetics but id sacrifice that for safety and control anyday.
Agree on all your points. I too run a pair of molokos and are by far my favorite bar I've ran despite the slight weight addition
Very practical and realistic assessment...don't have a problem with anything you said at all 👍
You make a lot of valid points which I totally agree with!
Totally agree as an older rider
Totally agree, I went to alt bars a few years ago and an older Niner mtn frame with 45c tires for my gravel bike. Drop bars where I live were insane - rolling down 2000-3000 feet of switchbacks would make my hands numb, so much easier and faster on the mtn setup with alt bars. Climbing was also a bit of a challenge as you eluded to since gravel bike gearing is not setup for 10-mile steep climbs - short punchy climbs, sure. If I lived somewhere else where it wasn't always so dramatic with steep ups and downs and downs then I'd probably appreciate drop bars.
Ride the Surly ECR.. Love my Moloko Bar, Rode 4 hours today and was very comfortable... Also Ride a Treck Full Stache and went with Jones Bar withy 2 inch Rise also very nice and comfortable.. I came from Road and gravel bikes but now am older and like a more upright riding position....
Harder to pull the breaks on dropbars. I went for flatbar for better control and easier with the break levers. Thinking of adding an “inside” bar ends.
Yeah, but what the about the brakes you use for stopping?. And why do you need 'break levers' - to get things broken?
I’m a recent convert to alt bars (Surley Molko)from a flared drop bar gravel bike with sti shifter/brake. The drop bar was at first interesting for handling and shifting, it was restricted as to size of front bar bag I could pack, too narrow for my tent to go in it. After a year riding it I was finding my hand positions were more restricted to riding on the hoods which resulted in hand, neck pains. It was time I changed it so I went to a Molko bar and mountain bike shifters/brakes and even a 2x11 mountain bike gear setup.
It has proven a much better setup for both comfort and handling. Can also load a bigger bag up front now, more places to mount crap (camera, lights, gps). Reduced my hand and neck pains so far as well.
Interesting setup, I like it! 👍
I swapped out my drop handlebar on my e-gravel bike with a touring bar designed by Alee Denham.
It has just the right amount of back sweep and has horns for a more aero position, when needed.
I couldn't be happier, but I have to admit that I still really like the drop bar on my road bike.
This makes a lot of sense! Thanks!
While I do love some drop bars, I think my next build is going to be a Karate Monkey with some alt bars, probably either Molokos or Jones Loop bars. I think it would be the perfect bike for some Wisconsin winters.
You nailed it! Subscribed!
Agree completely. I run Jones bars on my MTB and Velo Orange Crazy Bars on my gravel bike. Both have all the hand positions I'd ever need while offering the control of wide flat bars.
Love the Jones bars, never tried the Crazy Bars but always thought they looked great.
@@RideYearRound They have the same 45 - degree sweep which seems to be best for my wrists. I really like Molokos too.
rando (type of drop bar) works great for me. while they are bit more challenging than flat bars (or some alt bars) I think that is the fun. as for the use of the drops I think that is more a setup thing. Most people setup drop bar to use the hoods but I setup my dropbars to use the drops. not make the drops my goto postion but make the drops a comfortable position. I set my drops so that is my hands on the end of the drops are comfortable and it is a goto relaxed chest open position. I only use rando bars so they do have a slight flare and that make a big difference. I get 7 hand positions on drop bars; two in the drops, two on the hoods (one is palms on hoods fingers over the top kind of puts me in a tuck position), two on the ramps (one with my thumb on the hoods the other with my palm on the bend on the flats but my fingers are on the ramps and my palms are facing inward), and one on flats. If you set up the drops to use they rocky descent can be done tucked in the drops giving a very secure grip (without the need to clench super hard) and good brake lever control. Wiskey No7 24f are a good non rando drop bar for gravel IMO.
I just discovered your channel and wished I had done so earlier… I put Innerbarbends on my Hardtail Mountain bike a few months ago to get more comfort. And then I got a classic Gravel Bike with a Dropbar… Had I known about this option I might have gone for a Surly Monkey full rigid with this Setup.
Agree with all on all points. Got a Surly Moloko on the way.
Love the idea! One snag, I like the hoods position for doing longer distances on good surfaces, but I wouldn't want to have my hands away from the brakes all that time on risers / alt bar bull horns.
I think the same way. Shimano has some inline break levers. I wonder if those could be installed at the bull horns of the alt bars.
I started using similar bars from Jones on my fat bike. What a difference! I love the multiple hand positions and much easier on my arthritis.
No arthritis here, but I can see how a more natural position would help that out.
Well done.....subscribed!
I use this Surly's Moloko bar, the ride experience is wonderful
Your video just reminded me why I built my “gravel”/multi-road bike with Jones bars instead of drops.
Jones bars are great, but they're $269 (AUD) here in Australia...OUCH 🚵😬
@@53glowe they don’t come cheap, but if you like em, you soon forget what you paid for them.
I like them a lot for gravel or around town riding but not for trail riding.
I like the look of a drop-bar bike, and the hoods position for comfy efficient road miles. I only use the drops for better brake leverage - i.e. when going fast downhill on the road, and anything technical off-road- even though the drops position is all wrong for technical stuff, I just don't feel in control on the hoods. Flat/riser bar plus inboard bar-ends is a good compromise on the hardtail if you don't fancy going full alt-bar!
There is something really cool about the look of a drop bar bike with chunky tires.
Way to go buddy!
Nice bike you’re smart. 👍🏼
💯 Totally agree 👍🏻
I usually don't care for Surly aesthetics but OMG the paint on that karate monkey is beautiful!
Drop vs alt.. I do prefer alt bars offroad but it has more to do with having brake access in my main hand position than anything else. For drops my main position is the hoods and that just makes zero sense off road. Touring, riding in the drops is no problem granted you have a modern bar, a little flair, and the top of the bar is relatively high; I'd still rather tour on drop bars.
I used the Albatross bar for winter riding this year. Just switched back the other day to the Noodle and am seriously missing the Albatross.
I run a inverted trekking bar on my rigid MTB now, for paved rides. The inside aft part is similar to your bars, but I thing I will give it a custom oval wrap job (some layered foam under the wrap) to make it even more comfy, my hand still get numb now.
There are randonneur drop bars which allow for five hand positions on the top floor of the handlebar: tops, inner and outer curve, the ramps and the hoods.
Good video. I recently put Moloko bars on my Fargo for many of the same reasons. I also think they will eliminate the need for a front rack because they provide such a great place to hang a sling and bag (where I keep my tent, pad, bag, and a few camping things)-I’m not really a fan of the way the bike feels with loaded Anything cages on the fork.
I was so close to getting a Fargo instead of this Karate Monkey, but I decided I was going to go the flat bar route anyway so there was no need for the short reach of that frame or to have to convert everything over to flat bar shifters/brakes.
I have used an On One Mary bar for years. My latest bike is a drop bar. First one I have ever owned. No regrets buying it but my next one will probably go back to flat bar and go with some kind of alt bar.
I’ve been running these Surly bars for 4 years now on my fatbike. Recently picked up a Lynskey gravel bike and I’m thinking about getting another set of these bars. They really are that comfortable.
I bought Jones Loop H-Bars for my Kona Rove ST. Still sitting on the fence, though, about installing them.
Nice vid! Been seriously considering some Moloko bars for my Pugs.
I’d recommend them! (obviously haha)
I can't decide between these and the corner bar.
Very interesting. This could be a solution for me.
Totally agree! I don't get why 99% of gravel bikes sell with drop bars, but that is just my take.
MONTANA makes me say WOW!
I know they are not as popular but I like running classic style bar ends, gives you that one extra hand position, a lot of people do not like how they look\
i got kind of similar setup, wide straight bars with bar end horns in the middle
rode drop bar, flat bar and alt bar. Tried those three on long distance sadly on different bikes, my conclusion mostly bias towards flat bar and alt bar 😀
Looks nice. I am kind of interested by alt bars. Can you put bags, like the Restrap front bag on the Surly Moloko ?
Also more options for bike packing bags & gear as you don’t have the width limitation of the drops
I actually feel sort of opposite where no matter what I just feel more comfortable on drop bars. I currently use PNW Coast 52cm Drop bars and the shallow drop and flare out to 60.2cm feels very nice IMO. I typically set my bike up to have the tops lined up with my seat which combined with a slightly shorter stem gives me better control off road and still lets me tuck in.
I'll be honest I used the Moloko bars on my fat bike for about a year and thought they were almost good enough for me to replace getting another drop bar bike. The only thing I didn't like was the weight. Personally if I had those bars in an aluminum model I would have been more satisfied.
What I will say is from when I was trying to build my own gravel bike to now, I'm amazed by how many more options are available for me to dial in the setup that works best for me!
I’ve heard great things about those bars from multiple people. I also completely agree that it’s nice to see how much variety there is on the market so you can basically build whatever fits your needs most and make it exactly what you want.
With that big width and shallow drop, that PNW handlebar is practically an "alt bar" of a certain kind, too!
I feel like you're right but I'm going to choose to ignore your reasoning because it would be too expensive for me to convert my regular road gravel bike to an alt bar with mtn bike shifters and brakes. Maybe in 10 years when my bike feels too uncomfortable.
They seem to have an aero position also. You can also use your old thumb shifters on your current mountain bike. The 90s mountain bikes are basically gravel/touring set up already. Whatever works for you. The only question is , are they to wide for street use?
I have a gravel bike and a karate monkey while I like the thought I love my 27.5x3"s
I agree. Though I suppose it depends on the riding, and honestly, what you're using as a gravel bike. The term is problematic at the moment because a gravel bike in the plains, where it started, is much different than a gravel bike suitable for the PNW, which are essentially drop bar mountain bikes. I had the Moloko bar on my Ogre but ended up taking it off. Anything over 30 deg of sweep is just too unnatural. And, the up-sweep angle on the horns is awkward and, at least for my fit, forces you to fit for the horns or the bars, but not really both. Though, again, that could just be my fit. Or Ogre just being a peculiar bike, to begin with. I ended up putting on a Persuader bar and I'm finding the moto-inspired alt bars to really be where I like it. At any rate, I do agree and think we're going to see more flat/altbar fashioned gravel rides in coming years. Specialized has decided its ok with that new Diverge Evo that doesn't really make any sense until you think of it in the context of gravel event races in the PNW and such where the speeds + skinny tires make steering response and leverage all the more important to managing lane choice.
It for sure depends on what you’re riding, as seems to be the case with everything in the biking world haha. I really enjoy the sweep and even enjoyed the Jones bars which are swept back even more, but I think it depends on the rider. I found the horns really comfortable once I did a single wrap on the end and then a double wrap from the crossbar down. It fits very naturally in my hand that way. If you get a wild hair and try the Moloko again, I’d recommend wrapping it that way.
@@RideYearRound I tried wrapping the horns when I had it, even adding bar gel to try to also increase thickness at the joint with the handles. I think the real issue is just that for me, the horns are too close together and the angles too weird. Actually messed up my wrist a bit when I got caught on them hitting a rut. I do like the concept though and still need to try some inner bar ends. And I still agree. Alt bars are orders of magnitude better than drop.
I have 750mm drop bars. (So, wider than these.)
I have multiple positions too….the top position is basically a mtb bar. A wide hooded position is crazy comfy.
I’ve set up sub brakes on my flat section up to, so no probs there.
I’d say you maybe just haven’t tried a lot of drop bars.
No question having to outlay the money on levers is a big setback though.
Are there any alt bars out there similar to these? Feel like this is the only one besides maybe VO crazy's
Now Corner Bar is another level
Also, would you recommend bar and shifters on these bars? Why or why not?
A 'gravel bike' in marketing speak is a road bike with bigger tyes and maybe lower gearing. Hence drop bars, road tech, and expensive.
For me a gravel bike is an MTB without suspension. Hence flat bars, MTB gears/brakes. Less expensive and I think more suited to the more rugged environment of gravel riding.
I could get low and forward on the drops uphill to prevent lifting the front.
Any alt bars that could do that for me?
Interesting video, I got some questions for you mate: on my 29 gravel tourer I got installed some simil jones open bar like, with 48° backsweep angle (don't know yet if is too much...should maybe try something with less) what you think about it?. Right now I'm intrigued by the possibility to go aero on the bulls of the moloko/ koga denham or crazy velo orange bars type. But then I tought wouldn't be even better to just install some proper aero bars on the one I got right now? With that I would have new aero position and rest for my wrist since I would put the weight on the elbows..
48 is more than I’d like but I know some people love tons of sweep. I’ve seen some set ups with aero bars or just bar ends on a normal flat bar and it seems to be a good option but I’ve never tried it. I’d say try it if you’ve already got the aero bars laying around, there’s nothing to lose!
You got me sold on those bars! I've been tinkering around with "ALL" types of bars in the past and would like to give this one a go. Can you provide a link or more info. where one can order this actual bar?
Any local bike shop that sells anything from QBP (Salsa, Surly, All City, etc) should be able to order them in. You can also check online retailers to see who has them in stock.
👍
I would never ride a bike with drop bars! Leave that to the MAMIL’s Great vid 👍
MAMILs like to be fast. Avoid clothes that flap. Use aero handlebars.
105 GBP new is more than I have spent on some of my bikes!
The price factor is so over looked. Just the road shifters cost so much more, esp hydraulic ones, you can get an entire microshift drivetrain for that price. I would go for Velo orange crazy bars because they are cheaper here in India, and offer almost the same hand position. Think they're lighter than Moloko too
Yeah, I had thought about converting a bike awhile ago to drop bars but the price for road shifter blew that plan up haha. I considered the crazy bars and they’re significantly lighter, but wanted the extra width of the Moloko’s and I’m not too much of a weight weenie on a bike like this.
Which alternative bar brand do you recommend then?
Well done! Any thoughts about what bar bags work best for Moloko's would be great. Seems there isn't much out there for ideas... Thanks again.
Good question. I haven't looked much into bar bags. I know Surly makes one specifically for it, but I'd also guess any bag made for a loop bar (i.e. Jones) would also work on it.
Surly makes a Moloko specific bag, but it is far from waterproof. Nice bag, but the design puddles water on the top and everything inside gets wet (I live in the Pacific NW).
This bike was really easy to assemble ruclips.net/user/postUgkxMesz3KOGEmwmvyKQfLfrRSUXLFzfVHZA and required very few adjustments out of the box. The wheels did not require any truing/adjustments. The frame had some small scratches, but nothing major.I did replace the seat though - the seat it came with was very uncomfortable. The tires need to be re-inflated every 4-5 days, but this appears to be quite common for the narrow 700x25 tires.Overall, in my opinion, this bike looks and rides like a much more expensive bike.
In terms of comfy, is it better compared to loop bar?
Being a cyclocross fan and seeing the evolution of the gravel bike from CX bike I still foolishly think its sacrilege to remove the drop bar. However, while admitting that if they went to a flat bar in CX I would instantly stop watching I completely see the sense for a different style of bar in gravel riding. I have an old Scott AT-3 bar in my bike shed that constantly beckons me to install on my gravel bike. Who knows.
Wide flared dropbars may be good option?
Inverted near parallel Nitto North Road Club bars are the go. Great for winding between cars & are very comfy. Plus make it much better for keeping an eye on traffic instead of the front tyre running over cracks on the road. Or obsessing about tyre spacing in a weekend fantasy peloton run to the cafe with all the other plastic helmeted Lycra fanatics, so when one slips all nearly all the rest go down too. Why non racing cyclists on dropbar bikes do this is beyond me. Cyclist commuters on normal bikes don’t bunch up like that.
i love my drop bars.
I'm an old school MTB rider and definitely interested in these for my new gravel bike.. Do you ride much single track with these? I feel like the 34deg of sweep might be a bit much for trail
I haven't ridden any true singletrack on them, but a lot of very rough doubletrack. I think the sweep is totally fine for it. I had used Jones Loops before and found those to have too much sweep for my liking on trails, but they're 45deg of sweep which is quite a bit more.
Great video thinking of doing the same thing. What size stem did you go with?
Thanks, it’s a 70mm stem.
this over mtb hb with aero bars attachment?
Drops are not meant for serious gravel, you just need much more torque and lever to control the bike even without any package.
This was just the info I've been digging to find. I have wanted to put alt bars on a gravel or something tour-y like a Kona Sutra. This info helps show that it can be done! Thank you! I've got a question though: would you still go for the same frame and stem dimensions as you would with the drop bars your standard gravel bike comes with or would you need to make some adjustments?
If I'm going with a mountain bike frame as the base, I typically look for one with a shorter reach and taller stack. If I can't find that though, I'll either size down or use a shorter stem with some rise.
I see. I thought the video was about converting a gravel frame (which generally come with drop bars) to an alt bar system.
Sorry that was kind of an incomplete response I gave haha. On a gravel or drop bar focused bike I’d use the same stem at first and see how that feels…there’s a good chance it’ll work just fine, but it’ll depend on the bars you’re using. You may actually end up wanting a longer stem because it can feel cramped due to the loss of reach that’s built into drop bars.
@@RideYearRound Righto! I understand after looking back and doing a bit more research, but this makes sense due to the drop bar reach. Thanks for the follow up :)
As an older rider, back sensitivity not to mention extra weight and extra cargo on the gut area, I find the typical bull horn position becomes more of an irrate and inconvenience 😝.
Not to mention the repeated swerving on the roads, due to a poor maintained city with infinite potholes that even car drivers tend to fear. Thus without a doubt this bars become the ideal biking option!
Thanks for your vid, beautiful biking environment btw! Where was that ???
Potholes are brutal to ride in! The videos are all in SW Montana.
@@RideYearRound thanks !
All this research just to conclude I should keep the bars I have, thanks
Would you be willing to post a video of how to wrap tape on these handlebars?
Yes I'll post a vide of that at some point. I've been thinking of re-wrapping them with some additional bar coverage.
I always thought of Gravel bikes as something the marketing department thought up to sell more bikes. Don't we already have something that can ride on gravel? They're called MTBs. Why the hell would I change out the wheels on a road bike to go ride on gravel?
Dude the color of your bike is insane and i am looking exactly for that color. How can i get my hands on it?
Unfortunately I no longer own this bike. It's a Surly color called "Spray Tan Orange"...basically an orange tinted clear coat...it's pretty sweet looking.
@@RideYearRound I see its a 2015er model as well... Thanks for your answer
Question i moved my bar ends to the inside and it seemed to me I was going slower. While at the same time I could climb with them better. Why?
I’m not sure why you’d be going slower so maybe it just feels that way but you’re actually going faster.
@@RideYearRound could be or perhaps it's due to the fact the bar ends are short and the stem is short but I can climb better in this position
Not a fan of being in the drops. I stay on the hoods or on the bar. I might have to consider an Alt bar.
I am a fan of drop bars myself but I have a serious question about the statement made at 3:17 about bombing down a steep grade clinging to your hoods...why are you on the hoods during a descent? That is the position of least control and if this is your general method for descents or tackling difficult terrain then I understand exactly why dropbars aren't your favorite for off road.
I didn’t mean to imply that was the best method on drop bars, I just meant it’s not a very fun experience and since you can’t always predict how steep something is or when you’ll hit a descent, you might find yourself in that position (speaking from experience). The drops definitely give you the most control with access to the brakes, shifters, etc.
@@RideYearRound Yeah sorry didn't mean to come off confrontational at all. It is definitely a different feeling being head first into tech terrain though. I found once I added a dropper to my bike that all the descents I thought were sketchy got a lot easier in the drops. Before that I had my seat trying to push me OTB on even some relatively mellow descents.
No worries I didn’t take it that way, just wanted to explain it. Appreciate the comment. Droppers make a huge difference, I didn’t quite get it at first but I’m converted now.
Nothing better that dropbar...
where can i get those white buttons to cover the hole at the top of the horns?
They are just the bar end plugs that come with most road bike bar tape or can be bought separately as well.
@@RideYearRound thanks very much!
At last... some manufacturers are starting to realize they can be more creative than the conventional standards with their handlebar designs
I’m enjoying the bike so far ruclips.net/user/postUgkxMesz3KOGEmwmvyKQfLfrRSUXLFzfVHZA My only real complaints are the brakes and the pedals. I feel like a bike designed for bigger people should have much larger pedals and more heavy duty brakes. I’ve only gotten two really good rides out of it, minimal downhill action, and the brakes feel like they’re already going out. A larger person has more momentum, so I think this wasn’t thought through very well. Also, I wear size 13-14 wide shoes. My feet cramp up on these pedals that are clearly made for smaller feet. Since I’m not a pro rider (and I don’t think many are who purchase this bike) I don’t think that the straps on the pedal are necessary at all. None of this takes away from the enjoyment I get from riding, however. I’ll just head to a bike shop to improve on a few things.
Where can you find these bars
Any QBP/Surly/Salsa dealer should be able to get a hold of some. There might be some significant backorder time. I got mine from Tree Fort Bikes.
Which are better; Surly Moloko or Jones H bars?
Jones H Bars are lighter, but Moloko’s offer additional hand positions. I really like both, but would probably use the Jones for a more off-road exclusive bike and the Moloko’s when wanting to ride on the road/longer stretches of nice gravel.
@@RideYearRound so you don't use xc/honk position on Jones?
@@b75723 Yes I did when I used them on my bike, but the Moloko has an additional position because of the horns that I actually find to be more comfortable.
As a rider with both carpal tunnel syndrome and ulnar nerve problems I have tried multiple bar types. Flat bars are a no-go unless they have good bar ends, IMO Jones bars are over-hyped, they have the same 45 degree sweep as upright bars have had for the last 100 years, Crazy bars are nice and offer more hand positions but still have the 45 degree sweep, for me Molokos are the best; 33 degree sweep works better for me and the short "horns" are very comfortable. Plus, I am a Surly fan..... 4 Surlys, 3 Molokos and one Crazy! I gave the Jones bar to a nonprofit bike shop.
@@paulgoogins4022 how about the surly terminal bars sir? they have alot of rise but no horns..
I wish there was a version of these WITH the traditional drop handlebars still incorporated, it would be perfect.
Take a look at the redshift kitchen sink bar or Surly corner bar. The corner bar looks awesome but it weighs too much ima.