I’m always looking for new techniques and ways to use IR but I gotta say that this video is THE most comprehensive explanation of IR processing. Well done buddy
I am just getting into infrared photography and this video was perfect to watch to learn about white balance. Thank you for taking the time to make this.
I never thought of WB in terms of creating separation, I was more concerned with getting the "correct" color. That's an interesting concept, thank you!
Absolutely wonderful! I have your new book, and purchased your LR color swap presets. I am very new, so I am playing around with all of it. This video really showed me the vast array of possibilities. Thank you for such a wonderful channel!
Going through several books and videos trying to get my feet wet in IR photography, I was still pretty intimidated. Finding this site and tutorials, my apprehension has almost disappeared and I was able to process some (older) IR photos and get amazing results - I even processed one through HDR afterwards. Something that took me easily half an hour previously I was now able to achieve within minutes. What a find! I also ordered the book.
Thanks! If this had been the first video on IR white balancing I ever saw, it would have saved me a lot of frustration.. It is enormously helpful to know that the goal here is to obtain a separation of colours that you find meaningful :-)
Thank you for making this video! Incredibly helpful how you listed so many options for picking white balance. Even choosing dirt as an option... I probably would have never thought of that! I'm looking forward to trying out more in IR
I never heard anyone say folage before. I always heard it pronounced fol-ee-age. Not a criticism, just interesting. Pronounce words how you want. Great tutorial, I really enjoy your channel!
If you are shooting in raw, the WB setting in-camera doesn't matter, since you will have full control when editing. If you are seeing a wash of red and would like a better preview in camera, you can set a custom WB in-camera. This makes you viewfinder easier to view and you still have full control over the WB when editing.
Great videos. Glad I stumbled upon them. I still like setting WB in camera, it’s just me. I have 665 and an 830nm camera. What wld u suggest for setting the WB on them? I was told by a conversion company to set the 665 to the scene and the 830 to white or grey? I look fwd to your opinion. Best. William
For 665nm, it's best to set WB on a completely color neutral subject, something white or gray, such as clouds or concrete. You could even get an 18% gray card. For 830nm, you can also use any white or gray subject, but you can also WB on any green/organic subject, such as grass, since organics will appear as white with an 800nm+ filter.
@@robshea Thanks Rob....Interesting videos. Glad that I came upon your feed......I am trying to remember how you placed the LR picker tool into continues action, instead of resetting it each time? William
@@WILLIAMPERRELLI in LR, use the W key to quickly toggle the WB picker on and off. Once I make a selection, if I want to try more, I will use the W key to quickly toggle the picker back on.
Assuming I have already created the custom camera profile, is the white balance used when shooting in RAW (w/ full spectrum Nikon d800, & 590, 665, 720, & 830 external filters) important? In other words, assuming that I don't shoot a concurrent JPG, is the LCD screen view the only thing that is affected by the in-camera w/b setting with the RAW image being white balanced in post-processsing (ACR or LR)?
You are correct. If you are shooting in raw, setting a white balance in camera changes the preview you see on your camera's screen, and will be the value selected will be the default value when you load the image in your raw editor. However, that selection doesn't permanently alter the raw file and can still be changed in editing. For JPG, it's critical to set a good WB in-camera, since the WB controls will be more limited in the editor.
Thanks! That particular image, of the Bixby Creek Bridge, used my Photoshop actions. You can view a video on that process and download the actions here: ruclips.net/video/k7ZoMCE6u0c/видео.html There is another process that you can use in Lightroom with LUTs, which avoids a trip to PS. You can view that video here: ruclips.net/video/jYk6Jr-0a_I/видео.html
I noticed on several of these images, that as you were moving the color picker around, the skies were pretty flat and a very light shade of gray. I will be converting a Fuji camera to 720nm but I do like a dramatic sky, just not necessarily as dramatic as an 830nm. What considerations would we be aware of to get a dramatic sky with a 720 conversion?
When shooting in raw, the images will be quite flat straight out of camera. This applies to all filters. You will want to add some contrast in processing. This could be done by adding contrast, clarity, dehaze, tone curve, or other depending on your editor. In Lightroom, I like to you the Select Sky mask and then apply generous amounts of dehaze. By applying the dehaze directly to the sky, I find that I can use higher values to punch up the drama on the sky without degrading the rest of the image. Check out this video for more details: ruclips.net/video/v1cx24-m6go/видео.html
Great, thank you, I'll check it out. I've been a serious hobby photographer for many years way back to the film days, but I'm a total newbie to Infrared photography (full spectrum conversion so I have more choices to choose from), I've just been been experimenting with that "Chanel mixer" technique, so I think between the two I'll get something I like aside from the nice black and white. I've really been liking the results with the 850nm filter, but now that I know about these other things I'll take another stab at the test shots I did with my 720nm filter, I was having way too much red to white balance it in RAW before. I'm seriously considering buying a ultraviolet filter next so I can do some different looking portraits and see what the bugs see. :)
You could. I've been shooting infrared with an ND filter and will have an upcoming video to discuss my observations. Kolari Vision has a series of ND filters designed specifically for infrared. Personally, I prefer to use lens filters that provide a specific optical purpose, I don't use them for lens protection.
Hi Rob - I have been trying to understand. Your video is amazing but when I choose the profile for Panasonic G9 (from your website) not a lot changes not as drastic as yours. I have tried many different points for white balance.
Which filter are you using? Do you have a neutral gray subject in your images, such as clouds or pavement? When you select a spot to WB on, does the resulting color temperature land between 2,000K and 50,000K? More details on this here: blog.robsheaphotography.com/2022/02/12/which-infrared-profile.html
@@robshea Hi Rob - Im using a Haida M10 IR720 drop in filter. It drops straight to 2000K it never seems to choose anything else when I do the eye dropped. Tried a few images an always the same result. (There where ones of the ocean and used the surf as my white point and clouds) I am not using Lightroom classic but am installing as I write this to see if that makes a difference. I really thank you for your reply. I am in full problem solving mode now. I am gong to try to a grey card next time and set an in camera white balance.
@@geoffanderson311 If the color balance is still 2000k, then you are not getting enough of a shift in the color balance. Try switching to the other profile. There should be no difference between LR and LRC.
@@robshea I tried both G9 Profiles but I have now installed LRc and it was almost immediate difference. I will do some more testing but getting some really good results just from that one switch.
hey there, I enjoy the video, its very usefull, but I just cant get white balance right with my IR 720nm filter. I make a profile for my camera for lightroom and still where ever I pick for white balance, i dont get white leaves or other color? Any ideo why? Thank you!
@@amajsen I've had a number of photographers complain about trying to get an effective white balance with this filter. They shared some of the images taken with this filter and I suspect that it allows too much visible light to pass to be effective with an unconverted camera. Instead, I would suggest a 720 nm IR filter from a reputable brand.
You can still change the white balance using the Temp and Tint sliders. However, in Adobe products, you might have have enough range to get a good white balance. You may need to use another editor to effectively set the WB, such as darktable, RawTherapee, or ON1.
It you are shooting raw (recommended), setting the white balance in camera does not limit your choices when editing, but it can make it easier to preview compositions. If you are shooting in JPEG, you should set a custom white balance on a neutral subject, such as clouds or pavement.
I mostly shoot with a 590nm filter. If you want more color, lean towards the lower numbered cut-off filter. You can always reduce the saturation in editing. If you want less color, more white, or desaturated foliage, lean towards 720nm.
Which IR filter are you using? This could make a big difference in the results. I suspect that you are not using a converted camera, but please confirm that. Since you are shooting in JPG, did you set a custom white balance for your lighting conditions? This is essential when shooting in JPG. Shooting in JPG with an unconverted camera can be tricky regardless. Which editor are you using?
I have an R72 filter. I took some pictures about a month ago. I downloaded the DNG converter and created my profile. Even after doing that, when I edit in Lightroom using the color picker I still don't get different color tones. I created a white balance shooting off grass in my d750. My pictures are either red or white but I never get the color separation. Even after I do the channel mixer swap in Photoshop I still can't get the separation I need. I'm perplexed.
Up until now, all of the profiles I have created have been for converted cameras. Based on your experience, I wanted to confirm the results with an unconverted camera. I just created a profile for my unconverted camera using an image shot with a 720nm filter and then applied it to that image in LR. I ended up with light green foliage and pink/brown sky after WB. Here is the image: www.robsheaphotography.com/Unlisted/n-xQk5qP/Samples/i-h4H2LnX/A Do you notice a dramatic change in the colors of the image once you applied the profile? If the image is still bright red after applying the profile and setting a WB, then it sounds like the profile didn't work. Ensure that you created the profile with a DNG image shot with the R72 filter on. Double check with this video for instructions on creating the profile: ruclips.net/video/mWAmW5fGFsA/видео.html You will have fewer colors to work with when using an R72 or 720nm filter. Most of the images in this video are from a camera converted with a 590nm internal filter and will not represent the experience of an unconverted camera with an external R72 filter.
@@robshea yes I see a change. And when I do the white balance I can get it to a bluish white. I'm just not getting the color separation everyone else is getting. I'm using a Hoya filter. I think it's in my editing. I'm not doing something right.
@@bobbyhill1156 I'm just using a Hoya filter. I've heard you get different results. Of course I have to use long exposure too. But I try to go in the middle of the day when it's sunny so my shutter speeds aren't too long.
I’m always looking for new techniques and ways to use IR but I gotta say that this video is THE most comprehensive explanation of IR processing. Well done buddy
Great video! Thanks for sharing, I was struggling with white balance and this really helped!
I am just getting into infrared photography and this video was perfect to watch to learn about white balance. Thank you for taking the time to make this.
I never thought of WB in terms of creating separation, I was more concerned with getting the "correct" color. That's an interesting concept, thank you!
Absolutely wonderful! I have your new book, and purchased your LR color swap presets. I am very new, so I am playing around with all of it. This video really showed me the vast array of possibilities. Thank you for such a wonderful channel!
Going through several books and videos trying to get my feet wet in IR photography, I was still pretty intimidated. Finding this site and tutorials, my apprehension has almost disappeared and I was able to process some (older) IR photos and get amazing results - I even processed one through HDR afterwards. Something that took me easily half an hour previously I was now able to achieve within minutes. What a find! I also ordered the book.
I'm so happy I could help! 😄
Thanks! If this had been the first video on IR white balancing I ever saw, it would have saved me a lot of frustration.. It is enormously helpful to know that the goal here is to obtain a separation of colours that you find meaningful :-)
Thank you for making this video! Incredibly helpful how you listed so many options for picking white balance. Even choosing dirt as an option... I probably would have never thought of that! I'm looking forward to trying out more in IR
Really an excellent talk and makes the topic so clear, many thanks.
Incredibly useful! Thank you.
That was a great video , very clear way to move forward I have outdated version LR and 720nm converted canon camera
Very clear explanation. Thank you for your content.
thank you, good tips and really beautiful photos.
I never heard anyone say folage before. I always heard it pronounced fol-ee-age. Not a criticism, just interesting. Pronounce words how you want. Great tutorial, I really enjoy your channel!
Think of it as a conservation of syllables. :)
Hi
Nice videos!
If using your method of the picker tool to set WB, what wld you hv the Canons WB set to initially, AWB?
Thanks
William
If you are shooting in raw, the WB setting in-camera doesn't matter, since you will have full control when editing. If you are seeing a wash of red and would like a better preview in camera, you can set a custom WB in-camera. This makes you viewfinder easier to view and you still have full control over the WB when editing.
Thanks for the great tip! :-)
thank you, great tips
Great videos. Glad I stumbled upon them. I still like setting WB in camera, it’s just me. I have 665 and an 830nm camera. What wld u suggest for setting the WB on them? I was told by a conversion company to set the 665 to the scene and the 830 to white or grey? I look fwd to your opinion. Best. William
For 665nm, it's best to set WB on a completely color neutral subject, something white or gray, such as clouds or concrete. You could even get an 18% gray card. For 830nm, you can also use any white or gray subject, but you can also WB on any green/organic subject, such as grass, since organics will appear as white with an 800nm+ filter.
@@robshea Thanks Rob....Interesting videos. Glad that I came upon your feed......I am trying to remember how you placed the LR picker tool into continues action, instead of resetting it each time?
William
@@WILLIAMPERRELLI in LR, use the W key to quickly toggle the WB picker on and off. Once I make a selection, if I want to try more, I will use the W key to quickly toggle the picker back on.
@@robshea Thank you
@@robshea Rob hi. If I am carrying my 665nm and not my 830 for b&w, is it better to use the b&w mode or convert later in post? Thanks. William
Assuming I have already created the custom camera profile, is the white balance used when shooting in RAW (w/ full spectrum Nikon d800, & 590, 665, 720, & 830 external filters) important? In other words, assuming that I don't shoot a concurrent JPG, is the LCD screen view the only thing that is affected by the in-camera w/b setting with the RAW image being white balanced in post-processsing (ACR or LR)?
You are correct. If you are shooting in raw, setting a white balance in camera changes the preview you see on your camera's screen, and will be the value selected will be the default value when you load the image in your raw editor. However, that selection doesn't permanently alter the raw file and can still be changed in editing. For JPG, it's critical to set a good WB in-camera, since the WB controls will be more limited in the editor.
Thanks.
How do you process that very last shot? With Red foliage and blue skies, that was gorgeous.
Thanks! That particular image, of the Bixby Creek Bridge, used my Photoshop actions. You can view a video on that process and download the actions here: ruclips.net/video/k7ZoMCE6u0c/видео.html There is another process that you can use in Lightroom with LUTs, which avoids a trip to PS. You can view that video here: ruclips.net/video/jYk6Jr-0a_I/видео.html
I noticed on several of these images, that as you were moving the color picker around, the skies were pretty flat and a very light shade of gray. I will be converting a Fuji camera to 720nm but I do like a dramatic sky, just not necessarily as dramatic as an 830nm. What considerations would we be aware of to get a dramatic sky with a 720 conversion?
When shooting in raw, the images will be quite flat straight out of camera. This applies to all filters. You will want to add some contrast in processing. This could be done by adding contrast, clarity, dehaze, tone curve, or other depending on your editor. In Lightroom, I like to you the Select Sky mask and then apply generous amounts of dehaze. By applying the dehaze directly to the sky, I find that I can use higher values to punch up the drama on the sky without degrading the rest of the image. Check out this video for more details: ruclips.net/video/v1cx24-m6go/видео.html
Is Lightroom/Photoshop capable of using the lasso/select tool to select and white balance different areas of the image to make them more creative ?
Absolutely, check out this video as an example: ruclips.net/video/lh4XFGlagoU/видео.html
Great, thank you, I'll check it out. I've been a serious hobby photographer for many years way back to the film days, but I'm a total newbie to Infrared photography (full spectrum conversion so I have more choices to choose from), I've just been been experimenting with that "Chanel mixer" technique, so I think between the two I'll get something I like aside from the nice black and white. I've really been liking the results with the 850nm filter, but now that I know about these other things I'll take another stab at the test shots I did with my 720nm filter, I was having way too much red to white balance it in RAW before.
I'm seriously considering buying a ultraviolet filter next so I can do some different looking portraits and see what the bugs see. :)
Can you use a neutral density filter to protect your lens on a infrared camera?
You could. I've been shooting infrared with an ND filter and will have an upcoming video to discuss my observations. Kolari Vision has a series of ND filters designed specifically for infrared. Personally, I prefer to use lens filters that provide a specific optical purpose, I don't use them for lens protection.
Hi Rob - I have been trying to understand. Your video is amazing but when I choose the profile for Panasonic G9 (from your website) not a lot changes not as drastic as yours. I have tried many different points for white balance.
Which filter are you using? Do you have a neutral gray subject in your images, such as clouds or pavement? When you select a spot to WB on, does the resulting color temperature land between 2,000K and 50,000K? More details on this here: blog.robsheaphotography.com/2022/02/12/which-infrared-profile.html
@@robshea Hi Rob - Im using a Haida M10 IR720 drop in filter. It drops straight to 2000K it never seems to choose anything else when I do the eye dropped. Tried a few images an always the same result. (There where ones of the ocean and used the surf as my white point and clouds) I am not using Lightroom classic but am installing as I write this to see if that makes a difference. I really thank you for your reply. I am in full problem solving mode now. I am gong to try to a grey card next time and set an in camera white balance.
@@geoffanderson311 If the color balance is still 2000k, then you are not getting enough of a shift in the color balance. Try switching to the other profile. There should be no difference between LR and LRC.
@@robshea I tried both G9 Profiles but I have now installed LRc and it was almost immediate difference. I will do some more testing but getting some really good results just from that one switch.
@@geoffanderson311 Excellent! I'm curious about what is different between the two but glad you are seeing good results now.
hey there, I enjoy the video, its very usefull, but I just cant get white balance right with my IR 720nm filter. I make a profile for my camera for lightroom and still where ever I pick for white balance, i dont get white leaves or other color? Any ideo why?
Thank you!
Is your camera converted or unconverted? Which brand of 720 mm filter are you using?
Hi, I use Nikon D750, with Urth 720nm filter
@@amajsen I've had a number of photographers complain about trying to get an effective white balance with this filter. They shared some of the images taken with this filter and I suspect that it allows too much visible light to pass to be effective with an unconverted camera. Instead, I would suggest a 720 nm IR filter from a reputable brand.
My infrared converted phone A52s doesn't support RAW. Can I still control white balance using PNG or JPEG photos?
You can still change the white balance using the Temp and Tint sliders. However, in Adobe products, you might have have enough range to get a good white balance. You may need to use another editor to effectively set the WB, such as darktable, RawTherapee, or ON1.
So what camera white balance should I use or does it not matter?
It you are shooting raw (recommended), setting the white balance in camera does not limit your choices when editing, but it can make it easier to preview compositions. If you are shooting in JPEG, you should set a custom white balance on a neutral subject, such as clouds or pavement.
@@robshea thanks
If you white BALANCE in camera should you then chose to use Custom White balance in post processing?
Most cameras cannot get to a good WB in-camera alone. You will need to WB in post processing.
What filter did you use for these photos? Can't decide between 720 and 665 for a pink foliage look
I mostly shoot with a 590nm filter. If you want more color, lean towards the lower numbered cut-off filter. You can always reduce the saturation in editing. If you want less color, more white, or desaturated foliage, lean towards 720nm.
I bought ir filter. But i cant seem to make trees white. I dunno how to edit. I only shot jpeg
Which IR filter are you using? This could make a big difference in the results. I suspect that you are not using a converted camera, but please confirm that. Since you are shooting in JPG, did you set a custom white balance for your lighting conditions? This is essential when shooting in JPG. Shooting in JPG with an unconverted camera can be tricky regardless. Which editor are you using?
Where is the link to setting the custom profile please?
Instructions for creating profiles: 590.red/dcp
Download existing profiles for popular cameras: 590.red/infrared-profile-pack
I have an R72 filter. I took some pictures about a month ago. I downloaded the DNG converter and created my profile. Even after doing that, when I edit in Lightroom using the color picker I still don't get different color tones. I created a white balance shooting off grass in my d750. My pictures are either red or white but I never get the color separation. Even after I do the channel mixer swap in Photoshop I still can't get the separation I need. I'm perplexed.
Up until now, all of the profiles I have created have been for converted cameras. Based on your experience, I wanted to confirm the results with an unconverted camera. I just created a profile for my unconverted camera using an image shot with a 720nm filter and then applied it to that image in LR. I ended up with light green foliage and pink/brown sky after WB. Here is the image: www.robsheaphotography.com/Unlisted/n-xQk5qP/Samples/i-h4H2LnX/A
Do you notice a dramatic change in the colors of the image once you applied the profile? If the image is still bright red after applying the profile and setting a WB, then it sounds like the profile didn't work. Ensure that you created the profile with a DNG image shot with the R72 filter on. Double check with this video for instructions on creating the profile: ruclips.net/video/mWAmW5fGFsA/видео.html
You will have fewer colors to work with when using an R72 or 720nm filter. Most of the images in this video are from a camera converted with a 590nm internal filter and will not represent the experience of an unconverted camera with an external R72 filter.
@@robshea yes I see a change. And when I do the white balance I can get it to a bluish white. I'm just not getting the color separation everyone else is getting. I'm using a Hoya filter. I think it's in my editing. I'm not doing something right.
That sounds right. The colors will be more subtle with a 720nm filter. You would need a different filter to capture more colors.
@@carlmcneill1139 But your camera is IR converted or you are just using the Hoya filter on a normal camera?
@@bobbyhill1156 I'm just using a Hoya filter. I've heard you get different results. Of course I have to use long exposure too. But I try to go in the middle of the day when it's sunny so my shutter speeds aren't too long.
why photographer dont do astrophotgraphy as example it sucks bro what to do at night its still hard to fix red cast while editing night sky
I think we get the point after the first photo Duh!