You've done an excellent job with this video, Sam! I found myself nodding in agreement many times as I listened to you. The fact that you can articulate this level of understanding about Jorg without having read Emperor of Thorns makes me keen to find out what you'll think once you finish the trilogy. For me, the ending adds even more layers of understanding and fascination to his character.
I love Lawrence and find his books fascinating. The fact that he can make a complete sociopath like Jorg a sympathetic character by the end of the trilogy shows how great a writer he is. And then to turn around and write the Red Queens War, which has a completely different vibe? He is so talented.
I think Jorg's self-hatred is also a factor in his resentment. I think he partially blames himself for the death of his mother and brother, claiming that he could have gotten out of the thorns to help, and blames his inaction on fear instead of the reality that he was indeed stuck and probably would have been killed by the thorns, had tried to move and help. This was such a great review. I just finished Prince of Thorns, and am about to start on King of Thorns.
One of my favourite lines in the series is "faster than an arrow, faster than a bullet even. Oh yes, I know of those." I just love the smugness that drips from it.
I still haven't read anything by Mark Lawrence, but I appreciate your take on looking at what the book is doing rather than criticizing it for not following a certain fantasy formula. I personally find the genre term grimdark too reductive, but that's a whole other conversation. Great hearing your thoughts here!
That’s probably true about grimdark. It’s an internet term that has a whole set of expectations but also baggage. It would honestly be more accurate to say this is dying earth fantasy that’s very dark.
Yeah I also find the term simplistic. It tries to group fantasy books that are kind of violent, depressive or whatever into a subgenre but it doesn’t really achieve it since some of those books are really different to each other. I sometimes think genres don’t make books justice.
I have a lot of thoughts about this series. It is one of my favorites. I appreciated that Lawrence didn’t try to say his main character is “better” than the road brothers. Jorge didn’t just suffer the trauma of his mother and brother being brutally murdered in front of him, he also suffers the incredible consistent abuse of his father. On top of all that, Jorge is constantly fighting against the darkest parts of himself. He is self aware enough to know how that darkness can destroy him and his dreams and works to counteract it. I struggle to take people seriously who write Jorge off because of SA. Not the murder of innocent people, just the SA. Anyways, great video!
Although the ending/reveal negatively impacted my experience with the trilogy, I still recommend it to people nonetheless. That being said, this might be the best video on the book I’ve seen in all of BookTube! I agree with your points for sure.
Very thoughtful and nuanced analysis. Great job. I haven’t read Mark Lawrence yet, but I’m reading The Blade Itself right now, and have no trouble rooting for several of the morally grey characters (perhaps that’s an indictment of myself), but it’s definitely funny. I look forward to reading this one for grim comparison.
Lawrence does what Gemmell used to do. Stories that feel complete and pack a punch with 350pgs or less. Skipping appetizers and straight to the main course without making you feel like you are missing something.
Love the video. Such a nuanced take and I praise you for actually doing the leg work to trying to understand the main character in context of the story and what Mark Lawrence is trying to do. I think that's what a mind like Gene Wolfe would be proud of. I haven't read the books yet and based on the premise it wouldn't be my absolute Top 5 fantasy sci fi for me either, but it is worth trying to see this character's journey. Also, love that comparison to Batman.
It’s definitely worth a read. It’s not popcorn fantasy or “fun” in the sense that a typical adventure story is fun, but it’s very fascinating and has real merit.
To me the broken empire trilogy and the red queens war are the same. They tell one story and it is epic. It is not about the protagonists. They are the vehicle of the story for sure but not the focus. This story does a lot of things. First and foremost it is story about feelings: Hate, anger, frustration, loss, sadness, love and hope. Second it is a story about faith, fate and destiny. The author has an excellent grip of the physical reality we live in, being well versed in mathematics and physics, and he weaves his intuition into an extrapolation of our current reality into the mystical realm of AI, space and time. He challenges the narratives of religion in a profound way letting Snorri lead the way in a way which I don't think leave any observant reader untouched. Finally the story talks a lot about the nature of power and violence. What it is and how you should think about it. I read and listened to the trilogy more than five times and I just keep finding more. I have a hard time even pick up new books because of how great this work is as it most other books to shame.
Mark's stuff is definitely in my top 10 fantasy, all 6 of the Broken Empire books (i.e. Thorns and Red Queen), and I don't think of Jorg as evil or bad, he''s flawed, perhaps deeply, but not evil...
I read the reviews for this book And everyone was talking about the grape in chapter 1 and how disgusting it was and because of that they dropped the book When i read chapter 1 i was like " what are the se people talking about" There is no grape scene there is only one sentence the impkies a grape happened If this is so disturbibg for you in a made up world then ypu have a problem I was expecting a grim dark extreme fanatasy book and to be honest i felt it was mid conpared to the other grin dark books i have read Honesty the book does not deaerve the hatw it gets because there ia no justification for it
I definitely agree. I have to think it’s a combination of the main characters age mixed with how bitter his inner monologue is that makes people react so strongly.
as described, it makes no sense. he's already PRINCE! why would he need to WORK to be king?! it's on the calendar already! and after he escapes to testify who did it, why wouldn't his father the king have the count's head? and how dare a mere count attack the family of a king? where was the SECURITY DETAIL?
You're going to have to go on to The Red Queen's War. It's a concurrentquel, but is incredibly entertaining, as it follows a Han Solo-style loveable rogue who gets magically bonded to a Viking warrior against both their will. It is a bunch of fun, and gives you all the missing pieces about what happened in the past of the Broken Empire. So, you get the humor of The First Law, but in a Broken Empire-setting. ...then, you should also be aware that ALL books released by Lawrence since are, in some way, connected to the Broken Empire...
@@Fredpettersen No kidding? All his books connect to these ones? I knew Red Queens War did but had no idea the others do. Even his library trilogy and One Word Kill?
@@iSamwise One Word Kill more ties into the Book of the Ancestor/Ice stuff, but those two for sure tie back into Broken Empire. What he does in Book of the Ice in tying everything together is really the only thing I like about that trilogy. Library Trilogy feels much more like a meta commentary on storytelling in general, though there are direct quotes in epigraphs in the beginning of every chapter.
@@iSamwise Yup, there are a couple of characters that crop up in every single trilogy (and fans have taken to calling it "the Taprootverse, after one of these characters). The Impossible Times-trilogy is basically the background story to how reality eventually "breaks", causing the Broken Empire in the first place. The library trilogy is less directly connected (so far), but it mentions several of the characters and the main city is called Crath...
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
You've done an excellent job with this video, Sam! I found myself nodding in agreement many times as I listened to you. The fact that you can articulate this level of understanding about Jorg without having read Emperor of Thorns makes me keen to find out what you'll think once you finish the trilogy. For me, the ending adds even more layers of understanding and fascination to his character.
Thank you Dr. Chase, that’s very kind! I hope to read Emperor before the end of the year!
I love Lawrence and find his books fascinating. The fact that he can make a complete sociopath like Jorg a sympathetic character by the end of the trilogy shows how great a writer he is. And then to turn around and write the Red Queens War, which has a completely different vibe? He is so talented.
@@Marcus-id5ur absolutely!! He’s doing something very uniquely crafted here!
I think Jorg's self-hatred is also a factor in his resentment. I think he partially blames himself for the death of his mother and brother, claiming that he could have gotten out of the thorns to help, and blames his inaction on fear instead of the reality that he was indeed stuck and probably would have been killed by the thorns, had tried to move and help. This was such a great review. I just finished Prince of Thorns, and am about to start on King of Thorns.
@@mtwice4586 thank you! Personally I think King of Thorns is the best of the series!
One of my favourite lines in the series is "faster than an arrow, faster than a bullet even. Oh yes, I know of those." I just love the smugness that drips from it.
@@runningcommentary2125 haha I just read that in King of Thorns. The set up for KoT ending is there if you’re looking for it!
I still haven't read anything by Mark Lawrence, but I appreciate your take on looking at what the book is doing rather than criticizing it for not following a certain fantasy formula. I personally find the genre term grimdark too reductive, but that's a whole other conversation. Great hearing your thoughts here!
That’s probably true about grimdark. It’s an internet term that has a whole set of expectations but also baggage. It would honestly be more accurate to say this is dying earth fantasy that’s very dark.
Yeah I also find the term simplistic. It tries to group fantasy books that are kind of violent, depressive or whatever into a subgenre but it doesn’t really achieve it since some of those books are really different to each other. I sometimes think genres don’t make books justice.
Great video man! I think you'll like the end of the trilogy, but I'm curious.
Thank you! Looking to start book three in the next few weeks.
I have a lot of thoughts about this series. It is one of my favorites. I appreciated that Lawrence didn’t try to say his main character is “better” than the road brothers. Jorge didn’t just suffer the trauma of his mother and brother being brutally murdered in front of him, he also suffers the incredible consistent abuse of his father. On top of all that, Jorge is constantly fighting against the darkest parts of himself. He is self aware enough to know how that darkness can destroy him and his dreams and works to counteract it.
I struggle to take people seriously who write Jorge off because of SA. Not the murder of innocent people, just the SA.
Anyways, great video!
This is very true. It’s not clear to me that Jorgs murders are forgivable but assault isn’t.
Although the ending/reveal negatively impacted my experience with the trilogy, I still recommend it to people nonetheless.
That being said, this might be the best video on the book I’ve seen in all of BookTube! I agree with your points for sure.
Thank you! That’s very kind. I know book three is divisive so I look forward to seeing how I feel about it.
I really enjoyed your review and the way you approached it. I look forward to hearing what you'll think after you finished all three books.
Thank you! I’m excited to complete the trilogy!
Very thoughtful and nuanced analysis. Great job. I haven’t read Mark Lawrence yet, but I’m reading The Blade Itself right now, and have no trouble rooting for several of the morally grey characters (perhaps that’s an indictment of myself), but it’s definitely funny. I look forward to reading this one for grim comparison.
They’re very very different series but each dark in their own ways. Let me know what you think!
Lawrence does what Gemmell used to do. Stories that feel complete and pack a punch with 350pgs or less. Skipping appetizers and straight to the main course without making you feel like you are missing something.
That makes sense! It definitely packs a punch!
7:40 If the Pope is a woman, that is NOT the Catholic Church 😂
Lol yeah, but I'm guessing it's a secularized take of the church from Mark Lawrence
Facts
Love the video. Such a nuanced take and I praise you for actually doing the leg work to trying to understand the main character in context of the story and what Mark Lawrence is trying to do. I think that's what a mind like Gene Wolfe would be proud of. I haven't read the books yet and based on the premise it wouldn't be my absolute Top 5 fantasy sci fi for me either, but it is worth trying to see this character's journey. Also, love that comparison to Batman.
It’s definitely worth a read. It’s not popcorn fantasy or “fun” in the sense that a typical adventure story is fun, but it’s very fascinating and has real merit.
read this in afgahn alone out in the middle of nowhere, loved it. got me back into reading.
@@2DaysYouth wow. That’s amazing. Glad it could do that for you!
@@iSamwise ha thanks man. now ive read everything it seems, and aspire to write my own things.
To me the broken empire trilogy and the red queens war are the same. They tell one story and it is epic. It is not about the protagonists. They are the vehicle of the story for sure but not the focus. This story does a lot of things. First and foremost it is story about feelings: Hate, anger, frustration, loss, sadness, love and hope. Second it is a story about faith, fate and destiny. The author has an excellent grip of the physical reality we live in, being well versed in mathematics and physics, and he weaves his intuition into an extrapolation of our current reality into the mystical realm of AI, space and time. He challenges the narratives of religion in a profound way letting Snorri lead the way in a way which I don't think leave any observant reader untouched. Finally the story talks a lot about the nature of power and violence. What it is and how you should think about it. I read and listened to the trilogy more than five times and I just keep finding more. I have a hard time even pick up new books because of how great this work is as it most other books to shame.
@@KristoferPettersson fantastic take! I definitely need to continue on to Red Queens War
Mark's stuff is definitely in my top 10 fantasy, all 6 of the Broken Empire books (i.e. Thorns and Red Queen), and I don't think of Jorg as evil or bad, he''s flawed, perhaps deeply, but not evil...
@@danieltripp2578 glad you love them!!!
I read the reviews for this book
And everyone was talking about the grape in chapter 1 and how disgusting it was and because of that they dropped the book
When i read chapter 1 i was like
" what are the se people talking about"
There is no grape scene there is only one sentence the impkies a grape happened
If this is so disturbibg for you in a made up world then ypu have a problem
I was expecting a grim dark extreme fanatasy book and to be honest i felt it was mid conpared to the other grin dark books i have read
Honesty the book does not deaerve the hatw it gets because there ia no justification for it
I definitely agree. I have to think it’s a combination of the main characters age mixed with how bitter his inner monologue is that makes people react so strongly.
as described, it makes no sense. he's already PRINCE! why would he need to WORK to be king?! it's on the calendar already! and after he escapes to testify who did it, why wouldn't his father the king have the count's head? and how dare a mere count attack the family of a king? where was the SECURITY DETAIL?
A mystery for the ages…
You're going to have to go on to The Red Queen's War. It's a concurrentquel, but is incredibly entertaining, as it follows a Han Solo-style loveable rogue who gets magically bonded to a Viking warrior against both their will. It is a bunch of fun, and gives you all the missing pieces about what happened in the past of the Broken Empire. So, you get the humor of The First Law, but in a Broken Empire-setting.
...then, you should also be aware that ALL books released by Lawrence since are, in some way, connected to the Broken Empire...
@@Fredpettersen No kidding? All his books connect to these ones? I knew Red Queens War did but had no idea the others do. Even his library trilogy and One Word Kill?
@@iSamwise One Word Kill more ties into the Book of the Ancestor/Ice stuff, but those two for sure tie back into Broken Empire. What he does in Book of the Ice in tying everything together is really the only thing I like about that trilogy. Library Trilogy feels much more like a meta commentary on storytelling in general, though there are direct quotes in epigraphs in the beginning of every chapter.
@@iSamwise Yup, there are a couple of characters that crop up in every single trilogy (and fans have taken to calling it "the Taprootverse, after one of these characters).
The Impossible Times-trilogy is basically the background story to how reality eventually "breaks", causing the Broken Empire in the first place.
The library trilogy is less directly connected (so far), but it mentions several of the characters and the main city is called Crath...
First interesting pitch I’ve heard of this series.
@@sw3dge-Trevor haha! Thank you! Yeah I feel like this series if often misrepresented even by some who are fans.