Well done! Niki fro Scubapro here - the lights guy... We do have a "tec"version of the Nova 850 as well. It doesn´t have the Safety mode (which is ment to protect the light from accidentally switching on in your luggage and melting your t-shirts :) ) and it is a turn to activate light head, so even safer for your really deep dives. It comes with the 3C battery tube, but you can also use the 18650 tube you have on your normal 850R. The reason why we don´t claim the 300m for the push button lights is that we simply can´t test properly enough to do such a big claim. The light is too relevant for safety to claim sthg that we are not 100% sure of. The potential! failure point could! be the o-ring in the push button, especially when it ages. Anyway, thks for reviewing! Your two-tank-pressure-tank is really cool!
Thanks Niki, good job on these lights. I'm a proud Scubapro ambassador so I was thrilled when this light did so well in the test. I'll chat to Brett about having a look at the tec version too.
After watching Richard's video here, and seeing a review of the Nova 850 Tec. I've been sitting here thinking about a solution to Richard's problem with his backup lights at 30 bar. Tactile Switch is a no go, no easy way to remedy the issue of operation at both 1 bar, and 30 bar, plus the other issue of a small o-ring that will fail. Tailcap SPST switch is a also a no go, better to use a SPST Toggle Switch on the body, and have the LED Controller failsafe the LED on if the switch fails closed due to water ingress. You would also need to isolate the Toggle Switch from the main body of the light, by have the switch relay control voltage only through contacts in the body, instead of directly wired to the LED control board. This way water ingress into the switch wouldn't compromise the body of the light. Twist on heads, with standard single start threads, 30mm x1.5, which I believe is what the 850 TEC has been cut to, are the best solution for it's 30 bar rating. The problem as stated by Richard, is that this style of threaded head lacks usability at 30 bar. The light may be rated for this pressure, but at that rated pressure you can't twist the head because of friction. My idea is this. Instead of using a normal single start thread on both the head and the body. Insert 3 pins in the head at 120 degrees, pin diameter around .75-1.00mm, then cut a triple start thread in the body wide enough for those pins. 1/8 turn from bottom, and actuation of the light, mill small detents in the thread for the pins. This way the bottom two o-rings are in full contact, but the head has a place to rest before dropping the rest of the way down, and turning on the light. This solution would also eliminate the issue of being able to twist the head on so tight that you can't get it off again. The trick will be in how aggressively the detents are milled, so that actuation at 1 bar isn't too easy, and actuation at 30 bar isn't too hard. There's only handful of people in the world that could help with hands on testing...
Excellent Video, Im after some new backup lights as my really really old ones are at end of life. Concerned about your choice of safety boots, thongs made add more protection than bare feet. :)
Hey Richard, I'm curious about the issues you see with the push button switches - I think you mentioned from the Bigblue lights. If they are activating at depth, I suspect they aren't a true magnetic switch (which would use either a hall effect sensor or a reed, with a moving magnet). For a true magnetic switch, the reed or hall effect sensor would be completely sealed inside the housing, with usually a basic push button with spring moving a magnet close enough to the housing so that the magnetic field reaches through the housing thickness and activates said sensor when the button is fully depressed. The void where the spring and magnet sit is environmentally exposed to allow water to easily enter / exit, firstly to allow the magnet to freely move but also to mitigate any pressure changes since water can freely move in / out of the void. Another possibility is that the void I mentioned above in the torches with issues is environmentally sealed, at least from the outside, hence at depth you would run into issues with the button being depressed due to the increasing external pressure. I've been searching for an off the shelf true magnetic switch solution, but have yet to find one. I have an old un branded dive torch which does use one, but it looks like a custom design where each part, particularly where the magnet sits, has been custom fabricated. Great videos and content by the way. I don't dive to depths you do (50m is my absolute max at the moment) however I always look to the tec divers to increase my knowledge in order to apply this to my recreational dives to improve my conservatism, amongst other benefits.
Hi I actually haven't asked Big Blue how the switches work, but I have had the strobe problem with at least 4 different BB lights on separate dives, and as shallow as 40m in one instance. The Dive Rite primary has a rotating collar which is seemingly a magnetic switch with no penetration of the hull, so that would inspire more confidence. I have some deep dives coming up and will give that a test.
I would love to see a video with you an Achim Schlöffel from ISE, on equipment and setup of equipment. Maybe you get in touch. As far as I know Achim, he would love to do a video with you! Looking forward to seeing a video of the two of you!
Harry Way in the past they made dive lights that non-penetrating switch using magnetic reed switches, and even the AquaZepp used them for power switching (Zepps used them to activate a relay). Am surprised that no is making deep rated dive lights using that tech today John
I’ve got two Big Blue video lights. Interesting that they don’t let you reset them at depth. I don’t get anywhere remotely that deep yet. I’ve had the issue with my screw on Orcatorch lights. I may add an index mark on them so I know they’ll stay off in my pocket until I need them.
I’m curious if anyone has tried to fill the air gaps with something like Fluorinert. not sure how it would affect the activation or the beam angle but it would certainly be interesting to see how it stacks up against a standard light.
so what housing you use for the gopro?? and what model do you use? as far am aware the depth for those housing is 40 and 60 mt! i saw a video 100mt but have a small leackage if i spelled it correct!! thanks for sharing very well made vid
You need links to the various lights if they're still available. I'm looking for a good, all purpose torch right now and whilst these would be overkill I'd expect them to last a long time.
@@DrHarryH yeah I have been using them for the last 2 years and been very happy with their performance and design so far. Would be interesting to do some deep testing on them too and see
Next time I would make the top half much shorter so you can fill the base, then more easily put the "lid" on and fill the lid through the top hole. Other wise it seems to working well (and I am no longer terrified of it!). In fact I am planning to get the lid shortened.
@@DrHarryH Great to know! I'm thinking of a very similar design, but I might try using some thick walled steel pipe and pipe flanges for an easy bolt on top.
I would think just the ali top plate would work well without the short tank section but with inside turned down 5mm to act as a bit of a cap to locate the bottom tank inside it, unless you need the extra lengh of the top tank half
Dare you put the dive Scurion into it! I'd be interested to know if it does 300m but (A) won't ever go to that depth to find out myself and (B) would cry if it broke. 🤣
Craig and I both have the Scurion Dive lights and we have dived them to 245m. Unfortunately the battery packs started to get small amounts of water in them at that depth. They are undoubtedly awesome lights however!
Interesting-thanks. At the start of the video you mentioned recent deep cave exploration- can you tell us any more about this? Any further work in the Pearse Resurgence? Thanks.
I think if you were to measure the 650 lumen light against the scuba pro 850 you would find the difference. Human eyes are actually pretty bad at perceiving brightness. That's why the DALI lighting standard they included the "DALI curve" because we don't perceive light in a linear fashion. (But I wouldn't say I am actually qualified in any particular way, so take this with a grain of salt).
Lumen is the total light production, not the brightness. Light intensity (or brightness) is measured in candela. So, for instance, a light bulb can produce a lot of lumen, but since it's emitted in all directions, the light intensity (candela) isn't very high. A laser produces very little in terms of lumen, but concentrates into a tight beam, so the candela is very high. It's therefor hard to visually compare a 600 and 850 lumen light, since the extra light production may be in the corona, and not in the focused beam.
Спорт
Well done! Niki fro Scubapro here - the lights guy... We do have a "tec"version of the Nova 850 as well. It doesn´t have the Safety mode (which is ment to protect the light from accidentally switching on in your luggage and melting your t-shirts :) ) and it is a turn to activate light head, so even safer for your really deep dives. It comes with the 3C battery tube, but you can also use the 18650 tube you have on your normal 850R. The reason why we don´t claim the 300m for the push button lights is that we simply can´t test properly enough to do such a big claim. The light is too relevant for safety to claim sthg that we are not 100% sure of. The potential! failure point could! be the o-ring in the push button, especially when it ages. Anyway, thks for reviewing! Your two-tank-pressure-tank is really cool!
Thanks Niki, good job on these lights. I'm a proud Scubapro ambassador so I was thrilled when this light did so well in the test. I'll chat to Brett about having a look at the tec version too.
After watching Richard's video here, and seeing a review of the Nova 850 Tec. I've been sitting here thinking about a solution to Richard's problem with his backup lights at 30 bar.
Tactile Switch is a no go, no easy way to remedy the issue of operation at both 1 bar, and 30 bar, plus the other issue of a small o-ring that will fail.
Tailcap SPST switch is a also a no go, better to use a SPST Toggle Switch on the body, and have the LED Controller failsafe the LED on if the switch fails closed due to water ingress. You would also need to isolate the Toggle Switch from the main body of the light, by have the switch relay control voltage only through contacts in the body, instead of directly wired to the LED control board. This way water ingress into the switch wouldn't compromise the body of the light.
Twist on heads, with standard single start threads, 30mm x1.5, which I believe is what the 850 TEC has been cut to, are the best solution for it's 30 bar rating. The problem as stated by Richard, is that this style of threaded head lacks usability at 30 bar. The light may be rated for this pressure, but at that rated pressure you can't twist the head because of friction.
My idea is this. Instead of using a normal single start thread on both the head and the body. Insert 3 pins in the head at 120 degrees, pin diameter around .75-1.00mm, then cut a triple start thread in the body wide enough for those pins. 1/8 turn from bottom, and actuation of the light, mill small detents in the thread for the pins. This way the bottom two o-rings are in full contact, but the head has a place to rest before dropping the rest of the way down, and turning on the light. This solution would also eliminate the issue of being able to twist the head on so tight that you can't get it off again.
The trick will be in how aggressively the detents are milled, so that actuation at 1 bar isn't too easy, and actuation at 30 bar isn't too hard. There's only handful of people in the world that could help with hands on testing...
I recognize those old tanks! Nice work Harry!
I love you guy! 😅 You’re just doing the necessary.
lol. i am most impressed, that the gopro survived that^^ (even in a dive case :D)
Excellent 300m housing from Golem Gear.
Excellent Video, Im after some new backup lights as my really really old ones are at end of life. Concerned about your choice of safety boots, thongs made add more protection than bare feet. :)
Hey Richard, I'm curious about the issues you see with the push button switches - I think you mentioned from the Bigblue lights. If they are activating at depth, I suspect they aren't a true magnetic switch (which would use either a hall effect sensor or a reed, with a moving magnet). For a true magnetic switch, the reed or hall effect sensor would be completely sealed inside the housing, with usually a basic push button with spring moving a magnet close enough to the housing so that the magnetic field reaches through the housing thickness and activates said sensor when the button is fully depressed. The void where the spring and magnet sit is environmentally exposed to allow water to easily enter / exit, firstly to allow the magnet to freely move but also to mitigate any pressure changes since water can freely move in / out of the void.
Another possibility is that the void I mentioned above in the torches with issues is environmentally sealed, at least from the outside, hence at depth you would run into issues with the button being depressed due to the increasing external pressure.
I've been searching for an off the shelf true magnetic switch solution, but have yet to find one. I have an old un branded dive torch which does use one, but it looks like a custom design where each part, particularly where the magnet sits, has been custom fabricated.
Great videos and content by the way. I don't dive to depths you do (50m is my absolute max at the moment) however I always look to the tec divers to increase my knowledge in order to apply this to my recreational dives to improve my conservatism, amongst other benefits.
Hi I actually haven't asked Big Blue how the switches work, but I have had the strobe problem with at least 4 different BB lights on separate dives, and as shallow as 40m in one instance. The Dive Rite primary has a rotating collar which is seemingly a magnetic switch with no penetration of the hull, so that would inspire more confidence. I have some deep dives coming up and will give that a test.
I could listen to this guy doing anything
I would love to see a video with you an Achim Schlöffel from ISE, on equipment and setup of equipment. Maybe you get in touch. As far as I know Achim, he would love to do a video with you! Looking forward to seeing a video of the two of you!
Harry
Way in the past they made dive lights that non-penetrating switch using magnetic reed switches, and even the AquaZepp used them for power switching (Zepps used them to activate a relay). Am surprised that no is making deep rated dive lights using that tech today
John
I’ve got two Big Blue video lights. Interesting that they don’t let you reset them at depth. I don’t get anywhere remotely that deep yet. I’ve had the issue with my screw on Orcatorch lights. I may add an index mark on them so I know they’ll stay off in my pocket until I need them.
I need to upgrade my rec lights. Tec ain't cheap but there's just no getting around it.
Brilliant work! If you can get a couple more gazillion views from light nerds, you will be on a winner with RUclips :-) I enjoyed this.
I assumed everyone is a light nerd?!
@@DrHarryH I like to think so too!
I’m curious if anyone has tried to fill the air gaps with something like Fluorinert. not sure how it would affect the activation or the beam angle but it would certainly be interesting to see how it stacks up against a standard light.
Wish you tested Orcatorch. I feel like they are the best
so what housing you use for the gopro?? and what model do you use? as far am aware the depth for those housing is 40 and 60 mt! i saw a video 100mt but have a small leackage if i spelled it correct!! thanks for sharing very well made vid
Golem Gear make nice 300m housings for a variety of GoPro models.
@@DrHarryH ill check them out ty
You need links to the various lights if they're still available. I'm looking for a good, all purpose torch right now and whilst these would be overkill I'd expect them to last a long time.
Easy to search for them. Google Dive Gear Express, Hollis and Scubapro Nova 850R.
If im not leading, I love to glide without lights but would attach a glow stick to my 104's.
Thanks for this! Have you tested by any chance Ammonite LED backup lights?
I hadn't heard of them actually, but looking at the website they appear to be pretty robust.
@@DrHarryH yeah I have been using them for the last 2 years and been very happy with their performance and design so far. Would be interesting to do some deep testing on them too and see
Nice flange
you know I'm gonna have to build one now as well....
Good! Love to see it when you do.
I dont have a German pump but was thinking same concept but fill with water and pressurise with compressed air
I’m looking at making a pressure vessel for testing as well. Any recommendations or lessons learned?
Next time I would make the top half much shorter so you can fill the base, then more easily put the "lid" on and fill the lid through the top hole. Other wise it seems to working well (and I am no longer terrified of it!). In fact I am planning to get the lid shortened.
@@DrHarryH Great to know! I'm thinking of a very similar design, but I might try using some thick walled steel pipe and pipe flanges for an easy bolt on top.
@@serafinobp9428 I did get an engineering mate to review my concept. Be careful and only ever use water to pressurise!
I would think just the ali top plate would work well without the short tank section but with inside turned down 5mm to act as a bit of a cap to locate the bottom tank inside it, unless you need the extra lengh of the top tank half
Dare you put the dive Scurion into it! I'd be interested to know if it does 300m but (A) won't ever go to that depth to find out myself and (B) would cry if it broke. 🤣
Craig and I both have the Scurion Dive lights and we have dived them to 245m. Unfortunately the battery packs started to get small amounts of water in them at that depth. They are undoubtedly awesome lights however!
Looking really fit Harry, whats the secret?
Eat less, do more!
Have you ever tried to fill a backup torch with mineral oil?
No, we haven't found it necessary for backup lights.
Interesting-thanks. At the start of the video you mentioned recent deep cave exploration- can you tell us any more about this? Any further work in the Pearse Resurgence? Thanks.
Our main ongoing project is the Pearse Resurgence, current exploration depth 245m. We should have been there in February but got COVID'd again :-(.
Your German is pretty good
Sorry about that!
I think if you were to measure the 650 lumen light against the scuba pro 850 you would find the difference. Human eyes are actually pretty bad at perceiving brightness. That's why the DALI lighting standard they included the "DALI curve" because we don't perceive light in a linear fashion.
(But I wouldn't say I am actually qualified in any particular way, so take this with a grain of salt).
Lumen is the total light production, not the brightness. Light intensity (or brightness) is measured in candela.
So, for instance, a light bulb can produce a lot of lumen, but since it's emitted in all directions, the light intensity (candela) isn't very high. A laser produces very little in terms of lumen, but concentrates into a tight beam, so the candela is very high.
It's therefor hard to visually compare a 600 and 850 lumen light, since the extra light production may be in the corona, and not in the focused beam.