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That ground news seems close to a genuinely even split of news sources across the board. I can honestly say for the first time ever, I am actually going to look at a sponsor from a RUclips video after this. I've very curious now.
There was no mention of this lime green line carrying on from Hackney and then appearing to take over the central line Leytonstone all the way up to Epping ?!?!!
IMO the best name for that Euston-Kings'-Cross-St-Pancas-Golly-Gee-Whiz station is "Disaster", because for anyone who has to catch a train in anything less than four hours' time, that's _exactly_ what it will be.
As a Project Manager within Construction and Infrastructure with 10 years experience, Crossrail 2 is desperately needed (along with other major infrastructure investment). The U.K's ability to futureproof is awful, as no current government wants to commit to £bns in infrastructure spending for 10-20+ years in the future which has no immediate political pay-off. That's fine in the short term, but when you do get 10-20+ years down the line you suddenly have a very big problem with no easy or quick solutions, and this inevitably results in downward spiral. Look at how successful Crossrail/Elizabeth Line has been since it's opening, almost no-one remembers that it was delayed by 4 years because it's delivering such a significant benefit to the Public! Britian as a nation is crying out for long-term strategic investment in our public assets which actually benefit us in the near and far future.
This is why HS2 being started then slashed in half and then cancelled beyond Phase 1A is such a massive f u to the British public. That was going to be infrastructure for the next 120 years worth of expansion like the West and East Coast Mainlines were in the Victorian era.
Since you are a planner, let me ask you something: Why does Crossrail 2 suggest building new tunnels for slow/stopping services relatively near to existing quad track railways, rather than building new cheaper tunnels for fast trains freeing up more capacity for slow and semi-fast suburban/regional trains on the existing quad track railways? Sure, the core section should absolutely be built with short distances between stations and be used by suburban trains, But next to places like Clapham Jn it seems like a good idea to swap so that the trains that runs in a new central core tunnel surfaces and uses the existing railway, while the fast trains that terminate at Victoria or Waterloo dives down and runs in tunnel outside Clapham Jn. (Or for that sake swap around which is in tunnel and which is not at Clapham Jn if there are any particular benefits for one or the other). Sure, there would be a need for emergency exits built if there are no or few stations along a long underground tunnel, but that must surely be way cheaper than building stations. Is this just due to it being politically easier to sell the idea of new stations to the general public? IIRC I've read arguments that close by the existing Southwestern quad track main line the population density isn't that high. But that can IMHO be seen as a reason for infill development and whatnot, and the existing state can also be seen as a result of not that great frequency at the suburban stations along the route.
And HS2 north of Brum. please. Stopping there is almost pointless. Extra capacity (for freight) is needed on the WCML. As for travel across the Pennines...
I'd agree the UK is useless at future proofing, but it's more than time elsewhere got a bite of the money pie for transport. Many fully costed plans have been thrown out because of the demand in Londoncentric attitudes in parliament and by big business. Id argue that TfL and the Councils really ought to finance the planning stages themselves. But what is needed is a massive overhaul of the planning and finance of large long term construction project such as Cross Rail or Leeds Trams. Personally I'd support a plan that Central Government sponsors a set amount say 30% of any transit project, then the regional transit bodies sponsors another 40% from fares with councils giving the rest from a small levy on top of council tax much akin to what happened for the Olympics.
@@paintedpilgrim That's kind of how it works in London. London has independence in generating capital expenditure. No other part of England has that legal power and is thus almost entirely dependent on Treasury. London also has a lot of power in what happens compared to other regions. Manchester just got control of the busses again and will take control of regional trains by the end of the decade. It's a start, but Greater Manchester and the other city regions really should have TfL and Greater London style deregualtion for infrastructure projects. Everywhere outside of the M25 relies on Westminster, and they just aren't interested with things that far away. They aren't even interested in things within it most of the time either, they hate funding things and only do it begrudgingly because it'll benefit them in some direct way too. It's also worth pointing out that this government hasn't done a single large project. Crossrail was put into law by the last Labour government, so was HS2. Even the Olympics was done by the last government, they just happpened to have been built (or partly built then canned) by the Tories because they were kind of obligated to.
Since no actual London Central Station is ever going to happen, this might be as close as we're getting to that, so that perfectly good name might as well be used for this (if it ever actually does happen).
@@ospero7681 TCR would be central, if you have a "CR3" Milton keynes to Euston/Baker street to Cannon street which branches to bermondsey or C2Ctakeover
Surely in true British fashion the mega station should be called “Mornington Crescent”. The only safe way to properly confuse visitors, but of course only when no-one plans to use tobermory’s stratagem.
Wonderful idea. I can hear the on train announcement already: ......calling at Bushey, Carpenders Park, Hatch End (passengers politely applaud), Willesden Junction, (hesitantly) Kensal Green? (passengers murmur approval, conductor interjects "a nice deployment of Fletcher's Reverse in play there"), Queens Park (sharp intake of breath from passengers), Kilburn High Road, (dramatic pause) Mornington Crescent! (passengers cheer enthusiastically).
We bought our place in Angel in 2016 and I'm lucky enough to say that I can't really imagine ever moving again until potentially retirement, thankfully a good few decades away, or something unexpected happening with the children - Crossrail 2 was on my radar when we made the purchase. I'd love for it to happen. I've loved watching London change over my lifetime, and Crossrail 1 was a genuinely exciting development. Long gone are my childhood sci-fi dreams of society moving into the stars, and instead stuff like genuinely new game changing infrastructure is one of the few achievable developments I'll get to see and enjoy. Lord knows everything else seems to be sliding the other way.
It’s a shame they pulled the plug on this one, even as planned it missed the genuine opportunity to connect other parts of London directly to Stansted Airport without having to fight to Liverpool Street, Tottenham Hale or Stratford. It could also have run 24hr for that purpose and helped to greenify/cheapify those getting to Stansted for the horrific 06:00 Ryanair flights, avoiding the £120+ minicabs to catch your £9.99 flight (+£38 carry-on, +£60 suitcase, +£12 seat reservation, +£13-78 air passenger duty… oh no I’m getting carried away).
That mega-station could have a working title of St Jude's , said feller being the saint of lost causes. The routes would be very useful to me, around Tooting, Clapham, Balham etc. If it wasn't for the fact that I have moved to Edinburgh
Although 1 Station could spell one chosen between Tooting Broadway and Balham, at the moment. Why not do both between Clapham Junction and Wimbledon, (however Earlsfield own South Western Railway (Metro though)), [e.g.] from Clapham Junction towards Balham, Tooting Broadway, and Wimbledon. I just thought a reason enough timing, unfortunately as the Main Line Fast, where they go somewhere like Fast Wimbledon Tunnel(?).
Except it is in NW Central London , wasnt served by Great Central (but is by Grand Central) and doesnt have the Central Line going through it. It is probably best called North Midtown
2:50 - Wood Green is what Haringey council wanted because it would give them a good reason to spaff millions re-re-developing Shopping City but TFL (I believe) always wanted Turnpike Lane and Ally Pally because those stations serve far, far more residents who would travel for work
Not just that but it would relieve services on the Northern City Line and Moorgate during events at Alexandra Palace. Last time I was getting home from a concert there it was a close call on whether I'd get in to central London before the last train home.
This line would get me to work in 15 minutes direct, whereas now I face a horrible change at Holborn 😭 so I take the bus which can take an hour but it’s preferable at this point
6:57 the reason the northern line extension didn’t get extended to CJ was more because the northern line wouldn’t be able to handle it rather than CJ station itself. The trains would just get crush loaded right at the start, and no one would then be able to use the trains from there at all the intermediate stations
Interesting thought. However, I've often wondered why people would want to change on to the Northern Line at CJ. From SWR they could just carry on into Waterloo which is quicker and has more NL trains, and from Southern there are generally good alternative routes available from Victoria. The NL could handle the numbers changing from the Overground.
@@jasonhaven7170 For some journeys, not for others. For example, most people coming from the southern suburbs and further afield go into Victoria rather than change onto the Northern line at Balham. Similar things would apply to people on suburban or long distance train into Waterloo - it's quicker and more pleasant to carry on into the terminus rather than getting off at Clapham Junction and taking the tube from there (if one existed). There are exceptions; Finsbury Park is a more convenient interchange between tube and National Rail than the Kings Cross labyrinth.
@@stewartclark2137 I agree entirely! The overground, Elizabeth line and all suburban railways in the London area are the S Bahn London and the tube and DLR are the U Bahn London.
I live in Enfield, and so frequent the Greater Anglia lines that run into Liverpool St. and Stratford a lot. It's worth mentioning that when Angel was closed down and Meridian Water was built to replace it - Meridian Water was built to Crossrail Specifications, ready for when the rest of Crossrail 2 was built. The same applies for Tottenham Hale and Northumberland Park when they were recently upgraded, they are all ready for Crossrail 2, which would reduce the time taken to build the line if and when it happens. My vote for the Mega Station at Euston/Kings Cross/St. Pancras is "Mega Station" - I wonder if they'd be brave enough to use it!
I think the best name for the new megatermius formed by adding Euston to the King's Cross - St Pancras complex would have to be LABYRINTH FROM HELL. It would be worse than Bank - Monument: people would go in and never manage to get out again, and their dessicated bodies would be found years later by archaeologists.
But at this rate, it would probably have to be the William line (unless it gets the nickname of the Willy line, maybe then reconsideration might be needed) or the George line, given Charles will probably be long dead by the time it finally gets built.
With the number of interchanges available at King's Pancras Saint Euston they'd have to start announcing it before they've even departed angel. I appreciate the many disclaimers about routes being underserved ***in a london context***, i will indeed not start (today)
I remember once going on a train to Colchester: the driver announced on the approach 'If you wish to go to [a] change at Colchester... [repeat several times for locations b, c, d...]' Driver realises what he is saying and then continues 'In fact, if you wish to go anywhere other than Colchester Town Station, change at Colchester.'
Assuming Euston is integrated with Euston Square and that the Northern line is split at this point: This is a Crossrail 2 service for Shepperton, next station... Euston St. Pancras. Change here for the Victoria, Northern and Southern lines and the London Overground from Euston; the Circle, Hammersmith and City, Metropolitan and Piccadily lines from King's Cross St. Pancras; as well as for Thameslink from St. Pancras and national and international rail services. This station has step-free access.
@@chemistmanuk we need both. We need another city in the UK to increase dramatically and have things pushed away from London to there, like Manchester ideally
Call it North City Grand Interchange. I don't see CR2 ever starting in Harlow at its north end. It was always going to be Broxbourne, as there is an unused 6 road yard there, with space to add as many new tracks in the yard that they need for stabling and maintenance. The station would need a big rebuild, but there is space for that as well.
First time I've ever seen a reference to Upper Halliford on RUclips, and possibly the internet! Brings back some great memories ❤️ Shepperton always got the mentions ☹️
I chuckled at the two subtitles "By London standards, don't start". Although it is only two miles away, I last travelled by train from my local station in 1980, so it is good to know that at least some metropolitan types realise the irony of building or not building Crossrail 2 for us oiks here in the Midlands.
Worth noting that local services north of Tottenham Hale at the moment are 4tph, and only 2tph at Brimsdown and Ponders End. Quad-tracking the line up to Broxborne would have to be done to accommodate the extra trains, and could more than double (or quadruple) services stopping at the intemediate stations.
They already seem to be thinking about Quad-tracking. The design of the new Meridian Water station seems to allow for another track and platform to be added on the East side. 👍 Northumberland park seems also to have passive provision for it.
@@Pesmog Hmm only three at Tottenham Hale though and that's quite recent, without indication they'd be adding more later, or really much space to do so.
I think it should be called the Albert Line. I'm speculating that this will be the name of Prince George's first son, who it'll be posthumously named after.
I suppose though that depends on whether they are first in line. If they are first in line, George might want to go with a more regal sounding name, such as to maintain some continuity with past monarchs, and I'm not sure whether he would want a first. By all means though, if George has a daughter first and that son is the spare, it doesn't really matter.
@@Cowman9791 Perhaps Charles IV (Henry and Edward are 'already many' with George (and James in Scotland) close behind; all three Richards died untimely; Stephen and John were Bad Kings (a la 1066 and all that).
Interesting to hear it’s not happening. London Boroughs are still charging a Community Infrastructure Levy on new developments, specifically to fund Crossrail2.
Crossrail 2 or "we really really want it and need it but will probably not live to see it." As for the Mega-station I would say either St Pancras Interchange or London Grafton, both nods to the heritage of the area
@highpath4776 The Earl of Euston is the Duke of Grafton's son or other heir. So one up from Euston in rank and importance should logically be Grafton.
In Newcastle, Glasgow and Cardiff the main train station is called "Central station" and in Birmingham, it's called "Grand Central station" like the one in New York but I do think it would be nice if the main station in each city could be called Central station as standard.
It is not just Harlow Town which campaigned for a stop. In Streatham, we argued vigorously that it was outrageous to run the tunnel just a mile or so away to Tooting or Balham (which both already have tubes) without finally bringing this very significant population a fast underground link.
A point to add to your commentary: Just as the northern arms would free up capacity at Liverpool St (for more Greater Anglia trains) the local trains going underground at Wimbledon would free up lots of capacity in from there to Waterloo which was to be used to increase the trains coming in from Woking and beyond as there would be more platforms available at Waterloo and space on the existing lines, so Crossrail 2 would improve services in Southampton and Cambridge.
London is missing a central station, and the city rail network is mainly connected by the Elizabeth line and Thameslink. I really like the idea of a big station connecting multiple mainlines in London to one hub. I would like it to be called "London Central".
Looks like this line is still very much needed despite being called off. Thanks for creating this portrait of it, what it could be, and what it might be if Londoners did not have to wait until they get another Queen to name it after before the line will be built.
By the time Crossrail II happens it will probably be called the Charlotte line. As for the name for E.St.P.K.X. ? East Park Junction in North West One? "Clear as mud junction" lol. I think of E.St.P&KX as being in north London (NW1) but for most people it is quite central.
It would also help alleviate pressure on the West Anglia Main Line which has only two tracks despite having a lot of competing services running, e.g., to Cambridge, Hertford East, Stansted Express. It also has a lot of level crossings. There was a formal review done of this some time ago which can be found online somewhere. Just on your point about the north eastern part of the route, I seem to remember reading that Wood Green is the preferred option for Haringey Council as they say it would help with the economic regeneration of the area.
Wood Green is near Ally Pally, unless you’re walking. Ally Pally is a busy centre with exhibitions an ice rink and a theatre that holds many concerts . It’s a busy place and deserves decent public transport, which frankly it lacks.
I think I'll be long gone by the time Crossrail 2 gets built. I mean I've waited 22 years for step free access to Motspur Park station, and now that my niece & nephew have grown up and I don't need to struggle carrying a tiny tot & a buggy up all those stairs; they finally put in a new bridge with lift access!
Would SWT's Kingston Loop half-hourly trains via Teddington and Richmond still run to and from Waterloo after other suburban services were diverted to CR2?
@06:32 In terms of redevelopment of Clapham Junction, there was something a few years back of "London Bridge-ing" the station by opening the arches below. There was a couple of other things about rejigging the Southern platforms with the local stopping Victoria services using the platforms where the West London serving Southern services currently run from. If covid didnt happen, probably would have been the next big Network Rail Sussex region upgrade after the Croydon Triangle rebuild
My vote for the mega-station name would be just call it "London" as it would be THE definitive London station, where you come in from most of the country and abroad, connects to most of the tube, and would be just painful and confusing enough as well.
I asked chatGPT for some names for the mega station. I like 1, 3 and 6 1. Nexus Central Station - "Nexus" signifies connection and a central point where various elements converge. 2. Gateway Junction - Highlighting its role as a gateway for different rail lines. 3. Union Hub - Emphasizing unity and connectivity of multiple routes. 4. Concord Interchange - "Concord" suggests harmony and cooperation between different lines. 5. Vertex Terminal - "Vertex" suggests the highest point or key connection where everything converges. 6. Central Crossroads Station - Reflecting the intersection of multiple rail links. 7. Axis Link Station - "Axis" suggests a pivotal, connecting role, emphasizing its strategic importance.
I would call the megastation Somers Town. I already refer to my walk between Thameslink up to St Pancras to LNR and Avanti at Euston a "Somers Town saver". I usually save time and always save money.
German cities have "Hauptbahnhof" stations because they're all medium-sized cities; Berlin has 3.6 million, and no other city there has more than 1.5m. London has 10m. This station does serve the north and would have suburban trains elsewhere, but mainline services to the south and west are still elsewhere.
@@IndigoJo The funny thing is that the Hauptbahnhof is a relatively new station and Berlin used to rely on various termini spread across the city. Before that, Ostbahnhof was the most important station (and still is today, since with its many platforms and through tracks, east-west trains can easily terminate there) and even then, its advantage was that it lied on the Stadtbahn. Ever since the Tierparktunnel was built (which allowed for North-South mainline service), its significance got diminished given that there is a now better station for intercity trains. Moreover, Berlin is big enough to support four more intercity stations (i.e. aside from Ostbahnhof, there also is Spandau, Gesundbrunnen and Südkreuz), roughly matching the many termini of Paris and London except they support through service.
My suggestion for the megajunction station's name is King Alfred the Great Station, since he seems to be the only British king to be called 'the Great,' as well as being a good aspirational name to the designers to live up to, or the passengers to be disappointed by.
I thought one of the advantages of CrossRail 2 was to move suburban services away from London Waterloo to the Crossrail 2 tunnels to free up more platform capacity for trains on the Portsmouth Direct and South Western Mainline. Talking of the Portsmouth Direct, any chance of a video on the Battle of Havant, the frog war between the LBSCR and LSWR?
Yes: north and south are still not directly connected---there's not even a Waterloo/Victoria route. Termini like Charring Cross, Cannon Street,Fenchurch Street stand alone
if you look at the infrastructure built in the STAR project (The triple track from coppermill junc to meridian water) and meridian water station it was all built with provision for an additional (4th) track for crossrail 2 in mind. Ponders End had a rebuild projcet to get 3 platforms (to allow a couple more trains along the WAML) with that same provision for C2, but that project was cancelled in 2023
On the topic of rail lines and development round Clapham Junction, have you ever thought of making a video on the redevelopment of Vauxhall, Nine Elms and the Cold Storage? Such a fascinating area of London.
Hope to see a Jago Hazzard video on the opening of Crossrail2! Re station: maybe Grand Central - both as it links several grand old stations & is the HS2 terminus (the successor to the Grand Central Line)
@@paulhaynes8045 Because people will be getting the train from outside London so they need to know what city it's going to. Same reason that in airports signs say London Heathrow rather than just Heathrow
Battle Bridge was what the area of King's Cross and Saint Pancras was know as before any railway was built. calling the new CR2 interchange that would reflect what getting it built would involve!
I really think they should add a station at Essex Road too, to allow interchange with the Northern City line. It could take a lot of pressure off of the Northern line at Angela and King's Cross
I like the proposed names of "London Main", "London Midtown" and "London Union" Station. But I also want to propose "London Camden" or "Camden Hub", as it's the borough of all three stations now. And what a mega station it would be! It could have a full-fledged people mover (airport style) just to connect the different platforms!
2:15 - An interesting point is that the new Meridian Water station was built with passive provision for Crossrail 2 - space for tracks and the platforms were reserved and the pedestrian bridge is wide enough to accomodate this as well. 6:30 - The only reason holding the Northern Line back from Clapham Junction is the lack of Crossrail 2. Crossrail 2 would alleviate some of the pressure on the Northern Line, otherwise the trains would be packed at Clapham junction and unable to take on passengers at Nine Elms and Battersea Power. The alignment underneath Battersea Park is reserved and should Crossrail 2 get the go ahead, Northern Line Extension 2: Electric Boogaloo should get the go ahead.
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That ground news seems close to a genuinely even split of news sources across the board. I can honestly say for the first time ever, I am actually going to look at a sponsor from a RUclips video after this. I've very curious now.
There was no mention of this lime green line carrying on from Hackney and then appearing to take over the central line Leytonstone all the way up to Epping ?!?!!
IMO the best name for that Euston-Kings'-Cross-St-Pancas-Golly-Gee-Whiz station is "Disaster", because for anyone who has to catch a train in anything less than four hours' time, that's _exactly_ what it will be.
As a Project Manager within Construction and Infrastructure with 10 years experience, Crossrail 2 is desperately needed (along with other major infrastructure investment). The U.K's ability to futureproof is awful, as no current government wants to commit to £bns in infrastructure spending for 10-20+ years in the future which has no immediate political pay-off. That's fine in the short term, but when you do get 10-20+ years down the line you suddenly have a very big problem with no easy or quick solutions, and this inevitably results in downward spiral. Look at how successful Crossrail/Elizabeth Line has been since it's opening, almost no-one remembers that it was delayed by 4 years because it's delivering such a significant benefit to the Public! Britian as a nation is crying out for long-term strategic investment in our public assets which actually benefit us in the near and far future.
This is why HS2 being started then slashed in half and then cancelled beyond Phase 1A is such a massive f u to the British public. That was going to be infrastructure for the next 120 years worth of expansion like the West and East Coast Mainlines were in the Victorian era.
Since you are a planner, let me ask you something:
Why does Crossrail 2 suggest building new tunnels for slow/stopping services relatively near to existing quad track railways, rather than building new cheaper tunnels for fast trains freeing up more capacity for slow and semi-fast suburban/regional trains on the existing quad track railways?
Sure, the core section should absolutely be built with short distances between stations and be used by suburban trains, But next to places like Clapham Jn it seems like a good idea to swap so that the trains that runs in a new central core tunnel surfaces and uses the existing railway, while the fast trains that terminate at Victoria or Waterloo dives down and runs in tunnel outside Clapham Jn. (Or for that sake swap around which is in tunnel and which is not at Clapham Jn if there are any particular benefits for one or the other).
Sure, there would be a need for emergency exits built if there are no or few stations along a long underground tunnel, but that must surely be way cheaper than building stations.
Is this just due to it being politically easier to sell the idea of new stations to the general public? IIRC I've read arguments that close by the existing Southwestern quad track main line the population density isn't that high. But that can IMHO be seen as a reason for infill development and whatnot, and the existing state can also be seen as a result of not that great frequency at the suburban stations along the route.
And HS2 north of Brum. please. Stopping there is almost pointless. Extra capacity (for freight) is needed on the WCML. As for travel across the Pennines...
I'd agree the UK is useless at future proofing, but it's more than time elsewhere got a bite of the money pie for transport.
Many fully costed plans have been thrown out because of the demand in Londoncentric attitudes in parliament and by big business.
Id argue that TfL and the Councils really ought to finance the planning stages themselves.
But what is needed is a massive overhaul of the planning and finance of large long term construction project such as Cross Rail or Leeds Trams.
Personally I'd support a plan that Central Government sponsors a set amount say 30% of any transit project, then the regional transit bodies sponsors another 40% from fares with councils giving the rest from a small levy on top of council tax much akin to what happened for the Olympics.
@@paintedpilgrim That's kind of how it works in London. London has independence in generating capital expenditure. No other part of England has that legal power and is thus almost entirely dependent on Treasury. London also has a lot of power in what happens compared to other regions.
Manchester just got control of the busses again and will take control of regional trains by the end of the decade. It's a start, but Greater Manchester and the other city regions really should have TfL and Greater London style deregualtion for infrastructure projects.
Everywhere outside of the M25 relies on Westminster, and they just aren't interested with things that far away. They aren't even interested in things within it most of the time either, they hate funding things and only do it begrudgingly because it'll benefit them in some direct way too.
It's also worth pointing out that this government hasn't done a single large project. Crossrail was put into law by the last Labour government, so was HS2. Even the Olympics was done by the last government, they just happpened to have been built (or partly built then canned) by the Tories because they were kind of obligated to.
Megastation name: British Library
Oh yes! That's a far better name than the one that I thought of.
I'm imagining a neoclassical art deco structure, something between milano centrale and Terry gilliam's Brazil
Brilliant name for the Booking Hall 😊
Can I start a book on that name being chosen?
That would be the bookies favourite.
But a super choice.
5:11 Oh, this is the London Hauptbahnhof plan I have heard about.
Since no actual London Central Station is ever going to happen, this might be as close as we're getting to that, so that perfectly good name might as well be used for this (if it ever actually does happen).
@@ospero7681 TCR would be central, if you have a "CR3" Milton keynes to Euston/Baker street to Cannon street which branches to bermondsey or C2Ctakeover
yes! voting for London Hbf
Euston St Pancras should be known as Jago Junction, naturally.
☝️This 💯👍
As a homage to Judge Dredd of 2000 AD, the station should be styled simply as 'Mega Terminus One'
I was gonna say 'Mega Station One' for much the same reason.
One of the few underground railways in London that has nothing to do with either UERL or myself.
hang on! i know you!
Big Chucky Yerkes the GOAT 🐐
You just need to possess the Crossrail 2 CEO and then you’ll be back in the arena, Mr Yerkes 💪
Megastation name : Long Walk.
Surely in true British fashion the mega station should be called “Mornington Crescent”. The only safe way to properly confuse visitors, but of course only when no-one plans to use tobermory’s stratagem.
Wonderful idea. I can hear the on train announcement already:
......calling at Bushey, Carpenders Park, Hatch End (passengers politely applaud), Willesden Junction, (hesitantly) Kensal Green? (passengers murmur approval, conductor interjects "a nice deployment of Fletcher's Reverse in play there"), Queens Park (sharp intake of breath from passengers), Kilburn High Road, (dramatic pause) Mornington Crescent! (passengers cheer enthusiastically).
I prefer Evenington Crescent
😂 I didn’t even realise how close Mornington Crescent is to Euston, that’s perfect!
@@geekandguideStorytelling on an unprecedented level
We bought our place in Angel in 2016 and I'm lucky enough to say that I can't really imagine ever moving again until potentially retirement, thankfully a good few decades away, or something unexpected happening with the children - Crossrail 2 was on my radar when we made the purchase. I'd love for it to happen. I've loved watching London change over my lifetime, and Crossrail 1 was a genuinely exciting development. Long gone are my childhood sci-fi dreams of society moving into the stars, and instead stuff like genuinely new game changing infrastructure is one of the few achievable developments I'll get to see and enjoy. Lord knows everything else seems to be sliding the other way.
awwww i would so love to live there, maybe one day
It’s a shame they pulled the plug on this one, even as planned it missed the genuine opportunity to connect other parts of London directly to Stansted Airport without having to fight to Liverpool Street, Tottenham Hale or Stratford. It could also have run 24hr for that purpose and helped to greenify/cheapify those getting to Stansted for the horrific 06:00 Ryanair flights, avoiding the £120+ minicabs to catch your £9.99 flight (+£38 carry-on, +£60 suitcase, +£12 seat reservation, +£13-78 air passenger duty… oh no I’m getting carried away).
by a 737
Doesn't Ryanair also charge for using the toilets or is that just a rumour?
That mega-station could have a working title of St Jude's , said feller being the saint of lost causes.
The routes would be very useful to me, around Tooting, Clapham, Balham etc. If it wasn't for the fact that I have moved to Edinburgh
Of course it should go via Balham, which is after all the "Gateway to the South"
Spams off luv!
🤣
@@markiangooley I used to have a Peter Ustinov record with "Balham, Gateway To The South" narrated in his inimitable style.
Although 1 Station could spell one chosen between Tooting Broadway and Balham, at the moment. Why not do both between Clapham Junction and Wimbledon, (however Earlsfield own South Western Railway (Metro though)), [e.g.] from Clapham Junction towards Balham, Tooting Broadway, and Wimbledon. I just thought a reason enough timing, unfortunately as the Main Line Fast, where they go somewhere like Fast Wimbledon Tunnel(?).
With Euston, King's Cross & St Pancras combined, you might as well just call it "London Central".
Except it is in NW Central London , wasnt served by Great Central (but is by Grand Central) and doesnt have the Central Line going through it. It is probably best called North Midtown
Or London Interchange
@@highpath4776 Midtown???
@@highpath4776 A "central station" doesn't have to be in the city centre. It meant it is the main and most important station.
How about; "London Camden, Euston, and St.Pancras International Cross Station"(?)
2:50 - Wood Green is what Haringey council wanted because it would give them a good reason to spaff millions re-re-developing Shopping City but TFL (I believe) always wanted Turnpike Lane and Ally Pally because those stations serve far, far more residents who would travel for work
Not just that but it would relieve services on the Northern City Line and Moorgate during events at Alexandra Palace. Last time I was getting home from a concert there it was a close call on whether I'd get in to central London before the last train home.
@@kitfagan2027 i bloody hate ally pally just for the transport links. Its such a beautiful venue thats just a nightmare to travel to
I live in New Southgate. I’ve held onto hope all this time. This video title is the final dagger in my heart.
I am Gareth Southgate and not a football coach
>Lives in New Southgate
I’m sorry, I’m _so_ sorry
Sorry to hear that my friend. In fact I have friends who live near there and Wood Green so it sucks to hear that news.
Same, love New Southgate station but we need more services, two an hour on the Great Northern route off-peak isn't enough
This line would get me to work in 15 minutes direct, whereas now I face a horrible change at Holborn 😭 so I take the bus which can take an hour but it’s preferable at this point
6:57 the reason the northern line extension didn’t get extended to CJ was more because the northern line wouldn’t be able to handle it rather than CJ station itself. The trains would just get crush loaded right at the start, and no one would then be able to use the trains from there at all the intermediate stations
Interesting thought. However, I've often wondered why people would want to change on to the Northern Line at CJ. From SWR they could just carry on into Waterloo which is quicker and has more NL trains, and from Southern there are generally good alternative routes available from Victoria. The NL could handle the numbers changing from the Overground.
@@iankemp1131 People prefer the Tube
@@jasonhaven7170 For some journeys, not for others. For example, most people coming from the southern suburbs and further afield go into Victoria rather than change onto the Northern line at Balham. Similar things would apply to people on suburban or long distance train into Waterloo - it's quicker and more pleasant to carry on into the terminus rather than getting off at Clapham Junction and taking the tube from there (if one existed). There are exceptions; Finsbury Park is a more convenient interchange between tube and National Rail than the Kings Cross labyrinth.
Purple Trains Beneath the Streets of Chelsea sounds like a good acid trip, or at least an intriguing book title. :)
The Euston/St Pancras megastation should, of course, be named simply ‘London Hauptbahnhof’
It cannot be an Hauptbahof as it translates to 'Highlineyard'.
I think that a better name for the OvergrounD would be 'S bahn' though
@@stewartclark2137 I agree entirely! The overground, Elizabeth line and all suburban railways in the London area are the S Bahn London and the tube and DLR are the U Bahn London.
Just go with Central Station
That's an odd way of spelling "London Centraal"
Surely then it should be Londoon@@yoironfistbro8128
I live in Enfield, and so frequent the Greater Anglia lines that run into Liverpool St. and Stratford a lot. It's worth mentioning that when Angel was closed down and Meridian Water was built to replace it - Meridian Water was built to Crossrail Specifications, ready for when the rest of Crossrail 2 was built. The same applies for Tottenham Hale and Northumberland Park when they were recently upgraded, they are all ready for Crossrail 2, which would reduce the time taken to build the line if and when it happens.
My vote for the Mega Station at Euston/Kings Cross/St. Pancras is "Mega Station" - I wonder if they'd be brave enough to use it!
Ah the longed for Weymouth to Harlow Town link would also fit this line. ☺️
Thanks!
And thank you!
I think the best name for the new megatermius formed by adding Euston to the King's Cross - St Pancras complex would have to be LABYRINTH FROM HELL. It would be worse than Bank - Monument: people would go in and never manage to get out again, and their dessicated bodies would be found years later by archaeologists.
I also propose that if Crossrail 2 were ever built, it should be named after our present King and be called Line of Charlie.
But at this rate, it would probably have to be the William line (unless it gets the nickname of the Willy line, maybe then reconsideration might be needed) or the George line, given Charles will probably be long dead by the time it finally gets built.
If ever a line is named after the present monarch, it should be called the ‘Charleston Line.’
Yes, I do acknowledge your cocaine-based gag!
A Line of Charlie is already something most people take in London anyway
@@timeywimeyproductions I didn't know that was a slang word for blow.
It would be nice to name a line after lady diane as she was the peoples queen unlike lizzi the lizard
I need a "*by Paris standards, don't start." anytime I discuss the Paris metro too lol
With the number of interchanges available at King's Pancras Saint Euston they'd have to start announcing it before they've even departed angel.
I appreciate the many disclaimers about routes being underserved ***in a london context***, i will indeed not start (today)
I remember once going on a train to Colchester: the driver announced on the approach 'If you wish to go to [a] change at Colchester... [repeat several times for locations b, c, d...]' Driver realises what he is saying and then continues 'In fact, if you wish to go anywhere other than Colchester Town Station, change at Colchester.'
Assuming Euston is integrated with Euston Square and that the Northern line is split at this point:
This is a Crossrail 2 service for Shepperton, next station... Euston St. Pancras. Change here for the Victoria, Northern and Southern lines and the London Overground from Euston; the Circle, Hammersmith and City, Metropolitan and Piccadily lines from King's Cross St. Pancras; as well as for Thameslink from St. Pancras and national and international rail services. This station has step-free access.
Ok this is long 😂 @@Alto53
I think the mega-terminal should either be called Dave, or Station McStationface.
I agree (offcource Dave is only used when you are to drunk to remember real names ;) )
Stationopolis? Stationzilla....?
Mega Station McStationface? Terminus McTurminusface? (No, I was too already thinking about those alright?)
Thanks
And thank you!
*This project really deserves to be re-energised asap.*
Changing government will be the only thing that gives that a chance, so here's hoping
@@adsadam1 Changqing..??? Do you mean Chongqing??? But that has nothing to do with this???
just realised it's "changing" 😭 Wow I am dumb sometimes
Yes, to hell with anything north of Watford, let’s keep all our money for new infrastructure in London. (sarcasm BTW).
@@chemistmanuk we need both. We need another city in the UK to increase dramatically and have things pushed away from London to there, like Manchester ideally
Call it North City Grand Interchange. I don't see CR2 ever starting in Harlow at its north end. It was always going to be Broxbourne, as there is an unused 6 road yard there, with space to add as many new tracks in the yard that they need for stabling and maintenance. The station would need a big rebuild, but there is space for that as well.
First time I've ever seen a reference to Upper Halliford on RUclips, and possibly the internet! Brings back some great memories ❤️
Shepperton always got the mentions ☹️
Call Euston-King's X-St Pancras just simply "London Somers Town" in honour of the only part of London surrounded by the 3.
I chuckled at the two subtitles "By London standards, don't start". Although it is only two miles away, I last travelled by train from my local station in 1980, so it is good to know that at least some metropolitan types realise the irony of building or not building Crossrail 2 for us oiks here in the Midlands.
“Euston St Pancras” is currently called Euston Road…. Via The Rocket pub usually!
And the Doric Arch, &c., &c.
@@SportyMabamba find it’s a bit warm in there and prefer The Rocket.
@@loftlegacy yeah I don’t rate it particularly highly but need it for 100% completion of a Euston Mile 🤣
@@SportyMabamba better than paying £7.80 for a pint in Euston station!
I propose the megastation should be called 'That London'.
Worth noting that local services north of Tottenham Hale at the moment are 4tph, and only 2tph at Brimsdown and Ponders End. Quad-tracking the line up to Broxborne would have to be done to accommodate the extra trains, and could more than double (or quadruple) services stopping at the intemediate stations.
They already seem to be thinking about Quad-tracking. The design of the new Meridian Water station seems to allow for another track and platform to be added on the East side. 👍 Northumberland park seems also to have passive provision for it.
@@Pesmog Hmm only three at Tottenham Hale though and that's quite recent, without indication they'd be adding more later, or really much space to do so.
Alexandra Palace was called Wood Green originally, and is reached from the main centre of Wood Green using "Station Road"
I’ve always been invested in the chaos around Crossrail
As taxpayers, haven't we all been? 😂
I think it should be called the Albert Line. I'm speculating that this will be the name of Prince George's first son, who it'll be posthumously named after.
I suppose though that depends on whether they are first in line. If they are first in line, George might want to go with a more regal sounding name, such as to maintain some continuity with past monarchs, and I'm not sure whether he would want a first. By all means though, if George has a daughter first and that son is the spare, it doesn't really matter.
@@Cowman9791maybe. Though we've _sort of_ had an Albert. Edward VIII was christened Albert Edward, so not unprecedented.
VII. Oops
@@Cowman9791 Perhaps Charles IV (Henry and Edward are 'already many' with George (and James in Scotland) close behind; all three Richards died untimely; Stephen and John were Bad Kings (a la 1066 and all that).
King George VI was an Albert before choosing George as his regnal name.
If Crossrail 2 was given the go ahead after next week then it would be finished in about 2050!
I for one don't plan on being alive that long and why should I build something that my children could use.
/Sarcasm
A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they know they shall never sit
@@kevinobyrne5 Ooh; that's a nice one.
Interesting to hear it’s not happening. London Boroughs are still charging a Community Infrastructure Levy on new developments, specifically to fund Crossrail2.
Crossrail 2 or "we really really want it and need it but will probably not live to see it."
As for the Mega-station I would say either St Pancras Interchange or London Grafton, both nods to the heritage of the area
But the Grafton Arms are in Victoria
@highpath4776 The Earl of Euston is the Duke of Grafton's son or other heir. So one up from Euston in rank and importance should logically be Grafton.
@@SmudgeThomas Fitzroy Station could work too, but Grafton sounds good.
This really needs to be built , would be the perfect line
Crossrail (Taylor’s Version) 😛
Great one Jago. In my opinion as much as it's needed and even if it was approved by parliament, it would take a very long time im looking at you HS2
the new mega-terminal should be London-mian similar to how many train stations in the European continent is called something like Berlin hauptbahnhof
In Newcastle, Glasgow and Cardiff the main train station is called "Central station" and in Birmingham, it's called "Grand Central station" like the one in New York but I do think it would be nice if the main station in each city could be called Central station as standard.
@@lazrseagull54 or... for the shits and giggle. We litterally call it londen haupbahnhof.
It is not just Harlow Town which campaigned for a stop. In Streatham, we argued vigorously that it was outrageous to run the tunnel just a mile or so away to Tooting or Balham (which both already have tubes) without finally bringing this very significant population a fast underground link.
A point to add to your commentary: Just as the northern arms would free up capacity at Liverpool St (for more Greater Anglia trains) the local trains going underground at Wimbledon would free up lots of capacity in from there to Waterloo which was to be used to increase the trains coming in from Woking and beyond as there would be more platforms available at Waterloo and space on the existing lines, so Crossrail 2 would improve services in Southampton and Cambridge.
Just that link from Leytonstone to Homerton in the early plan has been a dream of mine since moving that way. I look forward to a dedicated video
Brilliant video sir!
Im not a london local but from what i understand this would be amazing
Well, thank you Jago - you published this on my birthday and the proposed line starts at Broxbourne, where I grew up. How apropos.
Wow I came across the repurposed Michelin place at 6:20 just walking to the V&A. Obviously the perfect entrance station for underground trains.
Megastation name: Holy Trinity. After the Grade 1 listed church on Euston Road opposite.
London is missing a central station, and the city rail network is mainly connected by the Elizabeth line and Thameslink. I really like the idea of a big station connecting multiple mainlines in London to one hub. I would like it to be called "London Central".
Megastation name: Brill Place, which is just nearby, then they would have to make it brill.
Looks like this line is still very much needed despite being called off. Thanks for creating this portrait of it, what it could be, and what it might be if Londoners did not have to wait until they get another Queen to name it after before the line will be built.
By the time Crossrail II happens it will probably be called the Charlotte line. As for the name for E.St.P.K.X. ? East Park Junction in North West One? "Clear as mud junction" lol. I think of E.St.P&KX as being in north London (NW1) but for most people it is quite central.
another amazing video from the greatest guy on earth
5:48 "Big station" is what it should be called
Wait until we get to see Crossrail 3. Now that is a project. 😮
A brilliant exposition of the current state of Crossrail 2. We can only hope.
I once had the best tasting cup of tea of my life at Somerset Park. New stand looks good... all the better for keeping the terracing.
It would also help alleviate pressure on the West Anglia Main Line which has only two tracks despite having a lot of competing services running, e.g., to Cambridge, Hertford East, Stansted Express. It also has a lot of level crossings. There was a formal review done of this some time ago which can be found online somewhere.
Just on your point about the north eastern part of the route, I seem to remember reading that Wood Green is the preferred option for Haringey Council as they say it would help with the economic regeneration of the area.
Wood Green is near Ally Pally, unless you’re walking. Ally Pally is a busy centre with exhibitions an ice rink and a theatre that holds many concerts . It’s a busy place and deserves decent public transport, which frankly it lacks.
I think I'll be long gone by the time Crossrail 2 gets built. I mean I've waited 22 years for step free access to Motspur Park station, and now that my niece & nephew have grown up and I don't need to struggle carrying a tiny tot & a buggy up all those stairs; they finally put in a new bridge with lift access!
Would SWT's Kingston Loop half-hourly trains via Teddington and Richmond still run to and from Waterloo after other suburban services were diverted to CR2?
@06:32 In terms of redevelopment of Clapham Junction, there was something a few years back of "London Bridge-ing" the station by opening the arches below. There was a couple of other things about rejigging the Southern platforms with the local stopping Victoria services using the platforms where the West London serving Southern services currently run from.
If covid didnt happen, probably would have been the next big Network Rail Sussex region upgrade after the Croydon Triangle rebuild
My vote for the mega-station name would be just call it "London" as it would be THE definitive London station, where you come in from most of the country and abroad, connects to most of the tube, and would be just painful and confusing enough as well.
Not a bad idea, actually.
The Tokyo option.
I asked chatGPT for some names for the mega station. I like 1, 3 and 6
1. Nexus Central Station - "Nexus" signifies connection and a central point where various elements converge.
2. Gateway Junction - Highlighting its role as a gateway for different rail lines.
3. Union Hub - Emphasizing unity and connectivity of multiple routes.
4. Concord Interchange - "Concord" suggests harmony and cooperation between different lines.
5. Vertex Terminal - "Vertex" suggests the highest point or key connection where everything converges.
6. Central Crossroads Station - Reflecting the intersection of multiple rail links.
7. Axis Link Station - "Axis" suggests a pivotal, connecting role, emphasizing its strategic importance.
Good one jago 👍
2:49 - why not build in between Wood Green and Alexandra Palace..? Same with Angel and Balham
5:50 - London Northern Terminal Junction
Sooooo lovely that it can connect to the continent - would that include the incontinent as well though?
I would call the megastation Somers Town. I already refer to my walk between Thameslink up to St Pancras to LNR and Avanti at Euston a "Somers Town saver". I usually save time and always save money.
The obvious name for the new super station would seem to be Hubby McHubface.
Well, someone had to suggest it so we could then get on with our lives.
Berlin's best hub is Berlin Hauptbahnhof, so I think the mega terminus should be called London Central or just London.
German cities have "Hauptbahnhof" stations because they're all medium-sized cities; Berlin has 3.6 million, and no other city there has more than 1.5m. London has 10m. This station does serve the north and would have suburban trains elsewhere, but mainline services to the south and west are still elsewhere.
@@IndigoJo The funny thing is that the Hauptbahnhof is a relatively new station and Berlin used to rely on various termini spread across the city. Before that, Ostbahnhof was the most important station (and still is today, since with its many platforms and through tracks, east-west trains can easily terminate there) and even then, its advantage was that it lied on the Stadtbahn. Ever since the Tierparktunnel was built (which allowed for North-South mainline service), its significance got diminished given that there is a now better station for intercity trains.
Moreover, Berlin is big enough to support four more intercity stations (i.e. aside from Ostbahnhof, there also is Spandau, Gesundbrunnen and Südkreuz), roughly matching the many termini of Paris and London except they support through service.
It unites multiple different lines and stations and connects them all to the rest of the continent?
European Union Station 🤩
Euston for short?
@@neilyoungman9814 ow? Wow!
@@neilyoungman9814I will never see Euston the same way now. Also, I’m totally going to spread this as a myth
My suggestion for the megajunction station's name is King Alfred the Great Station, since he seems to be the only British king to be called 'the Great,' as well as being a good aspirational name to the designers to live up to, or the passengers to be disappointed by.
Thanks for the views of Seaford Bay during you commercial
It should be called British Libary
I like this - very educational!
I used to get the train in the morning from Angel Road, I guess since I moved to Cornwall they decided to get rid of it
I thought one of the advantages of CrossRail 2 was to move suburban services away from London Waterloo to the Crossrail 2 tunnels to free up more platform capacity for trains on the Portsmouth Direct and South Western Mainline. Talking of the Portsmouth Direct, any chance of a video on the Battle of Havant, the frog war between the LBSCR and LSWR?
Yes: north and south are still not directly connected---there's not even a Waterloo/Victoria route. Termini like Charring Cross, Cannon Street,Fenchurch Street stand alone
Call the new station ‘London Central’
Clean and efficient
That's a bus company
LondONE
@oc3phish07. London Central was my thoughts exactly. Well done.
That’s not in central London.
How about ‘Grand London’ Station
This project would be outstanding
if you look at the infrastructure built in the STAR project (The triple track from coppermill junc to meridian water) and meridian water station it was all built with provision for an additional (4th) track for crossrail 2 in mind. Ponders End had a rebuild projcet to get 3 platforms (to allow a couple more trains along the WAML) with that same provision for C2, but that project was cancelled in 2023
On the topic of rail lines and development round Clapham Junction, have you ever thought of making a video on the redevelopment of Vauxhall, Nine Elms and the Cold Storage? Such a fascinating area of London.
Station name idea: King's Pancras St Euston? :P
Hope to see a Jago Hazzard video on the opening of Crossrail2! Re station: maybe Grand Central - both as it links several grand old stations & is the HS2 terminus (the successor to the Grand Central Line)
Suggested name for Euston St Pancras Megaterminus - The Long March Travelator Replacement Service. You're welcome.
Euston St Pancras - what about calling it Somers Town after the area in between?
London Grand Central. And I say that as a serious rather than a facetious suggestion, as a nod to the American DNA of the Tube.
Ah, but this isn't a Tube line. Its DNA isn't that of Yerkes et al, at all
Birmingham did that.
Why 'London'? Just 'Grand Central' should do. If people don't know which city they're in, they probably shouldn't be looking to take a train...
@@paulhaynes8045 Because people will be getting the train from outside London so they need to know what city it's going to. Same reason that in airports signs say London Heathrow rather than just Heathrow
@@bluemountain4181 Well, it's just barely in London.
Most informative, Jago! Eustpkingx Central doesn't exactly roll off the tongue I guess... Can't argue with a Swift newsfeed blockage... Cherrio!
A pity the line from Northumberland Pk via Wood Green to Alexandre Palace (Palace Gates) was ever decommisioned.
Battle Bridge was what the area of King's Cross and Saint Pancras was know as before any railway was built. calling the new CR2 interchange that would reflect what getting it built would involve!
I know it's just cause I live here but everytime you mention Balham, I get a lil excited
6:42 my understanding of the Northern proposal was that the line, at present, does not have the capacity to absorb new passengers into Zone 1.
I really think they should add a station at Essex Road too, to allow interchange with the Northern City line. It could take a lot of pressure off of the Northern line at Angela and King's Cross
could there be direct services from Southampton to London to the north?
I like the proposed names of "London Main", "London Midtown" and "London Union" Station. But I also want to propose "London Camden" or "Camden Hub", as it's the borough of all three stations now. And what a mega station it would be! It could have a full-fledged people mover (airport style) just to connect the different platforms!
2:15 - An interesting point is that the new Meridian Water station was built with passive provision for Crossrail 2 - space for tracks and the platforms were reserved and the pedestrian bridge is wide enough to accomodate this as well.
6:30 - The only reason holding the Northern Line back from Clapham Junction is the lack of Crossrail 2. Crossrail 2 would alleviate some of the pressure on the Northern Line, otherwise the trains would be packed at Clapham junction and unable to take on passengers at Nine Elms and Battersea Power. The alignment underneath Battersea Park is reserved and should Crossrail 2 get the go ahead, Northern Line Extension 2: Electric Boogaloo should get the go ahead.