@@charismatic9467or maybe, you’re just too sensitive. We can go back and forth name calling but at the end of the day if the frame rate doesn’t bother them it doesn’t bother them. It didn’t bother me either. Still not blind.
@@sayzar9474 Nice cope. You’re just blind. In more ways than one. Literally and figuratively blindly a fanboy. The framrate and performance are objectively bad. It’s not an opinion it’s a fact. Still a good game, but you’re just blind and objectively in the wrong
"Need I mention that the Imprisoning War was explained four separate times because the game wouldn't know what order I was going to tackle the dungeons in." This is my biggest grip with open world storylines. Pokemon Scarlet and Violet suffer from a variant of this as well. Echoes of Wisdom proves that linear story and open world mechanics are not mutually exclusive, and I hope to see more games like this.
I don’t know why developers struggle (or purposefully choose) with this problem. Just have a generic cutscene happen after # of dungeons have been defeated. Or heck with TotK, just have a character moment of that specific region’s character from the past, like those BotW vignettes. Then once you beat them all, show that Imprisoning War scene. I think they even do have cutscenes of those characters preparing for that war… it should’ve just been that.
Interestingly, the developer interviews published recently tell of how the devs listened to feedback understand now that the lore means a lot to the fans so they had a huge session discussing the plot. It is a good sign for them moving forward and perhaps taking the lore more seriously.
I don't care for them making every old game's story relevant to the new games; it would end up making things unnecessarily messy and take the focus away from the individual character stories and moments the games do so well. I just want them to be straight up about how they go about it and not set expectations for a clear cut timeline without actually writing the games with it in mind.
@@speedude0164 just because it's relevant doesn't mean it needs to be messy...see wind waker- a blatant sequel very clearly set after OOT but with entirely it's own unique story. It's when the Devs sent mixed and confusing messages that makes story concepts messy
@@Dd-fb2tj I may not have explained that the best. I just worry that if you take this over-arching story and just keep on adding more and more and more to it for so long, things will just become unnecessarily convoluted. I also don't really care for the whole idea of a Hero and Princess constantly being destined to fight a Demon King especially with them being the same people (though I view Link and Zelda more as symbols of the hero and princess respectively from us gamers' perspective while the actual people are completely different). That said, Wind Waker is easily the best execution of this concept, and I especially love how it continues Ganondorf's story from Ocarina of Time.
@@speedude0164it's a fair point. I suppose one person's convoluted is another's puzzle/mystery. I love it personally but do appreciate the preference for completely independent stories like final fantasy...agreed wind wakers story was outstanding
@@Dd-fb2tj I am a huge fan of Metroid lore, and I also surprisingly enjoy how Axiom Verge doesn't explicitely state what's happening and just leaves vague hints throughout. When playing the Zelda games, I don't really see them being benefitted by the stories of past games, but I don't wanna try and take that away from you if you do. Video games can be about a whole lot of different things for a whole lot of people after all.
Idk why but frame rate has never been an issue for me. The objects are moving idk if I’m not looking closely enough or what but it has never taken away from a games experience for me lol
From my experience, the worst areas were outside or specifically when you were talking to npcs. It mostly went away when you went inside, since it wasn't having to render as much of the world. Link's Awakening Remake had similar issues.
Different people can ask for different things, to me it's obvious it should have been capped at 30. Those who can't stand anything below 60 won't get it half the time anyway in this game, so what's the point, if anything it's more jarring.
This game proved to me that what a lot of what the community surmised after BotW dropped could be done if they simply tried. You can have a grand open world adventure with a structured linear story. Oh, and the Pieces of Hearts, I have never been so excited to find a PoH while just exploring the world, instead of just more Rupees, a food item I can make myself or a material I can easily gather. I hope the next 3D Zelda has PoH. The exploration aspect of an open world needs it.
This is admittedly kinda dumb, but I've always disliked Pieces of Heart as a kid as it felt so unsatisfying to find a heart shaped treasure and still be so far from actually getting a new heart. These days I'm mostly indifferent about them.
Why do people complain about the menu?!!!! Has anyone tried to go to the main menu, select any amount of echoes they want to use, and all those echoes will be available in the “last used” when pressing the Y button in the menu. So it is no longer a problem!
played the whole game and i dont know how people complain about framrate drop lol, had it like 3-4 times in 20 hours of playing the game. people just be hating on anything
Reminds me of castlevania symphony of the night. Starts as a character, defeat boss, character gets in trouble, another character appears and saves that character later. Summon things. Some puzzels.
I love the Platboom so much. It's not getting enough appreciation in reviews! The Platboom and the flying floor tile were major for me. Used the ignizol pretty much start to finish and adored the electric wizrobe from the moment I got it. And the spiders of course. Yay spiders. Didn't even bother with my own bombs wasting my meter when I have a fish.
Not sure what you mean by a lackluster story. I mean, sure it's not QUITE at the levels of OoT through SS, but there's plenty of good story and lore. The final boss is interesting in that the three Goddesses have a nemesis now, akin to Hylia having her nemesis in Demise. Sure, he's destroyed by the end of the game, but only in the (presumably) fallen timeline. But new lore aside, a lot of the character stories for dungeon quests are interesting as well. From the two Zora rulers who have a very obvious school playground crush on each other, to the Goron chief learning to rule in his own way, and OMG Conde
08:02 BY DESIGN ZELDA GAMES ARE NOT ABOUT STORY. This fact doesnt mean a zelda game cant have a good story, failing to understand this is part of why your take is wrong. The sad thing is that this has being occasionally pointed out by developers yet you guys insist about plot being a central element.
My framerate was never an issue, but then again, I have opened up the switch to clean out dust and replace the thermal paste, so mine probably runs a little better than the average 7 year old switch.
Yeah, the story actually going back to the roots and actually pushing the world building and then even actively using the old traditional world building from old games as pertinent plot points to the current lore is absolutely what pushed this game from a C-tier to an A-tier game for me (settling it at second rank below TWW and ST and right next to ALBW). It already had a pretty solid feeling to it, nice blend of open overworld while actually solid dungeons (and the main mechanics of the game were able to be well-used not just in one or the other but in *both* (looking at you ultrahand)), but the story going back to... the things it did, made me genuinely excited about what it was adding to the world we knew. The worst thing is absolutely the menu, so I'll be constantly thankful about the journal menu being the way it is. Getting through dialogue to just Get On With Things is also kind of egregious (looking at the dream training and failing and the long process to restarting what you wanna do- that mini-game is honestly the one that made me disinterested in even getting 100% of the game done). The Link's Awakening floor grid makes some interactions act strange and I wish we had a ground marker that showed exactly where an echo would spawn... but ultimately the negatives definitely get overshadowed by the positives. And yeah, I think the Main Quest is about as good a blend as Your Own Choice and linear as I could possibly hope for. BotW and TotK were.... far too open-ended on what you could choose to do next. Yeah there was the Tutorial and then the Base Game and then Beating the Game. But that's nothing compared to linear choices in combination with "you can choose between these two early on and these three later on." Honestly, almost just like how A Link Between Worlds did it! These two go so well hand-in-hand, I would very much consider them sibling games! And then on top of that, it seems like 'Grezzo learned from Nintendo's mistake' in how they presented the knowledge of the game's actual plot in those latter three dungeons. It wasn't just "you get the same run down of information every single time you complete a dungeon" but you actually get the information after each dungeon... in the exact order you complete them. No matter which one you complete first, you will get the post-first dungeon rundown from the person talking to you at the end. The one you complete second? Doesn't matter who's talking to you, that second one will always provide to you the Legend that comes with beating the second of three dungeons. And so on. Fun fact about the central plot piece we're working with, but that was apparently present as far back as 2005, mentioned very briefly in one of the encyclopedia entries in capital letters even directly on Zelda.com!
It's nice that we finally get more lore regarding the 3 goddesses rather than it always being about Hylia. Though the question is where Ganon plays in all this (the lore dump in this game makes most sense if Ganon and Ganondorf are entirely seperate), but that might be a story for another time.
@@sinteleon Oh, Ganondorf and Ganon both just doesn’t play into it at all. He’s just entirely irrelevant to the game’s story really. Every single Ganon we see in the game is an Echo made by Null so. He’s just not relevant.
@@sinteleon I'm not saying Ganon didn't exist previously, but the actual Ganon is not present in this game at all and isn't tied to the game's plot. Every Ganon we see- including the one at the very start -is an echo. The most relevance he has is that he needs to have existed prior to his echo for the echo to exist and that can include before every event that occurs in the game.
@@NajaSide Yes. The other issue is that there was no instance of Triforce or Hylia ever being referred to at all, even though the prime energies are clearly the triforce in everything but name, whereas Demise/Ganondorf comes from a time after Hylia and the Triforce was a thing. (Yes there was a goddess statue, but such statues can be explained by any number of reasons).
The story was the main thing I was worried about (art style aside), so hearing you being positive about it makes me more likely to change my mind and get it
The story is more compelling and well thought-out than I anticipated. Overall I think it’s a very good game, certainly after the first few hours (which are also enjoyable).
I agree everything from the video. I wish there was more dungeons. And also explain what is the connection with a link to the past, it is the same map, but it is never explained if it is a prequel or sequel, anyway, all Zeldas are like this, they don’t fit in a timeline.
Zelda has never been about story. And yes, I played all the games that you mentioned and even the story is a shell. It just facilitates whatever gameplay they wanna build into it I mean tell me anything about link other than that he’s the hero of viral tell me anything about Zelda other than she’s the princess, tell me anything about the history of viral. Tell me anything about the culture of viral there are either no or no consistent answers to these questions because it’s never been about the story.
It has never been & hopefully it would never be about story. Game mechanics & explorstion first. Want plot focused games? Go play Naughty Dog games or watch slome good movies.
This is one of those games that the developers would believe truly captures the idea of playing in a box garden you can put in your desk drawer! I loved being able to basically go anywhere, do anything, and just explore! I uncovered the whole map, but it really didn't break the game...rather there was always revisiting areas I've been to and see what is new. They did a better job here than many previous games where stepping out of bounds causes a glitch. Not here!
People always have to complain instead of enjoying a new experience. It's kinda sad that people hold themselves back with preconceived notions of what these games "should" be.
Because what these games should be has never changed. Some players in the user base are the ones introducing their personal opinions of what the series is about. Exploration & mechanics first. These cohesive lore & plot focus has never being the point. There are other games, genres & mediums for better storytelling. Accept thse games for what they are.
Zelda 1 & Links Awakening on GB are other horrible examples. The incredible thing is that they dont stack enemy types vertically. The menu would be shrinked substantially.
In my opinion going forward. While this game is solid, I would hope that Nintendo would perhaps make a new LoZ game with this same art style but make both Zelda and Link both simultaneously playable and maybe create dungeons around Link being a Hack n slash fighter and Zelda still using Echoes or a similar power that's more centered around magic. I don't mind playing as Zelda but there are times where I kind of missed Link because I felt his hero mechanics would have been way better than the limited sword fighting I got with Zelda.
@@latt.qcd9221 Yea or also similar to in Majora's Mask, there was a spot where you had to alternate between Link and Kafei to get the Sun mask during the couple's mask sidequest.
Dungeons are a sticking point for me, I actually dont like them in most of the games because they revolve around finding an item and fighting a boss with said items. With Echos of wisdom i just enjoy how the dungeons are puzzle and everything you need is there within them. Its a better take on them in my opinion.
I am loving this game. The frame rate is perfectly fine. I didnt even care that much about the menus. I mostly had a smooth experience. The one thing that i didn't like is how accessible healing is. If making bed echoes cost money, that could do a lot to encourage puzzle variety.
Great video Joey! I think most importantly for me, this game shows that Aonuma still knows what makes a Zelda game a Zelda game. After some incredibly frustrating comments from him after the release of TotK (i.e. Classic Zelda fans only like the old formula because nostalgia and that they basically fixed the dungeons issue with TotK), I was feeling pretty dejected about the future of the series. I didnt have faith in Aonuma being capable anymore of producing a Zelda game with restrictions, real puzzles, DUNGEONS, a sense of progression, and respect for previously established lore. All this to say, Echoes had all of this and I'm now incredibly hopeful for the next 3D Zelda. If they can incorporate more of the classic elements into the next game, I think it could be incredibly special.
His new comments from the dev interviews from this game suggest they are taking the lore more seriously now and had a huge session discussing the plot. You should read if you have not already
@@Dd-fb2tj I did read it before playing the game and I was very skeptical. I'm glad that it ended up not just being lip service and actually bore fruit!
I highly doubt the "zero restrictions" thing is much more than just the main gimmick of BotW and TotK. It'll certainly be an inspiration for the next few games, but I view it the same way as the boat in WW, the wolf in TP and the motion controls in SS. You can't really take this concept much further than it was taken in TotK; good luck carrying a whole series with just that. 😂
Aonuma is just a producer and has usually no impact on production at all! Aonuma’s last Zelda was Twilight Princess. Skyward Sword, Botw and Totk are directed by Fujibayashi!
I’m actually glad you enjoyed EoW game! I just 100% complete everything and beat the final boss last night in that order like I have in the past Zelda games! I admit it’s far from perfect cause of the frame rate and how the game being played differently then traditionally Zelda games where you slash and used items. But on EoW is different then playing as Zelda, we actually get to solved puzzles from using echos, playing traditional dungeons we all missed and have the story go through instead of just face the final boss too early. So yeah, I really enjoyed playing EoW a lot! I hope Nintendo plans to create more Zelda games where we can play Zelda again. I don’t mind if there’s gonna be a sequel with the same art style of EoW or a new art style. I just hope it’s gonna be the best for Zelda’s character like we saw on EoW! 😄
8:26 This! This part right here! If there was anything Echoes of Wisdom did perfectly, it was the dungeons. While I did enjoy the Divine Beasts from BotW and even the regional temples from TotK, I greatly enjoyed the dungeons from Echoes of Wisdom. They actually made me realize just how much I missed traditional Zelda dungeons that are not split up into 120 different shrines scattered across the land. I also loved how certain parts of the dungeons could be solved multiple ways. It made me excited to keep advancing the story so I could see what dungeon awaited me next.
@@FerrisWheelPro Yeah, I looked back and it's been 11 years since the last traditional anything (remakes aside- Link's Awakening Remake, you did great). Like ALBW was the last game to have proper linear but also open choice, 11 years since that Ganon design, 11 years since proper dungeons, 11 years since the Triforce being plot-important enough to actually be called out by characters, and so on. There's so many connections between the games, and that so easily extend to theories tying them together. It's almost impossible for me to not look at them side by side.
Here are the 4 most important echos in the game 1 Crawtula: skip the water temple 2 Flying tornado enemy: bed flying across Hyrule 3 Bed: it's broken 4 a Sign: yes literally the sign echo is literally one of the most broken things as paired with the bed it allows you to wrong warp into the final boss skipping 99% of the game and beating it in about somewhere around 33min The crawtula and bed to skip 99% of the water temple is not even using any glitches it's just actual game mechanics, though i assume the tornado enemy and the bed interaction is not exactly working as intended but it's definitely not a glitch. The only glitches in the any% speedrun are the wrong warp which uses the sky box to void out into the final boss and a glitch to get around a softlock so you can progress in the final chambers. Without getting around a softlock Link is literally not there and you can't beat the game but once you get to the actual final boss fight itself Link is pretty much doing all the work so you get to play as Tetra from the Wind waker pretty much lol
I was so worried that Echos of Wisdom was going to be too much like BOTW and TOTK and that I would not like it. I am sooooo glad that I was wrong! EoW is such a nice satisfying breath of fresh air after the clunky, tedious all hell TOTK! My only complaints are the terrible long scrolling list for Echos, and I wish the game itself was longer. It is by no means my favorite Zelda game, but it is quite fun! Maybe I'm just blind or something because I never noticed any lagging or frame rate drops. Just to be clear, I don't *HATE* BOTW and TOTK, but they also are just not quite right for Zelda. And TOTK was very clunky and grindy and tedious.
YOU WERE WRONG ABOUT ECHOES & ABOUT OPEN AIR ZELDAS IN GENERAL. 00:24 "carefully designed dungeons & emotionally satisfying story" can be qualities of open air zeldas, but its up to developers to achieve that. Your claim its easy to debunk since in your traditionsl zelda games not all dungeons are good & not all games have good stories or good story telling. Saying the contrary about plot would imply that zelda games should become jrpgs since some of the best stories in videogames came from that genre.
I skipped the Wii generation so I played TP after Breath came out and SS after finishing Tears. I felt TP was outdated and basically Ocarina 2.0, SS, while I liked it more than TP mainly because it didn't have wolf link, also had all the signs of a franchise that was getting behind the times. I don't know if they can go back to a true "classic" zelda title, the game has to offer something new unless it's a remake.
It’s kind of the opposite. No one is making 3D Zelda like games, so it would be “new” (not new because we’ve had them, but new as in unique to everything else being made). Whereas everyone is making open-world games. There’s a happy between the two styles, but that would require making good dungeons/puzzles or having some minimal restraint (only # of dungeons are accessible, then a story cutscene related to those events plays OR they’re all available but you have a more generic cutscene play after # dungeons completed to move the story along). But they have no interest in that. Even Echoes of Wisdom doesn’t have anything really new about it. The mechanics are taken from BotW/TotK, the art style from LA Remake, and 99% of the characters/races are recycled from other games. They didn’t even change the UI (the boxes) to look different even if they wanted to keep it mechanically the same. It’s literally the same images. You didn’t get that in any other Zelda game unless it was a direct sequel maybe, and even then I think that was only the case for Majora’s Mask and not Sprit Tracks or even Phantom Hourglass (in relation to Wind Waker).
I wasn't wrong about The Legend of Zelda Echoes of Wisdom because it's that GOOD, but a BETTER than I tought creating things like tables, boxes and beds making a way up and using animals and enemies to help your adventure I LOVE how this is just like The Legend of Zelda Link's Awakening art style, give easily a 10/10 score this has one of the BIGGEST potential to be GOTY 2024 too and you play as Princess Zelda herself to save the Hero of Hyrule Link himself and it's still NOT The Legend of Link: Well EXCEUSE ME PRINCESS! 😅
Puzzles can be solved in multiple ways - that translates into meaning that you can effectively evade the puzzles - almost like cheating which really breaks the immersion in places.
Don't see how that would break immersion so much as enhance it, technically. It might break a more enjoyable experience by essentially "hacking a solution" rather than having that "A-Ha" moment for figuring out the only correct solution. But being able to bypass a puzzle by using your tools in different ways is more realistic than being like "Well I COULD build a ladder of beds to reach that, but the game won't let me so I GUESS I'll have to raise the lever or whatever."
Not true. The intended solution is always there & its the most obvious one. People hacking solutions are: 1) The 1% creative players. 2) People that have invested many many hours toying with mechanics or are in following playthroughs. 3) A hughe majority of players that self sabotaged the game experience by watching videos withoht even completing the game once naturally. For case 3 theres nothing game design can do, since this ruins even the so called traditional zeldas.
@@Refreshment01 example: In the Eldin volcano level there is an elaborate lava system which is a puzzle to navigate. Yet you can just use a “rock man” to stand on and then put in front of you which totally evades the puzzle and acts like a god mode. No creativity required at all. I agree that when it works it’s great, but when it doesn’t it falls very flat. The problem is that with so many solutions it breaks the puzzle in some areas.
@@Refreshment01 I dunno, not all intended solutions are super obvious. The video guy admits he didn't even know you could glide by holding onto winged echoes because he hacked his way around it.
I like Echoes of Wisdom... but still feel like I’m starved for traditional Zelda games. This is definitely a step up from Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom though.
It sounds like you and I thinking very similar. When I first heard about this game I was very disappointed but after I had played it I can say I like this game much more than Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom. It is not my favourite Zelda game, my favourite games are still A Link to the Past, Twilight Princess and Ocarina of Time but it is a game I can think about to play again in the future but BotW and TotK I played once and no more.
personally i rly dont kno how i feel abt the dungeons in this game. all except the Faron Temple were very easy dungeon for babies to me, tho I haven't rly dug into the final challenge yet, I would've liked a more consistent challenge. For a game called Echoes of Wisdom I wanted it to test my Wisdom more, but the dungeon layouts and puzzles are relatively simple in this game. I'll grant that Faron Temple is definitely better than any botw/totk dungeon, but as for all the others, I'm honestly not really sure how I feel yet. Anyway all these games get a Not Enough Fishing Rod/10 for me
The echoes menu really hurts the experience. It was the same for me with TOTK. I wish they at least would've put in a separate weapons based echoes menu from the other. That and/or a customizable menu. It's lazy on their part and frustrating on ours. "Oh I need the trampoline. Let me scroll through a hundred echoes to get to it. Ok, the trampoline's are set but now I'm being attacked, so let me scroll back a hundred echoes to activate a Darknut. Oh crap here's a puzzle that requires the fire blob thing. etc. etc." It's a pain in the butt. But other than that, like TOTK, the game's fantastic. But Echoes of Wisdom must absolutely be the last time they utilize this menu system.
I agree the menu system is atrocious and, may I add, is even worse than it was in TotK. I honestly stopped using the right button and simply opened the menu by pressing start whenever I wanted to switch echoes.
Yeah, I think- considering there were several unused buttons in the game, assigning echoes to multiple buttons at once could've really helped with that too- either assigning them like traditional Zelda games or like choosing favorite echoes like how you'd have Faved spells in Kingdom Hearts (weird choice to reference, I know). It'd be such an easy way to have enemies assigned plus also maybe an echo that's tied less to combat. Or maybe if you want all combat echoes, easy way to choose a favorite squadron setup and swap between them at will.
@@NajaSide All I would want is a button (like X or Y) to press above certain echoes so I can assign them as favorites. Then swap the menu around so your favorite echoes can show up first. It's not hard nor asking for too much.
@@JohnnyYeTaecanUktena It depends on how its being pronounced. Those kinds of shouts are called 気合 or "kiai" in Japanese. One of these is イヤー or "Iya" which can sound like "hiya" or "hya" depending on how the person says it. It's usually used for things like powerful strikes and blows.
Your feelings about TotK and BotW is exactly how I feel about it about those games. And TotK especially felt more like a chore. I wasn't fond of how much story it lacked, the new characters were meh, even more Koroks and it destroyed the fun of house building cuz it was still limited and the new areas were for most of it empty. EoW was a fun. I liked the story, the map gave me aLBW and LA vibes of course, which I loved and there were a lot of OoT references. One of my top fav Zelda Game. Yes I am boring and old fashioned.
When I first started playing, I was pretty upset that the Sword mechanic pretty much makes the echoes useless in combat. And I still think that actually. There is no real incentive to only stick with echoes to kill things. Its faster and more fun to just transform into Link, and I think Nintendo knew this but couldn't find a way to make the echoes work better in combat, especially when it comes to bosses. The hardest part about using echoes in combat is having the patience to actually wait and have them kill everything while you run in circles
Players are the reason sword mechanics make echo combat trivial. Nintendo could have easily cut the respawing sword crystsl amounts to force players to rely on smoothoes to fill the sword bar. But them you woule have a ton of players complaining about it.
Not the I WAS WRONG video hahaha. I'm glad Nintendo listened to you. After about 5 hours in, this game is insultingly simple and easy, therefore dare I say.....kinda boring. I like that they're blending a lot of elements from the previous games. That is cool. Seeing menus and quest icons like this in a chibi Zelda game is surreal. The game still feels like a dream. Kinda funny though that even Nintendo can't make games that run on Nintendo hardware anymore.
you realise it's quicker to heal on the bed if you lay down heal the hearts get up then lay down again. especially doing this when you get zeldas bed you heal loads of hearts very quickly. your welcome 😊
I'm loving this game. It's just a refreshing experience, I hope playing as Zelda becomes a thing, although it worries me the recent games have made the protagonists devoid of any personality whatsoever. Why Nintendo? Give them something other than a blank stare!
The whole reason Link is devoid of personality is because Link isn't a "character" in the same way that other Nintendo characters are. He was intended to be a "proxy" for the player.
Re: Zelda (as a protagonist) and Link not talking... This might be controversial but I really hope Nintendo lets them talk in a future game. There's a live action movie coming out and are we going to have a mute Link in it too? There's no better time to get rid of this outdated silent protagonist thing than now.
Dialogue and voices for Link break immersion because, much like Gordon Freeman from Half-Life, Link is just a proxy for the player. He's very different from other Nintendo characters in that respect. Also, with how badly they screwed up the dialogue for Breath of the Wild, I wouldn't want them giving Link a voice and dialogue, anyways.
you are a boomer zelda fan-- well i am a greatest generation zelda fan and it is no accident there was a chorus of us immediately upon the release of BOTW praising the heavens that FINALLY the promise of that first game had finally become realized... Go back and look at the media surrounding that game - maybe you will get some perspective-- OoT wasn't the first zelda game nor was LTtP
People say this implying BotW is the “true” Zelda game because it has free-roaming like the NES game, and also saying everything else are just false/imitations. But that couldn’t be further from the truth. The free-roaming is the only real difference. You know what is in all the other “fake” Zelda games that’s also in the original? Labyrinthian dungeons with multiple floors, puzzles, locked doors, items halfway through a dungeon, items you use in the overworld, musical instruments (or some in-game musical mechanic), and more! And this begs the question… did everyone forget Wind Waker? Sure, the stuff in the sea isn’t that exciting but it exists. I don’t think you can tackle dungeons out of order but that’s not some huge deal anyway. Two more things… 1) Aonuma didn’t make Zelda, and didn’t even work on the series till Ocarina of Time. So he really doesn’t have a say on “what the essence of Zelda was originally supposed to be”. And 2) Even if all the other games are “fake Zelda’s”… they aren’t. You don’t get to make 25 years of games a specific way and then claim “it’s actually not that”. The result (what you produced and what people played) IS what the series was, whether people like it or not. It’s like claiming Mario Kart is actually supposed to be a slot car derby type of racer that takes place on a single flat plane (i.e. no elevation) because the original did. Despite the fact you made 99% of the entries unlike that. And no, technology to make Zelda open world wasn’t a limiting factor. Maybe not climbing or the elemental system, but an open space where you can choose any direction could’ve been done in 2D. They just chose not to.
After the end screen I was like, - okey, that was fun, boring and I dont know - game. Everything felt like cheap storys around the ares. Nothing new. And I really dont use any echoes, just lvl 1 goblin with sword and some beds and waters. Just to pass trought the game. And all the different potions? Did not use any, maybe 3.. okey I am negative right now but I dont feel for this Zelda game. It was ok, nothing more.
As someone older than you, who has played Zelda when you still popped your diapers, that if you think you’ve been critical of Zelda games lately (because of specific ideas that you think make up a Zelda game) then you’re not old enough to know what Zelda games are, or how different each one has been.
There were only 4 games before OoT (the 4th is Link’s Awakening). And two of those (LttP/LA) set/used the formula that would be the structure for 25 years. Zelda 2 plays so far apart, it might as well be considered a spin-off. It’s the only mainline game up to BotW that even played differently, it’s an exception. So you’ve got a total of one other game “on” him/people. And most people have played/tried Zelda NES through the multiple re-releases. You really can’t claim you have much of any authority by playing from the beginning over someone who started at LttP/OoT. Because it’s not a big enough difference in time or entries, and those games are what laid the foundation for decades anyway. You’re grossly over exaggerating how much has “changed” between the beginning and BotW too. Zelda 2 was the only one that was significantly different, and they never tried that again. They followed a very clear structure since LttP, and Aonuma himself admits it. It’s why BotW is different in the first place, he wanted to get away from the formula. For crying out loud, one of the taglines when they announced it was “breaking conventions”. You can’t have a “convention” to break if there isn’t a consistent formula across a large span of time.
I grew up on Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest, so I've always cared more about story and characters. Though, music is important to me as well and I'd argue that music often enhances the story
@@zodiacbraves Those are story-based menu clicking words words words RPGs. Zelda has always been about full player controlled action. They’re not the same.
Echoes isn't a bad game at all. It's just a children's version of Zelda for 8-year-old boys. Quite simple, linear dungeons, repetitive puzzles...it's great if you have little children to play it. I finished it in two days and never died once
I want a new open world Zelda, now lol. I can’t bring myself to play EoW. Not after BoTW or ToTK. My expectations are too high. I absolutely love what Nintendo did with BoTW and ToTK. They have ruined everything else for me. And I’m a long time Zelda fan/player.
Great video but your "complaints" about the 3D games were just dumb. I'm sorry dude. Those games were absolutely groundbreaking and THIS game we cranked through it in about 20 hours and now we have.. about 3-4 years to wait for the next 3D game. "In BOTW/TOTK you can just go straight to the end boss easily" - Letsplayers have done it, but average players would get killed very soon by bad guys. Just remember: you're a YTer, not a game designer. Never forget that.
Breath of the wild and tears of the kingdom are the worst Zelda games ever made echoes of wisdom was mid at best a brain dead monkey could play that game. Nothing will ever beat the first five Zelda games. this new direction they’re taking is just terrible
dont listen to the fake reviews. the game is very dull, the combat is annoying the enemies are boring, the game is way too easy i could go on. long story short this is a 5 out of 10. i did play it to the end but i dont remeber any of the characters, the dungeuns are too easy and generic. its exactly what you think it is. this is like they made a zelda maker game and some kid spent a year making this. if this was 50 dollar title i would be more forgiving but as a full price game this is a joke
Think you’ve also got to remember you’re a grown man and these games are still tailored for families and children. This one specifically is tailored at girls. I know you want things to grow up with you, but Nintendo is and always has been a family/kid company.
Zelda, and pretty much every other game franchise for that matter, isn't just about one specific thing. It takes us on an adventure through which we can find any meaning that resonates the best with us.
Sadly Nintendo doesn't usually count CD-i games as existing, but you're right. The Wand of Gamelon and The Zelda's Adventure were the first ones. The latter of these is also interesting because it is the so-called "Live Acrio video game" for budget reasons and the characters in the game were real people in costumes.
NOPE. Absolutely not. This multiple ways to play BS is just like having 500 cheat codes. Its fine if they keep that to 3d zelda, but how dare they drag classic zelda into this too. Boycott. Will NOT buy. This makes me so pissed off.
So does Echoes of Wisdom get a BOOM or a DOOM?
boom
Boom
Boom boom tiktok
got a ROOM
a big room to improve with respect to frame rate in the new switch
Badaboom! Big badaboom!
Frame rate has never bothered me at all, docked or handheld. Echoes has been great fun. Enjoyed it immensely.
Then you’re blind
@@charismatic9467he didn't say he doesn't see it. He's just not bothered by it.
@@joe_razor The only way to not be bothered by it would is being legally blind. It's genuinely teriible
@@charismatic9467or maybe, you’re just too sensitive. We can go back and forth name calling but at the end of the day if the frame rate doesn’t bother them it doesn’t bother them. It didn’t bother me either. Still not blind.
@@sayzar9474 Nice cope. You’re just blind. In more ways than one. Literally and figuratively blindly a fanboy. The framrate and performance are objectively bad. It’s not an opinion it’s a fact. Still a good game, but you’re just blind and objectively in the wrong
"Need I mention that the Imprisoning War was explained four separate times because the game wouldn't know what order I was going to tackle the dungeons in." This is my biggest grip with open world storylines. Pokemon Scarlet and Violet suffer from a variant of this as well. Echoes of Wisdom proves that linear story and open world mechanics are not mutually exclusive, and I hope to see more games like this.
Yes! I always thought A Link Between Worlds was a good example of how that could work, and so is Echoes of Wisdom.
I don’t know why developers struggle (or purposefully choose) with this problem. Just have a generic cutscene happen after # of dungeons have been defeated. Or heck with TotK, just have a character moment of that specific region’s character from the past, like those BotW vignettes. Then once you beat them all, show that Imprisoning War scene. I think they even do have cutscenes of those characters preparing for that war… it should’ve just been that.
There is story in a Pokémon game that isn’t Black and White?
Completely agree.
@@BullCraftMaxxGen 5 fans try not to mention BW’s story at any opportunity challenge (impossible)
Interestingly, the developer interviews published recently tell of how the devs listened to feedback understand now that the lore means a lot to the fans so they had a huge session discussing the plot. It is a good sign for them moving forward and perhaps taking the lore more seriously.
I don't care for them making every old game's story relevant to the new games; it would end up making things unnecessarily messy and take the focus away from the individual character stories and moments the games do so well. I just want them to be straight up about how they go about it and not set expectations for a clear cut timeline without actually writing the games with it in mind.
@@speedude0164 just because it's relevant doesn't mean it needs to be messy...see wind waker- a blatant sequel very clearly set after OOT but with entirely it's own unique story. It's when the Devs sent mixed and confusing messages that makes story concepts messy
@@Dd-fb2tj I may not have explained that the best. I just worry that if you take this over-arching story and just keep on adding more and more and more to it for so long, things will just become unnecessarily convoluted. I also don't really care for the whole idea of a Hero and Princess constantly being destined to fight a Demon King especially with them being the same people (though I view Link and Zelda more as symbols of the hero and princess respectively from us gamers' perspective while the actual people are completely different). That said, Wind Waker is easily the best execution of this concept, and I especially love how it continues Ganondorf's story from Ocarina of Time.
@@speedude0164it's a fair point. I suppose one person's convoluted is another's puzzle/mystery. I love it personally but do appreciate the preference for completely independent stories like final fantasy...agreed wind wakers story was outstanding
@@Dd-fb2tj I am a huge fan of Metroid lore, and I also surprisingly enjoy how Axiom Verge doesn't explicitely state what's happening and just leaves vague hints throughout. When playing the Zelda games, I don't really see them being benefitted by the stories of past games, but I don't wanna try and take that away from you if you do. Video games can be about a whole lot of different things for a whole lot of people after all.
Idk why but frame rate has never been an issue for me. The objects are moving idk if I’m not looking closely enough or what but it has never taken away from a games experience for me lol
From my experience, the worst areas were outside or specifically when you were talking to npcs. It mostly went away when you went inside, since it wasn't having to render as much of the world. Link's Awakening Remake had similar issues.
Yeah and some people are more sensitive to framerates than others.
I only saw it near the intro in castle town. It’s been smooth everywhere else.
It's light juttering, almost feels like momentary lag. Easy to miss, really.
@@brahtrumpwonbigly7309 right, something soooo insignificant to me it’s not even worth mentioning imo lol
People complained about switch games being locked at 30fps. Now we get an unlocked game and people complain about frame drops. Pick your poison.
It would be good if they let us pick in the settings like you say to pick your poison but they don't let us pick lol
Different people can ask for different things, to me it's obvious it should have been capped at 30. Those who can't stand anything below 60 won't get it half the time anyway in this game, so what's the point, if anything it's more jarring.
This game proved to me that what a lot of what the community surmised after BotW dropped could be done if they simply tried. You can have a grand open world adventure with a structured linear story. Oh, and the Pieces of Hearts, I have never been so excited to find a PoH while just exploring the world, instead of just more Rupees, a food item I can make myself or a material I can easily gather. I hope the next 3D Zelda has PoH. The exploration aspect of an open world needs it.
I felt the SAME way about PoHs!
Actually A Link Between Worlds did it first. You get story bits between however many dungeons you completed no matter the order
This is admittedly kinda dumb, but I've always disliked Pieces of Heart as a kid as it felt so unsatisfying to find a heart shaped treasure and still be so far from actually getting a new heart. These days I'm mostly indifferent about them.
Why do people complain about the menu?!!!! Has anyone tried to go to the main menu, select any amount of echoes they want to use, and all those echoes will be available in the “last used” when pressing the Y button in the menu. So it is no longer a problem!
played the whole game and i dont know how people complain about framrate drop lol, had it like 3-4 times in 20 hours of playing the game. people just be hating on anything
Reminds me of castlevania symphony of the night. Starts as a character, defeat boss, character gets in trouble, another character appears and saves that character later. Summon things. Some puzzels.
That's totally what I had in mind😂
Platboom to get height plus Crow for gliding trumps the bed lol. My most used echo was the Platboom
I love the Platboom so much. It's not getting enough appreciation in reviews! The Platboom and the flying floor tile were major for me. Used the ignizol pretty much start to finish and adored the electric wizrobe from the moment I got it. And the spiders of course. Yay spiders. Didn't even bother with my own bombs wasting my meter when I have a fish.
@@dragontears I also never used the bombs, bomb fish all the way!
I didn't even realize you could kill platboom until postgame
@@TheRealBatabii In a game where you can turn whatever you kill into an echo, you attack everything you see 😅
@@EPS5000 I thought I tried attacking it and it didnt work. And you can't attack them in other games...
Not sure what you mean by a lackluster story. I mean, sure it's not QUITE at the levels of OoT through SS, but there's plenty of good story and lore. The final boss is interesting in that the three Goddesses have a nemesis now, akin to Hylia having her nemesis in Demise. Sure, he's destroyed by the end of the game, but only in the (presumably) fallen timeline. But new lore aside, a lot of the character stories for dungeon quests are interesting as well. From the two Zora rulers who have a very obvious school playground crush on each other, to the Goron chief learning to rule in his own way, and OMG Conde
08:02 BY DESIGN ZELDA GAMES ARE NOT ABOUT STORY.
This fact doesnt mean a zelda game cant have a good story, failing to understand this is part of why your take is wrong.
The sad thing is that this has being occasionally pointed out by developers yet you guys insist about plot being a central element.
Wow, glad that your channel was recommended to me! I always loved your contributions and opinions on gamexplain.
Thank you Jeff! 😁
My framerate was never an issue, but then again, I have opened up the switch to clean out dust and replace the thermal paste, so mine probably runs a little better than the average 7 year old switch.
actually you play as zelda in Super Smash Bros. 2
Hi Jake
Get out.
@@FerrisWheelPro he’s a good friend, is not really interrupting. I missed him.
2 Smash 2 Bros.
2:31 The Pegasus Boots are for dashing. Roc’s Feather and/or Roc’s Cape are used for jumping.
I can't tell if he said that as bait, if he forgot, or if he legit hasn't played the game boy titles.
Yeah, the story actually going back to the roots and actually pushing the world building and then even actively using the old traditional world building from old games as pertinent plot points to the current lore is absolutely what pushed this game from a C-tier to an A-tier game for me (settling it at second rank below TWW and ST and right next to ALBW). It already had a pretty solid feeling to it, nice blend of open overworld while actually solid dungeons (and the main mechanics of the game were able to be well-used not just in one or the other but in *both* (looking at you ultrahand)), but the story going back to... the things it did, made me genuinely excited about what it was adding to the world we knew.
The worst thing is absolutely the menu, so I'll be constantly thankful about the journal menu being the way it is. Getting through dialogue to just Get On With Things is also kind of egregious (looking at the dream training and failing and the long process to restarting what you wanna do- that mini-game is honestly the one that made me disinterested in even getting 100% of the game done). The Link's Awakening floor grid makes some interactions act strange and I wish we had a ground marker that showed exactly where an echo would spawn... but ultimately the negatives definitely get overshadowed by the positives.
And yeah, I think the Main Quest is about as good a blend as Your Own Choice and linear as I could possibly hope for. BotW and TotK were.... far too open-ended on what you could choose to do next. Yeah there was the Tutorial and then the Base Game and then Beating the Game. But that's nothing compared to linear choices in combination with "you can choose between these two early on and these three later on." Honestly, almost just like how A Link Between Worlds did it! These two go so well hand-in-hand, I would very much consider them sibling games!
And then on top of that, it seems like 'Grezzo learned from Nintendo's mistake' in how they presented the knowledge of the game's actual plot in those latter three dungeons. It wasn't just "you get the same run down of information every single time you complete a dungeon" but you actually get the information after each dungeon... in the exact order you complete them. No matter which one you complete first, you will get the post-first dungeon rundown from the person talking to you at the end. The one you complete second? Doesn't matter who's talking to you, that second one will always provide to you the Legend that comes with beating the second of three dungeons. And so on.
Fun fact about the central plot piece we're working with, but that was apparently present as far back as 2005, mentioned very briefly in one of the encyclopedia entries in capital letters even directly on Zelda.com!
It's nice that we finally get more lore regarding the 3 goddesses rather than it always being about Hylia. Though the question is where Ganon plays in all this (the lore dump in this game makes most sense if Ganon and Ganondorf are entirely seperate), but that might be a story for another time.
@@sinteleon Oh, Ganondorf and Ganon both just doesn’t play into it at all. He’s just entirely irrelevant to the game’s story really. Every single Ganon we see in the game is an Echo made by Null so. He’s just not relevant.
@@NajaSide Echo implies a previous existance of it. You can't echo from nothing.
@@sinteleon I'm not saying Ganon didn't exist previously, but the actual Ganon is not present in this game at all and isn't tied to the game's plot. Every Ganon we see- including the one at the very start -is an echo.
The most relevance he has is that he needs to have existed prior to his echo for the echo to exist and that can include before every event that occurs in the game.
@@NajaSide Yes. The other issue is that there was no instance of Triforce or Hylia ever being referred to at all, even though the prime energies are clearly the triforce in everything but name, whereas Demise/Ganondorf comes from a time after Hylia and the Triforce was a thing. (Yes there was a goddess statue, but such statues can be explained by any number of reasons).
The story was the main thing I was worried about (art style aside), so hearing you being positive about it makes me more likely to change my mind and get it
The story is more compelling and well thought-out than I anticipated. Overall I think it’s a very good game, certainly after the first few hours (which are also enjoyable).
I agree everything from the video. I wish there was more dungeons. And also explain what is the connection with a link to the past, it is the same map, but it is never explained if it is a prequel or sequel, anyway, all Zeldas are like this, they don’t fit in a timeline.
I've given up on trying to understand that timeline lol.
You don’t need dialogue cause dialogue is happening in your subconscious, making it different for each player
Zelda has never been about story. And yes, I played all the games that you mentioned and even the story is a shell. It just facilitates whatever gameplay they wanna build into it I mean tell me anything about link other than that he’s the hero of viral tell me anything about Zelda other than she’s the princess, tell me anything about the history of viral. Tell me anything about the culture of viral there are either no or no consistent answers to these questions because it’s never been about the story.
It has never been & hopefully it would never be about story. Game mechanics & explorstion first.
Want plot focused games? Go play Naughty Dog games or watch slome good movies.
Jumping without the Rocs feather/cape bruh ;)
That's the last time I trust Google's AI results. 😤
Beat me to the correction. Don't mean to be a Zeldaxplainer...
This is one of those games that the developers would believe truly captures the idea of playing in a box garden you can put in your desk drawer!
I loved being able to basically go anywhere, do anything, and just explore!
I uncovered the whole map, but it really didn't break the game...rather there was always revisiting areas I've been to and see what is new.
They did a better job here than many previous games where stepping out of bounds causes a glitch.
Not here!
People always have to complain instead of enjoying a new experience. It's kinda sad that people hold themselves back with preconceived notions of what these games "should" be.
Because what these games should be has never changed. Some players in the user base are the ones introducing their personal opinions of what the series is about. Exploration & mechanics first. These cohesive lore & plot focus has never being the point. There are other games, genres & mediums for better storytelling. Accept thse games for what they are.
I'm 35 and.... Zelda games have always had bad menus tbh. Remember the iron boots?
I try not to. 😬
Zelda 1 & Links Awakening on GB are other horrible examples.
The incredible thing is that they dont stack enemy types vertically. The menu would be shrinked substantially.
In my opinion going forward. While this game is solid, I would hope that Nintendo would perhaps make a new LoZ game with this same art style but make both Zelda and Link both simultaneously playable and maybe create dungeons around Link being a Hack n slash fighter and Zelda still using Echoes or a similar power that's more centered around magic. I don't mind playing as Zelda but there are times where I kind of missed Link because I felt his hero mechanics would have been way better than the limited sword fighting I got with Zelda.
That would be awesome. Kinda similar to how partners worked in Wind Waker dungeons but more complex.
So, basically like Spirit Tracks.
@@Jeff-tt7wj More like Spirit Tracks where you actually played with both Link and Zelda throughout the game.
@@latt.qcd9221 Yea or also similar to in Majora's Mask, there was a spot where you had to alternate between Link and Kafei to get the Sun mask during the couple's mask sidequest.
5:15 ''Lately"? As if any Zelda game had good menu ever since Ocarina of Time.
Galoodaladoo
OoT loses the "good menu" stamp solely for the Iron Boots in the Water Temple issue
Least we got Metroid Prime 4 next year
Dungeons are a sticking point for me, I actually dont like them in most of the games because they revolve around finding an item and fighting a boss with said items. With Echos of wisdom i just enjoy how the dungeons are puzzle and everything you need is there within them. Its a better take on them in my opinion.
I am loving this game. The frame rate is perfectly fine. I didnt even care that much about the menus. I mostly had a smooth experience. The one thing that i didn't like is how accessible healing is. If making bed echoes cost money, that could do a lot to encourage puzzle variety.
Great video Joey! I think most importantly for me, this game shows that Aonuma still knows what makes a Zelda game a Zelda game. After some incredibly frustrating comments from him after the release of TotK (i.e. Classic Zelda fans only like the old formula because nostalgia and that they basically fixed the dungeons issue with TotK), I was feeling pretty dejected about the future of the series. I didnt have faith in Aonuma being capable anymore of producing a Zelda game with restrictions, real puzzles, DUNGEONS, a sense of progression, and respect for previously established lore.
All this to say, Echoes had all of this and I'm now incredibly hopeful for the next 3D Zelda. If they can incorporate more of the classic elements into the next game, I think it could be incredibly special.
Thanks Bryce! I was frustrated about Aonuma's comments as well, but I'm hopeful for the future of 3D Zelda.
His new comments from the dev interviews from this game suggest they are taking the lore more seriously now and had a huge session discussing the plot. You should read if you have not already
@@Dd-fb2tj I did read it before playing the game and I was very skeptical. I'm glad that it ended up not just being lip service and actually bore fruit!
I highly doubt the "zero restrictions" thing is much more than just the main gimmick of BotW and TotK. It'll certainly be an inspiration for the next few games, but I view it the same way as the boat in WW, the wolf in TP and the motion controls in SS. You can't really take this concept much further than it was taken in TotK; good luck carrying a whole series with just that. 😂
Aonuma is just a producer and has usually no impact on production at all! Aonuma’s last Zelda was Twilight Princess. Skyward Sword, Botw and Totk are directed by Fujibayashi!
This might be a hot take, but in my opinion eow has the best story
I'd put Echoes of Wisdom in my top 5 in terms of story, alongside Skyward Sword, Twilight Princess, Link's Awakening, and Majora's Mask
I’m actually glad you enjoyed EoW game! I just 100% complete everything and beat the final boss last night in that order like I have in the past Zelda games! I admit it’s far from perfect cause of the frame rate and how the game being played differently then traditionally Zelda games where you slash and used items. But on EoW is different then playing as Zelda, we actually get to solved puzzles from using echos, playing traditional dungeons we all missed and have the story go through instead of just face the final boss too early. So yeah, I really enjoyed playing EoW a lot! I hope Nintendo plans to create more Zelda games where we can play Zelda again. I don’t mind if there’s gonna be a sequel with the same art style of EoW or a new art style. I just hope it’s gonna be the best for Zelda’s character like we saw on EoW! 😄
I agree 100% with your introduction and your opinions on this game. It was definitely a step in the right direction back to the classic Zelda formula.
8:26 This! This part right here! If there was anything Echoes of Wisdom did perfectly, it was the dungeons. While I did enjoy the Divine Beasts from BotW and even the regional temples from TotK, I greatly enjoyed the dungeons from Echoes of Wisdom. They actually made me realize just how much I missed traditional Zelda dungeons that are not split up into 120 different shrines scattered across the land. I also loved how certain parts of the dungeons could be solved multiple ways. It made me excited to keep advancing the story so I could see what dungeon awaited me next.
Isn't it crazy how we haven't had new dungeons like these since A Link Between Worlds (I think)?
@@FerrisWheelPro Yeah, I looked back and it's been 11 years since the last traditional anything (remakes aside- Link's Awakening Remake, you did great). Like ALBW was the last game to have proper linear but also open choice, 11 years since that Ganon design, 11 years since proper dungeons, 11 years since the Triforce being plot-important enough to actually be called out by characters, and so on. There's so many connections between the games, and that so easily extend to theories tying them together. It's almost impossible for me to not look at them side by side.
Beds and Water blocks are so broken. Lol.
Here are the 4 most important echos in the game
1 Crawtula: skip the water temple
2 Flying tornado enemy: bed flying across Hyrule
3 Bed: it's broken
4 a Sign: yes literally the sign echo is literally one of the most broken things as paired with the bed it allows you to wrong warp into the final boss skipping 99% of the game and beating it in about somewhere around 33min
The crawtula and bed to skip 99% of the water temple is not even using any glitches it's just actual game mechanics, though i assume the tornado enemy and the bed interaction is not exactly working as intended but it's definitely not a glitch. The only glitches in the any% speedrun are the wrong warp which uses the sky box to void out into the final boss and a glitch to get around a softlock so you can progress in the final chambers. Without getting around a softlock Link is literally not there and you can't beat the game but once you get to the actual final boss fight itself Link is pretty much doing all the work so you get to play as Tetra from the Wind waker pretty much lol
I was so worried that Echos of Wisdom was going to be too much like BOTW and TOTK and that I would not like it. I am sooooo glad that I was wrong! EoW is such a nice satisfying breath of fresh air after the clunky, tedious all hell TOTK! My only complaints are the terrible long scrolling list for Echos, and I wish the game itself was longer. It is by no means my favorite Zelda game, but it is quite fun! Maybe I'm just blind or something because I never noticed any lagging or frame rate drops.
Just to be clear, I don't *HATE* BOTW and TOTK, but they also are just not quite right for Zelda. And TOTK was very clunky and grindy and tedious.
YOU WERE WRONG ABOUT ECHOES & ABOUT OPEN AIR ZELDAS IN GENERAL.
00:24 "carefully designed dungeons & emotionally satisfying story" can be qualities of open air zeldas, but its up to developers to achieve that. Your claim its easy to debunk since in your traditionsl zelda games not all dungeons are good & not all games have good stories or good story telling.
Saying the contrary about plot would imply that zelda games should become jrpgs since some of the best stories in videogames came from that genre.
I skipped the Wii generation so I played TP after Breath came out and SS after finishing Tears. I felt TP was outdated and basically Ocarina 2.0, SS, while I liked it more than TP mainly because it didn't have wolf link, also had all the signs of a franchise that was getting behind the times. I don't know if they can go back to a true "classic" zelda title, the game has to offer something new unless it's a remake.
It’s kind of the opposite. No one is making 3D Zelda like games, so it would be “new” (not new because we’ve had them, but new as in unique to everything else being made). Whereas everyone is making open-world games. There’s a happy between the two styles, but that would require making good dungeons/puzzles or having some minimal restraint (only # of dungeons are accessible, then a story cutscene related to those events plays OR they’re all available but you have a more generic cutscene play after # dungeons completed to move the story along). But they have no interest in that.
Even Echoes of Wisdom doesn’t have anything really new about it. The mechanics are taken from BotW/TotK, the art style from LA Remake, and 99% of the characters/races are recycled from other games. They didn’t even change the UI (the boxes) to look different even if they wanted to keep it mechanically the same. It’s literally the same images. You didn’t get that in any other Zelda game unless it was a direct sequel maybe, and even then I think that was only the case for Majora’s Mask and not Sprit Tracks or even Phantom Hourglass (in relation to Wind Waker).
I just love this game...
A wholehearted BOOM
i just 100% this game yesterday and i can confidently say this is my favorite 2d zelda game, and probably either a top 3 or 4 zelda game
I would love this version of Zelda in the next Smash Bros, her move set would be crazy
Her Final Smash would be beds.
@@FerrisWheelPro PUT ‘EM TO SLEEP!
2:19 you may laugh at me 2:23 okay okay I can’t take it either.
I wasn't wrong about The Legend of Zelda Echoes of Wisdom because it's that GOOD, but a BETTER than I tought creating things like tables, boxes and beds making a way up and using animals and enemies to help your adventure I LOVE how this is just like The Legend of Zelda Link's Awakening art style, give easily a 10/10 score this has one of the BIGGEST potential to be GOTY 2024 too and you play as Princess Zelda herself to save the Hero of Hyrule Link himself and it's still NOT The Legend of Link: Well EXCEUSE ME PRINCESS! 😅
2:30 - I think you meant the Roc's Feather/Cape.
Yeah it's been a long time since playing Link's Awakening lololol
Echoes is very fun! i enjoyed it more then tears of kingdom. Echoes also have Pokemon vides which i also like.
One of the the best entrees into the zelda series!
Is this Caddicarus' older brother?
Puzzles can be solved in multiple ways - that translates into meaning that you can effectively evade the puzzles - almost like cheating which really breaks the immersion in places.
Don't see how that would break immersion so much as enhance it, technically. It might break a more enjoyable experience by essentially "hacking a solution" rather than having that "A-Ha" moment for figuring out the only correct solution. But being able to bypass a puzzle by using your tools in different ways is more realistic than being like "Well I COULD build a ladder of beds to reach that, but the game won't let me so I GUESS I'll have to raise the lever or whatever."
@@GoeTeeks "bypassing a puzzle". Think you nailed it right there.
Not true. The intended solution is always there & its the most obvious one. People hacking solutions are: 1) The 1% creative players. 2) People that have invested many many hours toying with mechanics or are in following playthroughs. 3) A hughe majority of players that self sabotaged the game experience by watching videos withoht even completing the game once naturally.
For case 3 theres nothing game design can do, since this ruins even the so called traditional zeldas.
@@Refreshment01 example: In the Eldin volcano level there is an elaborate lava system which is a puzzle to navigate. Yet you can just use a “rock man” to stand on and then put in front of you which totally evades the puzzle and acts like a god mode. No creativity required at all. I agree that when it works it’s great, but when it doesn’t it falls very flat. The problem is that with so many solutions it breaks the puzzle in some areas.
@@Refreshment01 I dunno, not all intended solutions are super obvious. The video guy admits he didn't even know you could glide by holding onto winged echoes because he hacked his way around it.
You also play as Zelda in parts of Spirit Tracks.
I really need to play that one of these days. It's on my Wii U. 😁
I like Echoes of Wisdom... but still feel like I’m starved for traditional Zelda games. This is definitely a step up from Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom though.
It sounds like you and I thinking very similar.
When I first heard about this game I was very disappointed but after I had played it I can say I like this game much more than Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom. It is not my favourite Zelda game, my favourite games are still A Link to the Past, Twilight Princess and Ocarina of Time but it is a game I can think about to play again in the future but BotW and TotK I played once and no more.
"Switch to Zelda" lol
personally i rly dont kno how i feel abt the dungeons in this game. all except the Faron Temple were very easy dungeon for babies to me, tho I haven't rly dug into the final challenge yet, I would've liked a more consistent challenge. For a game called Echoes of Wisdom I wanted it to test my Wisdom more, but the dungeon layouts and puzzles are relatively simple in this game. I'll grant that Faron Temple is definitely better than any botw/totk dungeon, but as for all the others, I'm honestly not really sure how I feel yet.
Anyway all these games get a Not Enough Fishing Rod/10 for me
That’s good!
The echoes menu really hurts the experience. It was the same for me with TOTK. I wish they at least would've put in a separate weapons based echoes menu from the other. That and/or a customizable menu. It's lazy on their part and frustrating on ours.
"Oh I need the trampoline. Let me scroll through a hundred echoes to get to it. Ok, the trampoline's are set but now I'm being attacked, so let me scroll back a hundred echoes to activate a Darknut. Oh crap here's a puzzle that requires the fire blob thing. etc. etc."
It's a pain in the butt. But other than that, like TOTK, the game's fantastic. But Echoes of Wisdom must absolutely be the last time they utilize this menu system.
I agree. There has to be a better menu design!
I agree the menu system is atrocious and, may I add, is even worse than it was in TotK. I honestly stopped using the right button and simply opened the menu by pressing start whenever I wanted to switch echoes.
Yeah, I think- considering there were several unused buttons in the game, assigning echoes to multiple buttons at once could've really helped with that too- either assigning them like traditional Zelda games or like choosing favorite echoes like how you'd have Faved spells in Kingdom Hearts (weird choice to reference, I know). It'd be such an easy way to have enemies assigned plus also maybe an echo that's tied less to combat. Or maybe if you want all combat echoes, easy way to choose a favorite squadron setup and swap between them at will.
@@AzurePipthat's a faster route IMO
@@NajaSide All I would want is a button (like X or Y) to press above certain echoes so I can assign them as favorites. Then swap the menu around so your favorite echoes can show up first. It's not hard nor asking for too much.
2:54 Etika 🥹🥹🥹
I hung out with him a few times and he was the kindest soul.
@@FerrisWheelPro That’s so cool man! I wish I got to meet him 💙
Hya is a syllable
Oof you got me.
Actually two as "Hi" and "Ya"
@@JohnnyYeTaecanUktena It depends on how its being pronounced. Those kinds of shouts are called 気合 or "kiai" in Japanese. One of these is イヤー or "Iya" which can sound like "hiya" or "hya" depending on how the person says it. It's usually used for things like powerful strikes and blows.
@@latt.qcd9221 dude stop nit picking
@@JohnnyYeTaecanUktena Lol you can't complain about nit-picking right after you nit-pick, yourself.
Your feelings about TotK and BotW is exactly how I feel about it about those games. And TotK especially felt more like a chore. I wasn't fond of how much story it lacked, the new characters were meh, even more Koroks and it destroyed the fun of house building cuz it was still limited and the new areas were for most of it empty.
EoW was a fun. I liked the story, the map gave me aLBW and LA vibes of course, which I loved and there were a lot of OoT references. One of my top fav Zelda Game. Yes I am boring and old fashioned.
What’s wrong with dudes eyes? Lol
You like skyward sword
K
When I first started playing, I was pretty upset that the Sword mechanic pretty much makes the echoes useless in combat. And I still think that actually. There is no real incentive to only stick with echoes to kill things. Its faster and more fun to just transform into Link, and I think Nintendo knew this but couldn't find a way to make the echoes work better in combat, especially when it comes to bosses. The hardest part about using echoes in combat is having the patience to actually wait and have them kill everything while you run in circles
Players are the reason sword mechanics make echo combat trivial. Nintendo could have easily cut the respawing sword crystsl amounts to force players to rely on smoothoes to fill the sword bar. But them you woule have a ton of players complaining about it.
Not the I WAS WRONG video hahaha. I'm glad Nintendo listened to you. After about 5 hours in, this game is insultingly simple and easy, therefore dare I say.....kinda boring. I like that they're blending a lot of elements from the previous games. That is cool. Seeing menus and quest icons like this in a chibi Zelda game is surreal. The game still feels like a dream.
Kinda funny though that even Nintendo can't make games that run on Nintendo hardware anymore.
Could never make fun of you, being skeptical only to be proven wrong and really enjoying a game is one of the best feelings
Taking a nap in the middle of a fight is the funniest😂
Hate how short and easy it was, although I guess I could play it on hero mode
Do iiiiiiit
Hero mode doesn't change that much, still super easy
Isn't it 20 hours long for the main quest and more for side quests? Longer than other 2d zelda games
Please get a life, leave me alone!! 😂😂 cracked me up lol 😅
2:53 Etika would've LOVED this game. :)
you realise it's quicker to heal on the bed if you lay down heal the hearts get up then lay down again. especially doing this when you get zeldas bed you heal loads of hearts very quickly. your welcome 😊
I'm loving this game. It's just a refreshing experience, I hope playing as Zelda becomes a thing, although it worries me the recent games have made the protagonists devoid of any personality whatsoever. Why Nintendo? Give them something other than a blank stare!
Yeah, I really don't get why they made Zelda protagonists allergic to personality.
The whole reason Link is devoid of personality is because Link isn't a "character" in the same way that other Nintendo characters are. He was intended to be a "proxy" for the player.
We don't talk about the CDI games 💪🏿(chokes out)..............shhhhhhh 🤫
Damn RIP
Re: Zelda (as a protagonist) and Link not talking... This might be controversial but I really hope Nintendo lets them talk in a future game. There's a live action movie coming out and are we going to have a mute Link in it too? There's no better time to get rid of this outdated silent protagonist thing than now.
Dialogue and voices for Link break immersion because, much like Gordon Freeman from Half-Life, Link is just a proxy for the player. He's very different from other Nintendo characters in that respect.
Also, with how badly they screwed up the dialogue for Breath of the Wild, I wouldn't want them giving Link a voice and dialogue, anyways.
You can jump off the bed then back on to speed up the healing.
you are a boomer zelda fan-- well i am a greatest generation zelda fan and it is no accident there was a chorus of us immediately upon the release of BOTW praising the heavens that FINALLY the promise of that first game had finally become realized... Go back and look at the media surrounding that game - maybe you will get some perspective-- OoT wasn't the first zelda game nor was LTtP
So you were born in the 1920's?
People say this implying BotW is the “true” Zelda game because it has free-roaming like the NES game, and also saying everything else are just false/imitations. But that couldn’t be further from the truth.
The free-roaming is the only real difference. You know what is in all the other “fake” Zelda games that’s also in the original? Labyrinthian dungeons with multiple floors, puzzles, locked doors, items halfway through a dungeon, items you use in the overworld, musical instruments (or some in-game musical mechanic), and more! And this begs the question… did everyone forget Wind Waker? Sure, the stuff in the sea isn’t that exciting but it exists. I don’t think you can tackle dungeons out of order but that’s not some huge deal anyway.
Two more things… 1) Aonuma didn’t make Zelda, and didn’t even work on the series till Ocarina of Time. So he really doesn’t have a say on “what the essence of Zelda was originally supposed to be”. And 2) Even if all the other games are “fake Zelda’s”… they aren’t. You don’t get to make 25 years of games a specific way and then claim “it’s actually not that”. The result (what you produced and what people played) IS what the series was, whether people like it or not. It’s like claiming Mario Kart is actually supposed to be a slot car derby type of racer that takes place on a single flat plane (i.e. no elevation) because the original did. Despite the fact you made 99% of the entries unlike that. And no, technology to make Zelda open world wasn’t a limiting factor. Maybe not climbing or the elemental system, but an open space where you can choose any direction could’ve been done in 2D. They just chose not to.
After the end screen I was like, - okey, that was fun, boring and I dont know - game. Everything felt like cheap storys around the ares. Nothing new. And I really dont use any echoes, just lvl 1 goblin with sword and some beds and waters. Just to pass trought the game. And all the different potions? Did not use any, maybe 3.. okey I am negative right now but I dont feel for this Zelda game. It was ok, nothing more.
As someone older than you, who has played Zelda when you still popped your diapers, that if you think you’ve been critical of Zelda games lately (because of specific ideas that you think make up a Zelda game) then you’re not old enough to know what Zelda games are, or how different each one has been.
Ok cool guy
There were only 4 games before OoT (the 4th is Link’s Awakening). And two of those (LttP/LA) set/used the formula that would be the structure for 25 years. Zelda 2 plays so far apart, it might as well be considered a spin-off. It’s the only mainline game up to BotW that even played differently, it’s an exception. So you’ve got a total of one other game “on” him/people. And most people have played/tried Zelda NES through the multiple re-releases. You really can’t claim you have much of any authority by playing from the beginning over someone who started at LttP/OoT. Because it’s not a big enough difference in time or entries, and those games are what laid the foundation for decades anyway.
You’re grossly over exaggerating how much has “changed” between the beginning and BotW too. Zelda 2 was the only one that was significantly different, and they never tried that again. They followed a very clear structure since LttP, and Aonuma himself admits it. It’s why BotW is different in the first place, he wanted to get away from the formula. For crying out loud, one of the taglines when they announced it was “breaking conventions”. You can’t have a “convention” to break if there isn’t a consistent formula across a large span of time.
Geez all this hate for view 😂
Zelda’s never been about story. It’s about exploration, action, puzzles, boss fights, and great music. Slap me. 😛
*Viciously rubs hands together.*
Zelda has had plenty of emphasis on story even as early as Link to the Past or Link's Awakening
@@zodiacbravesMaybe it’s because I’m a Gen X 80s kid, but story isn’t my motivator, gameplay/music/art direction is what drives my enjoyment.
I grew up on Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest, so I've always cared more about story and characters. Though, music is important to me as well and I'd argue that music often enhances the story
@@zodiacbraves Those are story-based menu clicking words words words RPGs. Zelda has always been about full player controlled action. They’re not the same.
The dungeons are horrible in echoes of wisdom, they have little to no puzzles and boring enemy fights.
Echoes isn't a bad game at all. It's just a children's version of Zelda for 8-year-old boys. Quite simple, linear dungeons, repetitive puzzles...it's great if you have little children to play it. I finished it in two days and never died once
exactly. 20hours in and all of a sudden, you've beaten the game
2D Zelda was always simple and short, with linear dungeons
Boys AND girls. Nintendo knows that more girls than ever are playing video games and want to feel represented.
@jesusramirezromo2037 I guess you've never played a 2D Zelda, right? If you had, you'd never say a dumb thing like that
@@MrLanarana I've played all of them dude
I want a new open world Zelda, now lol. I can’t bring myself to play EoW. Not after BoTW or ToTK. My expectations are too high. I absolutely love what Nintendo did with BoTW and ToTK. They have ruined everything else for me. And I’m a long time Zelda fan/player.
Great video but your "complaints" about the 3D games were just dumb. I'm sorry dude. Those games were absolutely groundbreaking and THIS game we cranked through it in about 20 hours and now we have.. about 3-4 years to wait for the next 3D game.
"In BOTW/TOTK you can just go straight to the end boss easily" - Letsplayers have done it, but average players would get killed very soon by bad guys.
Just remember: you're a YTer, not a game designer. Never forget that.
game was too simple and repetitive for me
Breath of the wild and tears of the kingdom are the worst Zelda games ever made echoes of wisdom was mid at best a brain dead monkey could play that game. Nothing will ever beat the first five Zelda games. this new direction they’re taking is just terrible
dont listen to the fake reviews. the game is very dull, the combat is annoying the enemies are boring, the game is way too easy i could go on. long story short this is a 5 out of 10. i did play it to the end but i dont remeber any of the characters, the dungeuns are too easy and generic. its exactly what you think it is. this is like they made a zelda maker game and some kid spent a year making this. if this was 50 dollar title i would be more forgiving but as a full price game this is a joke
Think you’ve also got to remember you’re a grown man and these games are still tailored for families and children. This one specifically is tailored at girls. I know you want things to grow up with you, but Nintendo is and always has been a family/kid company.
Zelda games have never been about story. I swear look me in the eye when im talking to you
Zelda, and pretty much every other game franchise for that matter, isn't just about one specific thing. It takes us on an adventure through which we can find any meaning that resonates the best with us.
This actually isn’t the first game you play as Zelda
Ya know i keep forgetting you technically play as Zelda a bit in Spirit Tracks when you give her commands
Sadly Nintendo doesn't usually count CD-i games as existing, but you're right. The Wand of Gamelon and The Zelda's Adventure were the first ones. The latter of these is also interesting because it is the so-called "Live Acrio video game" for budget reasons and the characters in the game were real people in costumes.
As the main character through out the entire gamei it is.
This dude GASPED at lock-on. Your bar is LOW dude. This game was absolutely terrible.
NOPE. Absolutely not. This multiple ways to play BS is just like having 500 cheat codes. Its fine if they keep that to 3d zelda, but how dare they drag classic zelda into this too. Boycott. Will NOT buy. This makes me so pissed off.
You play as zelda in phantom hourglass and that is more mainline than this game is
Wow I don't remember playing as her in that game. Wild.
@@FerrisWheelPro That's because you don't as they are thinking of Spirit Tracks where you control the Phantom that Zelda Possesses
You're thinking Spirit Tracks, which is a phenomenal game. Phantom Hourglass is one of, if not the worst, Zelda game.