Uber CEO Slams Tesla-But Hints at a SURPRISING Deal
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- Опубликовано: 24 окт 2024
- In this video, we break down Khosrowshahi’s doubts about Tesla and Elon Musk's ability to pull off robotaxi plans on their own, raising issues like user acceptance and peak demand. Learn why he thinks a partnership between Uber and Tesla could be the key to overcoming these challenges and changing the game in autonomous vehicles.
Jeff Lutz is an ex Supply Chain C-Level Exec at several Fortune 100 companies like Google, Lenovo and Motorola. Currently running his own consulting firm.
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If Elon Musk can start up a successful car manufacturing company from scratch..he can sort out the finer points of a robotaxi business...I think that Tesla doesn't need Uber....
Jeff Lutz is an absolute wealth of highly intelligent opinions and evaluations 👍👍👍👍
Thanks guys
Forget the car. He can land rockets
How fortunate are we to have Jeff's invaluable insights !
Learning with LUTZ !
Uber needs Tesla more that Tesla needs Uber
I am a Tesla owner that can'T wait to put my car on the network. I purchased it in 2020 thinking it would help me pay for the car.. well it's paid for now but I'm not using my car nearly enough to justify the price of the car.
Just remember the same people telling you they'd have robotaxis in 2020 are also telling you it'll happen in 2024. Who knows maybe they'll be telling you that in 2028 or 2032 or 2036. Despite all the enthusiasm they didn't know the future then and they don't know it now.
@@verynice5574 I am perfectly aware now that this was hopium but I know it's coming!! Might not be this year, maybe not the next either but real soon. I see the improvements and having FSD on my car is clearly the best way to keep a close eye on it
@@verynice5574 eh?
Pretty sure that they have been saying 2026 for about a year or so now!
Of course I would send it my Model Y out. When my truck comes the Y will be the new daily driver !
@@verynice5574all your comments are essentially the same. Why are you even here???
Uber has no substantial value to offer to Tesla that they couldnt easily duplicate, quickly
As a software engineer in the machine learning space, I can confirm what Luts States here... Handling missing items in a dedicated robo taxi is going to be a trivial operation.
First of all, the robo taxi dedicated robo taxi vehicle should have cameras in the rear. In fact, it should have cameras near the ground plane and it should have cameras over head of the potential rear passengers and as well it should have a camera that can look into the footwell in the front seats... Assuming a four-seater?... Now we know from the leaked images that Tesla's robotaxi appears to be only a two-seater which is fine... As well, for any trunk space that might exist in the vehicle that should be a camera in each trunk.
As let's pointed out, rather intuitively and efficient means of determining if items are left over could be had by simply taking a snapshot of the vehicle pre-entrance of the customer followed by a snapshot of the vehicle post exit of the customer and then take a difference. As he said rare sufficient difference will alert the car to notify the passenger who is leaving the vehicle that they've left something and even go so far as to send them a message with a picture of the item that was left. Also, the vehicle can choose to loiter when such a signal is detected rather than take off.
It's from my perspective as an engineer. It's a fun little problem to solve and in fact it's something that competent Engineers should be able to build a solution for within an iteration (2 weeks).
Thanks - aligned 😊
GPT could implement the software in an afternoon with the complete specifications which comes from a human.
I plan on putting my 22 MY in the robotaxi fleet and buying a new Juniper for myself
Hardware 3 won’t cut it.
@@tedg1609 that’s not good news 🙁
Tesla doesn't need Uber.
Why would tesla need uber Keep the $$$$ in the investors pocket!
3:50- the current single cabin facing camera will not be enough to pinpoint lost items. Items often fall out of pockets or get left on rear seats. This is currently out of the field of view of the camera. Additional cameras needed- probably positioned somewhere near where a changer hook would traditionally go, one on each side facing diagonally downward, so all areas of the back seat can be seen. It is a solvable problem.
My 2021 M3 LR has lost so much value that putting into robotaxi service is the only way it can be justified.
Love the car but at 81, I barely use it, mainly for restocking food every 3 or 4 days.
Placing it in robotaxi service would be a huge financial plus.
I sense a glimmer of denial in the Uber CEOs words. I think they’re very worried.
Denial/wistful thinking
In SF many people are willing to pay Waymo slightly more to avoid Uber drivers.
The car reminds you to get all your belongings before it pulls over.
You can tell the car to pull over if you're sick. Just like Uber, if you throw up you'll be charged a cleaning fee.
You could also have a reminder before they leave to please check and make sure you’ve got everything that you came with.
Great idea.... Also with the level of technology Tesla possesses they could identify with internal cameras if someone has left something behind and notify the person via the Tesla/ robotaxi app.
So, what else can the boss of Uber say to the news that Tesla is about to eat his lunch? Oh, how many Uber shares did Darragh just sell??
Uber has no experience or staff to provide fleet management or Fleet Operator. The car rental companies like Avis, Hertz, Budget, Enterprise etc. have the staff and experience managing large fleets of vehicles (cleaning, washing, fueling, and parking vehicles). The Uber spokesperson said Uber was a software company. Software companies don’t do fleer management.
Tesla shouldn't partner with anyone who doesn't understand Tesla and acts like Tesla doesn't know how to do Robotaxis like the Uber CEO.
I think it would be great if one of the Tesla guys (like Brighter with Herbert) would post at the top right corner of every video, the current number of miles per critical intervention for Tesla FSD and a monthly chart. This is really all that matters regarding making Tesla robotaxis a reality.
Love Jeffs opinion
I work an abnormal schedule, and therefore have absolutely no problems letting my M Y go out for robotaxi work evenings in the back half of the week, nights, and for morning and evening commutes. If it’s paying for itself and making some $ all the while, I will probably buy a couple of used ones and put them on the network as well.
The car could be set up to keep itself weighed. So, if anyone forgets something the car could immediately inform the existing customer that they have left as something in the vehicle.
Inner camera recognizing a phone or a bag or a wallet would be amazing. He don’t leave your precious item.
Regarding Tesla building out their Robotaxi network, I think they have been doing that for quite some time by way of leased vehicles. The primary reason I did not lease my model Y was because there was no option to then purchase that vehicle off of my lease at the end of the three-year period. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it would make sense to me that Tesla is doing that specifically to build up that Robotaxi network so that once FSD has been properly solved, they will be ready to hit the ground running.
Edit: sorry, I jumped the gun a bit. Just after I made this post you addressed this very topic, and I completely agree. As soon as FSD is ready all of those leased vehicles, with relatively low mileage, will immediately be ready to go. Additionally, that likely explains why the cost to lease a Tesla vehicle recently decreased considerably as Elon probably knows that FSD is virtually solved already, and they want to get as many leased vehicles on the road as possible to maximize their effect on the robotaxi numbers.
Looking at the possibilities of Robotaxi, how many current car owners just buy a subscription to use robotax on demand. So instead of leaving my car 23 hours a day idle, I just decide not to buy one. Or if I have 2 vehicles, I cut down to 1.
Regarding his point that existing Tesla owners won't want strangers in their car... isn't that what Uber drivers deal with, except they have the additional personal safety risk of being in the car at the same time? Also, wouldn't that keep Airbnb hosts from wanting strangers in their house? Regarding his point about the complexity of dealing with lost items, etc... think about all of the new features that have been added to X in such a short amount of time after laying off 80% of the employees. Once autonomy is fully solved, Tesla will clearly be able to add all of the additional "bells and whistles" features needed and at much lower cost than what Uber spends on software.
Uber never acknowledged that Tesla excells at hardware and software
When Jeff Lutz talks, people listen
I think the delay to 10/10 was to change the front of the vehicle to add a temperature controlled walking delivery robot that can go to a restaurant (or store) to pickup food -etc, and deliver it!
Listen to Dara talk about “Uber’s” problems NOT Tesla ride share problems.
This interview is very telling
So many people project their problems onto a competitor. We can thank Dara for providing reasons for Tesla ride share will be successful.
In my use case, v12.5.1.3 had no notable improvements. Based on the last couple of updates, FSD seems stuck in the "march of nines" with a little training regression mixed in. I’m a big investor and was hoping for a bit more from v12.5.1.3. Hopefully we see more feature improvement e.g. smart summon, reversing, auto parking, etc. I guess seeing more features necessary for a functional RoboTaxi service. Fleet manger sounds like a good fit for Uber. Thanks for the video. Great production.
Sorry, I am struggling to understand what $UBER brings to the table in the roboTaxi market
I will give the CEO credit that they have great software, but is it really better than Tesla's?
The only thing that Uber has that RoboTaxi doesn't is a list of riding customers. When RoboTaxi offers rides at 50% of the price of $UBER, Tesla will get riders very quickly. Further, Tesla can seed the list of riders with the X app
Yes, there needs to be a fleet manager, but I just don't see that as an $UBER strength as their drivers look after the fleet
I could see Tesla partnering with delivery services like UPS and FedEx to help smooth out the demand by delivering packages directly from the warehouse to businesses or homes as long as there is someone at the location to unload the package to help with delivery efficiency of last mile deliveries.
People let "Complete Strangers" have sex in their beds. It's called Airbnb.
With robotaxi the star rating system gets turned on the passenger instead of the driver. Anyone who vandalizes or violates Tesla TOS gets a lower score and owners can choose to avoid any passenger lass than a certain score threshold, but this is not the argument… Uber realizes this is a joint Telsa or be put out of business by them, so Uber is presenting the expertise they feel they have acquired and cN partner with Tesla instead of being destroyed by them
It's already there for the passenger. Has been for years.
A bunch of Uber drivers will buy Teslas and put those into the FSD fleet and instead of driving those vehicle owners will spend their time cleaning their 10 Tesla's.
You also have people who want a little side gig who will buy seat covers and put their car into the pool of available cars when they don't need it.
A lot of owners won't but plenty would like to have their car earning money and paying for itself.
Of course, Tesla will have to continue to make progress and if they truly believe in their product they'll offer insurance.
What is Uber's accident rate?
I think Uber are screwed.
FSD can only be used on the Tesla network, it's in the purchase agreement.
Will Tesla make an exception and allow Uber to use FSD on their own network?
It would be a huge quick win for Tesla and a win win situation.
Open to other views and opinions.
When watching a *lot* of interviews, I get the impression that a lot of people can’t see the difference between predictions and wistful thinking. . .
9:16 I wonder if Tesla will utilize the old leased Model 3s that they took back with the intent to allocate those vehicles to areas with higher demand for the self driving fleet.
That would be really cool if they could spin that up before the purpose built vehicle hits the market.
Tell you what, we better get some concrete details and real guidance on 10/6, or the stock will take a serious draw down.
Uber is trying to play it cool, but is clearly panicking.
The peak and valley argument at 9:00 also applies to uber because those are private cars too. Worse actually as they owners of the cars are the drivers and cannot use the time doing something else other than drive the customers around
Tesla should NOT attempt to run a robo taxi or ride share business. Tesla should become the world wide supplier of autonomous vehicles, hardware and software. Do consulting and anything else that is directly involved with with that. The logistics, resources , insurance and legal issues required to support a multi million vehicle fleet would be staggering. Tesla does not need that.
As long as tesla gets paid for each mile driven with fsd enabled and gets a share of the revenue.
But l also want tesla to compete with airlines for between cities travel.
I bet customers would buy two Tesla's and have one of them a dedicated taxi and the revenue could possibly cover the lease loan costs for both vehicles or at least a good portion of.
BIG TELL: The smirks and nervous smiles killed any potential partnership.
Autonomous driving is clearly the disruption and future of Uber, if they survive. This ceo bet the future of the company that someone else would do autonomous and be willing to partner with them. The ceo seriously over estimates the value Uber can provide to an autonomous company in his big bet. The ceo will personally make lots of money from the profitability, of cutting costs in the advanced technology group, in the short run and if hes wrong on his future bet he will get a golden parachute and become a ceo of some other company. If the ceo kept the ATG his personal income would have been alot less due to less near term profitability and then he would have to wager his personal financial wealth that Uber would eventually be a forerunner in Autonomous and that he would then make a tone of money on his Uber stock. This ceo made a decision regarding what was best for him personally and Bill Gurley would be wise to have a corrective convrsation with him or just simply fire him
💯 Yep, he may have taken short-term gains at the expense of the company survival.
In SF and LA Waymo quite easily avoids using Uber. I'm not sure how far away Tesla is, but they don't need Uber - they need safety. Waymo is also expanding and gaining a real following.
Should Tesla sell/loan their old leased vehicles for Uber to use as supervised FSD?
It would only increase their QA/ Data collection.
If I can pimp out my Tesla for 20 hrs a month and that can cover my monthly payment I would do it.
A lot of people are working from home and can do this 3 times a week without having any inconvenience.
Grok integration with the Robotaxi would be very interesting.
People at work may decide to be a robotaxi while they delay their trip home to eat out if the robotaxi revenue matches or exceeds the cost of eating out.
What if some robotaxis have a teslabot in one seat so it can pick up a single rider and after the trip can then go to a restaurant and pick up food/etc for delivery? I’m sure the rider won’t mind chatting with a teslabot (free advertising) and the bot might even be his own salesperson!
One thing he didn't factor in. If rides are getting cheaper then people definitely will be going more places taking more rides.
Those decorations in the background make him look like Micky Mouse
Tesla does not need them or their software. Don't see that deal ever happening. In fact, Uber will be out of business once robotaxi is widespread.
Have several sets of seat covers and mats would be convenient and help keep the car pristine on the inside. Clean one set ehole using the other. There is room for lot such solutions.
JEFF💪❤
Good discussion. 😮
Retired people will have their Teslas available during peak hours since they avoid peak times to do their arrands!
If something left in car. Car could talk saying you left something behind.
Funny he should mention loosing items. My daughter left her cell phone in an Uber in LA. The driver quit & stole the phone. Uber did nothing lol
Huge difference, FSD cars don’t care about routing back to customer to return an item.
UBER drivers loose revenue.
DARA is DIZZY ! 😵💫
A company is not a singular person. To say "Uber" is good at software and not hardware is not a problem. You simply higher 20 people who are individually good at the thing and now Uber will be good at the thing. The thinking we' ve heard here is very concerning.
Everyone doubting Tesla's ability to execute is in for a rude awakening at some point. Tesla doesn't need Uber. Uber will be wiped out without FSD.
If I had the room to park and charge them, why wouldnt I just buy several of the lowest priced Teslas and let them make money for me? I'm sure the Tesla cameras could spot any items he custome left in the car and tell them before they got away. I have seen discussions where they are planning to monitor cleanliness and send the car home to be cleaned between cusomers if necessary. They also plan to sanitize the car between customers.
When a CEO convinces the board that autonomous is the future they spend 6 years and god knows how much money, and then says no it's not that important we don't need it.
😱 Run away fast this guy is just trying to save his job.
Take away the human wage, and the robotaxi will undercut any other service. And if they sit idle , at least there isn't a motor running to keep the driver warm. And for the guy who commutes, why pay for parking, when you let out the car to earn. You might even work flexible hours to max out your car earnings. If tesla-taxi has the option for riders to share a car, you could use the tesla network, to find a neighbor to carpool into your place of work when desired.
a lot of uber drivers want to go out and do stuff with friends at peak times too. if im going out at peak times i want to use a robotaxi that will cost me 10 bucks while my car is out making me 100 bucks. duh
22:29 toin coss?
This is classic innovators dilemma. Uber ceo is only looking at the past to judge the future. Clearly!
When you take the keys away from your 98 yr old grand parent will they be restricted from buying a FSD Tesla 🧐
Only way the robotaxi fantasy is going to work is to team up with Uber, they have all the missing pieces figured out.
In LA & SF Waymo doesn't use Uber. It has its own app that is possibly a little better but similar.
In SF they charge about the same or a little more and people love them - clean, safe and you can set the music and the temperature.
Bicyclists and pedestrians also like how polite and safe they are. They're not impatient -they're not playing on their phone.
I don't know if current Teslas can get to Waymo level. Maybe only their latest models or maybe their next model.
They appear to be improving, so I'm all for it IF it will reduce deaths and injuries
Obviously this CEO has conflict of interest but the biggest problem is the self driving it self every thing else will just fall in line
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Tesla is going to eat Ubers lunch. They must be absolutely terrified.
Uber sees A disruption coming and like any CEO he's trying to protect his business.
Good to know
I don't think anyone can compete with these hardworking immigrants who invest in an electric bike and deliver food in Manhattan and can park their bikes anywhere on the street and provide the customer service of bringing someone's doorbell and walking up the stairs to deliver their food.
How does it work if your Tesla becomes a business tax wise, licensing within cities & insurance? Tesla takes on the liability & insurance aspect of the business including creating & maintaining the app ride hail side of the business. Tax wise, those using their cars for a business will be taxed as a business proportionly & also get some of the benefits of being in business. I think it is win/win for consumers who want to make mre money.
Those who think people will not want strangers in their car are those who may not need the money. There are many more people who live within financial constrains who will see this as a way to make more money & their financial position will make their decsion for them. It seems like a way to increase household income & most people may look at that as an incentive to choose to join the Tesla network that already has all the business aspect & paperwork done for them. Look at how many people have joined networks to deliver food & products to people's door. Tesla will easily do the same at a cheaper cost without a driver & the car owner will get a greater piece of the pie. It's a no brainer IMO.
It's perspective. From Uber's point of view there is probably a battle.
If Uber doesn't partner with Tesla it will go down like the Hindenburg
Uber couldn't make self driving cars work when they tried so it no wonder why the organization is doubtful. This ceo sold half his stake in Uber so im guessing he acknowledges that Tesla has a 50% chance of completely racking their business. If a car can drive by itself and determine if the driver is paying attention then im not to concerned that the car can see if someone made a big mess or let something behind or deal with a door thats left partially open
That's a big stretch to assume that he sold his shares because of Tesla. Especially when you consider that tesla currently has zero of the robotaxis they've been promising for years.
@@verynice5574 Theres tones of FSD videos of hour long intervention free drives. Teslas current level of compute is known and the amount coming online in the next year is estimated. Tesla's pace of FSD improvement is super fast now and if extrapolated suggests it will be solved soon. Tesla has big FSD announcement and demonstration coming up soon. I agree that my assumption was an assumption but I dont see how it is a distance stretch? Share with me your perspective?
A competitor having doubts about Tesla, shocking.
Try getting in touch with Uber. Customer service is non existent.
Oh, and what about these unscrupulous Uber drivers that try to get riders to cancel rides under the guise of 'getting gas' or 'traffic congestion' and then keep a cancelation fee. And body odor and smokers and bad music. I could go on. And wanna blow chunks in a robo taxi? Fine. They've got your credit card. Thanks for the $500 detailing fee.
You make $2 because you have the expensive drivers on your side!
UBER will be good for poor weather needs for a time. They will have no choice but to fold into Teslas network at some point along with the others like Lyft. It’s remarkable that we are asking the dude running a simpler business model (UBER) to comment on a new more complex model… smh…
This guy is stating his own opinion. The fact is if the car is making money i would take public transport home. Simple. He is talking nonsense. Maybe i can own 2 cars. 1 fulltime robotaxi. 1 part-time
Simple answer he's no Elon
Two things that Tesla needs to take into account when getting into the Robo taxi business. First, $25,000 car is not gonna be robust enough to drive 20 hours a day for more than a couple of years before falling apart. Watched the video that Bryan made about cost of owning an operating Robo taxi and the profitability. It doesn’t look like, any robotaxi operation whether operated by Tesla or by individuals is going to make significant amount of money unless the charge rate is something north of two dollars a mile.
CHINESE CAR COMPANYS HAVE FULL SELF DRIVING IN CHINA NOW ?
Uber is based on, *anchored* on Humans driving cars. That’s not hard. I’m sure it took a lot of work to really develop a good experience for the driver & rider… but that’s just it.
Uber hasn’t done any work to achieve escape velocity from cars driven by humans.
Developing autonomous vehicles is insanely, wildly, drastically, incredibly, *most evidently* more complex than building an app like Uber.
The idea is If a company can:
1. Develop Robotaxis
2. They can certainly build an app to handle pick up/ drop off.
Uber is not required. Bye bye 👋
Robotaxi business is easy!! Production and landing rockets are hard!!
Hey Uber and Lyft, Tesla is going to do to you what you did to the taxi! Say BYE BYE!!!😅
This Uber CEO sold his stock $70.4 million 😮! Ask yourself would you buy Uber stock or Tesla stock ?
Did he buy Tesla stock ?
Never doubt Elon and Tesla
This guy is going out of business dream on
Whast with the annoying fake video artifacts...an attempt to avoid a copyright strike?
What about items left... on the floor, in the front seat, in the back seat, in the trunk... Are you going to add cameras to look at every possible spot in the car?
toin coss, teads or hails?! :P