The boys go over another tier list. do they have everything in the right place? Instagram: last_alliance_o... Music: Pill R/B Musician: Not The King Music: Lifes alright Musician: Silicon Estate
They really screwed over Théoden. 2 attacks 2 wounds and 1 fate. I mean he is the king of Rohan, hero of legend. Lead the charge on the Pelennor fields. Killed Sulladan in 1v1combat and Haradrim, warg riders/wargs, Uruk-Hai and Morannon Orcs. Compare that to Shagrat. Who has 3 attacks/wounds/might/will/fate All he did was stab some guy and start a civil war in Cirith Ungol over a mithril shirt and then run away from Sam. It basically an insult.
Deorwine's model in person is fantastic, some of the Rohan heroes look excellent on the table. Also seeing a ton of cav across the table is intimidating, absolutely love playing my Rohan!
One thing about Dernhelm. As Merry can use his might to affect Dernhelm, if you keep them near Gamling you can recover Merry's might in the early game without affecting your real heroes.
@@Julesgio absolutely yes. She still has so much potential, heroes underestimate her, she carved through troops and if she’s an early target something big is getting close
Another awesome Tier list Video! :D Listening to you in these Videos feels Like one could sit just next to you and participate in the discussion and have a good time^^ Keep Up the good Work ^^
There is one big thing I hate about the rohan army, and it's Eorl and to a lesser extent, Helm, who pay the price. The list is built around Theoden, which for such a huge army with so many awesome potential generals (theoden, Eomer, Eorl, Helm, Theodred ect) is crippling. Losing the +1 F bubble sucks. It sucks hard. The army bounces off shieldwalls because it can't win fights without Theoden. Poor writing from Jay who mostly does a wonderful job with the rules. Such a restrictive bitch of a rule for such an expansive faction.
It is very much a theoden centric army. Just doesn't click like it should without him, yet I always seem to write lists with him not apart of them. A lil disappointed that such a well rounded faction feel trapped behind it own leader. -Sean
Its why Theodreds Guard and Helms Legion are such enticing LLs, they bring that fight value you're usually getting from Theoden. Why they couldn't make the rule +1 fight within Theoden, Theodred or Eomer, would have made the list much nicer -Liam
@@NoobsandMen Just finished a 10 man local 500pt tournament. Helmsguard LL came 3rd! Having sneaky f5 royal guard definitely helped him out! My Dunland won, with another Dunland list coming 2nd.
@@judgejudyandexecutioner.5223 Love seeing so much Dunland up at the top! I recently won a tournament with Dunland as well. Helms LL is just such a powerful list, Helm getting free might and a free combat is bonkers. Eorl needs a list like that hahaha! -Liam
My favourite thing to do with Aldor in the Defenders Legion is to take him with Banner Gamling. Aldor basically gets 1 might every turn as he always burns it to hit / wound at range and then a heroic move every turn until a “real” hero has run out and needs it more :) Also while typing this you obviously both had a stroke. Kings huntsman… A tier?! What fresh madness is this?! :)
Mate, he's 50 points for a str 3 3+ shoot boy, burning might on heroes or monster wounds and getting all of it back on a kill? absolutely amazing! -Liam
You got both of us commenting on this bad boi. I need to know the reason behind you saying the huntsman shouldn't be in A tier. As Liam mentioned above the huntsman is absolutely amazing. S3 +3 shooting might Regen, only fails in the way on 1s and he only cost 50pts. What's not to love???? Also you can just replace aldor with a huntsman in gamling combo mentioned above for an even more effective killing machine. -Sean
@@NoobsandMen Appreciate it, he is one of my fav characters lore wise as well. In the book he was the one who helped Gandalf save helms deep, not Eomer. He is just an old man that got out of retirement when his king's son died. He and his red shields single handedly saved dozens of west mark villages, and for his efforts he became the Marshall of the West. Such a chad, love him too much.
I rate erkenbrand slightly higher purely for the ability to have small self contained that can flank away with him and still have the banner or allied into a green alliance doing the same thing
You are spot on mate with taking him as a self contained force in a Green alliance. Tho for the purposes of purr Rohan. I think there are heros you are looking at before erkenbrand. Theoden, eomer, deorwine, gamling w/ banner and by this point unless your looking at 1000pts erkenbrand just doesn't feel like he has a solid place. Don't get me wrong I'm a huge fan and he definitely sit on the fence between B and A -Sean
@@NoobsandMen I probably put too much value in the +2C horn purely cause I cant keep squishier heros like theoden alive and worry about what happens after bodyguard goes away
If you were adding Erkenbrand anyway I understand, but Rohan just has so many good heroes in that same points bracket I'd consider over him. Or drop him and his warband entirely and grab a warrior banner and a half dozen royal guards for roughly the same price. -Liam
Genuinely curious as to why you think this?? He is 50pts with might Regen, only hits in the way on a 1, 3+ shooting, S 3 bow. Dead set one of the best hero and monster snipers in game, and if they just have to shoot at regular troops that fine aswell, might to snipe out banners, warhorns, elite troops and so on. I've seen these lads dominate games. One or two in an army is out right amazing. -sean
So I think the captain is C tier. You just never take one. Gamling without the banner and Hama (and you never see hama) are literally just strictly better captains. Rohan has too many damn captain heroes, and they squeeze captains out. Erkenbrand is definitely A tier IMO but you guys came close enough to putting him there. Remember he's a banner for his warband too!
The big difference between hama and cpts is that you can kit out a cpt to suit the army. Hama has no option apart from his horse and a shield, so a worse cpt IMO (yeah sure he get 3 might) Gambling can take the banner and if you are running him you are running the banner. The issue with erkenbrand is that his banner only effects his warband and for the same points as a red shield you can take a Royal guard and I'm taking them every day of the week. His horn is amazing tho. He is definitely on the fence between A and B but I feel more comfortable with him near the top of B. -Sean
@@NoobsandMen I understand your Erkenbrand feelings, I think if you're playing vanilla rohan over riders of theoden or paths, it's to take him. Not sure if that makes him A tier though. If you want a captain on horse, Hama and Gamling are just way better for 5pts. That's how most captains are taken I guess, but yeah, if you want a sneaky different captain, they can be kitted out different.
@@judgejudyandexecutioner.5223 Hama also doesn't have march or throwing weapons, he's just really not as good as a captain in anyway other than the one extra might. -Liam
Nah typically warhorns aren't already included in statlines, like Erkenbrand's warhorn isn't considering there's absolutely no way he'd be courage 2 base. Same with Durin, or Merry in the shire, if you compare their courage to heroes around them it's obvious warhorns aren't added to statlines even if they come in wargear. -Liam
@@NoobsandMen I understand your point, but it is strange this exception, because the shield and armour/heavy armour are always reflected in the stats, if they are in the wargear 🥴
Yeah I get that but context and overall values in each of these heroes armies would easily suggest warhorns are an exception to this usual rule. sadly there's nothing really to confirm or deny this either way in FAQs or the rule books, however from a glance is does specifically state in items like armour and shields that their bonus is included in the models profile if in wargear but does not state the same when talking about warhorns and the like. Personally I'd definitely say there's more going for warhorns bonus not being included in base stats than going the other way -Liam
@NoobsandMen Check the newest army faq it says they can declare which they are targeting and hit on a 2 plus. I'll drop a screenshot in the discord lol
I painted Théoden's horse black lads, Just because i have two models and to paint a white horse on a black primer make me sick 😂 I agree with all but Erkenbrand deserves A TIER for me ... On a Red vs Blue tournament with so much terror models, You NEED to be charging, and i think Is shit to be stomped by a courage test. 7 Is average, 50% models charging. 5 Is much Better, You can rely on Riders to maybe counter an Heroic move, stomp some big Heroes wherever they are ecc. Too much times You NEED a single model to charge and then flop, 6.
Fair point for sure, the warhorn is absolutely the best thing about him. But I still think he doesn't quite hit a their, there's plenty of other Rohan heroes I'd take over him. At higher points sure, he's in for sure, but that's after I've picked up an Eomer or a Theoden and then one of the other captain tier heroes, then I'll likely take him -Liam
@@NoobsandMen im not sure, his+2 courage buff saved me lot of times. You must rely on charge bonus with infantry +1f/s and this is an insurance that You will get! Btw is Just talking, Helm's legendary Is over all 😂
That speaks more of you as a player than the Legion being good. Trash tier armies can still win events, I've done it myself with armies considered trash tier. -Sean
@@NoobsandMen thanks for the compliment! I’ll have to fly over to Australia sometime and see how it does at one of your events as your meta is quite distinct from ours.
They really screwed over Théoden. 2 attacks 2 wounds and 1 fate.
I mean he is the king of Rohan, hero of legend. Lead the charge on the Pelennor fields. Killed Sulladan in 1v1combat and Haradrim, warg riders/wargs, Uruk-Hai and Morannon Orcs.
Compare that to Shagrat. Who has 3 attacks/wounds/might/will/fate
All he did was stab some guy and start a civil war in Cirith Ungol over a mithril shirt and then run away from Sam.
It basically an insult.
A two handed axe mounted warrior would have been a great addition, especially when we see them in the film!
Deorwine's model in person is fantastic, some of the Rohan heroes look excellent on the table. Also seeing a ton of cav across the table is intimidating, absolutely love playing my Rohan!
One thing about Dernhelm. As Merry can use his might to affect Dernhelm, if you keep them near Gamling you can recover Merry's might in the early game without affecting your real heroes.
Tier lists are so much fun to watch, please do more! Maybe combine some of the smaller ones like Fellowship and Throin's Company together
That's already the plan! Gotta get through some of the bigger factions first then do some small ones in the one video.
-Liam
Awesome Video Boys! Great entertainment and informative! I like that you not only did the heroes but also the warriors! :)
Thanks mate! they're heaps of fun to make!
-Liam
Eowyn with no upgrades is a bargain- she always outperforms Faramir in my fourth age alliance list
Fully agree there mate.
-sean
With no armor ? Just a dress and a sword ?
@@Julesgio absolutely yes. She still has so much potential, heroes underestimate her, she carved through troops and if she’s an early target something big is getting close
Yeah, and if you bring Eomer he goes on a murder spree after she inevitably dies, which is great fun
Another awesome Tier list Video! :D
Listening to you in these Videos feels Like one could sit just next to you and participate in the discussion and have a good time^^
Keep Up the good Work ^^
Glad you love the style of videos mate. The whole channel our goal is to try and make you all feel at home and part of the group
-Sean
Really enjoying these. Thanks
So good to hear you are enjoying these.
Thanks for the love.
-sean
I would be Hyped for a Angmar list or Fiefdom in relation to Minas Tirith. Great vid :)
Thanks mate! We'll for sure be getting to them soon enough!
-Liam
You men are doing the lord’s work…thank you.
In MESBGs time of need Eru Ilúvatar sent his two autistic sons to spicy things up.
-Sean
There is one big thing I hate about the rohan army, and it's Eorl and to a lesser extent, Helm, who pay the price.
The list is built around Theoden, which for such a huge army with so many awesome potential generals (theoden, Eomer, Eorl, Helm, Theodred ect) is crippling. Losing the +1 F bubble sucks. It sucks hard. The army bounces off shieldwalls because it can't win fights without Theoden.
Poor writing from Jay who mostly does a wonderful job with the rules. Such a restrictive bitch of a rule for such an expansive faction.
It is very much a theoden centric army.
Just doesn't click like it should without him, yet I always seem to write lists with him not apart of them. A lil disappointed that such a well rounded faction feel trapped behind it own leader.
-Sean
Its why Theodreds Guard and Helms Legion are such enticing LLs, they bring that fight value you're usually getting from Theoden. Why they couldn't make the rule +1 fight within Theoden, Theodred or Eomer, would have made the list much nicer
-Liam
@@NoobsandMen Just finished a 10 man local 500pt tournament. Helmsguard LL came 3rd! Having sneaky f5 royal guard definitely helped him out! My Dunland won, with another Dunland list coming 2nd.
@@judgejudyandexecutioner.5223 Love seeing so much Dunland up at the top! I recently won a tournament with Dunland as well. Helms LL is just such a powerful list, Helm getting free might and a free combat is bonkers. Eorl needs a list like that hahaha!
-Liam
At least the Helm LL makes him better Theoden, but it's still a shame that you kinda gotta take the old man
*Likes video
*Then watches video
Thanks for the support
-Sean
King 👑
Thanks mate!
-Liam
love the content, while your making tier lists would love to see a rivendel one
Thanks mate! One day soon for sure, we'll get to everyone eventually
-Liam
I second this, move Rivendell up that list!!
Cheers for this!!!
Happy you are enjoying it
-Sean
Hama on horse, Rohan’s secret weapon :)
And you accused us of having a stoke... hahaha
-Liam
Yeeeees! Rohan!
All for you baby
-Sean
My favourite thing to do with Aldor in the Defenders Legion is to take him with Banner Gamling. Aldor basically gets 1 might every turn as he always burns it to hit / wound at range and then a heroic move every turn until a “real” hero has run out and needs it more :)
Also while typing this you obviously both had a stroke. Kings huntsman… A tier?! What fresh madness is this?! :)
Mate, he's 50 points for a str 3 3+ shoot boy, burning might on heroes or monster wounds and getting all of it back on a kill? absolutely amazing!
-Liam
You got both of us commenting on this bad boi.
I need to know the reason behind you saying the huntsman shouldn't be in A tier.
As Liam mentioned above the huntsman is absolutely amazing. S3 +3 shooting might Regen, only fails in the way on 1s and he only cost 50pts. What's not to love????
Also you can just replace aldor with a huntsman in gamling combo mentioned above for an even more effective killing machine.
-Sean
I fucking love erkenbrand in pure Rohan, auto include for me tbh
Controversial but mad respect.
Nothing gets me more bricked that running models you like over quote on quote the more optimal option.
-Sean
@@NoobsandMen Appreciate it, he is one of my fav characters lore wise as well. In the book he was the one who helped Gandalf save helms deep, not Eomer. He is just an old man that got out of retirement when his king's son died. He and his red shields single handedly saved dozens of west mark villages, and for his efforts he became the Marshall of the West. Such a chad, love him too much.
Greets from germany :D We say only, Dernhelm is S tier 💪🏽😂
I rate erkenbrand slightly higher purely for the ability to have small self contained that can flank away with him and still have the banner or allied into a green alliance doing the same thing
You are spot on mate with taking him as a self contained force in a Green alliance. Tho for the purposes of purr Rohan. I think there are heros you are looking at before erkenbrand. Theoden, eomer, deorwine, gamling w/ banner and by this point unless your looking at 1000pts erkenbrand just doesn't feel like he has a solid place.
Don't get me wrong I'm a huge fan and he definitely sit on the fence between B and A
-Sean
@@NoobsandMen I probably put too much value in the +2C horn purely cause I cant keep squishier heros like theoden alive and worry about what happens after bodyguard goes away
Im on board with erkenbrand and 2-3 redshields as a flanking force. Its almost like getting a 2nd banner for 2-3 points
If you were adding Erkenbrand anyway I understand, but Rohan just has so many good heroes in that same points bracket I'd consider over him. Or drop him and his warband entirely and grab a warrior banner and a half dozen royal guards for roughly the same price.
-Liam
You should do halls of thranduil tier list
Don't worry mate.
We will get to all the faction.
Just make sure you keep an eye on our community tab so you can vote for the next Faction
-Sean
Kings huntsman A? Not even close
Genuinely curious as to why you think this??
He is 50pts with might Regen, only hits in the way on a 1, 3+ shooting, S 3 bow.
Dead set one of the best hero and monster snipers in game, and if they just have to shoot at regular troops that fine aswell, might to snipe out banners, warhorns, elite troops and so on.
I've seen these lads dominate games.
One or two in an army is out right amazing.
-sean
@@NoobsandMen I’ve never seen the might actually regen. I do often forget the stronger bow so he might need another opportunity in my lists
@@NoobsandMen It Is not a unique character?
@@Sierra117Masterchief00 no you can take as many as you wish
So I think the captain is C tier. You just never take one. Gamling without the banner and Hama (and you never see hama) are literally just strictly better captains. Rohan has too many damn captain heroes, and they squeeze captains out. Erkenbrand is definitely A tier IMO but you guys came close enough to putting him there. Remember he's a banner for his warband too!
The big difference between hama and cpts is that you can kit out a cpt to suit the army. Hama has no option apart from his horse and a shield, so a worse cpt IMO (yeah sure he get 3 might)
Gambling can take the banner and if you are running him you are running the banner.
The issue with erkenbrand is that his banner only effects his warband and for the same points as a red shield you can take a Royal guard and I'm taking them every day of the week.
His horn is amazing tho.
He is definitely on the fence between A and B but I feel more comfortable with him near the top of B.
-Sean
@@NoobsandMen I understand your Erkenbrand feelings, I think if you're playing vanilla rohan over riders of theoden or paths, it's to take him. Not sure if that makes him A tier though.
If you want a captain on horse, Hama and Gamling are just way better for 5pts. That's how most captains are taken I guess, but yeah, if you want a sneaky different captain, they can be kitted out different.
@@judgejudyandexecutioner.5223 Hama also doesn't have march or throwing weapons, he's just really not as good as a captain in anyway other than the one extra might.
-Liam
@@NoobsandMen Ooooh no march? I take it back, he can get in the bin
48:18 does he get courage 7 because of the horn? It is already included in the wargear, so it should be included in his stats, right? 😊
Nah typically warhorns aren't already included in statlines, like Erkenbrand's warhorn isn't considering there's absolutely no way he'd be courage 2 base. Same with Durin, or Merry in the shire, if you compare their courage to heroes around them it's obvious warhorns aren't added to statlines even if they come in wargear.
-Liam
@@NoobsandMen I understand your point, but it is strange this exception, because the shield and armour/heavy armour are always reflected in the stats, if they are in the wargear 🥴
Yeah I get that but context and overall values in each of these heroes armies would easily suggest warhorns are an exception to this usual rule. sadly there's nothing really to confirm or deny this either way in FAQs or the rule books, however from a glance is does specifically state in items like armour and shields that their bonus is included in the models profile if in wargear but does not state the same when talking about warhorns and the like. Personally I'd definitely say there's more going for warhorns bonus not being included in base stats than going the other way
-Liam
@@NoobsandMen great point 👌 thanks 🙏
So is a kings hunstman S tier since they can target mounts or riders like legolas 😯
No sadly they can't target mount or rider like legolas 😞
They are still amazing tho
-Sean
@NoobsandMen Check the newest army faq it says they can declare which they are targeting and hit on a 2 plus. I'll drop a screenshot in the discord lol
Ohhhh damn
I dunno how I missed that.
Officially SS tier.
-Sean
I painted Théoden's horse black lads, Just because i have two models and to paint a white horse on a black primer make me sick 😂 I agree with all but Erkenbrand deserves A TIER for me ... On a Red vs Blue tournament with so much terror models, You NEED to be charging, and i think Is shit to be stomped by a courage test. 7 Is average, 50% models charging. 5 Is much Better, You can rely on Riders to maybe counter an Heroic move, stomp some big Heroes wherever they are ecc. Too much times You NEED a single model to charge and then flop, 6.
Fair point for sure, the warhorn is absolutely the best thing about him. But I still think he doesn't quite hit a their, there's plenty of other Rohan heroes I'd take over him. At higher points sure, he's in for sure, but that's after I've picked up an Eomer or a Theoden and then one of the other captain tier heroes, then I'll likely take him
-Liam
@@NoobsandMen im not sure, his+2 courage buff saved me lot of times. You must rely on charge bonus with infantry +1f/s and this is an insurance that You will get! Btw is Just talking, Helm's legendary Is over all 😂
I don't know if we can take Rohan advice from someone who painted snowmane black 😂
@@NoobsandMen you're probably right ... 😆
Ok, just for the record... I play Eomer’s LL regular and I have top tabled with it at some of our largest Canadian/OSGBL events. I love them.
That speaks more of you as a player than the Legion being good.
Trash tier armies can still win events, I've done it myself with armies considered trash tier.
-Sean
@@NoobsandMen thanks for the compliment! I’ll have to fly over to Australia sometime and see how it does at one of your events as your meta is quite distinct from ours.
Did you... Did you say 'Noob nation'???!!
Yeah Larry we sure did.
How do you feel to be apart of the Noob Nation??????????
-sean