Chemist here: the reason you get a better crust using malt syrup instead of honey is that you are using a reducing sugar which acts as a mild base doing some of the work you did not employ the Baking soda to do. Additionally reducing sugars behave differently in the maillard reactions generally giving better color at lower temperatures
Hi, bagel baker here! Where I work we use honey because it gives a shiny brown look when fully baked and it also allows your toppings to stick better. Another thing, just a couple of tips, I'm was trained to do Montréal style bagels, so here's my advice: 1. When you roll, make sure the "rope" of dough you make is the same thickness all throughout. DO NOT USE YOUR FINGERS, ONLY PALMS. Wrap them around your hand with the closing ends in your palm and roll TWO TIMES. Otherwise you'll end up in the situation you were in where one side is too thick and the other is too thin. It's also why one of yours broke after taking it out of the water. 2. When you boil them, they should have the texture of a boiled perogie. Make sure to flip them once the top is brown. 3. You don't have to have to let them puff up. You can start rolling them as soon as they're done mixing. It's easier if the dough is hard. If you have any questions for me or anyone else in the comments, feel free to ask.
It reminds me of how Koreans also use ssal-jocheong for sweetener as it gives a shiny brown look, and reminds me of invert sugar as well which you can make quite a deep color, also used to give a brown appearance. How do you think a honey/malt bagel recipe could be adapted for a thicker syrup like maltose? (If you search it the images give you a good idea of its viscosity)
@@foofu6685 Literally adam when he was doing the research for this recipe. He's openly talked about how he often searches forums and other websites catered specifically to professionals to get some tips from them.
I would I roll it 1 1/4 times. Just let the ends overlap. Not the whole rope around your hand twice. That doesn’t make sense and it’s too much Letting the ends overlap about an inch is perfect - I made this recipe today :-) You’re absolutely right. Having a thin end like that isn’t good for even cooking and it’ll break fishing it out of the water. I have a Montreal style bagel recipe I will try next time :-) As a trained baker in that style, if you have a recipe and any tips , I’d appreciate it :-) Thanks 😊
2:13 The opposite of a lubricant is a "frictionizer" But it's a very esoteric term, it's not used very much since with many things you want to try and reduce friction. But, frictionizers are used in paper and textile manufacturing, and on floor coatings to reduce slippage. I'm also assuming such substances are used in manufacturing tyres and shoe soles etc. but are called a different name.
I honestly love how we can watch Adam go down a research trail with his videos. The last 3 videos have been about malted barley and before that, it was all about grain. He has huge Alton Brown vibes, I would watch Good Eats as a kid, learning about food makes it so much more fun to cook.
Just realized that heterogeneity is actually one of the really nice defining characteristics of so much hand / home made food and that the homogeneity of most mass produced food is just one of the reasons it’s so much blander.
I work at a Wholefoods and we have been getting asked a bunch of times if we have that malt syrup now (my particular store doesn't but I might add it to our shelves if we keep getting asked). Adam your power is growing wield it responsibly!
I can’t believe how long it took me to figure out that the three pictures Ragusea shows at the end of each video is a “vinegar leg on the right” reference.
NY style bagels typically have a higher gluten content than bread flour can provide. Some recipes recommend adding vital wheat gluten to get the protein levels up and add chewiness.
Speaking of them, you should consider looking at doing a pretzel recipe! Most home recipes use baking soda as you said, but traditional German pretzels are boiled in a LYE solution for even higher pH. They are unreal.
A lye solution and a baking soda solution could both end up with the same ph, depending on how much each one was diluted. (I mean could have a dilute lye bath that was the same PH as a very saturated baking soda bath)
@@rdizzy1 not exactly, baking soda HCO3^- can function as both a weak base and a weak acid. If the pH low (=acidic) it likes to take up H^+ ions (either free in solution, or rip them from water H2O which leaves an OH^- ion in solution) to become H2CO3 (which converts into water and CO2) and thereby make things less acidic/more basic/alkaline. But in high pH (=basic/alkaline) solutions, it likes to donate H^+ ions (which either stay free in solution or combine with OH^- groups to form water, or be used by some other molecule that likes to take them up) to become CO3^(2-) making the solution more acidic/less basic/alkaline. In the middle, it happens both at the same time, which can act as as a buffer at pH of around 8-9 where these reactions are in equilibrium, and if added enough, even adding a more basic/alkaline or more acidic component can get cancelled out by the excess baking powder. As such, you won't be able to get a pH higher than that from baking soda. Lye on the other hand is a strong base, and although weak solutions of it can also reach that pH of 8-9 (so in that sense, you're correct that they could end up with the same pH), you can also use it to create a more basic/alkaline solution (which baking soda never can, so in that sense your comment is wrong/incomplete). The concentrations of lye used for pretzels are often much more basic/alkaline than can be achieved with baking soda. That said, using lye requires much more safety precautions, and may be difficult to get in the first place, and using baking soda can still give a decent effect if you wish to make your own pretzels without needing all the safety precautions that come with using lye.
@@nienke7713I read in a couple of articles that if you put the baking soda on a baking tray and BAKE it (I forget time and temp), it will make the baking soda more like lye than when not baking it would. I can see why bagel places want to avoid using lye, probably for safety reasons. I wonder about the pretzel places.
@@gerriebell2128 yes, you can turn baking soda into washing soda by baking it. It will take the pH up to around 10-11 (whereas baking soda won't get you higher than 8-9), but it's nothing compared to the pH of around 13-14 that a 3%-4% lye solution used in pretzel making can reach. Bagels don't typically use an alkaline solution at all, that's really a pretzel thing (and is what gives you that typical brown pretzel crust).
I haven’t made bagels (although now I might) but I’ve had success using parchment paper to proof Stella Parks’s dinner rolls, which are boiled before baking too. The trick is to cut the parchment so each roll (or bagel) is on a separate piece - then you can use it to lift the roll into the boiling water, and the paper separates easily once it gets wet and the roll firms up a bit. There’s definitely less waste using the oil method, though (especially since a little oil is helpful anyways to get the parchment to stick for the baking step). It’s also probably less important for a low hydration dough like this, since it can take a little manhandling during the boiling process.
I always like how you manage to reduce what other cooks might portray as a very laborious and challenging process into something that looks very approachable. I was always a little scared to get into bread making, it just seemed like it was a whole other world that I wasn't sure I belonged in. Theirs yeast, blooming, different types of flour, kneading techniques, rising, ect. It was a bit daunting looking from the outside in. Well I've been making my own pizza dough for a while because of you and yeah now after seeing this it looks like I'll end up making bagels sometime in the next few weeks.
You are absolutely not wrong about bread making but I would look at it from a different angle. You can do almost everything wrong and still end up with an amazing end product that you will enjoy a lot. If you stick with it you will gradually improve and you will probably always have something to improve on. It's your own personal journey. Pizza Dough is also a great place to start.
Some commercial bakers boil the bagels in a lye solution to get the surface browned. I learned that if you bake baking soda in the oven and drive the moisture out it turns into a different chemical that has a ph much higher than baking soda alone but not as strong as lye. Perfectly browned bagel. Can't wait to do it with the addition of malt syrup. Thank you!
I heard it turns sodium bicarbonate into just sodium carbonate. I've tried it, and the powder actually gets smaller and lighter when you bake it, and the stuff is wicked basic so far as cooking goes. I use it in ramen noodles a la Alex French Guy Cooking, works great
My father was a NY bagel baker 60 years ago. You are absolutely correct with malt in the bagel. He used cake yeast, but I know that's not easy for the home. He never used oil to prevent sticking, he always used corn meal. The "snake method" is absolutely correct too. I don't remember malt in the " kettle" but maybe. Nice work.
Diastic malt powder..is generally used Or this Barley malt sryup Ones the dried powdered version of the other basically King Arthur sells it now in one pound bags put in glass jars stored in cool dark cabinets lasts 4 ever Cornflour that's finer or Semolina to dust parchment for baking at home Your dad proofed and used giant wooden smooth with age patina Ed Boards to load unload into vast wide ovens sticking wasn't much of a problem due to ovens use n older aged equipment The malt powder is also sold in beer making supply shops though due to the dam internet there all online now.
I worked baking bagels on Long Island back in High School. The water color is from the corn meal used to keep the bagels from sticking to the baker rack trays.
Made these today. I prefer to roll around the hand about 1 1/4 times. Just overlapping the ends so they are thick like the rest of the bagel. - about an inch of overlap. This makes for an even bagel all around which I prefer so it doesn’t break fishing it out of the water and it’s even This recipe is pretty good. Adding extra flour and kneading and adding more and kneading is key for a big fluffy NY style bagel. Takes about 20 minutes by hand. Also , stick with the malted barley if you want that NY style bagel taste you’re used to. If you want to make with honey, I would look up a Montreal style bagel recipe because they use honey - and they are much thinner and crispier. - so something different to try :-). I am on the lookout for one and I’ll post it here in the comments when I try one I love both Montreal and NY style - Depends on my mood. Lately I prefer the thinner crispy sweet Montreal style, but growing up in NY, I love the soft chewy dough and the barley malt taste so this will satisfy that craving when I’m homesick.
YYYYAAAAUYYYYYYYYY!!!! I’m getting a new oven this month and I live in Korea now and bagels here are obviously not … like home in Queens. I’ve saved a few recipes but this could NOT have come at a better time, Adam.
So there are a few different opposites to lubricant. In the context of using flour to dry out the outside of the dough to keep it workable, I believe the opposite there would be desiccant. The flour is acting as a desiccant.
Malted syrup is available in virtually all supermarkets in Northern Europe, and probably also in neighbouring countries like Germany or Poland (where the bagel originated). It's sold as "bread syrup" here.
I was the baker at a bagel chain for a time.. I loved that job...I was so surprised to learn how to make pretzel bagels... Really just baking soda + water dunk, and sprinkle generously with salt. You can dip your bagels in the seasoning, with the most recently boiled side down (into seasoning), and as long as it's still pretty damp\tacky, it'll stick fairly well. No need for egg wash, unless you like that sort of thing.
I have a proposal for you: We typically see "Cake flour" (7-9% gluten), "All-purpose flour" (8-11% gluten) and "Bread flour" / "Strong flour" (12-14% gluten). But! Now that I've bought a five pound bag of vital wheat gluten, I can just buy AP flour and add a little of that to make bread flour. So I got to thinking... Why not go higher? What does a 16% gluten bread look like? How about 20%? 25%? Is this the easy kitchen hack that renders all sorts of tough doughs easier to develop? No-knead sourdoughs became famous for using time to create gluten development, so can I make a bagel out of extra-high gluten dough and develop it in the refrigerator without all the effort associated with using kneading bread flour or AP flour into bagels?
This is two years old but... I have made insanely high protein breads (for the gainz) and my main takeaway is that they work for making breads of all kinds (pizza, ciabatta, sourdough boules in my experience) but that they taste kind of weird. I hate the fishy taste you get from the extra gluten. I would never sacrifice the good taste of bread for the beneficial structural properties of more protein. But YMMV.
Malted Barley syrup is actually a common grocery store item in Norway, sold as "malt extract", it's good for babies' digestion if they're having a tough time digesting something.
You might even want to get wheat gluten to add to this dough if you think your flower does not have enough gluten. Furthermore, the autolyse also certainly hydrates the flour better/easier than you would without it. I also suggest using sturdy/longer chopsticks as a way to grab and flip the boiling bagels.
In Portland, Oregon we have a local chain called Henry Higgin's Boiled Bagels, and they are made boiled, like yours are. This video inspired me to crawl out of bed and go buy some.
Good crust usually means maillard reaction, which require reducing* sugar and amino acid in a quite high temp, low moisture. Reducing sugar (glucose, galactose, maltose, lactose"milksugar", and more) and non-reducing sugar (sucrose maple syrup beetroot canesugar, and fructose* honey, fruit syrup, corn syrup, and some sugar alternative). This is from memory so might not 100% accurate. If you want good crust use: reducing sugar source Milk powder, maltose, caramel. And amino acid source, egg, bean and nuts.
Thanks Adam! It's impossible to find bagels down here in south america. I used your last bagel recipe to make my own and it tastes delicious. I still have 3 or 4 on the fridge and every morning I get one to make myself an egg sandwich. Now I have to find malt extract to make my bagels even more new yorkers
These bagels seem a lot more Montreal style bagels (another city with a significant Jewish population and strong bagel tradition). Montreal bagels are less bread and with larger holes than new york bagels, and use a method like this one to form the holes. If you haven't had them and are in Montreal you should try them our:)
Please post more malt content. Malted barley is one of my favorite flavors -- it makes the best bagels, milkshakes, beers, candies, breads, cookies, dipping sauces (malt vinegar)... It is severely underappreciated.
if you can't find malt syrup anywhere near you I know a neat alternative that is basically the same thing though can also be tricky to find depending on where you live, but more choices is still better than less. the alternative is LME or Liquid Malt Extract, this is something commonly used is home beer making so a quick trip to a local beer supply shop will find you plenty. it's also sold generally in bulk by weight, they just pour it into a container of your choice of which I'd recommend you bring your own small container cause all those stores normally have are big buckets. hope this info helps someone :) edit: the reason I came by this if anyone is curious is that my family has a holiday tradition of making bagels and lox for holiday mornings, like christmas, and a few years ago when I experimented making bagels I kind of became the guy who brings the bagels as everyone liked my homemade WAY better than store bought, problem was is that buying the syrup online was kind of spendy and there were no stores near me that sold it. well, I was talking to one of my Dads brewing friends(Dad brews beer) at one of these events and showed him the container and he basically went "huh, isn't this just lme?" which led to me trying a batch using lme instead of the syrup and it came out exactly the same and costs less for me lol. that story aside, the video was great and spot on, though I use cornmeal instead of oil on the pan, but I can understand why someone wouldn't like this method lol. homemade bagels truly are the best!
it occurs to me that an inexpensive source for malted barley syrup would be your local home-brew shop. they call it extract instead of syrup. but it would certainly do the job and be far cheaper than Whole Foods
@@somefreshbread Ye abrasive would be something to rough up a surface, not to make the surface sticky although a large roughed up surface will have a higher coefficient of friction its not really the opposite of lubrication
I think abrasive implies it's used to wear things down. Some quick googling suggests maybe there's not a word for this sort of a substance? In car brakes, for example, it looks like they literally just call them "friction materials" so seems like there's not even an industry-specific word for it.
The healthfood crack takes me back to my childhood, getting fed a spoonful of Extract Of Malt every morning along with a capsule of Cod Liver Oil. Which was fine, until the family lunatic who thought this was a good idea found a brand that mixed the Cod Liver Oil into the Malt, thoroughly ruining both.
Oh gahhh, that reminds me of the time I opened a can of sardines, first time ever, and thought I'd make a sandwich. It was disgusting, so I put peanut butter on it to disguise it. Ruined peanut butter for months. Never have been able to eat another canned sardine, though fresh grilled is a treat.
I found that when I was rising doughnuts, individually greased squares of baking paper was much easier to work with and didn't deform. Pick the paper up and gently drop into the oil, or water
In barley syrop you have maltose and maltodextrins, in honey is glucose and fructose. First are Disaccharide and polysaccharide. Better for Maillard reactions and molecules are longer so crust is better ;)
How does this malted barley syrup compare with liquid malt extract (LME), the viscous stuff familiar to amateur home brewers everywhere? Due to a bit of a misunderstanding with my home brew club I have several gallons of amber LME in my freezer and I never thought to use it in bread and bagel making like this.
They're the same thing. The home brew stuff is exactly what I use for my bagels and they're fantastic. Somewhere on the label or online for your particular product it likely says its made from malted barley.
Liquid malt extract can be from non barley sources and it will specify if it is but otherwise they are the same thing. Liquid malt extract is just the nerdier more precise form of malt syrups
I always wondered why my macaroni sometimes boils over - starch increasing the surface tension of the water allowing larger bubbles, huh? Nice to know there's a scientific reason for my incompetence at cooking.
I tend to find that those little surface blisters on baked goods tend to coincide with a cold overnight fermentation in the fridge. It's been hypothesized that since the dough has water, and the fridge makes that water cold, more gases are able to dissolve into the dough itself. This could be gas from the air, or likely some of the carbon dioxide produced by the yeast. Then when the dough heats up in the oven (and the water bath in this case), the water in the dough gets too hot to hold as much gas as it's got, so the gas comes back out of solution, turning into little surface bubbles.
Love everything bagel breakfast sandwiches. But my favorite is Lox and Bagels. Cream cheese topped with smoked salmon, raw red onions, and some capers. Sooo gooood!
Not malt "syrup" but maltose can be found in Chinese mom-and-pogrocery stores. It is sold in a hard, concentrated form with texture like honey but 100 times thicker. You can get it onto a pair of skewers and sandwich it between two saltines. If you want fancy, there's dragon's beard candy. It takes a block of less hydrated, almost solid piece of maltose coated in Glutinous rice flour and pull it like ramen until the strands resembles cotton candy, then wrap peanuts and white sugar in it. It's a collective childhood food that isn't available at many places because it cannot be stored.
Hey Adam, I'm curious. I love making pizza using your other recipes, but the kneading process is extremely long and hard for me. Would this Autolyze thing be useful in pizza bread as well?
Yes! It can be used with pretty much any flour recipe. In fact, it should work even better with the pizza dough because it's higher hydration. And for kneading after the autolyze, I would look into techniques like stretch n fold. It takes more time but gets a similar result with almost no physical labor required
If you want NY Bagels without having to make them yourself- Rockland Bakery ships nation-wide :). They also have Bialies and Black and White Cookies etc other things that are hard to find outside of the NY Metro area.
I honestly believed all these years that, Bagel is bread deep fried in oil Donut is baked, Not only am I wrong, and exactly opposite, They deepfry the fricking bagel in water!!!!
Um... if you put malted barley syrup in water, you get a low pH solution, though, so you kinda need to add an alkali salt to raise the pH above 7.0 (the syrup itself has a pH at about 5.5, give or take).
Fun fact: malt is comparatively rich in proteins! This is likely the explanation to your question about the crust, because the malted barley syrup has more peptide compounds (about 3% protein content) that can then react with the carbohydrates in it (most of it being maltose, but there's about 30% of more complex carbohydrates) - i.e. Maillard reactions.
interesting, is your complaint that bread in the south does or does not have that crust? i live kinda in the middle (northern ky) so idk what differences exist or where
"I don't like being watched"
I have bad news for you, Adam.
Yeah just take a look at the new Amazon products that recently came out! Flying cameras and moving robots with cameras
@@sigfreed11 also the fact that he’s a youtuber with thousands of views on average
@@SeanEncarnado I think with the number of videos he has and the number of viewers it is entirely possible he is never *not* being watched.
@@SeanEncarnado r/woosh
this is the best comment on youtube imho
Chemist here: the reason you get a better crust using malt syrup instead of honey is that you are using a reducing sugar which acts as a mild base doing some of the work you did not employ the Baking soda to do. Additionally reducing sugars behave differently in the maillard reactions generally giving better color at lower temperatures
That’s so cool thank you for sharing :D
Yes, but how do you stop widow mine marine drop harass?
Honey is also more acidic, possibly giving a slight opposite effect (though I’m not sure how significant that is in the amounts added here)
Love me some Maillard reactions. Thank you for that explanation. Made Adam’s pot roast last night, lid off for last hour of the cook.
Does this imply there's no difference between honey + baking soda and malt syrup besides the malty flavor?
This is a malt and malt appreciation channel now
Hank Ragusea, now selling malt and malt accesories.
We’re Malt people now, living off the amino acids and fat of the Malt.
Next up: brewing beer with 80% malt
How about malt and toes
This is now the take someone else's recipe and make a video without crediting them + Malt channel.
"this looks like something"
A rounded croissant?
"A space ship!"
That was a little out of left field but okay 🤣
it was the pacman at the end ;)
@@jarrodfrankum it wasn’t
oh its well out of field its on the moon! xD
amogus
@Piit Emi🌹 EXCUSE ME??
'Rock back and forth like you're having a panic attack'
Oh wow i might actually be able to make these.
"How to utilize social anxiety for baking bagles" a memoir xD
@@jamescanjuggle Hmm... maybe we can monetize this in some way.
Adam: 'I have a simpler recipe using honey'
Me: *waits impatiently for the "which is the sponsor of this video"*
Only the real ones are gonna get this
Whom I’m now briefly thank
Whenever Adam makes something informative about a certain ingredient. Expect his next video to use that ingredient.
“What does Cocain taste like?”
Exception: Gumbo
@@Apersonl0l Lmfao
@@istealeggs mmmmmm yumm toothpaste cookies 🤤🤤
Adam is gonna make something with toothpaste⁉️
Hi, bagel baker here! Where I work we use honey because it gives a shiny brown look when fully baked and it also allows your toppings to stick better. Another thing, just a couple of tips, I'm was trained to do Montréal style bagels, so here's my advice:
1. When you roll, make sure the "rope" of dough you make is the same thickness all throughout. DO NOT USE YOUR FINGERS, ONLY PALMS. Wrap them around your hand with the closing ends in your palm and roll TWO TIMES. Otherwise you'll end up in the situation you were in where one side is too thick and the other is too thin. It's also why one of yours broke after taking it out of the water.
2. When you boil them, they should have the texture of a boiled perogie. Make sure to flip them once the top is brown.
3. You don't have to have to let them puff up. You can start rolling them as soon as they're done mixing. It's easier if the dough is hard.
If you have any questions for me or anyone else in the comments, feel free to ask.
It reminds me of how Koreans also use ssal-jocheong for sweetener as it gives a shiny brown look, and reminds me of invert sugar as well which you can make quite a deep color, also used to give a brown appearance. How do you think a honey/malt bagel recipe could be adapted for a thicker syrup like maltose? (If you search it the images give you a good idea of its viscosity)
I have question: Who asked?
@@foofu6685 Literally adam when he was doing the research for this recipe. He's openly talked about how he often searches forums and other websites catered specifically to professionals to get some tips from them.
I would I roll it 1 1/4 times. Just let the ends overlap. Not the whole rope around your hand twice. That doesn’t make sense and it’s too much
Letting the ends overlap about an inch is perfect - I made this recipe today :-)
You’re absolutely right. Having a thin end like that isn’t good for even cooking and it’ll break fishing it out of the water.
I have a Montreal style bagel recipe I will try next time :-)
As a trained baker in that style, if you have a recipe and any tips , I’d appreciate it :-)
Thanks 😊
What is the texture of a boiled perogie like? Very soft or tough?
2:13 The opposite of a lubricant is a "frictionizer"
But it's a very esoteric term, it's not used very much since with many things you want to try and reduce friction. But, frictionizers are used in paper and textile manufacturing, and on floor coatings to reduce slippage. I'm also assuming such substances are used in manufacturing tyres and shoe soles etc. but are called a different name.
My mind went to desiccant first but that's definitely a more appropriate term. Cheers!
I honestly love how we can watch Adam go down a research trail with his videos. The last 3 videos have been about malted barley and before that, it was all about grain. He has huge Alton Brown vibes, I would watch Good Eats as a kid, learning about food makes it so much more fun to cook.
9/10
Docking points for not literally putting the entire universe into the bagel.
Isn't the universe thought to be bagel shaped?
Don't let this distract you from the fact that I get bullied because my classmates think my videos are the worst. Please don't agree, dear ari
kugrash moment
@@AxxLAfriku You worry me boy
@Piit Emi🌹 shut mouth
I love when the Monday and Thursday videos are on the same theme, plus it's a pretty cool recipe
It feels like I'm taking a course. Monday vid is the lecture, Thursday vid is the tutorial.
Okay, that ad transition was actually really funny.
@Piit Emi🌹 ur in the wrong video
"Rock your body back and forth like you're having a panic attack"
Me: "A Chance for Faramir, Captain of Gondor, to Show his Quality"
funniest comment here
Is Gondor an actual thing? I was thinking of The Modern Rogue.
@@mpk6664 its a lord of the rings quote
truly under-appreciated comment
@2:43 "rock my body back and forth like I'm having a panic attack or something" Adam really knows his audience.
Just realized that heterogeneity is actually one of the really nice defining characteristics of so much hand / home made food and that the homogeneity of most mass produced food is just one of the reasons it’s so much blander.
8:31
Adam: that shape reminds me of something
Me: oo maybe he's foreshadowing a croissant video coming up
Adam 10 seconds later: a l i e n s h i p
GET IT OUT OF MY HEAD
@@everynameimakeiscringe2610 AMOGUS
AMOGUS
AMOGUS
I work at a Wholefoods and we have been getting asked a bunch of times if we have that malt syrup now (my particular store doesn't but I might add it to our shelves if we keep getting asked). Adam your power is growing wield it responsibly!
Did you order it
“I made an effort to get a little syrup in the belly button”
Adam woke up naughty today.
Malt is the new white wine, oh how times have changed….
White wine bagels are the too obvious YTP.
The king has been dethroned
Watch out for malt infused white wine.
@@redbirdsrising ... beer?
I miss the white wine
I work in a New York style bagel shop. We make the starter for like 3 or 4 days and we malt the bagels ever day and bake them fresh every day
Hearing you mention the engineers ship from the alien movies brought me so much unexpected joy that I decided to write this comment. Thank you adam!!
8:46
2:15 the opposite of being a lubricant is being a discord mod Adam
I disagree, have you seen how slippery and oily those guys are?
I'll be that guy. The opposite should be an abrasive.
@@ericksencionrestituyo1802 the more you know
I can’t believe how long it took me to figure out that the three pictures Ragusea shows at the end of each video is a “vinegar leg on the right” reference.
It took FOREVER for me to find out what on earth those symbols were for. Then I stumbled across the chicken video and it all became clear
Don't let him forget, vinegar leg is on the right!
It took watching a YTP for me to notice this.
Bums me out that a whole new generation of Ragusates won't be able to get the shirt.
Goddammit! THAT's what it is! I always thought it was a bottle of olive oil, so didn't make the connection.
NY style bagels typically have a higher gluten content than bread flour can provide. Some recipes recommend adding vital wheat gluten to get the protein levels up and add chewiness.
Speaking of them, you should consider looking at doing a pretzel recipe! Most home recipes use baking soda as you said, but traditional German pretzels are boiled in a LYE solution for even higher pH. They are unreal.
A lye solution and a baking soda solution could both end up with the same ph, depending on how much each one was diluted. (I mean could have a dilute lye bath that was the same PH as a very saturated baking soda bath)
@@rdizzy1 not exactly, baking soda HCO3^- can function as both a weak base and a weak acid.
If the pH low (=acidic) it likes to take up H^+ ions (either free in solution, or rip them from water H2O which leaves an OH^- ion in solution) to become H2CO3 (which converts into water and CO2) and thereby make things less acidic/more basic/alkaline.
But in high pH (=basic/alkaline) solutions, it likes to donate H^+ ions (which either stay free in solution or combine with OH^- groups to form water, or be used by some other molecule that likes to take them up) to become CO3^(2-) making the solution more acidic/less basic/alkaline.
In the middle, it happens both at the same time, which can act as as a buffer at pH of around 8-9 where these reactions are in equilibrium, and if added enough, even adding a more basic/alkaline or more acidic component can get cancelled out by the excess baking powder. As such, you won't be able to get a pH higher than that from baking soda.
Lye on the other hand is a strong base, and although weak solutions of it can also reach that pH of 8-9 (so in that sense, you're correct that they could end up with the same pH), you can also use it to create a more basic/alkaline solution (which baking soda never can, so in that sense your comment is wrong/incomplete).
The concentrations of lye used for pretzels are often much more basic/alkaline than can be achieved with baking soda.
That said, using lye requires much more safety precautions, and may be difficult to get in the first place, and using baking soda can still give a decent effect if you wish to make your own pretzels without needing all the safety precautions that come with using lye.
I wonder what can be done with Chinese lye water and pretzels.
@@nienke7713I read in a couple of articles that if you put the baking soda on a baking tray and BAKE it (I forget time and temp), it will make the baking soda more like lye than when not baking it would.
I can see why bagel places want to avoid using lye, probably for safety reasons. I wonder about the pretzel places.
@@gerriebell2128 yes, you can turn baking soda into washing soda by baking it. It will take the pH up to around 10-11 (whereas baking soda won't get you higher than 8-9), but it's nothing compared to the pH of around 13-14 that a 3%-4% lye solution used in pretzel making can reach.
Bagels don't typically use an alkaline solution at all, that's really a pretzel thing (and is what gives you that typical brown pretzel crust).
I haven’t made bagels (although now I might) but I’ve had success using parchment paper to proof Stella Parks’s dinner rolls, which are boiled before baking too. The trick is to cut the parchment so each roll (or bagel) is on a separate piece - then you can use it to lift the roll into the boiling water, and the paper separates easily once it gets wet and the roll firms up a bit. There’s definitely less waste using the oil method, though (especially since a little oil is helpful anyways to get the parchment to stick for the baking step). It’s also probably less important for a low hydration dough like this, since it can take a little manhandling during the boiling process.
You really got *a hole in one* with this bagel tip!
Why I can *barley* wait to try it!
blocked
@@MetaBloxer 😢
@@MetaBloxer what, did that pun really give you a *migraine?*
Andddd that's one more on the NKVD watchlist
Xixixi
I always like how you manage to reduce what other cooks might portray as a very laborious and challenging process into something that looks very approachable. I was always a little scared to get into bread making, it just seemed like it was a whole other world that I wasn't sure I belonged in. Theirs yeast, blooming, different types of flour, kneading techniques, rising, ect. It was a bit daunting looking from the outside in.
Well I've been making my own pizza dough for a while because of you and yeah now after seeing this it looks like I'll end up making bagels sometime in the next few weeks.
You are absolutely not wrong about bread making but I would look at it from a different angle.
You can do almost everything wrong and still end up with an amazing end product that you will enjoy a lot. If you stick with it you will gradually improve and you will probably always have something to improve on. It's your own personal journey.
Pizza Dough is also a great place to start.
How'd they turn out??
@@Just_Sara Every time I make a dozen, I end up eating half of them straight out of the oven. Their so good I can't resist.
Some commercial bakers boil the bagels in a lye solution to get the surface browned. I learned that if you bake baking soda in the oven and drive the moisture out it turns into a different chemical that has a ph much higher than baking soda alone but not as strong as lye. Perfectly browned bagel. Can't wait to do it with the addition of malt syrup. Thank you!
I heard it turns sodium bicarbonate into just sodium carbonate. I've tried it, and the powder actually gets smaller and lighter when you bake it, and the stuff is wicked basic so far as cooking goes. I use it in ramen noodles a la Alex French Guy Cooking, works great
My father was a NY bagel baker 60 years ago. You are absolutely correct with malt in the bagel. He used cake yeast, but I know that's not easy for the home. He never used oil to prevent sticking, he always used corn meal. The "snake method" is absolutely correct too. I don't remember malt in the " kettle" but maybe. Nice work.
Diastic malt powder..is generally used
Or this Barley malt sryup
Ones the dried powdered version of the other basically
King Arthur sells it now in one pound bags put in glass jars stored in cool dark cabinets lasts 4 ever
Cornflour that's finer or Semolina to dust parchment for baking at home
Your dad proofed and used giant wooden smooth with age patina Ed
Boards to load unload into vast wide ovens sticking wasn't much of a problem due to ovens use n older aged equipment
The malt powder is also sold in beer making supply shops though due to the dam internet there all online now.
@@samthunders3611 It's a long time ago, but I remember the malt being a thick liquid like molasses, in big metal drums.
I worked baking bagels on Long Island back in High School. The water color is from the corn meal used to keep the bagels from sticking to the baker rack trays.
Adam is obsessed with malt at the moment, and I’m loving it!
Made these today.
I prefer to roll around the hand about 1 1/4 times. Just overlapping the ends so they are thick like the rest of the bagel. - about an inch of overlap. This makes for an even bagel all around which I prefer so it doesn’t break fishing it out of the water and it’s even
This recipe is pretty good. Adding extra flour and kneading and adding more and kneading is key for a big fluffy NY style bagel. Takes about 20 minutes by hand.
Also , stick with the malted barley if you want that NY style bagel taste you’re used to.
If you want to make with honey, I would look up a Montreal style bagel recipe because they use honey - and they are much thinner and crispier. - so something different to try :-). I am on the lookout for one and I’ll post it here in the comments when I try one
I love both Montreal and NY style - Depends on my mood.
Lately I prefer the thinner crispy sweet Montreal style, but growing up in NY, I love the soft chewy dough and the barley malt taste so this will satisfy that craving when I’m homesick.
I definitely recommend letting the dough cold ferment before shaping into bagels, taste the same but way easier to make room for
Good idea, I'm trying that mod tonight.
YYYYAAAAUYYYYYYYYY!!!! I’m getting a new oven this month and I live in Korea now and bagels here are obviously not … like home in Queens. I’ve saved a few recipes but this could NOT have come at a better time, Adam.
I walk over to my laptop with a bagel in hand only to discover Adam Ragusea has just released a video about bagels. Perfect timing.
Nice haha
Literally laughed out loud (loudly) at the pac man bit at the end 😆
I love how much of a dork you can be sometimes Adam, please, never stop being you.
rude
So there are a few different opposites to lubricant. In the context of using flour to dry out the outside of the dough to keep it workable, I believe the opposite there would be desiccant. The flour is acting as a desiccant.
Malted syrup is available in virtually all supermarkets in Northern Europe, and probably also in neighbouring countries like Germany or Poland (where the bagel originated).
It's sold as "bread syrup" here.
I was the baker at a bagel chain for a time.. I loved that job...I was so surprised to learn how to make pretzel bagels... Really just baking soda + water dunk, and sprinkle generously with salt.
You can dip your bagels in the seasoning, with the most recently boiled side down (into seasoning), and as long as it's still pretty damp\tacky, it'll stick fairly well. No need for egg wash, unless you like that sort of thing.
"I don't like being watched" - Adam says, as I watch him.
But we watch him cook using his hands so it's fine
I have a proposal for you: We typically see "Cake flour" (7-9% gluten), "All-purpose flour" (8-11% gluten) and "Bread flour" / "Strong flour" (12-14% gluten). But! Now that I've bought a five pound bag of vital wheat gluten, I can just buy AP flour and add a little of that to make bread flour. So I got to thinking... Why not go higher? What does a 16% gluten bread look like? How about 20%? 25%? Is this the easy kitchen hack that renders all sorts of tough doughs easier to develop? No-knead sourdoughs became famous for using time to create gluten development, so can I make a bagel out of extra-high gluten dough and develop it in the refrigerator without all the effort associated with using kneading bread flour or AP flour into bagels?
This is two years old but... I have made insanely high protein breads (for the gainz) and my main takeaway is that they work for making breads of all kinds (pizza, ciabatta, sourdough boules in my experience) but that they taste kind of weird. I hate the fishy taste you get from the extra gluten. I would never sacrifice the good taste of bread for the beneficial structural properties of more protein. But YMMV.
Malted Barley syrup is actually a common grocery store item in Norway, sold as "malt extract", it's good for babies' digestion if they're having a tough time digesting something.
You might even want to get wheat gluten to add to this dough if you think your flower does not have enough gluten. Furthermore, the autolyse also certainly hydrates the flour better/easier than you would without it.
I also suggest using sturdy/longer chopsticks as a way to grab and flip the boiling bagels.
Thank you!! I’m going to try this. We live in Florida now and we can’t get a decent bagel to save our lives. I miss the chewy NY style bagel 🥯💜
Adam is truly the king of ad segues
In Portland, Oregon we have a local chain called Henry Higgin's Boiled Bagels, and they are made boiled, like yours are. This video inspired me to crawl out of bed and go buy some.
i think boiling them is the traditional way to do it. the kind sold at grocery stores are usually not, though
Traditional bagels are always boiled.
Good crust usually means maillard reaction, which require reducing* sugar and amino acid in a quite high temp, low moisture.
Reducing sugar (glucose, galactose, maltose, lactose"milksugar", and more) and non-reducing sugar (sucrose maple syrup beetroot canesugar, and fructose* honey, fruit syrup, corn syrup, and some sugar alternative).
This is from memory so might not 100% accurate.
If you want good crust use: reducing sugar source Milk powder, maltose, caramel. And amino acid source, egg, bean and nuts.
Caramel? is this true? because if it is, that's way easier for some of us to source (make ourselves!) than malted barley syrup.
Thanks Adam! It's impossible to find bagels down here in south america. I used your last bagel recipe to make my own and it tastes delicious. I still have 3 or 4 on the fridge and every morning I get one to make myself an egg sandwich.
Now I have to find malt extract to make my bagels even more new yorkers
If you use honey it'll be a very similar result, in Montreal they don't use malt extract
@@mtldaxthank you, I’ll give it a try
I really liked how pretty the light hitting your counter looked at 5:00. Very nice shot!
These bagels seem a lot more Montreal style bagels (another city with a significant Jewish population and strong bagel tradition). Montreal bagels are less bread and with larger holes than new york bagels, and use a method like this one to form the holes. If you haven't had them and are in Montreal you should try them our:)
Love the appreciation for the Engineers from the Alien universe! More of sci-fi enthusiast Adam is always welcome :)
Malt syrup is already partially cooked, helps with the mallard reaction. Also, the main component is maltose, not glucose
I love New York style bagels. Especially fresh everything bagels. Get some lox and scallion cream cheese on it. Delicious 🤤
Hey Adam! Can you do a video on making making on waffles? 🧇
on making making on
these are like a happy middle between montréal style and new york style, nice
Gotta admit, that's one of the slicker and more clever ad segues I've seen so far on RUclips
Please post more malt content. Malted barley is one of my favorite flavors -- it makes the best bagels, milkshakes, beers, candies, breads, cookies, dipping sauces (malt vinegar)... It is severely underappreciated.
I agree!
if you can't find malt syrup anywhere near you I know a neat alternative that is basically the same thing though can also be tricky to find depending on where you live, but more choices is still better than less. the alternative is LME or Liquid Malt Extract, this is something commonly used is home beer making so a quick trip to a local beer supply shop will find you plenty. it's also sold generally in bulk by weight, they just pour it into a container of your choice of which I'd recommend you bring your own small container cause all those stores normally have are big buckets. hope this info helps someone :)
edit: the reason I came by this if anyone is curious is that my family has a holiday tradition of making bagels and lox for holiday mornings, like christmas, and a few years ago when I experimented making bagels I kind of became the guy who brings the bagels as everyone liked my homemade WAY better than store bought, problem was is that buying the syrup online was kind of spendy and there were no stores near me that sold it. well, I was talking to one of my Dads brewing friends(Dad brews beer) at one of these events and showed him the container and he basically went "huh, isn't this just lme?" which led to me trying a batch using lme instead of the syrup and it came out exactly the same and costs less for me lol.
that story aside, the video was great and spot on, though I use cornmeal instead of oil on the pan, but I can understand why someone wouldn't like this method lol. homemade bagels truly are the best!
it occurs to me that an inexpensive source for malted barley syrup would be your local home-brew shop. they call it extract instead of syrup. but it would certainly do the job and be far cheaper than Whole Foods
The term Adam was looking for as the opposite of a lubricant, is an abrasive
Edit: “Frictionizer” is a term I did not previously know existed
"Frictionizer" is actually a real term, if not a real word. Abrasives are for polishing/grinding.
@@somefreshbread Ye abrasive would be something to rough up a surface, not to make the surface sticky although a large roughed up surface will have a higher coefficient of friction its not really the opposite of lubrication
Hey thank you both! That’s cool :)!
2:16 i think that would be an abrasive, something that creates more friction
I think abrasive implies it's used to wear things down. Some quick googling suggests maybe there's not a word for this sort of a substance? In car brakes, for example, it looks like they literally just call them "friction materials" so seems like there's not even an industry-specific word for it.
I don't even like bagels, but I still clicked because a malt bagel sounds insanely good and frankly Adam is the man
The healthfood crack takes me back to my childhood, getting fed a spoonful of Extract Of Malt every morning along with a capsule of Cod Liver Oil. Which was fine, until the family lunatic who thought this was a good idea found a brand that mixed the Cod Liver Oil into the Malt, thoroughly ruining both.
Oh gahhh, that reminds me of the time I opened a can of sardines, first time ever, and thought I'd make a sandwich. It was disgusting, so I put peanut butter on it to disguise it. Ruined peanut butter for months. Never have been able to eat another canned sardine, though fresh grilled is a treat.
I found that when I was rising doughnuts, individually greased squares of baking paper was much easier to work with and didn't deform. Pick the paper up and gently drop into the oil, or water
In barley syrop you have maltose and maltodextrins, in honey is glucose and fructose. First are Disaccharide and polysaccharide. Better for Maillard reactions and molecules are longer so crust is better ;)
How does this malted barley syrup compare with liquid malt extract (LME), the viscous stuff familiar to amateur home brewers everywhere? Due to a bit of a misunderstanding with my home brew club I have several gallons of amber LME in my freezer and I never thought to use it in bread and bagel making like this.
First thing would be that LME doesn’t have barley in it. It’s a strictly malt syrup.
They're the same thing. The home brew stuff is exactly what I use for my bagels and they're fantastic. Somewhere on the label or online for your particular product it likely says its made from malted barley.
I use LME for my bagels, no noticeable difference between it and barley malt syrup in the final bagel product that I can pinpoint
Liquid malt extract can be from non barley sources and it will specify if it is but otherwise they are the same thing. Liquid malt extract is just the nerdier more precise form of malt syrups
I always wondered why my macaroni sometimes boils over - starch increasing the surface tension of the water allowing larger bubbles, huh? Nice to know there's a scientific reason for my incompetence at cooking.
Just take the lid off your pot.
I tend to find that those little surface blisters on baked goods tend to coincide with a cold overnight fermentation in the fridge. It's been hypothesized that since the dough has water, and the fridge makes that water cold, more gases are able to dissolve into the dough itself. This could be gas from the air, or likely some of the carbon dioxide produced by the yeast. Then when the dough heats up in the oven (and the water bath in this case), the water in the dough gets too hot to hold as much gas as it's got, so the gas comes back out of solution, turning into little surface bubbles.
"This shape reminds me of something, hmm...."
Ah, he must be hinting at a future croissant video!
"alien spaceship"
ah yes, of course
Love everything bagel breakfast sandwiches. But my favorite is Lox and Bagels. Cream cheese topped with smoked salmon, raw red onions, and some capers. Sooo gooood!
Earlygang where we at.
Malted everything rocks. We even have malted barley candies.
Not malt "syrup" but maltose can be found in Chinese mom-and-pogrocery stores. It is sold in a hard, concentrated form with texture like honey but 100 times thicker. You can get it onto a pair of skewers and sandwich it between two saltines.
If you want fancy, there's dragon's beard candy. It takes a block of less hydrated, almost solid piece of maltose coated in Glutinous rice flour and pull it like ramen until the strands resembles cotton candy, then wrap peanuts and white sugar in it. It's a collective childhood food that isn't available at many places because it cannot be stored.
You can also get malt syrup and powder at home brewing supply stores.
I wonder how this dough would taste for pizza. Could you make a video about that?
I think it would be great. Hint of sweet and nuttier bread would be great with cheese,like those some seasoned bread in subways
You could maybe make a pizza with it and then you'd know for real.
Try it and let us know please 😆 I would, but I can’t have gluten. Lol
would be a very tough pizza dough if made as stiff as it needs to be for bagels
Wouldn't be a good dough for pizza. Would be hard to stretch and dense/hard after cooking
Time to appreciate the malt boys
2:16
I think you're looking for the term "desiccant."
Making fresh bagels and then immediatetly freezing them? That's madness! Fresh bagels are the best.
8:34
me: forshadowing for a croissant episode
8:49
me:*visible dissapointment
'rock your body back and forth like you're having a panic attack...' finally, my time to shine, all these years of training - I can do this! 👍
Hey Adam, I'm curious. I love making pizza using your other recipes, but the kneading process is extremely long and hard for me. Would this Autolyze thing be useful in pizza bread as well?
Yes! It can be used with pretty much any flour recipe. In fact, it should work even better with the pizza dough because it's higher hydration.
And for kneading after the autolyze, I would look into techniques like stretch n fold. It takes more time but gets a similar result with almost no physical labor required
its important u dont really let them steam off after boil, and get them right into oven, more blisters the wetter the surface
Adam you should try using your sourdough starter for bagel leavening. Idk if you’ve already tried it but it changed my life
We're back with the introduction video then recipe video, nice to see malt the malding grain being the recipe here.
Best "Ifo Food RUclipsr" yeah, because of Ragusea I think this will be a thing. Cheers to doing your thing!
Those silly hand movements Adam was making during that surfshark ad breathe life into my soul
What kind of bagel can fly?
A plain bagel
You know, on sub-atomic level, we are all bagels!!!
That gives me the panic attack I need to knead my bagel dough!
In the UK we put jam on our bagels
If you want NY Bagels without having to make them yourself- Rockland Bakery ships nation-wide :). They also have Bialies and Black and White Cookies etc other things that are hard to find outside of the NY Metro area.
Adam with a top tier Prometheus reference. Love it.
I honestly believed all these years that,
Bagel is bread deep fried in oil
Donut is baked,
Not only am I wrong, and exactly opposite,
They deepfry the fricking bagel in water!!!!
8:31
Adam: "That shape reminds me of something"
Me: "The half moon logo from Bayonetta 3?"
Adam: A l I E N S
Um... if you put malted barley syrup in water, you get a low pH solution, though, so you kinda need to add an alkali salt to raise the pH above 7.0 (the syrup itself has a pH at about 5.5, give or take).
Fun fact: malt is comparatively rich in proteins! This is likely the explanation to your question about the crust, because the malted barley syrup has more peptide compounds (about 3% protein content) that can then react with the carbohydrates in it (most of it being maltose, but there's about 30% of more complex carbohydrates) - i.e. Maillard reactions.
no way i was literally gonna make bagels with malt syrup and then adam goes on a malt adventure and makes them himself. how lucky am i??
I feel your relocated-Yankee pain although not coming from NY my major beef is the crust on rolls and bread. So soft. So easy to chew.
interesting, is your complaint that bread in the south does or does not have that crust? i live kinda in the middle (northern ky) so idk what differences exist or where
@@user-ze7sj4qy6q A little of both. Chewy rolls or rolls/bread with good hard crusts are difficult to find, at least around here.
One of these days I’m going to make those
Legend has it that Adam is still feeding his kids endless egg sandwiches